Thread 96903321

Fucks saké Edition

>Previous Heresy:>>96891575

>HH 3.0 - Complete gofile - All Books:
https://gofile.io/d/cnJk0N

>New Edition, to a great wailing and gnashing of teeth:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/setting/warhammer-the-horus-heresy/
>Official FAQ/Errata/Downloads:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/downloads/warhammer-the-horus-heresy/
>Thread FAQ (very old, remembers Age of Terra)
https://pastebin.com/iUqNrrA8
https://pastebin.com/8riDmnhS
>30k TACTICA & TIPS
https://pastebin.com/Tm2P4QLp
https://1d6chan.miraheze.org/wiki/Age_of_Darkness-Warhammer_30k/3.0_Tactics/General_Tactics

『Adeptus Titanicus and Legions Imperialis』
>Official FAQ/Errata/Downloads
https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/downloads/legions-imperialis/
>List of Titan Legions with Badges and Colours
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17Jccq0V--SwJifLVLwbisYnQeqLlS2pMSiPbGXp1Brs/htmlview
>More lists
https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/List_of_Titan_Legions
>What size magnets do I need?
5x1mm
>Tactics
https://1d6chan.miraheze.org/wiki/Adeptus_Titanicus/Tactics
>Legions Imperialis Army Builder
https://legionbuilder.app/

>Thread question:
DO YOU FUCKING MIND

haaaaiiiiiiiiii

>>96903321 (OP)

>DO YOU FUCKING MIND
Not really no, carry on.

Fuck off animefag.

>Functional thread question
Whats your favorite tech unit/option you like to take because it's cool?

I love Augur squads. Something about a small command and control unit slinking around the field is cool.

Cursed thread

>>96903527
Yeah, now that you're here.

>>96903435
Pintle mounted weapons. Whether or not you actually use them you should model the tank with them because why not?
My only trouble is the pintle combi-weapons that very clearly do not depress enough to actually shoot at targets approaching the tank.

>>96903435
I love my silly, lil, chud thralls

>>96903435
Love Thallax
Love me lightning guns
Love me chain bayonets
Simple as

>>96903321 (OP)

Why is a Thousand Sons tank commander wearing the Emperor's Children femto helm?

Post last games anons!

Got a game in last week, IH vs WB.

IH ended up winning last turn as the WB Centurion went down to a Forgelord in a challange and couldnt push him off the big objective in the middle.

IH Inductii managed to throw phosphex into themselves twice like champs but implacable advance is pretty fkn sexy on a line 1 unit with a FNP reaction built in.

WB stand out units were a rock hard termi command squad getting biomancy and Ashen Circle burning everything + phage.

>>96903607
Just an honorable gift between brother legions

>>96903606
I just started using 3.0 Thallax and really missed using chain baes both times I did. I will be taking them religiously now as the amount of times you get a lucky shred and it could have nuked something bigger happened alot.

As always love your mech grey anon.

>>96903435
in 1.0 I loved taking a breaching charge on a breacher sergeant. chucking a C4 into the face of some terminator in a challenge was epic and fun as hell

>>96901842
At this point we need a message thread on major misconceptions of 3.0. No line being strong isn’t bad. A unit having line is a big buff. Despoilers having it makes them go from meh to good. Tacs and breachers and vets having it make them go from good to great which is why stronger units don’t have line(2). You’re never going to kill stronger units with tacs so you have to bodyguard and rush them onto objectives for them to squeeze out points while playing aggressive. Weaken it and you make the game way less aggressive. It’s the same reason the moves the game from 5>4 turns. On the opposite end they can’t make vanguard great. It’s an incentive for already strong units to play aggressively. You make that a sure thing and you’re actively disincentivized from playing weaker units or getting near objectives

>>96903753
go play the third mission right now without line(2) in your army

Got 16 bases worth of Thallax painted. Gonna base them later this week.

>>96903789
I’m not playing something as homosexual as a mission with forced terrain placement lmao

>>96903820
the base mission, you homo

>>96903824
don't bother, you're arguing with a buffoon

>>96903824
Oh wow that certainly helps when we’re talking about idiots who made bad missions. Yeah the core missions suck, you’re not going to really find anyone who disagrees with that. They’re still better than whatever the hell this guy is trying to put out. Oh no the mission that only buffs line units is horribly unbalanced who could have guessed

>>96903860
>standing in your deployment zone the entire game is le good

>>96903753
>go from good to great
Why would I take tacs if not for line? I guess if you are in a bizarro world meta where militia and thrall spam are pre-eminent they do a job of clearing chaff, but they aren't even particularly notable for that.

Seeing these arguments makes me so glad I'm playing LI and not

>>96903956
They’re alright at killing meq with 60 shots for 10ppm without needing character investment to unlock a detachment for them. 20 max squad size also means that they can gum up melee squads equipped to take out elites

Disintegration pistols, yes or no?

>>96903608

Basic magos Int 9, +1 Combat Veterans, effective +2 Cyber-Familiar for 12, then a penalty of 3 if he's in the unit (casting on Malefic plus power's base -2) or 4 if he's not, so effective Ld8 or Ld9. Not so tricky.

The real limit is that they're 1W MEQ that have an 18" range and cost a fortune, just blast 'em.

>>96903602

It is really neat that there's actual scope for cyberdaemon armies now. Brutes do look a bit slow, but I suppose they are basically Charonites you can boost.

>>96904163

They look cool, but I don't think there's anyone I'd be taking fancy pistols on that can't take Archaeotech Pistols, which are basically just better in every way. S4 on something that expensive is rough.

>>96903860
Rob, his dogshit opinions and his circlejerking simp squad have been terrible for aos, I instantly think less of anyone who regurgitates his ideas

>>96903598

How have they been holding up? I am still building the last 20 thralls I need to run the full grey-goo Lacrymaerta build, so I haven't gotten any games in with them yet. Kind of hard to tell how effective they are on paper when a lot of the power comes from 3-4 of them appearing out of thin air every round.

>>96903435

Servo-automata. I always liked my squad of shitty cuttlefish firing away with meltas and occasionally doming a marine or three while their Magos fixes things. Sadly they lost their wargear options this edition so they can't have the meltas, but the base statline is actually quite good now, I'm considering upping the squad from 8 to 12 and having them march up the board as a cheap scoring tarpit.

Still not sure if they can use their own Battlesmith alongside the techpriest character or whether you take the best of the two.

Since the Breacher upgrade sprue is right around the corner, is there any load out other than bolter and shield that's worth getting?

>>96904207

Both regular and Veteran breachers want to take their lascutters or gravguns options, they're good. I'm also fond of a combi-melta on the sarge if you take the gravity guns, just because a single melta shot is very possibly a dead rhino or pred without having to charge and that's just a convenient opportunistic capability to have.

>>96904207
Wait it's an upgrade?

>>96903435
Plasma weapons. Even have plasma pistols on some of my units. Conversion beamer weapons too.

>>96904207
lascutters and grav guns are a requirement otherwise your doing them wrong, both are fantastic small upgrades that change your threat profile immensly

>>96904207
Breachers with lascutters and a melta bomb on the sarge have a very high chance to destroy AV 14 vehicles in one turn. Put them in a rhino, throw them at a land raider or kratos, sit back and watch the fireworks.

Now that the dust has settled.
What's your opinion on 3.0?

I'm playing my first game this weekend and I'm curious.

>>96904470
I think it is a better game than 2.0, brutal and the level of unbalance between units made that edition quite monotonous.
Also enjoy it more than 1.0, have always played infantry heavy which was very rough in the edition where artillery was king.
Haven't been this motivated to paint in a long time, there are so many things I want to play with how many units and options are genuinely playable or even good now.

>>96904470
Deckchair edition. Shuffles stuff around, adds stuff, takes stuff away, not an actual improvement just *different* so they can sell you more books. Some of the new systems also aren't very well thought out - hypothetically they could be good, but in practice they're often dumb, so with 3.0 you're looking at an edition that's only going to live up to its potential with years of FAQs and supplementary material, ie it will only finally get good right before 4th comes out and invalidates it all.

Outside of people who really like what it's *trying* to do, enough to overlook that it often fails to do it in practice, the only people I see defending 3.0 are the types who always think Current Thing is the best simply by virtue of being Current Thing. You know the types, the drones who won't play old SGs or editions because they're "unsupported". It's certainly killed my local scene stone-dead.

>>96904470
Much less tilting than 2.0 had a way of being. Most legions lost a lot of flavor though (fuck you Thousand Sons). Non legion armies are mixed bag. Solar Aux, Knights up, militia idk, daemons are boring, Custodes are less toxic but don't get to play missions, Sisters of Silence got nuked.

>>96904607
At least all the non marine armies are playable. In 2.0 you didn't even have to bother trying to win with SA or militia, and daemons were a one-unit army (sovereigns) Knights also were a complete joke compared to dreadnoughts, twice the points but worse in every way.

>>96904207
So fucking ugly, the resin mkIII moggs especially the helmet

>>96904362
Back in my day plasma was AP2

>>96904615
Most. I wouldn't want to be a daemons player.

>>96904656
GW is trying to remove Daemons entirely from all their games and settings, the suits absolutely HATE people being able to use the same models across all the different games.

>>96904207
I'm waiting to see what options the kit comes with.
If it's sub-par, there's always Tortuga.

>>96904362
>This meme is older than half of GWs customer base
Ouch, my back

>>96904339
I dunno if it will be sold separately as an upgrade, or just bundled with the Mk.3 sprues, but that is just the current Mk.3 bodies with new heads, shields and weapons, yeah

>>96904857
Probably like they did with the Command box, yeah.

>>96904857
I suppose it's not a bad way of doing it, but at the very least I hope it comes with a few other odd options as well.

>>96903395
Idk if it's really minmaxing. It's a fun unit but A) it's an incredibly fragile glass cannon (a single ten man tac squad kills a third of the team in one shooting phase) and B) it's an incredibly inefficient use of resources (wasting an apex is the big one but you're also reliant on bringing a 150pt nanny to even make it work).
Ultimately it's probably still worse than just bringing it's point in seekers (which AL can spam super efficiently).
I would make sure to tell opponents about it beforehand if I ever ran them, so they're not surprised to see a leviathan disappear in a puff of smoke, but at the end of the day you're just taking a unit and giving it +1 BS.

>>96905018
It's absolutely is
>Take prime advantage only avail to traitors that grant a keyword in top of being able to dodge statuses at a cost
>Put that on an infiltrate, shooting, precision 4+ unit that spams a lot of breaching shots
>Ally in unit that uses technomancy to improve their BS into crit territory
>Crits count as 6s for wounds to so breaching is triggered and do +1 damage
Higher volume of shots is better for fishing for crits vs seekers. A magos boosting an allied maelific unit like this is 7e 40k ally fishing territory and you know it.

>>96904206
Just grandfather the options in, if you modeled them already. It's what the cool kids do.

>>96904700
I just noticed GWs kit has the mowhawk helmet vent. I might pass on it and go tortuga.

>>96905231
I think I'll skip the helmets entirely and just go for the old MKIII.

I love 1500 point games. They're busted and you can run bullshit lists and it's funny to watch it happen.

My friend group does this sort of "list to beat" challenge, where whoever wins has to run the same list against the next guy, and can only change out if he loses. It's a constant back and forth and we have made some really, really dumb lists.

>>96905187
Do you also get this worked up about people putting Paragon of battle on a Vigilator? Or running the techpriest/thrall regenerating blob? Synergies and combos exist in the game, I don't think it's against the spirit of it to have a squad of possessed assassins being guided by a corrupted techpriest.
As I said earlier in the end it requires a lot of forethought and careful positioning when compared to just taking it's weight in seekers for example. You can get almost 20 seekers for the price of the headhunter bomb, and for that price you're basically twice as durable, have much longer range, don't lose a third of your guys each time you fire, can control more of the battlefield, etc...

>>96905187
>i don't like this combo, it is as cheesy as 7th ed
lmao. 3rd edition HH is tame as fuck when you compare it to anything from 40k 7th. i still have nightmare of those screamerstars with invisibility and 2++ reroll saves (and that wasn't even close to the top bullshit you could bring)

>>96905187

If you want to cast across factions you can also just cast normal cybertheurgy on any dreads/vehicles, or any base Astartes unit with The Flesh Is Weak. If it wasn't intended then the cybertheurgy rules wouldn't include an explicit -1 penalty on the check for targeting out-of-faction units, it's clearly an intended route.

>>96905269
No, because those exist within one book and are directly intentional. If "Forethought" is "how can I break this unit using allies that happen to have a nich interaction", then yes it requires forethought.

More seekers have more coverage, but a smaller compact footprint with as many shots that benefit from a single magos is much more efficient for the desired effect. Seekers are already overturned to begin with and should be Breaching 5+, but vomiting breaching crits from HH using a magos is absolutely minmaxing breaching crits by cherry picking an allied unit that overly boosts a units unique application.

Its like I'm with 6e or 7e when everyone allied in that salamander named apothecary attached to ever deathstar becuase he was the only apoth that wasn't baked into a command squad.

>>96905325
There's a difference between
>Magos interacts with machine
And
>Magos is better Corvidae for Maelific Head Hunters
If Corvidae is busted, so is this because it's also +1 damage.

>>96904700
Hate to tell you anon but those heads are fucking massive. They’re big on primaris marines

>>96905343
Nta but as >>96905325 pointed out it's something explicitly provided for in the game rules, with a clause for both casting cybertheurgy on a non-mech unit and on a malefic one. Clearly this is intentional.

>>96905376

If Corvidae units were 1/apex detachment and were exclusively 18" range 1W MEQ I would be a lot happier with 1ksons, I'll tell you that much. A Corvidae autocannon HSS is better in almost every way.

>>96905376
>If corvidae (the thing thousand sons can put on any unit they like at a negligible cost and can stack with the million other buffs available to them) is powerful, then this one ten man squad (that wastes your Apex Det, requires you to invest into a babysitter to even make the damage output happen and is generally much harder to get off) is just as powerful!

>>96905380
Then I'll just buy Mk3 bodies to go with them?

>>96903321 (OP)
Lmao that praetor is so mid

>>96903800
> Epic
Based
> Namefag
Gay

>>96904470
It's a lot better than 2.0 and better than unmodified, unregulated 1.0. it's got a lot of weird hang ups and it's written in an annoying style. I think they finally got vehicles right. Morale actually matters. Weapons are more fun. The only things I don't like are the challenges (it's just not necessary and it slows the game down), how they rolled out the legacy units (which marred the entire release), and the extremely weak mission pack.

>>96904470
I had fun playing it but man the list building format is really getting on my nerves

>>96905521
>Legacy units release
What people keep forgetting is that the entire rules got leaked almost two weeks ahead of the actual release date. If that hadn't happened, the legacy units rules would have been out within a couple of days.

>>96903612
TS vs AL+WB
It was take and hold and I scored 14 points on my t1 so on t3 even with my army decimated and both Slay The Warlord and Last Man Standing in his grasp there was no way to rebound (23-12 IIRC)

Is there a pdf for the Dropsite and Ashes of Imperium novels?

>>96905590
It's not about that, it's about the last minute editing and other bullshit they pulled. If you don't think that we got a LOT more units and options back in the game because of the outrage you are fucking naive. Their faggot tier 'ummm only options that are in the box' is cancer and contrary to years of how HH worked, it's the same shit we are now seeing in the BB release (and going over just as well).
It's not even consist with OTHER specialist game releases (Necromunda, fucking TOW straight up tells you to convert units like Tomb Guard Chariots). It just reeked of a spiteful, anti consumer money grubbing move and the community rightfully called them out (and shat on the influencers who tried to defend GW).
It poisoned the release for a lot of people, which is a shame, because the bones of the edition are probably the best HH has ever been (in line for 1.0 before the release of Inferno, which just ruined the entire game)

>>96905626
It's all unpainted garbage to me

>>96905661
post games + models + chin

>>96905653
GW announced pretty much all options and units missing from the libers in the first live interview they streamed you dumb fuck. They warned everybody ahead of time, that the Libers would only contain "off the shelves" options, and that all the other stuff would be in the legacies rules and more added through the tactica journals. The roadmap for releases, also put online by GW before all the leaks, also announced the legacies rules in the same month.
Illiterate retards like you not attention and throwing a fit because of only the book rules leaking weeks ahead of the planned release does not change the actual timeline. I'm so fucking fed up with you fucking idiots and your revisionist history, that you are stupid enough to believe yourself. It is impossible for the vast amount of legacies units and options to have been created and playtested within a week, especially with how balanced everything is. The HH 2.0 legacies unit balance at the end of the edition was still a complete fucking joke to how the legacies units in 3.0 are.

>>96905262
Can you give some examples?

>>96905626
>23-12 IIRC
Your opponent did remember to use Counter Offensive in their last turn, right?

>>96905661
Please consult the graph

>>96905245
WB breekies look sick

>>96905806
There were no more objectives and thus no way to trigger Vanguard (RAW it has no effect on secondary objectives)

>>96905871
Oh, you played THAT mission. GW should tell people to rip the page with that mission out of their rulebook, it is terrible.

>>96905816
>hierarchies
This is what an inferiority complex does to a motherfucker

>>96903435
Shotguns, heavily considering doing a squad of full shotguns for my World Eaters, feels on point for the legion.

So I'm bringing a couple squads of Vanguard Vets with a Master of Descent for my World Eaters. All about landing safely behind cover, before pouncing on tacticals to earn vanguard or disrupt heavy support squads and such.

Assuming I equip them all with lightning claws or Power Axes, anyone have the math for how many I need in each squad to comfortably beat these units? I dont think I need a full 10 man squad, so trying to find the magic number.

>>96905932
I'm just tired of people constantly shooting down other people's batreps or models without posting their own or giving advice to improve.
The only reason I used to go on TG was to see people's models and batreps, it sucks to see them become rare because they're immediately met with insults from tourists who don't actually play the game or own models.

>>96906000
I feel ya
I'm just here for leaks and cool pics.

This isn't a nice place, don't let it affect you.

>>96903594
I sometimes wonder how much of HH equipment is there because of 40k options over the years, and how much is there because it was on a classic Golden Demon entry and seemed cool

>>96904163
on sergeants yes, +5 points for 1/18 to kill charging terminator is a worthwhile outlay

>>96906059
>5s to hit 5s to wound 2+ save is 1/18
huh?

>>96905816
Lmao.
Why not spend this time to paint your shitty grey plastic instead of making your shit meme

>>96905765
No because when I do and you demand you post yours in response you will just ghost, happened to be last month.

>>96905784
> Let me try to bury how they were updating the legacy article in real time to add in shit they were adding
Lmao. And the whole 'its only the box options in the book' was in RESPONSE to community outrage at the leak, if you think they would have added the options back without the outrage you are a fucking naive fool. GW was trying to move the overton window, as they constantly try to do, and got called out. Was there stupid shit done (Pardo got a lot of hate for literally posting hmm on a Troon run discord and some schizo then said HE forced the Troon mods to delete leaks (the troons would have done it anyway) by the community? Yeah. Did it force GW to pull back? 100%

>>96906089
what is Overwatch

>why doesn't he have the rifle

because you exchanged his bolter for combi-melta to fuck that tank, dumbass

>>96906220
>>96906089
alright 1/27 I still haven't internalized T5 termies :(

>>96906116
Concession accepted, KWAB

>>96906104
Post models, faggot

Sometimes I get this feeling that I should make my own little unit of guys, in the style of those "Exemplary Battles" units. But everything feels so done, that there is no niche to fill that hasn't been filled already.

>>96906361
find something they havent made yet then

>>96906361
What legion do you play? Surely there must be something they haven't done

>>96905969
You need 7 to get an average of over 10 wounds.

>>96906260
>>96906303
> They say, without posting models of their own
So you have no painted models, gotcha. Let me guess, just a 'fan of the lore'

>>96906361
Plenty of room. Just don't make them super-specialest boys to ever be and you'll be good.

Example: an Iron Hands units that exclusively fight with Thunder Hammers and shields, and use jump packs.

>>96905380
No they are same size as old fw heads, the tiny nu-heads are small
>>96904700
I bought them and I like them.

>>96906361
Ur imagination is the only limit, anon

>>96905948
Yeah shotguns are cool

>>96905816
Wait this is a game?

>>96906361
A few of the legions deserve their own destroyer variant. Others have an obvious niche to fill. The real challenge is finding an actual unit that can properly serve as the template so you can actually field <your dudes>

>>96906728
>TSons Destroyer variant that uses warp fuckery to mess with time, enabling them to fire their weapons twice

>>96906779
TS pyrae destroyers that's just them jumping around breathing fire on everyone or biomantic slamming bunkers into paste. Or some sniper squad with proto warp-bolt ammo.
Numerologists are cool but a psychic techmarine was a weird choice for them

>>96906728
IW variant called Obliterators, yada yada you get the joke

>>96906659
Now post your army in a game, surely you can?

>>96906880
I never got the whole 'models can look worse painted than grey plastic' until now holy shit

>>96906937
You say my models like like shit yet post none of your own. Curious . . .

>>96906937
You say my models look like shit yet post none of your own. Curious . . .

What's with this low-effort trolling? Another trooncord raid?

>>96906994
GW kind of killed the game so now there's not much to do besides shitpost in between monthly games of 1e

>buying models
cringe af, means your broke ass can't afford a printer
>painting models
cringe af, means your broke ass can't afford to commission someone else to do
>playing games
cringe af, means using GW rules and letting some poorfag touch your models

>>96906994
There is at least one residential thread shitter. You can tell when he wakes up by the posts that start appearing.

>>96907048
What a pathetic life he must lead.
Wasting his one and only life like this.

>>96906880
thin your paints man

>>96905380
Oh hey it's Lying Vatnik again. Shouldn't you be queueing to suck off the local FSB officer for your meagre ration of petrol, tovarishch?

>>96904615
Well, its def not all non marine armies. Certainly better than the abandonware of 2.0, but its still worse than 1.0 where most armies had at least one or two solid lists.

Aux- Solid
Mech- Solid
BS- Solid
Shattered legions- Solid
Militia- Usable
Todes- Usable
Knights- Low end of usable
Daemons- lol
Sisters- lol

>>96905521
>got vehicles right
Yeah sure, a system where it's objectively better to glance vehicles to death because even if it takes a while they'll be rendered functionally useless through stacked Statuses, while trying to actually kill them with proper AT weapons is just dumb because your chances of doing that are tiny and if you fail as you almost certainly will their fully functional tank will go on raping face unimpeded sounds "right" to me...

>>96907286
daemons are definitely usable, they score way to many points

>>96905187
lol at all the WAACER tears after you called them out

>>96903321 (OP)
good reminder that gloss coated minis never look good

>>96905262
this is a great idea, nice

>>96907292
Low tier bait.

>>96905262
https://youtu.be/1l1nETE89Us?si=QMuIlEghV4kVBbMO
an old 1e channel used to do something like this but with a fixed, really solid IH army in ZM
honestly one of the better youtubers but they died out when the owner moved to australia and covid hit

>>96905187
Its a combo, but im with the anon. I think its less "minmaxing" and more "a funny gimmick".

Its like 400pts for 10 1w 3+ save dudes, sure theyre malefic or whatever but they literally drop like flies to any sort of shooting (or melee) so just kill them. And its 18" range so its not like theyre doing this damage from safety either.

Its a strong unit (situationally), but I think its just a fun thing you can do more so than rules abuse.

Am I supposed to fill the in black or grey space?

>>96907402
Up to you

>>96907388
the anon you replied to would have had an aneurysm last edition when I was taking an allied detachment of WB with dark brethren and then buffing my myrmidons or ursurax with the daemon buffs

>>96907442
Wasnt dark brethren primary detachment only?

>>96907446
no, that was serrated sun

>>96907367
We still play 1e! It's killy enough to let the game move fast and it's got something that 2nd and 3rd don't have. No idea what, but it's just my favorite.

>>96907335
Thank you, we do 1e and it's very fun

>>96905785
Yes! In 1e I've brought:
IW with a warsmith and 3 iron circle, two 10 man tactical squads in rhinos and nuncio, 10 man breacher squad with nuncio, and a medusa.

Buddy brought a solar aux list with 2 russ tanks, some big transport, and 5 of those little exploding remote controlled bombs.


Other times I've done WB gal vorbak and infantry spam, buddy did some crazy stuff with IF breachers, it's always a hoot.

>>96904615
That is a big trade for how many marine armies became unplayable. It is not like a lot of people play mechanicus or auxilia outside of US and western europe.

I think the journals for HH3 might be the worst supplements since 7th edition 40k dataslates.

The content isnt terrible, but theres hardly any of it and so far its all shit that very clearly was left out of main books just so it could be sold separately.

https://discord.gg/4bHqw4f7

I'm trying to get a painting discord going for /tg/ as a whole, Here's my best piece to prove I'm not a paintlet.

>>96907624
GW hasn't figured out how to implement a battle pass for warhammer yet so horse armor is what we get.

>inversion beamer weapon kit for the saturnine dreadnought still out of stock on GW's webstore
So much for HH players not being tournament minded WAACfags.
Also, least played edition by the way.

>>96907270
Who? I’m warning the dude cause these are the heads I used on my 40K iron hands

>>96907733
Post pictures.

>>96907286
Yeah. Militia could use some buffs on some really bad units like the beast master but holy hell they’re a lot better. Daemons are probably a bit higher on the list because they can score well a they have a few really good units but yeah. A lot of the army stinks

>>96907740
Still wip but you get the point

>>96907763
Imo the biggest issue with demons is that they seem even MORE reliant on their 2/3 "carry units"

Sure, like 3 4++ 4+++ greater demons are insane and brutes and beasts are still very good, but its still a case of "abuse the few optimal units or suffer" and thats both going to lose to a tailored enemy list and not be very interesting to play.

There isnt really multiple ways to play demons, just skins for the singular demon list.

will HH actually reach the scouring and will we see a return of Mark VII armor?

>>96907774
They look perfect, what are you talking about mate?

>>96907829
Within 2-3 editions, for sure. Once GW has squeezed every last bit of blood from this husk and needs to expand the setting to introduce all the other stuff they axed from 40k.

>>96907579
>became unplayable
Lol
>outside of western europe and us
So the vast majority of the playerbase?

>>96907579
>Outside of western europe and US
Those aren't people

>>96907579
>can't take thunder hammers on all your HQs
>become unplayable
Polish fags really are the worse

>>96904470
Rushed garbage. A placeholder edition moneygrab. Going back to house ruled 1.5 or 2.5 is preferable. It's just pick your poison at this point, nothing is perfect.

>>96907579
>outside of 90% of GWs market

>>96907861
On primaris yeah. They’re just huge on the new hh minis. It makes the guy look top heavy

>>96908050
No, on Horus Heresy marines.

>>96907985
I had exactly one thunder hammer in my whole army, and it was on my herald on jetbike. Every other character or model with a model option had a lance.

>>96907986
Insane cope, seeth harder macca

>>96908008
What I was saying that those armies only exist outside in those two places. And it is not like HH in US or UK is SA or Mecha majority. this is a marine game. just like w40k.

>>96908087
Not any more. It already started when SA and Mech got their plastic model kits, but now that those armies have functional rules as well thanks to 3.0 marines only make up half the playerbase in my local area.

>>96907292
They don't auto die, the glancing chart is fine and gives you something for your efforts even if you don't kill or damage the vehicle, and they can't score objectives (aka how you win) so spamming them has some drawbacks. In 1.0 it was a parking lot simulator, and in 2.0 they were generally shit. This is a good enough middle ground even if it's not perfect

>>96907008
Why is someone else touching your model?

>>96907985
NTA but it's kinda lame you can't put anything on your consuls besides fucking pistols. I just want to spend 10 points to give a dude a power weapon (gate off thunder hammers, fists, chain fists, whatever) but I can't. Why does my officer have less melee options than a tactical, who can at least put an over priced bayonet on his bolter?

>>96908081
> Every one of my HQs still uses their thunder hammer
Kinda sucks for challenges now but fuck it I'm just using Finishing Blow every time anyway.

>>96908086
Lol getting incorrectly namefagged by a spazoid who loves slop. Mark one off my bingo card.

>>96908081
How are lances this ed? I don’t run many fast characters that could make the most use of that. Doesn’t seem like that bad of an option for characters that can’t get paragon blades

>>96907986
> A placeholder edition moneygrab
Literally 2.0

>>96908297
2.0 was so bad it almost killed most of australia's 30k groups. The utter resistance to a easy FAQ adjusting dreads, lascannon spam and shit like stone gauntlet was insane.

3.0 aint perfect especially mission but fuck 2.0 right out the door.

>>96908297
Anybody calling 3.0 an unfinished rush job to then recommend 2.0 right after is painfully obvious a troll.
HH 2.0 got so tiresome it made me pick up 40k again for a short while, 10th edition after not having played it for two editions straight.

>>96908483
>10e 40k
Really threaded the needle on getting the biggest piece of shit

>>96908513
(You)

>>96908513
At least it wasn't a serious time investment to try a few times. Fuck the bloated cesspool the 9th edition rules were.

>>96907579
>That is a big trade for how many marine armies became unplayable
None, no marine factions became unplayable, the balance between legions (and blackshields/shattered legions) is the best its ever been.

>>96908620
Fury of the Ancients became unplayable. WAACfags are still in shambles.

>>96908870
You actually can still FOTA, you just need mortifactors.

>>96908620
Yeah people really mistake some legions in 3.0 having one bad aspect like the da rule with complete dogshit because of how row worked. Da may be one of the weaker legions but fuck me it’s not complete dogshit like certain offenders from 2.0. Just bend over and take it if you’re trying to run sl or ts

>>96908876
Kinda hilarious dreadnoughts were so busted that taking multiple big nerfs still let dreadnoughts stay as good/great units. Dereodeo are probably the worst yet they still hit like 18 wheelers against a family of 5 in florida

>>96908876
2 mortifactors, 1 centurion, and a prime techmarine from that special detachment.

>>96908297
you might hate it, but anon is right, 2.0 was fucking vaporware

Is Alone and Forgotten + The Blade of the Just the best way to play HeroHammer?
Or would The Eternal Vendetta be a better pick?
I'm working on a jump squad list for Alone and Forgotten with a bs7 Moritat at its head.

>>96909021
Yes you have it right.
AaF+Halo Blades is probably for effective at killing things though, if you want to discard victory.
Plus AaF doesn't apply to Lord of War detachments so if you're at a high points game you should consider a big tank. Model the big tank with an angry tank commander.

>>96907330
I know. I came back from work to see the waacery simps in this thread is out of control. Apparently requiring more than 1 braincell to do a wombo combo is just skillfully navigating synergistic combinations. And if someone strong and easier exists everything else by default is justified.

What did the FAQ fix?

>>96909522
Moritats can now join destroyers. Thats about it.

Hey 1.0 vets (and other hobby bros) I present my humble imitation of the og FW primarchs basing with my Kelbor Hal, it doesn’t feel done though, I require illuminating

>>96909522
Lots of minor fixes, like the TS special bolters no longer having the Assault trait. Oh and the DA legion rule actually does something now.

>>96909522
Aspyhx bolters are no longer pistols, that's the only thing people really cared about

>>96909488
I can't believe you fags are crying this hard about a 300 pt squad of 1W MEQs.

>>96908202
Just pay the points for a sword. If anyone puts up a fuss over a sword or axe on an accountant then don't play them.

>>96908561
>went full box loadout only (including squad size)
>most army rules boil down to rerolls, or +/- 1 to hit, wound, or damage
>eldar at launch
>3 month churn

building my 1st Horus Heresy army and I was wondering something or pretty much trying to decide on what I should get for vehicles so far I already have the following: Deimos Pattern Predator Battle Tank, Sicaran Venator Tank Hunter, Kratos Heavy Assault tank & Land Raider Proteus. I thought about getting another Predator Tank but I am unsure, what do you guys suggest? I'm mainly fielding MK III Marines with mostly bolters, I do have some heavy weapons but I'm still trying to decide on what I should use.

>>96909725
Thats quite a lot of tanks already. Frankly you probably dont want to field more.

Id recommend some rhinos for your lighter troops and thats about it.

If you want more tanks? Vindicators are good, predators are cheap and can do whatever you want them to. Sicarans look good but arent great.

>>96909725
You already have plenty, just make sure weapon swaps are easy. You invest too many points into vehicles and your opponent can just force statuses on them or block los while they steamroll your units that can actually score

>>96908620

Orbital Assault became unplayable

>>96909842
Orbital Assault isnt a faction, and you can still take as many drop pods as you want.

>>96909847
>you can take as many drop pods as you want
Look I'm of the opinion that 'unplayable' armies are overstated but the ability to run drop pods that won't be able to deploy is the most retarded argument that you could make.

should I take land raider explorators over carriers?

they're a good 45pts cheaper, in a more favourable slot (recon, i'm playing AL) and they're transporting 5 Lernaen terminators each so the front ramp+assault vehicle doesnt matter too much if they even want to charge

>>96909898
Wait, they released a FAQ and didn't address the inability to bring more than 2 drop pods? Oof
We're really in "Just wait for the Rebalance!" hours

>>96910087
I'd do it. It's not like there's dedicated transports slots anymore

>>96905897
Which one's the bad mission? Man, Cthonia's missions were comfy

>>96910561
the one with the disappearing objectives
it's the worst mission

>>96910570
In 2.0 there was one with moving objectives, and another with objectives you didn't know the value of until after the game. I think those were fun. It kept you guessing. It kept the players from parking somewhere and devolving into a castle defense game

>>96910759
war of lies from 1e was peak
the one with the single moving objective was pretty ass, sometimes it would just sit in one player's half of the table and they'd just farm VP all game

>>96907829
I hope not. The scouring book was interesting, but honestly I could care less about what happens after the heresy. Each step forward in the timeline is a step closer to 40k....

>>96910771
we must return

>>96909747
I'm more or less going into a thematic army like loyalist survivors from the wretched traitor legions & them getting their hands on whatever armaments they can, if that's the case with me having enough i'll probably get 1 Rhino like >>96909814 said along with magnetizing what special/heavy weapons I have:
5 flamers, 5 plasma guns, 5 meltaguns, 5 rotor cannons, 5 volkite chargers, and 5 volkite calivers got these from the Battle Group & i traded the Dread for a leviathan dreadnought for heavy weapons i recently got Volkite Culverins, Lascannons & Autocannons I'm pretty sure I'm good on weapons.

>>96910759
they should have a mission with blip objectives, where you only count who scored them each turn and don't know what they were worth until the end of the game

Finally booted that printer I got after a month
>captcha: MM2TT
I love tits too captcha

>>96907829
Big doubt
I think a TOW equivalent to 40k is more likely, set during m41, possibly Badab or Armageddon 3

>>96911268
is GW not planning on going into the scouring?

>>96911252
based.

>>96911252
@Warhammer @GW @FBI
STOP HIM

>>96911284
It took 10 years to go from HH books to HH rules

>>96911284
Anon, I hate to tell you but there's an insanely high chance the scouring is now apart of heresy so they have more material because of the 3 year cycle.

>>96911203
... that's a 2.0 core mission, yeah. Though I guess it is different, as they only score at the end of the game inthink

>>96911332
is there anything unique to the scouring thats not present in 40k?

>>96910087
If you're not attaching any leaders to those units, it might be worth entertaining, but perhaps predictable. Might be cool with Headhunter Leviathal but you still got nice things like Recons and Effrits in that slot. Now if only we got plastic Sabre Tanks.

>>96907829
If they don't, gonna be weird to see all forms of Mk VII go OOP entirely.

>>96911411
It’s basically pre badab war where legions are only just evolving into their 40K identities so you still have crazy stuff from the heresy like destroyers and mhra gal while mk7, indomidus, and castraferrum dreads just start to become the norm. The codex isn’t out yet and chapters are just starting to form in the background so they could totally do a lot of weird units like proto devastators

You guys honestly think GW in TYYOL 2025 is capable of doing something interesting with the scouring besides just retconning a bunch of stuff and selling you slop?

>>96908154
But it's not a middle ground, you absolute tacticslet. If you have a choice between two approaches both of which will render your opponent's vehicle incapable of hurting you if they succeed, and one is FAR more likely to succeed, you're simply a retard if you choose the less likely option. It's too easy to dump a bunch of status effects on a vehicle and render it - functionally - just as useless as if you had blown it up. Maybe in a system that hadn't culled two of its six turns in order to free up time for a faggy little challenge minigame that was a solved problem before the game even officially launched it could have worked, but in 3.0's 4 turn progressive scoring approach being able to pretty reliably lock down opposing vehicles for several of those turns is ridiculous, especially in comparison with how resilient they are against attempts to actually blow them up with proper AT weapons.

Every word 3.0tards speak convinces me further that all the bleating and moaning about 2.0 was due to the fact you lot were all fed on a steady diet of lead paint and methylated spirits as children.

>>96911578
Everything interesting about the heresy was retconned in to sell you resin slop, what are you on about?

>>96911620
so you're saying no they're not capable

>>96911850
I'm saying the interesting bit is the retconning nitwit, that's what it's always been. There's like two paragraphs written on these historical events before they expand it, and that's what people want to see.

>>96911599

If there's a Techmarine or Magos around said vehicle then they will happily clear all the statuses up with very little effort. Supported vehicles need to actually be killed, or have their repairmen assassinated before you can status them down, so if you can just dump a bunch of hull points onto it it's a much more reliable way to go about things if they actually bring Battlesmith.

>>96909041

Also helps to make said big tank a transport because superheavies can take multiple units, so you can pile a bunch of guys in your Mastodon and jump them out individually. Good for when you want to skip jump packs on some of your characters, too.

Hermes or Veletaris sentinels for the ones I got from the combat force box?

>>96911599
obvious troll is obvious LMFAO

post models

>>96912187
You can always use more multilasers to force snapshots on units

should I give a tactical squad sergeant weapon upgrades like a power weapon and better pistol?

one the one hand it looks cool as fuck
on the other hand he only has 1 attack

>>96909553
Get some sand on that base to bring out the ground texture, and add 1 or 2 dead bodies/skulls to the base.
Apart from that it looks pretty good.

>>96910859
As long as its not primaris shit I am more than fine with it

>>96912338
Can get to two attacks with master sergeant.
Purely from a min/max standpoint you shouldn't give tactical sergeants any upgrades, this has always been the case. However, I will continue putting power swords and even plasma pistols on my sergeants, because it looks cool as fuck.

>>96912399
maybe I should just take despoilers then, they're in a rhino, not like FoTL gonna do anything

>>96912427
Yeah bolters are kinda ass now that even terminators are toughness 5. With the risk of losing tacticals to return fire as well I rarely have my tactical squads shoot anything any more. Despoilers can at least fuck up MEQ in close combat when you sprinkle in some power weapons.

>>96909522
Kratos cannot be glanced duiring reactions
DA trait now officially works in combat
We finally know what a friendly models means
Sallies got a bunch of fixes/buffs depending on how you look at it.
You cannot precision a character then force said character to tank every single bullets that aren't precision
Moritats now cannot join a single unit that isn't in the legacy pdf.

It's going to be like 2.0 I think. No major balance/mechanic fixes until a new edition drops. Get used to Vulkan and Kratos being amazing.

Tourist here. So what is the deal with Saturnine Terminators? What makes them different by the other termies rule-wise? Are they tankier? Shootier? Melee-er?

>>96912493
Try looking at the rules maybe? They're T6 vs T5, W3 vs W2, 4++ vs 5++ of Tartaros, carry different weapons, get two guns and Firing Protocols(2).

>>96912493
Tougher, slower, more geared towards being a devastating short range fire platform than close combat suit.
They also put the dreadnought in tactical dreadnought armour, they're piloted more than worn. It also requires the use of a neural link interface like dreadnoughts and titan pilots use, in addition to being plugged in to the black carapace. So they're like a dreadnought for marines that aren't mortally wounded.

>>96908870
No one was playing FotA anyway, every fucking 'tournament' a WAACfag would attend to get his rocks off banned it anyway. He just ran IF in a stone gauntlet

>>96912544
They're not fucknuggets?

>>96912566
No. Except for the EC, those definitely got turned into fuck nuggets. The paragraph about EC in Forges of Saturn heavily implies as much.

>>96912544
That's pretty lame

>>96912544

Admittedly the best way to use them on the actual tabletop probably is as Big Cataphractii with command squads/phraetus foregoing the arm guns for flamers and melee, but that's more the fault of the fairly mediocre guns than anything else.

>>96911252
The chad printer go BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR when GW cries out in pain of lost shekels

>>96911292
@Grok is this true??

>>96906361
Well, if you want somewhere to start, they still haven't done "a good WE unit instead of complete trash or deeply mediocre" in 3e. (Butchers got improved slightly in exchange for Rampagers being taken out back behind the woodshed, Inductii are whatever at best, butcher surgeon is only useful in one or two combos and even then hard to justify, and Red Hands are nothing special and nothing I'd be interested in taking.)

>>96906361
The EC fabius freak astartes mutt experiment squad, Tetra or something

more progress

>>96906361
The thing is, a lot of the exemplary battle units do niches something already did. What do atramentar do thats unique? What do red hand destroyers or dark sons of death or sunkillers do? Its not about being crazy whacky out there, its about making something mechanically unique-ish to represent a specific formation or unit.

If you just want to make assault marines that all have heavy chainswords? You can do that. Thats in line with the sort of units that you find in exemplary battles.

made a 3k list, need input as i'm bad at making lists
going more for a "theme" than anything

Alpha Legion
Loyalist

HC:
>Cataphractii Praetor w/ paragon blade, volkite charger

C:
>Centurion w/ power sword
>Prime Advantage (the rewards of treason)

T:
>Despoiler Squad w/ 2x plasma pistol, 2x power axe, vexilla, nucio-vox, sergeant plasma pistol, sergeant power maul
>Prime Advantage (Logsitical Benefit)

>Despoiler Squad w/ 2x plasma pistol, 2x power axe, vexilla, nucio-vox, sergeant plasma pistol, sergeant power maul

LT:
>Rhino w/ havoc launcher
>Rhino w/ havoc launcher

RoT:
>Morlock Terminators (Legion Standard, 2x Chainfist, 3x Artificer power axe, 1x graviton shredder, 3x graviton gun)

LB:
>Land Raider Carrier

Armoured Support:
>Predator w/ plasma cannon
>Predator w/ plasma cannon
>Sicaran w/ punisher turret
>Sicaran w/ punisher turret

Headhunter Leviathal:
>Land Raider Explorator
>Land Raider Explorator

Army Vanguard Apex:
>Lernaen Terminators w/ Conversion beam cannon
>Lernaen Terminators w/ Conversion beam cannon

>5x Seekers
>Prime Advantage (Combat Veterans)

3k exactly

>>96912735
Whats the theme?

>>96912763
praetor leads a heavy armoured division (terminators, land raiders etc) while the centurion leads the core army division (despoilers and rhinos)

I might swap those guys out for assault squads though and not worry about the rhinos

What are thoughts on librarians in this edition?

Wanted to include one with my cataphractii but seems steep as fuck 115 points + 30 for any of the good disciplines.

>>96912796
biomancy is god tier on a melee unit (i.e terminators)

>>96912796
Very fun, there's a lot of cool tricks you can do with each of the different psychic disciplines.
>Biomancy for +2 str and t on the charge
>Pyromancy for tons of hits, especially funny against 4+ save units
>Telekinesis gives a 3+ Shrouded save with a psychic reaction, also a ranged attack with pinning 2
>Libby with force axe and Divination is probably the best challenge character marines can bring
>Telepathy provides Fear 1 in an edition without stubborn or fearless, don't even need to cast spells
>Thaumaturgy is... free at least.

>>96912488
How strong is the DA legion trait now?

Before seemed completely useful but they made up for it with detachments

>>96912830
In the right situation is can potentially be impactful
>DA unit lose combat badly
>Still pass their Ld check on a 6
>Can walk out of combat with Disengage
>Leaving them free to turn around and blast their attackers in the face or charge back in
Still niche, but at least it does something.

>>96912493
They’re based on the og mining suits that terminators were built from and require a lot more effort to pilot in exchange for a lot of bulk. Vulkan upgraded them with better reactors and shielding to handle more energy intensive weapons. In game they primarily wield large disintegrator cannons or mechanicum style plasma bombards which are basically plasma artillery guns. They also wield short range particle shredders which I imagine are horrific warcrime weapons. Additionally they commonly have deep strike beacons built in so all but their base variant has an easy time ds

>>96912789
Oh, right. Well it looks fine.

>>96912830
>How strong is the DA legion trait now?
Its a flat out better version of the 2e WB trait. Its Stubborn 6 army wide + phospex resistance.

>>96909021
>bs7 Moritat at its head.
Not a Command Sub Type, can't Paragon him

>>96913119

Moritats are BS6 base, so you can get BS7 without Paragon just by picking that option for the Alone and Forgotten buff.

>>96913182

Again. Pretty sure you can only buff the replacement Centurions with that Oath.

>>96913258
Anon read

>>96909657
(You) x2

>>96913031
what about replacing the despoilers for assault squads idea?

>>96913269

In my defence, this is a very poorly written edition.

>>96913269
>the only Units that may be chosen to fill those Command Slots are Centurions or Centurions in Terminator Armour.

anon read

>>96913354
now read the previous sentence, don't worry you'll get there

>>96913331
nta, but I think the rhinos might be a better idea.

>>96912830
It really depends on the situation, the unit and your rolls (obviously).
On a tactical squad ? Good rule. On the Lion ? Might as well not exist.
As other anons have said, succeeding a Ld check in the right situation may be clutch. Not running away from an objective, denying Vanguard points And the objective is impactfull.
That is IF you actually manage to pass the Ld 6 check wich is far from given.
It's not useless like before, but still in the bottom tier of legion rites of war.

Rate my 1.5 k doubles list for January at WHW. Every model with a lasrifle has blast chargers. Army is ultima pattern.
CRUSADE DET

6 man legate squad: Vox and vex.

Command tank: Vanquisher, Lascannon, Hunter killer missile

5 man Line command: Vox and vex

3 model aethon sentinel section: with melta lance and hunter killer missiles

2 x INF TERCIO DET

2X 15 man rifle sections: Vox and vex.

1x 2 man Hermes section: grenade launcher

ARMOUR TERCIO DET

2X Leman Russ Tank: Battlecannon, Autocannon, Multi-laser

>>96913371
anon it's pretty clear you can only take Centurions or Centurions in Terminator Armour for this Oath, the only exceptions are non-Troops, non-Command slots

you can still have a high command, you can still have transports and armour, but you can't get Line easily and you can't chain detachments to take 30 Mortificators and get 90 contemptors like you would in a normal army

it's just centurions

>>96912710
This is wonderful anon. Can you also post your army pics?

>>96913571
false
where does it say ALL command choices have to be a centurion ?
all command choices that were previously troop choice must be centurion/terminator centurion; and that's it; you can take whatever in the 3 regular command slots

>>96913591
i don't have many TS at the moment; the rest won't be as fancy as magnus but i wanted him to really stand out

>>96913331
I think you need the line, and rhinoes are good for actually keeping your dudes alive.

Assault marines are a better unit if you just need to be offensive with them, but theyre liable to get shot to swiss cheese before they get somewhere.

>>96903321 (OP)
40k vehicles look so stupid it's unreal. How did they create the most aesthetically pleasing universe in every other regard but completely fuck up vehicles?

>>96913620
>>96913571
>>96913371
>>96913354

Thanks for taking the time to prove my (>>96913333) point guys.

>>96913698

They're in heroic scale, same as the troops.

>>96913892
Anon poor writing doesn't make you retarded enough to not realize what "those" means. The only unclear thing with alone and forgotten is that GW never defined what a "choice" for a battlefield role is, which is important because they seen to regard it differently compared to what slot a unit is filling.

>>96913892
it's really not that bad. the rules are very detailed and if you can't bother reading the whole thing then yes obviously it become tedious

>>96913649
Also good. Can you share the colors you used for painting red?

>>96914007
airbrush
vallejo liquid metal rich gold
baal red
gloss varnish
and that's it

>>96914021
Cool. Thanks. I bought liquid gold, but dropper the idea to use it after I red the declaration: Danger
Harmful if inhaled. Very toxic to aquatic life with long lasting effects. Suspected of causing cancer.

Be careful with those colors

>>96914349
so much harmful shit these days, i'm not dying of old age for sure.
better die with a painted army than live with greytide

Is there any worth to 2 squads of 5 tartaros Terminators with chainfists and combi meltas as anti tank? Or even with tartaros speed are they too slow to footslog

>>96914391
melta isn't even great at tank hunting, they're more reliable at killing termis and custodes

>>96913892
>>96913571
>skims once
>decides to make shit up
>doubles down when confronted
>blames the writer for his stupidity
Congrats, you're the Dumb Faggot of The Day

How do mech kill tank?

>>96914391
Not terrible, but not great. Foot slogging tartaros are better equipped to be more flexible I think, won't always get to engage what you wanna send them after. Also too high a chance they'll get killed before getting in range to use those combi-meltas.

>>96914418
What you mean, melta is still great at killing tanks below AV 14 at short range.

>>96914391
The ranged options terminators get aren’t good anti tank. Chainfists are enough so focus guns on targeting either meq or teq

>>96914533
By allying in a melta kratos

>>96914533
vulturax

>>96914565
yes they are good at killing rhinos at 6"
they are unreliable at hurting anything else

>>96914587
There's more vehicles with 6 HP or less than just rhinos you fucking retard.

another thread, another retard who thinks penning 1/3 of the time with one shot is a good solution

>>96914104
all my marines have helmets i can't tell

>>96914777
cool titan

>>96914777
Sweet army

>>96914533

Krios Venator and Melta Thallax for light/medium armour, Vultarax for statusing the hell out of anything and chunking a couple of hull points off. The lascannon Thanatar isn't bad at anti-AV14 but it is quite pricy because it's paying for all that Thanatar durability.

I think a Reductor priest sitting with a bunch of photon thruster Thallax might be deceptively good anti-tank but I haven't actually tested it yet. +1S on all those S8 shots means anything that actually sits still has quite a bad day, and if there are no good tanks to shoot you can still put a lot of BS5 S8 AP2 into anything with a toughness value.

>>96914777
Nice cock

are saber tanks any good?

>>96914897
They seem , to me, rather pricy at 70-80pts for a one weapon platform with av12. and the 4 sabers cost 20pts on top of that.

>>96914897
Unfortunately their weapons are bad.

>>96906690
White Scars inductii on outrider bikes

>>96914980
I wish that could be true. Manwhile I can't force myself to finish assembling my land speeders or painting the rest of my army. I look at them and and think why should I bother. Even White Scar guides tell to maybe run A unit of 3 vulkite max. Not 5, and definitly not multiple squads of them. Same with speeders, both the regular javelins and the Kyzagan. I wonder what the dude writing the rules for WS thought, when he was puting them down. Lets make a low damage or mid damage "fast"(lore) weapon platform that has to not move , with its low resiliance, to use its weapons to full.

why aren't the "fallen angels" their own faction for chaos?

>>96915166
Because Calibanites aren't a chaos faction?

>>96915142
Having ridiculously fast multimeltas and arguably the best command squad in the game helps

>>96915166
Those are just traitor dark angels though. Did they even fight anyone until post heresy?

>>96915344
Kinda. Luther's dudes had been stationed in outposts since decades before the HH. And during the HH Corswain stopped by Caliban to get a few thousand dudes to reinforce his fleet while he was dogging Typhon. They went with him to Terra. And the DA inductii fluff from Siege of Cthonia hints that there were inductii-class legionaries from Caliban who seemed to pursue agendas parallel to the objectives of the legion in general. So there is cause to believe that Caliban's secessionist faction were active in subtle ways around the galaxy.

>>96914627
>The residential threadshitter still thinks all vehicles are AV 14 and cannot into math

>>96915166
Because this isn't 40k. The whole Fallen and DA infighting happened after the heresy, during The Scouring.

>>96914565
>melta is still great at killing tanks below AV 14
Then it's not good at killing tanks. Nobody cares about things below AV14 because that is the real goal. Whatever kills AV14 will also kill Rhinos

>>96915838
>Investing a heavy tank killing unit costing hundreds of points into killing a single cheap 60 points APC
Tell me you are a nogame without telling me you are a nogames.

>>96915838

I could burn my 250pt Thanatar lascannon on that rhino and hope both shots hit or I could have my chump techpriest/midboard thallax squad fire a 15pt meltagun at it once and watch it become an expanding cloud of steam over half the time because damage 6 is an instant kill against most light to medium vehicles, I know what I'm picking.

I still haven't heard a good reason for the kratos to have the stable subtype

>>96915993
Its a big dedicated weapons platform?

>>96915993
It's the same size as a super-heavy tank like the typhon or cerberus, yet only has stable and none of the other benefits of being a super-heavy vehicle.

maybe I should just make an all-cataphractii list

well, plus land raiders and leviathans

>>96915889
>>96915908
Bro no way the other guy has only a single Rhino, 0 Predators and Sicarans, no Vindicators and no Land Raiders. There will be a good target

>>96916068
Wait, apparently nu cataphractii will get shown on Friday in a release box with 20 breachers and a leviathan a la the numkiii box

>>96916155

The heavy AT can shoot the big stuff, the meltaguns can clear up the small to medium stuff with great efficiency, as opposed to bringing 600 extra points of heavy AT because you need to kill rhinos as well as raiders.

(Assuming you're not Death Guard, in which case multimelta HSS can disembark from a transport and delete their target vehicle because they actually do get to combine Melta + Heavy.)

>>96916155
>Only take heavy tank killing units, because they also kill rhinos
>People point out shooting those units at rhinos is a waste
>Bro no way they only brought rhinos, just shoot the heavy tank killing unit at those instead of the rhinos!

Are people really this fucking retarded. 6

>>96916213
>10 DG Multi-melta HSS in a Rhino
This feels like extra *extra* heavy antitank. Feels like the "10 Termies in a Spartan" equivalent of the antitank world, and despite my previous comment, even I am not sure one can justify that much AT

>>96916276
>>96916213
Its not even great AT because you dont get the DG benefit when disembarking, and multi meltas have a low melta range.

It feels more designed to explode dreads/custodes.

>>96916296

I'm pretty sure you do get the DG benefit when disembarking, unless it was in the FAQ somewhere. Just have to make sure you move less than 4" from where the models appear next to the exit door.

>>96916264
Bro what the fuck are you on about? I said "the only AT that matters is the one that can kill AV14". You are saying "bring only AT". That's a whole different thing you twitter brain

>>96916311
Dont you automatically count as moving when disembarking? Same as for deep strike.

>>96916360

You count as moving, but Remorseless Advance doesn't give a damn about whether you count as moving, it says "if you haven't moved more than 4", you get the benefit of Heavy" and getting out of a transport can easily be done while moving less than 4".

>>96916324
>Whatever kills AV14 will also kill Rhinos
Is literally what you said you fucking troll. No one said bring only AT. Take your meds.

>>96916360
>DG trait: a non-vehicles model that has moved less than 4" and didn't rush can still claim Heavy benefits
>Disembark: if the models don't do a Normal Move, they count as having moved
Funny thing: if DG disembark and don't move, they'll count as having moved...but if they do move 4", they won't, as Disembark doesn't make you count as having moved if you did make a normal move

>>96916417
>>96916407

Same logic applies in a couple of other places - Reductor gets +1S against stationary vehicles, but the Stable subtype says "gain benefits of remaining stationary" not "count as not having moved" because otherwise a Kratos cruising around at battle speed would get shredded by the anti-fortification specialists.

>>96916414
You said to only take heavy tank killing units. This is saying to take only heavy tank killing units in your army, eschewing the use of troops and other things.
You didn't mean that ...but you did say that.
To say what you really meant you should've written "only take heavy tank killing units for your antitank", which limits then to only the antitank portion of your overall army.

>>96916498
Legit psychotic behaviour anon, get help. Or deep strike off a chair, I don't care.

>>96916440
So, moving your vehicles at least 1" (and avoiding immobilized) completely shields your vehicles from being affected by a Reductor?

>>96916523
Autistic behavior, anon. Psychosis means hallucinations and/or delusions instead.

>>96916498
ESL

>>96916524
Well yea but that also fucks with your heavy weapons in most cases

>>96916163
yeahhh but when I think about it, if i'm going to be taking cataphractii I might as well just take lernaens instead as line is better than vanguard (even if its line 1), they have WS5, have hatred, and can now take the same weapons as a cataphractii squad

the only way to get some medium range (i.e 24") firepower on cataphractii is via tyrant siege etc, otherwise its just combi-bolters
saturnine doesnt have this issie as they have plasma bombard and disintegrators, but I want cataphractii not saturnine

>>96916565

Remember to give your Lerns the conversion beamers because it's basically a pint-size tank gun, it's nuts.

I've found five lerns with one fist, four axes and the beamer are basically impossible to remove from an objective without smashing an equivalent melee heavy squad into them, which is handy.

>>96916565
Yeah it's hard to pick other units in cataphractii now as AL, those are just the perfect package. Elite melee unit stats, solid long range shooting with the conversion beamer, Line 1 so they sit there and farm an objective instead of having to waddle somewhere to be useful.

>>96916662
>>96916799
2 squads+command deathstar in land raiders, with 2-3 squads at the back?
then add in some spice like leviathans if I have the points (I should)

and if I have the points, slap banestrike combis instead of chargers on them?

The best AT against AV14 is ignoring it

>>96916880
actually its lascutters

>>96916848

Banestrikes are an expensive upgrade when your stock guns are already better than normal bolters, I'd just get more dudes. Some laser destroyer rapiers wouldn't go amiss, or a ROT Crimson Paladin squad. Crimson Pallies are basically Lerns with deep strike, even if a couple of them are stuck with shitty power swords, so you can drop them on a point to immediately cap it.

>>96916848
Nah keep the chargers, the conversion beamers will be doing all the ranged damage anyway.

>>96916880
I am facing three land raiders tomorrow. I expect to test the contrary of this theory.

>>96917135
Only gotta deal with what comes out of the land raiders. Land raider shooting is pathetic now honestly, specially if they gotta move to get LOS. My rhinos have survived one or more land raiders shooting at them several times now.

>>96917155
>Only gotta deal with what comes out of the land raiders
Thats a load of terminators of various kinds. Also some mortus poisoners.

But yea, im honestly not TOO worried about the actual land raiders, the spartan probably has to die though.

>>96917169
>Three land raiders and a spartan
How many points are you playing?! That's over 1k points in transports alone.

>>96917169

I do think people have been underrating Mortus and DG Tacsupps, purely because a squad of 10+ poison 2+ flamers can kill damn near any meat unit by stacking so many templates on it. Good to remember that you get to react-move away from dismounts if they make a normal move after getting out.

>>96917181
Sorry, I was counting the spartan as a land raider. So its two normal land raiders and a sparta.

Were playing 3k.

>>96917188
That still has to be at least half of the points tied up in terminators and their transports.
Just have some expendable units in front to eat the charges, then keep dropping damage 2 pie plates with AP 2 or breaching on them until they stop moving.

>>96917212
>then keep dropping damage 2 pie plates with AP 2 or breaching on them until they stop moving.
Dont have any.

But yea, the army is basically those three armored bricks, besides that (and their contents of grave wardens, deathshroud and mortus poisoners) theres just an arquitor, two rhinoes, three tac squads and a breacher squad (and the characters)

>>96916998
i'll be taking morlocks for a retinue for my termie praetor

>>96917295
Well you do have something to kill terminators, right?

Have become very fond of my dual gravis plasma cannon boxnought. The damage it can do to all kinds of infantry for only 135 points is disgusting.

>>96917308
>Well you do have something to kill terminators, right?
Yea, six rapiers, a kratos and some thunder hammers. Also seekers I guess.

Of those the rapiers and kratos are however going to be mainly concerned with the kratos till its dead. Or maybe the arquitor since thats the other half of the long ranged shooting.

>>96917298

Not tempted by Huscarls? They're rather better at punching than morlocks due to the crit fists, and the morlock advantages of a smaller min squad size and a nuncio-vox are mostly relevant when they're with a primarch who can then be kept unpinned and squeezed into a land raider. 5 Huscarls+ termie character fits anyway and it's less important to keep statuses off the squad since they're less of an investment and get the benefit of Heavy.

>>96917436
banner and grav

>>96917782
>>96917782
>>96917782