Is this really something you should share with a friend?

>>715876009 (OP)
only with a friend who's within punching distance.

>>715876009 (OP)
Teleport is soulless.

>>715876009 (OP)
yikes

>sacred armor
holy hero editor batman

>>715876009 (OP)
>sacred armor
state

>>715876009 (OP)
Enigma isn't that rare, I mean you can get it for the playtime of some sixty hours, guaranteed.

SoJ is a lot rarer and you can trade one for Enigma easily.

wouldnt wish ARPG addiction on my worst enemy

>>715876712
this is like the complete opposite of reality

>>715876712
lolno, run nm andy for 60 hours and you're bathing in sojs

>>715876712
nigga what
soj is not worth a jah+ber and I've found soj way before a jah+ber

>>715876009 (OP)
making enigmas is easy, they hand them out for free in lobbies

>>715876009 (OP)
Diablo 2 is fine but i always gravitated more to Sacred, Divine Divinity and NoX. I literally have Sacred GOLD installed right now after i bought it on GOG.

>>715876902
sacred is only playable with the slav reborn mod, the vanilla skill animations/durations are some real wank

>>715876798
https://diablo2.io/pricecheck.php?item=938

SoJ goes for Jah, Ist, and Ber runes all the time. You're just not using the economy right.

>>715876972
>using the bot/rmt based economy as an example instead of actual droprates
lol,
lmao,

>>715877030
It has a low ROI overall. Of course you could do 1000 Andy runs and get maybe 3 SOJ's, but look at how much time you wasted doing that when the Ber Rune or Jah Rune could be traded up easily for just one of them. Not only that, but cubing up an Enigma with a normal base is a lot easier than say farming Andy for 1000 runs.

>>715876972
you're being retarded. soj is like a 1 in 600 drop from nm andy which is pretty common in d2. jahs are insanely rare.

>>715877204
>look how much time you wasted doing that when the botter will sell you a jah/ber for cheap
bro

>>715877260
Oh I posted the wrong image.

SOJ is like 1:3000 or something right now.

>>715876972
imagine trading in d2 outside jsp
also jah and ber has insane worth the first couple of days, soj's are nowhere near close
soj only has worth the first week because of clone

>>715877285
That's what return of investment means. You use it in any RPG from WoW or Ragnarok Online. You don't seriously think Blacksmiths waste an entire day hunting for Doppelganger cards when they can just buy one?

>>715877312
i have no idea what website this is but that is simply not correct.

>>715877312
1:3800 with 0mf at p1 and you can take it down to 1:800 or whatever

runewords ruined d2

>>715876712
Show me someone trading enigma for SOJ. I'll wait.

>>715877439
Yes, 1 class being about 20x better than all the other classes was great

>>715877356
yeah, bot market is cringe and if you didn't find the runes yourself you didn't earn it

>>715877406
These are the values from another website.

https://maxroll.gg/d2/d2-drop-calculator#item=unique,unique122

>>715877507
ssf is cringe since you can't fight anyone or grief

>>715877496
better for instectoids farming all day treating the game like a merchant sim on d2jsp or whatever other trade site

>>715877536
now try modifying the conditions to match actual player activity. nm, p7-8, 450+ mf

>>715877507
moser's is my favorite shield in the game right now.

>>715877447
You'd be waiting for a week or so, but I'm sure I could put a video or something together.

>>715876952
I am playing with the vanilla GOG version and the game is great. You just have to learn the keybinds(there is even a special PDF that lists all they kybinds that were included with the physical game)

>>715877641
you're implying this wouldn't have happened with godly rares. it probably wouldn't have since nobody would've played the game

>>715876712
>Pajeet is a retard
A tale as old as time

>>715877649
Key word here, "easily."
It's not that easy if it's possible at all, so yeah, whip up that video

>>715877647
The best case scenario, when you're playing with five other people, and they've surrounded the monster when it's died (on-screen) with a total of 600+ MF, is still about a 1:1,000 chance of finding the item.

https://maxroll.gg/d2/d2-drop-calculator#p6,6;mf800;item=unique,unique122

>>715877750
for fuck sake its nightmare, not hell

>>715876009 (OP)
Idk, but my favorite Gauntlet clone is Heroes of Hammerwatch

>>715876902
Dungeon Siege 1 and 2 are so much better you get have a full party

>>715877750
>hell
nm goes down to 1:820 at p3 700mf (my setup)

>715876712
>715876972
>715877312
shut the fuck up namefaggot literal dungeater attention whore

>>715877747
You don't really understand what you're talking about. People literally buy Enigma from paysites and keysites. The rarity of the item is pretty much a facsimile of anything you'd conditionally surrender, meaning its worth is tied to what YOU specifically put effort in; which in laymanns terms means you're only calling it a rare drop because you spent time hunting for it longer than other people did.

>>715877884
That's a lot of words but no evidence of a trade literally nobody would make.

i haven't gotten past normal difficulty Diablo (Act IV) yet. this game is tough as a solo druid, but the cinematics are great. i played D2 as a kid and someone was always carrying me through content. now i'm playing it as an adult, and it makes me feel like a retard for not beating it on normal difficulty yet. i'm getting filtered by a 25 year old ARPG.

>>715878000
I guess you're not playing fire druid then because it's like the definitive ezmode normal clear build

>>715877954
What do you mean nobody would make this trade?

I'm staring at 12 Ber runes for $7 dollars.

>>715878062
>Enigma isn't that rare, I mean you can get it for the playtime of some sixty hours, guaranteed.
damn, it takes you sixty hours to come up with a dollar?

>>715878062
This isn't what you said here: >>715876712
You said you can easily trade an SOJ for an enigma. I don't know what you're talking about with this RMT shit. Show me the trade of enigma for an soj

What, specifically, makes D2 better than PoE
I cant have fun with D2

>>715878184
SoJ was basically a currency after 1.10 because gold was relatively useless. You could buy basically anything if you had enough of them in your inventory. I dunno why people are cracking up over something that's factual about the game's community.

If anyone is curious you can solo farm a soj in maybe 20 hours. You can target farm an enigma technically by getting a good lk layout but that will take you literally weeks and you will want to kill yourself.

t. solo chad

is there anything more pathetic than RMTing for items in a video game?

>>715878241
>after 1.10
turboretard that never played the game asking for AI summaries of shit he doesnt know anything about lmao

runes took over sojs as the primary currency, sojs as a currency was more of a thing pre-LoD

>>715878386
So you're basically strawmanning because buying gear with SoJ doesn't count unless people have vivid memories of farming dupes from 2007.

>>715878427
you can buy gear with soj, but you're not buying a fucking enigma with one unless the other guy RMT'd his enigma and has no idea what the fuck he's doing

>>715878241
This right here is how you can tell how someone didn't play during that time at all. SOJs were a currency pre-1.10 because of how many were in circulation from dupes, and runewords were mostly shit except for like Silence. By 1.10, Ist was the currency since most duped sojs were erased by ruststorm .

>>715878241
SoJ stopped being relevant after 2002 you dumb AI zoomer faggot

>>715878485
You getting disgruntled over actual trades isn't making me feel stupid.

>>715878489
soj was currency for like one year. then it was hrs for the next two decades.

>>715878526
looks pretty relevant here, someone found a buyer not too long ago.

>>715878584
>8 hel runes = soj = enigma
??

>>715878623
Yeah, I know. I just said that.

>>715878680
They aren't leveraged over price, it's bartering. You trade for what you need, not what is fairly priced.

>>715878241
>>715878427
>>715878654
Hey faggot, it's me >>715878216
You don't seem to be answering. Show me where you can trade a SOJ for an enigma. You said it's easy.

>>715878792
and because my dad sold me a $200k condo for 50k it must be a normal occurrence in the market

>>715878885
Hey, fucknuts.

It's me, the shithead you keep calling a faggot? Yes, me. I posted another set of SOJ trade tables for you; you want to see more?

ITT: life long nubs argue about the trade value of pixels in a 25 year old game. Have you scrubs finally beat hell mode yet?

>>715878935
Which table shows 1 soj trading for an enigma. please link it, thanks.

>>715878935
>>715878885
you're both faggots

>>715879025
No, I'm sure he's just being dense because he's mad SOJ actually trades pretty well for Enigma.

>>715879060
You're mad you're being called out. again, link the trade where it's one for an enigma

>>715876902
>NoX
Absolute ludo

big fraction doesn't want you to know that the left is rarer than the right.

>>715878584
>>715878654
what the genuine fuck are these prices supposed to be? how is 8 hel runes anywhere in the same place as 2 jah runes? is the playerbase just 5 guys and a bunch of bots competing on cheaper HRs to sell them via RMT?

>>715879129
I'm mad I'm being called out when I'm sitting here, patiently working out the conditions you keep changing post-by-post because I have literally nothing better to do right now. Right, I'm mad because I can seize opportunity, i.e. be patient.

>>715879060
SOJ and enigma are barely worth anything in non ladder due to dupes and bots. They might as well be the same price when shit like a 30% fathom trades for 40 bers. It's not even worth arguing about

>>715876009 (OP)
I had an Enigma once and the story how I got it is weird as fuck
>playing d2 one day, on a pretty low level server, don't remember what exactly we were doing
>ladder, but iirc it was still a month or so from ending
>someone messages me something along the lines of "Hey, I'm gonna rush one of my alts all the way through the game but I need someone to ancients glitch for me"
>i was familiar with the glitch (it allows underlevelled characters to complete the act 5 quest despite having a "hard" req of level 20 / 40 / 60) so I said sure
>join his private, passworded game
>spend the next hour or so entering a portal -> tagging a waypoint / collecting quest items
>ancients glitch for him twice
>after the final one, he gives me a fucking archon plate Enigma + a 6/4/6 CTA and a flail Heart of the Oak
>never see or hear from him again
It was my first and only Enigma, which I eventually gave to one of my real-life friends when the ladder ended

>>715879227
?
You said here >>715876712 SOJ trades for an enigma easily.
Now show me this trade.

>>715879249
I was going to say this too. If it were LADDER HARDCORE then MAYBE you could have argued, "bro no, that trade would never happen." But so many people play offline and on softcore ladders, it wouldn't even matter if you had 20 Enigmas, someone would trade one for a bunch of SOJ.

>>715879332
Yeah soj and enigma are worth whatever someone will give you for it because the economy is so fucked. I've given out free bers to anons in these threads before.

>>715879418
That I do believe.

>>715879293
Not him but both barely hold value on non ladder due to inflation. Even on ladder, both lose their value within a week due mass botting. Having said that, though, I'd say in general a SOJ is probably worth ohm - sur but once people are trading near perfect griffons, fathoms, etc for 20+ hrs, people stop giving that much of a shit. I've "overpaid" many times when I just need a specific item fast. If I needed a soj really bad, I'd trade a jah and ber for it if I had a bunch laying around.

>>715879910
THANK YOU

>>715877496
it was. game had soul back then.

the guy said enigma isn't rare and that soj is rarer, both patently false, then defleced to "well they have a similar value due to bots" which is a completely different argument. jah and ber are extremely rare while soj is not.

>>715877439
Runewords are kino and I wish more of these sorts of games had them. They give a purpose to white items, a deterministic way to get levelling items or specific endgame effects and you can choose their base item to prioritise certain things.
Some specific runewords are gamebreaking in the literal sense, but that's just badly balanced items, not a flaw with the system

>>715880413
I didn't deflect anything. You literally cherrypicked an argument, got mad when I plucked a similar fruit from the same argument, showed it to you and how much similar it was to your original point, and started to call the thought police because you couldn't deal with the fact your cherrypicking could be seen as subversive and unusually mean-spirited.

>>715880413
I'm a different guy saying that the prices are inflated you fucking dipshit. They're just 25 year old botted pixels. Grow up manchild.

>>715880512
>You literally cherrypicked an argument
your argument is that enigma is "rarer" because in specifically nonladder everyone has 100 botted ber runes and that's not a cherrypicked situation compared to literal droprates? lel

>>715880616
Yes, when you argue that rarity depends on how legal the player's agency is, you are cherrypicking. If someone farms 100 runs themselves, or bots 100 runs, you are choosing the one you like best, not the one that has the runes/stones.

>>715880512
>>715880540
i don't care about trade value. a lot of people play the game single player so it's insanely retarded to just say the really rare thing is not rare and the common thing is rare because of your online bots. that's misleading and stupid.

>>715880695
>tyrael's might isn't actually rare because I can buy one in 3 seconds with some dollars
you're a retarded thirdie whale

>>715880776
Yes that's how a relative economy works bro.

>>715880743
If you just play single player, why do you give a fuck about trade value online? You obviously do care about the trade value. You've been arguing with anon about it for an hour.

>>715880824
you're mixing up rarity with value, brother

>>715880827
my nigga please read the first sentence in my post again.

>>715880861
In what way does the value of an object in D2R differ from its rarity now that we've basically defined SOJ's, Runes, and Enigma as valuable assets?

>>715876952
I find Sacred unplayable because of how quickly everything respawns.

>>715880934
rarity is how common it is to find the item as a drop from a defeated enemy

>>715880891
Both sojs and high runes aren't common at all. Do you have autism? Even if you're specifically target farming sojs, you might have to do a thousand runs to find one. You can target farm bers and jahs, too. You just need a barb to hork trav thousands of times instead or run lower kurast.

>>715881034
>>715879175

>>715881012
So the rarity of an item is how much time it takes to find it, which is directly proportional to how valuable it is.

>>715881083
no. plenty of extraordinarily rare items in the game are not that valuable. and plenty of common things are fairly valuable. such as soj.

>>715881083
rarity has nothing to do with value, I rarely get diarrhea but I don't value it over my regular poop

what is the differene between ARPGs and Gachaslop? Only retards play these genres.

>>715877439
Ruinewords are great, it's an immersive crafting system that gives you some control over the equipment you can realistically find. The drop rate of endgame runewords is pure cancer though.

>>715881074
It takes a fraction of the time to hork a bunch of trav members compared to teleporting to andy. What now, autismo?

>>715881156
Under that postulation, you would have to submit that rarity and value are different and also not mutually exclusive. Which would still qualify that argument that SOJ is a meaningful trade for runes like Ber, Ith, or Jah or even Etheral 3os base Archon armors.

>>715881171
horking trav is slower than lk chests which is still slower than andy with a good map.

>>715881271
Andy is a single monster. Trav is a huge pack and they drop so much shit that the game has trouble displaying everything that dropped. I can kill them with my dual grief ww barb in seconds. I've self found many bers and jahs.

>>715881362
now imagine if bers and jahs had a 1 in 800 drop chance instead of 1 in 50000. that's what farming nm andy is like.

>>715881463
Farming both requires autism or botting. Neither are common drops. This is such a stupid fucking argument and you're so emotionally invested in it.

>>715881545
my dude you are sperging because i told you that the computer program we call diablo 2 makes the one thing appear more often than the other. get a grip.

>>715881362
took me 5 mins of nm andy runs to get my soj kek, 30sec per run including menu downtime

>>715881615
I'm not the other anon that you were arguing with for an hour. Don't make me start posting my hardcore characters and loot to clown on you newbies in this general again.

>>715881740
having a hardcore character doesn't make 1/800 more rare than 1/50000. it's math nigga.

>>715881842
correction: the council droprate is actually 1/75000, not 50000

>>715881842
The "1/50000" is a deceptive number when there is a massive pack of trav members that takes me 10 seconds to kill and 10 more seconds to hork. What is the math then, nigga? 1/10000? 1/5000? Hrmm

>>715881936
Are those p8 drop rates? When you hork, you get p8 drops.

>>715881842
The number is smaller, but it doesn't account for circumstance. Just because you have a 1/100 chance of finding a million dollars in a corporate setting doesn't mean you are in a corporate setting.

>>715876510
sorry teleport makes the game good
why do shitty arpg devs not understand this. nobody wants to walk around your poorly designed zones and mazes at 5mph in order to find the one monster with good drop rates
your design is what facilitated teleport, if you hadn't designed shitass layouts and didn't weight drops to be completely fucking unfarmably worthless off of 99.9% of monsters in the game, then nobody would need to use it
if you gave everyone 300% movement speed, nobody would need to use it
>b-b-b-b-but then you'd play for less time
and? i'm not here to grind away endless hours on your dogshit design, i'm here to have fun and progress. it's also a false claim, your playerbase overwhelmingly are more likely to stop playing becuase they get fed up of getting no consistent regular drops, or because they're fed up navigating your intentionally shitty layouts. and let's be clear d2 isn't even the worst offender of this, it's massively better than most arpg layout design and it's STILL too annoying to bother playing 95% of all zones in the game because of it

>>715882156
He doesn't seem to realize that when you kill Andy, you're making a single roll on each of her dropped items and when a well geared ww barb kills trav, they're making 22 rolls on each of their drops in seconds (11 for the kills, and 11 more for the horks).

>>715882379
Exactly. The number might be smaller but the situation is not ideal. There's a greater ROI in hunting down 100 monsters at once with a 1:60K chance than in hunting down 1 monster with a 1:1000 chance.

>single player
>start seeded game
>warp to lower kurast
>run up and down for a set amount of seconds, open one chest here, run over there and open an armor rack, then run way over there and open a chest containing a ber rune
>repeat indefinitely

>>715882436
They drop tons of rings, amulets, and jewels, too. I've found many sojs, facets, and GG charms just from autistically running trav over and over. I'd much rather run them over a worthless nm andy farm any day.

>>715882619
I need some of those amulets too, I have basically zero prismatic stats for resistances at level 69.

>>715881961
you take the reciprocal of the drop chance and then set that to the power of n where n is the amount of occurrences. or in the case the amount of council members. so 6. or 12 if horking i guess. so your chance for a ber from one full horking council run is ~0.00024%. that's better than 0.00002% which is the drop rate from a single council member but still a lot lower than 1/800.

>>715882260
The game is playing through to the end making due with what you get, not repeatedly farming anything and trivializing what you've already long beaten.

>>715882997
There are not 6. There are 11 of them and it takes me less than 10 seconds from the the waypoint to kill them since my barb has enigma and dual grief. Running nm andy is fucking pointless and even if you're target farming soj in particular, it's really not much better for that either. I've found many sojs just from running trav (I use dual isted ali baba on swap) as well as countless high runes.

>>715876712
I had several years of playtime and all the runes combined would maybe have made one. I think they massively increased droprates when they took out the difficulty after closing the company that made it.

>Thinly veiled /pol/ thread
kys

>>715883621
You're forgetting how terrible the online servers for LOD used to be. After 10 or so runs, you would get a "realm down" that would lock you out of your account for a full day. They also increased the drop rate of high runs around 2010 when they implemented respecs. Both of those combined coupled with 20+ years of target farming knowledge is why it feels like drop rates are increased in D2R. It took people 20 years to find a ber because it was such a pain in the ass to play online back in the day and most people had no idea about how drop rates worked.

>>715883269
i can't find the drop tables for the non-superunique council members to calculate their drops but it's probably lower than the named ones.

>>715882260
>it's massively better than most arpg layout design
Most arpgs don't have maggot lair, arcane sanctuary and half of act 3.

>>715884656
There is nothing wrong with arcane. It's a nice farm for lightning based characters. Lots of great chests for charms/runes and ghosts that drop runes.

>>715883621
>>715883843
It's bad because people are generally disinformed and because people don't care about their time being wasted. The reason these items take forever to drop, or even use them ethereal bases is precisely because knowledge about them is so limited to player discretion.

>>715880452
What they actually did that people love is give characters access to skills from other classes.

>>715883738
>he's STILL talking about epstein

>>715883843
> most people had no idea about how drop rates worked
Drop rates were available more than 20 years ago.
Realms down didn't fucking matter because it was before forced online cancer.

>>715887257
Nice pointless post. Realm down definitely did matter because you couldn't farm if you were playing online. You were locked out of your account. Most people were total newbs 20 years ago and didn't know how to look up drop rates because they were stupid fucking kids just discovering the internet. Compare the D2 community online back then compared to now. Compare online gaming in general back then compared to now. It was something new. When people say "I haven't found a ber in 20 years," that's why.

>>715885709
Epstein is still a pretty big deal. When you can be held accountable for someone's sex crimes simply by being at one of their parties, you're in the mix with all sorts of nefarious elements. It's a big case, not just because of the sex trafficking, but because of the premise. Just like how Weinstein was a big deal because of the dark underbelly of Hollywood being shown, Epstein reveals the nature of dirty politicians censoring themselves when necessary.

>>715880953
I also found the it annoying that I couldn't full clear an area past the tutorial zone. I know the game uses save state instead of session instances, but it should have been an option. It's not like you can ever run out of things to kill when you can export and import saves.

>>715883738
You're the one who made it /pol/.