Thread 717915970

After YEARS of crying blizzard finally caved to the casual crowd and decided to disable combat addons for their next expansion. How do you feel about the casualization of video games, especially multiplayer ones?

>>717915970 (OP)
>also adds a one button rotation for every class
I assume there will be a console release soon

MMOs are a waste of time and money

>>717915970 (OP)
I you're giving money to blizzard in 2025 you can eat the shit they're serving you.

>getting rid of addons that trivialize content
>casual
retarded thread

>>717917108
Getting rid of addons that they designed a lot of their content around, rather. Between this and housing I imagine they're copying FFXIV's better visual tells.

>>717915970 (OP)
Isn’t installing mods to do better than others in combat kinda casual though? Get good.

>>717915970 (OP)
what do they mean by combat addons?
weak auras?
arena/bg frames that track cooldowns?
something like bigwigs or deadly boss mods?

>>717915970 (OP)
>casualization
relying on an addon to tell u when to do something truly requires elite skill

>>717917108
>>717917195
No, you retards. Addons give you 5 more fucking things to keep track off. In trash mmos like tranny fantasy 14 bosses have like 20 sec windup and lightshows for every attack. In WoW you actually need to keep track of the bosses mechanics instead. That's why wow fights are a lot less scripted than ff bossfights where every mechanic happens at the exact same time every try. If you want your casual dance parties instead of actual bossfights stay with your tranny game.

>>717917346
WoW fights are less scripted because they have like three mechanics

WoW's conveyance of boss mechanics also fucking sucks in comparison

>>717916672
https://www.wowhead.com/news/estimated-dps-loss-with-highlight-assist-and-one-button-rotation-in-patch-11-2-378081

>>717917346
>Addons give you 5 more fucking things to keep track off
No they don't.

>>717915970 (OP)
The fact that they designed raid encounters for almost a decade now, presuming that you had DBM and Weakauras installed and many of the encounters are simply not possible without those addons is insanely bad design. They should have done this a long time ago. The wow dev team is lazy as fuck.

Also this is a prerequisite for the long-delayed console port, along with the single button rotation feature added in 11.1.

>>717917346
Addons spoonfeed you the 5 things you'd normally have to keep track of. While doing it without addons is utterly impossible for WoW players, for Lost Ark god gamers it's boring mundane homework they do 18 times a week.

>>717917757
weakauras slowly got out of control as people learned to script more positional stuff

Making the UI readable is not casualization.
Watching a 45 minute youtube guide on a boss fight to learn a fight that you are barred from practicing/learning in-game is not hardcore.
Having the UI tell you that something bad is about to happen is not easy mode.
Having only your UI due to addons tell you that something bad is about to happen does not make you great at a game.

You're welcome. Let me know if you have any other gay threads you need help understanding.

>>717918042
Doing it without addons is a completely miserable experience in WoW because fights are designed with the assumption you have them, and I cordially invite anyone moaning about them to try.

>>717918419
Yeah and it's taken them this many years to do anything about it. Actually pathetic. Too busy turning women into bowls of fruit instead of anything actually useful

>>717917454
>Assisted Highlight
I assume it only highlights the button to press next. What's up with the dps loss then?

>>717915970 (OP)
WoW has become more casual every year for 18 years now.

>>717917413
>WoW fights are less scripted because they have like three mechanics
WAY more than 3 lol

WoW raids are so autistic and retarded but are propped up by addons that are literally mandatory at this point because more easy fights are a joke due to addons

>>717918672
Ironically the endgame prior to TWW was super not friendly to casuals. It still mostly isn't, but there is something meaningful to do for casuals now at endgame in Delve because M+ is so hostile to anyone that isn't an autismlord. And before you say LFR or queued normals/heroics, you outgear that quickly and the challenge is so nonexistent even grandmas would be bored

>>717918736
I was playing these out in my head and I was wondering where I'd seen most of this shit before, he's just Hypertuned Grynewaht from FFXIV's Ala Mhigo dungeon back in Stormblood except bringing him down to HP thresholds and moving around has buffs and debuffs for some reason.

DPS/healing tracking is fine but I've seen addons that tell you where to stand for boss aoe attacks and countdowns for big attacks I literally don't understand how that's not cheating and blizzard allows it

There's no way they're actually removing combat addons I'm actually shocked

>>717918940
Fundamentally they knew about it and just let it get out of hand. Then after a while, they were so afraid of taking it away and upsetting the playerbase, they started designed encounters around players having it. Everything since Ion took over has been a mistake.

DBM indirectly ruined encounter design so this is a great change on paper at least

How do you casualize a game that's already standing in place pressing buttons as soon as cooldown finishes?

>>717919276
Because the game nowadays is largely about running around like a headless chicken dodging swirlies on the ground and bullet hell projectiles flying towards you. It hasn't been standing in place since at least 2016.

>>717919153
>make encounters based on timers
>dbm displays the timers
>this ruins them

>>717919461
Yes, bosses have to be designed around the players knowing the exact timers. If they weren't they'd be too easy with DBM.

>>717918474
I could do it (my teammates couldn't)

>>717918850
>because M+ is so hostile to anyone that isn't an autismlord

DPS players are so fucking subhuman it has turned into a design problem. Unironically.
It takes no understanding of the game to play DPS. It's 200% unga bunga zug zug dps dodge and do your rotation. The second any responsibility is laid on them shit goes haywire, the community complains and shit goes back to healers and tanks. It's an actual insane state of affairs.
The vast, vast majority of the time you can't rely on them to actually use fucking potions. Or dispel. Or to have the slightest idea of what the route is. A good amount of the time they won't even know the mechanics of the fucking bosses beyond the very minimum of what they are forced to.
By and large the design of the game itself lays responsibility on tanks and healers, but then, beyond of what the game explicitly sets, they end up taking even more responsibility in groups because the average DPS is a fucking 75 IQ vaping monkey high off their mind and this single button business is a simple acknowledgement of that fact.
It wouldn't take autists to run M+ if 90% of the effort wasn't put by 40% of the community.

>>717919354
Try 2009. Shit stopped being that in ulduar.

>>717919907
It's a problem in FF14 too and the entire problem is DPS trackers. People are so obsessed with parsing high that literally anything that lowers DPS, even if it makes clears consistent, is seen as bad. Even tanks and healers will try to skip mechanics for more DPS

>>717917289
You're talking about a community that has convinced themselves an 18 hour headstart is actually a disadvantage in a race. Wowfags are pretty low IQ.

>>717919907
I agree with you and it's the reason they should have left M+ as challenge modes for spergs like they were in MOP, instead of making it the main endgame, when most of the playerbase is incapable of doing them properly and it just breeds anger and resentment between players instead of anyone having fun, which is what gaming is meant to be about. Putting a timer on top of it, just boils the crucible of anger even hotter

>>717918896
Poor Guy. Good duty, great music. Meanwhile generic filler ogre adhd fest has what? Retards screaming at each other.

>>717916672
More like mobile release lmao

>>717917454
>Jayda (he/him)
Why the fuck would you use such a faggy source? There has to be one that isn't like that.

>>717915970 (OP)
I started a trial account like 2 or 3 years ago after taking a huge break after playing 2006-2011. I was in shock and awe that none of the monsters in the starting areas agro anymore and they all LITERALLY die with one hit. You end up over leveling before you even have a chance to fully see what the area offers

>>717917226
They already released a "cooldown tracker" that is similar to some WeakAuras
It's trash
They're aiming to kill things like Deadly Boss Mod, which admittedly, their encounters are terrible and impossible to do without bigwigs/dbm since there is no telegraph and everything one shots if you mess up.
The worst part is their retail API changes get pushed onto Classic, and Classic content is peak "designed with addons in mind"

>>717920345
I saw this fucking cutscene on /v/ the other day and I couldn't believe it was real. The shitty mobile game ads like Wolf Game look like they have better animation than this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXvToh3lYwY

>>717918736
I dunno, wow raid guides are like 5 minutes per boss

>>717915970 (OP)
If they remove parsing and other meta faggotry from WoW it either will die instantly or it will be better than it has ever been. No middle ground here.

>>717920530
kek

Expecting DPS to keep up is a form of harassment

I want to be optimistic but WoW specs nowadays are so fucking dependent on addons. You're expected to track from 4-5 buffs and then 2-3 debuffs on top of that on some specs. I think the removal of combat automation helpers is obviously good and frees up game design space but this worries me.

I tried this TWW with a super open mind after not playing retail for 12 years. It was extremely boring, mindless, and unfun. Zero challenge. Zero stakes. The entire experience just felt like a little point and click themepark adventure made for pre teens. I am not exaggerating. Everything was awful. The cutscenes. I tried to follow the story with an open mind. I can't believe thats the real game. Today I checked the wow subreddit and the people there made me want to kill myself. Look at the top post about gay orc and read the comments. Where the fuck did this crowd come from? But anways yeah retail wow is dead to me no matter what.

>>717921045
Hey it's not as if the company has an absolutely dogshit track record on this regard right?

Reminder that if it weren't for addons we wouldn't even have fucking action bars.

>>717921118
There was a massive exodus of players during Shadowlands and the only ones left behind are mentally ill toxic positivity types who howl if you so much as lightly criticize the game. The r/wow sub is beyond fucked. This is the only place you can discuss wow sensibly

And yes, TWW is incredibly mediocre. The game lost most of its devs over the pandemic. They bought another studio called Proletariat Games who made a miserable BR called Spellbreak and moved all 150 of their employees over to making wow. They’re the ones making the game now, which is why it feels so different (bad).

>>717915970 (OP)
Hear me out: Why not make the combat fun instead so people don't try to skip it in the first place?

this might finally kill wow

>>717920345
WoW is such a good argument for why dumping infinite money into a project will never produce anything good

>>717921762
employing more people at the slop factory just produces greater quantities of slop

>>717915970 (OP)
Last time I played this game the numbers were in the millions, just looks retarded as fuck watching so many numbers fly around the screen, shits obnoxious.

>>717921639
I suspect you have no idea of how much of an issue addon bloat has become anon.

Here, take a glance at this: https://wago.io/search/imports/wow/all?q=ovinax

These are weakauras, custom groups of alerts/messages/tracking shit.

Ovinax is ONE boss. Yes there are 135 VERSIONS of some tracking bullshit for ONE. FUCKING. BOSS. Yes it's an extreme case but you gotta understand fucking guilds going for world first have people developing shit on the fucking go in order to beat encounters. It can't get much worse.

>wow
>blizzard
>2025

WHO GIVES A FUCK!?

>>717918538
blizz recommended rotation vs actual best rotation as mathed out by nerds on discord

>>717915970 (OP)
>casuals
>crying about addons
???
Casuals depend on addons, always have and always will.

>>717921568
it’s like they’re stuck in the 2010s before everyone was disgusted with drag