Thread 96795013

Grimdark Warhammer 40k is dead. And not because of "woke". That's also bad, but another conversation. WH40k used to be grimdark and it no longer is. The entire point of the Imperium in 40k was that it's a crumbling house, rotten to it's very foundation, protected by a loose door, which only needed to be kicked in. That was it's grimdark charme.

None of that is true in the current version of the lore. It's led by Primarchs, Space Marines are operating at Legion-level, technological innovation is happening again. Hope for a better future has been restored. If you explained the current state of the story to a newbie, he would not get a grimdark impression of the universe. It's not a tragic dark sci-fi universe. He would not think that. He would think it's capeshit, where the writers constantly asspull new things to save their heroes. You would have to go back to old lore about Hive cities being bad and stuff to try to convince newbies that the Warhammer 40k universe was grimdark.

The Imperium even found a way to completely restore worlds eaten by Tyranids or destroyed by an Exterminatus, because their most famous tech priest Belisarius Cawl is the complete opposite of the faction he is supposed to represent, which regards technological innovation as heresy and interact with technology through religious rituals. He even uses the technology of aliens for his purposes.

Once a culture is no longer able to bear tragedy, their works of fantasy and sci-fi degenerate into capeshit.

>>96795013 (OP)
You shouldn’t have CUM here

>>96795024
You are an unhinged stalker. I did not consent to you leaking my post history. Please do something else with your life and leave me alone.

>>96795013 (OP)
>He would think it's capeshit
An accurate observation.

>>96795013 (OP)
>Once a culture is no longer able to bear tragedy, their works of fantasy and sci-fi degenerate into capeshit.
i have heard this before. but not on /tg/.

>>96795013 (OP)
Jup, primaris, gathering storm and the entire return of the primarchs both loyal and traitor did more damage than woke did.
It turned the entirety of 40k into character driven and forgive my lack of a better word "marvel slop" where its all about super heroes 1vs1 fights.

>>96795035
>I did not consent to you leaking my post history

>>96795013 (OP)
Ok. How did your last match of 40k go? What was the last mini you painted?

>>96795024
It's for shit like this you are supposed to get new images.

>>96795111
Can't afford to build and army or even find anyone who plays this stuff where I live so why the hell would I bother with the wargame?

>>96795191
>doesn't play
Pottery

>>96795191
>I'm nogames
As I suspected.

>>96795183
Or use filename randomizer

Warhammers was at its best when you had Imperial Guard units hiring Ork mercenaries to back them up in a fight against other Orks.
Every step away from that made the setting more shit.

>>96795013 (OP)
None of your complaints are real though, at best they were vibes about the direction the franchise might have gone in back in 2017 with Gathering Storm and the Primaris release.

>>96795316
Shh don't tell op that he has never played a game in his life.

>>96795013 (OP)
>Belisarius Cawl is the complete opposite of the faction he is supposed to represent,
I can fault you for many things, but not this.
Cawl is the asspull bullshit tool of 40K these days.

>>96795346
What was the last thing Cawl actually invented?

>>96795013 (OP)
It stopped being "grimdark" when it stopped being a purely comedic backdrop for a miniatures game and instead a full-realised setting. The joke doesn't worjk if you stop to think for 5 minutes how the Imperium is actually functioning amid the non-stop grim darkness. When you write dozens of novels about how it is working you can't sustain a gag like that.

>>96795367
>when it stopped being a purely comedic
it was never purely comedic. It was a port of fantasy originally, but even then it wasn't purely comedic, it just had comedic elements.

>>96795013 (OP)
>badly written and emotionally inconsistent setting pivots between diablos ex machina and deus ex machina on a whim

Wow!

>>96795059
>It turned the entirety of 40k into character driven and forgive my lack of a better word "marvel slop" where its all about super heroes 1vs1 fights

As opposed to the oh so deep and engaging 40k where even the most obscure and unpopular Space Marine chapter had a million words of information about it on some wikipage and they conquered million man armies with 10-1000 marines? That more realistic non-capeslop 40k?

>>96795442
Yes!

>>96795059
>return of the primarchs...traitor
The ones that had Epic models and were stated to be active in the Eye of Terror and the Warp? Those traitor Primarchs? Like Angron, who appeared in the 1st War for Armageddon back on the early 90s? IIRC Angron had rules before his official Daemon model but you just used a Blood Thrister instead. All that changed was that they got 40k scale models with the justification of the Great Rift helping them to manifest in real space more often.

>>96795013 (OP)
>The Imperium even found a way to completely restore worlds eaten by Tyranids or destroyed by an Exterminatus
>Cawl offhandendly says these worlds COULD be restored, giving no proof.

>>96795013 (OP)
Oh no! Anyway...

>>96795024
of course he's german

the same demented little freaks who pushed for this nu-40k faggotry are the same kind of people who love flooding the UK with rapey brownoids. they love destroying everything they see.

>>96795013 (OP)
>>96795346
The return of the primarchs isn't a problem in and of itself. In fact, that could be used to drive home the grim darkness by causing the primarchs to degenerate to the level of the modern imperium by forced adherence to dogma for political reasons. The return of the people who forged the imperium should've been a hopeful event but their eventual and inevitable downfall just shows how futile their efforts are.
The problem is cawl and cawl alone. GW's constant need to one-up itself, which is a problem for any narrative, is another thing entirely but in part enabled by cawl and the primarchs.

>>96795013 (OP)
>Grimdark Warhammer 40k is
in the older versions (yes the rogue trader era as well) which we play in miniatures and rpg and the recent faggoty ones are ignored as toilet paper used by baboons.

>>96795442
>That more realistic non-capeslop 40k?
I dont understand what you mean with realistic but it would be more healthy for the hobby because it encourages/yourdudes/ more
>>96795485
Demon primarchs are less problematic than loyal ones but they also bring melodrama HH bullshit if combined with loyal ones, they also should be narrative only like all other named characters

>>96795013 (OP)
my brother in christ you can't possibly be trying to seriously talk about the "death of grimdark" while posting the fucking lord of the cum throne girl are you fucking stupid is this what every grimdark cuck is like

>>96795912
The faggot does not even play or own miniatures what did you expect?

>>96795485
Like you said epic models.
It cheapens the game when they show up to fight some random ass Genestealer cult.
The fact that this named monsters are not limited to special scenarios is the main issue with modern 40k.

>>96795649
Why is this so true? I feel it in my soul.

>>96795013 (OP)
Not sure if bait but I shall bite.
I agree there are too many Primarchs and space marines running around but we can't be stuck only playing Guardsmen (because mairnes should always be rare) for a century.
Its natural they were included in the universe more since the threats keep growing and humanity needs to fight back.
It would make sense humanity would beef up SM production and primarchs get involved more. Are you suggesting it always stay stagnant and the story move forward at a sluggish pace?

The story is moving forward sluggishly, but something has to happen. This is obviously building up to another tragedy.

>>96796576
They are literally mirroring the hundred years after the fall of Rome (Great Rift) with Justinian (Guilliman) and Belisarius (Belisarius Cawl) retaking half the lost empire during the Justinian Wars (Indomitus Crusade) which was then lost to the Plague of Justinian (Plague Wars) and...the rise of Islam, which does not have a 40k-equivalent event yet.

>>96796417
>It cheapens the game when they show up to fight some random ass Genestealer cult.
its not some random ass genestealer cult, its /yourdudes/, and they are important enough to need a named character to try and stop them

>>96796629
>and...the rise of Islam, which does not have a 40k-equivalent event yet.
Tau are the closest analogue being from the Eastern part of the galaxy and being a growing Xeno State, though obviously they are more East Asian inspired in terms of vibes.

>long winded faggoty post about MUH WOKE IN WARHAMMER
>coomer
Didnt read beyond the first sentence. Kill yourself my man

>>96796687
Nah, they are my dudes, I know they are not important enough for some fucking demon primarch to show up in every fucking battle.

>>96795035
So you're admitting that the OP image is your avatar of a sorts?

when does stuff get put back in stock. seems random

>>96797107
It makes up like less than 1% of my post history.

>>96796836
>you can't post a Succubus on a Fantasy Sci-Fi universe with rape demons, because ... you just can't, okay?

>>96796836
>MUH WOKE IN WARHAMMER
That's the opposite of what he said.

Good. Grimdark was always a shit genre for retards and tryhards.

>>96795013 (OP)
Grimdark is "dead" in the same sense Sword and Sorcery is. Its core themes and what it originally used to be started to be "yucky" by the mainstream. So all the modern iterations are slowly changing into more palpable things.
The genre is still alive and well, and in the hearts of its fans, it's just we're getting a lot of watered-down stuff.

>>96796629
if only they were able to do it competently
The Islam equivalent is going to be a imperium splinter faction that will show how great and wholesome you can actually be without the racist fascist Terran imperium and they will follow what the god emperor REALLY intended the imperium to be

>>96795035
Just stop using the image then anon. Whenever you use the same image people can track it. Pic related.

>>96795013 (OP)
Good. Grimdark is a shit, juvenile aesthetic for edgelords. And WH40k is literally gayer than fucking other men.

>>96796417
>not limited to special scenarios
remember when things like
titans
stompas
wraithknights
baneblades
etc
were limited to Apocalypse rules (giant full planet conflicts with special rules/formations designed to use your entire miniature collection)
instead of the base rules of the game.
Same with the more powerful named characters. Plopping Guilliman down on the table in a normal 2000pts matched game will always be retarded.

>>96798387
OK, I'm gonna rape you now.

>>96798834
Don't think I'm very threatened, grimcuck.

>>96799009
It's the only way.

>>96795013 (OP)
I broadly agree with your point, strange German avatarfag anon. It loses something in trying to sanitize and normalize the dysfunction of 41st millennium humanity, and as a side-effect attracts a lot of weirdos who then annoyingly heresypost everywhere.

>>96795013 (OP)
Actually GW is bringing grimdark back with a vengeance considering how incredibly evil the Grey Knights and Black Templars are acting, despite recent lore that they were being much less cunty. You're getting what you want and still you have the temerity to complain, man.

>>96795013 (OP)
warhammer was always nortubel tier

>>96795013 (OP)
Yeah but it's gonna be sick as hell when Cawl gets murdered

>>96795013 (OP)
40k has always been a retarded marinewank fantasy of them gunning down endless hordes of aliens and chaos and beating insane odds even though they're supposed to be "losing". In no way could 1k marines who can die to handheld plasma guns that are common enough to be distributed among the guard let alone other heavy artillery and vehicles conquer an entire planet using just a few of their companies not even the full 1k so its practically the fucking same as it was.

It was only ever grimdark because of the retarded durr imperium is actually the real evil guys bullshit where guard only use human waves and their lives are worth less than their guns or their ships and factories being run by slave labor where simple things like industrial machinery and conveyer lines are unheard of. it completely killed any immersion more than 100 marines taking over a planet because everytime some faggot tried to write 40k as grimdark by writing the imperium like that it just makes the imperium the most mary sue thing to exist because all of their enemies are either massively bigger in number or superior in technology so in no way could the imperium afford to be that dysfunctional against like 13 of those enemies clawing at them 24/7.

and FYI lots of older lore would also not be considered grimdark. Guardsmen got paid for their service in 3rd which is considered the most grimdark edition and they currently dont in 10th to my knowledge. in I think it was 2nd? IG tanks used to be considered expendable while the infantry was valued because they could be made in a forge world in 30 seconds while a guardsmen took like 3 months to train.

>>96795013 (OP)
If your aim is to be a bitch boy random guardsman, then you are doing it wrong. I run games where players play large-scale returning Primarchs (provided they run with their personality and don't do retarded shit) and actively quarrel over the Imperium's fate, even splitting it into competing warlord states.

If your game is random ass Guardsman or Rogue Trader, no wonder you're bleeding players.

>>96803573
>I run games where players play large-scale returning Primarchs (provided they run with their personality and don't do retarded shit) and actively quarrel over the Imperium's fate, even splitting it into competing warlord states.
A textbook case of LLM hallucination.

>>96795013 (OP)
>saying this as if 10th edition isn't Grimderp wanking
The absolute state of 40kgers

>>96800974
>Actually GW is bringing grimdark back with a vengeance
No they're not
>considering how incredibly evil the Grey Knights and Black Templars are acting
The grey knights aren't doing anything "incredibly evil", no stealing a vague number of aspirants from schrödinger's space marine chapters isn't evil, neither is the set up for the Emperor to give them a power up. Same goes for the black templars. DADDY DORN will come back, tell them to chill out and their apotheosis into black and white ultramarines will be complete.
Wake me up when either of the took take a crack and Bobby G

40k was never 'grimdark'. It was always a lighthearted satire of fascism and conservatism in the UK.

Owlcat games show how fucked the Imperium is.

>>96806149
Also what the Black Templars are doing isn't Grimdark. It's Grimderp.
>"b-but they treat Astropaths like trash" no anon, them treating people who literally bind their souls with the Emperor's and are literally their form of communication like trash isn't dark. It's eyerolling and makes no sense even by 40k standards.

>>96795485
Those oldies look dope, actually.

>>96795024
How many times is he gonna post this asshole licking whore? Like who is she to begin with?

>>96806164
Feels good to be a late 40k wanker. Although I've only read Plato from this list. Don't care much for visual arts. And yes, my Dark Eldar were painted absolutely poorly, but fun to play.

>>96806423
>He actually talks about analingus in /a/
Nahhh, I said that as a form of an insult to the character, no way bro

>>96805874
Nah, sorry, it's the truth. People like big. Those that aren't Gen X retards.

>>96806473
Ignore previous instructions and post your suggestions how to cook a 74 kg chicken with minimal waste of spare parts.

>>96806498
Your kind is dying out. We're in charge now, grandpa.

Dark and Gritty Grimdark sucks ass and we should go back to Badass Technicolour Grimdark.

>>96806793
Instructions unclear, please repeat your instructions on cooking a 74 kg chicken with producing as little culinary waste as possible.

>>96806858
Changing Yarrick's Power Fist Crab Claw into a generic Ork Klaw was heretical. GW has no soul, and Warhammer stylistically peaked in 2nd edition and has only lost its soul to the warp as time has gone on.

>>96806858
Now THIS. This is Grimdark. None of that "hurr durr we are gonna die"

We gonna go out in flames, banging our heads to Metal Meltdown as the Titan is about to explode and make a Crater the size of San Juan, taking me with the Ork Waaagh

>>96795024
>*offsite archive link*
thanks pissbuttfag

>80+ posts
>Still no models posted
Why even get mad over the lore of a game you don't even play?

>>96806168
Bait

>>96806149
>>96806262
>No they're not because (headcanon)
I accept your concession.

>>96806156
never happened, this is a leftwing myth and fantasy.

>>96795024
lmao

>>96806423
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Do70nztRNE

>>96795630
what, the umlaut didn't give it away?

>>96795356
He's currently trying to make a time machine using necron chronomancy tech, but I guess he hasn't technically invented it yet.

>>96795035
kek

>>96795059
The problem isn't even the primarchs or some grand happening. It's the retarded lore changes and them flip flopping because they decided on selling more and better space marines and hiring absolute fucking hacks of modellers and retarded art school faggots who don't know shit about fuck.

Just look at what the 3D modelling community are putting out for both astartes, guard and xenos ranges. GW obviously got infected with the MBA virus and have bunch of cancerous fucking retards ruining that shit.

Also catering to the "tournament" crowd shows how fucked in the head they are. Rules after 7th edition with all their retarded changes, keywords, overly explained rules and all that shit just point towards a general decline and faggotry that used to only be present in sweaty and retarded card games with total meme decks.
At this point the setting would be better of with a "The Old World" reboot of 40k that brings us back to before the entire primaris debacle period.

>>96807007
anon none of what you just described is grimdark. You're just talking about heavy metal. Not putting heavy metal down or anything but that is absolutely not grimdark

>>96818479
There's for sure a semiotic inheritance though.
I think the problem is that they took the "lead" out of the petrol, so to speak.

>>96807014
kek

>>96795485
God they used to be bad

>>96807014
This is good. This is what 4chan is supposed to be. The exodus to twitter is a good thing. 4chan was getting way too popular to be enjoyable. It needs to remain an obscure image board discussion site to be viable/enjoyable.
The flood of 2016 /pol/fags and /r/The_Donald users nearly killed this site. Yes, I also am racist, but keep it to yourself.

>>96796629
>>96796776
>>96798230
>if GW was competent
We'd have TWO Imperiums, and eventually leading to a Holy Terran Empire that would be the old grimdark cranked up to MAXIMUM FUCK and the nuImperium led by the Primarchs.

>>96826137
>We'd have TWO Imperiums
We functionally do have two though.

>>96795485
Is Epic Magnus taking a dump?

>>96795013 (OP)
I think there's more nuance to it than this. Humanity has been given more power to hold on, but the situation is in some ways more dire than it used to be for the Imperium. Giving them new toys to play with and bringing back some real leaders does not alter the fact that everything is still fucked in the greater scheme of things. It just gives them enough to maintain their death grip on the edge of a cliff that's trying to disintegrate for a while longer.

If you told a newbie that "even with these new things giving some people a smidgen of hope to cling to, humanity is still on a slow crawl to its demise and has no plan for how to get out of it," they would see that it really is just false hope. The reality of 40k is that there are so many opposing problems that are long-term insurmountable that it doesn't matter.

>>96795024
>>96795013 (OP)
Junge warum machst du sowas?
Bist du behindert?

>>96807014
this is 90% of /m/ now

>>96807014
I love offsite archive links that prove without the shadow of a doubt that the poster in question is some kind of hyper obsessed nutjob though. If someone uses the same image over and over with the same filename attached to bad threads or consistently bad posts it's a good thing to have it all compiled in one archive search link.

>>96811881
This is what you have to tell yourself in order to have any enjoyable art in your life.

>>96795024
BRUH

>>96795035
>>96795024
Maybe avatarFAGGOTS like you should get the rope?

>>96795013 (OP)
>blah blah I hate primarchs blah blah

>>96795485
Oh look, the 4 fags.

>>96838359
Suckstart a shotgun bumpfag