Thread 713976112

I forget how incredibly stupid the average gamer is sometimes

I've been saying for ages now that modern FromSoft is just Hard Boss Fight Loud Music: The Company
turns out I was right

people play singleplayer shit for hype moments and aura bro. if they wanted depth they'd be playing a fighting game.

are they wrong

>>713976112 (OP)
How is this wrong?
Nobody cares about Witch of Hemwick, even though she had some of the most unique mechanics in comparison to most other Soulsbornekiroringcore bosses.

difficulty is objectively the correct answer though, memorable doesn't objectively mean good, it just means memorable. I'll never forget some parts of Halo 2 on Legendary, not because they were great moments, but because it was absolute total fucking bullshit

>>713976112 (OP)
>Malenia
>Difficult

Waterfowl's shitty design has done irreparable damage on what people think is a good boss fight.

>>713976496
Malenia is a genuinely high-quality and challenging fight regardless of waterfowl.
>>713976112 (OP)
Using Malenia as the icon for 'Difficulty' has likely resulted in people simply choosing the option with Malenia, as she is one of the most iconic bosses From has ever designed. Alongside Radahn, she is the face of Elden Ring, and Elden Ring is the most popular Souls game.
The Nameless King is renowned as well, so it's not surprising that his choice is in second place.

>>713976496
What makes a good boss fight that's lacking in Malenia?

>>713976760
she's a joke without waterfowl

For me it's setting > mechanics > difficulty > music

>>713976112 (OP)
Music 100%.
That's why I still remember almost all Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance bosses but barely any elden ring bosses except for the last ones.

>>713977974
This and MGRR music arent even that mechanically complex. What makes people remember a boss is the music and how many times you fought them because that gives a lasting impression. Mechanics on the other hand are often treated like gimmicks that can often times result in tedium because you have to fight a boss a certain way, which the average gamer doesnt like.

>>713976112 (OP)
SOULSGODS are smarter than you

>>713976760
Why is she so iconic? Because of difficulty. Why is she difficult? Because of Waterfowl.

>>713976112 (OP)
The people who care about mechanical depth are going to be playing pvp games or niche titles that demand them to fully explore a game's systems just to stand a chance. Souls games aren't that.

>>713977974
STANDING HERE
I REALIZE
YOU ARE JUST LIKE ME
TRYING TO MAKE HISTORY

>>713977974
kinda not 100% and also elden shart has a lot of reused bosses compared to concentrated experience of mgr
also you still gotta acknowledge the mechanics of mgr bosses, for example you probably remember monsoon because you have to spam parries or sundowner with his shields

>>713976112 (OP)
Name 5 memorable bosses based on their mechanics alone. Guarantee the other 3 choices are why they are memorable.

>>713976112 (OP)
What the hell is "mechanics" referring to here and how do you separate it from difficulty? 98% of Fromsoft bosses are just "roll/parry when it attacks and then hit back a couple of times", mechanically they're all practically identical. The rare times they do some kind of gimmick boss it's almost universally hated.

>>713976112 (OP)
Difficulty is right, but I would say it works better specifically when it's a huge spike compared to what came before. All the bosses I remember from various vidya follow this pattern and made an impact specifically because they teach you how to play properly.
Music is also a good answer, but it will feel like a waste if the boss in question goes down too easily. Anons here mention things like MGR, but then the memorable part is the music itself, not the boss fight attached to it.

>>713976112 (OP)
Difficulty is just the sum of mechanics

>>713980509
The final boss of MGR would still be memorable without music. Though that doesn't go for most of them

>>713980709
Only Monsoon and Armstrong imo. The former is also a difficulty spike so there's that, the latter just has a cool intro.

>>713976112 (OP)
Um, yeah?

this board is just stealing tweets word for word now its embarrassing

>>713980547
Not quite.
Shmups for instance are mechanically straightforward but their stages and bosses can be excessively brutal.

>>713981052
I love that sword stance, does it have a name?
It's probably not very useful to point away from the opponent

>>713981383
The "I'm going to kick your fucking ass" stance.

>>713976242
>modern fighting games
>depth

>>713979676
>Why is she difficult?
because she randomly activates hyperarmor frame 1 on certain animations with no rhyme or reason

>>713976112 (OP)
Retard. Mechanics can make for a good boss fight, but it's not what will make you remember them. Music is one of the easiest things to remember, and so having that associated with a boss fight can make it unforgettable. I'm surprised setting was scored that low though.

>>713980547
>boss fight is just a red screen but you have to click the screen when it turns green within 20ms or you die
>clicking when it's red also causes you to die
>this is extremely difficult, despite being so simple

What is boss fights arent memorable because they are hard, but they are hard because they are memorable?
Think about it, if you were the dev, would you not make the boss fights you put more work into harder to make sure the player experiences it for longer?

all the people who voted in this poll would get blown the fuck out by Vergil 3 on DMD mode and wouldn't be able to beat mission 1 on Master Ninja in Nina Gaiden Sigma

>>713976112 (OP)
Right? It's the cutscenes.

Hard bosses are old news, skippable bosses are the new rage.

>>713976112 (OP)
what a dumb poll, its every one of those things combined

>>713979957
A lot of MMO bosses boil down to a mechanic gimmick, I'll always remember stuff like Siegecrafter Blackfuse since I played a hunter and had to do that fucking belt every time.

>>713982012
Thanks to From and their amateur hour boss balancing all you need to do is make something hard and people will defend it to the death. No matter WHAT you do, difficulty is a guaranteed way you shield your design choices from criticism because "skill issue" is always the default response. Design doesn't matter anymore. Just make your boss hard and people will defend it with their lives.

>>713980509
I think music is the biggest factor imo. People remember Jetstream Sam not only because of his cool factor and personality but because the fucking intro of the music immediately blasts you with you
https://youtu.be/FhHeGZoWl0g?si=okjHCLD5fQUlw6ek
The fight itself is nothing special. Both of you just mash attack on each other until the other drops dead.

>>713982012
I would certainly try to make fights with important characters difficult to communicate the message through gameplay.

>>713976112 (OP)
I saw this poll too, bunch of braindead fags

>>713982362
I remember the music sure, but I don't think the boss fight itself is memorable.

>>713976112 (OP)
Good gimmicks.

>>713977342
Her second phase is kind of bad due to her using 2 moves way too often. Given that's half the fight, it's a bit disappointing. 1st phase is quite heavily tarnished by Waterfowl but other than that I think it's pretty good.

>>713976239
Only post-BB.

>>713976112 (OP)
They're absolutely fucking correct.

Look at Metal Gear Rising a minute, most people don't even get to experience all of the mechanics in Sundowner's fight.
Hell, most people don't engage with any of the bosses mechanics for that matter. I don't know how many playthroughs into that game it took me to find out Monsoon was weak to EMP effects.
Now look at stuff like Deltarune. People are blowing their nuts over the knight because of how hard it is even if it doesn't differ mechanically from anything seen in Undertale over a decade ago. It's only been like a month and Jackenstein only lives on in meme magic.

>>713976112 (OP)
lmao
Also design isn't even an option. Double lmao.