Thread 717977175

skyrim still has bugs after 10 years of patching. they'll never finished a game again

How are they quirky?

>>717977175 (OP)
Bethesda is going to die next game they release. There'll be a lot of cope around them for a while but the next game is going to put an end to the studio as it is.

>>717977175 (OP)
Yup. how df skyrim got perfect scores across the board in 2011 was beyond me.

>>717977262
All games have bugs that never get fixed.

>>717977335
Because the games are so buggy but they try their best anon :)

bugs are one thing but it's the ass backwards way they do literally all of their programming. how was there no higher up somewhere along the way who said "we need to eventually replace or upgrade this toolchain".

>>717978017
>bugs are one thing but it's the ass backwards way they do literally all of their programming
Any examples?

this place really does drive the devil into you
holy obsession

>>717977435
Because it's a fine game no matter how much /v/ seethes about it

>>717978436
>a broken product is fine
this is why gamers are the highest tier of consoomers

>>717978481
It's not broken. It's flawed. There's a difference.

>>717978203
nta and probably "muh merchant chests muh train headgear". They can't claim ladders anymore because Slopfield does have them.

>>717978481
Jank=/=broken. Bugs comes with the territory when you're designing immersive open worlds with large maps and so many systems.

>>717978641
Starfield only has ladders inside ships where the navmeshes don't really matter. The train headgear was just a clever way of doing a one off thing instead of having to code entirely new systems for it

>>717978564
>>717978673
>still making excuses for releasing a unfinished product
small indie dev do not bully

>>717978641
Yeah, I was expecting those exact examples. I wonder why so many ignorant people are so obsessed with trying to shit on Gamebryo/Creation Engine.

>>717978803
>no argument
Figures

What's your favourite Bethesda bug?
For me, it's the one in Skyrim where Skjor just randomly shows up alive in the Companions hall long after he is supposed to be dead. He can even keep giving you quests.
I think the issue is that his "dead" model is the werewolf one and the game doesn't really conflate the two as being the same character.

>>717979043
Can you consider Giants launching you into the stratosphere a bug? If not, I remember if you Unrelenting Force'd Dawnbreaker off its pedestal you could grab two copies of it and dual wielding it

>>717979043
my favorite is the one that spans through Oblivion/Fallout 3/New Vegas and Skyrim on PS3 where the save gets more corrupted the longer you play until eventually the game runs at a whopping 3fps
its like a small timelimit to complete the game

>>717979043
Not a bug technically but if you kill off Balgruf via console shenannigans his brother becomes Jarl with dialogue and everything. You softlocked at the meeting at High Hrothgar late into the game because the scripting for is incomplete

>>717978965
>Still no argument

>>717977175 (OP)
They’re successful because no one else does sandbox RPGs with the same level of detail and content.

It’s that simple.

>>717979043
His dead model is not a werewolf. It's his regular body. The bug was triggered by a random wilderness event for companions that may cause Skjor to be respawned if enough time has passed since his death for the game to have automatically deleted his corpse from the corpse storage.

>>717979327
>he actually spends money on this

>>717979475
Works on my machine

>>717979251
Saves in Bethesda games are weird in general. As a kid, I figured out that if you only use manual saves and you face a wall with your weapon holstered when saving, it prevents any gamebreaking bugs from occurring at all. I assume this is because when you load a save, it gives the game less to render in initially, which keeps it from shitting itself from information overload.

>>717979475
>He still has no arguments
What did Bethesda do to mind break you this hard? Especially when Starfield was so mediocre.

>>717978673
>. Bugs comes with the territory when you're designing immersive open worlds with large maps and so many systems.
ive played dozens of open world RPG's yet none of them come close to how buggy Bethsoft games are
300 hours into the Witcher 3 and the game never crashed on me

>>717979791
Saving and loading is very highly optimized in Bethesda's games. Optimized code is generally fragile code.

>>717980734
I love TW3, but anyway who has played knows that it's nothing like Bethesda's games, no open-world RPG is.

>>717980874
>it's nothing like Bethesda's games,
it actually works for one

>>717980734
The two aren’t comparable. You can’t don’t have the ability to enter pretty much every building and interact with every object that each have their own physics in The Witcher 3. You also can’t kill the vast majority of NPCs in the game like you can in Beth games.

Beth games are just way more complicated in terms of their general architecture and that ambition leads to jank.

>>717980734
Games like The Witcher 3, GTA, Far Cry, etc. are fake open world games. There is very, very little persistence in those games. Lot of very heavy handed scripting for events. Often just straight up doing nothing but playing back entirely pre-scripted animation sequences and nothing more. Not a lot of reliance on game systems to handle things. Bethesda does things almost the complete opposite way to that. Makes for a little unreliability but far, far more modder friendly game.

>>717980734
There's an entire wiki page on TW3 bugs https://witcher.fandom.com/wiki/The_Witcher_bugs
I've had the game crash on my a few times while playing. I never played too much though since I couldn't stand the janky combat and I got tied of castjng quem over and over. Skyrim's combat is basic as alm hell but the hitboxes are at least true to the attack animations and you can avoid them reliably by just moving

>>717980948
So does Bethesda's games, which is why people still play them.

>>717980967
>You can’t don’t have the ability to enter pretty much every building
Oh wow i can enter all 5 houses in Imperial city
Impressive

>>717980980
Bethesda games are closer to immersive sims than the are to a lot of open world games, I feels they have more in common with games like Deus Ex, Dishonored and nu-Hitman than they do with something like the average Ubisoft game. They’re just jankier than any of those games because they try to couple immersive sim level detail and emergent gameplay with a massive open world. The sheer effort it takes to make something like that is why we’re yet to have a “Bethesda killer”.

>>717981057
>but the hitboxes are at least true to the attack animations and you can avoid them reliably by just moving
Stop, they aren't and you can't. Which is why there is a mod that fixes it. and everyone should use it.

>>717981089
The sheer level of interactivity creates the illusion of the locations being bigger than they actually are. They have to do that, because the sheer level of detail would make having hundreds of enterable buildings in one place impractical.

>>717981304
You can though. I do it reliably without mods. The only mobs whose attacks you can't avoid by just spacing are giants due to the shockwave and trolls and wolves because they're fast and lunge forwards

>>717981603
The only way you can avoid attacks is by backpedaling out of their range. You can't sidestep them, and even then backpedaling rarely works against forward power attacks because of fast and far they are.

>>717977175 (OP)
>they are so hecking quirky
Who? Where?
Bethesda games are the blandest shit imaginable
Have you seen starfield?
It's literally HR-core in every dialog there

>>717977607
Has the big chungus who made this reddit image ever met a person who actually crawled with fleas and bugs irl?
Yikes
You wouldn't want to be near such a person

>>717979418
This nigger plays gayrim

>>717977175 (OP)
>anon plays a non-nintendo game for the first time
>BUGS? IN A VIDEO GAME??

>>717981916
In third person you can just turn around and sprint in short bursts. With movement enchants you can kite basically everything

>>717981089
This but unironically, it's what people like you don't seem to get for some reason. Their motto when making a new Elder Scrolls is always "go wherever you want, be whoever you want, do whatever you want". It's the philosophy that makes TES so played alongside the level of interaction you can have with the universe. Sure in a normal warrior-leaning playthrough you might never enter every NPC's house, but then you play a thief next time around and suddenly all those named houses belonging to named NPCs each with their own schedule are a whole lot more important. What if I want to kill that NPC and his schedule helps me isolate him in a random street at the right time when there are no guards around? What if reverse pickpocket a daedric dagger into his inventory then hit him with a Frenzy spell? That's the kind of shit no other games allow you to do to this scale in an open world RPG which is why dozens of thousands of people still play a 15yo singleplayer game daily

>>717982132
>woah your used to games working out of the box how stupid of you anon :^)

>>717978203
Bugs they fix in old games still turn up in newer ones. These niggers can't use source control properly or something?

>>717982339
There are no movement enchantments in Skyrim.

>>717982502
>"go wherever you want,
unless a invisible wall stops you or a door that cant be opened
> be whoever you want,
always be the chosen one whos the greatest at everything , with amazing dialouge options like Yes, No (yes), seek more info, Yes (sarcasticly)
>do whatever you want
oh you want to handle this quest through other means than killing and looting? cant do that, want to kill this quest essential character? cant do that, heres 3 endings good luck with that dickhead

>>717982540
Any examples?

>>717981321
>The sheer level of interactivity creates the illusion of the locations being bigger than they actually are.
oh wow theres 5 npc's walking around (3 cant be killed because they are marked as essential) and i can move objects around with physiscs that have been around since Half Life 2
very immersive

>>717982564
There are from rings the free fishjng dlc as well as t>>717982669
he boots from dragonborne.

>>717983019
Didn't mean to reply to that second post.

>>717982849
who plays without "no essential npcs" mod. it's the most important mod of all for me

>>717977175 (OP)
Would not say they made it widely accepted, but that annoying subsection of people that cope by telling you to install 50gb of mods to fix it are especially prevalent with their games.
Usually, this is reserved for indie early access dogshit, not decades old fully released titles, but this company sucks at finishing games, so those people answer the call to action.
Other games get rightfully shit on for being buggy messes.

>>717983142
>mods make it good
that should about do it, every Bethesda cope has been posted in this thread

>>717977175 (OP)
It's incredible how a company so incompetent has so much success. Their fans are truly that stupid.

Their games require several fixing mods to work, and a console command to fix broken quests.

It's ridiculous and an absolute dreadful experience for console gamers.
Yet, they are praised for sucking that bad.

>>717982669
>unless a invisible wall stops you
See that mountain? You can climb it
>always be the chosen one
You could've just said your first game was Skyrim
>oh you want to handle this quest through other means than killing and looting? cant do that
But you can. Learn to pickpocket and sneak past enemies
>heres 3 endings
Sounds like a neat RPG, thanks anon

>>717983019
What boots exactly? I don't remember any boots from Dragonborn that increased movement speed.

>>717979043
>What's your favourite Bethesda bug?
probably the funniest was when Flak from Fallout 3 for some reason followed me around like a companian and didnt have any fingers. He'd shoot at enemies with his double barrel but it floated in front of his club hand.

>>717983385
>>heres 3 endings
>Sounds like a neat RPG, thanks anon
GTA V might as well be a RPG then

>>717983385
>See that mountain? You can climb it
you cant climb them all
>Learn to pickpocket and sneak past enemies
nearly every single quest ends in you killing someone rather than making a deal or something. Skyrim quests are very barebones.
>Sounds like a neat RPG, thanks anon
go away todd

>>717983410
Boots of blinding speed. They were an item from morrowind and reimplemented in Dragonborn. You need to counteract the blinding debuff to use them but you can do it pretty easily using alchemy. You can cross the map in ten seconds with them

>>717982849
You sound mad

>>717983518
>nearly every single quest ends in you killing someone rather than making a deal or something. Skyrim quests are very barebones.
That's just plain not true. Actually, I'll think you'll find very few quests in Skyrim actually require you to kill anything and most of the ones that you do are very explicitly about killing something, i.e. bounty hunting quests. The majority of quests in Skyrim are either glorified pick up or glorified delivery or glorified both.

>>717977175 (OP)
that bethesdaland presentation they did where they acted as if they are the hottest shit in the industry still makes me mad to think about. these guys SUCK

>>717983506
All good RPGs have multiple endings but not all games that have multiple endings are RPGs

>>717983518
>you cant climb them all
But you can
>nearly every single quest ends in you killing someone
Sounds like a (You) issue, plenty of choices end with either dialogue or the objective of the quest located in a chest or a character's inventory without the need for death
>go away todd
I just accept the strengths of TES III~V without losing my mind, fren. As stated, there's a reason Skyrim is played more than Starfield and there hasn't been a 'Skyrim Killer' yet

>>717983705
That's not Dragonborn, that's Creation Club shit. Which is why I was so confused.

>>717981321
I'll take a Whirerun over a Novigrad any day of the week

>>717981089
You don't get it. It's okay.

>>717984263
youre not entirely wrong... yeah, every quest is quite barebones, especially with the mainquestline just being a "hero clears all the dungeons" series

>>717984460
>But you can
im pretty sure there are moutains you can see that you cant climb... invisible wall
>plenty of choices end with either dialogue or the objective of the quest located in a chest or a character's inventory without the need for death
plenty of interactions with NPCs have a very simplistic ending. Skyrim's quests very often have one ending.

>>717985070
>im pretty sure there are moutains you can see that you cant climb
I mean, you probably shouldn't try to head to High Rock same way you shouldn't try to head to Morrowind from Vvanderfell
>plenty of interactions with NPCs...
That's nice but we were talking about quests that required you to kill NPCs to progress, anone

>>717985302
>talking about quests that required you to kill NPCs
do get things straight, lets just say "Every quest that requires you to confront an NPC". Those ones more than not require you to chop at them with a sword

>>717978872
>I wonder why so many ignorant people are so obsessed with trying to shit on Gamebryo/Creation Engine.
they don't understand programming

>>717977175 (OP)
Their most recent game wasn't "bug ridden", memebrained retard.

>>717985976
Define "requires you". Is it the game's fault if the player goes out his way to get bounty hunting or Dark Brotherhood quests where the very intention is to hunt someone down and kill them? I confronted the likes of Mikael or The Caller or Rolff Stone-Fist just fine

>>717986263
if only it was content ridden, kek

>>717977175 (OP)
>makes releasing unfinished bug ridden games acceptable
Never happened. Bethesda simply got away with it because people enjoyed the content, systems, and settings of the games. However, Fallout 4 straddled the line when it came to having enough content to drive player engagement (barebones writing / quests). Starfield shit the bed. The "mods will fix it" mentality is going to kill this company if they fail to deliver a role playing game that encourages role playing.

New Vegas is proof that a disastrous release state isn't necessarily damning when the underlying game draws enough attention.

>>717987476
>The "mods will fix it" mentality
Never existed with Bethesda, that was something you projected on them. The majority of their sales come from console and gamepass

The worst part is how they destroyed Doom multiplayer by first excluding classic game modes because it would "compete" with other product segments in their lineup and secondly nerfing weapons to shit in order to cater to redditors who can't deal with powerful weapons.

>>717986360
>Dark Brotherhood
haha oh yeah that's another faction that makes you the leader in like a day lmao

>>717979043
Not sure about favorite, but Fallout 4 is full of annoying bugs.
>companion will never travel to settlement
>companion affinity dialogue never triggers
>triggered Open Season by toggling the breaker on Spectacle Island
>Sandman / Ninja / Cloak & Dagger are autistic
Never get anything funny like in FO3 / NV. Just a bunch of aggravating QoL issues.

>>717987773
This is the company who implemented CC, Creations, and mod functionality on console. Where have you been?

>>717988336
None of the CC content "fixes" anything, they're just microtransactions

>>717988778
You could argue that they flesh out a few things that needed it in FO4, but I mostly agree. Convenient that you ignored the official mod support they added for console versions of Skyrim and FO4 kek.

>>717977175 (OP)
that was always the industry standard

>>717989330
>Convenient that you ignored the official mod support they added for console versions of Skyrim and FO4 kek.
Convenient that you keep moving the goal posts but okay. Most console mods are only additions and aesthetic changes. They don't even have a category for "Bug Fixes".

Arthmoor's "Unofficial Patch" isn't even a patch, it's changes he made of things in the games that he doesn't like. Bethesda play tested Skyrim and made Archery a stealth skill that gets boosts from the Thief Stone. Arthmoor changed this to move Archery to combat.

>>717987952
The Dark Brotherhood is genuinely the best faction questline in the game because you actually have solid progression from just doing low level hit jobs, to getting increasingly more high profile targets, culminating in you killing the Emperor.

I feel like it’s the most high effort questline in the game, just like the DB questline in Oblivion was.

>>717989776
Identifying a lack of content as a problem that can be fixed is not moving goalposts. In fact, I would say a lack of content is THE biggest issue with Fallout 4, so having mod support + CC (and likely Creations, eventually) could easily be seen as a "fix".

And by saying "most", you're conceding that there are bug fixes available through console mod support. Why would you choose to die on this hill?

>>717988124
FO3 and NV both have amusing glitches where NPC heads will spin like clock hands when you’re talking to them. Something about the character models seems to make them prone to glitches. 3 also has a glitch where one of the regulators or Talon mercs can have a white head, but black arms and legs.

>>717990256
I really think a big reason that 4 wasn’t as popular as 3 and NV was because they kneecapped the RPG elements from both those games, and placed way too much emphasis on base building. People play 3 and NV for a mix of shoot and loot dungeon crawling and RPing, not for playing the game like it’s Minecraft.

>>717990256
"Lack of content" isn't a bug, it's your personal perception. Fallout 4 had more content than any previous bethesda game.
>so having mod support + CC (and likely Creations, eventually) could easily be seen as a "fix"
mod support isn't a fix, bethesda isn't telling people to mod their games
>And by saying "most"
Do you really believe a skin texture for a gun is a fix?
>there are bug fixes available through console mod support.
They don't have a script extender brainlet, the "fixes" are just changes, they don't fix anything

>>717990524
Voiced protagonist hurt the game a lot, as did the changes to SPECIAL / perks. Settlement building was surprisingly engaging, but like the rest of the game, it was underbaked. What kills the game for me is that the quest narratives / writing are shit for roleplaying. You can look at Nuka World for the extreme case, but almost every quest is underwhelming in terms of player agency. And the voiced protagonist actively works against any narrative you may be trying to insert for yourself.

>>717981994
>>717981994
see pic

>>717990620
>isn't a bug
You're outing yourself as an autist for hyperfixating on the word "bug". OP also used the word "unfinished" which was the driver for my comments addressing a lack of content. I'm not going to argue with someone who was lost from the beginning.

>>717991074
You're the one who calls a "lack of content" a "bug"

>>717990524
the thing is Fallout 3 isnt a very good game either. It's definitely way more bearable though because there's no annoying voiced protag.

I really fucking hate this with a passion to the point they deserve the monicker Bugthesta.
Its like they are even expecting it at this point, and hoping that some nerd out there will fix their shit for free, and outright skip quality control or asking some interns to fix the shits thats broken if its not broken on release at the 15 minutes in the game.
Bugthesta giving you the kit to do modding should be to make shit, not to fix this bullshit.
Its worse when several games had reported bugs for years known to everyone to the point their wikis even have notes on the bugs, and they still do not solve them by default.

>>717990954
>Morrowind
Old-guard Bethesda game. Toddslop starts with Oblivion.
Saying Morrowind is a Toddslop is like saying Starcraft is an ActiBlizz slop.

>>717991767
>Bugthesta giving you the kit to do modding should be to make shit, not to fix this bullshit
Anon, it took almost 6 month for Skyrim to get creation kit. Same-ish with Fallout 4. IIRC, it took a whole year for shitfield to get its kit.
So much for that. XEdit started as a skyrim editor because CK was delayed.

>>717991406
3 was a good enough game that it made Fallout actually relevant again after the franchise killed itself through bad spin-offs and publisher mismanagement.

FO3 being a bad game is largely historical revisionism. It was widely praised on release, and the people who hated it where in the minority.

>>717993203
>FO3 being a bad game is largely historical revisionism
Fallout New Vegas effectively proves that Fallout 3 is just a significantly worse game than what it could have been. The direction Fallout 3 went with it's mainquestline and overall setting is nonsense. The writing is very lame, and there really aren't very many options in questlines for the player to make.

>>717994467
>there really aren't very many options in questlines for the player to make

This isn’t true. Most of the side quests have branching paths and account for a number of different playstyles. Even the main quests, which are often more linear, have different ways you can approach most of them.

As for the writing, it’s obvious that was a secondary concern. Bethesda games don’t usually focus on the main questlines and instead focus on side content. No one plays Bethesda games for their main quests, hence why they often phone in that aspect.

>this is the kind of shit Bethshit spends a decade on
woah
so much freedom and immersion

>>717984715
Based

>>717994678
>No one plays Bethesda games for their main quests, hence why they often phone in that aspect
You got that backwards. It's not "they phone it in because nobody plays their main quests", it's "nobody plays their main quests because they know they'll be written like utter dogshit". People love the crap out of Dagoth Ur and Akulakhan, comparatively

>>717994678
>Most of the side quests have branching paths and account for a number of different playstyles
Literally the only quests that come to mind that actually has choice is the slaver quest at Paradise Falls or whatever it's called and the stupid robot guy vs ant woman quest. Everything else is very bare bones.

>>717977175 (OP)
They are popular when the game is fun even with the bugs.
Bad and buggy games are just never talked about.
>I don't find the games fun
That is a you problem.

>>717977175 (OP)
Dear God...

>>717992923
You retarded or merely pretending?

>>717990256
>lack of content is THE biggest issue with Fallout 4
You are mentally ill

WHO'S LAUGHING NOW?

>>718003061
Everybody. They are laughing at Bethesda

>>718001450
Settlement building with rusty sheet metal and wooden planks is not content. Neither are "another settlement needs ou-YOUR help" quests and their likes.

>>717979043
I especially love the CONSTANT cell crashes with Oblivion on PC, doesn't matter if vanilla, lightly modded, not modded at all etc. pp.
Meanwhile even the abhorrent FO3 port worked like a charm for me with a few mods, maybe 5 crashes in a whole playthrough.
Never going to replay Oblivion because of that shit, not buying some cashgrab garbage or Shitrym with some Oblivion skins.

>>718005204
>Oblivion constantly crashes
Problem with your setup. Mine works fine - i do get some crashes, but they are quite rare.
There is a bug with havok and speedtree, which makes any system crash if you are in a densely forested area, and by that i mean a specific area east of Skingrad - the redwood forest. Other ones work fine.

My issue with Oblivion is just how little meaningful content there is, especially for character.
>no black hoods whatsoever, and you need to kill either of 3 NPCs to obtain it
>only one set of unenchanted green robes and hood in the entire game
>no gloves clothing item, all you get are wrist irons, and there is a maximum of 3 in the entire game
And like that for a lot of items, which is made even worse by level-scaled loot/item tables
>want a nice ring?
>come back when lvl 16
>want a nice staff?
>come back when lvl 20
>got that unique sword at lvl 4?
>its a worthless and USELESS trophy now that you've hit lvl 10
Oblivion is garbage. A genuine piece of garbage that was overhyped to shit because Morrowind, despite is flaws, was the last good game Bethesda made. After Todd took over, it all went to shit.

As for the cashgrab - Oblivion remaster is just that - absolute abhorent piece of shit. Skyrim is shit too because they now push paid mods in full on creation club, and most of them are genuine trash.

>>717996036
I think he was including stuff like stealth or combat approaches. Technically different but quickly forgotten.

>>718006609
>Problem with your setup
Might be but I tried to play the game with 4 different PCs, Windows XP, 7 and 10 and I'm not a complete moron when it comes mods, I always read the info files and checked for compability issues.
And yeah, the leveling system was absolute dogshit, I just liked the cities, landscapes and the janky NPCs.
I played Oblivion first, then Skyrim and a few years ago Morrowind and while I can appreciate Morrowind as the best RPG out of the three the game world just looks like shit, almost everything brown and grey, Skyrim as well.

>>718009513
I should've clarified that i was playing vanilla, and vanilla + 1 esp file with adjustments i baked for myself.
The issue with mods is that they do indeed make Oblivion unstable. Especially if you use shartmoor's unofficial patch. I have no idea what it would make the game unstable, but it does (ran the game with just it - so many more crashes than just vanilla). Mods that do scripts and especially heavy scripting. Mods that do spawns and leveled creature lists. I had a mod that would crash the game mercilessly, and it turns out that the reason it did that was a missing inventory entry on bandits for an item from a mod that it was dependent on. Also, some mods just dont play nice with each other, and those compatibility patches can mess the whole setup even when you follow the instructions.
And then there are mods that are just plain shit and will crash or tank your game straight to desktop. I know of two - one added high-heels (script, and tanked fps to barely 20), another one was for flight, levitation, and wings (and kept crashing randomly).

So... exercise caution. A lot of it. There are mods that will brick even vanilla Morrowind, not to mention Skyrim (SE specifically).

>>717979043
>operation anchorage dlc
>shove a dead body onto the simulation chair
>purportedly do the entire simulation while laying down on top of a corpse
>before you're even fully awake, shove the entire DLCs worth of weapons onto the body before the script takes it all away
>due to the nature of the DLC not factoring this plausibility, all weapons have impossible health stats
>roam the wastes as a killing machine with unbreakable gear
as well as any other exploit that involves a corpse

>>717979251
sounds like this bug
>During gameplay, the game maintains 'ActorCause' objects, which track information about the source of projectiles and explosions. These objects contain the source actor, their position, and a list of all actors detecting them at the time the weapon is fired. Due to an oversight in the game's design, the list is not calculated correctly for the player, causing it to grow excessively large over time with potentially thousands of actors. This list is not used in-game, but it is still saved, leading to bloated save files.

>>718010460
>shartmoor's unofficial patch
Isn't that just for Skyrim? I used the regular UOP for Oblivion, maybe that's shit anyway.
I've also tried vanilla, first few hours are fine and then cell crashes appear more and more often until it's 50/50 if the game crashes or not when I exit a cave or some shit which totally breaks immersion. At this point I've just given up replaying Oblivion again.

>>717977175 (OP)
Skyrim was like 14 years ago man and pretty much everything they've put out since has gotten massive hate and people trust the company less and less.