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Thread 717743097

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Anonymous No.717743097 >>717743661 >>717743815 >>717743861 >>717744354 >>717744421 >>717749097 >>717751991 >>717752646 >>717754910 >>717754970 >>717756004 >>717756324 >>717760580
What made AI games so bad?
>5 years
>0 successful games
Anonymous No.717743194
Why would I pay for AI games? They didin't cost anything to make so why aren't they free?
Anonymous No.717743308
Nodev talentless losers cheering for cost cutting slop producing machines because it would "own" people who actually practiced skills unlike them.
You expect this demographic to make anything creative?
Anonymous No.717743661
>>717743097 (OP)
AI games will be equivalent to the Atomic Moggings of Hiroshita and Niggasaki.
When they drop, all conventional games will be rendered obsolete.
Anonymous No.717743815
>>717743097 (OP)
Paying for AI games is literally the most retarded shit you can do
Best they can do right now is shitty gooner visual novels about femboys
Anonymous No.717743861 >>717753150
>>717743097 (OP)
soulless, like her SV
Anonymous No.717744047 >>717749104 >>717750036
who the fuck is number 1
Anonymous No.717744239 >>717748609 >>717751761
>AI game as devs use AI to make assets (except voice lines)
this is shit
>AI game as it uses chatbot features for immersion
this is pure kino and is the future
Anonymous No.717744354
>>717743097 (OP)
Because the moment i know the dev uses AI, it tells me there is no effort put into the game, especially if they're charging for it.
Anonymous No.717744421 >>717746951 >>717747024
>>717743097 (OP)
>AI game
>just a braindead NPC hooked to some paywalled chatbot
AI is still not advance enough or implemented properly for vidya, but it'll get there in few years
Anonymous No.717744494
Anonymous No.717746951
>>717744421
This
Anonymous No.717747024 >>717748558 >>717748669 >>717753143
>>717744421
>in few years
And this mantra has been going on for how many years now?
Anonymous No.717747110 >>717748387
AI can barely make an image with no mistakes, who the fuck is making an AI game that isn't just a VN or something?
Anonymous No.717748387
>>717747110
Elon musk
Anonymous No.717748558 >>717748669 >>717753143
>>717747024
ChatGPT has only been around for less than three years, released in november 22.

So a little over 2 years.
Anonymous No.717748609
>>717744239
I would love RPG with local LLM actors. But we are still years away from that.
Anonymous No.717748669 >>717748712
>>717747024
>>717748558
just 2 more years
Anonymous No.717748712
>>717748669
Unironically tho, thinking how much it improved over the past 2 years.
Anonymous No.717748840 >>717748958 >>717749238
If you want to actually make a video game and make it good and playable in any major capacity, you wouldn't be using AI, and even if you did you'd still be doing the vast majority of the work yourself and it wouldn't be used for any significantly visible assets.
If you want to try and cheat the grind of having to seriously develop the game and pump out something that counts as a 'product' so you can try and get money out of people, then you use AI.

there's no shortcuts, you can try and skip the hard part but not having the discipline to actually put in effort where it counts is the biggest red flag that anything you make wouldn't ever be worth buying. Honestly no matter how good it gets you'll still have to put in a modicum of effort in order to make something that actually stands out because otherwise you're just pumping out the same slop as the rest of the industry.
Anonymous No.717748958
>>717748840
>you can try and skip the hard part but not having the discipline to actually put in effort where it counts is the biggest red flag that anything you make wouldn't ever be worth buying
Biggest truth nuke that jeets & other retards just can't even comprehend.
Anonymous No.717749097 >>717749780
>>717743097 (OP)
Well to make a good game you have to
>Appeal
>Engage
Because a game is essentially giving a toy and an activity for the player to keep engaged with. Someone heavily using AI cannot be trusted to have deep enough thoughts put into their game design or aesthetics. They definitely dont do any playtesting or get any feedback from players. And they already lost in the appeal department by using fresh out of the oven AIslop.
Anonymous No.717749104
>>717744047
clearly her, red is the player 1 color, haven't you seen mario
Anonymous No.717749238 >>717749632 >>717753716 >>717754601
>>717748840
>you'd still be doing the vast majority of the work yourself and it wouldn't be used for any significantly visible assets.
Why is this retarded take so prominent? Pre 2019, people who were serious about monetizing a game paid commissions for visible assets. They didn't do jack shit of work on ANY of the "significantly visible assets." AI offers the exact same pipeline for free, so surprise, all the same people are taking the free route, treating gens like free commissions.
>there are no shortcuts
The wallet is a shortcut and they all took it, retard. Let alone solo projects, go open up any major project like Elden Ring. All of the visible assets are outsourced to the cheapest third worlder hands they can find, taking the cheapest shortcuts they have to buy - and only because they had to buy.
Anonymous No.717749632 >>717749729
>>717749238
devs buying, repurposing, and reusing assets and trying to bullshit your way into a functional game with AI with the excuse of crying poor are nowhere near the same
Anonymous No.717749729 >>717750042
>>717749632
>It's not the same!
Same cope as ever, I see. Minimal effort slop will always be so. You just pretend one is better.
Anonymous No.717749780 >>717753856
>>717749097
how is using AI worse than using store assets?
with AI you have to put some effort into it to get decent results, with store assets you just buy them from the store
Anonymous No.717750036 >>717750384
>>717744047
we are
Anonymous No.717750042 >>717750381 >>717750786
>>717749729
It takes a grand total of 10 minutes of actual game coding to realize what the difference is but it takes 5 seconds to bullshit an argument here, there's a reason cheap games look and feel cheap and full AI is that to an even higher degree
Anonymous No.717750381
>>717750042
I have yet to see any AI art game that looks and feels as cheap as anything from the DAZ goblin era, an era that glorified your touted "buying, repurposing, and reusing assets." You're just making blind assertions and claiming them as truth, despite having no evidence that there's any difference between minimal effort 3DCG and minimal effort AI. Minimal effort slop is always so, no matter the source of assets.
Anonymous No.717750384
>>717750036
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oy-3KI2eHi4
Thanks for reminding me.
Anonymous No.717750786
>>717750042
Not in the face value appeal per se. AI generated asset that is very, very obvious instantly bring down the appeal/expectation of the game being good, just like how you can use a very highly polished store asset but if everyone uses it, players would immediately spot the characteristics of that asset / AIslop and just ignore it.
Anonymous No.717751761
>>717744239
AIRoguelite can be a laugh, but it's really not for everybody. It does use AI for most assets, but it generates them based on your initial world prompt.
IMO, any game using AI generation should let you use your own keys vs the typical limited shit they dish out.
Anonymous No.717751991
It is funny to me entering this thread with SillyTavern chugging away in another tab.

>>717743097 (OP)
>What made AI games so bad?
Lack of understanding on where to employ the tech. It's a technology that doesn't fit into modern games. At best, you can do AI-rendered assets for UI and certain audio, but the technology is without a demand. It has a wider utility in supporting roles, like rapid concept art and code debugging (the latter use has taken businesses by storm), but that wouldn't make an "AI game."

Now, I'm critiquing the problem but I don't have any solutions. I find the best use of AI is the purest source of it: a wide variety of text-based entertainment, whether that's short story co-writing, Narrator-User CYOA, chatbots, 1-man dungeon master text RPG games, and so on. The only place I feel any demand for LLM in modern games is NPC dialogue. Not for a crappier version of what I already do in SillyTavern, but an actual system that incorporates the game's quest texts in the context and has extremely strong context framing for accessing the info, so that you can question various NPCs for details and they can actually have things to reveal in real speech. But that takes a lot of work, even more experimentation, bloats hardware demand, and is still just a novelty that isn't necessary.
Anonymous No.717752646 >>717752919
>>717743097 (OP)
Well the stigma around AI doesn't just hurt the popularity of AI products coming out but quashes and decentivizes them from being developed. I must say the anti-ai sentiment from creatives like artists and actors have done an amazing job at controlling the narrative that AI steals and plagerizes, ignoring the fact that humans learn and produce basically the same way and that gens shouldn't just be thrown into a final build, they need to be tweaked and tempered if not used as the reference.
Liar's Var simply used AI voice lines for simple 1 or 2 words to accompany what kind of play you did with the cards, and it got a fair amount of critisism for that alone, boogeymanning it out like it's the laziest game ever. Hell a fat fetish artist I see often has gone under fire for using ai to gen anatomy as models for him to work off of, despite the fact that others will just draw irl fat girls but slap cartoon furry faces on them and do colors like that's a completely different thing.
I don't trust normies and their sensibilities, but unfortunately I also understand normies either control the narrative or the people who group together to make guilds and unions have a frequent habit of attacking any other form of art and artistic expression when they feel threatened by it.
I like the gameplay loop of Suck Up. I love the idea of using the interaction with the NPCs to persuade them into giving you your winstate. That is exactly the kind of thing I want to see AI do, simulate people and cognative processes in NPCs to emulate people. Honestly, so many things could possibly be improved with AI over human made assets used only for 1 scene, level, camera angle, context, or whatever, but the diversity to gaming that AI can offer I think should purley be focused on giving the player immersive responses that a script or prewritten dialog alone cannot, we got most rhw rest in a "good enough" state.
Anonymous No.717752919 >>717753061 >>717753445
>>717752646
>I don't trust normies and their sensibilities, but unfortunately I also understand normies either control the narrative or the people who group together to make guilds and unions have a frequent habit of attacking any other form of art and artistic expression when they feel threatened by it.
Might I interest you in this infograph?
Anonymous No.717753061 >>717753181 >>717753445
>>717752919
It's horseshit because autists don't "beat" shit. They're vulnerable to other forms of control, but more importantly, they have 0 meaningful impact on the world around them.
Anonymous No.717753143 >>717753502
>>717747024
Since the 50s

>>717748558
You're an idjit, the tech has been around since the 90s.
Anonymous No.717753150
>>717743861
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nf4XvicwrkM
do vocaloidniggers really listen to this shit
Anonymous No.717753181 >>717753883
>>717753061
every single big leap forward was because of an autist.
Anonymous No.717753445
>>717753061
I kinda agree, but autistd are the ones who actually make shit that the corpos/government didnt, and in my view of history are the ones that set the bar higher for quality. Its the powers that be, the ceos and corpos, or paychopaths in this case that normalize, commodify, followed by enshitifying things. However aside from the rare occasion where a bipartisan issue (like what bullshit the Online Saftey Act and Screen Act are to the public) I don't see autists changing the culture or coming out ontop. My interpretation is that autists have the ability to remove themselves from the shackles of corpo control because they can learn technology and pirate what they like and trim the fat. This also assumes "autist" means skilled autists passionate about their craft like Temple-OS autism, not like Chris-chan autism.
>>717752919
With above said, yeah this tracks. Right now the paychopaths are about to take a fuckton from us, but if I keep up my studies and learn to build the future I want I can at least be happy. I want to save the world as much as I can, save as many lives as I can, but at the end of the day if the world floods at least I will have a boat for myself. Also hopefully I'm not just full of hubris and refuse to see myself for the normie I can/may be. I am quite emotional in my argumentation...
Anonymous No.717753502 >>717753883 >>717757183
>>717753143
Ah, are we counting Clippy then?
Anonymous No.717753716 >>717754378
>>717749238
Name me a single successful game with assets from these asset shops?
Anonymous No.717753856 >>717754174
>>717749780
Anon, if (You) are capable at making an appealing and engaging game, it does not matter whether (You) are making a game out of sticks or out powerpoint slides. For fucks sake, if (You) need some random anons to validate your choice of making your game (You) are definitely not going to make an appealing or engaging game.
Anonymous No.717753883 >>717755643
>>717753502
now go ahead and google "history of LLMs" you fucking 3rd world pajeet

>>717753181
no, every single leap forward was by someone who implemented the tech made by an autist.
Anonymous No.717754174
>>717753856
>Anon, if (You) are capable at making an appealing and engaging game, it does not matter whether (You) are making a game out of sticks or out powerpoint slides
This. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. EA/2k/Ubisoft have audiance capture because once upon a time they delivered on quality and that hype conbined with massive marketing budget campaigns is how they live off sliding by on mediocrity.
Games built from scratch and no reputation get by because they're fun, usually gameplaywise but also possibly because its a beautiful work of art. Among Us is an amazing example of people finding the core gameplay loop so engaging that they'd play it for days and days, many AAA struggle to capture that audiance retention. On that note, roadmaps, DLC, and online/multiplayer focuses are hoe AAA try to artificially elongate those periods of interest, but that trend has fatigued many many people, its power is waning, especially after people agknowladging the finite lifespan of these games and the issues with them that Stop Killing Games is illuminating.
Anonymous No.717754378 >>717754918
>>717753716
Nothing in that post is about asset shops. Modern game devs commission 3rd party studios from India, Malaysia, and any other for-pennies shithole to develop assets for them for as cheap as humanly possible. Indie devs also commission assets. Kenshi, for example, looked like pic related until the dev commissioned an artist to make assets for him. He also commissioned blocks of code, including pathfinding code. And lacking understanding of the stuff he just bought is why he wasn't able to fix pathfinding or rendering issues later on throughout the game's life. Because he didn't put the work on it himself, didn't have a dedicated team member for it, and just took what worked on miscellaneous commissions. Despite all this, Kenshi is a wonderful (sometimes janky) game, belying the post that one is responding to about "no shortcuts" and "lacking discipline to put in the effort himself." Before AI, the wallet and cheap commissions were (and still are) the shortcut to effort.
Anonymous No.717754601
>>717749238
>AI offers the exact same pipeline for free
The grand point you are making is that the asset production is significantly easier and cheaper, which is true, but I feel the need to lossibly split the hair that this usually isn't free for corporate use, especially with the output needs of a corporate or even llc enterprise structure.
niggermods No.717754910
>>717743097 (OP)
hey teto
Anonymous No.717754918 >>717755207
>>717754378
Kenshi is a broken shitpiss of a game that has figuratively no players and no impact.
Anonymous No.717754970 >>717755163
>>717743097 (OP)
Video games are a creative medium. AI is a tool used by the soulless to try to replicate a soul because they think something existing is the same as being creative. You could feed an AI every level of Super Mario Bros 1 and it would never think up Super Mario Bros 3, or World, or 64, etc.
Anonymous No.717755163
>>717754970
Just because a corpo can use it to churn out something lazy doesnt mean it cant be used by creative people with visions to make or help make something neat. You are right to be afraid of what new corners AAA sees and can cut, but lumping the whole tool's usage like that I fear is misguided.
Anonymous No.717755207 >>717755331
>>717754918
>figuratively no players
I literally don't know what you're trying to say. Kenshi was made by a single developer and his sister, it sold 2.3 million copies, and right this second has 8,300 people playing it despite being a single-player game released 7 years ago. To you, does "figuratively" just mean "objectively false information but I want to complain anyways"?
Anonymous No.717755331 >>717755414
>>717755207
>8.3k players
>meaningful

okay buddy retard
Anonymous No.717755414 >>717755558
>>717755331
So you're just shitposting. Figures. Congrats, you got me to reply, you disingenuous asshat.
Anonymous No.717755558 >>717755601
>>717755414
Bro, kenshi isn't even in the top 150 games being played right now. What the fuck are you talking about? It's irrelevant to the games industry.
Anonymous No.717755601 >>717755679 >>717755740
>>717755558
>still going
Anonymous No.717755643 >>717755740 >>717755973
>>717753883
If you go really that deep autists were universally shunned by society and now we are more than happy to have whatever they did. Only the autistic gene allows to go really in depth in a very specific thing, but the problem is a lot of autists now take interest in something extremely useless, esoteric knowledge and modern cinema being a good example of this. Autists are needed by society, just not the wrong types, aka the redditors, who have actually higher IQ than the average normalfag but again their interest is in something which leads nowhere. You already know what kind of government you would establish and how you would distribute resources, how you would punish Trump, but you cannot fix a clogged toilet. And that is the problem here.

AI is the same exact caliber. People badly want to believe that AI is gonna be the savior of the low skilled, invent-nothing crowd, who never tasted victory, were never applauded, or accomplished something, while in reality they'll be just as useless as they were without AI. The smartest way to approach it is if you are already capable of doing something semi-decent you use AI to decrease your workload, or your shortcomings. Shiftup already does this, and they are very open about using AI for Nikke specificially, but again the artists who use it are already skilled without AI.
Anonymous No.717755679
>>717755601
Stop giving it (You)s
Anonymous No.717755740
>>717755601
What impact has Kenshi made in the video games industry?

>>717755643
Broadly speaking, yes. I find that AI is an excellent "force multiplier" but if you're just blindly having it do shit for you, it'll produce crap.
Anonymous No.717755973
>>717755643
>Only the autistic gene allows to go really in depth in a very specific thing, but the problem is a lot of autists now take interest in something extremely useless, esoteric knowledge and modern cinema being a good example of this.
I know we aren't dennouncing their freedom of choice but I do want to point out what a wonderful world it is where we can hyper focus on those things at our own leisure. I also think there are enough people in this world that we can facilitate those hyper niche and seldom relevant fields, I certainly love having autists mod my favorite video games like putting Lanky into Smash Remix, the hot Smash Bros 64 mod, I love that nigga like you wouldn't believe. I think if we all have autists in our communities building, the world AND anthropological progress is satisfied.
Anonymous No.717756004
>>717743097 (OP)
If you're talking about shit made with AI assets (or made by AI wholesale), the answer is simple.
Those who would "create" games through AI lack the creativity and drive to create something good. All they're capable of doing is prompting a computer to rip off something else for them.
Anonymous No.717756324
>>717743097 (OP)
What do you mean, the 1girl masterpiece best quality solo big breasts tile sliding puzzle game industry is booming.
Anonymous No.717757183
>>717753502
Pumping
Anonymous No.717758749
Wait do people gen using 1girl as a prompt token tag? I always use the first sentance to define subjects, like [1 subject] and then describe her the next sentance.
Anonymous No.717760580
>>717743097 (OP)
They are never made by someone who knows jack shit about games.