Why would anyone want to play the war criminal faction?

unfufilled school shooter fantasies

>>717630661 (OP)
>posts on 4chan
>doesn't grasp the existence of contrarians
t. replaying tbc classic as dwarf paladin on netherwing

I want to cum on an undead cutie's exposed kneebones

>NO SHOES FUCKING NIGGGERS!!!
horde has the objectively better end-game city and town placement for both pve and pvp, alliance has a better starting 1-30 experience

To fuck fem nelves

>>717630661 (OP)
But enough about Call of Duty.

>>717630989
fippy bippy
>>717631382
>instant cuckold shit
I hate burger hours.

>>717630661 (OP)
There is no such thing as war crimes if the geneva convention or any international agreement never took place :)

>>717630661 (OP)
Edginess.
>>717631209
This. Alliance is way comfier at the beginning and it has that original warcraft vibe, but Stormwind is terrible.

>>717632209
dumbass

>>717630661 (OP)
The bad guys look cool

>>717632893
>retard can't comprehend that war crimes are a social construct
lol
lmao

>>717630661 (OP)
>the war criminal faction
did you forget when the alliance butchered a peaceful tauren encampment, including the women and children? both sides have always had blood on their hands. though naturally, only the faggoty alliance players refuse to acknowledge this.

>>717632971
This.
People want to live out being part of a dark fantasy army.

>committing multiple genocides and invading a world good
>putting said invading genociders in camps because you don't know what to do with them, instead of killing them all bad
What did Californians mean by this?

>>717633068
>NOOOOO NOT THE HECKIN COWARINOS
Fuck off vegan

>>717633138
i hate tauren, but open your eyes you clown.

>>717630661 (OP)
They were the most fun in WarCraft II. They became kinda lame after.

>>717633068
>>717633170
>defecting rogues did something that sorta almost is as bad as the average hordenigger action and then got punished for it with death, that means they're the same bro
You're not even trying.

>>717630661 (OP)
>Why would anyone want to play the war criminal faction?
Srbija mentioned
RAHHHH!!!

>>717633115
It is the appropriate take.
Genocide is always the optimal outcome.

>>717633285
>NOOOO THEY WERE HECKIN ROGUE!
Fuck off faggot

>>717633441
The sacking of Taurajo was done by dirlewangers against orders, yes, but even if it wasn't it would still not be worse than the average horde action.

>>717633591
we're not comparing, we're acknowledging that the alliance doesn't have clean hands.

>>717633115
Californians kind of just overlook that the Horde are fascist, imperialist invaders. They're less civilized and organized into tribes which, to many retards, means that they MUST BE black/indigenous people, due to their innate bigotry. So they project their own belief in the inherent virtue of black/indigenous people onto the Horde and then see the Alliance as "white-coded." So the internment camps are no longer just a reasonable response to the events of a fantasy setting (and a reasonable punishment for the invasion and genocides committed by the orcs) but instead they are now an allegory for slavery or some stupid shit.

Most reasonable people accept that the Horde are the bad guys and that's the entire point. It's fun to be the edgy monster guy with inhuman morality that wouldn't think twice about slaughtering a bunch of humans despite still having a code of honor. Nobody's joining the faction made up of berserk space aliens, hulking minotaurs, cannibalistic jungle beasts, and undead bioterrorists to be the morally righteous person. Granted, the writers for WoW have always been a bit schizo when it comes to the Horde and wanting them to both be the villainous monsters of WC1 and 2 and the more honorable tribesmen of WC3.

>>717633105
>that one elf with the orc armor
ahahahaha

>>717633612
Well yeah it's a war (that the horde started completely unprovoked btw)

My burly Orcette with a purple ponytail was cute
The troll priestess not so much

>>717633712
>(that the horde started completely unprovoked btw)
yes, they did, and if garrosh was here we'd do it again.

>>717630661 (OP)
Better racials, blood elves, the fact that the story focuses on them so much, and the fact that more people play on the horde so players gravitate there

>>717633903
>the fact that more people play on the horde so players gravitate there
is this still true? i quit in bfa.

>>717633818
God, I miss that man. Now that was a fucking Warchief.

>>717633818
Akshually Sylv- I mean Putress did, but Garrosh probably would have 5 minutes later anyway to be fair.
>>717633903
Not sure what particular expansion your bias is from but World of Warcraft's story is focused on Alliance characters almost all the time.

>>717630661 (OP)
Why would anyone play WoW at this point?

>>717633978
Garrosh was unironically peak Horde and we've been shit ever since we were robbed of him.

>>717634024
Same reason he would post on /v/. Sunk cost, familiarity, addiction.

>>717630661 (OP)
WE DINDU NUFFIN. WE WUZ PEACEFUL SHAMAN TRIBES

>>717634061
The shit Blizzard had to pull when they realised players were expressing wrongthink by liking Garrosh is staggering.

>>717634180
i bet he put his fat green cock into that human's mouth afterwards. it's the fate of all alliance players.

>>717633998
How do you reach this conclusion? Cata- thrall, mop - garrosh, wod - iron horde, legion - nightborne join the horde for some reason, bfa - sylvanas, shadowlands - sylvanas, dragonflight - highmountain guy becomes leader of the black dragons over wrathion, tww - thrall stars in a cinematic depsite doing nothing in the expansion ,gallywix and gazlowe star in the .1 patch, and the alliance is forced to work with the horde goblin faction, midnight - takes place in silvermoon. The only expansion that didn't focus on the horde is tbc and wrath

>>717633115
This is kinda nuts though. What does a Californian seriously want? Once you defeat the invading (presumed to be) demons with a bloodlust who tried to genocide you and your allies for no reason, just instantly give them a country of their own? Where?

>>717634180
it's weird that "kek" came from world of worldcraft but "bur" didn't catch on. and what time period was "lel"?

I find the whole orc cuck stuff rather odd. Night Elves are larger and more imposing than orcs and lanklet trolls. Tauren are based though.

>>717634320
I like how you equate horde leaders becoming comically evil genocidal villains to an expansion being "horde focused".

>>717630661 (OP)
>implying worlo devs give a fuck about the story

bro I literally murdered a pandarian nurse and the wounded alliance soldiers and in a few quests i was being buddy buddy with alduin as if nothing happened.

>>717634437
kek did not come from World of Warcraft. It's literally just a coincidence. No one who played WoW actively typed kek, it only showed up if you got ganked and the horde player typed it in /s. The meme kek is from /sp/ and is just a further corruption of lel, which was a corruption of lol.

>>717634320
>legion
>horde focused
you're a bit of a comedian, aren't you?

>>717633063
>retard can't comprehend that he lives in a society
lol
lmao

>>717634437
Back in the day if you played horde you'd sometimes see people use bur ironically and/or to indicate the alliance acting like asshats
>Stevebones: This ?? nelf hunter has been camping me all morning
>Tomzugzug: BUR!

>>717634513
Yes, if a story focuses on a horde character, it is horde focused. As OP said, the horde being evil is kind of their thing. There's a reason their most popular characters are garrosh and sylvanas
>>717634686
>the race of people we helped for half of the expansion going horde for no reason in particular is not horde focused
The only funny thing here is your lack of critical thinking skills

>>717634634
Are you a retard? honest question

>>717634437
It's because of that gif of the LOTR WoW parody

>>717634867
you can't be this retarded.

>>717634875
No, I'm just not a 12 year old retard trying to fit in, unlike you. But please keep digging your grave, it's pretty funny.

>>717634634
underageb&

>>717630661 (OP)
>war crimes
lmao call the UN about it pussy

>>717635002
I double replied so you're going to have to tell me what point you specifically think is retarded so I can laugh at you

>>717635101
>No, I'm just not a 12 year old retard trying to fit in, unlike you.
nta but this unironically reads like a child typed it in 2004. i think it was the inclusion of 'unlike you' that really put the nail in it.

>>717635202
i don't need to. anyone who played legion is going to read your post and just think "wow, this guy's retarded."
you want me to push you into the fire, but anon, you're already in it. i don't have to do shit to prove it.

>>717635204
>>717635135
It's very weird to me how this simple fact makes zoomer faggots shit themselves in impotent rage. "kek" was never a thing in WoW. It was never actively typed by anyone. It was an observation, "oh, when horde players type lol it says that". It was never anything more. But again, keep embarrassing yourselves. It is very fucking funny and genuinely gratifying to me.

>>717634320
>Cata- thrall
Sick of this meme, Cata was a HARD Night Elf focus, Thrall got one lame questline about repairing his soul and pressed his execute button on Deathwing, that was it. Firelands was all about Night Elves, Dragon Soul required you to go through MULTIPLE dungeons droning about the history of the Night Elves.

>>717635305
Anon, no one is going to side with you if you can't make an actual argument and just say "no I'm right". You've yet to explain how I'm wrong.

>>717635341
>"kek" was never a thing in WoW.
No but we typed it here because of WoW

>>717635341
>n-no u are a zoomer
lol

>>717635401
Temporarily becoming the aspect of earth and kill stealing deathwing is a lot

>>717634320
Wrath
>a human paladin and a human paladin fight over who gets to replace the human paladin as the next king of the dead, the name ner'zhul is not spoken once
Cata
>start of the endless night elf wank
MoP
>let's all destroy orgrimmar, alliance pouts that half the playerbase is allowed to keep existing
WoD
>hey remember these old orc heroes? Kill them kill them kill them btw aren't the draenai nice for enriching this primitive planet?
Legion
>illidan, khadgar and velen are the only characters that matter, while thrall gets cucked out of his doomhammer. final patch is entirely based around the new alliance race (also old alliance characters are back) also night elves, might elves everywhere
BFA
>MoP 2, this time with even more horde leaders dying! Jaina fully becomes a disney princess, night elves lose a tree (they can just change phase into anyway)
SL. Horde essentially cease to exist as a faction at this point
>Baine sits in the corner, alliance do everything, more might elf whining, also they get their own afterlife to be special
DF. For all the sylvanas wank Anduin winds up taking up more of the story
>the night elf whining saga finally draws to a conclusion, taking up the entire final patch.
BFA
>alleria, anduin moping and the bronzebeard family drama take up the first patch, second patch was entirely goblins so they desperately dredged up the only alliance goblin they could to be the focus of the story

>>717630661 (OP)
I like wc3 trolls

Are tendies the new Disney Adults?

>>717634437
"lel" Was back when jimmies were rustled and Lemon Key.

>>717635761
Jabootyyyy~~~~

>>717630661 (OP)
they had the coolest and most memorable reign of chaos campaign
we are talking about pre-tbc WoW right?

>>717634190
>NOOOO YOU CAN'T HAVE A FACTION LEADER THAT ISN'T THE HECKING GOOD GUY
>...
>but lets make Vol'Jin a Warchief for 5 minutes and then make what will be a Female Arthas tier villain the Warchief

>>717634180
>redridge twink
holy fucking based

>>717635690
>a human paladin and a human paladin fight over who gets to replace the human paladin as the next king of the dead, the name ner'zhul is not spoken once
I've stopped there, are you genuinely trying to argue that Arthas is an alliance character? Do you think that Illidan is an alliance character too? Or are you arguing that humans mean alliance, which is equally as retarded

>>717630661 (OP)
Because I liked rexxar's campaign the best

>>717636021
Makes me laugh to think that vol'jin got made watching at the last cutscene of MoP, WoD took place entirely on another planet while he stayed home, then he died in the opening scenario of legion. Guy made one decision as watching and it was appointing a corpse as successor so he'd seem useful by comparison.

>>717635690
>Wrath
>Ignoring Sylvanas and the based Wrathgate incident

>Cata
>Night Elf Wank
Night Elves were crazier in WC3. They single-handedly defeated the Burning Legion once before and were the decisive factor in the Third War.

>>717633678
>90% of horde officers are orcs or tauren
>elves make up 90% of the horde population
Fuck this game

>>717636124
>level 29 in a low 20's area
>based

>>717636398
25, same as the questers for the keep :)

>>717630661 (OP)
>the war criminal faction
You answered your own question. Horde is based, while Alliance is cringeworthy carebears.

>>717636129
So thrall wasn't horde in cata, Garrosh wasn't horde in SoO, none of the WoD orcs were horde, sylvanas wasn't horde in SL... damn, looks like all the times alliance were whining, it didn't count after all because they weren't part of the player team at that point in time.

>>717636428
forgot pic
half my gear is just unenchanted shit from WC

>>717634745
>retard
lol
lmao

>>717636507
is this your theme song?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8coDNlnCQ6E

>>717636630
we'd unironically sit in the /china channel until leadership passed to us then ban all the chinks from it until a mod had to manually restore it lol

>>717636326
You raised a good point
>forsaken as a faction existed solely for revenge against the lich king, their storyline stops in the second zone and the final assault on icecrown is a coalition between human led paladins and human led death knights

>>717636498
>So thrall wasn't horde in cata
He was warchief from vanilla to wrath he is a horde character
>Garrosh wasn't horde in SoO
He's literally warchief of the horde in SoO, it's a civil war to remove him
>none of the WoD orcs were horde
Grommash, Garrosh, and Orgrim are all heavily associated with the horde, they named their capital after Orgrim even
>sylvanas wasn't horde in SL
She was literally warchief in the previous expansion and a horde character since vanilla
How does anything you just said make sense in your head? Do you even pay attention to the story you're currently seething about?

>>717636781
So Arthas and illidan are alliance characters after all, thanks for clearing up your own argument.

since this is the latest active wow related thread(after epoch committed suicide) i have a question:
How long until I can use LLMs to simulate conversations/characters in a single player private server until cata?

>>717636885

>>717636736
>forsaken as a faction existed solely for revenge against the lich king
This characterization is not quite right. In WC3, Sylvanas isn't just seeking revenge. Otherwise, she wouldn't really care about taking over Lordaeron from the Dreadlords who betrayed Arthas and would have allied with them entirely. I think it's entirely fair to characterize Sylvanas as a Machiavellian power player rather than just a vengeful spirit.

Wrath was just a poorly written expansion, because WoW writers wanted to make the Horde look heroic and sweep its flaws under the rug (and then, of course, Garrosh comes).

>>717636861
Illidan isn't part of the alliance because he was exiled before the night elves joined the alliance. Arthas isn't part of the alliance because he never did anything for them. He was born into it as the prince of lordaeron, culled stratholme, and then destroyed his kingdom. he never had a chance to be a part of the alliance. If you're going to seethe about a story, you should atleast read it

>>717630661 (OP)
uhh pic unrelated? did you forget the alliances war crimes?

>>717636885
I thought there already was an LLM integration.

>>717630661 (OP)
To learn how to commit crimes IRL.

>>717636861
>Arthas
I think it's fairly ridiculous to disclaim young Arthas, since the Human/Alliance campaign in WC3 is all about Arthas. However, by WoW he is 100% Scourge and not Alliance. WC3 ends with him fighting Illidan as a mortal enemy, who you claim is also Alliance.
>Illidan
Illidan helps the Alliance in one mission in WC3. The next appearance he makes is in the service of Kil'Jaeden and along the Naga. Unless you're going to tell me that the Burning Legion is part of the Alliance, it's ludicrous to treat Illidan as Alliance.

The Horde comparisons to these characters would be Varimathras (who was always plotting to betray Sylvanas) or the High Elves in the Alliance (who were never Horde to begin with).

>>717637430
Oh boy, let's directly quote >>717636781
To prove your own retardation.
>Grommash, Garrosh and Orgrim are all heavily associated with the horde, they named their capital after Orgrim even
Let's see who Illidan is associated with
>night elves, alliance faction
>tyrande, alliance leader
>malfurion, alliance leader
>maiev, neutral-ish night elf
Seems like a strong association with the alliance to me. But wait! I hear you burble, gears in your head desperately turning, Illidan went to outland and became a raid boss before the night elves joined the alliance. Oh wait, Orgrim died before the horde we know today was even formed, so that's useless as an argument.
Now let's look at Arthas. Can we say he's strongly associated with alliance characters? Yes we can, he barely interacted with orcs at all in warcraft 3. But those were all part of a slightly different alliance! (Apart from Jaina) Surely that's a clear win for me! Oh wait, there's an alliance settlement named after him too, Menethil harbor. Guess he's alliance material. Unless you're a hypocrite of course?

>>717637903
You can leave a faction and still be associated with that faction, unless you want to go right back to >>717636498

>>717635690
Don't forget that awesome questline in Legion where Tyrande berates you for something you didn't do and drags you around doing errands for her and Horde can't tell her to fuck off in any capacity but escorting Baine to visit Highmountain got the bluebabies fidgeting in their chairs too much so they cut it.

>>717638232
>there's an alliance settlement named after him too, Menethil harbor
Menethil is the name of Lordaeron's ruling family. That comparison is like saying Trump Tower is named after Kai Trump.

>>717638446
>You can leave a faction and still be associated with that faction
There's a difference between stepping out of the spotlight and leaving. Thrall never formally left the Horde, just stepped out from being Warchief. Garrosh was Warchief in SoO (and you only fight him so the Horde can be good boys). I can't speak for Sylvanas in SL because I never touched that expansion.
Compare that with Arthas, who burned down his kingdom and slaughtered his own people, or with Illidan, who was a pawn of the Burning Legion until Legion.

>>717638232
Grommash, Garrosh and Orgrim have all been a part of the horde. Two of them were warchiefs. Illidan has never been a part of the alliance, what is your argument here?
>Illidan went to outland and became a raid boss before the night elves joined the alliance
What? The night elves were a part of the alliance in tbc. Do you even play the game?
>Orgrim died before the horde we know today was even formed
The game literally says it's the same horde. Again, do you even play the game?
>Menethil harbor
His father was king menethil, menethil is his last name, it's not named after arthas, it's named after the crown.
It's becoming very obvious you don't even play the game, let alone know the story you're seething about.

>>717639068
Come on man, the dude is the brother of the Night Elf faction leader. You're really going to tell me people wouldn't have cried Horde favoritism in Cata if it was Melvin, Exiled Brother of Thrall getting the Earth Aspect?

>>717638974
Garrosh slaughtered plenty of his own people, by the time we were raiding orgrimmar there were two distinct hordes. I don't remember arthas ever formally handing over the keys to lordaeron either.

is it legal for druids to have sex in their animal forms?

>>717639068
...dude, Illidan left for outland in WC3. You do know there were games before wow right?

>>717639237
Yes but only with other druids. There was a big trial over it, baine lost the case. Again.

>>717639431
ok what about tauren having sex with other races? is that legal?

>>717635643
Kek comes from StarCraft althoughbeit

>>717639468
Not recommended, you either get hotdog in a hallway scenario or you have to tell the spirit healer why you have to res from ruptured organs.

>>717639163
If thrall disliked his brother melvin, imprisoned him for years, and banished him before he created the horde then yes I would not consider melvin a horde character, and I would not consider cata a horde expansion if he became green jesus instead. I don't consider arthas an alliance character and I never said wrath was an alliance expansion.
>>717639312
Yes, but he did not become a raid boss before the night elves joined the alliance. It was after they joined that he became a raid boss

>>717639505
but popularized by wow's translation of lol into kek

>>717639731
He was in raid boss mode, they just hadn't gotten around to him yet.

>>717639731
So WoD isn't a horde expansion.

>>717630661 (OP)
to play as a goblin/vulpera onahole (that humans use).

>>717639869
I know a lot of people would argue him becoming a raid boss was a waste of his character, but I see what you're saying now
>>717639945
>A expansion starring major characters of the horde is not a horde expansion
Were you dropped on your head as a baby?

>>717639068
>the game literally says that it's the same horde. Again do you even play the game?
The game LITERALLY says that orgrim's horde was a precursor comprised of demon worshipping orcs, Amani forest trolls and ogres. It split up after the dark portal was closed and is called the old horde to distinguish it from the one thrall founded after orgrim's death. The remnants on azeroth still loyal to the old horde regrouped around rend blackhand and camped out in blackrock mountain, while the ones trapped in outland became the fel horde serving under illidan. Do you even play the game?

>>717630661 (OP)
Need Orc gf

>>717630661 (OP)
alliance had a lot more fags

>>717631971
>I hate burger hours.
I'm pretty sure indians lead the way in cuck and blacked shit.

>>717640418
Multiple orc characters in the "new" horde are characters who were in the "old" horde, multiple of these characters are regarded as heroes to the "new" horde, and a large part of the horde story is making up for the shit they did in the "old" horde. It seems as though you don't play the game.

>>717640827
So Arthas is an alliance character. We can do this all day dude.

>>717640945
>So Arthas is an alliance character
Have you not been paying attention to this entire thread? This has been brought up and debunked multiple times

>>717630661 (OP)
tauren wives

>>717641292
Multiple human characters in the "new" alliance are characters who were in the "old" alliance, multiple of these characters are regarded as heroes to the "new" alliance, and a large part of the alliance story is making up for the shit they did on the "old" alliance. It seems as though you don't play the game.

>>717633660
>illainous monsters of WC1 and 2 and the more honorable tribesmen of WC3.
the horde basically isn't either anymore. it has almost no plot agency and hasn't had any in about a decade. Its most important characters now are undead and elven women. All of its even marginally nationalistic or horde focused leaders are dead or MIA

>>717641730
Reminder that lorthemar is the longest serving horde leader alive today. (Thrall doesn't count because of his repeated bitch outs)

>>717641443
until their hooves come out and you realize they don't have human feet

>>717630661 (OP)
>Why would anyone want to play the war criminal faction?
People that enjoy getting paid bonuses for having a good time. $100 for every civilian casualty with a 25% tip on every section eight housing complex flattened with artillery.

>Cairne dies in offscreen during Cata
>Garrosh turns evil in MoP, and then dies in WoD
>Vol'Jin does fuckall on WoD, and then dies like a bitch in Legion
>Sylvanas turns evil in BfA, and then something happens to her in Shadowlands idk I stopped playing
Even if the Horde was allowed to make fun warcrimes they'd just get another of their leaders killed. But I guess Tirion Fordring and Varian dying during Legion makes up for all the Horde bias?

>>717641642
>Has no argument so you're just repeating what I said
This is why I love arguing with retards, they refuse to just admit they're wrong and instead spiral and post fun shit. Yes, the old alliance is the new alliance same as the horde. The difference between someone like Orgrim and Arthas is that Orgrim led the horde and is a hero to thrall, another person who led the horde. Arthas didn't do anything for the "old" alliance, and isn't a part of the "new" alliance.

>>717641987
Horde has been dead since Blood Elves were introduced.

>>717641987
You don't understand how hard the alliance have it, mekkatorque had to sit down for a whole patch and Jaina almost broke a nail after effortlessly destroying the entire golden fleet and killing rastakhan.

>>717641812
Yeah, it basically feels like the Horde no longer exists as a faction since it's only allowed to have plot agency when its leaders are the villain of the expansion
>Thrall JUSTed his reputation, power and relevance for almost no reason, no one cares about him anymore and he's MIA
>Garrosh character assassination from Cata to MOP, killed
>Vol'jin warchief for 1 expansion, dies without doing anything but not before being mindraped to make Sylvanas warchief
>Sylvanas leads the horde solely to fulfill a terribly written background plot told after the fact (BFA->Sneedolands is all J'lor manipulation)
Honestly trolls, orcs, and undead feel like they're all in a state of regime collapse as individual groups while Tauren, Nightborne and Belfs are becoming more isolatied. Elven part of the Horde has no common goals or culture with Thrall's horde and literally invited a bunch of humans to come to the Lor'themar/Thalyssra wedding.
imo trashing thrall was the biggest screwup, just feels pointless

>>717642021
>repeat back your own argument so you can see that you're just using rules for thee and not for me
>you don't get it for half a threads worth of posts, conclude I'm just shitposting
Arthas was a hero of the alliance, just as Orgrim was a hero of the horde. he was first in line to rule it before he went mad.

>>717642363
Sylvanas was definitely a victim of the writing team getting completely trashed multiple times. Same with Jaina.

>>717642426
>conclude I'm just shitposting
I never said you're shitposting, I said you're retarded, realized you're wrong, and are now spiraling and desperately trying to get the last word. Your argument is that arthas is an alliance character, but nobody has ever argued that except for you. There is a major difference between being a prince in the alliance and destroying your kingdom before you get a chance to rule, and ruling over the horde and being a role model to the horde. It's not rules for thee and not for me if they're two different rules

>>717642892
We're slowly seeing progress, you've reached the answer that arthas was a hero and prince of the alliance, now we just need that to meet up with the "Arthas isn't an alliance character" mental block you've built and consider why those two shouldn't exist at the same time. Let's start you off: leaving the faction doesn't mean you're not going to be associated with that faction, we can conclude that through characters like Garrosh, Bolvar and Thrall. So that must mean...

>>717642021
The issue here is that the question isn't whether the characters were actually on the Alliance but how relevant they are (if at all) to each side. Ultimately characters like Arthas and Illidan getting spotlight feels like Alliance centricism because their stories are heavily bound up with Alliance figures and perspectives
>Arthas (Human) is responsible for the big WC3 catastrophe: the collapse of the entire northern half of the Alliance (mostly human kingdoms, special focus on Lordaeron). He's bitterly considered the worst traitor to humanity ever
>Illidan's story is completely intertwined with Tyrande and Malfurion from the ground up. His character arc only makes sense in reference to his desire for prestige within and later betrayal of night elven society., in the end he has his player character champion deliver his final words to Tyrande + Malfurion
That's why something like Legion felt like extreme Alliance centricism, even if Velen (peacemonger), Khadgar (kinda neutral), Illidan (renegade from night elven society) aren't wearing blue lion tabards. The story is still being driven by Alliance races and told from those perspectives
Similarly, I'd say if we had some new blackrock remnant orc character that wasn't on the horde be a new major character, I'd say that that is horde centric because they would undoubtedly be bringing up horde history constantly

>>717643464
>arthas was a hero and prince of the alliance
He is not a hero of the alliance though, do you even read my posts anon, or is the seethe blinding you? Not only is there no character who would consider him a hero of the alliance, or even a hero in general, no fan of the game except you would consider him one. The mental gymnastics you're doing to reach this point are astounding.

>>717643810
He is literally the human faction hero character in WC3 campaign.

>>717643802
>Ultimately characters like Arthas and Illidan getting spotlight feels like Alliance centricism because their stories are heavily bound up with Alliance figures
That's completely reasonable, although I'd argue that doens't apply to illidan in legion because for whatever reason they didn't have him interact with malfurion or tyrande, what was that about anyways?

>>717644027
>interacting with the people who cucked you, banished you and tried to kill you 3 times after saving their asses twice already
Velen was just more fun and Maiev seething was enough I guess.

>>717643912
Are we now equating humans with the alliance? Is your whole problem just autism?

>>717644027
>although I'd argue that doens't apply to illidan in legion because for whatever reason they didn't have him interact with malfurion or tyrande, what was that about anyways
Pretty much just bad writing. That was also at a time when night elves were basically doing nothing so Malf + Tyrande got little screentime. The later Night Warrior thing was a reaction to people at the time of Legion bitching that night elves had been sidelined
Still, I'd say he didn't need to actually interact with them to make it "alliance centric" because his entire personality and arc is based on his relationship to the night elves (+getting cucked by Malf). Like, why would horde members give a shit about his Betrayer title. He didn't betray them, he betrayed the nelfs. That's my point

>>717644210
Oh we've regressed. The human campaign in WC3 follows the alliance of lordaeron which we already covered is still associated with the alliance of stormwind.

>>717644121
>Velen was just more fun
With that they did to malf and tyrande in bfa you might be right it was better this way

>>717644345
>regressed
My point has stayed the same, you're the one constantly doing mental gymnastics to argue a point you've come to realize is wrong. He was a prince of lordaeron, but he is no hero of the alliance. You don't even believe he's an alliance character

>>717636124
based
for me it's holing up in Dun Garok and causing massive questing pileups from ambushing groups until I hit sergeant

>>717635690
Didn't Legion have a moment planned where Baine took charge but Alliance fans complained and he was cut out the Highmountain storyline?

Disregard any retail playing faggot who talks about war crimes in Warcraft.

>>717630661 (OP)
>Why would anyone want to play the war criminal faction?
There are 10,000 other settings that do "humans and dwarves doing first edition D&D things" better than Warcraft does. It's something I've seen a million times already, so it doesn't grab my attention at all. If I want to do the humans and dwarves walking around castles and forests thing, I can play a ton of other video games or table-top roleplaying games that specialize in that. I don't often have the ability to play as a zombie, minotaur, or green caveman.

They look cool, too.

>>717645446
back in cataclysm baine was ready to open the gates of mulgore and butcher every alliance dog for what they did to taurajo back. they even had the voiceline recorded
instead they made him the biggest cuck in the game

>>717645782
What they did to baine is a travesty, in DF they had a questline where he goes and massacres a bunch of centuar, and the lesson at the end is these aren't the centaur I'm mad at, I'll still probably massacre those centaur if I get a chance tho. Why does this game sometimes give you a glimpse at a bunch better character?

>>717630661 (OP)
Alliance can play as Man'ari now, which are omnicidal war criminals on a scale that mankind simply cannot imagine.

i just think spikes, tusks, wolves, axes, and heavy metal are rad, what can i say?

>>717633068
It's so fucking funny. The Horde have been bitching about Taurajo for 15 years. It's all they have. After their faction literally had Sylvanas trying to commit "omni-cide." She wanted to kill everyone. Horde, Alliance, and just random people.

>>717636885
You already can anon. Take the Single Player Project Pill.

>>717646223
>The Horde have been bitching about Taurajo for 15 years
And Alliance have been bitching about the Warcraft 3 TFT bonus campaign for 22 years. Alliance asspainery has a long, storied history.

>>717630661 (OP)
Humans in the alliance alone have done more heinous shit than the Horde collectively

>>717646628
Like?

>>717630661 (OP)
Alliance races are all boring

>>717633105
The elves ruin it

>>717633660
The horde isn't fascist or imperialist they're just no shoes nigger marauders
Empires aren't necessarily evil, in fact the grand proud Imperial aesthetic is actually appealing to most people

>>717646703
Alliancefags love to talk shit about the orcs being duped by the Burning Legion and yet one of those very orcs, as a disembodied spirit in a block of ice thousands of miles away, manipulated tons of humans into becoming death fanatics.

The Cult of the Damned only came into existence because Ner'zhul and Kel'Thuzad were able to appeal to the disgruntled peasantry who had it so bad that serving death itself and working towards the end of the world seemed preferable to continuing as things were.

>blizzard makes the horde muh dindu nuffin ackshually it's the [good guys] that are bad
>both sides feel like mockeries
>jew workshop makes chaos flat out unironic evil and proud of how violent and evil they are
>everyone likes it

>>717646923
Fuck off, Chud.

>>717646923
Orcs blew up their own planet. The Cult of the Damned did not do that. If you really want me to blow you the fuck out, I also just have to mention anything related to Sylvanas from 2018 onward. The Horde should not exist after Battle For Azeroth. I don't mean that as a meme. there's no logical reason why a faction that had a leader whose goal was "to kill everyone" should continue to exist.

>>717646703
-Everything Defias Brotherhood related
-Baited a hostile response from the Horde by attempting to build a mega trade route in the middle of Durotar to Dustwallow Marsh
-Allowed Kel'Thuzzad to practice necromancy in the Kirin Tor despite knowing he was forming the cult of the damned
-Did nothing when they found out about the Scholomance shenanigans
-Betrayed the High Elves during the 3rd war wrapup
-Betrayed the Dwarves during the 3rd War wrapup
-Alteraci and Gilnean kingdoms betrayed everyone during the second war
-Medivh in general
-Everything SI7 does
-Gilnean empire letting 2/3rd of their population die because they didn't want to bother helping with the Scourge
-Arthas in general
-Lordaeron watching everyone die because they didn't want to quarantine and investigate

The Horde has an identity crisis. Are they "noble savages" who want to be left alone to their own devices in their little crevices of the world? Are they monsters who kill and rape and eat everything in sight, destroying swaths of land despite a resource shortage? Are they honorable good guys and allies in times of crisis? Are they eternal victims who think their past mistakes, demon blood, undeath or self-destructive ways make them sympathetic? Are they bits of everything, while destroying an entire narrative in the game? This is the problem with WoW going on for so long.

>>717647041
>>717646923
And don't forget Camp Taurajo

Where's the guy that posts the hearthstome art comparing wc1 era art to it?

>>717647041
Yeah, no. The Horde still had a leader whose goal was "omni-cide." She wanted to kill everyone to "better the plans of the jailer."

>>717647014
I don't care about "lore" after Vanilla. In any case, the Cult of the Damned were working towards destroying the whole planet via undeath. Just because they failed doesn't mean they weren't trying.

what the fuck is this thread?
it would be hilarious to see the ip counter
this looks like someone is copypasting chatgptshit into the void

alliancesissies? our response!?

>>717647041
+Literally causing the entire Forsaken bad ending because they didn't even give the ambassador 2 seconds to explain they retained all their memories and were working on ways to cure the plague of undeath

>>717647167
>I don't care about "lore" after Vanilla

I mean you can't just pick and choose this stuff. It's incredibly retarded, but it happened. Also, the Cult didn't want to destroy Azeroth. It wanted to turn it undead. Undeath isn't total destruction. Arthas' plan was to have a unified Azeroth to take on the Legion. And considering the Legion was beaten through unity, that probably wasn't totally impossible on his part.

Being a war crminal is based, but horde is nowhere near that. They be stupid nigger boys who didndoo nuffin. Undeads are closer to that dark edgy vibe.

>>717631081
>tbc
>classic
consecrate yourself

>>717647184
That's bullshit. Even in Vanilla the Forsaken were doing heinous shit to totally innocent people. Let's also not forget that Sylvanas killed Garithos, who had trusted her, and followed through on helping her.

>>717635401
The entire Maelstorm is held open by the Horde

>>717633612
>Backstabs the alliance while they fight arthas's army
He nothing personal

>>717636736
Wut, all the important dungeons, the three that released last have Sylvanas doing shit in them

>>717647284
I actually can. I don't care that your introduction to Warcraft was through Battle for Azeroth or some shit, I don't give a shit about anything after Vanilla.

In any case,
>Also, the Cult didn't want to destroy Azeroth. It wanted to turn it undead. Undeath isn't total destruction.
Lmfao. Thank you for revealing that you have a double digit IQ. And then the appeal to nulore about what Arthas's "real plan" was LOL.

>>717647358
It's literally in the opening fly over introduction of the Forsaken.
Also the lore was after the Horde took in the Forsaken, their motives changed because now they 100% knew the Alliance would never take them back - the same people they considered kin and friend
Also Garithos tried to have Sylvannas, Kael'thas, and the Dwarven company killed multiple times in the campaign while keeping his human forces as far away from actual danger as possible

>>717639163
>Come on man, the dude is the brother of the Night Elf faction leader.
He was straight up exiled from his own faction before humies were a thing on the planet and exiled AGAIN before the Alliance was even formed
Stop trying to force shit retard

>>717647454
That was his plan in Wrath. Like, whatever, dude. You're sitting here and saying, "stuff that happened doesn't count cause I don't like it." And okay. They happened though.

>>717646096
>Alliance can play as Man'ari now
But why and how

>>717647170
>IP counter
Nah country flags and post ID's work better to see samefags and trogs.

>>717647465
No, even in Vanilla, the Forsaken were shady, and trying to create a plague that would kill everyone. The Forsaken were consistently always evil. The problem is, Blizzard has schizophrenia, and they do two things with them and the orcs: have them commit some horrible act, and then go, "but we are noble, and misunderstood."

Anyone who played WoW past Cata knows Blizzard has totally fucked over the Horde in terms of redemption stuff. Garrosh and Sylvanas makes them an irredeemable faction. They should not be in the game. They exist solely because they're a recognizable brand.

>>717647170
I envy XIV chuds, they never once have to even wonder what their non-sensical lore is about. Just cute girls doing funny things

>>717647517
Yeah, nobody cares about retail and everyone agrees the writing went to shit starting with TBC. (Hell, the writing that had to justify a lot of the decisions for Vanilla was shit, too. Undead on Horde, Night Elves on Alliance, etc.)

But yeah, trying to cover the world in undeath is the same as destroying it. The Cult of the Damned were working towards this goal before Arthas fused with the Lich King and became one. The nulore from Wrath about him taking control is retarded, gay, and worth dismissing, just like discussing anything that happened after patch 1.11.

>>717647621
it's all in game
you wouldn't get it

How are the horde war criminals when they are actively at war with the alliance? If anything the alliance have more directly stated war crimes against the horde like killing the undead emissaries on sight. This being before they even joined the horde. Both factions have several warfronts afterall they arent friendly.

>>717647620
Vanilla may be that, but we're discussing the entirety of the Lore, as in WC to WoW
The statement is - in the lore- the Alliance straight merc'd the ambassador of the Forsaken, whos plan was to explain that despite being undead, they still retained all their memories and loyalties and we're looking for a cure to the plague of undeath
You can try to paint it however you want, but Sylvannas did at least TRY to field the option that would best satisfy the wants of the undead humans.
When they killed the Ambassador, that's when shit went to evil mode

>>717647620
Oh fuck off, yeah the undead side is right but the orc side is more clear cut in that orcs aren't a singular unified nation and have lots of clans in them from day 1
Next you'll tell me North Korea has the same laws as Mexico or some shit
Hell, Garrosh is quite literally not even on our fucking planet when vanilla was the main thing

>>717647620
They don't space out the atrocities, and the Forsaken should've never been a playable faction. They also don't give the Alliance any nuance, they always feel like a babysitter faction with gloves on. From Vanilla it should've simply been Orcs, trolls, Tauren and goblins. Then ogres in TBC.

>>717647761
>the Forsaken should've never been a playable faction
I always liked the idea that they would be a nootral faction which was the original design for them

>>717630661 (OP)
>So, you're saying the Orcs fled to a different continent to make a new life for themselves?
>Fuck that! HOUND THEM TO THE ENDS OF THE FUCKING EARTH TO PUT THEM BACK IN CHAINS!
At some point, whatever wrong they do is the fault of humans. Yeah, I get that in Warcraft 1 they're just one-dimensional evil monsters, but during classic they just genuinely wanted to make a new start, and the Alliance was starting all kinds of shit for no fucking reason.
Orcs may be bad, but humans are disgusting in that universe too.

>>717647567
Questline added at some point, I think maybe Shadowlands? You go back to Argus and the Krokul introduce you to some Man'ari defectors who are penitent. They claim that they had little choice in following the Legion because Kil'jaden was always peaking into their minds and looking for potential traitors. Guessing that any traitors he found ended up executed or worse (like getting mooshed together into one of those Ur'zul things).

>>717647739
Before they sent that ambassador, Sylvanas killed Garithos, someone, who, despite being an asshole, was still in a leading position of the Alliance. That happened in Warcraft III. She fucked up first.

>>717647826
>Sylvanas killed Garithos
>>717647465

>next expansion is most likely going to shove a bunch of alliance characters into silvermoon and is going to focus on uniting the elves
Why did this game become so gay?

>>717647567
its just red draenei

>>717647851
I know what you wrote. That still does not change anything. Garithos helped Sylvanas, and wasn't in an actively antagonistic role with her. He wanted Lordaeron City, which Sylvanas DID promise him. But then she decided to kill him, and take the city for herself. That happened. That happened in Warcraft III. Blizzard likes to ignore it, because it was supposed to be a "fuck yeah, screw that asshole," moment. But then Blizzard wrote Sylvanas as being way more evil than Garithos ever was.

>>717647761
>the Forsaken should've never been a playable faction
The amount of factions that should have been non-playable is pretty big
>Night Elves
>Goblins
>Forsaken
>Pandaeran
>Dracthyr
>Whatever the fuck the stone dwarves are called
>Every other elf faction past Night Elf

>>717647620
>forsaken
The totally not sex slaves, experimentation on innocents, recruitment of necromancers that joined the scourge willingly. I'm probably forgetting a lot more stuff from vanilla and I heard blizz edited a lot of the forsaken's problematic stuff anyways.

>>717647871
there are no factions anymore
its just a fantasy world centered around elves because theyre the only races people play

>>717647871
Yep, finally reclaiming another alliance city
Fuck you green skin

>>717631971
If you see a woman and immediately fantasize about being cucked, I don't think americans are the problem.

Did you know all fel orcs are dead

why would you give a shit about wow lore after shadowlands
it basically fucked the entire setting in the ass

>>717647929
Garithos was a military leader of an Alliance force, he never had political presence, and even then it was to a now defunct kingdom - and he did so little in terms of "help" he might as well have just posted his name on a piece of paper with Sylvannas to carry in the battles
He was a moronic throwaway and voided his own requests by only trying to welch on his end of the deal via last person standing (Help us secure Lordaeron and drive out the scourge/legion)

>>717633660
>Californians kind of just overlook that the Horde are fascist, imperialist invaders. They're less civilized and organized into tribes which, to many retards, means that they MUST BE black/indigenous people, due to their innate bigotry
Then the entirety of /v/ must be Californians, because you people have been calling the Horde black and black-related racial slurs since the game first launched back in 2004.

>>717647945
>The totally not sex slaves
The don't procreate, and their human systems don't function
Fuck off with this weird fetish shit

>>717647087

>>717648097
>why would you give a shit about wow lore after shadowlands
After patch 1.11*

>>717641976
Hooves >>>>> feet

>>717648208
see
>>717647041

>>717648137
He and Sylvanas teamed up. They were on the same faction. Sylvanas killed him and betrayed him. An Alliance character in a leadership position. It's hypocritical to ignore this, and then blather on about Alliance killing "forsaken ambassadors." Years later, almost every negative thing possible about the Forsaken people could accuse them of, came true, by the way. They are an almost unsalvageable faction, and Blizzard currently essentially has given them no way of "reproducing," so they're all going to die out.

>>717630661 (OP)
Because playing as an evil zombie guy who kills and eats people is fucking badass, you limp-dicked tard

>>717648239
why start there who gives a fuck about the lore after wc1

>>717630661 (OP)
might makes right

>>717647620
>"but we are noble, and misunderstood."
I don't even think that applies to the forsaken.
They're often very spiteful and miserable, even the ones who are less war crime-inclined.
They're very open about their feelings toward the living, and they're not good.
It's just often excused/glanced-over because they're "powerful allies"

>BFA
>Jaina kills zandalari leader
>it takes entire raid to take her down
>but actually she doesn't lose and she just teleports away because we're a waste of time
Boy I just love being part of the horde
Also thrall cheated.

>>717633712
Unprovoked XD LEARN AT LEAST BASIC LORE FAGGOTS
GARROSH:DEATHWING HAS DESTROYED OUR WATER SUPPLY, NELF GIVE US WATER OR WE WILL COME AND FUCK YOUR WIFES
NELFS:LOL YOU GAY
GARROSH:OK THEN IT WAR NOW

I just like playing as undead characters.

Alliance players are pussies.

Varian declared war on the Horde during WotLK and Alliance cried so hard about it that Blizzard had to retcon it in a book so that Garrosh could be the aggressor

>>717648274
>He and Sylvanas teamed up. They were on the same faction
On condition to satisfy the mutual end with combined efforts
Instead he ditches Sylvannas to search elsewhere
He then allies with Kael'thas and then promptly abandons him and his forces for them to search elsewhere
Then on the most heavily predicted battle, he abandons Kaelthat AND Sylvannas to find the Dwarven company - who he then only directs to the battleground while him and his forces fuck off a 3rd time
Then when all 3 other factions have done the work - he tries to cash in on the Capital City - to whiich Sylvannas just mercs him
So you ultimately have a person who tries to outsource his goal 2/3 times to non-humans, does everything in his power to have them killed off so there isn't a big resistance when he ultimtely betrays them, and then is shocked when the strongest force catches on to his antics and kills him first

The original idea of the horde being a ragtag group of small tribes that would be driven to extinction otherwise is actually interesting. The fact they were edgy and evil, like the trolls still practicing cannibalism despite Thrall wanting to ban, helped created internal conflict.

Sadly it was doomed from the start. The balance necessary in a faction mmo like this meant that they had to be as powerful as the alliance, which created ludonarrative dissonance with how a bunch of murlocs could be a threat to them.
Then, like having the nelves in the alliance was dumb, so was the forsaken and the blood elves in the horde.
A strong narrative with Zul'jin could have saved the blood elves, but it was a failure.

The second problem is that A LOT of people who want to play horde want to play warcraft 2 instead of warcraft 3 horde, so you have this tension between "we are the good guys" vs "good savages. wow would have benefitted massively from a 3-4 faction system
>human/dwarf/gnome
>night elves
>orc/tauren/troll
>forsaken

And then you have the forsaken ally with some blackrock trolls so that warcraft 2 fans can be happy.

orcs are actually japanese
see the blademaster

>>717648616
Orcs are actually turkish
See the buildings and original shamans

I'm simply enjoying questing and raiding with my husband.

>>717648535
Yeah. Garithos is not a good person. Sylvanas still teamed up with him, and then killed him. And then cried when the Alliance showed hesitance towards giving her support. No one is saying Garithos is a good guy. A proper leader though knows maybe killing someone in a military position of some merit, that you sided with, isn't the smartest thing.

Warcraft is not Game of Thrones, but Sylvanas has consistently shown she is more confident than she is intelligent. The entire jailer plotline will inform you of that.

>>717648535
>>717648727
I mean holy fucking shit. Think about it. Sylvanas names her faction the Forsaken AFTER she betrayed someone who allied her. Then she has a speech about how she's gonna like, lead her people on her own... And then she tries to ally with the Alliance again? And then when that doesn't work, she sides with the Horde? And years later, the Forsaken prove to be nothing but a problem for the Horde, and peace? Maybe she's just a piece of shit?

>>717648645
Orcs are actually negroid
See the remains of draenor

>>717648527
This is what all these NOOBS who started playing the game in Legion are unaware of because the forums were already dead by this point. One of the major reasons the Horde were made to wear the retard pants and get hit with the villain bat is because ANY TIME the Alliance did anything aggressive, the Alliance playerbase would FLOOD the forums QQing about it.

A lot of people on here like to LARP that the Alliance is akshually the right wing and mature faction to play but back when the game actually mattered, the faction was largely filled with crybaby carebears who couldn't stand to see the Alliance do anything cool. Yes, there were Alliance players who wanted to see the Alliance be aggressive and take charge, but they were always drowned out by the rest of the Alliance fanbase.

Additionally, there were a ton of Horde players QQing about being the villains, but Blizzard never listened to them.

>>717648853
i never knew a negroid race that could conquer a european kingdom through force of arms. interesting.

Orcs weren't intended to be negroids, they were a mishmash of various warrior cultures like mongols and samurai.
They increasingly became "black" with the release of wow, and californian increased obsession with associating their slavery with historical american slavery.

It didn't help that in broader fantasy fanbase orcs are often associated with blacks due to being a violent, evil, race.

>>717648980
they can when the legion (kabalah) gives them steroids and weapons and the alliance is not expecting them and medivh (shabbos goy) summons them
once the alliance realized they exist and they are a threat they were still put in camps and sold as slaves

tauren are obviously native american
darkspear trolls are obviously jamaican
goblins are jews
zandalari trolls are africans stealing south american aesthetics
orcs actually have the least obvious parallels to real life

>>717648873
i dont think anyone disagrees with you. back in the day, everybody knew the alliance was the carebear faction and horde was full of edgy retards. "undead rogue" was a stereotype then, much like "human paladin" is a stereotype now. after garrosh got retard/villain-batted the overall sentiment was "we want the alliance to dismantle the horde". every complaint from the end of mop til now has been "why hasnt the alliance genocided the horde yet"

its unironically fascinating how the stereotypical internet nerd transitioned from being an enlightened fedora tipper to a full blown racist

>>717649129
the only thing that stopped the orcs from winning the second war was gul'dan betraying them. orgrim was basically days away from taking capital city when he had to abandon the siege to deal with gul'dan. orgrim intellectually outclassed his alliance counterparts every step of the way.

anyways you're retarded because the orcs were inspired by generic fantasy barbarians and metal album covers. that's why they wear horned helmets and use big axes instead of chucking spears like trolls do.

>>717649298
The problem is there really fucking isn't a reason why the Alliance hasn't dismantled the Horde at this point. It's not even the Alliance. The Jailer shit should have made every third party faction go, "jesus christ, just piss off. Garrosh first, now this bitch?"

>>717649274
>orcs actually have the least obvious parallels to real life
It's because they keep changing
>W1 and W2
Generic Barbarians
>W3
Generic Barbarians + a bit of native american + a bit of bushido
>Vanilla
Same as above but downplays the bushido and they live in not!Africa
>TBC
Oh shit the player base thinks they're nogs, better start adding in some African culture and make them brown

>>717649348
the orcs were chucking spears in orcs and humans though

>>717649298
The Alliance were allowed to win precisely because of the carebear whining that didn't allow for the Alliance to do bad things. The same reason the Alliance were gifted the victories is the same reason the Horde exists. If the Alliance fanbase now want the Horde to be dismantled, it's simply too late. There were years and years where Alliance players threw insane temper tantrums if an Alliance character did something remotely shady. Now they want to turn back the dial? Tough shit. They made their bed and now they have to lay in it.

>>717631382

Is this cuck shits? sauce pls

>>717630661 (OP)
If you played wc3 you'd know. Not sure why the disgusting rotting undead was even an idea for the horde though

>>717649515
>When the Vanir heard how the Æsir had welcomed Gullveig, they swore vengeance and began to prepare for war. Óðin, sitting in his high seat in Valaskjálf, saw the preparations, and soon the Æsir, too, prepared for war.
>Óðin cast his spear into the host of the Vanir. Thus, the first war began.

>>717649515
Bro needs that arcane intellect irl

>>717649531
neither faction is allowed to win because its a video game and shattering your giga cash cow by fucking over half your playerbase would be a monumentally retarded thing to do

>>717649563
cause they didn't really care about the story or lore and they needed 4 races per faction, so they just went with whatever

Tauren couldn't even actually physically wear totems until WoD btw

>>717649437
Warcraft III DEFINITELY had "they're black people" elements. Their whole slavery shit.

>>717649802
Nah that's just part of the Thrall's Moses deal.

>>717649802
Do burgers really think slavery only affected black people or something and there was no slavery in the history of humankind other than with africans

>>717631209
>horde has the objectively better end-game city and town placement for both pve and pvp, alliance has a better starting 1-30 experience
its the complete opposite. barrens and ashenvale is top tier for horde if you know the paths and the extra quests from major cities. Alliance cities themselves are usually better ordered inside compared to walking across the entire city in org to go from AH to smith

>>717649885
mostly, yes

>>717649802
slavery existed before the colonization of north america. ever heard of spartacus? ever heard of the barbary pirates? or the ottoman empire? there's even fantasy stories written in the 1920s and 1930s where white people are slaves.

>>717649885
the only slavery that they hammer in to our heads is niggers and kikes in egypt, whatever makes us feel more guilty. everyone else was having a fucking jolly picnic the whole time.

>>717646223
the difference is that the writers act like Camp Taurajo was justified, meanwhile every Horde warchief has been raided and killed for their crimes. Jaina literally sic'd the alliance on Camp T for no reason, and then got mad when she got nuked in return, and the writers act like she's the victim. Doesn't help that you've got Baine thanking the alliance for killing all those young tauren hunters.

>>717649885
>>717649953
Lord of the Clans, which was a point and click game that was supposed to come out before Warcraft III, has Thrall rising up against his white european style oppressors, and freeing his fellow orcish slaves.

Can't Imagine not playing as a Human.

>>717650018
Nah, this all starts with the Warsong logging Ashenvale for the second time.

>>717648262
You can pick pretty much any race and list out a bunch of shit they did wrong, like Thermaplugg fucking over the entire gnome race, or Gromm basically poisoning his people to kill a bunch of Night Elves and destroy their land. It's a completely different topic than the war crimes a collective group of multiple races willingly commits and never pays for, which is what's being discussed.

Not to mention shit like the Defias was caused by Onyxia using magic to influence the nobles to fuck over the workers. Or individuals like Arthas, Kel'Thuzad, and originally what Medivh did were hated and denounced by other humans, yet all the war crimes the Forsaken have ever committed are continuously accepted by the Horde.

>>717650058
Do you somehow think slaves have never risen against their masters and won
Did you also miss the part where every single legit nation and people in the history of mankind has been slaves and had slave states including anglos, turks, chinks, arabs and slavs

>>717650132
based level 5 npc

>>717650058
look up the Servile Wars and the Swedish slave revolts and prepare to have your mind blown

>>717635539
he's calling you a retard for claiming the "Illidan, Turalyon, and Velen team up to save the universe from the burning legion" expansion was horde focused.

>>717650165
No, but you're fucking being coy if you don't think a white guy in America writing about slaves being freed didn't have American black slaves as a point of reference somewhere on his mind. Come off it.

>>717650237
So you're saying an american really can't study or learn history and has to have blacks on his mind and nothing else ever

>>717650220
See >>717650237 Yeah, I'm sure the guy in Irvine, California, was thinking that first and foremost. The guy who named his self-insert "Go'el" (Goku + Kal-El).

>>717650237
>Sees blatant references to Exodus
>Hmm must be about black people

Is Jaina ever going to pay for her dalaran genocide? Attempted orgrimmar genocide? Unprovoked zandalari slaughter?
Just saying every horde leader paid the price for their crimes.

>>717650165
When did slavs find time to own slaves when they were slaves themselves for so long?
When were chinks slaves when they are surrounded by mountains and kept to themselves? Do you mean Manchuria?
When were turks slaves?

>>717649531
the alliance has never won. its an eternal stalemate that nobody is happy with. horde is allowed to be eternally evil villain aggressors, alliance can only react but never wipe them out. people have been clamoring for a story with alliance agency and villainy for 3x longer than the "golden era" of wow existed

>>717650275
No, but it's clearly going to be the first thing a white Gen X American writer is going to have as a point of reference. Especially Chris fucking Metzen.

>>717650305
Yeah, it's a reference to Moses too. Another basic bitch thing your average American is going to understand.

>>717650335
>When did slavs find time to own slaves when they were slaves themselves for so long?
Really nigga
>When were chinks slaves when they are surrounded by mountains and kept to themselves?
>When were turks slaves?
Both of these people had each other as slaves for like a 100 year period each

>>717630661 (OP)
better racials for pvp

>>717650237
The guys who made Warcraft were comic book nerds, metalheads, and D&D players, at a time where these activities were not accepted in normal society. By modern standards, their social views would be considered right wing today. California in the 80s was a much different place than today. These guys were referencing A Song of Ice and Fire in Warcraft 3 decades at a time when those books were being read by probably less than 3,000 people on the planet. They were obsessed with Frank Frazetta, Warhammer, super heroes, Conan, Bakshi's Fire & Ice, and niche fantasy stuff as well as old school pulp.

I don't think blacks were ever on their mind when they made this stuff. They lived in a much different world than we do today. YOU think about blacks more than they ever did, I guarantee it.

>>717650212
I just love White Men in a Non Homo way.

>>717630661 (OP)
Evil factions are necessary,otherwise the game would be boring

>>717650387
Yes really. I always hear about slavs being turk rape babies and slaves but I've never heard of them being the masters unless you count slav shithole 1 annexing slav shithole 2 as enslaving them
I can see turks enslaving some parts of the chinese outskirts at some point during the ottoman empire but when did chinks enslave the turks? it this something from 2000 years before christ?

>>717650237
What is this dumbass post?

>>717650478
Nah, fucking bullshit, dude. You're having a kneejerk reaction because you're worried I'm worshiping blacks or some shit. He's an American dude who wrote a story about slavery. Of course he was thinking about American slavery as a point of reference in his writing.

>>717650478
>I don't think blacks were ever on their mind when they made this stuff. They lived in a much different world than we do today. YOU think about blacks more than they ever did, I guarantee it.
Americans worship them. Just look at The Elder Scrolls and how they just had to include them while every other race gets ignored.

>>717650154
>not the heckin' trees, think of the trees!
logging isn't a warcrime, killing kids is.

>>717650514
Jesus, they really don't teach you guys any history huh
>Fucking talking about the ottoman empire when talking about the chinese and ignoring massive european history as muh slav shithole 1 vs slav shithole 2

>>717650556
I'm stating the obvious, but because I'm not immediately jumping to, "there were white slaves too!," I got a bunch of people sperging out at me.

>>717650512
Man don't even get me fucking started on the Charr.

>>717650567
No, it's not bullshit. I'm old enough to remember a time before negrolatry was widespread. I remember a time before blacks were heavily pushed as "the cool race," via proliferation of hip hop and basketball players. I guarantee that Metzen was more influenced by the fucking BIBLE than he was about fucking slavery. White guilt was not something that permeated nerd culture until recently. In the 80s, people lived normal lives and didn't go around obsessing about blacks like they did today. These guys were too busy playing D&D and snorting coke to care about black grievances, they were just going by rule of cool.

It's funny to think how everything in warcraft could've been solved by Genn Greymane just not being such a giant pussy and attacking Death Knight Arthas's army from behind BEFORE he sacked Silvermoon and revived Kel'Thuzad.

Say the word

>>717650606
Just give some examples and time periods already?
When did slavs enslave another race and which one?
When did the chinks enslave the turks?
When did turks enslave the chinks?
>country 1 expanding it's borders mean enslaving country 2
I guess USA expanding to Alaska and Hawaii means you own them as slaves then

>>717650714
In what era do you think the people currently in charge of woke shit were raised anon? You're crazy if you think this brainwashing wasn't already happening decades ago.

>>717650714
black people have been enormously important to america's culture for ages, though to your point it was less totalising than today

>>717650714
No, you're being ridiculous. An American growing up in the 80s, after the civil rights movement, writing a story about slavery, is going to have American slavery as a main point of reference in what they're thinking and talking of. I'm not saying there weren't other considerations.

>>717650604
Trespassing and property destruction are
>killing kids is.
Not when they're animals.

>>717630661 (OP)
for the same reason that people play GTA games where you literally play a scumbag criminal: They themselves are scumbags. It's that simple. You don't need a PhD to figure this out. Shitty people don't turn their character off when they enter a game, they still want to be pieces of shit while gaming.

>>717650864
kek

No, you just don't understand, we just play Geneva checklist challenge. What wrong with that?

>>717634180
The first time I ever got ganked was the other mountain zone above the Barrens that nobody goes to. Dude camped me for at least an hour and I seethed so hard I almost quit. Based Redridgepwnr giving that experience to Allies.

>>717650825
>An American growing up in the 80s, after the civil rights movement, writing a story about slavery, is going to have American slavery as a main point of reference in what they're thinking and talking of.
I'm an American who was alive during this time period and I'm telling you that's not true. The nerd community back then was much more resilient to this stuff, there were zero black nerds around this time period and their biggest exposure to blacks at this point in time would've been the rare one in comic books or popular musical artists like Prince or Michael Jackson, but again, these guys were metalheads.

They were reading Karl Edward Wagner and L. Sprague de Camp and smoking weed and blasting Sabbath. Their thoughts were of Mordor and the Hyborian Age, they weren't concerned about the plights of blacks when they were hot-blooded 20 year old men. It just wasn't how people acted or thought back then, especially not guys who spent all day with their heads in White Men Being Heroic Badass stories.

>>717651113
No. Chris Metzen definitely knew about black people, and American slavery. You are jumping through hoops to try and deny something really stupid and basic, because the current culture war stuff is garbage.

>>717630661 (OP)
have you even watched the wow intro cinematic? the undead is cool as fuck

>>717651276
Yeah, I mean of course he knew about that stuff. I just really, really, really doubt it affected his writing or creative endeavors. I would chalk it up more to a mixture of the Bible and heavy metal and Conan the Barbarian. American blacks were gifted their freedom after whites killed each other. The Warcraft orcs took back their own freedom - this is something that would be right at home in a metal song or a Conan the Barbarian story. It's reminiscent of Conan strangling the king of Aquilonia in his own throne room. It's the will to power. Taking control of your destiny and fighting authority. It's metal, it's punk rock, it's all the kinds of things that a fantasy nerd in the 80s would draw from.

If American slavery was a huge motivating factor, the orcs would've been given their slavery after the humans fought a bloody war over it. It's more so that Thrall (which Metzen stated is inspired by BOTH Moses AND Marvel's Thor) is having a Spartacus moment and taking control of destiny by force. The gay, weepy "atonement for our sins" stuff comes much later in the story when Metzen and the other guys have aged and gotten more libtarded.

>>717651113
>Their thoughts were of Mordor and the Hyborian Age,
Conan stories are full of blacks thoughbeit

>>717651659
As villains and obstacles to overcome

>>717651548
I'm not saying there weren't other influences, but Chris Metzen isn't exactly the most nuanced writer. Moses? Yep. Probably raised with some basic Christian values. He's a guy born in the 70s in the US. Slavery? The first thing any American is going to think about as a point of reference, especially prior to the internet, is going to be blacks. Dude was three when Roots came out. He was taught this shit.

>>717633105
>Other Horde races in Orc armor
SOUL

>>717650018
Camp Taurajo was housing and training horde soldiers, and the commander in charge of the attack let as many civilians escape as possible. Compare that to the attack of Brennadam which the horde conveniently forgot about.

>>717651689
They're his crew in the Belit story, they're also wise witchdoctors from time to time.

Why is the horde the war crime faction tho?
Lorewise the alliances races did way worse crimes overall. Its just that we dont see that in the game.
Nightelves brought the first demons to azeroth and committed genocide on their own, who didnt share their ideals.
Humans and Highelves attempted genoicde on all trolls for the wrongdoing of 1 tribe of trolls. Also they attempted to eradicate the forsaken and they tried to enslave all orcs and used them for their amusement like gladiators.
Also humans purged Dalaran and Stratholme.
Draenei literally btfo and fled from the legion and left everyone, who didnt make it in time, to die.
The only races within alliance that did nothing or only minor stuff are gnomes (did nothing) and dwarves (stealing relics and some spying).
On horde side only trolls and tauren are mostly clear of any crimes (did Tauren ever do any warcrimes at all?).
But yeah even with the events of the game over the last 20 years, lorewise nightelves are the most fked up.

I love reading these threads and seeing how many people completely ignore or try to rewrite the story of the game to prove they're right in whatever fagtastic argument they're in.

>>717652542
I cannot imagine caring even slightly about WoW lore in the first place. The devs don't even care about keeping it consistent or make any sense from expansion to expansion. The game cannot even onboard new players into the story because of how nonsensical and contradictory it is.

i think we can all agree the alliance needs more warcrimes or at least some war

Is this accurate, Alliancechads?

>>717630661 (OP)
Love my orc
Love fucking elves
Simple as

>>717633678
>>717651853
>20 years later
>STILL not accepting that blood elves belong in the horde

>Play on Horde
>Highly skilled Chads play as Orc Female, Blood Elf Female Paladin or Undead Male
>Blood Elf Male is possibly a potsmoker or a Balkan
>Midwits are Trolls
>Full retards are Tauren Male

>>717652993
kek so true about the orc female
its always some effortmaxxxing gamer pushing it to the limit

>>717652841
>Is this accurate, Alliancechads?
No. A good racial can give you a massive edge against most players. The difference playing an alliance warlock vs a horde warlock was a night and day difference.
I could play around 1 fear break pretty easily. But if they had both wotf and pvp tricket i was fucked. Compare that to horde and most 1v1s felt like autowins with the potential to 1v3 people if nobody had a fear break.

>>717652993
>tfw belf male
>tfw balkan
got me there

>>717653345
Please explain why you Balkans play as Blood Elf Male. You guys are good at WoW though.

>>717652841
If I had to give a definite answer, no. Racials were a massive crutch, especially in older versions. Yes skill always beats no-skill, regardless of the players characters. But with both PvP and PvE cases the edge a good racial gives is literally make or break. I'll still play night elf priest though, disadvantages be damned.

>>717653094
But Shadowmeld is amazing Racial with High IQ

>Can surprise attack or defend against Horde on Battlegrounds particularly Arathi Basin and Alterac Valley.
>Can be a group saver against deadly patrols on dungeons
>Can eat and drink safely without extra pulls on levelling

>>717630661 (OP)
I wouldn't mind play good guys if alliance wouldn't look like Disney fraction.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0h1MmwGM294

Horde chuds come home. Alliance is the true Chad faction

>Beatiful women: Humans, Night Elves
>Aesthethic cities and beatiful music (video related)
>People help each other more than on Horde

>>717652706
>>717652542
I don't understand why people are so reluctant to admit that they play wow for the gameplay

>>717650323
Jaina is orc owned

>>717645446
Originally baine had a part in the high mountain tavern plotline and had hints of a romance with their leader. Alliance said they didn't feel comfortable palling around with a horde leader so he was cut entirely. Luckily legion was otherwise totally neutral.
>MALFOORION WHEAR IS MY BELOVID

>>717630661 (OP)
Why would anyone wanna play as the boring, middle-aged, balding Timmy?

>>717654176
>MALFOORION WHEAR IS MY BELOVID
What the fuck was up with that accent anyway

>>717649928
>1-30
nigger im talking about actually playing the game, not speedrunning 1-60 on your 12th character going from brown shithole zone #3 to red shithole zone #4 is not enjoyable
>cities
im talking about their placement in the world relative to pvp hotspots and raids
and also if you try to defend stormwind or darn or ironforge design for efficiency as better than tb you're retarded

Alliancefags will seriously complain about the Horde, then clam up when it becomes obvious for the 702430th time the Horde isn't allowed to be anything other than Red Alliance. Horde isn't allowed to have Garroshes or Sylvanases, who Horde players (but not Alliance ones) responded to positively. Horde players are not allowed to play the actually evil faction. Instead they have to follow this enormous faggot Thrall and other characters who have identical thoughts and opinions to whatever boring faggots are leading the Alliance, and everyone who doesn't fit in with that mold dies.

Then when the question "Why are the writers doing that?" pops up, it funnels back into Alliancebabs crying on the official forums.

>>717654397
I will never take anti-Horde posting seriously when the Alliance have shit their diapers for years begging for "high elves" i.e. fucking blood elves with different colored eyes AND THEN THEY ACTUALLY GOT IT.

>>717654397
No one complained about Garrosh. Garrosh is a based Orc like the Warcraft 2 Orcs. That's what Alliance players wanted from Horde, being an evil faction

Most Orc players are WC2 Orcs in Classic WoW, rape and pillage. So it fits like a charm that Garrosh finally became a warchief. Thrall is Chris Metzen's worst idea.

nta but elf supremacy (objective reality from both aesthetics and player count) does usually cause seething so at least you're not alone!

>>717654553
>No one complained about Garrosh.
If we're shamelessly making shit up then all Alliance are Pamperchu irl

>>717654578
both female neflies and belfies are super sexo but I slightly prefer neflies

>>717652993
>Male Orcs: average joe, like humans
>Female Orcs: Desperately wish they were playing alliance humans, will re-roll belf when switching to tbc
>Male Trolls: Peak Midwit
>Female Trolls: trans, and they all have that one face, will re-roll belf when switching to tbc
>Male Forsaken: LET THE BODIES HIT THE FLOOOOOOOR
>Female Forsaken: might actually be grill in real life, but probably trans
>Male Tauren: The dumbest cats around
>Female Tauren: might actually be a milf in real life

>>717653845
>Beautiful women: Humans, Night Elves
Both owned by Orcs and Tauren though

>>717653094
Arena is cross-faction now.
>>717652841
It depends on what you want to achieve and how hardcore is the playerbase compared to you.
I have a couple of 100 parses in Cata Classic, and it would be impossible if I played Alliance - not because of the racial, but because I would not find 9 good players to parse with. However, if a million rich, hardcore teenagers played WoW, I would have no chance of obtaining gold parses even on Horde character. It's not just your racial - you need luck, calculations, millions of pulls, 9 people to dance around you (I had 2 warlocks and 2 mages, and the player who currently has the world record had 7 locks, if I paid $100 to each player, I could have the world record by now).
What if parsing doesn't interest you? Can you perhaps get an Realm First as an alliance character? Or speedrun a raid? Probably not, because there are too few realms, but being first Alliance guild? Yes, and you can brag about it too, because it's prestigious. It's just difficult to find enough people.

>>717654835
>Desperately wish they were playing alliance humans

I was Orc Female Warrior on TBC Classic. I wanted to play on Alliance but my friends rolled on Horde. How did you know?

Yep, still hate Orgrimmar.

>>717654835
Male Orc players are average at best or full retard but in a really funny way. I can't explain it. Sometimes a retard male orc wipes the group but in a funny, ironic way. No way it was intentional

Female Undead are girls yes, but ugly ones. Attractive women play as Blood Elf Females.

Male Tauren are full retard and possible brainrot from too much weed.

>>717654835
>Male Humans: peak midwit
>Female Humans: High IQ Chads
>Male Night Elves: Full Retard or some WoW veteran playing it as ironically for memes.
>Female Night Elves: Best Hunters, Priests and Druids. Some attractive women play as them too.
>Male Dwarven: Dad gamers or Eastern Europeans
>Female Dwarven: schizos but good at vidya.
>Male Gnome: rude
>Female Gnome: tranny or a girl

>>717630661 (OP)
Americans worship criminals.

Look at Hollywood movies and shows, all the most popular movies are shit where they outright romanticizes criminal lowlives

>>717654457
We want high elves
>ok we bent the lore six ways from Sunday to get you these cool Dracula void elves, they've got their own unique aesthetic and-
Noooooo we want high elves
>jeez ok we stripped out all the cool voice effects they had and gave you all the basic bitch regular elf customisation so you can play-
NOOOOOO WE WANT HIGH ELVES

>>717655596
Okay so just give them fucking high elves, literally no one asked for this void shit.

>>717655697
Nah.

>>717655316
>Male Night Elf played by a veteran.
Accurate. I've seen Male NE Hunters and Rogues on WPVP killing Horde like it was nothing. Best dungeon tanks were ironically Deep Prot NE Male Warrs.

>Playing WoW post-WoTLK unless you are a Raid / Arena fag
>Having a serious lore discussion after WoTLK

Why are retail players living on copium? Why is it so embarrassing to admit that they play the game solely for end game content?

Wpvp died due to alliance.
>BFA introduces bitch mode I mean war mode, where PvP servers cease to exist instead there's this opt in system that can only be switched at the capital of the faction
>alliance PvP participation plummets
>introduce triple the rewards for playing with pvp on if you're alliance, war mode rewards is still referred to as a horde exclusive racial bonus
>beg one last time, offer the most powerful gear currently available in game for simply doing a bit of killing with PvP on
>alliance turn it on for precisely the amount of time it takes to get the op shit and then go back to complaining
>blizz gives up and stops the PvP event in the next patch

>>717656016
WPVP died due to Arena and Flying Mounts. Nobody gives a shit about WPVP after Classic. The only WPVP you get in TBC and WoTLK is some Male Orc killing Alliance on Stormwind Bank. Occasionally some Orc player griefs at Summoning Stone.

>>717656114
>Nobody gives a shit about WPVP after Classic.
Holy cope

>>717651863
>Camp Taurajo was housing and training horde soldiers
and by that you mean it was a high school for hunters.
>and the commander in charge of the attack let as many civilians escape as possible
with no food or soldiers to protect them, into the untamed wilderness, yeah women and children tend to do great in that kind of environment. Did i mention the region is plagued with hostile centaur, quillboars, and bug monsters, and that's all BEFORE the cataclysm got involved.

>>717656012
>raid/arenafag
a fate worse than death. Imagine being an unpaid worker in an amazon warehouse

>>717656016
>blizzard hates white people so much they turn sw into detroit overnight
>"we should listen to the 35 y.o raider who lives on stream donations and gibs and is about halfway becoming a tranny."
>obviously anyone who is sane quits the rest are the faggots who farm gold for a living and trannies with no skill IRL
>breadtubers makes videos why people quit
>not a single one mentions tigole and his raid autism, and how the rot started in TBC, or how kotick deliberately replaced whites hetero males with any goober he found ont the streets
>entry level triple digit IQ redditors trying to decipher it with mtx being the true fault, just like in that picture.
>FF years into now
>"p-please play alliance so I can camp you, don't quit I have way too many hours in this game!"

And now horde is the globohomo dream of low IQ, trannies, and whatever the fuck chinks and the rest of the glipglops playing their single player mmo, doing their humiliation rituals, while either grooming or being groomed on discord.

>>717656114
I played on a pvp server in TBC and I can say with certainty that farming motes of air was the most annoying fucking thing cause I'd get attacked constantly

>>717656626
>>blizzard hates white people so much they turn sw into detroit overnight
And how exactly it's supposed effect Alliance? Alliance players don't care about Stormwind, they all gathering in Goldshire Inn

>>717647041
None of this would have happened if the fucking ORCS stayed on their own planet.

>>717656882
Not according to Caverns of Time ;3

>>717656650
>TBC Classic PVP
>Play as Orc Tank Warrior
>Go to Shattrah and emote Alliance Warrior Tanks to follow me outside of Shattrah for 1v1 PVP
>Alliance and Horde players watch as bystanders when 2 Tank warriors fight for 3-5 minutes without interference.

What did they mean by this?

the alliance had concentration camps with orcs in them

>>717656908
Kinda weird to say "all things must be"

Completely removes the criminal aspect because by the laws of the universe it would happen, so by that end noone does wrong

>>717656986
>dragons who tasked with watching over time
>Kinda weird to say "all things must be"

>>717656970
Yeah, that was horrible. They should have executed them all, now their children pay the price.

>>717650154
ACKshually, the Cata warfare started with the Twilight's Hammer false-flagging Warsong/Night Elf aggression which led to the Garrosh/Cairne duel.

>>717656970
>Decades of war, genocide, rape and pillage by Orcish H*rde in Warcraft 1&2
>Destroy the Dark Portal to repel the invasion
>Blackrock Clan still raping and pillaging at the start of Warraft 3
>Admiral Proudmoore for being in the wrong for not letting H*rde having a stronghold on Durotar after decades of genocide.

I hate Chriz Metzen so much.

>>717655316
>>Female Humans: High IQ Chads
Nah Female Humans are peak midwits too, they just more arrogant and actually think they're good at the game.

>>717657071
Arent they making sure time isnt fucked with? Like they gotta make sure some woman is brutally raped and flayed because some stupid time bullshit.

Look, I really dont want to continue this discussion because time travel is fucking gay.

>>717657176
Who are the high IQ chads of Alliance players then? Night Elf Males? Are skilled Alliance players purposefully playing on worse faction then?

>>717631382
Only female night elves can fuck female night elves.

>>717657262
>High IQ Chads of Alliance

Male Night Elf Druids, Priests and Rogues
Female Dwarf Hunters, Paladins and Tank Warriors
Male Fury Warrior

>OK Anduin, this is your one big shot to make peace with the Forsaken.
>Sylvanas even agreed, nobody will bring any funny business to this convocation.
>*smuggles Calia Menethil in to start a rebellion*

>I'll hunt you to the ends of the earth if I have to! Do you hear me? To the ends of the earth!
What did he mean by this? The planet is called Azeroth.

>>717630661 (OP)
Ever since I played the old lotr strategy game where you could play a campaign as the villains, I fell in love with orcs and goblins. Ugly ones, hot ones, anime ones, doesn't matter. I just love orcs, trolls and goblins.

Though I wish Blizzard would've fully embraced the war-criminal or noble savage shit they did for The Horde instead of the schizo shit they became.

Why didn't Arthas explain to Uther The Undead Scourge infected the grain supply in Hearthglen and possibly Stratholme's supplies as well?

>H-how can you even consider that!? t Uther

>>717657164
>I hate Chriz Metzen so much.
>let's pretend Warcraft was not Metzen's personal project

>>717630661 (OP)
A lot of people enjoy being evil, the only reasons they aren't IRL is because they don't believe they can get away with it. A lot of people out there are absolute monsters who would rape and murder for fun if they got the opportunity.

>>717657851
Chris Metzen ruined Warcraft lore with his Thrall worship.

>>717657862
Socrates ova' here.

Because Alliance are a bunch of fags who caused 90% of the settings problems.

>Dreanai super charged the Burning Legion, they are also directly responsible for the Orcs drinking demon blood
>Elves summoned the Burning Legion to Azeroth....because the queen wanted some BTC. They also spawned Worgen
>Dwarfs summoned Ragnaros, destroying a large chunk of the Eastern Kingdoms
>Humans summoned the Orcs. The undead are because of humans.

Fuck the alliance pig dogs.

>>717657904
Metzen created Warcraft in the first place.

>>717657975
>>717657904
Metzen started to write shit stories when he stopped doing cocaine.

>Vanilla Private Server PVP
>Play as Alliance
>20% Alliance pop ratio
>H*rde being super aggressive and invading Stormwind daily
>H*rde getting BTFO always in WPVP without numbers advantage

Most H*rde players are far less skilled than an average Alliance player. The meme that skilled players are on H*rde are a small minority.

>>717657973
And most importantly, fuck their females

>>717657580
I don't even need to read this to know it would sound like I was reading a reddit post made by a 32y.o amateur writer who made his AO3 account 5 weeks ago.

>>717657164
>wow orcs just wanted a fresh start bro, just let them be, they're not hurting anyone!
>what could possibly go wrong if we let them do whatever the fuck they want on another continent?
>also ignore that night elves live there and the dindu horde instantly started fighting them for resources

>>717657973
WoD nullified Orcs demon dindu excuse thoughever.

>>717657693
The planet is made out of elemental earth.

>>717657262
Same as horde, you won't find a race/gender combo that is defined by being high IQ; they're just aren't enough high IQ players. Closet you'll get are male night elves who either high iq or the second dumbest combo after male tauren (fuck those guys are dumb).

>>717658105
>>also ignore that night elves live there
But Night Elves never settled in Durotar, Barrens or Azshara.

>>717658065
>start playing WC3 again
>shocked by how pretty Jaina is
Damn, I'd gotten way too used to hag Jaina

>>717658216
Nelves have always been in Azshara. You even get to kill them in cata.

>>717658237
Milf Jaina, best Jaina

>>717658029
You're close to figuring it out, but it's moreso that any server with a clear faction majority will have it reinforced by a thick padding of clueless tagalongs going with the flow while those with the will to stay with the underdogs are naturally a cut above. PvP servers tend to see more Horde majority because of the mistaken idea that they have "PvP racials", when that really isn't the case until Arenas are a thing, battlegrounds are focused around objective control which actually favors Alliance if they understand the strengths of Paladins in being able to stall out even the most overrun points with no counterplay.

>>717658176
>male tauren (fuck those guys are dumb).
>pothead friend of mine
>Rolled Tauren Male Feral DPS Druid on TBC
>went full schizo rant when no one invited him on Heroics or raids

The only good Tauren Male players I have seen are Tank Warriors but even then a midwit Troll Male Warrior is superior or a D-tier Tank Warrior, Undead Male.

Make Peacecraft not Warcraft!

>>717658284
>Nelves have always been in Azshara.
They never had any settlemetns of Night Elves in Azshara.
>You even get to kill them in cata.
Yeah because they threw a tantrum about orcs lubmering trees in Azshara instead of Ashenvale.

>>717658323
you can just say you hate druid players bro. it's weird how hung up you are on "male" tauren. is it because all the female tauren play healer druids and you're okay with healer druids or something?

It's a night elf world and you're just living in it.

>>717630661 (OP)
How's the faction war going these days, lorewise? Have they given up on it yet after fumbling it in BfA?

>>717658339
Strange how there were all these villages for Illidan to destroy in Azshara back in that game you never played.

>>717658441
Night Elves are just Trolls mutated by Titan magic.
Azeroth is a Troll world. Every other race has origins based off world. Goblins might be an exception depending on if they ever explained what the fuck Kazarite was

>>717658339
>They never had any settlemetns of Night Elves in Azshara.
Yes there are, see Talrendis Point. And again, in wc3 you see that it's inhabited by nelves.
Nelves simply lost another ancestral territory there, just like they lost ashenvale. Because Tyrande is too weak to Orc men.

>>717658285
>Horde losing Alterac Valley when a Shadow Night Elf Priest / Hunter surprise attacks them with Shadowmeld racial guarding a checkpoint
>Horde can't push forward due to Holy Paladin's infinite mana pool
>Horde going full Jihad mode with Mages doing kamikazi arcane explosion to break the barrier only to be futile effort

>Horde Shamans being retards don't know how superior Water Walking is on Arathi Basin
>Horde losing automatically Arathi Basin if a Night Elf defending a checkpoint with Shadowmeld.

>>717658505
BFA was basically the end of the horde. Factions don't have their own questions anymore and everyone defaults to following the alliance NPCs since they're still alive.

>>717658537
Trollpaganda.

>>717658542
Night Elf Smite Priests on Turtle WoW are pretty hilarious, they got a range increase that combined with their PvP gloves lets them outrange Hunters with Smite.

>>717658514
But I did played the WC3 TFT campaign, which been partially retckoned again and again. So either you stick to WoW lore while discussing what hapenned in WoW, or dismantle it completely because since the Vanilla WoW violated core idea of the WC3 RoC

>>717658606
BFA has the Horde winning in Kalimdor and the Alliance bowing to them, so I fail to see how it's the "end of the Horde".

>>717658167
Sure, but that's relatively unknown outside of Orc and Tauren cultures. Why would Arthas be a student of that nonsense?
Also it's made up of ALL elementals. Earth is not a synonym for Azeroth.

>>717657767
>We're too late, these people are all infected with the plague.
He was sleepy and couldn't speak too well, but he did try. It's on Jaina for not backing him up in words or deeds.

>>717658682
Even in WoW lore nelves have a foot there.
https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Talrendis_Point

And WoW lore constantly retcons itself and references wc3.

>no anvil in darnassus
what were they smoking?

>>717658693
I'm talking about the end of BFA, the horde lost all its leaders, gave up all territorial gains from the start of the war and haven't had a single notable action that wasn't alliance directed since.

>>717658747
>https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Talrendis_Point
>Talrendis Point is a large night elven outpost

>>717654578
Post Blizzard's newer version of this image :^)

>>717658606
I really wanted to like that expansion but man did they fuck up with Sylvanas and other characters. How hard is it to setup a scenario where both both faction percieve the other as the one in the wrong? They kinda did it with Broken Shore intro where Alliance PoV had Varian abandoned and killed while Horde PoV showed them being overrun and forced to retreat after Vol'Jin gets stabbed.

Instead it became Sylvanas obviously bad and everyone follows her because reasons except muh Saurfang.

>>717658749
>no engineering trainer in Thunder Bluff, even though the cows have windmills and elevators
I know they added one later, I'm talking about vanilla.

When are we night elves gaining a new world tree on Azeroth? We need a big tree.

>>717630661 (OP)
It's not a war crime if you have a fun time.

>>717658797
They lost Sylvanas, which is an undead elf.
>gave up all territorial gains from the start of the war
Nope Horde owns Kalimdor entirely now, including Ashenvale and Darkshore is a blighted shithole.

>>717658542
>Warsong Gulch
>NE Warrior guards Flag room with Shadowmeld
>Lonely Horde Rogue / Druid gets Charged and Hamstringed after taking Alliance Flag
>Horde player seething on anger, spends his time killing the warrior than moving forward.

Shadowmeld is so good in Battleground it's not even funny. Russian Pre-Made Alliance groups are hard to beat when it's nothing but NE or Gnome players mostly.

I wish Kael'Thas became the belf leader. Lor'Themar just doesn't have that pull.

>>717658947
Vanilla darn has to be the most cucked capital.

>>717659053
Kael'Thas would rather die than joining the Horde

>>717656542
Noshoes lives don't matter. They're alien invaders. In fact, humanity in Warcraft is incredibly pussified, I can guarantee you, that medieval humanity, think 15th or 14th century, if they were faced with the orcish orde invading them and razing their cities, subsequently defeating them and seeing them fall into lethargy, they would have executed them all down to the last elderly orc and child, instead of playing lost tribes of Israel with them via concentration camp simulator.

>>717630661 (OP)
>Why would anyone want to play the war criminal faction?
I don't give a fuck, I can't be a marauding war criminal in RL so I want to be it in a game. I hate elves

>>717659115
>Kael'Thas would rather die
Well he eventually did it while LiterallyWhomar united remaining elves on Azeroth and remained heterosexual character.

>>717659064
Oh, for sure. Night Elves have the worst 1-20 in vanilla by far, and escaping it is a pain in the ass, too.

>>717659115
Eh, could've just written something about it like they did with so many other things. I just think Lor'Themar is boring desu.

>>717659053
>TBC lore
>Blood Elf are nearly exctinct race and still divided to 4 groups: Lor Themar (Horde), Kael Thas (Burning Legion), Illidari and Scryers.
>Draenei main leader, Velen being on Alliance when sole purpose is to defeat Burning Legion and not being part of petty Alliance / Horde rivalry

The Alliance having Broken Draenei would have made more sense lore wise. They hate Burning Legion and Orcs. Automically good guys despite being Shamanistic.

>>717659064
It's actually quite a nice capital, but the bank is too damn far from the auction house. Ironforge is peak though. Shame world buffs destroyed its position as the alliance capital.

>>717659064
Darnassus is a nice place.

>>717658929
It's easy to spot that everything after the opening of BFA had a completely different writing team who scrapped the planned plot and ran in a different direction.
>trailer shows Jaina raising her dad's ship off the ocean floor, guided by a mysterious boatman who is revealed to be daelins ghost, ends in "I'm listening now father" this never comes up again and the unique daelin model is used for one dream sequence startle
>Sylvanas is shown to have grown tired of the constant slow bleed of the people she was sworn to protect, and have concluded that a final war that neither side can back down from is the only way any peace can last, horde leaders resent her but ultimately conclude she's correct
>completely flipped to retread MoP and now she's working for some big bad unknowable evil because that's easy to write without having to go into detail

>>717630661 (OP)
Tauren are cool and I like the whole indian and nature focus they have or rather had before the horde was ruined in cata.

>>717646904
The Horde is objectively a fascist government. It hits every single marker and criteria for one. It's a hypernationalist, militarized, authoritarian government in which the leader rules with a cult of personality and there's a distinct feeling of nostalgia and desire to reclaim former glory (either from the First Horde or from before the demonic corruption depending on who you ask).

Empires aren't necessarily evil, true. I wasn't mentioning that the Horde is fascist as an excuse for why they're irredeemably evil, just mentioning that they should realistically go against everything the writers should stand for but don't because the writers see them as black people. So it's okay if they're hypernationalist and jingoist. Those traits are really cool for a faction but the writers pussify the Horde out of them while trying to make them the good guys which makes neither side happy.

>>717659121
>edieval humanity, think 15th or 14th century, if they were faced with the orcish orde invading them and razing their cities, subsequently defeating them and seeing them fall into lethargy, they would have executed them all down to the last elderly orc and child, instead of playing lost tribes of Israel with them via concentration camp simulator.
>meanwhile IRL

>>717659210
Satyrs could have worked to, since a race as ugly as the broken would really be played. Really anything is better than the Eredar retcon.

>>717659239
>It hits every single marker and criteria for one.
Nope it doesxn't since Horde didn't reached industrial society.

>>717659281
What's this supposed to showcase? An ottoman client state fighting on their side because they turned all their kids into janissaries? Why don't you showcase the Siege of Malta instead?

>>717658958
Nah canonically the night elves, reeling from a "genocide" and unsupported by the greater alliance forces, completely pushed horde out of darkshore and retook most of ashenvale. Also tyrande got a DBZ power up. Alliance got a stranglehold on arathi and lordaeron wasn't reclaimed for years so EK was mostly just silvermoon.

>>717630661 (OP)
Because the horde feels more like a brotherhood than the alliance

>>717659230
I agree in a way. Music is nice, atmosphere is nice, but no anvil, no engie and blacksmithing trainers

>>717659296
I remember everyone on HS wanted to play as Broken Draenei Rogue / Warrior solely for Akama in Frozen Throne. My high school buddies were speechless when Blood Elves were introduced on Horde.

>>717659359
>Why don't you showcase the Siege of Malta instead?
Because Nicopolis was more hillarious. Due to the Serbain knights fighting against crusaders.
Besides, both are proving my point. None fought Ottomans to their complete extermination.

>>717659239
The same can be said of the alliance, varian was definitely militarised and authoritarian, there was a distinct cult if personality around him as he commanded the other alliance leaders who were all without exception far longer lived and presumably wiser, and I think the only race not looking to reclaim former glory is the dwarfs. It's fascists vs fascists.

>>717658403
>you hate druid players bro
I hate any Druid players who specs as DPS equally. I have nothing but upmost respect for Tanks and Healers. Whenever I see a Balance Druid or Feral Druid I see a player who isn't smart enough to play as Mage or Warrior DPS because he desperately wants to feel wanted by having Moonking Aura or Leader of The Pack so mommy guild officer invites him to a raid.

>>717659178
Lorthemar looks like he's fucking baked, thalysra looks like a party mask.

>>717659546
>None fought Ottomans to their complete extermination.
Yeah, because the ottomans didn't fall over unconscious after their invasion had failed and remain still where they fell. Invasions were launched into their heartlands but maintaining presence there and continuously purging them was too costly given the effort it took and how much could go wrong along the way. Ottomans didn't come from a single fucking dark portal that could be destroyed to halt their advance. You're comparing the logistics of warring between established planetary civilizations versus an invading alien force.

>>717654835
>Female Tauren: might actually be a milf in real life
I accidently catfished so hard back in the day

>>717658958
Sylvanas, Saurfang, Rastakhan. Compared to alliance losses of... minus two Proudmoores (one came back icky though so he got thrown back into the drawer) Also abolished the concept of having a warchief entirely. Can't blame them with their mortality rate.

>>717659731
>Sylvanas
Not Horde
>Saurfang
Okay
>Rastakhan
Not Horde

So you lost a bunch of "horde" leaders vs conquering Kalimdor entirely. Orcs only care about cutting trees and fucking fem nelves and on these points it was a total Horde victory.

>>717658606
>Kill off Vol'Jin, Sylvanas, Saurfang for the dumbest shit imaginable.
>Introduce Turalyon, Allera and nigger paladin for Alliance who didn't lose shit.
METZEEEEEEEEN SAAAAAAAAAVE UUUUUUUSSSSSSSSSSSSS!

Also, it baffles me how that one writer seemingly loved Sylvanas but then gave her a shit story focus that made everyone hate her and then just made her fuck off into nowhere. What the fuck was that guy smoking?

>>717659680
>Female Tauren Resto Druid / Shaman
Most likely a 40+ female

>Female Undead / Blood Elf Priest
Most likely a fattie

>Female Blood Elf Holy Paladin
Most likely a Stacy

>Female Troll Resto Shaman
A wild card: Stacy or a fattie

>>717659872
>What the fuck was that guy smoking?
He thought everyone liked her as much as he did. The loathsome Danuser.

>>717659872
>Alliance who didn't lose shit.
Alliance lost Kalimdor and fem nelves to Orcs forever

>>717654952
Orc females have the most "normal" model/proportions on Horde. They don't have hunched backs, the Undead's exposed bones, the Trolls' lack of shoes, the Tauren's fur, or the Blood Elves' supermodel fairy faggotry.
Their only real issue for an alliancefag is a lack of good hairstyles in Vanilla/TBC.

>open /wowg/
>Nonstop cuckoldry

i just wanna say..................tauren women are sexo..........................

>>717659551
That came after the fact when they were butchering the writing in Cata (or maybe later, I stopped playing retail in Cata). From Warcraft into WoW up to Wrath, the Alliance was always just a confederation of independent monarchies (which were themselves not fascist, as they had hierarchies of nobles and senates and stuff to make them more classically feudalist governments). The Varian High King shit was just a mess of them trying to make it more like the Horde. Even afterwards, the Alliance wasn't really fascist, however, because the individual nations in it were still more independent and High King was basically just commander-in-chief. Meanwhile, the Horde were fascist from the word go.

>>717659335
They have zeppelins, guns, machines of war, etc. They basically just have crude, misshapen engineering from the goblins. But industrialization isn't necessary for being fascist, anyways.

>>717659831
Again, night elves, not even the alliance, just night elves fucking swimming up from feralas or some shit because they sure as shit didn't have a beachhead- retook darkshore and Azshara, horde gained no territory. You lost a bunch of nameless NPCs and a tree you can still use as a capital city just fine vs loss of multiple important lore characters and the complete pussification of the entire faction.

>>717631209
I'm okay with Orgrimmar looking like it does with its primitive huts and all but putting the only anvil in the city in the ass end of fucking nowhere is unforgivable.

>>717659971
They are, but you've made a poor case.

Ah, good timing, lad. I sent two of my best knights to parley with the Orc's leader. They should be returning shortly.

>>717659937
>tfw Horde player going to Escape From The Durnholde and the Human Illusions kicks in
>Everything looks so aesthethic any gender / class combination

Horde Anons, I think Blizzard subconsciously mocked us...

>>717660131
Hope you sent two male knights to DP a big strong orcess

How seriously do players take the story? When I play Turtle next week will Night Elf players scream at me unprompted for cutting down trees? This seems like unhinged schizophrenic "this story and characters are real!" behavior.

>>717660064
Funny because right now it's the reverse.
The Alliance has a High King while the Horde is Warchiefless.

>>717660121
>never really thought too much about tauren
>one day I'm selling shit to a vendor and my character gets completely blocked out by a female tauren, must've been using some size changing toy
>had the eye covering fringe hairstyle and was wearing some mog skirt that meant with the default tauren posture panties were on full display to anyone at human height
>on top of this she'd parked directly on top of my character so his face was under the skirt
>dick twitches
Danny DeVito at the cinema moment.

>>717660276
Never seen anyone do that, usually people won't approach you for RP unless you clearly indicate that you are interested in that sort of thing.

>>717660231
All armour sets are designed on the human male model and then stretched and warped as needed. Was ridiculous in BFA when the horde exclusive armours had clipping issues on horde.

>>717660304
Nelves bowing to a "High King" is just another humiliation

>>717634437
Kek did not "come" from WoW - pretty sure it's the "Korean" "lolol"
They're just using it as a "translation convention" (probably a nod to gookclick)

>>717660276
there's very little RP in turtle wow unless you go looking for it.
the main server is definitely chill which is something i don't expect from the server they're about to open.

>>717660131
Here they come now ... Damnit maybe I should have checked if they speak horse.

>>717660276
>Turtle WoW RP players
Hilarious and unhinged. Just don't say anything anti-LGBT or you'll get banned.

>Play as Hardcore mode, Warrior
>Go do Dun Morogh for green quests
>Dwarf players RPing in Kharanos Inn being shitfaced
>"Dwarven are subhumans"
> get whispers: "FUCKING TRYHARD HARDCORE PLAYER GET OUT OF MY BAR REEEEE"

>>717660403
Kek did not "come" from korea either.
WoW popularized it.

>>717660403
Korean was "kekeke", "kek" is purely from WoW, as it is a translation of "lol" from orcish. That's what you see if someone from horde says "lol".

>>717660458
>can dish it out
>can't take it

>>717630661 (OP)
>war criminal faction
>war criminal race
>war criminal class
>war criminal professions
SIGN ME THE FUCK UP RN!

>>717660320
For me it's the hip sway. That god damn sway.

>>717660524
>Faction
Eithers good at this point really, just depends if you want out in the open or swept under the rug.
>race
Undead clear winner, worgen, human, void elf, lightforged draenai and orc strong competitors.
>class
I'm thinking rogue as priority, then warlock and death knight
>professions
Alchemy is the only war criminal adjacent profession, maybe engineering in a pinch

>>717660572
For me it's the way the long double braids rest on the breasts while still and swing side to side while running.

>>717660276
RP is mostly advertised ahead of time events for people to gather at, every so often you might see a few just chilling. I mostly just make a transmog and a profile on the addon to look cool and 'immersive'.

>>717659417
>no anvil, no engie and blacksmithing trainers
Human rubbish.

>>717648057
You are cuck snoy tranny your brown LOOOOOOOL

>>717660276
>Westfall
>Play as Human Warrior and do quests with Dwarf Hunter
>Night Elf couple named: Romeo and Juliet walk pass by
>Dwarf Hunter: "Fucking Night Elves"

>>717660403
This is plausible, could've been osmosis from StarCraft. Tangentially, is it China or Japan that uses wwwwwwwwwww?

>>717660883
Um aktshually Warcraft dwarves have no reason to have beef with elves

Tyrande asking for Elune to give her strength and cure her addiction to orc dicks.

>>717659615
>Yeah, because the ottomans didn't fall over unconscious after their invasion had failed and remain still where they fell. Invasions were launched into their heartlands
Aftermath of the WW1?

>>717658929
They had an actually interesting dynamic going into BFA with the botched peace conference and short stories about the razing of Ashenvale with Sylvanas ultimately concluding that if the Alliance just jumped the Horde right now they'd get wrecked and Anduin was absolutely useless in preventing that with things like Genn being allowed to veer off from the Legion offensive and pursue his grudge against her. So, she had to kneecap them and her original strategy was just to kill Malfurion and/or Tyrande, GOD FORBID one of those lame-asses bites it, but Saurfang was a fag and botched that but then OH Elune actually made Saurfang a fag and the retcons kept piling and mucking it all.

>>717660064
>But industrialization isn't necessary for being fascist, anyways.
Actually it is necessary since fascism (just like communism and libertarianism) is ideology of the industrial society

How cringeworthy is RP on Horde faction? I have seen so many cringeworthy Night Elf Nationals and Drunk Dwarven on The Alliance.

>>717661101
>Genn being allowed to veer off from the Legion offensive and pursue his grudge against her
Friendly reminder that Genn was 100% correct to do so. It's funny how there's a dozen instances of paranoid Horde commanders attacking the Alliance for no reason, but the Alliance does it once and turns out to be entirely right to do so.

>>717661185
There's no Horde RP.

>>717661064
Europe was in an even worse state after WW1.

>>717661374
Europe on WW1 and tried to pursue Ottomans in their heartlands, Once they fought back Europe made peace with Turkey

>>717661000
They are still dwarves

>>717661494
Yes, I was referencing everything that had happened in reality. It was not feasibly, or logistically possible for Europe to exterminate Ottomans to the last. If they could, like the US had done with the natives, they would have. The situation with the Orcish horde was different.

>>717661573
>The situation with the Orcish horde was different.
Yeah and since Warsong and Frostwolf clans (along with ogres and forest trolls) still were running around Alliance was nowhere close to US when it was genociding native population.
Especially since practically everyone left Alliance after WC2

>>717661813
If they had killed the majority captured instead of placing them into internment camps, they would have pushed their populace below replacement levels. "Emancipation of the horde" was a big deal in Warcraft 3.

>>717661185
I was part of a goblin guild a few years back and I can't remember any regularly occuring cringe shit. Granted, goblins generally have more lighthearted/relaxed RP by nature compared to orc military or belf noble house RP.

>>717653423
i dunno i just thought they look cool

all of my buddies thought they are gay though

which they are, but i still think they're cool

>>717662241
>they are gay
>they're cool
hmmm

>>717662373
It is possible to be both, although it takes some finesse.

>>717657767
Uther wouldn't listen to Arthas. Arthas only falls to madness because Uther proceeds to undermine him at every opportunity.

>>717658749
There is one next to the smith guy for the 20 warrior quests, unless that was added in wotlk
>>717658947
>not going to the hidden venture co. engineering trainer near the mine
Ngmi

>>717662830
Arthas is already sperging out and lashing out at everyone at the start, absolute failure of a paladin.

>>717663068
>sperging out and lashing out at everyone at the start
He's just hotheaded in Blackrock and Roll. Although Uther cautions him, you do end up killing all the Orcs in the end without getting reprimanded for it.
You can see things start to go wrong after Hearthglen, when Uther comes, berates Arthas, and then leaves so Arthas can't debrief him.

If you are mean to the Horde this is who you're being mean to. Think next time before you mention Teldrassil or Theramore.

Fuck Horde.