Thread 712716163

This is an RTS thread.
Post about strategy games which are real-time. Discuss why 3D is shit and 2D is better.

For me, it's Command & Conquer: Generals - Zero Hour with the Shockwave Chaos Mod

>3D is shit
It isn't. Stop playing bad 3D games.

>>712717487
Are you implying that looks good or?

>>712717785
>looks
Move along. Unless you're OP in which case I wasted 2 replies on the thread.

>>712717487
is that earth 2150?
shame I can't get it to run on my windows

>>712719145
Yes. Either try a virtual machine or upgrade your Windows back to a less shitty version. Won't be surprised if someone got it to run in something like wine and I remember reading something about some kind of GNU environment integration in newer versions of Windows so might try that too.

>RA2 YR
>Trick or Treaty Hard
Absolutely bullshit mission you have so little time to build good shit and the fucking masterminds are annoying as fuck

Will Lelic fix DoW3 if DoW1 Definitive Edition sells well?

>>712716163 (OP)
So... which Warlords Battlecry game is the best?

>>712716163 (OP)
Back in my days we called them wargames

What would you recommend for someone who have been wishing for this genre to click for over 20 years?
My attention span is great these days and I have no backlog at all.

>>712716163 (OP)
>>712717487
3D graphics and its consequences have been a disaster for video games

any hopes for nowadays RTS games lads? I might give it shot

Just got raped by Hardest bot in AOE2 DE
It's over

>>712723273
AoE2/AoE4/Rise of Nations

>>712723273
Starcraft 2 Wings of Liberty.

It was the last time someone made an RTS good enough it grabbed the attention outside of the beaten geriatric housewife club that is RTS fanbase.
And deservedly so, it is the magnum opus made by a team composed of basically all the star RTS devs after their various studios closed up shop.

>>712724240
Last game I preordered.

>>712723273
First of all, what's your preferred setting? Modern, medieval, fantasy, futuristic, ancient?

Finally decided to dive into the WC3 ladder after years of failed attempts.
It sucks being old and bad, bros. It's fun though.

Anyone has the Yuri's Revenge loading screen with many Brutes but without the logos?

>>712724782
Is Reimu gonna pay for that broken fence?

>>712719145
>>712718165
>>712717487

>30fps
>ancient european rts

it was good, but I don't know how you people can play that shit nowadays. Needs a sourceport or something.

While not a typical RTS game I believe They Are Billions could've been a much much bigger hit than it is and it's closer than you may think.
It has decent foundations, it changes the formula a bit, it is more focused on city-building and turtling than regular rts, it has superb music and it looks all right. People loved skirmish mode (despite game being extremely difficult with no saves), ironically the thing that was a nail in the coffin is the thing that should've been the crown jewel of this game: the campaign. If they made sound mechanic more obvious, decreased the difficulty and made an actual good campaign this could've been a cult classic.

Has anyone played the GOG version of Galactic Battlegrounds? Does it work without issue?

>>712725934
>minimap is completely identical to AoE2
That always trips me up when I see screenshots from Galactic Battlegrounds

>>712725917
oh and it's entirely singleplayer with active pause so the core audience can still play it

>>712725917
TAB devs are a bunch of cunts, they encrypted the game so no one could mod it and then abandoned it despite it still having issues. The closet thing to it now is Age of Darkness.

>>712725934
Doesn't matter, you want to immediately convert to EF, regardless of version.

>>712726192
I know. All that doesn't change the fact that this may be 'the' best RTS we had last 5 years and could've been really really great.
>Age of Darkness
Heard it's shit

>>712716754
shockwave and contra were great

Are there any jewtubers who cover Strategy games in general?

>>712726327
I wouldn't call it shit but it definitely has issues as well. IMO the devs should have either gone with co-op multiplayer OR a campaign, not both. They bit off more than they could chew. It's still getting patched but I'm not expecting any major content updates. Hopefully they'll keep up the patches.

Incidentally, they're the same devs doing War for Westeros. So it'll be interesting to see how that goes.

>>712726796
Wintergaming I guess. But a lot of his content is unedited vods of livestreams

>>712726047
the entire game is just an AOE2 reskin

>>712726796
perafilozof

>>712727246
Yeah it's clearly made in the same engine but at least icons are different and resources/menu buttons are placed elsewhere. The minimap is completely identical.

>>712716163 (OP)
I have been playing a LOT of starcraft 1v1's and ended up diamond 3 atm. I love it

>>712726047
because it literally is AoE ...IN SPACE!!

>>712725790
>I don't know how you people can play that shit nowadays
Because it's good.
>muh fps
>muh graphix
>muh muh
If a game is not good enough as a game none of them can save it. They all add to it and enhance it, just like music, style, FMVs and so on. But the main thing is how good of a game it is.

The only RTS I want for life

>>712727536
Los Santos...

I've been trying to get into RTS for the past 15 years, but I think I conditioned myself into a ADHD brain. It's ogre
Installing AOE2DE right now. Let's try again

>>712716163 (OP)
What is the OP screen from anyway?

>>712722760
I've only played 3 so I will say 3

very fun rpg-ish campaign, weird that there aren't more games like that

>>712727753
I gotchu bro: https://store.steampowered.com/app/25830/Knights_of_Honor/

>>712728274
Didn't a sequel come out a few years ago?

>>712728367
I have no idea.

>>712728367
>>712728542
yes it did
https://youtu.be/EKMZZF8xjGk?si=uAvV0PFBSNmKQbkG
(random vid don't hate me onegai)

any BAR chads?

>>712724576
>>712724629
>>712724782
>>712724838
>you now remember there is an actual touhou rts being developed

>>712725934
you need to get a patch from pcgamingwiki, there's one that keeps the game vanilla and other that adds new factions to the game, you need to choose one do not install both

>>712729996
I am unable to perceive differences between units in that game, really ruins it for me

>>712727636
its insane how much holding power this game has, its like fucking counter strike where the thing barely changes and people still play it since the 90s

>>712730594
Learning new stuff is hard.

>>712730594
It's probably pretty good while providing enough variety. I got tired of the historical kind of strategy games way back then and this spell does not seem to end so I can only wish them well.

Total War is RTS, right? How do I git gud at this?

>>712717785
Zoomed out, it has its own aesthetic.

>>712730980
The skirmish maps in this game were soulful and scenario-esque.

>>712731073
Who among you know of this one weird trick with bridges?

>>712730926
i had so much difficulty getting into total war, but after my first campaign i got the gist of it, don't be afraid of watching tutorials and learning cheese tactics

>>712730980
You can also post the missions with some decorations like trees. The very reason most of the environment looks like a barren wasteland is a plot point.

>>712731171
Recently discovered it in one of the UCS missions.

>>712720778
Vanilla campaign even on hard has been a breeze for me after playing mo for a while.

>>712731347
The atmosphere is exquisite. Really feels like you're scrounging for the last resources of a planet desolated by nuclear war. Quiet and eerie. The tilesets changing to warmer and eventually hellish volcanic ones is also a great trick that builds the atmosphere and urgency.

>>712723273
Of course to paint the map in DK once again.
And don't forget to get all commander equipment

>>712723273
well if you want easy rts games where there's just one resource and its easy to spam units play bfme 1-2 or dawn of war

here have a nice little RTS, fully campaign focused and costs the price of a coffee

>3D is shit
Warhammer: Dark Omen is good.

>>712724240
but sc2 was shit
it was just blizztard fanboy hype

>>712732187
What's shit about it, aside from the story/writing?

>>712732498
he's being a contrarian to pretend he has good taste

i think im finally going to try out command and conquer zero hour because of recent happenings

>>712732662
>>712732498
>>712732187
sc2 wasn't good, it was mostly hype driving it
>broodlord infestor spine crawlers
>widow mines
>swam host
>ball vs ball fights
blizzard should have done to sc2 what valve did for dota2, but they get unalived by DEI

>>712723273
>Medieval
Stronghold 1 - it's a camp and cheesy but fun campaign that gradually introduces the resources and troop types. There's one level in particular that will give you a challenge.
>Fantasy
Bfme1 has a huge campaign that you can play as both the forces of good and evil. Bfme2 had cheesy wall building and more focus on uber heroes.
>Scifi in space
If you don't mind old, homeworld 1. There is not a single game out there like it, one of the goats.
>Scifi on planets
Deserts of kharak is an easy intro to sci-fi and is a prequel to homeworld 1. Otherwise StarCraft 2 or Tiberium Sun.
>Ww2
Company of heroes 1.

>>712733659
Those things only apply to people who care about 1v1 ladder comp play, how is SC2 a shit game for the rest who play the campaigns, co-op, mods and custom maps?

>>712733659
What did valve ever do for dota 2?

>>712723273
Stronghold 1 definitive edition

>>712731702
And the tech trees are unrivalled among RTS, and the factions are also definitely in the top 5 regarding asymmetry, and it has actually good water component that is only surpassed by TA, and its environmental mechanics are not rivalled by anything to my knowledge, and the veterancy system is one of the best ever without going too far into either OP or trash, and while terrain modification is flawed and not complex enough it actually opens up (or closes) new avenues of attack or resource access routes, and capturing mechanics are one of the best in the genre too.
I think I can continue but at this point I'd rather play some again.

>>712717487
>>712730980
>>712731702
blud really be posting brown smudges and calling it video games :skull:

>>712723273
what is there to click?
either you like base building and seeing armies fighting or you don't.

>>712730926
in this one specifically, just spam ashigaru

>>712730926
hammer and anvil
works 100% of the time, every time

>>712733962
Even 1v1 ladder was fine until you got to the highest levels, which is pointless to talk about since maybe 1% of players will ever experience that. Most of the people complaining about how broken some strategies are just fought one bad player who copied a pro's build order and lost to them, not realizing that because the player is bad they would have lost to any decently-timed push had the player done any scouting whatsoever.

>>712734863
I can't believe it's been two decades, and Total War's AI still can't deal with the hammer and anvil tactic.

>>712733962
I've had my fun doing 2 base muta ever since wing of liberty days.

>>712735076
Just like real life?

>>712735076
>CA programs the AI to properly react to hammer&anvil
>player enjoyment goes down the shitter because they no longer get to feel smart

>>712735076
Cavalry is unplayable there because of all the spear units.

>>712732187
I hate SC2 story and aesthetic shift, but playing co-op missions with a friend was the most fun I ever had with an RTS. The commanders all were so fun and busted in their own way.
>maxing out Dehaka and just eating fucking Leviathans
>or getting your own Leviathan fleet with Abathur
>even simply Tempest spamming with Artanis
So fun to finally crack open Brutal difficulty.

>>712723273
assuming you want to have an easygoing solo experience, so a campaign with story and gameplay you probably want Starcraft or World in Conflict.

some greater RTS autist than me should make a table to rate these games by
>story
>story gameplay (and scenario)
>skirmish
>presentation (general visual appeal and sound)
>controllability (input, unit behavior, pathfinding etc.)

What are some good RTS game I can play in modern consoles (ps5, xbox, switch??)

>>712727672
im ADHD too but ive been playing Age of empire 2 recently and really been enjoying it. the game isnt insanely complicated or anything. its really fun to play the campaigns.

Dark Colony
many years enjoying that

>>712736263
Yeah, I heard the campaings are a lot of fun. I mostly play SP, so I think the SP could be really kind of comfy.

>>712736262
you better have an xbox, it has AoE and Halo Wars and that's pretty much it. The closest thing you can get on consoles is maybe something like Kunitsu Gami or Pikmin

>>712736159
Where can you fit Titan Submarine in here?

>>712736159
Can someone give a QRD on why Total Annihilation is labelled as the God of RTS? I never played it, but watching a few videos nothing really popped out, so I guess it's probably some deep mechanics the game has?

>>712737039
You had to be alive at the time

>>712737082
That makes sense.

>>712737039
Because the image was made by a casual who got filtered by BW.

>>712736662
There is no need. The chart was retarded even when it was new.

>>712737039
It might not be the best ever but it definitely has a lot going in its favour. Projectiles are simulated, you have 3 branches of "ground" units plus also ships plus also aircraft, both resource generation and construction were highly non-standard at the time and not very common still, units control well enough but you cannot compensate for worse strategy with micro-management, base defences are still good instead of being a gimmick or an afterthought like is the norm now, commander unit is both a vulnerability and adds an interesting option (D-gun), you can construct some of the buildings on and under water (there are special ones too), units leave husks when destroyed which can be reclaimed which plays a huge part in economy, energy (one of the resources) generation comes in several types. If I spent some type thinking I believe I would have been able to continue the list.

>>712738008
Thanks.

>>712737039
To be more clear it is TECHNOLOGY overload
Even though its another engine and a new game, you should try BAR and you would understand why it is so good. The gameplay is great and the projectiles and the economy and the several variations in units

>>712736027
I heard he got nerfed but Stukov was so much fun in co-op, it took a while until he got going but when he did it was a blast, even though he's the least zerg-like of all the zerg commanders he felt the most like controlling a swarm. IIRC he had one fewer commander abilities than the rest because one of them was literally just "this 'ability' is just a global attack move for all your units" which was needed because he constantly pissed out so many infested terrans.

>>712736159
This is a better list, very accurate

>>712736662
on the list of things to consider

>>712737039
Some argue that most rts are just real time tactics game, especially those with micro focus, so I suppose TA was the first "true" rts since the inception of the genre.

>>712738976
>le jank
Worthless picture. Perimeter is interesting. TA:K is perfectly fine because it is not very different from the original. Armies of Exigo isn't without merit too.

>>712736159
It lacks "I want some /m/echa RTS action!"

>>712733804
I fucking loved BFME1, 2 was just way too different that I didn't like it as much. My only pining was for the Helms Deep and Minas Tirith maps to be playable on Skirmish

for those of you shit talking 3D, warcraft 3 and Dawn of war were amazing.Go fuck yourselves. These days however the only RTS i like to play Beyond all reason.

>>712727636
I don't get it. Red Alert 2 has already surpassed AoE2 in 2000. Not to mention Shogun or Ground Control

>>712727672
>AOE2DE
Dont fall for the meme. It's a strategy game from the late 90's. C'mon, play some Age of Mythology of Age of Empires 3

>>712739478
these categories are quickly thrown together. I didn't even play most of these games, but every time I post the rts chart someone comes around with their scrimblo bimblo game he has nostalgia for, but nobody ever talks about.

Some anon convinced me to play War Wind and that game is confusing as fuck. The menu alone makes you think some alien quickly ported the game to human hardware.
Warwind makes Perimeter look good in comparison, but its clearly jank, everyone calls it jank (yes I played it). Armies of Exigo among some other issues has pretty terrible balancing, if I remember correctly. I think I confused Total Annihilation Kingdoms with Rise of Legends here.
Jank doesn't mean bad.
Most older games would fit that category. but it's fair to call them jank if they already lacked behind for its time.

has anyone played this?

>>712719145
>>712725790
I have an old guide on steam with dgvoodoo2 and some mods/tips for troubleshooting but it still bugs out when launching sometimes. Things like DEP needing to be turned on only for windows processes and .exe running in the bg but doing nothing: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1908815686

There's a newer version of the main mod but it uses an installer and some weird discord integration with other balance changes that I haven't tested.

>>712732498
>aside from story/writing
well ok
>Aesthetic
cartoon buildings and wiggling roach and queen butts. the simple fac that there's a unit even called the Roach, that works like the roach. Swarm Hosts for the phobia, Stalkers, etc. Even the sound effects are nothing compared to SC:BW.
>gameplay
oh my god this is the biggest issue. SC2 plays like an arcade game where the game wants to you to fail so you keep inserting coins and each challenge is a gimmick that's going to get thrown at you as a surprise as fast as possible. Marauders were a mistake. Banelings were a mistake. Most things were a mistake.
It has nothing on the strategic depth, that SC:BW has (with fewer units). And the game has gone through 8 significantly different eras and not ONE of them has gotten away from cringe- from proxy rushes to toilets to MSC to shitlord-infestor to tankivac. The lame has just been inescapable
>balance
Zerg cabal attitudes has soured the game. They just built Zerg from the ground up incorrectly, and the attitudes that came with that has just made tournaments frustrating to watch. Zerg just aren't playing the same game, and there's just matches and tournament wins that just have to be tuned out because of it. The game is in its twilight years, now only maintained competitively by some rich saudi oil prince who doesn't play but has weird tastes, and they only finally even attempted to address this zerg element, but it's too late. The other civs have been handed so many gay tools to counter the zerg gay, there's no way to unravel the knot at this point.

I had a plan to finally sit down and finish all the single missions in the first Sudden Strike but every time I try to I instantly get reminded how terrible those scenarios are and how badly balanced the game is.

>>712740782
"Jank" means retarded newfag lingo that almost invariably indicates the post is not worth reading.

>>712716163 (OP)
You are only allowed to reply if you've finished Cossacks campaigns without cheating.

>>712740852
Man, Battle for Middle-earth. Haven't heard that name in ages.

>>712741679
well, some of them. not all of them

>>712741679
I only play in the map editor sending big armies to their death against a line of organ guns

>>712741442
Don't torture yourself. This game is crap

>>712742240
I remember finishing and liking all the campaigns but I could never finish more than a few of the single missions

>>712741679
>mfw light cavalry out of nowhere claiming undefended mines

>>712741512
>everyone who uses a word in my bad lingo dictionary...
ok anon, stop talking

>>712730926
Claim region with blacksmith in it upgrade it to the highest tier and spam yariwall. Isthat ez

>>712738363
For me it was Alarak.
>got the prestige where supplicant permanently
>map is the one where the lava rises every few minutes
>bored
>look at lava
>have a lightbulb moment
>proceed to spend every subsequent downtime in the mission warping in more supplicants to throw into lava to power up my deathball

>>712740437
>Warcraft 3 and Dawn of War
>Have to reduce the number of controllable units to less than 40 so brainlets and the shitty 3D could cope
Fuck you.

Why did Westwood always refuse to do a third faction for CnC? I mean, it's a clone of Dune. And in Dune there were Ordos.

>>712742432
>try to take it back
>they always delete the mine instantly without fail

>>712743121
are you joking, Scrin?

>>712742432
>>712743175
You are supposed to leave patrolling troops behind.

>>712743440
not Westwood

Dawn of War 3 is a better RTS than DoW1 and DoW2. Now before you recite the mantra some youtuber taught you, consider the following.

>Better Hero units than DoW1 and DoW2
>Bigger maps than DoW1 and DoW2
>Extremely bigger unit cap than DoW1 and DoW2

If it had more factions it'd be gotyay.

>>712723273
Correct me if I’m wrong but company of hero’s with the blitzkrieg mod is excellent and beautiful. Calling in an artillery strike while you’re pinned down by enemy fire is exhilarating.

>>712743576
Oh true, I thought it was after C&C3 when devs left to create Petroglyph

>>712744119
They didn't leave, they got shitcanned after Renegade and before Generals

>>712716163 (OP)
>Knights of honor
I don't even want to imagine how many nights i've wasted on that.

>>712743620
>bigger maps
>bigger unit cap
those two mean nothing on their own or even combined
it's like saying Dagerfall is better than Skyrim because it has a bigger map

>>712743620
>Anime Marine
>Angelos Double Smash
>Break the nexus
>Jonah Orion lips

But Chaplain Diomedes is cool

>>712725917
I want to like it so badly but it's held back by such minor but significant things. Thr main thing for me is hoe long it takes to unlock new tech, I'm at the point where I'm in the 4/5 difficulty range (which is very frustrating without a button to speed up or slow down time in an instant like total war, only to lose because that one spot you didn't notice let a few zombies sneak through after 80 fucking days) amd I have barely anything unlocked. 2/3rds of the campaign feels like it's done with starting units and buildings.

>>712744119
It's still a retarded comment with regards to the Scrin, while details obviously weren't set in stone, the overarching backstory including aliens is said to have been there from the start.

>And also the Scrin as aliens have been planned from the get-go, Joseph B. Hewitt IV revealed during an AMA on 07/26/2014: [5]
>Tiberian Dawn was the title of the first one but that didn't get out till long after it was on the market. It isn't something that was ever mentioned with the game itself.
>I can't actually say at what point it was planned to be a trilogy though I know the story of the aliens being behind the tiberium being used to terraform the planet was there from the beginning.

CnC3 has several flubs with regards to the worldbuilding, but the Scrin are handled very well, considering they had virtually no buildup.
I hope Foreman 371 is having a good time with his ship AI out there somewhere.

>>712726796
Warlockracy does a few

>>712745164
It's a shame we never got Tiberium.

>>712743576
Yes Westwood. EA changed them but they were meant to appear in the real C&C3.

>>712745164
I wish Tiberium (FPS-RTS) was real

>>712726796
I don't think so because there's no real audience. Your modern gamers barely even know what RTS and have zero interest in finding out.

>>712745164
I always forget if it was TS or RA2 who got shit out prematurely, but still turned out pretty good.
I thought it was RA2. Doesn't that game even have info and pictures on the game box of content that wasn't in the game.

>>712716163 (OP)
Worth it?

>>712746110
>Doesn't that game even have info and pictures on the game box of content that wasn't in the game.
Happens shockingly often for some reason. Painkiller had screenshot with a cut weapon on the back of its CD.

>>712746110
>>712746212
I'll never fucking forget the back of TFT's box making it look like they naval combat was back on the menu.

>>712743576
>>712743121
The Forgotten in TibSun, cut though.

>>712730239
From the same dev that has already released 3 others, I think
Age of Ethanols was kino back in the day, I miss playing that

>>712746316
I mean there are a couple ships in the game

>>712740702
AoE2 is literally has the tightest gameplay in the entire series

>>712745849
One of the few cases where reimagining a classic series as an FPS looked interesting. You had a Crysis-like suit, you could command various units from first person perspective etc. It wasn't supposed to be just a corridor shooter.

obligatory

>>712746745
lol. lmao.

>>712741679
I finished the Saxony one.
I remember really loving the first level of Ukrainian and Polish campaigns, like they are among my favorite RTS levels, but I don't remember being able to finish the next levels

>>712746810
>reimagining a classic series as an FPS looked interesting
Another example of Westwood greatness: FPS transition with Renegade. While Blizzard chickened out with Ghost

look at this beauty

>>712746316
the whole C&C Generals intro sequence makes it look like it has naval and I think Act of War also made it look like it got some.

>>712747249
>Act of War
Didn't the expansion actually add some naval shit?

>>712747225
I was disappointed with Renegade.
>what I expected from a C&C FPS
Dozens of soldiers running around, tanks, artillery.
>what I got
One of the first missions is assaulting a NOD base and you get like 2 or 3 GDI infantry dudes and the base has like 5 NOD guys.

The scale just wasn't there. Maybe it was in MP, but I didn't play that.

>>712741442
Just download a mod like hidden stroke 3 or rwm and community made single missions for those instead
Then you can really feel the pain of playing an overtuned, unfair level made by a japanese autist. Some are actually really good though.

>>712747249
>Save pc gaming
After all these years, nothing's changed

>>712745849
>>712745971
I'm still praying that they realize what an amazing universe the Tiberian universe is and all they need to do is look at Ubisoft nailed to a cross and the team of a couple of dozen people producing E33 to figure out what to do.

>>712746110
Some interesting thoughts on that for the CnC3 era:

>Greg Black criticized in retrospect on 06/23/2010 in an interview the corporate policy of EA and denounced a lot of drawbacks: [3]

>Unfortunately although we had a very talented team of passionate gamers, EA simply would not give us the time we felt we needed to make a truly great C&C game.
>In the case of C&C:3 our development cycle was something like 11 months. Compare that to Blizzard or Relic who was spending 3-6 years on their RTS titles.
>Our longest development cycle was 18 months on RA3, but at that time the team was split in half and added another platform (PS3), so the extra dev time was kind of a wash.
>EA simply needed us to keep cranking out games to keep the LA studio afloat while many its other teams floundered
>[...] our games were always rushed, our engine technology aged and degraded over the years, our path finding was horrible, our online implimentations were embarassing, and ultimately our games did not, in my view, live up to the orginal C&C, or RA2, or Generals

Though for all the (rightful) flak towards EA, people have also said that Westwood itself had its share of dysfunction, so you know, not unsurprising.

>>712747332
Maybe in the campaign

>>712737039
Because it is one of the og greats of rts and spawned the most innovative branch of the entire genre.

>>712722760
Get protectors mod, available on steam, it's got all campaigns and shitloads of improvements

>>712746976
>aoe2
>you can dodge arrows with pinpoint precision
>aim and dodge mangonel shots
>constantly surf between spearmen with cavalry
>fight for the highground
>instantly quick wall to defend against or trap enemy troops
there is no competition. AoE2 is the snappiest RTS out there

>>712747404
Even more bullshit? No thanks. But at least now I know the vanilla missions were bullshit too.

I cleared a long way from home on ludicrous
Hooray for me

>>712745164
I genuinely loved the Scrin campaign in C&C 3.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3y-Cd6_vRic

The whole narrative of the campaign is kino. You just being some foreman sent to mine this planet having to fight off the angry natives that according to your predictions, ought to have gone extinct with what boils down to mining security forces, while uncovering the mystery of how the fuck this happened while your unappreciative boss keeps telling you to figure out who the fuck Kane is, while your loyal AI gf increasingly urges you to get the fuck out until finally cutting off your boss and offering you a plan of escape from Earth.

>>712747465
The setting of the Tiberian universe is gigakino and has potential for far more than just rts games. EA is fucking retarded though and will probably never utilize the potential.

>>712748373
tiberium twilight killed this ip completely

>>712747803
you can that too in SupCom except its not worth sacrificing your apm except for your ACU

>>712746173
Feels more like a Sins 1.5 instead of a full sequel, but if you enjoyed the original, it's probably worth picking up

>>712746847
I always forget how fucking sheep brained redditors are for such a stupid post to get so popular
RTS games having fleshed out multiplayers have been part of the genre since it's fucking inception, how young or casual do you need to be to think this was some later trend. RTS games are like real time chess. Saying that multiplayer killed them is like saying that "multiplayer ruined fighting games". Even fighting against an AI is fun because it's a well designed competitive feeling gameplay that feels like you could be playing against a real player. Single player and multiplayer always went hand in hand in the genre, even if 80+% of the playerbase never went as far as to minmax their skills for competitive play.

the "decline" of the genre started like 2 decades ago and had nothing to do with multiplayer (it's mostly caused by rising game prices making PC only games more risky investments, it's also why eg. point and click and city builder games declined). Stormgate is a fucking new, not even released game and pretty much the only example of an rts where the devs tried to appeal to the compfags first and foremost, and frankly that's hardly it's main issue, as not even it's multiplayer is as good as the popular competition's is.

>>712748206
It really is just a really fun ride that reveals enough to be interesting while leaving enough up to imagination by touching on all the right topics like Kane.
I really love the idea of the ship AI having a thing for the Foreman a lot by itself, but as a narrative point it's really important because it sets the tone that while the Scrin are seemingly monolithic, it's clearly not absolute, so a bunch of possibilities open up.

One thing I've always wondered is why they targeted Earth in particular for seeding.
By the nature of Tiberium you'd think that many planets would do, so the only thing left would be that they do prioritize planets with intelligent life to nip them in the bud.


>>712748373
You will play another Chinese mobile cash-in and you will like it.
Still, with how some of the industry trends are shifting a man could start to dream again.

bros take me back...
in a way I'm happy RTS is considered dead, that saves us from more blunders like Homeworld 3. RTS was completely untouched from the sins of modernity.

>>712749530
>Single player and multiplayer always went hand in hand in the genre
Nope.
Earlier RTS were single player focused with multiplayer as an add-on but after Starcraft blew up many people thought they should focus on multiplayer to become the next big thing and we had gazilion failed clones. What was the last RTS with a decent campaign, fucking Dawn of War?

>>712749962
Tempest Rising?

>>712749053
This is not true. Generals 2 was already in development. EA just gave up on the project

>>712749859
https://store.steampowered.com/app/2509200/ERA_ONE/

Be happy my friend

>>712746847
How is this multiplayer players fault? Sounds more like a retarded market research team to me.

>>712749962
Age of Empires 2 MP was as much of a cornerstone as its campaigns
Sorry bro, i know you have MP anxiety, but half the games were MP oriented
Cuz it's a genre designed to be played
By humans
Against or with humans

>>712749962
> after Starcraft blew up many people thought they should focus on multiplayer to become the next big thing
what fucking brainworm does cause people to literally just make up stuipd headcanon like this

do you even know what kind of RTS games came out after SC? Most devs didn't even know about SC having a big multiplayer scene in korea.

>Earlier RTS were single player focused with multiplayer as an add-on
almost all RTS games are designed to be competitively playable in multiplayer between 2 players and then build the campaigns around these already fleshed out and balanced factions, not the other way around. Again, a big reason why even fighting the AI is fun in these games is because even they feel like they could be players. The genre was like this since the first fucking games. The exceptions for this design are a minority.

>What was the last RTS with a decent campaign, fucking Dawn of War?
SC2 has the most fleshed out and biggest budget single player campaigns in the entire genre, and it was the last big budget RTS to be released, and it's usually a game that you clueless casuals blame for "ruining the genre with focusing more on multiplayer"

>>712749859
Even with modern devs and their way of storytelling I still cannot believe Homeworld 3's story is a thing that exists, it is so uncanny.
Instead of a human with DEI cancer it's like a skinwalker, human-looking but you can feel the existential abnormality.

>>712750661
In fact, strategies are the coolest when it comes to multiplayer. They only need 1 friend. That's it. For Quake, that's not enough. MMORPGs need thousands of people. Fighting games don't have that many tactics. And strategies are perfect in this regard. Get 1 friend, instal BFME2 and boom, you'll have an awesome RTS month marathon.

What pro multiplayer and anti multiplayer fags always forget is that it's a specific kind of multiplayer that's cancer to rts. It's not balancing or fun unique maps but the ultra sweaty shit that no one but the top 1% plays. The same exact thing happened to MMO's when devs started listening to the hardcore raiders over everyone else and implemented tons of shortcuts and qol features to skip past most of the leveling making the world feel empty apart from social hubs like the main city and the raids themselves
Also same thing with fighting games. Appealing to the competitive scene in rts is like appealing to people that study frame data.

Rts games should have a healthy multiplayer scene but not necessarily built with esports in mind. People still love to play stuff like fastest map in SC and that's not a competitive thing at all. As soon as you start talking to me about mmr or elo or whatever I zone right out because I'd rather play billy herrington wc3 maps

>>712750831
>and it was the last big budget RTS to be released
Company of Heroes 2

>>712751212
>Fighting games don't have that many tactics
they do
RTS and FGs are both peak multiplayer games. Both are high APM too

>>712751212
Fighting games have vastly more strategic depth than gookclick.

>>712751527
>Company of Heroes 2
that's more of a middle budget game. Same with AoE4 for example
SC2 was a real AAA game. The last one the genre ever recieved, and more or less the only one too, still, the genre overall has much less even middle budget game these days than it had back then, like 1 comes out every several years.

>>712725917
Even with the active pause this game is way too hard. What the fuck were they thinking. I had the cheat engine in some extra skill points to get more shit because you literally have to follow a perfect upgrade path otherwise you screw yourself later.
Of course you can't reallocate your points, that would be too easy!
Loved it otherwise

>>712751562
>gookclick
this term is used by the same kind of retards who think RTS games having fleshed out multiplayers somehow killed the genre

just an utter lack of understanding of the genre

>>712751562
bitching about high APM while saying FGs are better is pretty fucking stupid. You realize that FGs also require a similarly high APM right?

>>712750661
>Sorry bro, i know you have MP anxiety, but half the games were MP oriented
You're missing the fact that 99% of gamers have MP anxiety in RTS. Normal people don't want to sweat for 45 minutes or lose because they didn't memorize a build order. Competition sucked the fun out of multiplayer, you need an amazing single player experience to get people in.

>>712752662
>half the games were MP oriented
I always found it funny how relic always catered to the 1v1 niggers in every single CoH game and every single time 1v1 niggers made up something like 15-30% of the playerbase.

I stared play Beyond All Reason yesterday from the previous RTS thread, and in all but the most literal sense it is Total Annihilation 2. I'm having a blast.

Speaking of, I haven't played Supreme Commander or any of its follow ups, how do they compare?

>>712749962
>>712750831
>after Starcraft blew up many people thought they should focus on multiplayer to become the next big thing
kek
ironically both EA and Petroglyph tried to chase the Moba audience at that time as a last resort (CnC4, End of Nations). But also Gas Powered and Blizzard. So basically anyone with a name in the genre and the remaining few tried to make rts accessible on consoles.
It made sense because everyone thought PC was dying and MOBA was a glimmer of hope. The irony is that absolute nobody managed to make successful MOBA clone after the big 2 (and a half).

As a bonus, Gas powered made SupCom2, while it was a disappointment, it was probably the first big RTS on steam.

>>712747803
dumb micro minigames != tight gameplay, or else SC2 would actually be a good game

>>712745946
it's always EA...

>>712727171
He also was 90% SC2, unless that's changed. He rarely stuck out other games beyond a stream or 2.
I still remember that he got a bit annoyed when I matched him in SCBW. He went CC first to just folded to the basic 2 zealots and a probe.

>>712751134
It's time to wake up, the dream is over.

>>712753298
SupCom surpasses TA in every way

>>712753519
He's been doing mostly BAR but yes he was a sc2 guy

>>712751134
>>712753750

Is it possible to play RTS against enemy AIs and have fun.?

>>712753519
he's mostly abandoned SC2 with SC2 being so dead. he's aging out and he's been tackling variety RTS to try to stay relevant

>>712748206
>Finish Nod and GDI campaigns
>Menu suddenly shifts and alters to reveal the Scrin campaign

>>712723273
Tell us why it's not clicking to begin with.

>>712753750
>>712751134
you know what's funny, you can still see in some scenes Imogens pre-bogged model.

>>712737039
Pioneered an entire style of RTS with completely different principles than any other RTS of its time.

>>712754374
>Tiberium Wars has the GDI icon
>Kanes Wrath has the NOD icon
I really thought there would be a second addon dedicated entirely to Scrin

>>712754291
obviously almost all RTS have AI in skirmish. Unless you trying to play high-comp level against AI for some reasons.

>>712753874
SupCom's scale is too big and the engine blows ass so it's hard to even take advantage of the scale.

>>712752662
I'm not missing the fact, i'm stating it's a (you) problem
I don't give a shit about your anxiety issues m8, enjoy it or not, my fun is in MP and SP as well

>>712751212
>>712751528
Yes in fact

>>712716163 (OP)
D
O
R
F

>>712749530
Dune 2 was a single player game. Multiplayer only became a serious focus with C&C and Warcraft 2. You don't know what you're talking about.

Play Outpost 2.
Read the in-game novella story chapters too for some good scifi, with a cool twist at the end.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mzl8aQ1-ELw&t=3598s

>>712755627
i dont like this game because outpost 1 had far superior vibes

>>712755346
I can't wait for it to have shit campaign and be forgotten like all the other RTS.
I hope I'm wrong though.

>>712755627
Sorry, too ugly for me.

>>712754594
it looks fun but then you remember it's basically mobashit where everything you do is predetermined by the almighty Meta and if you stray you get banned for griefing

>>712752103
Not while multitasking they don't.

>>712755889
Don't play 8v8. I didn't like 8v8 when it was still BA in like 2006 and I still don't like it. Just play lower player count matches or 1v1s.

Why did Age of Mythology fail so hard?

>>712755536
>Multiplayer only became a serious focus when the internet took off
Wow...

>>712751865
Nah. You put RTS in a box and complain when someone doesn't like it in its box. It doesn't have to be what you think it's supposed to be.

>>712756114
Nobody was asking for supernatural shit.

>>712756136
Was it there from the genre's inception or not?

>>712755317
who would bundle fighting games and rts together. They don't share a fanbase nor a perspective not even the same platforms. RTS and FPS were everything you played at LAN, so this is the logical pairing.

>>712756258
Could it have been?

>>712755824
I know, but the videos look so cool.

>>712756338
Doesn't matter. Was it?

>>712756367
Who gives a fuck?

>>712756367
>Doesn't matter.
It does though.

>>712730980
the aesthetic of mud and dust. not like that stopped me from enjoying dawn of war.

>>712756408
Yes or no?

>>712751134
>>712753750
>>712754223
Qrd for those that do not know?

>>712723273
Maybe you don't like classic style RTS and that's ok, try Myth series, Men of war, Call to arms, Wargame.

>>712756114
RTS in current year cannot be successful

>>712747225
that's a meaty butt

>>712756260
>who would bundle fighting games and rts together
It will be something related to the duel of heroes

nobody on this board played pic rel (russian starcraft clone)

>>712756735
the theme of the game is literally: magic niggers vs terrans

>>712756735
a bit esoteric, no?

>>712756338
That's an empty hypothetical

>>712736159
>dead genre
that's not true Stronghold and DoW are still 1% alive

>>712757209
It's a full hypothetical

>>712756620
You can't really convey the madness through words. It needs to be seen.
If you don't mind the video suggestion you can watch from the following timestamp to get the meat of it.
If you want the full package watch both the premise and entire story section.
(Obviously spoilers)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nuC2I8s6qf8&t=1990s

>>712756859
between those stolen aoe2 vils mining some starcraft crystals and the smiley towers and the game ignoring its unit limit and some medieval looking civ having a "Laboratory"
it looks almost decent.

>>712755889
>I only play on Strait
Get with the rotatos granpa

https://youtu.be/aYM36JhkG4w?si=FgQpT25mRlr5DWAU

>Casually mogs your medieval OST
Spent so much time in this it's actually insane.

Do you guys have a go-to website for finding old RTS games? Something like what Gamebanshee is for RPGs. I skim through abandonware sites sometimes, but even they're missing stuff.

>>712751562
Fighting games are a fucking joke played by the most spineless twitter faggots imaginable that worship corporations

>>712749962
>What was the last RTS with a decent campaign, fucking Dawn of War?
Now there is a depressing thought. 20 years since their last real attempt that you could almost recite word for word because they've been trying to chase that white whale this whole time. The marketing behind Sins II would have you believe they are the ones leading the way by charging a premium just to play a bunch of custom scenarios with a description. That would've been a mod in other games. There is Homeworld 3 but that one was so fucking horrendous that it has firebombed what little good will was still left from the desperate.

Are the D.O.R.F. devs /v/irgins from /adgh/ or somthing for them to shill thier game on /v/3, or just madlads?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aNHMwEOJxoY

>>712746173
>removed the functionality for z-axis movement because multiplayerfags considered it a hack since you can troll newfags and static defenses by jumping or dipping below them
Every time

>>712760234
What's the point of static defenses if you can just go around them in 3D space?

>>712757261
its heartbreaking that the sequels dont live up.

if your rts has squads instead of individual unit it sux
if your rts has constant income instead of harverster units it sux
if your rts doesn't distinguish attack from attack move it sux

>>712756114
>built on an early build of the AOE3DE engine
>released with the EXACT same bugs as years old AOE3DE
>Microsoft then cancels AOE3DE DLC then EOLs it and moves its personnel to have an "all hands on deck" team as damage control
>player count already half of the already EOL'd game despite (contractually obligated) DLC still being announced
Microsoft execs being retarded as always.

>>712760520
Streaming economy is objectively better.

>>712760409
FireFly are incredibly lazy. They have had 1 formula and they just keep reskinning it with no innovation. I still can't believe they're trying to catch the same lightning in a bottle instead of just doing something different (i.e. asymmetric factions, more complex techs, i dunno).

>>712760357
There is no real point now because they're weak as shit anyway. Little more than an inflated speed bump for your fleets to shit on. Generally they can still orientate themselves in a full 360 sphere based on their LOS that you can measure via tactical grid. The real problem comes from not being able to place said defenses anywhere beyond the floor for each gravity well itself. So you can't plonk down a starbase on both poles of a world and extend their ranges out all the way to the equator. Stopping anyone from pulling sneeki moves like that.

>>712760520
Squads work better for infantry and shit like fighters etc in games on the scale of Homeworld.

>>712760520
C&C Generals
>both
>both
>it does

>>712761032
A serious response would have asked what the point of developers is if they can't find gameplay design solutions that doesn't involve simply removing a basic gameplay element.
Unless the Z axis was superfluous to begin with, but that's not what I'm getting from your post.

Why did Rise of Nations have the cost of everything increase with each built instance of it? Sounds extremely dumb on paper and it just makes the gameplay slower as the game progresses - especially with the dogshit resource income caps.

>>712760234
My guess is that it's not moddable and old versions are no longer obtainable either. I'm not very upset because from what I remember even the first Sins lacks the ground component compared to IG2 anyway.

>>712726796
Depends, do you like women who pretend to be more retarded than they already are?

>>712761362
If anything it was a holdover from a time when they were considering the idea but never bothered to go all the way. You have to sift through the keybinds to find the option and enable it. Outside of the intital novelty it makes the actual battlegrounds themselves a lot bigger than what they are. So rather than having a min of four vectors for phase entry and eight points of contact you've just tripled that. And since the designs of the ships can either fire from their fronts or broadsides you can engage in micro to sow further confusion.

Add in the ability to set up stat bonuses based on which sides you can exploit like 100% damage to the back and engines or 125% defense from the front. Something that the Visari starbases have the ability to do already. The other games that emphasized using this level of movement was the original Homeworld pre bog and Nebulous Fleet Command. Adds a lot more wrinkles to the game beyond doomstacking and strikecraft spamming.

>>712760638
HiFi Rush was terrible althobeit?

>>712761971
>pretend
Who's going to tell him?

>>712762549
They overplay it because it brings in money.

>>712762773
>overplay it
Don't tell me I'm the one who has to break it to him

>>712761971
Whomst?

>>712761967
>Imperium Galactica 2
This game was doing things that many today still can't match. Even with a hundred times the budget of your average magyar during the fall of the Soviet Union. You had spy networks, research, civil planning, tower defense, ship design, space combat and planetary invasions that you can lead personally. One the few attempts to match MoO2 in the RTS form.

>>712736159
this chart is fucking terrible so I made a lazy attempt at a better one that divides them into general styles, major developers, and a rough timeline. someone with more time should make it look better and add more games to it.

>>712749530
You are one ignorant tardy tard. 90% of RTS PLAYERS DONT TOUCH MULTIPLAYER AT ALL
https://youtu.be/XehNK7UpZsc

>>712756114
Idk. I used to play it and I was confused that they removed autoqueue in multiplayer. It's probably a matter of RTS not being popular nowadays, shrugss.

>>712765208
RTS's look like THIS?

Anyone want to play some BW

are there RTS with branching campaigns?

I feel that it is an underused concept

>>712767062
No of the big ones I can remember do that

what exactly are people asking for when they complain about multiplayer? do they want the game to not have multiplayer at all? do they want the game to not have features like a ladder or a game browser so it's harder for people to play multiplayer if they want to? do they want units to be balanced around single player instead of multiplayer? how would that even work? it just seems to me like what people are really asking for is for rts devs to take the call of duty approach where you have yearly releases and devs immediately drop support for one game so they can work on the next one instead of trying to make a game that you can play for a long time even after finishing the campaign.

>>712767341
you're overthinking it
they only want a cool campaign or something

>>712767062
Dawn of the Tiberium age has campaigns like that, Covert Revolt and Toxic Diversion

>>712767341
They literally want to turtle for 50 minutes and throw massive armies at each other
Don't listen to casualtards

>>712762938
Kaneko Lumi

>>712755627
based outpost 2 chad

>>712767749
>They literally want to turtle for 50 minutes and throw massive armies at each other
yes

>>712767062
Earth 2150 again sorta has them, the last missions are the same no matter which paths you take, if you get that far (the campaign is won by sending a specific amount of credits)
>UCS campaign: some branching missions depending whether you win or lose specific levels
>LC campaign: you can choose to uphold the UCS alliance or go for Neo's offer which causes some missions to be different
>ED campaign: no true branches, but has some secret missions
A related topic might be RTS campaigns where you don't have to win every mission.

>>712767341
PVP brain fundamentally misunderstanding the issue.

>>712767341
they dont know what they want because their experience with RTS is limited to what a 5 yo can understand of the genre

>>712751493
Starcraft 2 appealed almost exclusively to the competitive scene and was widely successful

>>712767341
How do you not forget to breathe sometimes?

>>712768321
Starcraft 2 was also the sequel to the most successful multiplayer RTS game in history.

I think obviating that fact is a bit disingenuous

>>712751493
This anon is right, Compfags only think of 1v1 games where you gotta hyper optimize everything or get clowned. The kind of multiplayer that appeals to most RTS enjoyers is casual 8 player free for all and its variations.

>>712768674
You don't and have never played anything 1v1

>>712768674
Why not both? You know every great RTS with a sweaty 1v1 scene also has a casual multiplayer side with it? co-op, tower defense, rpg's and team games. The greatest RTS's have it all.

There is no conflict here.

>>712768731
I did actually. Both Dawn of War with some Aussie friends on a 200 ping+ connection and back on AoE when learning the fast castle build by 15 minutes was the hottest thing on the block. But I much preferred taking it easy.

>>712733659
I don't recognize any of those things except the last because they weren't in WoL and that's where I stopped. I dropped the game as soon as Reapers lost their D-8 charges.

>>712768908
>fun and 1v1 are exclusive
The mark of a casual
1v1 is when you can truly do whatever you want and skill determines the winner
Teamshit like League literally bans you for "trolling" if you dare don't copy whatever twitchfag meta is fotm

>>712765010
by dev
you know there are games dbs and wikipedia for shit like this

>>712767062
Battle Realms

>>712768970
>compfag acting insufferably and missing the point
Appealing to this kind of person is exactly why RTS died out.

you just need 2 things to make the next big RTS.

1) It needs to run on 90% of currently available hardware

2) LAN capability that works in pirated copies

>>712769098
>literally told you that 1v1 is where you can do what you want so long as you can back it up with skill
>this causes you to seethe
You don't even know what you're angry about

>>712769109
>get your buddies on lan to play some games
>they like the game enough to buy the expansion when it comes out
Modern devs would never understand this

I love and hate Starcraft 2 at the same time.

I love some of the missions, objectives and achievements that make you tackle all these missions in a different way. It's really fun even for a guy who doesn't play RTS 24/7 like a hobo like me.

But I hate it for how much they ruined the whole franchise with their new stupid ass lore and the absolute trainwreck of a story.
Human Kerrigan was hot af in Heart of the Swarm.

>>712769109
1) is already the case with most RTS
2) doesn't fucking matter

>>712769293
Also the coop mode is genuinely fun.

>>712769361
>1) is already the case with most RTS
PFFFFHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

>>712769361
AoE4 requires quite a bit of a good computer for a game that looks worse than League of Legends

I don't know very much about RTS games but I really like being able to pause and think for a bit and not have to scramble.
I know the acronym is "real-time strategy" but i don't care. I want to be able to pause.

Are there games in this space for me? I really like Stronghold Crusader; that's just about the extent of my experience in this genre.

>>712770391
They Are Billions

>>712767565
so like starcraft, warcraft 3, or age of empires 2? I thought those were evil gookclick games.

>>712768313
explain it then

>>712769063
the original chart is just schizo rambling. I tried to group games into sub-genres.

>>712767341
>do they want the game to not have multiplayer at all?
Pretty much
They say they want a "cool campaign" without acknowledging that nearly all RTS campaigns are trial-and-error dogshit that isn't actually fun

>>712757798
I watched this whole vid

what fucking insanity drives a team of people to design a villain that blows up billions of planets each filled with billions of people and then gives them a "They were sad, you forgive them right?" Ending
I refuse to believe this is real. The youtuber's making a joke there's no fucking way.
WHAT THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH PEOPLE

>>712770391
Almost every game can be paused

>>712770391
Plenty of RTS gives you the ability to issue commonds while pause if playing single play along side the ability to control the game speed

'minder that over 90% of RTS players don't EVER touch multiplayer, and less than 10% of multiplayer games are PvP. Don't let /v/ sweatcucks speak for the fanbase just because they're more tryhard at pointless apm spam due to literal autism. THEY HAVE NO SAY IN THIS. They are the smallest niche of an already niche genre.

Multiplayer game design is anti-RTS. Developers purposefully avoid cool units, mechanics and campaigns which are the heart and soul of RTS for the sake of le balance. The delusional elitist comptards have been killing RTS for too long.

You may SEETHE, you may COPE, but RTS is a SINGLE PLAYER ONLY genre.

>>712773993
Jokes and bait aside, I think it's more a case that some RTS games try to ONLY be one or the other, when the truth is that a configurable multiplayer Skirmish mode is the test of weather your game is fun and worth playing more than once. All you need to do is let players choose a map or randomize, arrange the number of players, teams, bots, what faction/random, and what level of difficulty the bots are. If you do that, you give everyone a way to enjoy your game from the 1v1 esports tryhards to the compstompers.

And you're wrong, the only objectively and morally correct way to enjoy the RTS genre is to load up Dawn of War Dark Crusade, create a game where it's 4 of your friends and you on one team versus 2 Ork and 1 Necron bot team on Insane difficulty.

>>712749962
starship troopers terran command

>>712773993
>'minder that over 90% of RTS players don't EVER touch multiplayer
no proof

>>712773993
but what do you think is more important for single player: the campaign, or playing in skirmish matches against AI?

>>712778636
hot girls

I need to bitch about how fucking terribly handled the last Dune RTS was.
Spice wars was pushed heavily towards launch as having a UNIQUE and ENGAGING singleplayer experience but it's just Risk for retards connecting skirmish maps. It was incredibly simple and two of the factions weren't even playable in the "campaign" mode.
Meanwhile the multi which they hardly talked about was actually the bees knees and included moving fronts, allies of opportunity and mass backstabbing and mind games. It's where all the systems actually came into play because lets be real you can't bamboozle an AI that thinks a deal where you give them all your spice in return for some money so you can instantly win the game is a good deal because numerically they got the bigger number now.

>>712778636
nobody plays ai skirmish bro

>>712773993
RTS games shine in multiplayer, being symmetrical strategy games (both players have the same rules and start on the same footing), so it boils down to a game of skill and strategy
RTS games against the computer involve no skill or strategy

>>712773993
Single player RTS with “cool units” is literally autism

>>712779124
I did when I was young
one of my friends only plays skirmishes against ai

>>712773993
same reason Smash clones fail they just focus on competitive people want the full package

>>712768968
broodlord infestor spine crawler was wol: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KhM5VYIwDRE
death ball was every expansion

>handcannon guy not here
Grim

>>712779124
>nobody plays ai skirmish bro

>>712779897
You're right, I only vaguely remember brood lords in WoL though. I don't remember them being particularly all that strong compared to mutalisk spam.

This is more of a /tg/ related question, but I'm trying to develop a deckbuilder base don RTS-style gameplay loops.

I wanted to ape Starcraft just for ease of developing i.e. three asymmetric sides, but with similar goals.

My main question is what makes an RTS scratch the itch for you anons versus any other game genre? What sets them apart?

>>712781186
>My main question is what makes an RTS scratch the itch for you anons versus any other game genre?
Being real time

>>712781231
>
So are FPS, TPS, survival horror, and most other video games

>>712781349
Sorry, being real time and a strategy game

>>712781186
>My main question is what makes an RTS scratch the itch for you anons versus any other game genre? What sets them apart?
The sheer spectacle of recreating massive battles without too much of the bullshit and logistics involved. Provided the whole thing doesn't chug dick 86% of the time it is enjoyable to watch the opposing factions punch the shit out of each other. In a team based compstomp the AI can carry most of the central theaters while you can larp as fire support, setting up defensive lines or even microing small sabotage teams behind it all to fuck with their shit.

>>712781186
RTS are action games, strategy games and in depth sandboxes
Theyre the whole package in videogayman
Theyre adrenaline pumping, addictive and well paced. You can plan or improvise, do methodical gameplay or stupid shit against players. It has a great range of player expression, and loo awesome

>>712779948
i tend to not post in pure RTS threads. i mainly do it in threads with aoe2 OPs

>>712779948
>>712782102
though i could start doing it in RTS threads since you missed it.

im trying to play AoE2 but i find it really confusing. on most campaign maps i find myself just creating shitloads of farms and sending villagers to chop wood, and trading for gold in the market, and hoping somehow this is good enough. the game has a lot of other options for food but for some reason they never seem that viable.

>>712740852
Sure have.

>>712782705
That's normal

>>712782705
other food sources are for early game or to supplement your farm economy later in the game. in a mission with 200pop, roughly half of your pop should be villagers.

>white magic
>18/18/20 boons/life/nature
>12 levels in defensive mind magic for the mana refill spell
Yup, it's spellforce time

Fuck you guys, bargain bin 40k was great.

>>712783154
Is spellforce 3 good?

>>712783240
oh nightdive brought this back from oblivion, cool

>>712783565
Haven't played it yet so i dunno. Currently playing sf2

>>712783154
>when you go back to previous maps all the bases you constructed dissapears
fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck, i really don't like that

>>712768538
So by your own logic when you selectively obviate one fact it's ok, but not when I do it. Got it, thanks.

>>712781186
My two favorite RTS are SC2 and BAR (Beyond all Reason). I also love board games and deckbuilders. And I mean like Star Realms and Dominion, which is what I assume you mean, as opposed to like MtG.

I spent way too much time in MSpaint just to give you some ideas.

Some things that scratch the itch in RTS games:
1. Exponential growth. Deckbuilders already tend to do this, it's probably why I like them so much. Start small, buy things which let you get bigger, repeat until you hit unit cap/run out of space/end the game.

2. Rock/paper/scissors. Constantly trying to counter what the opponent is making by making the counter. You don't know whats going on in the fog of war. This would obviously be hard to replicate with a deckbuilder because you both need access to much more information compared to a computer game. You will know how much resources the enemy has and what they're spending them on, and what units and buildings they have at all times. Is there a way to obfuscate that information? Maybe the rock/paper/scissors comes from a commit->reveal game flow. Maybe units "committed" to the "front" of the battlefield are committed face up, where as units "committed" to the "back" are facedown. Then there is a reveal and battle is resolved.

3. Nukes. Is there anything more satisfying than glassing your enemies base?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHy8nW29dVg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TOL_RMuYkF0

They don't make 'em like they used to.

I like making custom maps for WC3.

>>712723273
Dawn of War

Need some tldr on
>Ashes of the Singularity
>Grey Goo
>Sunage

>>712785412
>ashes
Wannabe Sup-Com/TA style game that is so automated it's almost a auto-battler. Everything is hovertanks.
>Grey Goo.
the most 7/10 RTS ever made, poorly optimized. Soulful, jank, dogshit. Too competent to hate, not good enough to like, You either love it or don't care about it.

>>712785412
>Sunage
I had a CD of this game a long time ago. It was pretty fun, like squad-based Red Alert, but the unit collision was frustrating. However, I couldn't play this anymore because I lost the CD and the pirated copied online will detect the game is pirated. After like 10 minutes into the game, your units will suddenly erupt in flames. There's still no fix to it I'm afraid.

>>712716163 (OP)
Majesty 2 & Evil Genius are peak

every single rts thread ends up like this lol
casualfags get fucked
learn to make a goddamn single unit in less than 10 minutes

Get dunked eco fags

i played Galactic Battlegrounds today for the first time because of this thread

I've been playing CnC 3 recently as I got it in the bundle anyway and man am I disliking the overall gameplay. Defenses feel like they're made of paper, none of the units feel great to use as the rock paper scissor balance ensures you'll use the legally mandated counter and nothing else, and god forbid you look away for 5 seconds so they all run in and die because they're busy attacking the wrong target. The game's also really damn and all the units and buildings just kinda blend together.

MORE GOLD YOUR MAJESTY

>>712750831
>B-but MUH grimdark SC+BW atmosphere ruined!
>MUH Kerrigan is supposed to be EVUL!
>MUH Jim is supposed to be vengeful without relenting!
>MUH good things can't ever happen, everything has to be tragedy and and edge!

>>712725917
this game is a piece of shit that doesnt respect your time
you can spend like 30 minutes building your shit and just lose to one stray zombie
its a waste of time

>>712790758
literal skill issue

Is SupCom still the best game for turtling?
>multiple shield gen
>anti-nuke + nuke spam
>unblockable endgame artillery
>big units that can take a lot of damage
>can never run out of map resources

>>712790839
>DSLR
>2025

>>712790894
maybe.
the survive subgenre like Conan: Unconquered, TAB and Age of Darkness are all super turtle focused but it's not really traditional turtling.

>>712724629
>>712724782
>>712724838
>Touhou Red Alert 2 mod
Source?

>>712791302
search "gullible" on the internet. youll find it.

>>712791996
>ask for source
>act like a faggot
Why?

>>712725917
I think the issue is the difficulty, it's fun when it's really hard, but most people don't like hard games, but when it's easy it's boring and tedious because you just sit there waiting for shit to happen

>>712792254
im just having a little fun anon. type in "Touhou Red Alert 2 mod" into your favorite search engine and it should pop up.

>>712789187
Play expanding fronts.

>>712789670
That's CnC, not really great games altogether, but very nice presentation and ambience

>>712728274
Holy fucking based. I like the aesthetic. A mix between age of empires and cossacks

>>712734232
>definitive edition
Why?

>>712723273
Rise of Nations

>>712720778
Garrison the buildings at the edge of the map and they melt everything.

Baldur's Gate 2 - Improved Anvil

Anybody here playing tactical D&D mods? It's really the ultimate challenge in the D&D realm. There is nothing else out there. No other game, definitely not the newest release, and no other Baldurs Gate 2 mod either. SCS simply doesn't cut it if you are looking for a challenge.
I uploaded a few videos here if anybody wants to have a taste:

https://odysee.com/@Githzerai:e/Troll-Mound:d

https://odysee.com/@Githzerai:e/Guarded-Compound:4

https://odysee.com/@Githzerai:e/Kangaxx:a

>>712781186
>bogtross edit
kek

>>712767341
we want solid campaigns and decent AIs so that we can play comfy games any time we want, without having to play with sweats, cope with empty server lists or force friends to play with us (assuming we even have friends)

>>712756862
yeah, I found it as a kid back when the internet was full of weird free shit you could play but you can easily find it on steam now
>>712757892
it's worth a try if you're into weird, obscure games
the 2 factions have interesting aesthetics but they're very unbalanced and the AI is insanely brutal from what I remember
so it's certainly not a classic like aoe or ee

also the game had an interesting bug/cheat in the early versions
if you right clicked an enemy, you could attack it instantly and if you did this rapidly your units would have a very high rate of fire
and that was the only way I could defeat the AI

>>712799654
>James McAvoy had a sex change

>>712746589
>>712745849
>>712746810
>we will never have a CnC themed battlezone-esque FPS/RTS hybrid
SERIOUSLY GAY

>>712801040
>EA cancelled this game due to "quality concerns"
What was the real reason?

>>712801221
cost cutting or something as a mess behind the scenes

>>712723543
Tbf those are hard you need seamless low/no downtime play
I can only beat them when pausing most of the time as a way to cheese me not having god tier APM and even then the decisions I make in minute one could fuck me over later even with the pausing (wrong resource priority)

>>712767341
If the only way to playtest something is a skirmish it sucks
MP is great to keep the scene alive but MP is a vastly different crowd from SP
This isnt about choosing x or y, this is about you want to have a MP and SP scene? Then do both x and y.
Its up to developers what they want, both SP and MP communities are big enough to want to care about. If a developer doesnt do SP experience like campaigns and then wonders why the SP portion of the RTS crowd is staying away is retarded.

>>712767341
They just want puzzle games disguised as epic tales of genius generals. It's extremely easy to satisfy them, but they don't understand that devs desire MP players.
All the popular RTS have or had big MP scenes, objectively contributing to their success. If Warcraft 3 was released today without a multiplayer mode it would've been forgotten nearly instantly.

>>712802994
We got discount Warcraft 3 mixed with Starcraft 2, made by ex-Blizzard devs no less, and it's DoA. Focusing almost entirely on multiplayer to the extent that they released it before they had even considered making a singleplayer campaign for it didn't help it at all. That they also expected it to be some big E-sports game didn't help either.

Is there an RTS were you directly command a General, and he moves a bunch of soldiers around himself?
Specfically, I'm trying to find low-micro games, where you control maybe half a dozen "pieces" on the map, but these pieces are composed of multiple soldiers. I'm quite content with BfME and DoWII, but I'm wondering if there's something more "traditional", like an Age of Empires or something close, with diferent control schemes.

>>712717785
Yes

>>712803237
It's almost as if you had to make a good game first.
BAR is MP-only too and is thriving.

>>712773993
Stormgate was ass, you could see that from the trailers.
I wish I could've tried Battle Aces. Looked like something that would've been fun for a weekend, the first weekend where everyone is still new

>>712741679
Started the Ukie campaign; I think I managed to finish the mission where you have to free the dudes from the camp, but holy shit, those invisible timers are really fucking annoying.

yo this is fucking ass lmao

>>712803448
doesn't exist

>>712803448
Yeah, schlophammer has always been ass.

>>712802994
Warcraft 3 became big thanks to custom games not ladder so that's a bad example. Also the singleplayer was the springboard for WoW one of the most successful games of all time.

>>712803448
it's kind of funny how Relic failed all three of their last RTS sequels.

Reminder, most RTS players don't bother playing ladder/pvp, it's more often than not only the campaign
Just look at the achievment rates

>>712803757
>Reminder, most RTS players don't bother playing ladder/pvp, it's more often than not only the campaign
Yeah, rts is a single player genre, just like rpgs.

>>712803757
most dont finish the campaign either, anon.

>>712803440
Men of War is the worst thing that has happened to Soldiers and the GEM engine

>>712803757
Anon, most people don't finish the games they play at all. Using the achievement completion rates isn't the silver bullet you think it is. It's question for the industry at large that most people don't even finish their games at all.

>>712803813
most people don't finish the first level of any game if we go by stats

https://store.steampowered.com/app/2012510/Stormgate/
Did you fall for the hype anon?

>>712716163 (OP)
AoE 3 has some free trial right now on Steam

Gonna add my recomendation to the thread. Multiwinia.
It's very simple, yet very fun. Has a very fun way of controlling troops, a lot of diferent scenarios.
I'd recomend playing Darwinia first if you care about Lore. Several things in the sequel will spook you right up after you play the first one.

>>712803813
>>712803872
True, most people don't finish the campaign, but it varies where they drop it. Some drop it at the start, others near the end, etc.
And absolutely, it isn't a silver bullet, but achievment rates can be used to try and determine how many people even bother interacting with the multiplayer, or campaign, etc.
For example in Iron Harvest (dogshit game btw fuck the devs) only 18.5% bothered playing a multiplayer match.
I just think that it's important to take into account when it comes to discussing RTS games, that it appears that a significant majority of the playerbase isn't interested in pvp

>>712803994
It stank for me since the first trailer. It looked like a bad Starcraft clone and it turned out to be even worse.
I just wish that modern devs would try to make something original for once. I already have the classic C&C, why would I want to play a knockoff? The old Age of Mythology looks and works just fine, why would I pay for the remaster?

>>712803994
Hype for what?
>exnununublizzard devs!
>esports!
>nu-starcraft 2!

>>712804498
The first two could've been a sign of good things. The third one was the killer. There's objectively no point in trying to just make a new Starcraft 2.

>>712804574
>The first two could've been a sign of good things
lol no
never
lmao
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

>>712804498
>exnununublizzard devs!
Given many people believed blizzard went to shit because of the suits and not the devs, I can see it
>esports
were they shilling esports? fuck
>nu-starcraft 2
I liked starcraft 2 I confess
Primarly the coop PvE mode, which is what sold me for Stormgate, their 3 player coop mode
shame it went to shit

>>712804613
There was a time where I would've disagreed with that sentiment. Now though? Nothing good comes out of Blizzard, so nothing from the people from Blizzard can be good either.

>>712804424
>>712804498
How bad did they fuck it up? I haven't followed the game but I recall seeing some hype among my friends when it was first announced and then absolutely nothing. Didn't even know it was out in early access.

>>712803994
I was mildly interested (just like I am with every new RTS, maybe something nice would happen), but that interest died when I played the first demo they put out. I gave it a second chance when they released their pitiful attempt at campaign, but it was so bad I permanently removed Shartgate from my mind.
At least I didn't spend money supporting this scam

>>712804856
>How bad did they fuck it up?
Very.
Even the paid shills have given up.

>>712804856
>How bad did they fuck it up?
below 50% positive reviews, no players and a lackluster campaign and story

>>712804856
>How bad did they fuck it up?
RTS? You want real time schloppa?

>>712803757
And most football players play barely keeping the rules, in a small field behind grandmas garden.
Nobody will ask them for some opinions how to improve football or what is its future.

>>712805164
>>712805252
not a lot of changed from the beta to the early access release btw

>>712803615
Homeworld3 was not Relic

>>712805336
>Homeworld3
What a fucking way to go for HW.

Now I think about it multiplayer RTS was probably way more fun before you were expected to look up guides online for meta and build orders

>>712805375
Personally I prefer the
PLAGIARISM WILL MAKE ME GOD
line

>>712716163 (OP)
>Still no Asian magic jap themed RTS since battle realms
>Still no alternative for 23 years
Fucking why

>>712805375
It was fucking hilarious how bad the story of that game was that it actively pulled down everything else with it to hell. Gearbox pulled another Borderlands 3 moment on an entirely separate series.

>>712805164
>>712805252
This feels like they took the terrans from Starcraft, the humans from Warcraft and completely avoided everything that made both factions tick in their games.

>>712805336
he probably means AoE4, Coh3, DoW3
though AoE4 was a decent success probably the most popular new RTS in a decade.
The release version was mighty unfinished though, basically just campaign and skirmish and that's it, lacking controls, game modes, no map editor.
The very first AoE offered more.

>>712777531
This anon fucking gets it. It's surprising just how nicely these devs were able to fit the world of starship troopers into an rts format and make 3 campaigns, each more interesting than the last.

>>712805375
I just had to hear how woke infested the game is and the stupid cutscenes with faced character and I immediately knew whoever the fuck are the new writers never understood HW

>>712805829
Some of the bug designs are...questionable to say the least. the Basic Arachnids and their variants and the Tanker bugs look fine. The giant scorpions that delete your backline? What the fuck D-list budget film spawned them?

>>712805431
you're not expected to do that today either. You've just convinced yourself that if you can't parrot 400 APM pros you're bad.

>>712805829
i think the mercenary campaign was fine gameplay-wise, but not so much story-wise. basegame+urban dlc were great though.

>>712805947
I do agree with you. FUCK scorpions.
>>712806042
Urban onslaught is my favourite as well, but I love the Feds VS Mercs conflict in hellfire

I'm still seething that despite being ex-Blizzard none of them would be able to recreate Wings of Liberty campaign.
>no side missions to get more resources for branching out upgrades
>no permanent passive or active upgrades/abilities for your units or buildings
>no mercenaries that you can just spend money to instantly get without spending time and resources to unlock their requirements first
>no unique campaign units like the Odin or lmao Zerg mindcontrol tower

>>712727536
KEK

>>712783154
Ah yes, it was a fun run
Shame that Boons and Nature are literally fucking worthless in that game, like holy shit

>>712806374
To be fair neither could Blizzard.

>>712783565
I enjoyed it, the base game has a good story, the DLC story gets whack near the end and then the last DLC story is really good but I really did not like the two choices for the ending.

>>712805829
I like the line of attack concept. The reviews for the game are all pretty bad though.

>>712783154
magic always felt inferior to just making a warrior, especially a heavy warrior. i could solo entire armies in melee, i couldn't as a mage

How is C&C Generals working on Win10? Its part of C&C collection on Steam but I wanted to know first (I played C&C 3 and RA3 before so I would rather get Generals alone but since game is not on GOG, I don't really have a choice).

>>712806983
I'd always throw in some magic for the hell of it. Usually necromancy because having some skelebros around is fun. Not the most effective but fuck it.

>>712806983
I always get swayed to playing pala once I pick up that chest armor piece that has like 5 times as much defense as anything else you got at this point.

>>712716163 (OP)
Really stupid question but what is a 2D RTS? Because as far as I know every RTS is basically either 2D because the vertical axis doesn't really matter (Except maybe the concept of higher/lower ground for vision or combat bonuses) or everything is 3D because they all simulate a 3D space.

Unironic question because part of me was thinking about the idea of making an RTS game styled like Carbot's Starcraft mod where everything is shown as a cartoonish 2D sprite, but I don't know if that's a popular style for RTS games or not.

>>712807381
Isometric 2D sprites vs 3D models. The functional aspect rarely matters because most 3D games function on grids just like the 2D ones anyway.

>>712807381
Most are 2d and either look 2d or 3d but functionally still 2d. Rare 3d ones is something like Homeworld.
SC2 despite having 3d models is still functionally 2d.

is it worth buying?

>>712807381
Full 3D mostly applies to space games like Homeworld. Graphics don't matter.

>>712807482
>>712807521
>>712807613
Thanks for the helpful explanations anons, appreciate it.

>>712803994
no, there are Gates of Pyre and Liquidation.
rip Battle Aces

>>712804328
Multiplayer was hopelessly bad in Iron Harvest while the campaign was at least serviceable. The lesson here is that inexperienced devs shouldn't attempt to cater to compfags, because they're very difficult to please.

>>712807521
>still functionally still 2d
I think OP was going for 3D not aging that well and readability usually lacking. (pic rel are 20 years apart.

there are still some differences, but this is nitpicking territory.
2d is usually grid based and allows precise placement allowing stuff like house walling in AoE. They can still have some fake elevation, flying units etc. but also have a few anomalies, that is that a diagonally moving units have to move a longer distance to move to a new tile.
Bullet simulation sounds more like a thing of 3D games, but AoE has this too however a 3D game like SupCom allows for terrain blocking projectiles

>>712733659
Sc2 walked so that HOTS could run (and fatally trip)

>>712728274
>>712728367
>>712728542
>>712729894
It's just not very good unfortunately. I like the grand strategy map and the building systems and the like, but the battles are awful and there aren't enough options for you to take to win.
It's like 60% there but the remaining 40% has so many problems I just can't get into it, even though I've tried a lot.

SOVL

>>712730980
Are we doomed to never get a new Stronghold game that isn't shit? I loved 2 for all its flaws, but Firefly are so incompetent all they can do is re-released their old games and not do any actual dev work.
Manorlords will be a better Stronghold game at this rate even with its slow update releases

Got my first win at 500 mmr AOE2
I was losing hard until I infiltrated the enemy base with like 4 spearmen + 5 scouts and my opponent decided to surrender even doe he could easily defeat me if he just continued playing

>>712810783
>all they can do is re-released their old games and not do any actual dev work.
This can be said about basically all modern RTS "devs". Even those who release new IPs just do knockoffs of older titles.

>>712810505
It's less the battle gameplay is bad but it's just really easy to win, especially if you invest on really good units like Knights Templars.

>>712781186
Building an army and waging war.
That's why like total war games are more popular than ever and RTS are dead by the way.
The majority of people just want to build bases and an army and go kill stuff with it.

>>712781186
>RTS scratch the itch for you anons versus any other game genre?
Being everything at once. Putting you in charge. The overlord of the war machine.
I don't exactly care about base building (I don't hate it either), I'm more of a tactics fag, that's why titles like Dawn of War, Men of War, Company of Heroes, Gates of Hell and alike are my cup of tea. Usage of cover, different weapons, vehicles, call-ins and much more.

>>712810505
so it's like the first one then

>>712806668
>boons
>worthless
Nigga what

>>712803994
No, it was immediately clear to me that they had no direction with this

>>712811180
what?
AoE started that trend making one of the best remasters in gaming.
Then there was like C&C which was very well received, Battle Realms was good (more like a passion project)
SC and WC3 sucked, but they wasn't particular lazy.
Any remasters/remakes I forgot?

They only RTS devs that are still around are Relic and Petroglyph and I'm not too optimistic about Petroglyph

>>712767062
Conquest earth had this but it wasn’t worth it

>>712813872
>SC and WC3 sucked
SC remaster was all right
not great not terrible
WC3 sucked hard