>the real villain who pulled the strings behind it all was your mentor and supposed friend.

>>714533107 (OP)
He was the one that set the fire in the Park, right? Nobody else makes sense as a culprit. And why is he there just in time for you to flee in the cable car? Why is he gone from the Last Round before the Park mission?

>>714533107 (OP)
nah he was your homie and knew how to help you fuck over the corrupt camarilla even better if you go independent so you can tell nines and his goons to fuck off

>>714533323
I blame Ming, because it sounds like something she'd do.

>>714533493
>Fuck over the corrupt Camarilla so the corrupt Anarchs can move in

>>714533493
>>714533794
He fucks them both over. The power vacuum in California will be a bloodbath.

>>714533323
He's absent because of a bug. He's meant to disappear around the time of the Giovanni mission in reality. We can be sure of this because the disappearance flag is the only entity out of like eighteen that isn't flipped back correctly. This is a rare instance where Wesp was right.

>>714534031
Good to know but i dont think it changes anything. Hes still there waiting to pick you up at the park

>>714533323
It's LA
just was just bad timing hobos lighting fires on the hills happens a lot there

>>714533590
How would Ming know about the meeting? LaCroix knows and the anarchs in the bar know. Sure, it's possible to say
>Oh, she had a spy
But then any character is a culprit. The evidence that we have points at either LaCroix or Jack, and LaCroix's motive is nonexistent.

>>714534330
Nines says that the fires have been set from multiple directions.

>>714533323
>>714534031
>>714534293
It's pretty interesting how everyone says VTMB is one of the vidya storytelling greats when many of the narrative complexities don't actually stem from the text, but rather from quirky behaviours and design inconsistencies that are impossible to discern from bugs. Trying to figure out what Troika even intended adds an additional unintended layer of depth to the game.

>>714533323
Doesn't LaCroix admit it was him if you see through his bluff and Domination attempts?

>>714533107 (OP)
>the fact is we all started out as someone's little angel

>>714534659
I don't think so. LaCroix never admits to it, and rants about how (You) were the one that betrayed him. That's what he sticks to. Why lie to an audience of one person, who knows that it's bullshit? LaCroix is power-hungry, reckless and stupid, but he's not delusional. I think the only way his behavior makes sense is that if he actually believes you betrayed him.
I think it makes the story better. Half of the main quest is LaCroix trying to kill you by sending you to one meatgrinder after another, but what triggers his downfall is the one time he's not actually guilty.

>>714534659

no he doesnt but i know what youve gotten this confused for because i just replayed recently
at one point, if you see through his bluff, he does admit to working with ming openly

who caused the fire at the park is still up for debate, my money is on lacroix still as a way to tie up all loose ends for the bloodhunt

>>714533323
You make a good point, the entire point is Lacroix didn't know where Nines was hiding or he'd have smoking him where no one was looking and blame it on the werewolves, only Damsel and Jack definitely knew where Nines was so it defaults to him given how disbelieving Damsel and Skelter are about the werewolf story while Jack seemed almost nonchalant about that and the fire.

The question is why? On the one hand it would lean you to his side for showing up in time to get you to safety and inform you on things if you survived, but if the werewolf tore you and Nines to shreds what benefit would there be? I guess the script doesn't need to account for that since the game doesn't progress if you're dead but it seems odd given two assets for the Anarchs against Lacroix would go up in smoke.

>>714535917
You two surviving the werewolf ambush is pure bullshit and they wanted at least one of you dead

>>714535917
>The question is why?
To make the city implode. Whether Nines lives or dies, Camarilla-Anarch alliance can never happen after this shocking "betrayal". Whether you live or die, LaCroix loses his strongest soldier and the only reason he got anywhere with the sarcophagus.
Jack benefits from deaths of any one of you, or both of you, or the survival of both of you. The only scenario where he doesn't benefit is the alliance happening - which, judging from Nines' tone, he was at least heavily considering.

>>714534954
>Why lie to an audience of one person, who knows that it's bullshit?
Not saying LaCroix did it, but you lie to an audience of one person as a taunt and a powerplay. There'd probably have been an indicative facial expression of duper's delight if this were the case.

Here's another question - was the LaCroix-Kuei Jin alliance real? The only evidence for it existing comes from the kuei-jin themselves telling you about it, and they are the least trustworthy people in the game.

>>714534659
I don't think so. He calls you a retard for believing Ming and say something like why the fuck would he work with them when they're disgusting foreign monsters who want to take over his city.

>>714536829
The Kuei-Jin were at war with the Anarchs, but there were other ways for Ming Zhao to have attacked or sabotaged them, like fueling the Sabbat feud after he saved you from them, but Ming Zhao framing Nines for killing a recluse like Grout because Lacroix suspected he knew about their alliance seems too damning to have been made up and what else would Grout have been ranting about from paranoia if not said deceptions from Lacroix?

>>714537663
Malkavian things.

>>714533107 (OP)
He said he was a friend, not "your" friend.

>>714533959
>fucks everyone over and moves out of LA
Gangrel Gang

>>714538867
That's a fair point actually, back to square one I guess.

reminder grout is still "alive"

>>714540552
Shit, I forgot about that theory too. The fucking layers to this plot.

>>714539329
he was pretty friendly, figure he was slipping the player some antidiluvian blood or something to beef him up

You guys probably get this question a lot, but I just got this game and was wondering which version of the unofficial patch I should use? Apparently the latest versions has become more of a mod than a patch, and I would like to avoid that. Thanks in advance.

>>714544232
the unnoficial patch comes with an installer that lets you choose what to download, I'd advice you to play it first with just the fixes and without the new/restored content that it adds

>>714536829
>The only evidence for it existing comes from the kuei-jin themselves telling you about it, and they are the least trustworthy people in the game.

True but it would be quite difficult, not impossible, to pull the Nines frame without LaCroix participation. Ming can kill Grout and disguise as Nines but it wouldn’t know when LaCroix would send somebody to investigate, for all she knows LaCroix could have say
>Fucking Malkavians, lets give it a month and check on him
But even if she has spies or premonition powers or some other shit, the frame doesn’t work if they don’t send you and Nines is whit out and alibi.
The person that points true Nines, you, needs to be more or les independent and Nines not be around.
Maybe Ming can distract Nines from the public “somehow” but if LaCroix sends Cami Henchman number 14 his word wouldn’t be trusted and there wouldn’t be much conflict.
LaCroix been into the plot is the easer explanation.

>>714542646
it's a classic

>>714545151
it should be pointed out that one of the dementation powers is the ability to hide messages inside other texts and stuff. the gramophones could literally be speaking directly to the player's brain without playing any sound or something. outside of game logic finding the weird messages in order is less likely than being injected with some crazy juice.

>>714545151
>>714546035
oh and i guess that goes for the emails too, grout's more likely to just send some more crazy than know how to use email

>>714533323
It was probably Jack, Jack being at the bottom at just the right time and hitting you with a "no time to talk, the sun will be up kid!" is highly suspicious. How did the arsonist get past him?

Keep in mind Jack already massacred an entire boat for his scheme, he would absolutely sacrifice Nines just to spite the Camarilla.

Could Lacroix have survived had he just jumped out of the window and fallen down onto a sidewalk?

>>714546485
LaCroix was a fortitudelet. He gets fucked up by the PC with a letter opener. Even still he could probably have survived (but not very well) a jump out of the window if he were at full health, but he could only crawl by the time he opens it.

.t tabletop fag who actually used the "I have fortitude I can eat a fall from terminal velocity" trick once.

>>714533107 (OP)
Kino trope

>>714533107 (OP)
Just like Jade Empire

>>714546664
I gotta try the TTRPG at some point, one would think a little over couple hundred year old vamp like him would have more tricks up his sleeve.

>>714547235
If you do, go for V20 rather than V5. It's old and janky as shit with questionable mechanics, but it's closer to the stuff bloodlines was based on and has soul. V5's a skinsuit reboot that really isn't the same thing as Vampire: the Masquerade. There's also Vampire: the Requiem which isn't even the same setting but also has the best mechanics. Some people run Masquerade lore in Requiem as a result. Hell, back in the day some people even ran VtM in GURPS, a completely unrelated RPG system.

>one would think a little over couple hundred year old vamp like him would have more tricks up his sleeve.

Well it's theoretically possible someone who has only ever known courtly Camarilla politics would be way too specialized in politics and mind-diddling, to the point he doesn't have an answer for being punched in the mouth. Plus some vampires are chronic underachievers in unlife, though LaCroix's backstory would imply the opposite.

Honestly I think LaCroix's weak last moments are a consequence of Bloodlines' rushed development. It's obvious they were rushing things at the end, I wouldn't be surprised if a bunch of options and potentially bossfights were cut to meet the deadline.

>>714533107 (OP)
His offcial 3 humabity score basically spells out thats hes truely a piece of shit dispite how personalble he is.

>>714546485
No, he dies by a letter opener, but a fledgeling with Celeity could have saved him in the LaCroix ending.

>>714547757
This. V20 is the best system. My group has had fun with it for nearly a decade now. It's versatile enough to cover any type of campaign, but high level combat is extremely lethal.
It boils down to 'have fortitude/celerity or die'. Talky characters should rightfully avoid it as strongly as possible.

>>714533107 (OP)
DUDE you spoiled me
Fuck you

>>714547757
>If you do, go for V20 rather than V5.
This is what I concluded myself, I am not touchving v5
>Well it's theoretically possible someone who has only ever known courtly Camarilla politics would be way too specialized in politics and mind-diddling, to the point he doesn't have an answer for being punched in the mouth. Plus some vampires are chronic underachievers in unlife, though LaCroix's backstory would imply the opposite.
Makes sense then, going out of his way to get a bodyguard like the Sheriff to begin with.

>>714544232
the patch that's just fixes and nothing else. the restored content is cool, but it'll be better to have on your second playthrough as a different class.

>>714533323
He wasn't. It was LaCroix, as >>714534659 pointed out. He only admits to it if you have max persuasion and you side with him

>>714545151
huh, that's fucking cool. i always thought strauss was emailing you.

>>714549240
Him personally? Thats hard to believe.

>>714533107 (OP)
>>714533323
I actually liked working for the Camarilla and being a super vampire agent. But then La Croix betrayed and tried to kill me out of nowhere even though I found out the truth I was still loyal to him (until that point) because he was a chill/cool boss.

I hated the Vampire communists because they were retarded on every level. I stuck with the Camarilla in the end and got Vampire Morpheus to take the casket. My only real complaint is that the entire plot could have been solved if the Prince just ran the fucking casket through an X-Ray scanner to see inside.

>>714549240
See
>>714534954
>>714536559
>>714535353

>>714549498
nobody really has their hands on the casket for a long enough period of time, it's always moving.

>>714549498
>But then La Croix betrayed and tried to kill me out of nowhere even though I found out the truth I was still loyal to him (until that point) because he was a chill/cool boss.

I maintain that this is a consequence of the rushed production. All roads lead to LaCroix is a really easy way to speed up production.

>>714549681
>>714549498
its not that rushed, lacroix was always going to fuck you over because you're a threat to his plans even though nobody expected you to be a threat to his life and shit.

>Ghost mission
>Vampire Mafia mission that turns into zombies
>The mission with web blog recorders get hunted
For a 2 decade old game, I actually got some level of fear from these missions even though I was supposed to be a superpowered vampire in a trenchcoat.

>>714548561
it's not exactly as black and white as that. don't let that stop you from playing this absolute gem of a game.

>>714549991
>vampire
>superpowered
vampires are at the very bottom of the food chain
even humans are higher
think wizards are at the top
then ghosts and werewolves, dont remember which one is stronger
then humans
then vampires at rock bottom

>>714550105
Smelly wikidiving cross-splat faggot, begone from this cozy bloodlines thread!

>>714533107 (OP)
Assassin's Creed?

>>714549991
i love the haunted LA thing so much

>>714550168
my bitches and 300 hours in bloodlines beg to differ.

>>714549954
>because you're a threat to his plans

Not if you're a super simp. As rare as that one is on a first playthrough, it is entirely possible.

More to the point, Bloodlines being rushed is a matter of fact.

>the villain is literally (You)

>>714549991
It adds up, Beckett and Therese both make veiled statements that more worrying or at least unknown things likely lurk in the night since vampires exist, and vampires are all the more likely to run into them due to sharing space in the shadows.
It's sort of what disappoints me about the Underworld franchise, it never bothered to explore such a horrifying angle to immortality.

Queen of the Damned got close by implying like VtM that ancients aren't remotely human in their psychology and one of them awakening will be a nightmarish experience even for the modern day vamps, but it had its own hurdles between that.

>>714550305
i dont mean you want to spoil his plans but even being a witness to any of the sarcophagus shit is enough to get him fucked up by other elders.

>>714549510
see >>714549240

>>714533107 (OP)

>>714550147

>>714550426
His plan is already unhinged to the point of "I will eat a Methuselah, maybe even an Antediluvian".

Why the hell would he care about elders? It's not like he hid his obsession with the box well.

>>714549991
>>714550228
>>714550368
>You now remember the snuff house and how the creatures would pop out of nowhere.

>>714548561
He actually genuinely isn't the villain, and im not just saying that to make you feel better.

>>714550621
well any elder would be trying to eat an antediluvian but him working with the kueijin and fucking up multiple primogens and havens is going to put him on a national+ level shit list even if he fails.

>>714551005
>Created the entire drama around the sarcophagus
>Knew what he was setting into motion when he did so
>Everyone who gets dusted by the chaos it causes is on his hands

How is he not the true villain of the game? unless you want to give Cabbie/Caine credit for the plot

>>714551128
It's an all-in play. It's stupid, but if he succeeds, the Camarilla would let him walk for his many crimes as long as he continues to pay lip service to the Cam and extend their sphere of influence. They do the same for other methuselah, especially Ventrue methuselah. Why kill a loyal toadie in that case? He already knows how to use them, as seen in Magilla Gorilla.

>>714549991
>playthrough one
>italian zombie mansion is creepy
>playthrough 4
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-CiKnm0M9o

>>714551362
if his plan did not succeed he'd be throwing you under the bus anyway to try and save his own ass. i think the timing would be different but there was no way to avoid conflict with him in the long run. having you personally run every mission for him makes you an excellent scapegoat only witness.

>>714533107 (OP)
>Play this game for the first time, love it despite the janky gameplay and how the plot does break down in the final act if you think about it too hard, as evidenced by this thread
>Get into VtM tabletop. There's definitely some dumb moments in the lore but still pretty nice.
>Really love when we get to see glimpses of the world beyond vampires, like the Ocean House Hotel, hunting the Hengeyokai, and of course the Griffith Park Werewolf
>Actually look into Werewolf
>Don't like it.
>Look into Wraith.
>Don't like it.
>Always thought the Kuei-Jin were the weakest part of the game, look into them anyway.
>Holy shit it's awful.

>>714551526
If the plan fails, scapegoating you is like trying to pay off the national debt with scratch lottery tickets. If the plan succeeds (there was no universe in which it would), he doesn't need to scapegoat anyone. You don't try to eat a 4th or 3rd gen to go back to the political game. You do that shit so that everyone is so afraid of you that they won't even consider talking back.

>>714533107 (OP)
>the evil is a reflection of you and can never truly be vanquished

>>714551675
why do you think vampire got converted into tranny shit? it was the only one they could sell.

>White Wolf got dissolved because they made Vampires responsible for gay people getting murdered in eastern Europe.
I think people overreacted.

>>714551861
not saying his plan wasn't retarded but his implementation of it was very clean and politically sound. you're an independent gopher who comes into contact with literally everyone powerful in the entire town. all that can concretely be proven about lacroix is that he was vaguely investigating rumors and shit. its not his fault you fail to die under extreme circumstances and also is being played by much better vamps. his hands are clean until the final break.

>>714551447
Gun combat was fun, but melee is just OP and trivializes the game.

>>714552116
Honestly the dumbest thing about the gay chechen incident is that it's a tremendous case of the V5 writers genuinely having not read the earlier material.

The Camarilla wouldn't give a fuck one way or another about the chechens killing fags. The Camarilla is full of fags. The vampire elite of chechnya (all three of them) would be way more focused on how much money and influence they can suck out of the Kremlin in exchange for preventing another rebellion, or being a borderline feudal warlord state and reaping the benefits that entails.

>>714552259
>his hands are clean until the final break.

Are they? Beckett can prove how hard he was losing his shit over the Sarcophagus, and his word carries much further than LaCroix's.

>>714533107 (OP)
This is 95% fan fiction shit created out of thin air from a single line of malkavian dialogue during the last two decades. He's a total bro throughout the entire game. The fandom took what was basically an Easter egg and decided to canonize it.

>>714533323
But why though? Was he trying to kill Nines?

>>714552506
and when lacroix diablerized it beckett would then have something, him being a shitty prince isn't news. not sure if beckett is canonically political enough to get involved either way.

>>714552579
>Plants the sarcophagus bomb, even fucking signs it
>If the player dies due to this all he has to say is "shame about the kid though. Oh well, can't call em all."
>Bro

Jack is a monster, just like every other major player in the game.

>>714552816
The game treats him as a Kindred celebrity, Tung says as such. Beckett might be an antediluvian denier, but he doesn't deny the existence of methuselah. It doesn't take a genius to figure out what LaCroix wanted with the sarcophagus, and besides which, vampires don't operate on the U.S. Justice System. Proof is not always required to convict.

>>714552846
The game warns you not to open it a billion times.

>>714552846
your skill issue and greed or simping isnt his fault
you had every chance to bail

>>714552985
That has nothing to do with whether or not Jack actually cares about you or had ill intent.

>>714553019
You have a curious definition of "bro". It's okay to admit you fell for his "cool vampire uncle" routine. There's people out there that still won't admit VV was playing them.

>>714552846
>>714552579
it really depends on why the player isn't already dead by the time the bomb goes off. who actually expects him to survive anything in the mid-late game? a fledgeling singlehandedly conquers a sabbat hq? i dont even know the method behind it ruleswise.

>>714552965
yeah beckett is big in the source books but like i said the problem isn't the sarcophagus it's the other shit like the plot with ming and stirring up and fucking over the brujah and the grout/haven shit. he does a lot of unprincely things and makes a bunch of enemies if any of that comes out not so much the eating big vamps.

>>714552579
>Easter egg

Ah yes, the part where he breaks character and threatens you is an easter egg like when he calls out the player when they cheat.

Retard.

>>714553175
>i dont even know the method behind it ruleswise.

RAW, it's bullshit. You would've needed to be some sort of super spy before your embrace to have a chance at pulling it off.

There's a reason the "Caine is buffing you" theory is so popular. Bloodlines place loose with the setting and rules. Mostly for the better.

>>714552985
The first warning is from a druggie. You don't know what is inside of the damn thing. It could be just empty or a mummy.

>>714553105
hes a bro and gives you warnings not to open it
he aint gonna babysit yo ass nigga

>>714553105
It's not about him caring. Vampires are beyond stupid emotions like caring. You doing the opposite of what everyone told you to do for the last 15 hours of the game doesn't make him any more of a monster compared to the other vamps.

>>714546664
>>714547929
if lacroix gets final death'd by a humble letter opener how was he killing vampire hunters previously?

>>714553175
>a fledgeling singlehandedly conquers a sabbat hq
someone once theorized that its because the player is fifth gen and that in one night, he rose that high in power

Cain/the Taxi Driver are the biggest bitch in the game. Motherfucker, apologize to God so I can get my soul back and go to heaven or become a Mage.

>>714553337
right, but we see the player being sired

>>714553284
He's playing you for a fool and only helps you because he sees a line to dick over LaCroix with you. He's mildly happy when you live, because he might be able to use you again in the future. He's mildly annoyed when you die, because then he can't use you again.

>>714553301
>Vampires are beyond stupid emotions like caring
They really aren't. There's plenty of moments where you can gain humanity by having a heart. Jack is arguably the biggest monster in the entire game because he massacres an entire ship of innocent sailors just so he can kick off a scheme to get vampires to kill each other.

>>714550228
>>714549991
>both vtmb and mario sunshine of all things both did the haunted hotel a la the overlook hotel around the same time.
weird

>>714552013
Shit, evidently. Real shame though, bloodlines makes the rest of the monster mash actually look cool and intriguing.

>>714553482
well i was referring to the ghoost hunter tv show part entitled "Haunted LA." i love the shining mission too but it's not very LA-style.

>>714553421
at some point jack slips you some old bood, and it knocks you back several generations

>>714553421
doesnt say that the sire isnt some covert 4th gen
>>714553375
>cain is bored as fuck
>wakes up some antideluvian
>tells him to send a methusaleh and sire some dipshit
>then tells the antideluvian to go play dead to rile up the hornets nest that is la's night life
>antideluvian asks the oldest vampire of his bloodline, jack, to help you get your feet wet and to set up the prank, aka the bomb.
>drive a cab with sunproof glasses and air conditioning around, seeing all the chaos unfold while relaxing and having fun.

>>714553337
>>714553672

If you were a fucking 5th LaCroix wouldn't be able to dominate you earlier in the game.

>>714553667
That's not how that works.

>>714553315
If how he speaks about his achievements compared to those you do for him and the way he views the dominated security strapped with explosives and imposing Sheriff as an extension of his might, it's likely most serious scraps he scraped by were the result of sheer luck or others around at the time like Jack implied Camarilla ladder climbers tend to rely on.
As soon as you manhandle him a little he immediately defaults to begging, so he probably doesn't have much real experience or fight in him.

>>714553719
this is the first night you were sired. and you already become the top dog by the end of it. just give it time. it aint exactly as fast as flipping a switch.

>>714553468
They worked for the camarilla. They've been trying to kill you from the very second that the game starts. You should be happy that he's killing them and saving you from them over and over unless you're some kind of stockholm syndrome cuck.

>>714553775
I don't think you understand. Dominate does not work on vampires of superior generation. Full stop.

>>714553654
oh right. I forgot that quest.
I kill Pisha every playthrough BTW

>>714553856
Jack never saves you from the Cam, Nines does and Jack swoops in after he saves you from the Cam.

And besides which, even if you have a mutual interest with Jack, that doesn't mean he isn't a scheming bastard using you.

>>714553667
>>714553719
like ruleswise the only way you can really jump gens is through diablerie right? actually eating someone's soul not just drinking blood. could a fledgeling be dominated to do that or something?
>>714553896
i want her to be useful to me but she just isn't.

>>714553861
read >>714553734 and how roughing up lacroix a little makes him a little bitch far too fast
game's lore is semi accurate
anyway my head canon is the coolest and funniest and thus correct

>>714553274
>The first warning is from a druggie.
but also strauss, and beckett, who are much higher up than you. abrams is against it too, grout is a loony toon, but mentions it as well. that's a fairly diverse pool of people telling you not to open it.

>>714553952
>like ruleswise the only way you can really jump gens is through diablerie right?

There's like a handful of other ways but they're extremely fucking rare. Obscure blood magic and the like.

>>714553959
At least you admit it's headcanon. The Caine theory is a much better explanation for how you shoot up in power so rapidly.

>>714553719
You literally get rides by Cain to almost every mission spot and area. 100% sure he was pumping and powerboosting you up until the final battle.

>>714550838
>>714550228
I was playing dead island 2 recently and the start in the Hollywood Hills reminded me of the setting for the snuff mansion, a 1-1 remake with DI2 graphics would be awesome

>>714533323
No it wasn't him the speculation is that you guys were followed by either Lacroix henchmen or the Kuei-jin, Im pretty sure Jack knows that a wildfire won't kill you or Nines he knows how capable you guys are and would had scheme something better than that

>>714554092
Nigga read I am an advocate for the Caine theory.

I disagree with the idea that you are somehow sired fucking 5th.

>so called holy woman who hunts vampires
>is named chastity but is a stripper
>quest name is Hot Stripper Assassin Action!
my one problem with this game

>>714554325
Hunters (capital H) arent that kind of holy

>>714553719
You're right about the inconsistencies, but there is a line from Andrei in your second encounter about recognizing your blood, and he doesn't mean just remembering you, he remarks about the growing potency in your blood and how it is wasted on you as if he's aware of something significant.
https://youtu.be/nsSBxbdChpk?si=hc0-abvef1VPr24V&t=358
There may have an exception to the rule excuse intended.

>You can't keep the Japanese Hunter as your girlfriend and have her live with you.
>You can't save the redhead that was dying in a CA hospital because she gets kidnapped and dies to give you an upgraded equipment.

Fucking Troika games.

>>714554362
their whole shtick is that they have such strong beliefs that forces of good will always triumph over satanic demons that their belief makes you weak and extremely vulnerable before them.

>>714533107 (OP)
>the real villain who pulled the strings behind it all was your mentor

Why is Cain raising your fucking powerlevel to help you survive?

>>714533107 (OP)
>>the real villain who pulled the strings behind it all was your mentor

>>714554490
but its the belief not the morality

>>714554325
>>714554362
>>714554490
my favorite hunter lore is seeing past the veil. to the hunter, he just took out a bunch of evil little goblins. to people, a man just did a school shooting. absolutely insane, top tier lore.

>>714553952
>like ruleswise the only way you can really jump gens is through diablerie right
Nah you can become an elder and have your gen decrease by living long enough , vitae naturally thickens and becomes more powerful as a vampire ages. It's up to a point, however, because this process begins to plateau the older you get. You're not gonna get from elder to methusulah unless you are absolutely ancient or via diablerie , and diablerie at that level is dangerous since a vampire can override the mind of someone who eats them if they're too weak

>>714533107 (OP)
>>>the real villain who pulled the strings behind it all was your mentor

>>714554612
yeah they all live like deranged hobos sleeping under an overpass or something. i love hunters.

>>714554612
there's a veil? never knew that.
then why is there a masqurade?

So does the Camarilla the Illuminati or are they separate? Playing the game, I can't get a good grasp at how much they control and if they run the US government or not. Or are they just big players controlling cities and towns and companies and just working together?

Damn, all of this talk about Werewolves/Garous makes me REALLY REALLY we got an official Werewolf: The Apocalypse RPG game bros...

The thing is, with Werewolves being so powerful, you can't really make a game about them without them being an action hack-and-slash game, and that already exists.

>>714554749
especially in OWoD breaking the illusion is a BAD reality breaking kind of thing. torches and pitchforks are the least of your worries.

>>714554795
they got their own power ecosystem
why would they care about the government?
they usually made a kingdom for themselves in a place believed to be backwater by humans while controlling the local lord

>>714554362
>>714554490
Not all Hunters have True Faith. Most hunters are normal people.

>>714554612
and then there's this guy who is talking about Reckoning Hunters which are entirely different.

>>714554749
Despite what retards tell you, the different WoD series are not actually taking place simultaneously. For example, the werewolves of Vampire are not necessarily the werewolves of Werewolf.

>>714554795
>Playing the game, I can't get a good grasp at how much they control and if they run the US government or not. Or are they just big players controlling cities and towns and companies and just working together?

Don't worry Anon, the source material can't decide on this either.

>>714554864
this reminds me of that talk of modern science gimping wizards and them being forced to take over the academia so their "noble prize winning articles" can alter peoples worldview and let them cast some more magic again. that was removed of course as you cant have "modern science is bullocks" as central part of your lore.

>>714554749
the masquerade is vampire upholding the illusion of being people. they're gray, and dead looking, sure, but just normal people. at least most are. nossies are obviously big freaks, and tzimisce are proud of being monsters. the veil is what makes people see monsters as normal people. imbued hunters can see past that, and see the monster for what it is. the masquerade doesn't work on hunters, they always see vampires. a lot of them go nuts because they can't fathom people not understanding how many monsters infest the world. if a vampire is feeding on someone in public, and a hunter blasts the vampire and kills it, all people remember or see is 2 people making out, or hugging, then some lunatic came out of nowhere and murdered one. the other spectrum of their insanity is going full god schizoid and believing the power of god so hard that they start dropping thunder and lighting on vamp heads, literally. hunter is just as cool as vampire desu.

>all these dudes who read three wiki articles making shit up

make it stop

>>714554795
They're able to exist by hiding underneath and forming their own ecosystem. Hiding in plain sight in society, ala the Masquerade among the corporate world or among the rabble of the world like bums and the sewers. They don't really need to care about the human world, they just need to tell everyone to keep silent under punishment of death and keep their identity secret.

>>714554846
How powerful are werewolves? I don't know shit about the greater world of VTM. The game just made it seem like they were just super roided motherfuckers.

>>714555062
no

>>714555094
Did you play VTMB? Going head to head with the Werewolf you meet at the park is literally impossible and he obliterates you in 3 to 4 hits. Your only chance is hiding or tricking the monster into a trap.

>>714554918
>and then there's this guy who is talking about Reckoning Hunters which are entirely different.
fuck, i always forget that.

>>714555173
I can't blame you really, there's dudes who have been playing this since the 90s that can't actually get it straight.

WoD had dozens of writers PER GAMELINE, so bluntly it's a fucking mess. Take what you like and leave the rest.

>>714555094
they're good at fighting but are chronically retarded and routinely lose to X-Rated Captain Planet villains.

Go to /tg/, check out the WoD general, it has all the old books in a MEGA. This goes for all of you secondaries. Just read the books for yourself and decide if you like them or not.

>>714533107 (OP)
why weren't we able to romance him?

>>714555168
Yeah. He's a super roided motherfucker and him being unkillable seems more like a gameplay thing. Hence my question.

>>714555365
they're basically unkillable in general

>>714555245
well it's fucking dumb when they also drop reckoning hunters in vampire after showing you the normal dumbass hunters. like niggers it's world of darkness, not worlds of darkness.
>here's the cool werewolves
>here's the hippie ones
to be fair, a buttload of imbued hunters would probably dramatically change vampire the masquerade entirely, since they can actually kill vampires, probably most of them pretty quickly, minus all the lower generation ones that might as well not exist.

>>714555338
if he wants you
he just takes you
no need for romance

>>714554846
>Damn, all of this talk about Werewolves/Garous

Before your post one person was talking about it, and it was about his disappointment regarding them.

>>714555401
>like niggers it's world of darkness, not worlds of darkness.

The writers would disagree... about half of the time. They really could not decide on if there should be a shared setting or not. So what you get is a setting that's shared some of the time and not very well thought out when it is.

>>714533107 (OP)
Jade Empire's Master Roshi

>>714555523

>>714555523
it was horribly compatible and nobody ever wanted to break the taboo of mixing two systems cause it'd fuck everything up

>>714555094
Werewolf is the most combat focused game, they're strong as fuck and unless you have silver or are a high tier mage you're pretty much fucked. Extremely fast, extremely tacky, hit like a truck , they have multiple different forms they can use for any situation and a lot can use magic.

Why were there no wizards in this game

>>714555680
because mage is so trash that even Troika couldn't make them look interesting like they did werewolves and wraiths.

>>714555680
you have to play wizard: the wizarding for those.

>>714555680
a bitch ass werewolf and a wannabe hunter almost clapped yo ass to oblivion
you wanna add a lol lmao magician in the mix too?

>>714555680
well there could be, they're supposed to be ultra subtle about their shit anyway a lowly vamp wouldn't notice.

>>714554096
How's DI2?

>>714554501
it's such a good twist that it ruins any following playthrough

>>714555735
gameplay is fun. dont get bummed out by the shitty starting weapons breaking every 5 hits.
the gore and dismemberment system is one of the most fun Ive seen in a game.
make sure to turn off player voices as all the playable characters have nauseating personalities.

on werewolves, this is your one and only reminder that slipknot's first album with their first singer has a song called slipknot, and it's about werewolf the apocalypse https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4DkHdd9vdeE

>>714555603
Even internally, the games were a mechanical fustercluck.

My bigger complaint is how every gameline was written without at all considering the others, except perhaps how to dunk on the previous ones. Anything to make the games "fit together" was invented afterwards, and is very slapdash. One would think if they were setting out to make a "world of darkness" they would have planned things in advance but they didn't.

>>714544232

i like VTMB as a unique and interesting video game and in many ways its a well preserved relic of the early 2000s

but also much of WOD lore is not a joke, it's very real. much of what is said about cain, lilith, and the antedeluvians is straight up lifted from the book of enoch and kabbalah. its not even "references to the occult" it's basically feeding you raw, unfiltered origins of all that which is occult. i'm not going to give you a crash course on the line of cain and the nephilim right now. but this stuff is very real.

>>714553861
Man, I never understood that about the TTRPG
Generations are just wildly inconsistent at times. Sometimes it means you ignore stuff and have a massive power boost but most of the time it means jackshit.

>>714555838
/x/poster are you implying that vampires similar to the ones in Vampire: the Masquerade are real?

>>714554795
>So does the Camarilla the Illuminati or are they separate
WoD has like 10 different kinds of Illuminati my guy. The Technocracy has multiple factions like the literal NWO and Syndicate who manipulate governments and backed both sides of WW2, there's the Camarilla and Sabbath who pull strings in various cities around the world who also then have to deal with the Ministry who have their own schemes and connections, there's private corporations like pentex trying to feed people demons through fast food chains and dominate the world , the list just goes on and on

>>714555901
i think he's implying a legacy of caine

>>714555735
it's ok i got 2/3 of the way through and the zombies seemed to become way tanky, but maybe i should level up and upgrade my weapons more? i usually don't engage with crafting systems in games but you're surely expected to, otherwise i don't think it's normal that it takes 8+ charged melee attacks
to the head of a zombie to kill. the gore and environments are nice. i'll continue it some time.
t. >>714554096

>>714555941
soul reaver

>>714555885
It's not that difficult. There's a chart for it.

Generation dictates how much vitae you can hold, and how fast you can spend it. It also isn't linear. 10-13 can only spend one blood point per turn, but all have different blood pools. At 7+ you can start getting more than five dots in everything. So basically better generation lets you hold more blood and spend it faster, so it mostly benefits beatsticks with one big exception.

Dominate is the only power that just hard does not work on vampires of superior generation to you.

>>714555901
ive seen nosferatus
even on this very website

>>714555680
The Tremere are vampire wizards who are descendants of the House of Hermes and it's implied that the Technocracy were the dudes who experimented on you in Chinatown

>>714556049
I'm gonna shut this shit down immediately. If you have like 10 hacking you can find out that the Fu Syndicate are just working for Ming Xiao.

>>714556010
Yeah but there's also how it clashes with the narrative sides of things at times

>>714555831
But why?

>>714555838
that's never really hidden, /x/-man. that's how i ש̴̡̢͉͉̳̥̠̩̗̭͔̇̔́͑̀͂̀̈̂̓ח̵̧̱̠̘͕̘͖͔͍̘̱̞̳̣̻͉͓̳̙̖̳̐͋̃͆͗̆̈́͒̓̊̾͂́͂͌́̕ר̶̯̦̈́̃̉̑̈͐̔̃̓̃̍͂̂͝͠ר̴̨̫̝̠̼͉͆ת̵̨̢̢̼̣̜͎̮̖̦̱̻͈͍̹͉̗̺͆̔̓́̿̓̉̈͛̀י̴̨͉͕͚̠̈́̒̂͛͌̓̿̐͆̄̇̎̓͗̇̕̕͝ ̵̪͕̩̗͓̳̰͉̫̻͇̙͂̔͗̿̿̄̾̈͝א̶͍̮̻̻̗̱͍̗̙̤̻̊̽ת̸̨̢̯͉͖͎̳̯̺̾̍̄̌͠ ̴̢̨̮̣͎̰̗̘̬͇͈̥̆̈̓̚͜͝ה̷̰̞̘͇̳̱̯̱̺͇͎͔̤̳̼̺̹̀̉̀̌̽̒̊͝͝כ̸̧̛̛͍̫͕̹̳͎̬̯͉̎͌̓̾͒̐͗́̍̎̎̎̉̀͐͝ו̶̦̤̪́͋̆̏̄̾́̍͑͆̂͗͂͒̚͠͝͝ח̸̛̛͈͓͔͆͌̒͌͋͗̆͆͘̚͠ו̷̨̼͔͙̪̻̳͑͑̿̓͒̈́̇̀͊̉́͗́͌̿͘̚͜͝ͅת̶̧̭̮̼͚̾̄̏́̑̑́͒̓͌̎̽̚͜͠ ̵̨̨̼̰͎͙͙͈̤̩̜͍̦̰͛̇̂͛̈̿̊̈̆́̓̆͐̚̚͝͝͠ה̶̢̧̩̼͓̼̝̪̺͖͇̜̥̮̩̺̞̀͝͝ͅנ̸̨̟̯̰̦̞̺̰͖̤̩͉͓̙̪̞̊̎͜ס̴̹̯̭͙̯̰͈͒̈́͐͐͑̕̕͠ת̸̢̢̺̫̟͈̱̝̦͉̯͇͈͔̺͕͋͌̏̌̋̾̿̿̏̾̊̋̕̕͜͠ר̴̮̯̗͍͋̂͛̑̓͗̃̑͝י̷͍͊͂͒̃͑̄̓̈́͛̓͌̑̕͜ם̷̯̫̞͖̬̔ ̷̧̛̹̩͊̕ש̶̧̧̢̬̝͇͉̤̜̫̣̗̹̻̹̖̩̪̞͌̿͐ל̴̧̧̡̼̰̳͎͖̬͇̖̰̤̃̌̂̚י̵̢̛̥͉̝̘̠̝́̏́̆̕̕͜

>>714556136
What do you mean?

>>714551167
I just don't really consider it a villainous act, the only ones being villainized are people who are doing stupid greedy shit way in over their heads. It's like saying that a person leaving a prank decoy bicycle with a taser on the handle in the hood is a villain. I guess it's a matter of perspective.

Demons are cooler and they should've gotten a game instead

>>714556291
take your bad paradise lost fanfic back to english 102.

>>714556291
>demon: the forsaken

>>714555365
There is a power chart lying around about the power levels of all the entities in WoD with Werewolves, Mages, and Vampires, and according to it, an elder vampire is on equal footing to a lowly new Werewolf. That is how powerful they are. For vamps to take down a Werewolf, it would require a team of them to kill a single one running around.

Garous are supposed to be the beings made by Gaia to protect the earth from an entity called the Wyrm which is an entity of chaos and change.

Werewolves can change forms on the fly from human, werewolf, or lupis/wolf.

>>714555680
Wizards cannot show themselves or their powers and wizards are so hilariously powerful that they might as well just be a godlike universe game. I'm talking about power levels where you can be a wizard who is a photographer, takes a picture of the use, put the photo into Photoshop, uses Photoshop as his template/manifestion for his magic, add some shit in the photo, and make it appear in the world.

If there was a wizard in the game, you'll most likely see some faggot looking at you at the top of a building in the background and he suddenly gives you dejavou where you see a repeat event.

>>714556095
My guy, the syndicate is an arm of the Technocracy and they work with non humans all the time. You basically just proved me right

>>714556375
>here is a power chart lying around about the power levels of all the entities in WoD

That chart is a bad joke.

>>714556375
take a picture of someplace in the world*

>>714555838
yes yes, true, however, consider the following: F̵̋͝m̷̌͌j̸̒͝ l̴̋̈́v̴̓̐p̵̈́͐ ù̷̄p̵͆͠y̷̏͌y̴̋͠ b̵̋͠e̴̓̓ Y̵̓͐f̵͛͝j̵̽̚b̷̛̽j̷͊͝c̴̓͛w̶̓̔q̷͐̿z̷̔m̴̍̿ n̴̾̐q̵́̋b̸͌͝c̸̽̿ j̸̐̽ ë̷́̋b̵̀̏i̴͐͝ c̵̿͝ v̶̾̓ d̷̓̍ x̴̏̎v̵̈́͆ẅ̴́ s̵͗͝u̵͐͝ d̷̈́̕ v̵̍͑ ń̴̄y̸͝ p̶̈́́ s̷͗̒ d̶́̚?̵̽̚ F̶̐m̶͂͐j̵̈́̇ l̷̍̕v̶̕͠p̸̏̏ s̶̏̐t̵͝͝h̴͋͝ q̵͊͘ k̵͌̕y̴̔͘v̵͊̓j̴͗͝ w̵̾͑s̶͂̄v̶̔̇s̵͘̚ë̴́̐g̷̓̋ b̸̋͐é̶̒ q̷̓̐y̴͑u̷͗̐ì̵͌ y̷̏̓ z̴͑͘y̶̾̎v̷̔́ h̷͌̄ y̸͌̚q̵̄̚b̷̾̇ j̵͐͝v̸̽͠s̶͊̐ q̷͊ c̴͋̚ y̵̾͠y̶̿̐ z̵̈́͊?̴̋̿

>>714556375
>an elder vampire is on equal footing to a lowly new Werewolf
New werewolfs can get bodied by a group of well armed neonates or even just hunters my dude

>>714556405
Are you genuinely retarded? If you actually read the email in the building, it's just addressed to Ming. She is in charge. She is not an associate of some gay ass wizard in denial group.

>>714556375
>Wizards cannot show themselves
They absolutely can, the paradox gimmick literally doesn't work with Vampires and the majority of other supernaturals. Mages also can't really do all the busted cool shit starting out, a low level mage can be just kicked in the nuts by anyone and the ability to do all their crap while hiding is how they get by. They absolutely do get busted after a while though yeah.

>>714556284
The problem is that a lot of people who don't take the bait still get caught in the crossfire.

>>714533107 (OP)
>Bloodlines thread
>Everyone is just shilling their autistic tabletop lore

Shame.

>>714556608
only because you missed the first hundreds of posts

>>714556608
I want a Mage: the Ascension and Werewolf: the Apocalypse RPGs, goddammit!

>>714556547
Yeah that's true, i still don't believe though that he carries enough culpability in that frame though to be considered "THE" villain. I would say that's still squarely Lacroix.

>>714556657
Be honest with yourself Anon, do you really think that the current IP holders (Paradox Interactive) would be able to make one that you would even enjoy?

>>714551167
La Croix created the drama around the sarcophagus thinking he would get to diablerized an antediluvian and get out of being the sacrificial lamb for the camarilla.
Andrei is pure evil, plain and simple. Andrei is the biggest killer in the story.
Jack saw an opportunity to fuck with the cammies, and took it.

>>714556820
andrei is surely the most evil but his schemes are laughable cartoon villainy.

>>714556820
While Andrei probably has killed more off-screen, I genuinely think Jack is responsible for more deaths we can confirm happened on the Dane. There were more sailors than there were DMP people, not considering the morality of sailors v.s. snuff film makers.

Nobody is saying that LaCroix or Andrei aren't bad. Jack's "fucking with the cammies" isn't some sort of controlled operation. It relies on abject chaos, in which many get caught in the crossfire. Nines, Jack's own teammate almost dies as a result. He knowingly lit the spark that caused everyone's knives to come out.

Jack is not a good person, he is not your friend. He is a cold dead monster fueled by hatred of all authority, and damn the consequences.

>>714556375
>Gaia can't protect itself
>Makes entities weaker than itself for the job.
>Still loses to Humanity
From World of Darkness to Tsukihime, Gaia is a fucking jobber.

>>714556167
huffing his own farts mostly.
he keeps adding them, removing them, adding something else, removing it, mildly malkavian (bipolar)
there was a patch made by a guy who mostly made nsfw mods, that aimed to just be fixes and nothing else. it was finished enough to play the whole game and then abandoned after reaching that state. good enough for multiple playthroughs for me. it just didnt run on win10 as it was old.
/vrpg/ updated that patch to make it work fine on win10. no idea about win11 or linux.
there is some nonesense controversy about it due to stealing some code from wesp's mod as he didnt want to recode whats already done.
here's the patch
https://gofile.io/d/pD0jX0

>>714556491
>it's just addressed to Ming. She is in charge
Wow , Syndicate members lying about whose authority they really follow imagine that. It's called the Fu *Syndicate*, retard. If anything Ming might be a higher up because that's literally what the syndicate does sometimes

>>714556508
the paradox gimmick is in more effect the more unbelievable what you do is and the more powerful you are. so magicians who happen to be at the top get fucked the most

>>714557082
Ah yes, anything that uses the word syndicate is a part of the organization. Fucking retard, I hope you niggers get your own video game already so you stop blighting bloodlines threads with your bullshit.

>>714556980
he did it for the funny

>>714557287
>Anon is so clearly wrong and assblasted all he can do is cry and call me a nigger
Yeah that's what I thought

>>714533107 (OP)
Please spoiler that shit I've yet to play this game.

>>714557393
Your only argument is "they have syndicate in their name and work with other supernaturals sometimes".

Ming Xiao is not working with some wizard group. That is your headcanon. You can have it, but don't try to push it as fact.

Vampire the Masquerade is not shit half of the time. There's a reason it's the one that paid all the bills, even today.

The rest of WoD is trash that invariably devolves into "cosmic level war for reality based on the author's 4th grade understanding of a cultural issue". Like holy shit get a new idea already.

>>714556980
> he is not your friend. He is a cold dead monster and damn the consequences.
That's just vampires,
>fueled by hatred of all authority
and that's just the anarchs.
I don't think he's the villain in all of this, no more than any of the other blood sucking monsters of the night.
If he hadn't turned the Elizabeth Dane into a warzone Ming Xiao would have still been there to steal the key at the harbor and force La Croix on a goose chase.

>>714555901
no, the vampires from the video game are not real

heres your babby spoonfed QRD on the occult (that WOD lore is knee deep in)

>after adam and eve are expelled from eden, but before the flood, fallen angels breed with humans to create giants (nephilim) who rape and eat humans on the scale of millions (this is what attack on titan is about, but imagine it a million times worse)
>the line of cain assists watchers/nephilim in their quest to create mass atrocities against humanity by creating massive cities using knowledge revealed to cain by God for building and creation
>line of cain uses divine knowledge for basically the most profane thing possible
>watchers and line of cain also know how to manipulate DNA to create hybrids, monsters, mutants, etc
>all humans are genetically corrupted at the time of the flood except noah, the last pure human
>flood happens because God is putting an end to line of cain/watcher/nephilim tyranny and abominations, only noah and his family survive
>line of cain is genetically ended during the flood
>line of cain survives memetically after the flood because they enshrine sacred knowledge on obelisks which survive the flood that are found by egyptians (and possibly other cultures)
>this is why Egyptian sorcerers can imitate 2 out of 3 miracles moses performs
>high level magic encoded on these obelisks
>antedeluvians carried nephilim DNA and some DNA persisted after the flood-- the jebusites, anakites, and amalakites were attempting to breed nephilim back into existence, this is why goliath existed and was so tall

>>714557480
>Fu Syndicate group that has a far higher level of tech and access to military personal than any other organized crime group normally would including a level 10 hacking feat
>Hurr they're not akshully in the Syndicate
Lol, lmao even. Anon, look man I'm gonna go out on a limb here and help you out. Have you ever thought about just how retarded you really are? How the hell do you not catch on? Is your retardation low IQ or just autism? You really need to get that tested

>>714557935
It does beg the question of if everyone would have freaked out over the sarcophagus possibly containing an ancient if Jack hadn't done the massacre on board and deliberately made it look supernatural to everyone in the know? On one hand, less cause to suspect anything is up with the sarcophagus. On the other, there was the "odd presence in the air", which was likely the Cabbie.

Hell, if you press Johanssen hard enough he'll admit he got an anonymous tip on where to dig. So someone was planning this for potentially years. Granted, I don't think that one is Jack. That's the cabbie's doing again.

>>714558223
Damn I was really hoping there was a chance a hot vampire would sit on my face.

Still awake? Something on your mind? Or just lonely? Give me a call, /v/. 323-KL5-KTRK. Taking the call of a lucky number right now...

>>714558629
hi deb.

>>714558306
but without jack having any sort of motivations maybe he just diablerized this thing a long time ago and dug it up as a prop in his game.

>>714558761
Hello, caller.

>>714558886
is it true that you are a malkavian who talks into the telephone using the madness network while simultaneosly giving telephatic blowjobs to your callers?

>>714558886
hi deb.

>>714556918

>>714533107 (OP)
>the real villain who pulled the strings behind it all was your mentor and supposed friend
straus was the real villain?

>>714558228
This is a prime example of why nobody likes magefags. They like to insert themselves into spaces they don't belong, because they genuinely can't fathom a group having access to advanced technology without being tied to their beloved technocracy. Not to mention in this case it doesn't make any sense, as the Fu Syndicate building is absolute amateur hour. They use shitty spinning blades, dudes with shotguns, and fire spewers with exposed, shootable fuel canisters that can explode and destroy the windows of the observation chamber. Nobody else tries to insert themselves like magefags, and nobody throws a hissy fit quite like magefags, there's a reason they're the butt of many jokes over on /tg/. Yes, you can like mage without being a magefag and no, I'm not the anon you've been arguing with.

Wish they were still around to take a crack at bloodlines 2

>>714559208
Troika were a product of their time, a time where passionate teams with too many idea guys could push out a diamond in the rough.

>>714558223
Hey wait a second isn't this just Drakengard

>>714556980
...and he was a good friend.

was the Elizabeth Dane an intentional Dracula reference or did it just sort of happen?

>>714559616
I thought it was a The Fog reference, that old John Carpenter movie. Wasn't the ship Dracula was on called the Demeter?

>>714558793
I recall it being the theory that the dude in the coffin was just an ancient Ghoul. Though that could all be bullshit.

>>714558223
>they enshrine sacred knowledge on obelisks which survive the flood that are found by Egyptians (and possibly other cultures)
This is also a massive part of masonic Baphomet worship and the lands of obelisks are believed to be where they're ruling the world from. Egypt, France, Italy, Vatican, Lebanon, Turkey; Poland, UK and the US hold all the 30 obelisks

>>714559020
Is tonight a rerun?
>>714558961
Caller please, we're on air. The only one who can suggest naughty things is me.

>>714559673
yeah, but what I mean was that in Dracula, him and his boxes of earth were transported via the Demeter and he ends up massacring the ship.
The Elizabeth Dane is transporting the sarcophagus of Messerach (believed to be a vampire) and Jack ends up massacring the ship (an actual vampire).
It's kind of a parallel or something. Maybe a coincidence, but it feels pretty similar, so I'm wondering.

>>714559170
My dude I've played through mage play once, im a Hunter and Vampire type of nigga
>because they genuinely can't fathom a group having access to advanced technology without being tied to their beloved technocracy
A triad group shouldn't have anywhere near the level of access to military personal and level 10 tier hacking feat being required to hack their systems , nor should they have so much knowledge on the existence of vampires which is shared so freely in the organization.

>They use shitty spinning blades, dudes with shotguns, and fire spewers with exposed, shootable fuel canisters that can explode and destroy the windows of the observation chamber.
Yeah, all to test the capability of a vampire not to kill a vampire. Theyre either connected to the syndicate or some kind of hunter org connected with the Chinese government for whatever reason, and considering the tech checks I'm gonna go with Syndicate

>Nobody else tries to insert themselves like magefags, and nobody throws a hissy fit quite like magefags, there's a reason they're the butt of many jokes over on /tg/.
Maybe you should step away from /tg/ and layoff the internet for awhile, sperglord lmao. You're engaging in extremely insular fandom drama over on /tg/, go outside

>that time in 1996 they tried to turn VtM into a prime-time soap

>>714559067
Toplek

>>714559793
deb?

>>714559793
hey deb, today my taxi driver refused to take my money, saying rude things like "I know where its been I aint touching that" what has the world come to?

>>714559886
>that time I watched random garbage online and it turned out be very WoD-flavored kino schlock

>>714559689
yeah its very likely the whole thing was bullshit all along but anything goes.
>>714559886
that shit had a solid cast and it was still super fucking dull

>>714558629
Deb I'm drunk and took a really hot pale chick home with me who's freshening up in the next room. Says she's gonna "show me something special" when she gets out. I've been trying to get in her pants for awhile , any tips for something "special" I can show her?

>>714559816
The game is filled with horror references I wouldn't be surprised.

>>714559430
Inxile might be the modern day troika (A couple of ppl in this pic are now at inxile) gotta wait and see if they deliver on clockwork revolution first.

>>714559886
besides buffy the vampire slayer, as a lad in canada, my other vampire jam was vampire high. been a dork for anything vampire ever since. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=glYSHkzg6os

>>714559910
Next caller!
>>714559994
Oh, brother. Don't even get me started on taxi drivers. Just tonight I took a cab, and the driver was the weirdest man ever. I mean, who wears sunglasses at night, right? Let's make that tonight's topic. What's your 'weird' experiences in LA?
>>714560030
>Says she's gonna "show me something special" when she gets out.
You know, back in my days we used to call that "a favor". As for my advice, stop cheating on your hookup with me, and go have fun.

Replaying the game, it feels so 2005 and captured well, especially the edgelord fad that was going on at the time. Dialogue is kinda ass.

good thread fellers, see you next time.

>>714556820
>>714556918
Andrei isn't actually that evil, he does the things he does because he believes there's an ancient vampire in that sarcophagus and if he ever wakes up bad things are going to happen and wants to destroy it because of that
Meanwhile LaCroix also thinks an ancient is there but wants to diablerie it
You could call him evil because he's a vampire supremacist that doesn't care about humans, but you're vampire not a human

>>714561525
>Andrei isn't actually that evil

He turns people into weird hand goblin things and has them murder other people.

>>714556918
That's a tzimisce thing

>>714561525
Bro Andrei enjoys turning people into weird flesh freaks and making tapes of them murdering people.

>>714559886
It was surprisingly decent, but too watered down. I also like the bamboozle when you think that detective is going to be the main character and it turns out the Ventrue Prince is instead.

>>714561602
>>714561631
Yes, humans. Sabbat are vampire supremacists I'm not denying that. But was far as his vampirism stuff goes, he's correct in what he does
That's the general thing about Sabbat, they're more honest about their condition than Camarilla. Andrei is also one of the few characters that openly like Nosferatu and Malkavian PCs.
So from vampire perspective, he isn't that bad

>>714561815
I see someone fell for the Sabbat propaganda hook, line and sinker.

>>714561815
That's great anon, but one is going to turn me into furniture while the other won't.

>>714559716
>>714558223
wtf?

>>714561815
>No, you don't get it
>We aren't the same species so you can't apply the same morals to us

Cool justification leech, still using the matter sphere to turn you into a deck chair that I will forget to bring in when it rains.

>Creator of Vampires is the literal first born son of the first human made directly by God and cursed directly by God who calls him Human.
>All Vampires come directly from Humans and experience everything through a human mindset.
>Soul is Human.
"No, we Vampires are different and special."

Why do Vamps cope so hard?

>>714562535
Because they can't BE humans anymore. That's the entire point. This is going a bit deeper, but reliance on Humanity as measurement of how well-adjusted a vampire is a modern thing. Historically vampires would pick various philosophical Roads aka Paths that would embrace alternative morality that would let them continue their existence without just being feral monsters who are no longer human.

>>714555831
>Putting that lamppost there
He's literally pulling a Beginner's Guide move, bahahaha

>>714562535
It's really just the psychopaths that desperately seek a justification for being such pieces of shit. The vast majority of them act more or less like they did before being turned. The "worst" most of them get is not having a problem killing someone in self defense.

>>714562535
Because it makes dumb young vampires feel special and thus they'll be more willing to swallow the other bullshit you tell them to do. It's a trick.

>>714562780
Roads are just what happened when the writers realized that the hierarchy of sins for Humanity was just milquetoast 20th century western morality and that wouldn't work for a game set in any other time period. It's an ugly quick fix.

>>714562535
Vampires are stronger, smarter, more durable and much longer lasting humans. A young vampire might think like you stated, but after 200 years they'll find it hard to identify with humans
This was actually a pilot point in the past but it was dropped because WW kept forgetting about it, and they filled the WoD with hundreds of old vampires with high humanity

>>714562780
They could if Cain wasn't being a faggot.

>>714562780
>>714562931
interesting. so how would vampires on different paths interact when they met?

>>714563071
Considering a young mage becomes a literal God with their own creations. The 200 year old Vampire is still retarded.

>>714563217
In my experience playing the tabletop? Argue their underdeveloped philosophies at each other before going off to kill someone for the lulz.

I fucking hate paths and roads so much it isn't even funny.

>>714563264
Nobody cares about cross-splat. Most of the books do not treat the other gamelines as canon.

>>714563264
Assuming the vampire even knows about the existence of mages or how they work
And even still I doubt mage turned vampires like Tremere or Nagaraja dislike their condition considering they outlived their previous colleagues, immortality is much harder for mages

>>714563071
>and they filled the WoD with hundreds of old vampires with high humanity
Aren't those really rare even in the lore and somehow discouraged by mechanics too

>>714563217
Andrei is definitely on the Path of Metamorphosis and you can look at your interaction with him

>>714563309
How should they've been handled then?

>>714563460
>immortality is much harder for mages

Because those faggot technocrats took their bullshit too far.

>>714563539
Yes. Yes they are. Anon's point is that the writers forgot their own rule and made too many official examples of something that is supposed to be rare.

That's what most of the thread seems to be missing. World of Darkness writers aren't consistent. You're all operating under the assumption that this makes sense, or there's a good explanation for things. There isn't. The World of Darkness is spread between too many game lines that are only connected sometimes, written often by entirely different people who did not communicate and certainly didn't coordinate things to line up properly.

I get it, it seems cool and yeah, there's cool stuff there. Lots of it comes down to personal taste. But it is not a functional setting. It does not fit together, tonally, structurally or even mechanically. Your questions have three different answers that each contradict each other. Even with just vampire, the people who wrote vampire at the beginning of its original run and the people writing it at the end of said run are entirely different.

>>714563892
Because game lines were originally not meant to crossover. How it never occurred to anyone that was PRECISELY what the players would is beyond me.

>>714563646
Humanity should be semi-customizable to allow for different moral frameworks and principles to exist without relying on convoluted philosophies that facilitate playing like an irrational fuckhead. Have it tie more into willpower to make retaining your humanity less of a moral statement and more of a statement of how well you can control your beast and not degenerate due to your newfound power and curses.

>>714563892
That's one thing NWoD did better, it was built from the ground up with crossplay in mind so mechanically the splats play much nicer with each other. As opposed to OWoD where you had things like non vampires having almost zero chance of resisting dominate, because the formula for it was willpower plus a stat that non vampires don't have.

>>714564025
Yes I agree completely. They did not create them with crossover in mind and that is baffling since the appeal goes back to Frankenstein meets the Wolf-Man.

>>714564179
I'll actually be the brave soul to say I like a lot of nWoD's takes on things better. I love nWoD Changeling and Hunter especially.

>>714564179
>>714564308
OH NO

>>714564308
Oh Changeling and Hunter are near universally agreed on being better than the OWoD versions. And I've never played it but Deviant at least sounds interesting.

>>714547757
Gurps is great until you realize how stupid stat distribution is. If you can get over that hurdle the sky is your limit (planning aside)

>>714534031
But why does he disappear during that mission? What's he up to?

>>714565026
It's funny because Hunter has three very different games when you consider old version, H5 and Vigil.

>VTMB thread

>>714561815
Found the shovelhead.

>>714558629
Why would you draw Deb as a troon? For what purpose?

>>714533107 (OP)
Uhhhhhh wtf bro I haven't finished it yet

>>714550228
I like all the random metafictional (actual non-reddit definition here) stuff in the game. The TV shows, movies, video games, bands, etc., all sound fascinating and like something I'd be into irl. If Deb of Night was a real talk show with callers THAT eccentric I'd listen to it every night.

>>714555798
>werewolves
>slip
>knot

ew

>>714533107 (OP)
nah. they had to cut the game short so they turned into a jarjar Abrams kike mystery box bullshit non-ending. when you play the game its pretty obvious a lot it had to be cut to amek deadlines.

>>714570745
I get no respect, I tell ya.
The Cam finally invited me to one of their meetings, on account of my sire being a bigshot Toreador. I tried going in through the front door, when the guy guarding it stops me and says, "Hey pal, the sewer entrance is over there!" No respect.

>>714570745
Kathy Griffin did a masquerade violation recently too.

>>714571326
That just looks like a singer of some random rock band popular in the 70-80s after decades of coke and booze.

>>714565747
Beckett is there to prove that even a Redditor can be okay every now and then.

Leave the memories alone.

>>714565747
My first playthru I was considering opening the box, but the random beckett runs up on you in the street yelling "DON'T OPEN IT" after inspecting the box, is what made me not open it, I actually considered it might not be him for a second because it seemed out of character but because it was the real him, it was safe to take his word.

>>714572590
Is she even in the current version? They reworked Christina Hendricks so I assume thick chick got touched as well.

>>714572724
She's reworked into the Tremere nerd scientist girl with thick eyebrows.

>tfw the entire premise of blood diluting over the generations is basically what homeopathy is all about

>>714572590
I distinctly remember seeing this midriff in the latest trailer announcement, the head was replaced with some tanned old woman's head

>>714573172
No anon, homeopathy is the completely insane reversal, that extreme dilution over generations somehow amplifies the effect. It is nonsense in its purest form.

I opened it...