these evidently arent the same thing. considering its stated to be a fossilized, millions of years old creature, is it such a stretch to say the original jockey could be some sort of ancient ancestor to the engineer and by extension humans, and that the xenos are still an ancient horror that werent brought into existence by a gay robot

Ridley's a booze-sodden washed-up hack with a weird gay robot fetish, what else is new

>>211540206 (OP)
>considering its stated to be a fossilized, millions of years old creature
“Alien life form. Looks like it’s been dead a long time. Fossilized. Looks like it’s grown out of the chair.”
That’s all we get

>>211541213
dont know where I got millions of years, probably from a 4chan post like a tard. anyways point still stands, they dont have to be the same thing even if they take place in the same universe. maybe they made engineers like engineers made humans

>>211540206 (OP)
Its not the same thing. The original engineer is like a Biblical giant and the prometheans worshipped them as the true creators

This is made clear by David saying "mortal after all" because the prometheans live for 500000 years. So if this supposed extremely advanced superhuman species can die, so can the ones who created them (the original jockey/engineer)

i dont have anything against trying to expand upon the Alien universe but it is kinda stupid trying to make sense of the Alien itself. You mean to tell me that humans stumble upon a lifeform that just so happens to need a human face to wrap around? Pffft that doesn't make any sense... UNLESS they were engineered to be that way. It's something you can explain that way but it's hard to make sense of.

why would anyone bother making xenomorphs in the first place?

What if prometheus guy was just a manlet?

>>211541910
>the prometheans live for 500000 years
whut

>>211542684
Ridley's engineers live for many hundreds of thousands of years. That's why sacrificing their lives to create is so important to them. And they've lived so long, somewhere on the way they lost the ability to naturally reproduce

>>211542132
Biological machinery is usually much more efficient in doing its task.
The xenomorphs were originally biotech that was incredibly varied.

>>211542684

>>211540206 (OP)
The only ones worth watching are Alien and Aliens so who gives a shit

>there is now a distinction between a space jockey and an engineer
I hate this timeline

>>211543081
>ages ago they abandoned sex
Literally me

>>211543222
checked.
digits don't lie!

>>211540206 (OP)
Can anyone explain why those stripes on his arms just fuse with the seat and look like its part of the seat originally? Are they supposed to be some kind of cables or tubes attached to him? Seems rather restrictive since it means he has no freedom of movement on his arms.

>>211543184
so you hate them being one and the same and you hate them being different. what do you want then. you cant say for it to have never happened cuz it did

>>211543325
He took the fossilpill

>>211543184
I don't mind it. If we're forced to suffer including the engineers in the story, then they can be made to modify their bodies to merge with thr chair and/or grow a pilot for that specific purpose. There's zero way to ever include a live space jockey otherwise. It's too silly looking if it's disconnected from the chair

>>211543325
Non meme answer. I think it's seat belts for them to survive high speed travel.
hold your arms back on both sides and try to lift your chest up, pretty much impossible to do outside of like half an inch of movement.

>>211543325
Maybe they were malleable and stretched around easily. But they dried up and solidified with the corpse.

>>211543325
it is body horror based on the fact of having your body interconnected with bio tech.
like that scorn game.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3H_ayWPssuc

>>211541694
From what i understand of the prequels engineers made all life on earth and it was billions of years ago, not millions

Look on my works, ye mighty elephant men, and despair.

>>211540206 (OP)
The Space Jockey, the Prometheus Engineers, and the human-sized "Engineers" on the planet in Covenant that David genocides are three different things

>>211540206 (OP)
One's a space jockey, and the other is a baskin jockE.[/spoiler

>>211548147
Correct
Space jockey = original giant engies
Prometheus = intermediate 10 ft engies
Convenant = lesser 6 ft engies

>>211548487
Wrong. Original are pure bodybuilder engineers. They went crazy over time and became biomodified suit engineers. Went even more crazy over time and became space jockeys merged with organic technology and their ships

>>211541910
>>211542919
>>211543081
>>211543184
>>211548147
>>211548487
>>211548650
i don't consider Prometheus canon.

>>211548650
>>211548748

>>211540206 (OP)
Even Ridley alluded to them not being the same saying the third movie will show us "who" is sitting in that chair.

>>211543066
Hm yes instead of a robot I shall make a spiky black alien with acid blood, that'll be ideal for building my house or farming crops

>>211549095
We already know it's David

>Prometheans are Harkonnens
all makes sense now

>>211550491
Dunc is not canon and Harkonnen have red hair. Dunc just copied off Prometheus' style because they're creatively bankrupt

>>211540206 (OP)
the space jockey and its ship are way bigger too and have different interior

>>211542144
They have unproportionally different length of arms.

>>211540206 (OP)
>brought into existence by a gay robot

You did not even watch the movie

>>211552593
It's in Covenant though.

>>211540206 (OP)
Chicken space jockey!

>>211552925
>I told you to be peaceful! Love one another! Stop the violence! Look what you've done, making me kill you!

>>211552925
even if you're gonna make him chimp out, why make him do some retarded gorilla smash like this kek. hollywood is so fucking low iq.

>>211553220
that one is just a footsoldier. we dont know what happened to promethean hitler but its very likely not this roidrager

how did he end up in the cryosleep bed when we saw him kill himself in the opening scene? did he actually survive in the end and the opening scene is actually the ending scene?
i feel like we've got this movie wrong for all these years.

>>211549270
>that'll be ideal for building my house or farming crops
Mexican + chestburster =

>Giger creates some strange alien-like thing that may or may not be a creature connected to the ship, its left deliberately vague because it's fucking... ALIEN.
>"nah nigga its a little elephant man lmao or some other shit like some god shit or something i dunno im a genius btw" - ridley scott probably

>>211553448
What did you expect? Kung fu moves?

I hate Ridley Slop.

>>211554262
more effort than "hulk smash", have him stomp some heads or rip some limbs off since he's so strong. a double diagonal palm chop to the shoulders looks like something a toddler would do.

>>211553754
It's a different guy, watch the extended opening scene.

>>211553965
>giger shoves his pussy alien cock fantasies into an Alien movie
what a weirdo

>>211540206 (OP)
Ridley Scott has been senile for over a decade.

>>211540206 (OP)
> brought into existence by a gay robot
The Canon has two options:
>Option 1
David created all xenomorphs, somehow contradicting the lore of AvP that shows aliens fighting predators in pre-industrial human civilizations.
>Option 2
David creates *a* alien. There are other aliens, and we can assume the only way David made aliens was by manipulating the black goo which was pre-disposed to create aliens (engineer plan).
Option two is much better and fits with pre-existing lore without contradiction.

>>211556101
>somehow contradicting the lore of AvP
lmao AvP is stupid fanfic nonsense

>>211556101
prometheus contradicts the original alien since the ship carries facehugger eggs

>>211552550
Are you implying manlets arent deformed creatures

>>211556580
wasnt it implied that what burst out of the jockey laid the eggs? Hence why it burned a hole through the floor

i didn't mind the jockey being an engineer. i've never understood why people get upset about it. to me it's way creepier than anything in the original alien

>>211557667
No, it was a cargo ship carrying eggs for an arbitrary purpose and one of them got loose.

>>211559530
It's not. The movie is literally called "Alien". That means foreign and unknown. There's nothing creepy, mysterious or 'alien' if it's just human's ancestors, which have been to Earth many times and left a map to get there.

>>211556101
AvP has never been canon to anything. It's just fun brainless entertainment. Learn how canon works.

>>211540206 (OP)
If we take Prometheus and everything after it as cannon, I always saw the xeno physiology as being a product of something like carcinization. Basically, convergent evolution has produced xenos multiple times, and David simply provided the necessary conditions for them most recently. In this sense, the xenos, while indeed created by a gay robot, represent an almost elemental force that can reemerge de novo time and time again. The black substance is merely a tool to activate this evolutionary force/process.

>>211562234
ok but Prometheus isnt called Alien is it bucko

>>211565237
plebian

I’m glad Ridley Scott is no longer allowed to rape the franchise

>>211548287
Ha-haa!

>>211565820
also theres the xeno mural in Prometheus which straight up confirms that they already existed before David, and could be the Deacon we see at the end, aka the ‘engineer xeno’. as we know from Alien 3, they can adapt to host different life forms, so its possible that David did indeed create at least the first human version of the xeno, which is slightly different from the one we see in the original alien, which is slightly different to the ones in aliens… etc.

>>211565820
>I always saw the xeno physiology as being a product of something like carcinization. Basically, convergent evolution has produced xenos multiple times
My head canon is that the universe is mostly dead, civilizations have come and gone. The Engineers found the alien and the black goo was derived from them. The black goo allowed the Engineers to adapt to the perils of space travel, super stem cells, programmable in a way. To build and create but also destroy. Aliens are a highly evolved form of life because of their survivability and adaptability, maybe part of the reason why other forms of life died out. Because of the state of the universe the Engineers saw it as their mission to spread life. The reason why the black goo can so easily return back to xenomorphs is because the black goo is ultimately built from aliens.

David created a biomechanical strain of an unknown ancient parasitic alien species connected to the black goo and that strain is known as the Xenomorph. It's confusing because it happens after Alien: Covenant since he needed the colonists to perfect his organism.

>>211567785
>>211568822
Their name is not actually Xenomorph. That's just a catch all term for unknown alien beings. The Engineers could be called Xenomorphs. Gorman was just trying to tell the Marines that some extraterrestrial could be involved with was ridiculous to them and Ripley was a psycho. They need to come up with a real name for the creature like how Predators are called Yautja.

>>211556101
>and we can assume the only way David made aliens was by manipulating the black goo which was pre-disposed to create aliens
They've said as much but only in a short movie that many will never see

>>211570982
It's also in the book with his drawings but that's even more obscure. There's some interesting stuff on the Engineers in it as well.
https://imgur.com/gallery/4yoGf

>>211543325
it just looks cool. hr giger made it look cool

>>211548147
the covenant ones were another race created by the engineers, they just resembled the engineers more than humans

>>211548650
>>211548487
the prometheus one at the beginning and end are meant to be the same ones

>>211572286
So very, very wrong. Covenant was the engineers, David says exactly this. He's not saying "oh I killed another of their creations." No, he says I killed the fucking engineers. And the one at the beginning and end are obviously showing that they've changed drastically in those thousands of years. And Prometheus at the beginning was not supposed to create humans but he did.

>>211543325
>take a closer look at the picture
>realize the only thing he could do with arms restricted like that is jerk the handles of his huge penis telescope/gun off

>>211572890
How else do you expect him to fly the ship? Unironically, he swivels the chair and needs to shoot cum into wall vaginas to tell it what to do

>>211572535
so if they are engineers and they wait eagerly for their spacefaring kin to return that would mean they're on other planets too then

>>211572890
>>211573028
What the fuck was Giger's problem?

>>211573245
Not necessarily. The poem David keeps repeating is about a once great empire that thought very highly of themselves, that is completely destroyed and turned to dust, with nothing remaining.

>>211562180
Incredible that they used that device to sniff farts from across the galaxy

>>211540206 (OP)
>it worse

Ridley forgot to use the forced perspective with child actors in space suits to give the jockey and room the right scale.

>>211542919
If they're that advanced why do they have to die to just do what humans at this point could reasonably do if they tried (create mirror life).

>>211540206 (OP)
It evolved. The goo.

Why do gay nerds demand strict continuity in their 50 year old sci-fi franchises?
Is it really not enough to tell a cool sci-fi story with the same tone and a few identifiable aesthetic elements like the spooky alien, dirty industrial spaceships, and maybe some androids.

>>211540206 (OP)
Stop trying to canonize slop squirted out by a retard to sell tickets to other retards(you).

>>211552925
This entire scene is based on a comic book where the engineer fights synths. Except the reason is completely missing. After I found out about that this scene retroactively a trillion times worst.

The engineer is greeting a synth calmly and then abruptly wrecks him apart, like in the movie. Except that was because through his telepathic powers or enhanced senses/intelligence he figured out that they were there to attack him so he attacks pre-emptively.
In Prometheus the engineer is calmly greeting the synth and then attacks abruptly for no real reason other than vague "disgust for humanity". This is played off as a big mystery but no, it's actually just a "reference" to something that happened in the comic book that is no longer canon.

>>211578447
I only watched the first 3 alien movies. I have absolutely no idea what all this lore is but I'm glad i don't kek. Can't understand why normies need every mystery to be "solved."

>>211578447
It's something deeply ingrained in the mentality of the terminally online wiki addict. They don't have a personality of their own so they need their video game/movie/cartoon fiction "canon" to take its place, and if they can't use mental gymnastics to line up every iteration of a franchise, it shatters the illusion.

In reality, you're allowed to just ignore subpar derivative works and not be bothered about whether they retroactively "damage" the continuity of the original (see also Star Wars, etc)

>>211578802
creepy inexplicable Geiger artwork that triggers the primal horror/awe centers of our brain with tantalizing imagery combining incomprehensible lovecraftian abominations with sex and death

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

a cartoon monster man punching a guy with a visible "THOK!" sound effect

wrap that up in an ironic drake meme if you want

>>211578899
But guess what, the "creepy inexplicable Geiger artwork" movie scene is actually just a reference to the "a cartoon monster man punching a guy with a visible "THOK!" sound effect".

>>211578956
Plants grow out of fertilizer but we don't eat the fertilizer, tardo.

>>211540206 (OP)
People who got obsessed about some throw away background set design and created thier own head cannon are just as pathetic as Star Wars nerds who know the back story of every bounty hunter on the empire strikes back bridge that were visible for 20 seconds.
For example appartly the droid on the left was trying to overthrow the empire and was fighting some Druid supremacy faction, I don’t know the details

>>211579066
Except it's not a "head cannon", it's actually from 2 decades of licensed material which deposited money directly into Ridley's Scott's account.

>>211548748
Unfathomably based

>>211579380
>unfathomably
I think the based lvl is quite fathomable.
Zoomers overuse superlatives.
It makes you sound illiterate.

>>211579066
wish you'd cannon your head

>>211579768
So do I.
I actually have tried to kill myself in a way that should have worked.
I Basiccly believe in quantum suicide now.
You are still a dork for caring about the space jockey though

>>211578899
In fact, in many ways the comics make the engineer's goals and nature far more mysterious. In Prometheus script the engineer references literal Jesus. They took Jesus to their planet and taught him and then sent him back to earth but he was crucified, that's clearly what it was referenced. Then he just gets angry at the violence, that's it. They just see humanity as a bad plantation. The moral of the story is that the engineers are perfectionist creatures that lament the lack of hippies on planet earth.

The engineer in the comic is far too smart and perceptive for even a synth to understand. And ultimately he would just demand humanity to exist as a side species and take the planet for himself in exchange of dealing with the aliens. They're indifferent to humans, they probably see them as wild animals. They communicate by exploding thoughts into their heads, they don't have to talk to people. A single one of them thought he could just take all of humanity for himself.

>>211579937
I literally do not care about your moronic cartoon slop.

>>211579961
I want to be like you

>>211578956
What the literal fuck are you talking about, you absolute fucking retard? The design for the Space Jockey came from Giger's own painting Necronomicon V in the late 70s. He was literally an artist for a fucking Lovecraft fanzine. Get your fucking 1988 comic book shit out of here.

>>211580420
I'm talking about this >>211578802

>>211580457
Calling the Giger artwork a reference to your shitty comic book is mentally retarded.
>but in Prometheus-
who the fuck cares?

>>211543325
the whole ship is an engineer and jockey is a decoy to attract curious apes, like an angler fish. Fuck it I'm making up my own alien lore
>>211540206 (OP)
>were you there?
is what Ridley says about historical fiction you think there's any coherence in his senile head for space stories?
>>211555318
Allegedly the brain doesn't really differentiate between excitement from danger and sexual arousal. Given the success of the franchise I guess it reasonates

>>211541694
they aren't from the same universe.
Prequlshit is not canon

>>211542104
The more you try to explain it, the more retarded it gets

>>211543401
It didn't happen tho.
If it condradicts canon, then it's not canon
>>211543932
Nah, it just doesn't exist

>>211549095
Ridley just doesn't care

>>211556101
The only option is that anything past the theatrical version of the two original movies is dogshit and doesn't matter

>>211565864
Alien prequel, retard.
Don't want the baggage? Stay away from existing things

>>211565820
>If we take Prometheus and everything after it as cannon
we don't.
It contradicts the actual movies and shits on them
>>211567475
ridley didn't care, and it's still shit

>>211578447
>what's wrong with rewriting things?
>whay can't I take Moby Dick and rewrite some chapeters?
Leave existing shit alone, faggot.
Are you too stupid to create new shit like every other generation did?
Are you able to tell a "monster kills people" that doesn't piss on existing stuff?

>>211578810
>Can't understand why normies need every mystery to be "solved."
Going back to solving stuff is the so anti-artistic that it makes me want to vomit
If you are into that shit you literally don't care about what you are watching

>>211578447
Why do you slopslurpers demand 50yo sci fi to be ruined just to fill 2 hours of your uneventful life?

No, it's not enough, cattle

>>211540206 (OP)
Prometheus was an abomination.

>all those brainlets seething at loregods
Stick to capeshit if you hate it when a movie is thought provoking.

>>211540206 (OP)
if the top one had been styled differently then it could be that the engineers were paying homage to another race. possibly.
but it just looks like Ridly's concept is that the bottom one was always a beefy white dude in a bone suit.
way to trash your legacy ridley. how the fuck does he not know why people like the original?

>>211562234
the fear in the original alien is largely personal, the idea that you meet god and he loathes you and sees you as nothing more than an irritant is frightening to me, i was surprised when 4chan hated the scene at the end with david and the awoken engineer i found it so unsettling. i think if that film had been an entirely new ip like a lovecraft or arthur machen adaptation it would've been received better

>>211556580
It was not the same moon where the base and ship was.

>>211567785
Yeah, good take. Black blood being refined from xenos makes most sense without over retarding everything ridley scott style.

Would add xenos real value is not its form, it's just a resiliant parasitic predator by the end of the day, but the things you can learn from its chemistry and mutagenic black blood

>>211578802
>In Prometheus the engineer is calmly greeting the synth and then attacks abruptly for no real reason other than vague "disgust for humanity"
It's just been woken up and is confused by what's going on, and communicates seeking information. Then, as it's putting the pieces together as to what must have happened and how badly things have gone wrong, one of the humans smacks the woman, leading it to conclude that humans are just as violent as ever and therefore he must join in on the smacking about. Makes perfect sense.

>>211573757
>What the fuck was Giger's problem?
Cocaine and horny.

>>211540206 (OP)
I've got a theory... maybe they were written 40 years apart with absolutely 0 plan for the later movies to exist.
Stop trying to make sense of this shit.

>>211586956
>stop discussing movies, chuds

>>211585356
You statement is ambiguous.
Because if you mean og lore is king then it's ok
Otherwise if you mean that any new bucket of lore added to a franchise is king, then you are the what makes fanbases bad.

>>211585653
The scene is ridiculous, in a ridiculous film.
and even if it was executed in a godd, compeltely different way in a good, completely different movie (actually competent), it would still not belong to Alien

>>211543081
>I CANT BREED
>gets raped by the Trilobite

>>211580842
where are his fangs :(

>>211579260
looks Talmudic

>>211585653
The engineers could have worked in a different franchise, but in the Alien franchise they just ruin the mystery of the unknown and the weird, ancient beings that apparently exist in the universe. They also shit all over the atmosphere and ambiance that Giger's designs inspire.
As for your comment about meeting "god", those engineer faggots wouldn't inspire fear, but disappointment. They're just towering brutes and retards, who in no way inspire awe, nor do they reflect a race that has existed for millions, if not billions of years.

>>211542132
Because Weyland gave his robot feels so he got upset over how he was created, and how his creator was also created by another species, so he worked on something to wipe out both

>>211579260
It's so fucking stupid that they included the trunk, which is clearly meant to be a tube connected to its mask, and not a part of its original biology. I mean, it's literally based on what real life jet pilots wear.

>>211587678
Headcanon and franchisefaggotry spawned from the desire to legitimate bad cashgrab movies made by peopel who literally don't care is not "discussin movies"

Who wrote Ozymandias?

>>211588180
No. It's great because they're supposed to be otherworldy and merged with biological technology. They're not supposed to have familiar human faces like it's star trek.

>>211591991
nothing about that pic looks like he's merged with technology, just a elephant like freak with leathery skin.
most of prometheus looks good to me, except they should have made it more obvious to the dumb audience that the engineers see their surroundings differently and their language is basically DNA rather than words. also show the distinction between a fully biomechanic space jockey and the military engineers that wear the suits.

>>211591991
No, it's not. The original creature in the movie is clearly biomechanical, and has either been merged with mechanical parts or has been grown into the chair to function solely as a pilot. That explains the tube being merged into it.
However, for the original, non-biomechanical creatures to look like that is fucking idiotic, because it's clearly meant to be the oxygen supply to the helmet, and not a trunk.

>>211592769
Yes, it was. It's been that way since longer than you've been alive, kid.

>>211590398
This kills the Davidcel.

>>211593022

How psychotic would David have been in the third movie? I imagine him as King of the Xenomorphs leading a horde of thousands of them he birthed from the colonists. And he drops them all onto Earth to kill everyone has he smiles and looks on

>>211574000
You tard, it's fucking Ozymandius, the story of how you can be the greatest of your time, but it all goes to dust

>>211594099
Ayo why this nigga start talk about harry potter shit outa nowhere?

>>211595000
Checked. Because Weyland kept him in a little cupboard under the stairs. It made him very cranky.

>>211540206 (OP)
>they still think its some elephant creature

>>211542104
they can wrap around other animals, not just humans

>>211595427
Nope, it's just humans. You're thinking about toys which are for children and not canon

>>211543115
prometheus is kino and im tired of pretending it aint

>>211595472
>Alien 3 dog/ox xeno
one of the best ayys in the series too

>>211597288
It's because Giger was involved, the lips carried over from his sexy alien concept.

>>211597750
Would you kiss the sexy female xeno lips?

>>211599485
Yes to upper and lower, unsure about the inner ones.

>>211540206 (OP)
Just accept that everything with Engineers is non-canon and it's all much better.

>>211542104
>need a human face to wrap around
But they just need anything that has a breathing hole.

>>211600179
Not true, and very stupid. Snake, crab, and gorilla xenos were far more dumb than engineers. It's only good for silly comic books

>>211578447
If continuity is not to be kept than make something completely original. Prometheus could be about ancient aliens creating life on Earth without any connection to Alien - it would be practically the same movie. There's almost nothing in Alien to suggest it should develop into the search for the origin of humanity.

>>211578810
Prometheus actually begins to solve something that wasn't even part of the mystery in Alien. I hate it so much.