Thread 717813948

I genuinely can't decide if this is better than Super Metroid or not.

>More linear and easier
>But generally tighter design
Also the shinespark for the final energy tank is more of a final boss than the actual final boss, frankly.

You don't have to. Simply combine them.

>>717813948 (OP)
It controls better but it is not better overall. Simple as that.

I genuinely can't tell if Metroid is sexier as a ball or not. Just kidding she is!

>>717814868
Based and ballpilled.

>>717813948 (OP)
The art style and atmosphere isnt as good as Super Metroid.

>>717813948 (OP)
It's an amazing game, but not better. Super deserved a GBA remake tho.

>>717815103
zero mission worked because nes metroid had tons of issues and the remake fixed many of them
a gba remake would have ruined super

>>717813948 (OP)
the zero suit section is fucking trash

I finished Super Metroid last night. Amazing game.

But what do I play next, Zero Mission or Earthbound? I'm thinking a palette cleanser wpuld be nice so im leaning towards Earthbound and then Zero Mission after it.

>>717813948 (OP)
Needs less handholding, but it's fine enough

>>717815386
It takes like all of five minutes to beat, it's really not that bad.

>>717813948 (OP)
No, but it's rare for a company to take the good things from a lesser title, in this case Fusion, and apply them to the more traditional formula so successfully. I think Super is a game that should be left alone, but as far as remakes go, Zero Mission is about as good as it can get.

>>717813948 (OP)
it's not as good. you can't better something by improving tertiary aspects. the core concept of exploring a dense alien world is weaker and has more contrivances. it's still a good game and perfectly appropriate for the context it was released in but it's not better than super.

>>717815882
>think Super is a game that should be left alone
the way it handles missile and bomb controls is pretty fucking bad

>>717815386
filtered

>>717816752
there's patches for that

>>717815882
Fusion is an odd game that makes some truly terrible design choices and mixes them with surprisingly good ones somehow. Like on the one hand the linear factor and the dreadful forced cutscene diologue that can't be skipped is really fucking bad, but also it's one of the few 2D games to have bosses that are both threatening and actually challenging. I still think about the SA-X and Nightmare from time to time, but honestly all the Fusion bosses have more teeth to them than most of the bosses in the other 2D games.

>>717813948 (OP)
Its better in that it's not as tedious with a lot of backtracking and the fact the items are marked on the map removes a lot of the 'xray everything/powerbomb everything'

But honestly, both suck and both are terrible in their own ways

>>717813948 (OP)
it's a good game but locking collectables behind obscure techs that 9/10 players can't do and require perfect timing is stupid

>>717813948 (OP)
Late game's pretty fucking bad, and I don't mean just the ship.

>>717817658
To tell the truth, Fusion was what made the whole genre "click" with me as a kid. I had Super Metroid, but I never got very far, and I considered Symphony of the Night a wasted rental, but Fusion does a good job of telegraphing the way these games work, while being more structured to keep things moving. I think it's the lowest of the 2D Metroids these days, but it serves as a good primer.

I incidently went through all the 2d metroids last week and ended up touching super last. I didn't grow up with it, but just got hooked and kept replaying it. It's really cluncky with combat yet felt the best to play. I think the run button really adds something to the movement the other games just don't have.

>>717819751
>I considered Symphony of the Night a wasted rental
Well yeah, that kind of game was never intended to be beaten within a rental period. It's not like nips ever had vidya rental in the first place.

>>717813948 (OP)
I'm playing the x fusion super hack and i'm getting raped.
Send help

>>717819817
That's not what I meant, I got no enjoyment from it. Something about the structure of a Metroidvania just didn't make sense to me until I played Fusion.

>>717819826
I'll take your temperature and see if the meat is just right.

>>717820029
Fair enough I suppose. My first exposure was with Circle of the Moon which I'd say was pretty clearly structured and the for the most part easy to figure out where to go next and what you need to get there. Also no cryptic hidden mechanics that hide the true ending. So I guess I was lucky in that sense, starting with SotN when I was that young would've been tough I suspect.

Fusion >>>>

I'm insane and prefer Super's movement physics it has a sense of momentum the others don't have. Ledge grabbing is disgusting. Music, narrative, graphics, etc. are all worse than Super. Zero suit and its consequences have been a disaster for Samus's character. Marking shit on the map is far less elegant than Super's invisible guiding hand.

>>717813948 (OP)
It's boring. Not even as good as Metroid 1, let alone Super

>>717813948 (OP)
It plays extremely tight and it feels amazing, but I do think it's too linear and way too short.
Still, it's one hell of a game.

>>717816856
I think that was the other anon's point: It could do with some tweaking.

>>717813948 (OP)
it's not. they are basically just the same game. metroid pioneered an amazing gameplay genre, but itself is marred by completely retarded story continuity and retconning.

>>717816752
Metroid Redux is amazing

>>717815768
This, and the payoff is obliterating enemies with your endgame suit as payback for hunting you at your most vulnerable.

what do people think about the new metroid rom hack here? is it good?

>>717817658
>but honestly all the Fusion bosses have more teeth to them than most of the bosses in the other 2D games
Maybe for the time but certainly not nowadays. Every other 2D game is a "souls like" and needs to have le epic bosses.

>>717813948 (OP)
To me it feels too much like Super Metroid lite. It's good but generally it doesn't really surpass SM in any aspect except in having better controls.

>>717813948 (OP)
Gameplay wise, yeah. Narrative wise, Super Metroid is better.

>>717819826
Where are you getting raped at?

A reminder that X-Fusion came at the start of this month, for anything that was following it. V1.2 just released today as well.

>>717826679
What's new in 1.2?

>>717826786
Last area has more checkpoints added (dreadfully needed), difficulty options exposed from the get go, and Easy difficulty added. Most people should probably play it on Easy, since it's still harder than your average official Metroid game. General bug fixes (one which frustrated me on a certain boss that's supposedly fixed now), and a couple more save points added (those sectors badly needed it too).

>>717826874
>Last area has more checkpoints added (dreadfully needed)
That doesn't quite fix it though. I wonder if the easy mode gives you a worse ending or something. You still need to beat hard mode for the real ending anyway.

>>717826968
>You still need to beat hard mode for the real ending anyway.
I was so fucking blue-balled by the ending, not knowing there even were difficulty options after post-clear. I don't have the time to play through the game again just to see the one thing it teases.

>>717825925
I meant in comparison to the other 2D Metroid games in general, not 2D games at large.

>>717814189
Minimum % is infinitely harder than anything Super has to offer, however.

>>717827130
I'll spoil it for you.
The real Samus died days before the game. The one you're playing as is an SA-X that somehow kept Samus's reasoning out of like 10 other SA-X clones that the scientists had kept. And with the X having survived the Station explosion, SA-Xmus vows to hunt down her "sisters" because she's the only one that can stop them.

>>717827536
Oh, so there isn't a real Kraid fight then? It's nothing more than a cutscene?

>>717827678
Nope. Also no Mother Brain fight either despite being teased.

>>717826679
I heard this is difficult, but in what sense? Is it enemies hit hard/tank shit a lot or some stupidly precise wall jumping required to progress?

>>717815594
Earthbound is a long game. Only play it if you open to play an RPG to relax with at night before bed.

>>717827742
I was fine with that. Honestly, as far as boss encounters go, it shits over 95% of romhacks simply for having custom fights, even if 2/3rds of them are based off of Fusion.

>>717813948 (OP)
It's better on a pure mechanical level, but not in the overall feeling the game gives

>>717828001
V1.0 had enemies hit ridiculously hard. V1.1 nerfed damage output in general in the earlier areas (pre-Varia), but some things still drain you fast. Sector-6 when you reach it, is absolutely a difficulty wall though, and the difficulty kinda remains higher from there on. Final area is just bullshit in general, no mistakes allowed w/ tight platforming. Game assumes you know how to walljump (and Fusion limitation of being unable to walljump repeatedly off the same wall), and grapple with high gravity, that's about it that I recall the main path expecting. Some of the item pickup rooms later require some speedrunner tricks, but they're not mandatory to beat the game.

V1.2 added an Easy difficulty, which halves damage taken (you are still receiving more damage than an official Metroid game) and adjusts the AI of certain enemies that fuck your shit up, including the aforementioned difficulty wall section.

>>717813948 (OP)
It’s my personal favorite. Has the best movement hands down.

>>717823197
?

>>717813948 (OP)
I've only played 4 Metroidvania games total and one of them was a furry cub porn game so I'm not the best judge but Fusion was my second favourite of them my favourite was the furry game

>>717815882
Zero Mission doesn't have art design as good as Fusion. I think Fusion is peak when it comes to atmosphere and art, controls and many other things, it's just a shame the actual game could've used a sequel that let all of these things go wild.
At least it's still better than Samus Returns and Dread. Piece of shit games.

>>717813948 (OP)
Better controls but Super has the more interesting maps.

For me, it’s Fusion. Yes, it’s a more linear game. And yes, Adam is fucking lame. When you get past that, it’s a masterclass of atmosphere with snappy movement and great boss fights. The power outage is one of my favorite setpieces in any Metroid ever. And I love that the shady federation guy reacts to your sequence break by fangirling over Samus and breaking character.

I do really like Zero Mission tho. It is objectively a good game, and I love the art style and high-contrast colors that give rooms the appearance of depth. I don’t love the ZS section at the end but it’s really not that bad and discussion of it has been poisoned on /v/ by a small handful of deranged autists.

>>717827536
>they did the Vitality thing again
I didn’t like it then and I don’t like it now.

>>717813948 (OP)
Only Fusionfags hate Zero Mission because it wasn’t their first game in the series like Fusion was and it was a direct comparison to what a good game in the series looks like since they were both on the GBA

>>717830402
I've never played Vitality. I'll have to get around to it sometime.

>>717830461
I don't hate Zero Mission. I don't know where you got that from, Fusionfags supposedly hating a game that play near identical to it.

>>717830518
It’s actually super good, easily one of the best SM hacks if not THE best. The ending just triggers my autism with an unnecessary crossover.

>>717815386
>braindead parroted take repeated a million times
Get new material, you faggot lemming. You sound like a Redditor bitching about the Water Temple in OoT being “hard” just to fit in.

>>717830461
A lot of Nintendo franchises peaked on the GBA and the GC.

>>717830582
I was never the biggest Metroid guy. I like the series and I've played most of the entries so rom hacks typically aren't on my radar besides X Fusion which I waited 15 fucking years for. I'll give it a shot, I just hope that it won't kick my ass as hard as X Fusion did.

>other m was just a retread of fusion
>…dread was ALSO a retread of fusion
Fusion’s good and all, and so’s Dread, but can we move on from the “spooky monster/bodysnatcher outbreak in a space zoo” gimmick already? They’ve done it three times now.

>>717830782
Not until Yoshio Sakamoto does it right

>>717830781
X-Fusion is a hell of a first romhack to play, it’s advertised as “for veterans” but in reality it’s a borderline troll hack full of cheap kaizo traps. I think it’s pretty clear Metaquarius developed it almost entirely in a vacuum and got autistically good at his own hack without any outside input. I respect the vision but I didn’t really have fun.

I think both zero mission and fusion feel so much better to control than super
and its crazy all that those games do with two less buttons
but I guess with how metroid upgrades work you really only need jump and shoot

>>717831368
Yeah I know but I've been waiting on it since I was a kid and Fusion was my first Metroid so it holds a special place in my heart. I was willing to slog through the difficulty and still enjoy it.

>>717830930
I feel that if you fuck up three times in a row, you should probably rethink your strategy and try something else. Or please let literally anyone else have a go at writing because it's clear Sakamoto doesn't know how to at a fundamental level. He's like the Japanese equivalent of David Cage, in that it's astonishing they can have written for so many games without ever learning how to do it properly.

>>717833404
In essence, that is or would be the quintessential Metroid and that's something Sakamoto desperately wants to nail as his magnum opus. So, I don't see him giving it up until he either nails it or it bombs so badly that it's another Other M.

>>717813948 (OP)
Fusion is the only good game in the series. Everything else is trash.

>>717832226
>kill momentum and replace it with binary movement
>internet praises you for finding space with less buttons when you have objectively less mechanics to interact with
>youtubers who don't understand Super's movement just call the freed up button an anachronistic mario holdover

>>717833724
metroid never really was about momentum but it is a shame to see how 2d game physics began to decline right around this era as a whole

>>717833724
>>717835136
What the fuck are you even arguing? For one, you’re just making up shit in your head about “the internet praising less buttons” when Super has always been the one game unanimously sucked off in the series besides Prime maybe and two you’re making some nebulous and arbitrary argument about people not understanding your subjective definition of how a game “feels”. Quit acting like hysterical homos.

>>717836721
Your post reeks of chatGPTisms.
Everyone on the internet talks about the controls between these games all the time when 2D metroid is brought up, and I was literally responding to a post that was talking about how GBA Metroid controls so much better with fewer buttons.
It's easier to find space for the controls with fewer buttons when there are fewer mechanics in the game, what's nebulous and arbitrary about that statement?

>>717814189
I wouldn't say ZM is more linear (outside the added epilouge) rather it's just smaller and comes off that way

>>717837225
>Your post reeks of chatGPTisms
Didn’t even bother reading the rest of your post since you’re clearly some autistic faggot incapable of saying a single thing in good faith. Suck off a shotgun, you stupid nigger faggot

This post was generated by chatGPT

>>717837360
He’s just being a retard and parroting criticism thrown at Fusion so he can play “whataboutism” semantics

>>717837528
Ok mate, I don't think you understand that when we're talking about momentum we're not talking about "feel" but Samus actually handling differently in the games so it's a good thing you've decided to drop out early and spared us more nonsense pots.

>finally play Super Metroid last year
>pure ludo, one of the best games I've ever played
>have some free time a few months ago and get around to GBA Metroid
>play Zero Mission
>fantastic vidya experience
>play Fusion
>dialogue dialogue dialogue
>very basic map with insulting objective markers
>"Press A to confirm you understand or B to go through all that text dumb again"
>assume that Zero Mission confused dumb Japanese kids so they made the next one more handholdy
>look it up and turns out they released the other way around
They don't make video games like this anymore, I tell ya whut.
While I've got your attention, do the Prime games feel like the 2D ones or does the extra dimension make it a completely different experience?

>>717837631
Fusion is dogshit and ultra linear, we're talking about zm

>>717827536
Was this really necessary? This is what made me drop the Metroid franchise.

>>717814189
it's not that hard, you just suck

>>717838071
Prime is the closest game to super in the series for me imo, structured very similarly.

>>717833565
Considering that Sakamoto has never acknowledged Other M as a failure I don't think that's ever going to work.

>>717826679
a fan sequel for fusion?

>>717813948 (OP)
for me, it is. Super feels too clunky to me, but that's what happens when you play the GBA entries first
>inb4 zoom zoom

>>717838189
I never said it was hard, it's just harder than Mecha-Ridley which is pretty much a joke.

>>717838256
Alright I'll check it out on Switch

>>717838448
a fan retelling of fusion

>>717838147
What? Because of a fan game?

>>717813948 (OP)
I frequently have the same thought and ultimately I have come to the conclusion that super is better casually or the occasional playthrough but for mastery zero mission is far better.

> playing Metroid Z
> full size ZM romhack
> fun movement, highly open design, lots of optional paths opened by wall jumps / IBJ / shinespark puzzles
> item becomes permanently missable after an untelegraphed event apparently triggered by collecting unrelated upgrades
So close to being good

Not at all. It’s equal to or worse than fusion.
Metroid games are huge on atmosphere. Dread was the only one with lackluster atmosphere (no good soundtrack and uninspired areas), but was a complete triumph gameplay wise.
Super Metroid might have the best atmosphere out of any game in history. It just feels so dark and lonely and isolated, and the music is perfect.
Nothing can beat Super Metroid, it is a legit top 10 video game of all time.

>>717839875
>Dread
>triumph gameplay wise
>shit tier exploration/level design in a series built on exploration and level design

i fuckin hate the elistism surrounding metroid (and this fucking genre overall)

>>717840448
i never noticed any of that

>>717840248
I'm guessing he really liked the movement tech which is admittedly the best to date.

>>717840876
movement tech is maybe...13th on a list of things for metroid to nail. I don't care how good it is if the core aspects suck.

What are the ten definitive metroidvania games to play? This genre is filled with shovelware.

>>717839354
>game should guarantee a 100% item rate
>game should also reward exploration
retard

>>717837853
remember, when talking with anons like that, that genuinely mentally ill 3rd worlders and legitimate schizos make up 1/3rd of /v/ now. another 1/3rd are marketers and bots. the guy just wantes to tell someone to kill themselves

>>717840448
Please expound

>>717840448
I think a lot of the elitism is internet hyperbole, it's just a series where fans have an autistically specific idea of what the games should be. Look at the romhacks, they are made by and for fanboys who are an ill-fitting skirt away from speed running. For anyone else, they would be obtuse and poorly designed Kaizo bullshit.

>>717841630
Jesus Christ the irony of this post

>>717841181
The Metroids, SotN, Ori, HK, Bloodstained, Nine Sols, Blasphemous 1 and 2

>>717826679
damn yesterday spent watching a long run of this ROM hack, it is extremely solid, I liked the Alien Resurrection take the hard mode story had

>>717814189
ZM is more linear than Super Metroid but most Metroidvanias are less linear than Super Metroid. It's not like ZM is THAT linear either, you're framing it like it's Fusion or Dread.

>>717842891
most Metroidvanias are more linear than Super Metroid*

>>717827678
that cutscene is just an easter egg a reference to TLoZ 2 game over screen

>>717840248
The level design is excellent and the best in the series. The interconnected map design that autists go nuts over is what is lacking

>>717814419
>super zero mission
this but unironically. to this day still one of the best metroid hacks.