Does it deserve the hate?

>>715337641 (OP)
Yes. It seriously is my example of "gets good forty hours in". By that point I cared about everyone and what was happening. But that may have been some stokholm syndrome type shit I dunno. At least the one thing everyone can agree on is that it's very pretty. And how bout that battle theme? Aces.

no.

>>715337641 (OP)
No.

no but it didn't need any sequels

>>715337641 (OP)
Yes

>>715337641 (OP)
Yes. This is the game that killed FF. X came close, but it had good gmaeplay.

Not at all. If X wasn't critically acclaimed and adored by the fanbase then it would be fair game to hate XIII, but when XIII's "flaws" were just as pronounced in X, and its strengths mog X (gameplay, characters, and visuals by a mile, OST as well) then it becomes pretty clear how silly the discrepancy is between how they're viewed.

>>715337641 (OP)
no
it still deserves some hate though, there are a lot of issues with the execution

>>715337641 (OP)
Yes and the sequels are shit too

>>715337641 (OP)
Yes it does, I replayed it about a year ago. And the exact same thing struck me back when I first played it in 2010.
Complete burn out after a week of play.

>>715338178
>this cope again
>ignoring the discrepancies is pacing and content between the two
>actually thinking XIII has better gameplay or characters

>>715337641 (OP)
2009-2013 was peak ritual humiliation

>>715338107
Time killed FF. GTA, Call of Duty and WoW killed FF. Jrpgs were the AAA genre in their heyday. With technology progress other types of big and impressive games became possible. Casual crowds moved on to new bigger games. Final Fantasy tried to improve with the times in from 10 onwards but there wasn't much to improve without changing everything. They could slapdash something old timey but good like they did with 9, and get reasonable profits but they chose to pursue fleeting AAA flag and failing entry upon entry.

I beat this entire game and all side bosses only with auto battle and paradigm shift
gameplay wise it's horseshit but everything else (graphics, music, world, story, lighting's armpits) are very good
wasn't really good enough for 2 more sequels but hey gotta get that shitty custom engine to use

I love lightning

13 had issues 13-2 did not, and vice versa.
The story took too much of the focus if you asked me. The gameplay really needed to be looked at in a more polished light.
Seriously, it would have done the game a lot of favors if the end-game wasn't straight up shit.

>>715337641 (OP)
final fantasy games already suffer from attracting people who play the game in the slowest, safest and most boring way possible on the slow atb setting and then say the game is easy, let alone a game that literally takes double digit hours to give you the entire combat system and does a bad job of explaining key mechanics. ff13 also has a bad problem where most of the cast feels like the most annoying character in another games party as if they all formed a new party after getting kicked from their own for being braindead and obnoxious.
on paper the paradigm and battle ranking mechanics fix basically everything that kind of sucks about turn based combat, but the game is just kind of half baked even in its best moments. the sequel they made is genuinely one of the most fun final fantasy games but then the plot feels like a filler episode, and so lightning returns is just a bad valkyrie profile game instead of improving on these mechanics further.

TLDR: yeah mostly, although a lot of the hate is just from western game journalists who always hated japanese shit wanting to take it down a peg

>>715337641 (OP)
Hate is a strong word but I don't think it's good.

>>715338564
I mean, announcing an Xbox release was already peak humiliation ritual.

>>715338682
midgame is also shit. biggest problem probably is that you have 2 characters with already settled optima roles for chapters 3 through 10. there's no real room to play around when you can already have 6 of the possible 9 possible combinations at any time

I actually have 28 hours into XIII, got to the open grass part then dropped it. It wasn't bad, I but I was enjoying everything just being on rails and having to roam around killed the vibe and I got distracted with something else.

>>715339838
the entire point of paradigms is swapping constantly though, the idea that there's an optimal layout means you're bad at the game and doing a safe "good enough" c+ strategy

the actual issue is that only having 2 characters means you can do some boring ass commando + medic combo and slowly grind every fight to dust instead of enjoying the game

>>715337641 (OP)
Nigger, you can't play the team you want until you reach Pulse. Half of this fuckin game is a fuckin tutorial with one of the worse FF cast ever created. There is no villages, no shops, no side quests except hunting mobs...
And the community that loves it is even worse than the game itself, constantly jerking off to this bland bitch Lightning who is nothing but Cloud with all the flaws without any of the qualities (hell, Lightning is not even real name), and they are not even capable of admitting that the best and most important characters for the story are Vanille, Fang and Serah.

Fuck this game, and fuck the morons that love it

>>715340089
That's kinda what I mean. There's only 9 combinations for much of the game and during the lightning/hope chapters you don't even really have access to the more interesting jammer/enhancer. Hope does have enhancer but i remember that you mostly control lightning

>>715337824
They did tons of assets that you maybe see for a second in the background. Of course they had to reuse them somehow after first game's lukewarm reception.

>>715340430
why did they bother to make that titan and not let us fight it though

>Cast Libra
>Begin autobattle mash
>SYN/SAB/MED
>COM/RAV/RAV
>Stagger
>COM/COM/RAV
>Repeat
This is the "good gameplay" that FFXIII is supposed to have? You can't even control your party members

>>715337641 (OP)
it was mostly hated for its linear structure while not offering enough else along the way.
that and the characters.
both were justified criticism.
the game was mediocre then and it is mediocre now. it's just not as offensively bad as Square continued to become after.

People getting filtered by two slightly similar sounding terms will never not be funny.

>>715340545
the paradigms and stagger combat were fine as it was still new at the time. the auto-battle was retarded though, i've never used it.
games should never be designed for people who don't want to play them.

>>715340614
The problem isn't that linear, it's that it constantly forces you into different party combinations over and over again. It feels like a constant tutorial. I like FFX, I couldn't care less about it being a straight line .

>>715340858
FFXIII is linear without having anything in its corridors.
FFX did it right.

>>715340858
FFX had pitstops on the way with things to do and NPCs to talk to, plus the cloisters for a change of pace.
FFXIII is just hallways filled with fights between each cutscene

>>715340858
I think it's mostly that it just doesn't present its world interestingly or engagingly. They spout "saving cocoon" and rushie and farsuhie over and over but at no point make them known outside datalogs.
For its linearity X has characters tell Tida about the world with optional deeper lore dives if you go to Maechen.

It is fundamentally flawed.
The one thing it has going, the combat, only gets fully explored at around 60% of the game. That means, you are looking at 10+ hours of tutorials before you can play the game as intended.
And even after that point, there are no enemies and only a couple of bosses that require you to actually think on what you are doing.

>>715337641 (OP)
Yes. It deserved even more hate than it got. Especially after the superb foundation ff12 did for the future of the series, both mechanically and narratively.

>>715341748
13 actually also had a fairly haphazard development and much of it was scrummed together to meet a trailer. 11 is probably the last FF that didn't have fucked up development