Well anons, what did you think?

Glad we didn't have to endure Gayle Doornic, let's hope she's taken more acting lessons. I still don't care about the Mule, looks and acts like a villain from Spy Kidz, but I am glad that they recast the actor. Dawn, Day and Dusk are great as always, looking forward to seeing them all more and Demarzel.

is it just me or does this season look considerably cheaper than the previous ones?

>>212704777
I'm guessing they're saving the budget for some big action CGI crap later in the season.

Psychohistory is a form of science initially developed by Han Fastolfe. Combining history, psychology, and mathematical statistics, the science can predict a nearly exact model of the behaviour of large groups of people. It is the study of the reaction of human conglomerates when exposes to to economic and social stimuli. Psychohistory was expanded through the efforts of Hari Seldon, Dr. Gaal Dornick and other mathematicians.

Seldon used Psychohistory to predict the fall of the Galactic Empire and a following dark age lasting thirty thousand years. In an effort to stave off the barbarism that civilization would fall into, Seldon used his new science to nudge events in a certain direction that would see the dark age reduced to only a thousand years through the establishment of the Foundations, two groups of scientists and engineers tasked with the mission of preserving science and civilization.

>>212704669 (OP)
Can't believe they recast Persbrandt for literally no reason. And for Asbæk of all people? Total reddit actor.

>>212704880
I believe he couldn't fit his schedule in to match Foundation. But he's a problematic actor due to drug abuse and rape allegations.

>>212704880
>Persbrandt
i dont even remember the mule being in S1 or S2?

ugly brownoid show

>>212704874
>Seldon
bazinga!

>>212704669 (OP)
I got to be in the right mood for this le serious scifi. It's so disconnected from anything familiar.

>be me, i watched s1 & s2 , could barely remember what happened , watched one of those recap shows on youtube , know i am totally confused and have no idea whats little idea whats going on

These books should be left as books , did not Asimov himself say it could not be made into film.

>>212704669 (OP)

It was an effective showing of the Mule, the dialed back usage of Pace is more of a shame, but so far the storytelling for episode 1 was sleek and on point which the series has had a hard time with in previous seasons.

Though it does not seem to bode well with pull back of Pace and using the other two more when they're weaker actors, the old man can chew in a scene but the youngest is just weak in comparison.

What doesn't make sense to me is we now have the ability to restart the robot race based on what was told in the first episode..so it doesn't make a whole lot of sense not to rebuild the robot race with how well they've sinched her to the genetic dynasty, imagine a reborn AI race and what it could do against their enemies. The true nature of empire is being wasted. They could conquer the galaxy again.

Also chemistry between demerezel or however you write her name and pace's day was one of highlights of the show, and it lost a step so far.

the tradeoff for sleek storytelling is losing those big chewy scenes.

>>212705670
He appears in a few visions Gayle has in S2.
>>212704974
True enough. But still, Pilou Asbæk? Really?

>>212705745
Sex with Demerzel

Are the books worth reading ?

>>212706158
>Sex with Demerzel
Thats a fracking toaster bro.

>>212704974
I will say having an actor with an air of antagonism is a good thing, you want your villains to be evil.

>>212706303
love me some sexy toasters

how did people not know demerzel was a robot if she never aged for 1000 years?

>>212706255

The best things about the series aren't even in the books, or very different from how they're shown in the novella's

>>212704856
I'm not sure what fucking large scale action scenes even happen in Second Foundation. The Mule's Empire basically gets destroyed offstage and the entire plot of Now You Don't is Arcadia running around in a smallscale political thriller story, which is the point because the Second Foundation wants to keep shit low-key to cover their tracks because they had to reveal themselves way too early in order to prevent the Mule from throwing the entire Plan off.

But yeah, I'm sure they'll shove some pewpew space war scenes in there anyway because slop. If they wanted to do the big action scenes, Bel Riose's invasion or even the war against the First Citizen was the time to do it.

>>212706389

my guess is they memory wipe everyone...wait that is a good thought because they've broadcast her appearance in the past next to the Emperor's

>>212706389
I figure they just assumed she was a clone.

>>212706389
Maybe say she's is cloned or something.

I'm still hate-watching this garbage to see what new insult to their viewers they come up with each new episode.
Pilou Reddit as the Mule with no Magnifico was a particularly ballsy "Fuck you" to the source material. I'm continuously baffled by how terrifyingly bad all the foundation plotlines are, but then the empire stuff with Dawn/Day/Dusk (which is fully made up) is actually decent (although even that's gotten kinda shit since last season). Feels like two completely different shows.

>>212706440
The books do not lend themselves to TV well, IMHO. That's why they're basically running with fanfiction.

>>212706486
Lee Pace can make anything good, it's as simple as that.

Watching the show with my mom and she absolutely fucking hates Gale's actress. Keeps pausing every time she appears to complain about how bad her acting is. She even mentioned that Gale's actress is so bad that she throws Jared Harris off his game.

>>212706615

Not necessarily, he seemed bored playing off of Dr Bashir who was doing his best to chew. I think he's just bored of being the exposition guy.

>>212706389
It was more or less stated in one episode that people just assumed her to be a clone just like the emperors.

>>212706509
I keep hearing that but that honestly sounds like a complete cop-out. The only thing that makes Foundation's narration non-conventional is the many time skips, which shouldn't be an issue at all to work into a TV show. Just structure the show as a sort of anthology series with a continuous background narrative that gets picked back up with each new "story". If you're a so-called professional writer/showrunner and your excuse for hacking at the source material with a chainsaw is that "time skips are too difficult", then holy fuck, why are you allowed anywhere near a multi-hundred-million dollar production?

>>212706527

/thread

>>212706695
Here's the thing. All the stuff that is more book accurate sucks in the Foindation, the best stuff is what they made up for the show. The emperors are completely made for the show and its the best part of it.

In truth, the books themselves are not great as a whole. They have great ideas, but narratively they just aren't very good and the characters are not very memorable. Seldon and the Mule are more or less the only ones that left any sort of impact on me.

>>212706975
>All the stuff that is more book accurate sucks in the Foindation
Literally none of it is book-accurate. You have the foundation part, which is the part that's supposed to be based on the books, but is essentially just fan fiction very loosely reusing characters and locations from the book. And then you have the empire part, which is completely original since it doesn't have any source material to rape and butcher.

My complaint is, why bother "adapting" anything if you're going to willfully ignore and spit on the source material at every turn?

>>212704669 (OP)
>negress main character
who is that supposed to be? I dont remember any female prominent characters until the 2nd book. guess ill never watch this slop

>>212707293
Gaal Dornick, who shows up for pretty much the first chapter of the first book and never again. Just some new math graduate or something that meets up with Hari Seldon to interview for a job at the foundation. In the show they made her into a literal magical negress with precognition powers, which renders the whole prime radiant/psychohistory thing completely useless.

>>212707392
i see thanks. seems like they ruin the entire premise of the story
i will ignore this show then

>>212707427
Yeah. Salvador Hardin, who in the book is the guy who launches a coup against the scientists and takes control of the Foundation to force action against nearby hostile planets, has also been turned into a magical negress with precognition powers in the show, and for some fucking reason Gaal Dornick's daughter.
The whole thing is so fucking retarded.

>>212707427
Just watch the Empire stuff and ignore the magical negroes.

>>212707478
>>212707392
why make up Dune precog shit when the whole point was the psychohistory?

>>212707608
Now you see my point >>212706695
>>212707092 >>212706486


This show really feels like they made a point of completely fucking up everything that made the books good.

>>212704669 (OP)
It still has that shitty Millennial writer goofiness. Like the Mule saying that he controls with little nudges, nothing hasty. Which Asimov meant as subtle behavioral adjustments at large scale. Mind controlling everyone to shoot each other was the exact opposite of that, and fucking stupid. Yet again with Millennial writing we can't tell if this was Millennial edgy banal sarcasm in the Mule's character, or if their terrible understanding of plot and science lead them to think that the Mule's silent psychic trick off camera is somehow nudge and not hasty because of the exposition that says it was.

On the other hand, I liked the rest of the episode. They are turbo-normifying the world building exposition, but I'm totally okay with that so long as they actually sincerely try to approximate Asimov's world as much as possible.

The new Dawn and Day are pretty great, and despite last season's shit Day, these new guys are successfully cashing in on the premise.
I don't know what we're supposed to make of the Second Foundation? Is Demerzel and Empire supposed to be the Second Foundation? That would be actually pretty clever, but obviously the vault Hari and the vault in general are so god awful it kind of ruins it.

I guess Gail's psychic world is going to be Gaia?
The Magnifico or whatever is in the trailer, so the Mule twist will likely happen, but since the Mule comes from Gaia, does that mean the body possessing bitch from S2 escaped and is the Mule? If I have to accept S2, then that's fine with me. It was a pretty villainous horror character.

The shitty solution to the second crisis, the ex machina magic vault sucked ass, but thankfully the time skip means we can sort of pretend that never happened.

I'm still hoping for a cool R. Daneel Olivaw thing involving the Luminists.
We still have two major unresolved plot lines that will probably be abandoned
1) The weirdo that magick'd Hari from a hologram into a real boy
2) Why Salvor heard Hari's voice?

>>212705670
One dream sequence.

>>212706486
Magnifico's in the trailer.

>>212706509
Goyer's concessions almost work, but the writing quality is inconsistent to total shit.
Salvor's character was ruined in S1 because her whole arc was she heard Hari's voice in her head and they basically edited that arc out making her behavior completely retarded like she was a self-appointed bestest ever chosen one, and not a girl coping with being haunted. Vault Hari didn't know about the voice either, implying some sort of "Final Foundation" conclusion to the series the books never got to.
There was an actually good reddit theory that the unfinished plot of Foundation would integrate time travel and unify Asimov's literary universe, that the "Final Foundation" would use time travel to make psychohistory work, and then transform into the End of Eternity organization.

Salvor was the only cool and sane person in that whole Gale shitshow. And Gale's impertinence with holo-Hari (rationalized later by she has the force or something, which Hari had mistakenly not accounted for) was lame. Cool premise but they sold it poorly and it came off that Gale was just a dumb bitch. Plus the dumb reddit scientism theme.

Major scientific errors about the size of the galaxy (doh!)

Nothing is more horseshit than the crisis resolutions. That Hari predicted totally specific random events with that battleship, as critical to his plan.
The fucking Vault Ex Machina is totally unforgiveable.
Good God they could have done anything else it would have been smarter.

NGL the Empire conceit is working for me, especially since I think they're now making Demerzel the Second Foundation.

>>212706791
The sand planet arc was pretty kino, showed how badass and ruthless he was. How he could come to the border of true empathy with the full intent of being exploitative.

The necksnap of Dawn was such an anticlimactic ending, but in retrospect it serves the premise of the Cleonic dynasty. The point is, no Cleon will ever change his heart out of the program.

>>212707478
>>212707392
The problem is that even with the plot they chose, they produced it in the shittiest way.
Gaal's actions are because she has magic force powers that Hari didn't account for, so in the end he benefits from her defiance. But the dumb millennial writers portray this as some petty teenage bullshit.

Salvor's arc involved her being haunted by Hari Seldon, which is not made clear because of cut content. So she ends up seeming like some crazy self important bitch.

>>212706791
Annoying bird, I am the great cLeon

>>212708390
>Goyer's concessions almost work,
if I have to jump through that many mental hoops to trick myself into believing that 2 (going on 3) seasons of pure unfiltered dogshit was actually a 5D-chess ploy by Goyer to sneakily deploy an enhanced version of Asimov's vision right under my nose, then it's likely really just irredeemable shit.

I really like it, shame the black girl wakes up next episode

>>212708434
>>212708601

I'm hoping they try to offset the failings of cleonic dynasty because his self was changed and it seemed to be a change, genetically for the positive, based on that dawn's alterations, he should be more loved by the people not less based on how aspirational that previous dawn was, and even that Day who we're all technically judging the other cleon's against because of how great he seemed, let his 'son' live.

I hope they attribute the slow of the fall to the dynasty and not the bullshit magic device as we go on in the series.

>>212708390
>Nothing is more horseshit than the crisis resolutions. That Hari predicted totally specific random events with that battleship, as critical to his plan.
That was such bullshit.

>>212708625
I just mean how he found a way to make Empire a character, and uses cryo-sleep to keep other characters alive. I think he's making Demerzel the Second Foundation, which is honestly pretty clever.

These are simplifications that basically would have otherwise worked to translate to a television medium.

No, other shit like his inability to grasp space travel, the deus ex machina solutions to crises, that's unforgivable.

I'll admit, I thought Dawn's arc in S1 ended horribly, but now that we know the deal with Demerzel, it actually works a lot better. Getting our hopes up that Empire would reform and then having it end anticlimactically was actually the right approach.

It's just, subversive twists don't work when so much else is dogshit. You can't tell when it's subversion when you're wondering if it's just shit writing.

>>212709853
The season 1 podcast was hilarious.
Besides frequently admitting that he knew nothing about science and getting basic things wrong, the co-writers would say shit like they fucking hate science and the science part of it, or this one female writer was stoned as hell joking about what fucking nerds people who might like the books are.

Anyway, the predicting the battleship's jump position (when it's fucking randomized) was Goyer's interpretation of "woo woo magic science to mysteriously predict anything" which was his read of what psychohistory was.

>>212709886
>I think he's making Demerzel the Second Foundation, which is honestly pretty clever.
But why? There's a second Foundation that works perfectly well in the books, why does it need to be an entirely different thing here? This is the extent of my issue with this. The writing is just shit because Goyer is a shit writer, but why the obsession with arbitrarily changing literally every aspect of the story?
Gaal Dornick? Oh yeah we have that one in the show, but now it's a hecking strong black woman that magically sees the future.
Salvador Hardin? Ah yeah, you might the badass frontier fighter who uhhh, also has precognition magic.
Hari Seldon? Classic fella! By the way, he's just chilling there as a fully digitalized copy of the realy guy so that he can personally interfere with the foundation's course. I know the books make a point of having him dead to play into the theme of future progress and humanity's survival requiring the collaboration of people rather than the providential guidance of messianic figures, but we did hire Jared Harris for this, so we gotta use him am I right?
The Mule? Isn't it just the best how he takes you for a ride by pretending to be a jester, but turns out he's actually a tyrant with psychic powers? Yeah, we decided to just call Pilou Asbæk and have him redo his Euron Greyjoy interpretation from Game of Thrones.

And the list goes on and on. There's zero attempt at actually taking Foundation's story and adapting it for TV. It's just Goyer personal fan fiction because he somehow thinks he knows better than Asimov how the story should play out.

>>212709886

>Demerzel = Second Foundation
that would be the biggest fuck-you to Asimov source material, not any single book but the whole universe. but they probably dont care anyway

Watching this show feels like I'm watching an internal feud among the writers, some of whom are sci fi fans who want to make something great and some of whom are modern woke activists who want to spin out propaganda and DEI bullshit...

Like it bounces between fantastic art direction, acting and storylines for some scenes and characters, but then intertwined are the weakest and ugliest black actors you've ever seen completely shitting on the potential masterpiece within. There is an overall vibe of "sit down white man, it's our turn" that is so forced and weak that the sheer vitality of the white actors overcomes the writers attempts to neuter them.

The plotting across the whole show is still super weak and I have never seen a main character as unlikable as Gayle.

booba

>>212704669 (OP)
If you give this show views, you are a bad person. There is nothing more disgustingly openly woke and hateful than this fucking piece of shit.

>>212711204
Sci-fi has always been woke you fucking idiot, go read the bible and kill others that interpret it differently. Foundation is slop but it's sometimes very entertaining slop.

>>212711804
Oh my science!

>>212704669 (OP)
>‘Foundation’: Tim Southam (Netflix's One Piece) To Replace David S. Goyer As Season 3 Director.
>He will be taking over directing duties from series writer/executive producer David S. Goyer.
It's over.
Original plan was 8 seasons, first 4 for the original books, next 2 for the sequels and 2 more for an original ending based on Asimov ideas.
We'll probably only get 4 seasons

>>212704669 (OP)
I stopped watching a few episodes into season 2 I think
Should be illegal how they're wasting Lee Pace and focusing on the literal whos instead

>>212711829
THAT'S LITERALLY FUCKING SCI-FI. It's a bunch of nerds that hated the Christian jocks that wrote books about how awesome science is and how stupid religion is. They're also feminists and anti-racists, just look at Starship Troopers. A Filipino lead in a unified world government that's gender equal and racism is gone.

>>212706527
In season 1 I thought they used CGI or camera tricks to make him seem extra tall around the other actors, but he's just actually that tall

>>212711804
kys

>>212704669 (OP)
I've been reading ian banks culture series lately, and its been more enjoyable than anything I've watched in years, I've realised /tv/- Television & Film is gay.