Thread 714170954

Who is the best final fantasy protagonist?
>In before Jack
Ok the second then

Butz

>>714170954 (OP)
Cecil is legit the most heroic of them all, and immediatly sees his own faults and seeks improvement. Ignore the little genocide at the start.

>>714170954 (OP)
I liked Tidus's story of realizing his misplaced anger towards his father and understanding the value of sacrifice. Also interesting how Tidus is an argument in favor of selfishness because that selfishness allows him (and Yuna) to stand up for themselves and not accept mistreatment.

I still resonate with Cloud far more

Bartz "Butz" Klauser.

>>714170954 (OP)
Zidane > Bartz > Cloud > the rest

>>714171481
I like that tidus went through the same journey as his father and maturing like jecht did.

>>714170954 (OP)
It's between Tidus and Terra, but I think I'm leaning slightly toward Tidus.

How is this a fucking question?
It's Warrior of Light

>>714171481
>>714171887

I think Tidus edges out Cloud for me.

Buttz

>>714171887
He did and he didn't. Jecht might have terrible parenting skills but he has a genuinely good heart. It was just buried under a lot of pride. As his Pilgrimage stripped away that pride, his good heart was able to shine. So much that Auron went from hating him to trusting him above everyone and even willing to die out of anger for him.

With Tidus it's slightly different because he's not as prideful as his father but he is more immature. And a lot of that has to do with him trying to prove his father's memory wrong. Every time Tidus does anything, he's competing with Jecht in his brain thing him he can't do something. Tidus can't even have a wet dream without his father's memory fucking with him. But as he comes to accept that Jecht did love him, it becomes easier for him to make hard decisions and push forward. If only he could celebrate his progress under better circumstances.

>>714171110
He also got married and had a child so that puts him above most of the other protagonist already

you posted it, tidus is the best, most realized protagonist in final fantasy, bar none

>>714172191
This.

Zack (psp version due to insanely better voice acting compared to the remake)

>>714173847
escapism is not healthy, Marche was right

>>714171481
Tidus is the GOAT chad

>Top Tier
Warrior of Light (Dissidia)
Warrior of Light (XI)
Cecil
>Good
Tidus
Clive
Ramza
Warrior of Light (XIV)
Celes
Zidane
Balthier
Zack
Bartz
Noctis
>Meh
Cloud
Squall
Firion
Class Zero
Onion Kid
>Bad
Lightning

>>714170954 (OP)
I understand why people love Tidus. But everything in FFX is undercooked and done better in KH. So there's no such thing as “best FF protagonist”, they suck equally.

>Yuna: If the choice is between my life and the lives of thousands of others then there is no choice at all, I will sacrifice myself to Sin
>Tidus: No, that's bullshit. Fuck that. Fuck the system that made you think that's okay. We'll find another way to do it.

>Tidus: If the choice is between my life (and the Fayth's) and thousands of others then there is no choice at all, I will die alongside Sin to stop it all
>Yuna: Yeah, thanks

>>714174689
People that rank Squall low are saying it because of their hate for FFVIII rather that because of Squall as a character. He is the Ryan Gosling of videogames and quite literally me

>>714175106
>Yuna: Yeah, thanks
This isn't even close to what happens. Tidus didn't give Yuna a choice. She didn't even know what was going to happen until minutes before it did. Probably because Tidus knew Yuna would react the same way he did.

>>714175183
8 is actually one of my favorites, Squall is just a stick in the mud that mainly gets carried by a moderately more interesting cast.
If he didn't have a Gunblade then honestly Zell would be cooler than him.

>>714173617
So I've recently played Crisis Core. An while my overall opinion has soured on it, I kind of feel bad for Zack. Because he genuinely wanted to do well and be a hero but the rug was pulled from beneath him every time. He thought he was doing good work at Wutai because he was tricked by Shinra and he didn't realize he was their sword used to expand their empire and hide their mistakes.

>>714176032
But enough about Sephiroth

>>714170954 (OP)
It's Cloud. He has agency and stakes in the plot. His character arc has humanizing nuance and twists and it brought him full circle. He's also in harmony with his setting and story, never indulging too far into the wells joy or sorrow, but being humorous and serious fittingly. He has mystery/intrigue to solve and is competent to inspire the player to continue playing the game.

>God Tier (Have nuanced arcs with a twist in them.)
Cloud (VII), Terra

>Great Tier (Have arcs and/or their prominent personality is that great.)
Shotgun, Serah, Butz

>Good Tier (Likable, have quirks and/or let their actions speak for themselves. Zack in particular is a terrible character, but being so ridiculously likable gets him this high.)
Onion Kid, Warrior of Light (DDFF), Fighter (I), Zack, Lightning (LR)

>Average Tier (Aren't annoying and exist, can be cheered for.)
Yuna (X-2), Firion

>Bad Tier (Annoying and/or unpleasant.)
Ceodore, Squall, Lann, Clive, Vincent

>Terrible Tier (Obnoxiously annoying, a detriment to their party, one note personality or failed to establish a personality even though they tried.)
Ace, Lightning (XIII), Zidane, Noctis

>Atrocity Tier (Attempted to ruin their games, committed atrocities or have no reason to be there.)
Cecil, Tidus, Cloud (VIIR), Vaan

That's being evaluated as a protagonist specifically though, which has its own requirements, that is. However while being human is one of those aspects and it's important to me, Cloud isn't the most human character, who also happens to be a protagonist. That's Serah. My favorite.

>>714176121
Sephiroth's fall from grace is finding out his "mother" was special and instantly becoming an anti-human Ancient Supremacist

>>714176121
Damn. That applies to Sephiroth too. Sephiroth knew Shinra was producing monsters and had a lot of fucked up shit within it. He just never thought he was one of them

I think I like "good" Sephiroth more than evil Sephiroth

Is Jack's game really that good? It's on sale now. Is it worth skipping some meals to get?

>>714176745
If you like Soulslikes, go for it

Tell me about Bartz. Why does he wear the mask and why is he based?

Cloud, Lightning, Noctis, and Vaan are the hottest protagonists so them

>>714176745
I'd say it's only worth if you also get the DLCs


the base game is like... just the first half of the story but the whole package might easily be one of the best FF spin-offs ever (up there with fucking Tactics)


Shitton of jobs, weapons to dick around with and different playstyles (you can play fast, do juggles, combos n shit like Ninja Gaiden, or you can take it slower and poise through all sorts of shit like Souls, or just sit back and shoot guns, spells, command summons or become a fucking dragon that floats around shooting lasers, pretty much anything you've seen in any other FF gameplay or cutscene you can play it in SoP)

>>714177245
NTA but

>the whole package might easily be one of the best FF spin-offs ever (up there with fucking Tactics)

That is a hell of a statement. I'll admit i haven't looked at SoP since the meme trailer with the headphones. Is this hyperbole?

>>714176396
>Cloud

>agency

You give more thought to the character than the writers themselves.

>>714172034
>Fujos be like

>>714172034
>>714177542
Personally I think Noctis blows Vaan's back out

>>714170954 (OP)
I think its Cloud. Cloud has that whole relatable angle. He saved the world and became.....a nobody. No one even knows he's the hero who killed Sephiroth along with his friends. Cloud and his friends became poor working class losers. And given how in real life many men are incapable of impregnating women due to micro plastics and such Cloud being infertile due to Jenova Cells makes him even more relatable. It explains why he has sex with Tifa and despite being young he can't get her pregnant which left him worse in life.

Even if people don't want to admit it Cloud is the fan favorite because he truly is relatable.

>>714178353
He's relatable because he started out as a loser nobody liked, said he was going to make something of himself and then failed to do it.

>>714171772
just wish zidane didnt have his gay breakdown near the end. he's easily tops until that point. cloud also has something like that but he was also poisoned twice so its forgivable. tidus has way bigger mental bombs dropped on him than anyone and he some how takes it the best. So Tidus is basically better zidane. for ff5 I like Galuf more than bartz

>>714178353
Anon most FF protags don't get tons of recognition and reward after their games.
>WoL ceases to exist.
>Firion goes tocrebuild his home with his siblings, who are now all orphans
>OK is OK
>Cecil actually DOES get some recognition
>Bartz goes back to wandering the world
>Terra runs an orphanage
>Squall is a child soldier who MAYBE gets to live in Ishtar with Laguna
>Zidane kinda just geys with Garnet
>Tidus lmao
>Vaan turns into a really shitty pirate
>Lightning becomes French
>Noctis lmao
>Clive lmao

>>714178839
>he started out as a loser nobody liked
I think what makes this part special is how Cloud tried to rationalize it at the time

>Young Cloud
>Tifa always used to be with this three-some.

>Tifa
>...That's right.

>Young Cloud
>I used to think... they were all stupid.

>Tifa
>What!?

>Young Cloud
>You were all childish, laughing at every little stupid thing.

>Tifa
>But we were children, back then.

>Young Cloud
>...I know. I'm the one that was stupid.
>I really wanted to play with everyone, but I was never allowed into the group.
>Then later... I began to think I was different...
>That I was different from those immature kids.
>That then... maybe...
>Just maybe, they would invite me in.
>I thought that might happen, so I hung around...

>Young Cloud
>I was so prejudiced. And... weak.

N-NO I'M NOT A LOSER! I'M JUST TOO MATURE FOR THOSE DUMB KIDS! I DON'T NEED THEM! please let me play with you

>>714177245
Speaking of FF spinoffs, what the hell is this?

>>714170954 (OP)
Squall

>>714178986
>just wish zidane didnt have his gay breakdown near the end.
Garland attempts to rip his soul out of him so it's not like it's entirely his own doing either

>>714175183
My complaint with Squall is that he's supposed to be a logical young man who understands that he needs to be careful with how he lives so learn the correct skills to earn money to survive. He's orderly. So why would the love of his life be an immature chaotic idiot spoiled brat damsel who gets herself into trouble more than Princess Peach? Rinoa brings Squall down.

Don't give me opposites attract nonsense realistically speaking Squall would have said "This is the third time I've had to go out of my way to save you, this is the LAST TIME! You pull this shit again and I'm leaving you to rot." Rinoa is trash. And no, Quistis is also boring trash.

There are no girls who fit Squall's orderly tastes for how he behaves himself. And while Rinoa may seem spirited and fresh, there come a point where the immaturity stops being a novelty and it simply becomes annoying. Doesn't help Rinoa that she's got nothing to offer she's a disowned hippie activist who hates her father and she shows nothing good. And don't say she has magical sorceress powers, that only means she's eternally going to have critics who see her as dangerous. Given how immature Rinoa is she runs the risk of doing something real stupid with her super powers. Squall deserved better.

>>714179624
She's hot and Squall is drowning in hormones.

>>714170954 (OP)
>has a terrible mother
>can't even remember her name
>hates his father instead
He might be the worst protagonist in the JRPG genre, even worse than Edge from SO4 and Yuri from Vesperia.

isnt vivi the actual main character of 9?
>first character you play as
>games biggest theme is his main conflict
>surprise final boss is the embodiment of the theme of the game
>his story is the only one with a conclusion

>>714179901
Can't remember her name? What are you talking about, he just never says it. Do you want to argue that Claudia didn't have a name because she was called "Cloud's Mom" in the OG?

>>714179901
Also Tidus hating his father over his mother makes sense in context. Because Jecht was fucking with his son as a 9 year old just because he wanted attention. Because he's fucking 9. He doesn't understand that Jecht is trying to challenge him, he just thinks his dad is an asshole. Of course a 9 year old is going to think a drunken dick is worse than a neglectful ghost of a mom who'd rather be dead than take care of her son without Jecht.

>>714180334
I'm still convinced that most of his memories are made up, just that he could have a reason to hate his father.

Am I supposed to believe that his father was a top athlete, always in shape, but also always drunk?

>>714177454
Wait, are you actually disagreeing with Cloud having agency in how VII's story unfolds? He often takes command, asks questions, confronts people, has ideas of his own, makes pivotal choices with large consequences, sometimes at key plot junctions, and the main plot throughout is about him constantly fighting off and breaking free of external influence and internal delusion to attain full control.

Also if it counts (it doesn't), you could make the argument, that you can roleplay him with dialogue choices for the first 60% of the game, when he's still unaware of his past, meaning in-universe he's choosing how to act.

>>714176396
>separates viir cloud to og as if remake wasnt just the og but better
Lol
Lmao

>>714170954 (OP)
Why does he even have a fucking gun if he doesn't even use it?

>>714180739
Huh?

>Tidus: They say you don’t practice anymore, that you’re gonna retire.
>Jecht: Let them talk. I’m still the best.
>Tidus: They say you’re no good ’cause you drink all the time.
>Jecht: I can quit drinkin’ whenever I want!
>Tidus: Then do it now.
>Jecht: What did you say?
>Tidus: You just said you can!
>Jecht: Heh. Tomorrow, maybe.
>Tidus: Why not today?
>Jecht: Why do today what you can leave for tomorrow?
>Jecht: There he goes again…crying!

The obviously implication here is that Jecht used to be in prime condition, got lazy over time, and even though he gave Tidus shit for calling out his drinking he still went out to sea to practice and sharpen up his skills before vanishing into thin air.

>>714180980
thats a dagger

>>714179901
>>714180334
>>714180739
the thing with Tidus is that it's likely that some of his memories about Jecht are made up, making Jecht seems much worse that he actually was, why? because Tidus was a child and as children we tend to do that, we make bad things much worse than they really were and good things much better than what they really were. It's a self protection mechanism of sorts for the human mind, to have your convictions and beliefs validated.

On top of all that, Jecht leaving without saying a word (wan't his fault at all) made the situatión worse for Tidus because his problems with his dad got unresolved and futhermore, it heavily affected his mom, the only person Tidus had (even if she was a bad mom), which made him hate Jecht even more for hurting that protective figure (his mom, even if she was bad).

At the end when Jecht dies and Tidus says with tears in his eyes "i hate you dad", he wanted to say "i love you dad" because he finally got to know more about how Jecht really was and what actually happened

>>714177440
NTA you're replying either but like he said the base game is actually kinda shitty:

The story barely goes past the CHAOS memes and the trailer you mentioned, they do play that shit straight and it might even be enjoyable if you're into that kind of mood, nothing to be taken seriously. I'd even say it's nice but it just ends on such a big cliffhanger like "fuck you buy DLC to progress the story"

DLC story is where everything makes a lot more sense, a lot more characters from the FF verse are introduced and Jack actually gets a true goal to work towards while the whole story ties back to Dissidia. The way they play out the final moments and the final bosses of the 3rd DLC is also incredibly cool and well worth seeing through

That said: the gameplay is where the game truly shines, it is *not* a Soulslike at all: combat is a lot faster, progress is mission-based rather than open world (think something like Nioh or DMC) and your movement/offense is not tied to any stamina whatsoever (however, your defenses are tied to two different meters for blocking/perfect guarding/evading, each yielding different rewards adapting to how you want to play)

The one thing players might dislike is the Diablo-style RNG loot but for the first playthrough you don't really need to pay any attention to it

>>714180804
I do, and I will admit, I'm fundamentally incapable of giving NuCloud a truly fair chance. However I also know I already hated him two hours and three minutes into the game at the start of the water filter quest, when he was getting in NPC's face over his jealousy over NuTifa, even though he used to only be prone to fighting as a kid. Something he should've grown out of by now, as shown by him offering rationalizations to Barret before getting feisty. Also he is way too much of an autist for me to suspend my disbelief at things going his way like they do. Most importantly, in the most general sense he's in a meta story, but doesn't engage with it directly, so he's a bad protagonist for the story it actually is.

>>714181969
Well Tidus does realize this in Guadosalam

>Jecht: See? So I told him what I thought of him, right there!
>Tidus’ Mom: What? Really?
>Jecht: ‘Course!
>Tidus’ Mom: I suppose, but… (smooch)
>Tidus: Mommy…
>Tidus’ Mom: Just a sec, dear.

>Tidus Narration: Whenever my old man was around, my mother wouldn’t even look at me. Maybe that’s when I started to resent him, even hate him. When he left us…Mom just lost her energy
...
>Tidus Narration: The old lady next door told me…when a lovebird dies, the one left behind…It just gives up living so it can join its mate. It was just like that. I hated my old man even more. But really, my old man…

>[Flashback to end of first scene…]
>Tidus: Mommy…
>Tidus’ Mom: Just a sec, dear.
>Jecht: Ah, go to him. He’ll cry if you don’t.

When Tidus initially revisits that memory, he cut that last part out. Because it conflicts with his preconception that Jecht was an asshole that didn't care about him. If Tidus's Mom would've had her way, she would've been bouncing on Jecht's dick in beat to b Tidus's crying. But Jecht prioritized giving Tidus what he wants.

>>714182059
Did the game ever get patches? I remember that when it came out a lot of people were complaining about the performance and the 300.000 polygons bat

>>714182562
Oh yea it did get a ton of content/balance/QoL patches but none of them ever really improved performance much (Except for when it released on Steam where it allegedly runs much better than EGS but I haven't felt that myself)

the bullshit 1trillion polygons models for everything are still there, but nowadays a 3070 can easily run the game at 1080p locked 60FPS with high settings, other than that the smoothest version to play, ironically, remains the PS4 version (even if you own a PS5, because the PS5 version will chug in post-game content where you're fighting 20+ mobs at once)
Yes I did buy the whole game 3 times

>>714180739
>but also always drunk
He only stopped drinking when he attacked the Shoopuff in a drunken bout of 'heroism'. That's how bad he was. But it also means that he was good enough for Braska and Auron to have taken him that far in the first place.

It's not like he'd be the first professional, big name athlete with a substance abuse problem.

Zack sucks and always has
He's more interesting dead

>Jecht was the biggest celebrity in the city (world) and knew only adoration from the fawning masses and the attention of vapid whores who want to live a fantasy life with him
>knocks one up, probably by accident, stuck with a kid he has no idea how to raise properly with a woman who still only cares about her fantasy life with the celebrity
>Tidus grows up to replace Jecht as the biggest celebrity in the world, knows the adoration of the fawning masses and is starting to attract attention from vapid whores with fantasies of living a life with him
Tidus was a year or two from accidentally knocking some dumb slut groupie up and becoming his own father

>>714183803
GONGAGA

>>714184334
What's doubly funny is that he was already having wet dreams about Rikku and Yuna after only meeting them once. Also this blink and you'll miss it moment

In the intro in Zanarkand
>Woman in pink top: Can I have your autograph?
>Tidus: Of course!
>Redhead: Good luck tonight!
>Tidus: Nothing to worry about! Oh, if I score a goal… I’ll do this! (raises arms) That will mean it was for you, okay?
>Both: (Titter)
>Tidus: What seat?
>Woman in pink: East block in the front row!
>Redheaded woman: Fifth from the right!
>Tidus: Got it!

And then on the Mii'hen Highroad
>Tidus: You know… During a game, you have to think of blitz and nothing else, you know?
>Yuna: Okay.
>Tidus: You can’t think, “That’s a cute girl in the fifth seat from the right.”* And you can’t be thinking about where you’re going to go on that date, because the minute you do, that’s when you lose!

>>714185151
>Tidus was thinking about the 2 sluts from the intro while talking to Yuna

>>714185459
>important discussion about Yuna
>"I want to fuck you Lulu/Rikku"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3AmcTQ1bkE

>>714185773
nice redrawing of that classic KH artwork, also Rikku is so sweet in these

>>714170954 (OP)
Cecil.

>>714176562
>>714176032
modern hair rendering is so bad

Unironically Lightning, and Squall as number 2. Then Tidus/Yuna.

I apologize for nothing.

>>714188526
I haven't played XIII but i'm really curious about it

>>714189025
NTA but Lightning is a character that is good in theory but the game she exists in failed her

>>714189382
>but the game she exists in failed her
all 3 of them?

>>714189382
This. 13 was a mess they heroically tried to fix to ship but wound up making two more games out of the scraps left on the cutting room floor.

>>714189025
It's very very different from prior games, and very story heavy, and they made the horrible decision to tell the story through flashbacks rather than in chronological order so they could have cheap, unearned twists and an in medias res start.

The exploration is non-existent.
The combat is actually amazing with a really high skill ceiling.
The graphics still hold up today, even on release consoles.
The story is extreme melodrama fantasy. Not to everyone's taste.

Overall definitely worth playing once.

>>714189674
Who's the other child besides Hope?

>>714190073
Vanille, the pink haired lesbian

>>714170954 (OP)
Zidane, because he acts like a chad and not a whiny emo faggot

>>714189674
Snow dresses like a hobo

>>714190073
the actual mc of XIII

>>714190841
Actually true. I wish the story had started from her POV on Pulse, from becoming a l'cie to getting crystaled, and then picked up again after a timeskip when she unfreezes. It would have made way more sense.

>>714191468
I know Sazh doesn't have the material to a main character. But I wish his character progression didn't just stop after Nautilus. Because as far as pathos goes, I think Sazh can compete with Vanille. Sazh didn't ask for any of this shit. His only crime was going on an entirely innocent field trip with his son to see a Fal'Cie that he'd been raised to believe was his protector. Sazh was dragged into this conflict through circumstances entirely outside of his control. And even though he has a right to hate Vanille, he's a good enough man to understand that Vanille is just as much a victim as himself and Dahj. He's a good character that gets no attention because, for reasons I can only describe as a psychotic break, SE decided to put his Eidolon scene where he's hollering and jiving smack in the middle of his darkest moment. They did that shit with Barret in Rebirth too where Palmer's goofy antics was put right in the middle of Barret's most critical moment. Why does SE keep doing that shit?

>>714183803
He was better being sniped

>>714190841
the wiki says she's 19

>>714180739
MJ was a gambling drunk that god his dad killed

Mommy

>>714187084
the ds remake is my favorite version of FFIV desu

Other Mommy

>>714195335
>>714197971
She was Robin Williams' wife, right?

>>714171110
/thread

>>714198404
Edea was processed by Ultimecia but that happened years after she got married.

She also keep her outfit when they fucked off to their abandoned orphanage.

Crossover Mommies

>>714200367
Stop liking evil women

>>714200971
Better?

>>714192061
I mean, why do Japs do weird things with black characters? Gee I wonder.
But yeah, everyone loves Sazh. Then they relegate him to DLC in 13-2, and his little questline in LR is tiny and depressing as fuck. He just can't catch a break.

>>714177086
Shut the fuck up Eli.

>>714170954 (OP)
The hume male player character in XI

>>714202031
Guys... I'm starting to think The Reunion isn't the worst idea in the world

>>714202031
Sephiroth is not a protagonist, he is antagonist

>>714170954 (OP)
Tidus is the most human one

>>714203873
he's also not a woman (probably)

>>714196359
>Hardest version of FF4 but is not as complete as the psp version
Fuck

Turns Van is improved by a shirt

>>714170954 (OP)
Objectively:
Cloud
Squall
Terra
Cecil

One of my personal favorites:
Noctis

Objectively+my personal favorite:
Tidus

>>714175106
the difference, Yuna rejected the sacrifice because Sin always returns as a direct result of it
Tidus embraced the sacrifice because it sealed the deal

>>714172191
>name: Jitan
>name in english: Zidane
Fucking how?

>>714171065
fpbp, the ffv gang is a fun group.

>>714205650
Yuna, Wakka and Lulu reject it only after Yunalesca basically laughs in their faces and tells them Sin is eternal, nothing the Church of Yevon said about humanity atoning is possible so Sin will never go away. They were totally on board with sacrificing themselves on the 0.1% chance that Sin just wouldn't come back this time until that moment.