what's with modern devs and pic related? as if it's living for free in their heads

>>713594478 (OP)
Capitalism never worked in the real world, so they're trying to discuss it in art.

>>713594478 (OP)
they hate their jobs sitting in front of a computer and think they would somehow be doing something better in a planned economy instead of doing hard labor

>>713594478 (OP)

>>713594478 (OP)
>t.

>>713594478 (OP)
College is a machine that turns bright eyed young adults with potential into embittered and useless activists

>>713594890
It is also a mandatory requirement to get a career you can do without breaking your body by 50.

>>713594986
Break your mind or break your body? What a choice.

>>713594986
yeah, if you're stupid. smart people don't need college

still waiting for that trickle down

any day now

they cant just hoard it all for themselves right

>>713594478 (OP)
Capitalism oppresses Women and Minorities for the sake of straight white billionaire men.

>>713595081
living as a bum in the US is better than living "middle class" in third world countries

>>713595081
It's called piracy

>>713594478 (OP)
People with arrested development (all modern game writers) struggle with nuanced concepts so they reduce everything down to extremely simple and juvenile terms that they can understand.

Why is it ok for the 1% to own 99% of the wealth?

>>713595135
So things can’t improve?

>>713596395
because they worked hard for it!

>>713594478 (OP)
It's the dominant economic system of our times. Of course people are going to reflect on it.

>>713594890
If by that you mean going into eternal debt slavery at an age you're not legally allowed to drink yet in order to meet the minimum expectation on the job market and, after years of work, being forced to grovel before "job creators" and be told to be grateful for scraps, then yes, funny how that process turns people anti-capitalist

>>713595016
Third option, break your mind and neglect your body by being a useless shitposting NEET

>>713596401
They are improving, for the rich

>>713596572
Our economic system is democratic socialism, if you have a problem with the market, blame the regulators you pay taxes to for not doing their jobs and not the idea of free commerce.

>>713596627
Finally, we too can make things as miserable for our poor and huddled masses as they ought to be! The Third World was way ahead of us in this regard for ages.

>>713594478 (OP)
Capitalism is human nature.
>nooooooooo why does this system revolve around humans trying to outcompete each other no matter what???
Take any other system and watch it morph into the same over time, the only way to prevent capitalism is to install a regime that forcefully prevents it.

>>713596665
>Our economic system is democratic socialism
lol

lmao

>>713594478 (OP)
Capitalism kills creativity. The entire entertainment industry is on its ass because all executive decisions are made by CEO's and stakeholders.
This is why you only see half assed remakes of existing IP's and cheap cashgrabs in both film and vidya.
The music industry is no different which is full of niggers and pussies nowadays.

>>713596783
>Take any other system and watch it morph into the same over time
Imagine being a dialectical materialist and still concluding that capitalism is the end state of history

I love benefitting from a system of oppression

>>713596801
Yes, a semi regulated market in which the government intervenes in the economy to a limited degree with the purpose of preventing abuses. You're complaining about the very concept of commerce and completely ignoring that the people you are begging to regulate harder are, themselves, corrupt as fuck and only interested in regulating YOU six feet under the fucking ground because they're on corporate payroll. But sure, keep on with your college educated ignorance and keep being a useful footsoldier for corporate, you fags have been doing it the last 15 years since you let the feds misdirect back during OWS, being retarded has been rather on point for you since then.

>>713596825
I don't know man, they're being pretty creative in the way they fuck the masses over.

>>713596982
>Yes, a semi regulated market in which the government intervenes in the economy to a limited degree with the purpose of preventing abuses.
That's still capitalist. You're confusing economics and politics.
>You're complaining about the very concept of commerce and completely ignoring that the people you are begging to regulate harder are, themselves, corrupt as fuck
Literally no one mentioned this, congrats on winning an imaginary argument.

The world is so simple from where you're standing huh?

>>713597127
You're oversimplifying and you know it, or worse, you don't and you're just that retarded. Socialism is government intervention, definitionally, the economy is partially socialised and always has been.

>>713597221
>Socialism is government intervention, definitionally,
LOL
Jesus
lmao
*wheeze*

>>713594478 (OP)
I think everyone on earth should just die tbhfam

>>713594478 (OP)
>living for free
nope, capitalism charges rent. it stares you down every single day.

>>713597271
He's talking about Europe, not the US which is jewed beyond repair.
Should've been clear when he mentioned "democractic", which the US is not.

>>713597221
>You're oversimplifying!
>Socialism is when government
Still absolutely howling at this take
>>713597398
He's not talking about anything, nothing he says has any bearing on reality and he has no idea what he's talking about

How come trannies think communism will somehow favor them?

>>713597476
>think
Not something they do, or they'd think about the consequences of mutilating themselves with cosmetic surgery

>>713597476
Americans have no clue what these ideologies actually entail. Fat mutts LARPing as commies/fascists always make me laugh.

>>713597476
communism favors humanity. the only people it does not favor are the parasites, the slaveowners, the landlords, the bankers, etc.
note you randomly bringing up identity politics is a CONDITIONING capitalists have pressed on you so that you stop talking about capitalism and instead divert to muh queers or muh brown people. all the time.

>>713594478 (OP)
The answer is that the industry is filled with Marxist-Leninists that want to overthrow capitalism. Hence we had the game awards celebrating Disco Elysium and promoting Bolshevism worldwide. Likewise how they promoted Atomic Heart 2.

>>713597476
something alongside eating the rich and the redistributed wealth meaning they won't have to work ever again or whatever

>>713597623
>communism favors humanity

>>713597523
Yes, obviously they've never thought about the outcome of a process that's designed to address a specific problem they have, and which they explicitly ask for and had to go through extensive psychological evaluation for. Do *you* honestly think about any of your shit?

>>713597476
They think communism is about everyone holding hands and being able to take what they want whenever they need it. If you asked a person who lived in actual communist countries what they think about it, they'd spit on the ground and tell you never again.

>>713597623
How can it favour humanity when it has the biggest body count of any ideology ever conceived? Even the ancient fucking Greeks took one look at it and decided to make a mockery of it in Assemblywomen.

>>713597681
Yes.

>>713595102
It doesnt but it should

>>713597698
Obviously not since there's a coinflip probability they kill themselves after they've done it.

>>713597698
They don't have a problem, they just think they do. Physically mutilating yourself doesn't fix your delusion.

>>713597659
Always love this one
The slide is from a Grand Strategy game designer talking about creating alternate history games where certain historical events can happen if certain conditions are met, rather than according to a fixed timeline. It's not about any other aspect of Marxism. The slide even derides Marxism as "crazy talk" and implies it's only appliccable to video games.

In other words, every time you repost this you demonstrate that you lack critical thought and just reflexively fly into a rage at the word "Marxism", or perhaps you're just deeply dishonest. I'm going to guess it's both.

>>713597735
I'm living in a capitalist country right now and let me tell you,

>>713597889
doesn't count cuz you're brown

>>713597812
That's entirely false. You are at the arse end of a human centipede of misinformation.

>>713597827
Thinking you have a problem is, in fact, the nature of a psychological problem.

>>713597947
Wrong again boyo, but I do like the tacit admission that capitalism breeds racism and is an inherently awful system for large swathes of the population.

I don't even mind the discussion or conflict being capitalism but west audience can't do it right.
>Evil for Evil
Protesting and that shit absolutely does nothing, what people don't really want to admit is that to illicit actual change? You need to play on their level.
>Nihilism
Nothing changes because people are comfortable with where things are at. They're uncomfortable at change and even though their lives suck ass, they know shit can get worse quick. it can also get better but they don't want to take that risk.
I think some people know this already but post a certain event I think it's impossible to write a work that pulls an FF7 (early) or something in the west.

>>713597981
We've all seen the statistics, buddy, in fact it's probably gotten worse since I last checked, so my coinflip analogy is the only thing out of date here.

>>713597889
that you won't ever leave it for a communist hellhole

>>713594478 (OP)
impostor's syndrome after being severely overpaid for a couple months worth of work

>>713594478 (OP)
Capitalism kills creativity and is responsible for the rise of grifters infecting gaming with their outrage bait and complaints about wokeness.

I still don't know what capitalism even is.

>>713597837
or perhaps it's an obvious promotion of marxism and your critical thought is mere bullshit

>>713597748

>>713598039
Actually maybe FFXVI sorta did something like this with the crystals but it sidelined that plot pretty hard.

>>713597981
ywnbaw

>>713596982
You people will literally just use terms wrong, then call other people ignorant.
Capitalism just means that a person can privately own the means of production to make profit. That's it.
Socialism just means that the government owns the means of production. That's it.
Regulation has nothing to do with socialism. You retards just always push that notion anyway, because you're confused, retarded, and you listen to semantic propaganda until you don't even understand what the fuck you're saying anymore.
Go, look it up! I did, just to make sure I was right!
You flaccid dipshits can't even do that, because you can't think unless it conforms to a faggy narrative you read on twitter.

>>713598024
>capitalism breeds racism
Human nature breeds racism. In every single human society on earth that has light-skinned and dark-skinned people, the dark-skinned ones are looked down on.

>>713598251
Ah, le human nature.

>>713598192
>well if I just attribute these random conflicts to capitalism
you're so retarded

>>713594563
We should really give them this planned economy they yearn for because it will 100% result in them being in a labor camp digging trenches and probably dying of typhus.

>>713598285
>tribal species is tribal
>wtf how could this be
>i am very smart and above this :)

>>713598049
>We've all seen the statistics
You have no idea what you've seen, and I honestly do mean that.

The statistic that's bandied about is about lifetime suicidal ideation, i.e. people who were very much still alive were asked if, at *any* point in their lives, they had thoughts about suicide. That includes before transitioning. That includes people who had yet to transition at that point. Obviously, not everyone with suicidal thoughts follows through, and statistics show that transitioning drastically reduces them. In fact, regret after transitioning is lower than for many common surgeries, and the reasons are often related to societal acceptance. Which is why the paper you're desperately misinterpreting advocates for improving societal acceptance.

>>713598323
No, I'm not going to entertain this shit again, they've starved enough people to death only to shrug and say it doesn't count.

>>713598179
>or perhaps it's an obvious promotion of marxism
It really isn't.

>>713598126
comunism kills creativity and is responsible for the rise of grifters infecting gaming with their outrage bait and complaints about capitalism.

>>713598407
>>713598370
>>713598323
>>713598296
>>713598285
>>713598248
does post 9/11 cause writers to avoid this topic now? it feels like when you're against capitalism in the media now you're either didndu nothing protester or an epic hacker man

>>713598427
>marxism is great
>nuh uh
k

>>713598248
>Socialism just means that the government owns the means of production.
No, it's that the workers own the means of productions, under a government run by the workers. A capitalist government could very well put the means of production under direct government control without altering its fundamental capitalist nature.

>>713597317
I will never understand why these people will complain about low pay and cost of housing, then turn around and demand open borders.

>>713596401
They already do. The quality of life of your average blue collar worker is better than that of a medival king.

>>713598476
>>713598475
>>713598474
>>713598492
wanted to ask this question >>713598462
feels like nobody in the media can really do vs capatlism in a nuance view anymore and it really just seems very good or bad. it's just CAPATLISM ITSELF ISNT BAD ITS ACTUALLY JUST THE GUY IN POWER THATS BAD

>>713598248
Don't bother these retards don't have a good faith bone in their body. It's always the same
>well YEAH I'd love if the government could fix all my problems but everyone in the government is heckin CORRUPT so the only choice is to let corporations sell the air I breathe back to me and thank them for it
>Oh and every 4 years I'll vote for the guy who says he doesn't like the government either! Even though him and his team are all part of it!

>>713598462
>>713598517
mass reply faggot

>>713598476
They don't draw a connection between those two things, you straight up tell them and it's like the neural pathways between those ideas have been cut via surgery.

>>713598164
The capitalist owns the means of production (for instance, a factory) and they pay workers a wage for their labor. The workers generate more money (value) through their labor than they get paid in wages. That's surplus value. The capitalist pockets all of this surplus value and gets to do whatever he likes with it.
https://www.marxists.org/glossary/terms/c/a.htm#capitalism

>>713598407
It might shock you to hear just how many famines were experienced by capitalist countries. Russia experienced periodic famines well before the USSR - but experienced its last one after barely a few decades of communist rule.

>>713596825
It doesn't kill it, it simply doesn't promote it. The solution is not consume mainstream content.

>>713598557
>>713598556
>>713598551
>>713598524
>>713598559
reasking this question btw >>713598517

>>713598474
>marxism is crazy but great in the specific context of designing a historical video game
... but I guess context is not your strong suit

>>713598462
You're still not getting it. Capitalism is never defined as anything substantive, no one actually has a problem with private ownership of "means of production". Are you going to have a conniption if I own a tractor and own a farm? Yeah, fuck no. How about if I own my gamedev software and make my own game? No. Obviously not. Lefties just sperg out over "capitalism" because they blame everything else wrong with the world or in their life on the nebulous idea of "le capitalism" because they are reductionist retards with room temp IQ. If you try to explain to them how usury alone has sapped most of their generational wealth they'll just call you antisemitic or some shit.

>>713598517
>amerimutts
>applying nuance and moderation
That's like asking an elephant to do a backflip.

>>713598556
Okay that sounds normal though. Every transaction is exploitative in some way. It seems like the "problem" with capitalism is that it works too well/

>>713598285
>Ah, le human nature.
Yes. It is human nature. Literally go reserach what I told you, in every single human society on earth that has light-skinned and dark-skinned people the dark-skinned ones are looked down on. Regardless of the financial or political system at play there.

>>713598559
>hurrr vote with your wallet
This has never worked. The retarded mob falls for agressive marketing too easily.

>>713598603
I think you replied to the wrong person. Maybe you are a bot.
>>713598604
HAH! True enough. I mean it wasn't this bad pre 9/11. There was definitely some good thought provoking stuff now it's just
WHOA I HAVE MENTAL ILLNESS AND THAT IS OKAY I WILL BE HAPPY :D
>>713598637
>>713598645
asking this question>>713598517

>>713598591
>Marxism is Great it may sound crazy but it's great
context is my strong suit,stop bullshitting

>>713598476
That would be because immigrants largely work low pay shitty jobs citizens of the country don't usually work. Increasing rent is a result of financialization of housing, if there was a drought would you ask Nestlé to solve it? No because they're invested in maximizing their profit.

>>713598698
>>713598697
reasking this >>713598517

>>713598698
>jobs citizens of the country don't usually work
This is false. The reason they won't work them is because the immigrants lowered the standards not because the work itself is beneath the citizens. If you remove the immigrants the work will get done just fine.

>>713598603
Calling someone a reductionist retard while you cry about made up terms and refuse to engage with the actual definition of those words is rich. This stuff has been well established for hundreds of years but you have terminal confirmation bias so avoid reading and understanding information that goes against your worldview.

>>713598832
>>713598832
>>713598806
still reasking this>>713598517

>>713598517
Capitalism is inherently competitive. The "good guy" capitalist will get muscled out by the meanest bastard who cuts costs, exports jobs, and engages in all sorts of backhanded tactics. That is what the system is built upon.

>>713598637
What is "normal" to you about a tiny minority (who does little to no work) getting the lions share of the surplus value?

>>713598850
kill yourself asap

>>713598603
>no one actually has a problem with private ownership of "means of production"
Yes they do.
>Are you going to have a conniption if I own a tractor and own a farm?
You wouldn't need to own it under communism, you could just use the tractor provided

>>713598806
>Please boss I know you wanted to give me dental but can you actually make me work for less pay and not get any water breaks on this farmhand job in the sun
Please PLEASE think before you type for once. I can hear the blank space between your ears whistling.

>>713596825
Culture is not a civilizational prerogative. The only civilizational prerogative is producing real value that improves people's lives in tangible ways. That means raw resources, manufacturing and agrictulture are primary concerns. Nourishing the soul with culture has always been a tertiary concern.

>>713598870
OH SO YOU ARE A BOT!
>>713598884
man i just want some actual discussion fuck you man it's just bots talking to each other
>>713598889
still asking this >>713598517

>>713598749
Americans are just retards who cannot into critical thinking. Everything in school is taught to them as black and white, right and wrong.
They have no thought process of their own so they just go along with whatever identity ideology fits them best.

>>713598651
But do YOU have to be part of the retarded mob? No? Then it works.

>>713598832
cry more cunt, I can't wait for you to die in a labor camp

>>713598462
It's not 9/11, this shit goes back to the Cold War

>>713598918
still asking this >>713598884

>>713598915
>t.

>>713598927
I have a good paying job under capitalism! I'm doing great man thanks for asking, I just give a shit about other people (except bad faith retards that are allergic to dictionaries)

>>713598697
... for game dev.

Your real problem is that you're obsessed and unable to consider any possibility other than ENEMIES EVERYWHERE RAAAAA

>>713598918
no your question is just poorly formulated like wtf are you even asking

>>713598932
American (world) history is only 30 years old anon.

>>713598978
America does not produce anything of value, just gay culture and high fructose corn syrup.

>>713598517
Simple explanation: Nobody is running away from capitalism countries like China or North Korea. There's your answer.

>>713599041
Also weapons, lots of them.

>>713598915
The US is civilized?

>>713598918
>massreply faggotry begging for an answer
>gets an answer
>UHH THAT... THAT DOESN'T COUNT BECAUSE IT JUST DOESN'T OKAY? BOT BOT BOT
what fuckin answer do you want? so long as a boss steals the surplus value from their workers, he is not a good guy.

>>713596783
>outcompete

>>713599051
add "to" before countries because I'm derp.

>>713594478 (OP)
>person lives under capitalism and gets nothing but the downsides of it
>wtf why are they hating capitalism

>>713598993
>for a game dev
yeah and? My real solution is to see the obvious rather than project schizo delusions unto others

>>713594478 (OP)
Let me guess. You only started noticing this when they changed communism/nazism to capitalism, right?

>>713599068
I guess, it also produces wars, shouldn't forget that.

>>713599073
I'm being VERY generous here.

>>713598870
Two things
1 there's more value than just monetary. Factories leaving the rust belt in america is what made it into a desolate ruin. This is value given back through other means.
2 The owner takes on risks and if the business fell into debt you as a employee would not expect to be liable for it.

Yes there's issues with too much exploitation but again in terms of motivation and productivity, enrichment and progress capitalism is simply too powerful. It's better to cripple capitalism than to bother wit other ideologies that barely make it off the start line.

>>713598910
Yes this is what retarded immigrants do. The pay they get is sent back and is worth far more because of this. They can also get benefits through welfare. India is actually facing a crisis right now because the indians working in america are sending so much money back it's causing house prices to rise beyond the means of regular indians.

>>713595102
Based if true

>>713599096
nobody buys piss lemonade you melodramatic commie retard. people buy the lemonade they like the most.

>>713596572
>meet the minimum expectation on the job market

>hi sir i have a degree in social studies and an MBA in 17th century homoerotic poetry

Yeah...unless your graduating in STEM everything else is useless and a waste of time/money

>>713599118
well, actually yes

>>713598524
I try to look at the world as a grand mechanism of logical systems, so I just think it's fucking annoying how people will just start yelling about shit, and their rational comes from a gut-based vibe check about how they FEEL about things.
Capitalism does have issues. When people can own the means of production to make profit, they can use that profit to buy up more of the means of production, thus it leads to oligarchic power creep. And, it does seem clear to me that, rather than driving innovation, it just consolidates wealth into fewer and fewer hands. if capitalism was perfect, Elon Musk wouldn't have 400 billion dollars, that money would be more evenly distributed between himself and his engineers who actually did the innovation.
But capitalism has advantages too, mostly that it's intuitive and doesn't require outside factors to function. Also, other economic systems have worse problems. Socialism tends to devolve into a bureaucratic nightmare because government oversight is not nimble enough to respond to real world scenarios, and communism just can't really exist outside of a hypothetical vacuum because it's too inherently impossible to make function in a human scenario.
Capitalism can be regulated to prevent its worse excesses, but when people render the concept of regulation to being inherently socialist, #1 they're wrong, definitionally, and #2 they're getting up-in-arms about forcing childish, retarded binaries for kids. The world's complex, these people want to force it to be simple, and then get mad and start bitching when you tell them to educate themselves. It pisses me off.
Because... What are we doing here? Listening to some uppity college student yell about the economy when he doesn't even really grasp the terms he's throwing around. Why the fuck would I listen to that shit? Idiot is making an ass of himself.

>>713599186
yeah i'm sure all the shitty remakes companies have released these last few years didn't sell at all right? autistic mongoloid

>>713599201
The second US president one said "I must study politics and war that my sons may have liberty to study mathematics and philosophy. My sons ought to study mathematics and philosophy, geography, natural history, naval architecture, navigation, commerce and agriculture in order to give their children a right to study painting, poetry, music, architecture, statuary, tapestry, and porcelain."

>>713599108
>person lives under jews and gets nothing but the downsides of it
>trusts jews when they blame capitalism

>>713594478 (OP)
Capitalism isn’t bad because some people get rich and some people don’t. Capitalism is bad because it floods borders with cheap labor that depresses wages and erodes national identity.

>>713599221
>it's ok when devs criticize the former, but no the latter
Times change, and so do trends. You're either underage or retarded to not understand that these things go in cycles.

>>713594478 (OP)
weird how people who work on products that require huge budgets and demand high rates of profit to remain successful are so against literally the one thing that keeps them employed. without capitalism they wouldn't even have the jobs that they do.

>>713596572
That's what happens when you don't give your citizens basic rights and allow corporations to run your republic.

>>713599051
Neither of those is communist.

Also, whenever I say, hey, how about instead of becoming North Korea, we actually improve our society in a number of substantial ways? You say "no that's communism"

>>713599272
The second US president was a fucking idiot.

>>713599257
they sold because the majority of people prefer graphics over gameplay. it's stupid but it's what people want.

Wonder what got the tankies riled up.

>>713599419
>nobody wants piss
>except for the piss fetishists, it's what they want
i'm glad you agree

>>713599351
>that wasn't real communism! *shits diaper*

>>713599257
You're the autistic mongoloid for calling new products shitty because they had the audacity for not being perfect carbon copies of originals.

>>713599186
>nobody buys piss lemonade
You do and you don't even know it. Capitalists determine the supply, idiot.
>I'll just go to the mom and op lemonade stand!
Yeah, all right, except
- they can't meet the demand of everyone who wants it
- their costs are substantially higher, and so they are forced to ask higher prices for a smaller profit margin
- oops, Big Lemonade just bought up all the lemons... and Mom 'n Pops Lemonade Stand (soon to be a Big Lemonade franchise)

Enjoy your Pissonade, Murrifat

>>713599131
>The owner takes on risks and if the business fell into debt you as a employee would not expect to be liable for it.
The capitalist lands with his golden parachute, worker is suddenly a month away from being evicted unless he can find a new job fast.
>other ideologies that barely make it off the start line.
I wonder why so many socialist movements fail. I wonder if being sanctioned, couped, assassinated, and invaded by the bourgeoisie has anything to do with it? Nah, reading all that history is boring.

>>713599110
Incredibly ironic considering I have no idea what you're even on about at this point.
>The communist infiltrators are openly talking about Marxism, I'm not crazy, you are!

>>713599464
>audacity for not being
didn't ask for a jeet's opinion

>>713599481
>Capitalists determine the supply, idiot.
false. demand determines the supply. if people don't want their games the won't buy it. simple as.

>>713599272
The problem is, you were born to a generation that needed to work for your children, but since you're an entitled hedonist you just study ridiculous bullshit that won't make any money and then got mad that your forebears didn't give you enough free shit.
You know what you're like, you're literally like a faggot isekai protagonist! Your whole ethos boils down to being upset that other people haven't given you enough money and power, for free. In other words, you are literally, genuinely, just a fucking lazy narcissist.

>>713598993
Gamedev, like all art, works best with monarchy though

>>713599131
>there's more value than just monetary.
All that value can be expressed monetarily.
>The owner takes on risks
If the company goes under, the workers are the first to lose their income.

>>713599507
>worker is suddenly a month away from being evicted unless he can find a new job fast
Why doesn't the worker just do what the employer did?

>I wonder why so many socialist movements fail
Maybe because they suck? What socialist movement are you even talking about that showed any promise before being shut down?

>>713599351
Ah! The classic. It's not real communism if it failed.

>>713599507
>The capitalist lands with his golden parachute, worker is suddenly
You see, the thing you're too stupid to get is that everyone in that scenario is a capitalist.
And let's be real, you hate the worker because he probably voted for le heckin DRUMPF. He's a bad person because he doesn't want to pay you taxes so you can lecture him about how retarded he is and how he's being exploited. In other words, you're only pissed off that workers are being exploited by other people instead of yourself.

>>713597623
>communism favors humanity.
It tries, yeah, but it falls prey to our worst instincts. At least with capitalism, disgraceful at it is, you have a larger incentive for technology to keep improving people's lives by trickling down due to capital's dynamism. Having said that, the absolute horrid state of capitalism today and our current trajectory is an abomination. It's not even capitalism, you just have the 1% gobbling every productivity gain and barely any scraps for the rest of us. It's feudalism with extra steps.

>>713599236
>Socialism tends to devolve into a bureaucratic nightmare because government oversight is not nimble enough to respond to real world scenarios
Massive corporations are all centrally planned. Algorithms can micro-target advertisements for dragon dildos to your social media because your phone was on when you were talking about your Saturday evening plans. The idea that planned economies are some unsurmountable logistical hurdle is hopelessly 20th century.

>>713599341
Yes, capitalism.

>>713599607
>All that value can be expressed monetarily.
You can't express training and experience nor R&D that can bring new technologies to market. It's more complex than "bossman makes too much" and again this all says that capitalism is simply too powerful and needs to be reined in.

>the workers are the first to lose their income
They don't lose in that something is taken from them they simply stop receiving pay. They can use the experience they gained to join some other business or even start their own and compete.

>>713599760
i don't use social media and I have an adblocker.

>>713599665
Fun fact: none of those people actually would have ever said they were "doing communism" because they were all well-read in Marxist theory, unlike you.

Now address the point: if I say I want anything else, you still call that communism. Why? Why can't things ever be better?

>>713599549
Wiem. Dlatego dostałeś opinię polaka, ty zryty kutafonie.

>>713599558
>false. demand determines the supply.
Yeah m8, sure, that Econ 101 really paid off huh

>>713599901
Poles out
Pajeets in

>>713599558
>demand determines the supply
Yeah, the housing market in the US has been booming for awhile. There's no inflation on GPUs. Everything's lovely.

>>713599573
You weren't following the conversation so I'm not even going to address the inherent stupidity of your shitpost

>>713599558
Ah yes. The invisible hand descends from heavens and corrects the imbalance.
Holy hell econcels are retarded.

>>713599760
Oh, and another thing.
You bitch about capitalism, and then you literally advocate for every flaw it has.
The only difference is that, since you're an entitled piece of shit, you think YOU should be exploiting people instead of others.
>Workers unite! They're being exploited by their capitalist masters!
>The workers should all work, and pay me their taxes to sit in an air-conditioned office to tell them how they're being exploited, and what they should do, etc.
You fuckers only use them as pawns. Your only real motive is to replace the capitalist class with another, gayer capitalist class.
Or you'll refer to a failure of capitalism, like invasive data mining, and rather than propose that as a PROBLEM you imply that the only problem is that you're not the one in charge of it.
Then you wonder why people hate you and wish you would fuck off. You literally wander around describing how you're the human version of a blood-sucking tick, and then wonder why nobody takes your economic ideas seriously. Yes, there are capitalist ticks too. No, you're not different or better somehow.

>>713599837
Yes, because under capitalism they use this technology to intrude on your life with predatory and dishonest ads instead of providing you with what you need

>>713599928
wtf does a commie know about economics? you believe that getting rid of of all management positions will magically turn every pizza delivery driver into a multi-billionaire

>>713600085
>nooo, you can't demad basic neccessities, that would steal from billionaires!
Your shoe, "sir".

>>713600017
but housing in the us is dirt cheap what kind of a retarded argument is that?

>>713599530
What's ironic about it?You seem to have fully understood

>>713599450
Probably that whole desert shindig.

>>713598870
>who does nothing
He provides the building. Are the workers going to put forth the money to buy the property?

>>713600085
>You bitch about capitalism, and then you literally advocate for every flaw it has.
Where did I do that, pray tell?
>The only difference is that, since you're an entitled piece of shit, you think YOU should be exploiting people instead of others.
No, that's you. That is capitalism. The only defence for capitalism you have is that if you're lucky you get to be the exploiter rather than the exploited. I want a world wherein all workers receive the full value of their labour.
>You fuckers only use them as pawns.
I am them. I am a worker. Do not presume to know me or what I want. It's embarrassing, really.

>>713600082
That "invisible hand" is the customer.

>>713599321
the truth is, I'm not from anything you listed
nor do I car about any of this
I made this to farm (You)s

>>713600141
>you believe that getting rid of of all management positions
There would still be managers under socialism, but they would not be separate from the other workers. You are thinking about the owners, which is not the same as managers.

>>713600274
Sure you did, bud. Sure you did.

>>713599876
almost like they were communists huh

>>713600095
>because under capitalism they use this technology to intrude on your life
Ah, yes. Because communism is known for personal privacy and human rights.

>>713599876
Why? I tell you why you entitled prick. Because you don't deserve shit just for existing. What makes you think individuals in a society should be forced to give you same consideration as they do to their closest friends and family? You should expect that from your friends and family instead. You are on good terms with them aren't you? No? Well well well, that probably answers few questions now, doesn't it? I guess you spoke them in same entitled tone as you do to me.

>>713600207
The irony is that you're schizophrenic

>>713599453
literally
>replace piss filter with ue5
>suddenly everyone wants it
>this means people want piss
fuck off

>>713600372
>But hypothetically under communism!
Bitch this is right now under capitalism

>>713599626
>What socialist movement are you even talking about that showed any promise before being shut down?
Where to even begin? You should check out the book "Killing Hope" by William Blum for an introductory rundown, although the book focuses on America whereas every capitalist government suppresses socialist movements.

>>713599695
Both major parties in the US represent capitalists. It is a democracy for the bourgeois, not for workers. The fact you think I would care about [insert democrat here] shows just how within the box the capitalists have provided you your thinking still is.

>>713600419
how?

>>713600463
>hypothetically
Not hypothetically. It's right now under communism you retarded tranny.

>>713594478 (OP)
>What is it with devs and contemporary settings?

>>713600245
He didn't design the floorplan, he didn't mine the raw material, he didn't create the power tools, he didn't ship the materials, he didn't erect the scaffolding, lay the pipes, or pour the concrete. Sounds like workers made the building. The capitalist did nothing.

>>713600412
>Because you don't deserve shit just for existing.
Yes you do. That's what it's for. Capitalists think people exist for the sake of the economy, but the economy exists for the sake of the people.
>What makes you think individuals in a society should be forced to give you same consideration as they do to their closest friends and family?
It's called a "society". By all means, go and pillage your neighbours to enrich your house, laws don't apply to them!
>No? Well well well, that probably answers few questions now, doesn't it?
Can you people go five seconds without claiming victory in imaginary arguments?

>CAPITALISM BAD
>NO, COMMUNISM BAD
Both are bad in their extreme forms you absolute brainlets.

>>713600419
it's his class ideology you fucking bigot it's just as real and true as yours

Reminder that no one has ever proved this image wrong

>>713594478 (OP)
why do chuds hear the word 'capitalism' and go into an autistic fit and start imagining trannies dancing around their head like a concussed cartoon character?

>>713600496
Maybe you should read the book first so you can begin your argument instead of pointing at propaganda

>>713600562

>>713600305
That is the dumbest idea I've ever heard. No wonder cuckmunism never works lol.

>>713596783
>Outcompete
Lol bruh, point of capitalism is to remove any competition. If it's not a monopoly than the system failed.

>>713600587
Video games don't get made under marxism because everybody is busy being employed to starve to death

>>713600554
Workers were paid to make the building, which was purchased by someone else. What use do construction workers have with a pizza place?

>>713594478 (OP)
It’s our current economic system. Of course people will be making art commentating on it.

>>713600538
>It's right now under communism
There are no communist countries

>>713600671
Actually the most timeless and everlasting video game ever made was made under communism so how do you respond to that liberal

>>713600675
They can buy pizza there

>>713600496
>'murrica suppresses communist governments
>when it fails communist governments suppress their own people

I see where you're getting at.

>>713600705
There are no capitalist countries either.

>>713594478 (OP)
>what's with modern devs
Not sure devs have a say in the matter

>>713600615
why do trannies sperg out about capitalism and then cut off their dick?

>>713594478 (OP)
Capitalism as a system is fine. It's just the salaries are too low right now

>>713596395
Hey, cool it with the antisemitism

>>713599186
>people buy the lemonade they like the most
>cuts to Piss Lemonade spending $40mil this quarter alone on marketing convincing the average person they like Piss Lemonade
>another $3mil goes to astroturfing and spreading FUD against Actual Lemonade

>>713600749

>>713594478 (OP)
Capitalism as a pure ideal is great because there's the assumption that no one person could grab too much power in any one market because that would go against the self-interest of others who want the market to remain free. The problem is that in reality, the ability for capitalism to undermine options to keep the market free through regulation to prevent monopolies has proven far too easy because of phenomena like regulatory capture (where former industry types are elected to regulatory boards), and the amount of concentration is such that people who should be fighting back are instead piggybacking on these big winners because even the scraps they get are enough to set them for life, and fuck everyone else.

There's a good book by Thomas Piketty called "Capital in the Twenty-First Century". He describes inequality trending upward when the rate of return on capital exceeds the economic growth rate, and that the declining or stalling population growth of many countries makes the issue worse because the wealth remains undistributed if the rich aren't having that many kids, either.

Also, regardless of the economic system in place, sustainability should remain our primary concern. We seriously need to rethink what we consider to be "progress". We hate on bums for many valid reasons but then praise billionaires for creative value and jobs and so on, which in the short run, sure, that makes sense. But is it really productive if the process to make commodities takes more from our pool of resources than it gives? That's not productive, that's DESTRUCTIVE. And I know people will read this and go "Whatever, gotta break a few eggs to make an omelette", but when you do that with every vital natural resource, where's this gonna end up? I'm not some treehugger, this isn't about saving the Earth. It's about saving our fucking selves. Just try and leave the world as clean a slate as you can when you die so those in the future have as much choice on how to live as you.

>>713594478 (OP)
You know how there were companies in the 80's dumping toxic sludge into rivers while funding tv shows about environmental protectionism?
It's like that.

>>713600719
that it's gone and forgotten

>>713600748
So they should be managers? There's no guarantee they'd know or have the inclination to want to make pizzas for a living.

>>713600808
case in point

>>713600565
I thought post-modernism was supposed to be anti-capitalist?

>>713600719
No russian around today who lived through the soviet era wants it to come back.

>mods delete vidya
>but leave this up

>>713600875
your stench

>>713600562
Capitalism is bad when it's running as intended
Communism is bad when it fails

>>713600558
>Yes you do. That's what it's for. Capitalists think people exist for the sake of the economy, but the economy exists for the sake of the people.
No. Private property exists for whatever purpose the owners deems it. Outside have fuck all when it comes to decision making. Your choice is your level of engagement in private structures that surround you.
>It's called a "society". By all means, go and pillage your neighbours to enrich your house, laws don't apply to them!
Why would I? I live in a proper country where everyone respects boundaries.
>Can you people go five seconds without claiming victory in imaginary arguments?
Nice dodge, but I will keep asking that question until you answer it honestly. What makes you think individuals in a society should be forced to give you same consideration as they do to their closest friends and family? You should expect that from your friends and family instead. You are on good terms with them aren't you? No?

>>713600671
This is what's known as a thought-terminating cliché.

>>713600853
People like accumulating resources, it literally tickles the caveman brain because resources make you a winner, and more resources make you a bigger winner. No matter what system is put in place, it's doomed to fail at some point because of this fundamental fact of life. We're just the unfortunate sods that drew the short straw of having to live after an era of prosperity, but before the board is reset and the game begins again.

>>713600892
Ho boy you are so wrong

>>713594701
"Take the money and run" isn't a capitalist philosophy. The point of owning the means of production is to reinvest in production. Like studios make movies and games so they have money to make more movies and games. If they're throwing their money at something else, such as legal battles over copyright and patients, obstructing the production of movies and games -- it's not really a capitalist system.

Like, yeah, Nintendo can make money by licensing their "patient" on pokeballs or whatever. But it's like buying IPs just to sit on it and do nothing. They're not investing. They're obstructing.
In the end there's not "more"; there's just less.

>>713601127
Capitalism has to build walls to keep people out, Communism has to build walls to keep people in.

>>713600762
Almost every country on Earth is capitalist. Clever reversals work better if they're somewhat grounded in reality.

Bro Socialists tried to LARP a real life Bioshock city and this was the end result.

You can spam in thread all you want to try and force a pandelum swing on 4chans culture but the fact will always remain that socialism is as trash as capitalism.

>>713600562
>>713600939
Capitalism is bad when psychopaths are at the top
Communism is bad when psychopaths are at the top
both work in a vacuum

>>713601237
Then what is not trash?

>>713600562
Except billions of human beings thrive in capitalist systems, even when we're apparently at the end stage of it (kill all communists), and no one ever does in a communist system. Great false equivalency otherwise.

>>713600846
yes, yes everyone who isn't you and your buddies is racist, nazi, evil person, i get that.

>>713600846
wtf i hate communists now

>>713600865
Right, so this does indeed present a problem if these construction workers are the only ones in this society, but they're not. Them building the building contributes to the benefit of all, and they benefit in turn when it is run by others.

That part's not even that different from capitalism, there's just no one skimming the profits off the top.

>>713601269
>I'm not gifted a free house
>it means capitourism is bad
Grow up.

>>713601360
I just want to be able to own my house.

>>713601314
So they should give away the building for free?

>>713600957
>No.
>*Bunch of gobbledigook thast utterly fails to address what was said*
No to you.
>I live in a proper country where everyone respects boundaries.
Oh, so strangers respecting the law is beneficial to you and that's why you do it in turn to them, imagine that
>Nice dodge
No need to dodge a ball you threw in your head.
>What makes you think individuals in a society should be forced to give you same consideration as they do to their closest friends and family?
See your own answer above

>>713601397
You can if you're not a poorfag. As opposed to being poor as a default state of being and also not legally having the right to own a house in a commie system.

>>713601269
Nah communism is bad even with good people

>>713601478
It's a problem when the vast majority of the population are "poorfags"

>>713601269
Capitalism literally incentivises and reards psychopaths lmao

>>713598557
Tsarist Russia wasn't capitalist, it was a feudal command economy.

>>713600853
>Communism as a pure ideal is great
I don't even need to read the rest of your spiel.

>>713601540
That's not true.

>>713601478
you sounds like a filthy j*w,

>>713601409
If they built it for the common good, including their own, using materials that were in turn provided for them, so that they may also thereafter enjoy pizza along with everyone else which is also freely provided to them, how is everyone not enjoying the fruits of their labour?

>>713601360
>ummm actually if you don't think the triangle waist company did nothing wrong you're a pinko commie

>people mistaking the Washington Consensus/ IMF ultraglobalist as what all capitalism ever is

>>713601628
Psychopathic stance.

>>713601638
>using materials that were in turn provided for them
By who?

>>713601605
It was underdeveloped but it was definitely capitalist

>>713601280
Third position

>>713601637
We're going to get a front row seat in seeing a communist mayor destroy NYC and you will still say capitalism is at fault.

>>713601694
Other workers, who in turn... see how this goes?

>>713601478
>everyone gets a house but they don't "own it", so they have an incentive to maintain the state so that they can keep their free house, it cultivates loyalty to the state and cooperation among one another to prosper
>only the select few get a house and "own it", while the rest barely scrape by, hating their government and the people they live beside because they can't have what they do due to being born into a low income family and the chances of "making it" are akin to winning a lottery
I know which one I'd prefer.

>>713600892
Amazing, a completely false statement

>>713601714
Grow up.

>>713601126
I'll buy that. I'm lucky enough to be living comfortably, my folks both make a six-figure salary and I have a bachelor's degree, but even with that I can't for the life of me figure out where the fuck the on-ramp is to get a career going. Job sites are full of bots are ghosts jobs harvesting user data and inputs to sell to third-parties. I alternate between two jobs every day of the week not because I need to, just to have my own money to spend and not feel like a complete loaf. It just makes me feel bad, there's gotta be a better way than whatever the fuck this is.

>>713601610
That says capitalism, retard.

>>713601280
Not being a dogmatic retard and do what Lee Kuan Yew or Deng Xiaoping did. Pragmatism seems to be a lost word these days.

>>713601198
>Capitalism has to build walls to keep people from countries where capitalism failed out

>>713601754
You pretty the one that has no practical examples anywhere in the history of humanity working?

>>713601314
>there's just no one skimming the profits off the top
I know you don't understand this, and that you've only had a hundred years to read Mises, but the only alternative to profit is loss.
The fact that you can or cannot quantify it in money to relate a return value of a venture to its cost doesn't change the necessity of some ventures producing a loss, and some producing a profit.
If you simply cut out profit seeking, just that one incentive, your whole entire civilization will start to produce only loss. you'll regress until you literally can't lose anything more.

>>713601774
>G-Grow up!
Fucking pathetic refutation. Go the fuck back to r.eddit you subversive tourist.

>>713601875
USSR worked just fine until their government believed western lines and shamefully surrendered. Quite a few republics democratically voted to stay in the union, but it was dissolved nonetheless.

>>713601839
Ah yes.

Venezuela
The capitalist country

>>713601915
Anon, two things:
It's not about whether or not "the venture" turns a profit, but rather about whether those profits are appropriated by a single individual rather than everyone who contributed to them.
Secondly, if we look at a societal scale, then something may not be inherently profitable but still contribute to the overall benefit of society. The benefit of everyone is not a loss, even it it is not equivalent to the profit of the few.

V E N E Z U E L A

>>713601839
Capitalism sure has failed in Venezuela and Cuba...

>>713601727
It is.

>>713601929
Also noteworthy that the supposed tyrannical dictatorship handed over the reigns to the people when the jig was up whereas the Free Democratic West has repeatedly murdered democratically elected socialists

>>713601269
The process by which the people at the top are chosen in capitalism selects for psychopathy

>>713602086
Embargo since 1958, that's how scared they are.

>>713602121
Salvador Allende comes to mind, always. He actually began using early analog computer powered neural networking machines to optimize the socialist economy and then a few years later "moderate rebels" sprang up in his country and he died "by suicide".

>>713601929
What worked? The people never thrived. They lived in squalor. The standards commies have for their commie countries and capitalist countries, which is basically almost every damn country on Earth, is truly delusion. You think the capitalist system isn't working because your dumb ass doesn't own a 5-bedroom house at 30, but a commie country works if it just exists and hasn't collapsed even though everyone eats pigshit.

>>713602252
>he died "by suicide".
I mean, he may well have, but there is the context to consider.

>>713594478 (OP)
“Muh Captitalism” and “Muh Christianity” feel like two things from the “I hate daddy malcontent starter pack” as things to rail against if you want to come off as edgy and above it all, but without saying anything that would actually bring any real risk to your person or livelihood.

Perfect example is Jim Sterling. Constantly bitches about Capitalism, while seeing not a hint of irony or self-awareness that he’s attached himself to an industry that is built around selling things and making a profit, and surrounding himself with toys on his set, and encouraging you to donate to his Patreon. It’s comfortable suburbanites LARPing as revolutionaries.

>>713597271
>>713597468
He’s right
unfortunately retards like you wouldn’t know because Marx intentionally muddled the definitions by naming his conception of socialism, ‘Socialism’. The only difference being capitalization.
Lowercase ‘s’ socialism has always simply referred to government intervention and was a tradition long before Marx showed up.

>>713594478 (OP)
They're college-indoctrinated. That's really all there is to it. Because all the social science textbooks written over the past 50 years by raging white savior feminists deconstruct race/gender/politics/economics/religion and propose smashing the partriarchy as the only solution

>>713602372
Are you fine with the status quo?

>>713602326
The living standards in the USSR rose rapidly compared to Tsarist Russia and only stagnated when market forces were reintroduced. The image you have of the USSR is pure propaganda, not borne out by the facts.

>>713594478 (OP)
They resent that they have to be held financially accountable for their failures

>>713602121
Nothing supposed about it it was a tyrannical dictatorship that spied on,jailed and murdered people to stay in power up until the threat of civil war
>democratically elected socialists
ah yeah 99% even voted for them

>>713602379
A capitalist government intervening on behalf of capitalists (e.g. bailouts) is not socialism by any stretch of the word.

>>713599096
>go to the supermarket
>houndreds of different lemonades on offer
>only reason there are not homemade lemonade stands around like in the top pic is because of government issued loicences

The pic only happens in commie's wet dreams
Then he wakes up and capitalism is still the best fucking system ever made

>>713600558
> Capitalists think people exist for the sake of the economy
Capitalists describe "market" as "a system of social cooperation"
People exist for themselves, and when they interact they create the market. The economy indeed exists for the sake of the people... in capitalism. In communism it exists for the sake of the state.
>NOOOO BUT REAL COMMUNISM ACTUALLY IS-
It doesn't exist. There is a reason it has never been achieved. What has been achieved was people dying of hunger and mass murders.

>>713602424
Americans didn't go through widespread famine. That's all I need to know.

>>713599558
>Demand determines supply
Retard take. Supply determines what is advertised and what you can buy.
If all you have is waterade or pissonade you ain't got much choice.
True solution is making your own or going straight to local producers until they go broke or bought up

>>713594478 (OP)
Its the typical bitching by people who has never actually lived anywhere outside of the USA trying to blame their inadequacy on something vague and big to "fight against". All while reaping the benefits of the system of course. Nobody ever talks about how 99% of all worthwhile games came from capatalist nations. It is literally just now starting to change because America devs have been on the koolaid for so long that the competition outside of them and japan are finally producing something to fill the gap

>>713601648
People can't even distinguish between keynesianism and free market capitalism, let alone be able to understend the role the government plays in stuff like healthcare and college prices.

>>713594505
3/10

>>713602493
>In communism it exists for the sake of the state.
In communism the state equals the people.
>What has been achieved was people dying of hunger and mass murders.
But enough about capitalism.

>>713602525
Tell that to the natives.

>>713602716
Not white.

>>713599558
So many angry replies from baboons that have no idea how the supply ends up being invested in
>>713602558
>True solution is making your own or going straight to local producers until they go broke or bought up
That's exactly in line with what he is saying
That's LITERALLY what he is saying
There is a reason you are not forced to drink piss, and it's because demand does indeed determine supply.

>>713596825
Thats a good point, but it's a double edged sword. Only capitalist nations make any media worth consuming, the 0.01% of tarsasky films asside.

Threadly reminder that basic human nature is to be social and help each other out. Civilization itself is predicated on people going beyond that's personally beneficial. There will be people who seek to exploit that, and often try to justify their behavior by calling it innate, but in reality, we call these people "dicks"

>>713602054
The benefit to everyone who contributes to the venture is only quantifiable and calculable through a market economy that can relate the price of any one thing to everything else. If you do not have this market economy with a universal medium of exchange, you do not know what your system is doing to the resources fed into it. Your "build a pizza hut for the community" has zero reason not to have the economy be fully dominated by carpenters providing wooden posts for the brickyard to burn as fuel so that the brickyard people can build more furnaces out of the bricks they make to burn more wood.