Thread 718145205

Is Nioh a souls-like or a character action game?

It started as a soulslike but it evolved into its own brand of hack and slash action rpg. It's certainly not a character action because fundamentals still dominate combo expression and that's a good thing

>>718145205 (OP)
Souls like are based around exploration with a small amount of design for combat
Nioh is the opposite, it's a character action game. The combat is the focus, not the levels/world

>>718145205 (OP)
It's a garbage game for people who think they're too cool for Souls.

the horrendous fixed angle camera lock of 1 and 2 are souls-like
3 might actually be character action

>>718145205 (OP)
Diablo-like

>>718145205 (OP)
It's third person Diablo. A lootshit game.

>>718145205 (OP)
It's Ninja Gaiden-like.

>>718145432
lmao, is that DSP, literally slash the horns holy shit, high stance light attack, one hit is all you need, just line up the hitbox bro

Slay any yokai lately?

It doesn't have clunky combat, so it's not souls.

>>718145572
Should've used Hideyoshi's Rising Sun helmet for this meme. That's some real gigachad aura.

It's a hack and slash.

>>718145423
>t. soulshitter

>>718145205 (OP)
Nioh is a nioh-like.
It is echelons above any "souls-like" and is it's own genre.

>>718145652
>all slightly bigger enemies have infinite hyper armor
>you get fuck all i-frames, dashing into an attack will kill you
>not clunky
???
The combat is essentially just backstep to let them whiff then punish. It's not very good.

>>718145782
Is this post ironic?

>>718145205 (OP)
At its base it's a soulsike, but Team Ninja decided to push the combat forward really hard for the genre, so it went in its own direction compared to fromsoft and other souls clones by certifying its own gameplay identity. This in turn

>>718145782
>soulshitter has an existential crisis when she cannot epicly iframe into the wholesome chungus radahn's screen wide aoe and force him to kneel with two unsheathe r2s

>>718145841
Explain how else you would fight tengu, cyclops, tongue monk etc

>>718145205 (OP)
It's neither. It's an action game

>>718145432
Is this the alpha? Looks like his waist armor is broken

>>718145205 (OP)
It's a diablo-like

>>718145928
Hit their weakness or apply elemental effects to delete their hyper armor.

>>718145928
Block and i-frame, hit weakspot, deplete ki, unleash extended combo

>>718145928
Depends on the weapon. Tonfa? Wail on them and time demon dance to dodge their attacks and continue their onslaught
Odachi? You can just parry them or cuckoo's call and keep your combo going
Katana? Weave low stance with dodges, kicks and ki bursts to deplete their stamina and wail on them.
Alternatively, break horns to instantly deplete ki, whether with high stance attacks or arrows.
Being unable to be aggressive is entirely a skill issue, the game gives you plenty of ways to do so.

>>718145423
souls casuals need to go back

>>718145205 (OP)
It absolutely does not matter what you call it. But Candle Type 1a calls it a soulslike, and I like Candle Type 1a so that is what I am inclined to call it.

>>718145205 (OP)
I miss just calling these games 'action games'. But sure it's character action.

>Random looter and slash
no, it's dogshit

>>718145205 (OP)
>gigachad.playstation.input.jpg

>>718145782
>>you get fuck all i-frames, dashing into an attack will kill you
This is quite literally a non-issue.
One of the main gripes I have with souls combat is that it's just devolved into fucking roll spam with the low stamina cost for rolling and constant large aoe attacks that require you to roll them
Positioning isn't even a thought in the majority of souls players heads anymore.

>>718145928
>tengu
>one eyed oni
>onyudo

Ah, I see. You're just a new player. Try to fight them in mid or low stance at first. Dodge to the side to reposition. The tengu has a spin attack that can be annoying, just conserve your ki and drain theirs with short combos/attacks. Ippon soul core is really strong and can destroy ki bar, use it if you have one.

Once you've reduced a yokai's purple ki, they will be staggered by every attack, even from low stance.

Remember to block and utilize ninjutsu, onmyo magic, talismans, sacred water, etc.

>>718146387
Now, let's not act like dodges in Nioh aren't super strong. You can iframe through plenty of stuff.

>>718146387
>This is quite literally a non-issue.
I was stuck on Hino-Enma for a bit, couldn't figure out how to dance between her attacks, I would always get clipped. then said fuck it, I'll just youtube a guide. And the guy just backsteps out of her whole combo and only punishes the last hit. Is this how the game is meant to be played? That video had a LOT of views.

>>718146468
>Ippon soul core is really strong and can destroy ki bar, use it if you have one.
Nioh 2 only's really just ippon through all their problems and don't know how to play the actual game lmao

>>718146493
A compelling argument, however.

>>718146642
Balan-sama...

>>718145205 (OP)
Diablo but with real combat hence its a "DIACTION"

>>718146639
>t. living weapon user

Post the best girl

The combat is too good to be called a soulslike

>>718146468
>The tengu has a spin attack that can be annoying
The tengu spin kick is basically a freebie, it has almost no range. You can just dodge and get behind them.
>>718146540
Hino-Enma is the big filter the game has, IMO. Dodging back and waiting can definitely be a safe and easy way to get past her but I wouldn't say it's the most satisfying. You can perfectly dance between attacks, remember that you have three types of dodges. Low stance is the snappiest and lets you block while dodging for extra safety. Mid stance is decent enough and covers good distance and chaining a second dodge will give you high stance's roll, which is the slowest but has plenty of iframes

>>718146864
You can block-dodge in mid stance too. As long as it's a dash rather than a roll you can do it.

>>718145423
Based fromgods enjoyer

>>718146984
>memorable and deep story
>from software
LMAO

>>718145928
The same way I fight everything: in slow motion lmao.

>play fist weapon in nioh2
>complete and utter kino, endless amount of combos

>play elden ring fist weapon
>light attack and heavy attack
ye im thinking from software combat is garbage

>>718146642
Did /v/ died after Balan release? Where is the updated input graph with newer games?

>>718147136
>tfw you find out fists come with Royalguard

>>718145782
I'm a Nioh-shitter that never made to the higher NG++++ modes, but you can dodge everything in this game and blocking actually works.

>>718147136
SOTE fist weapons were such a fucking disappointment, not even close to bone fist, let alone Nioh.

>>718146847
I really dislike the out-yo-ass shinobi transformation. What was wrong with weapon swap like in RoR?

>>718147705
Royalguard is smalltime. The actual unique gimmick of Nioh 2 fists is the Defensive Drop which adds an entirely new way of dodging attacks. Ducking avoids an immense shitload of attacks including a ton of projectiles and entire yokai combos, and Sunrise is immensely powerful too.

>>718148162
The character gets a sacred relic that allows him to equip entire sets instantly, Nioh 3 is just one giant Garo tribute.

>>718148221
I love GARO, this is nothing like that.

>>718148101
What's SOTE?

>>718146642
Balan-dono...

>>718145205 (OP)
I would say it's technically a soulslike, but it goes it's own way with combat design.

>>718147136
>fists
Play Sifu.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7hZSWtkYN_c

>>718148162
We found some Dresspheres. We X-2 now

>>718148369
Shadow of the erdtree
It added two fist weapons and two beast claw weapons and they are all nowhere nearly as fun to use
And by the gods i've tried to give them a fair chance

>>718148369
Elden Ring DLC. They added a "martial arts" weapon, basically you can kick now, and it deals a truck ton of poise damage, so you just spam one move the whole game, no reason to ever punch.

>>718145928
You fight everything in this game with buffs and debuffs that let you melt it in under a minute. It leans in on arpg elements more that DS.

>>718145205 (OP)
It's character action.

Nioh is Ninja Gaiden with the jumping ability removed and replaced with dodging. It was also given a lock on to emulate souls like.

It re-uses animations, combos, button inputs, assets, 3D models and much more directly from Ninja Gaiden, down to the weapons you use and the button input's resulting attack. It's a modified Ninja Gaiden turned into a new IP. Don't believe me? Too bad, I'm only telling you the truth. They even re-used some asset from DOA with one of the bosses emulating Nyo Tengu.

>>718148162
not to mention stance switch, much more sane idea

>>718148616
No joke, both Nioh games start off BULLSHIT hard for the first 3-5 missions where everything 1-2 shots you and your kit is basic attacks, but then you power up and just chain stunlock bosses. I always find it funny when Team Ninja fags say these games are harder than Souls. Clueless buffoons.

>>718148616
Both buffs and debuffs were nerfed to shit in Nioh 2, this is not even remotely true

>>718148620
>guest character from a different IP is le reusing assets
Dumbest post ITT so far

>>718148620
With all due respect, Nioh feels nothing like NG to play.There's nothing that functions like wind run, GT, UTs. And NG doesn't have all the rpg elements of Nioh.

>>718148493
>playing Sifu with the Telltale Batman mod
Now this is peak videogames.

>>718148908
Not him, but I'm playing 1 after 2 right now, and buffs like power pills and barrier talisman run out in literally 15 sec and are barely worth using, while I spammed them in 2 all the damn time.

1 has much stronger set bonuses though. Warrior of the West weighs almost nothing, has high stats, as well as +10% melee damage and +30% damage to electrified targets (so a flat +40% if you're using a thunder weapon), just retarded for something you find so early in the game. No wonder literally every red grave is wearing the set.

>>718148908
Are you joking? Maybe sloth talisman was gutted but your kit of onmyo and ninjutsu is greatly expanded in 2. The options for applying confusion are much easier.

>>718148915
Kusa's Renegade Dragon is an UT from Ninja Gaiden. And the enemy ninjas reuse the black spider ninja moveset from NGB

The game rivalry between "Souls like" games and fromgames has always been weird to me, why are you comparing the cakes? It's more games for you to enjoy, but you make a dick size contest out of it, Are you too poor to even pirate?

>>718145205 (OP)
Soulslike.

>>718148560
Short ranged attacks with no HA have little purpose in ER where everything is exaggerated and thus ruined. Why would you do a slow stylised kick when you can fire 13f pokes out of ultras and powerstanced lances?

>>718149296
It's doubly funny when TN switched to making souls-likes and the new Ninja Gaiden games are outsourced to other studios (Blasphemous dev + Platinum).

>>718149296
Both have different strengths.
But I NEED other people to know my taste is better because I like the right one more.

>>718149296
I think it's all due to the pseudo-hardcore reputation the games have and the types it attracts. Neither game series is hard but when Dark Souls built its fame on "prepare to die over and over again" you get a bunch of players thinking they're hot shit and "veterans" for beating a game that simply won't hold your hand. Same with Nioh and Team Ninja referring to it as "masocore", which is equally silly.

>>718145205 (OP)
it's a souls-like, nioh players will always tell you otherwise and bring up the "BUT THERE'S A LOOT TABLE LIKE DIABLO" as an excuse, but it's just a souls-like with more numbers, that's it

>>718149487
its a souls like but with actual good combat

>>718148620
Now that you mention it, NG had rolljump long before Demons Souls was released. I wonder who invented i-frames in this type of game.

>>718148620
oh and there no reused NG assets at all

>>718149541
it's a souls-like, it put it in the same category as the yearly call of duty slop games and the combat isn't any better, it's the same shit

>>718149480
Nioh is "masocore" because half of the rooms are traps where you'll get jumped and then the screen goes greyscale and a sad song starts playing. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VW2xvVZ9Pzk

>>718149695
>and the combat isn't any better
absolute cope

>>718149714
I haven't played Niho but this sounds like DS2 spambush cope aka skill issue

>>718149480
>and the types it attracts
>Neither game series is hard
heh

>>718149296
Souls likes ruined action games as devs realized you don't need a good combat system to sell the game, that's the reason people are upset about souls likes flooding the market.

>>718149779
These games have really cheeky shit like you're climbing a tree branch to pick up a shiny, then eat a fucking cannonball and fall to your death because there was a skeleton with a cannon like 40m away on a different cliff.

I love it because these deaths are so cheap and ridiculous they make me laugh out loud.

>>718149048
You completely fucking failed to understand what I said. Completely.

>>718149785
I don't mean it as a flex or a way of saying "stupid peasants, only I am the true hardcore gamer". They are genuinely not that demanding. They just get that perception because the average game will hardly let you die. It's not like you're beating NG2 on Master Ninja or the NES games. I'd even say Sifu on Master is harder than anything Dark Souls 1 and 2 can throw at you.

>>718148915
Never what I said. You cannot read you fucking retard.

>>718149694
Nigga you are blind. Just look at the fucking weapons. You guys in this thread are collectively retarded and can't read. I'm outta here, have fun among yourselves you blindfags

>makes amazing combat
>wraps it in 5 levels you have to replay over and over again with 999999 randomly generated weapons
why is team ninja like this

>>718145205 (OP)
Souls with emphasize on action. You can opt for stylish play and not a braindead dodge-poke enemy to death

It’s a Nioh-like(wolong is similar)

>>718150596
Wo Long was so disappointing. Why would you want to go from a complete skill tree to two moves and two skills per weapon?

>>718150184
You have a distorted view on what is difficult, the type of person that can enjoy all the masochist shit that Nioh throws at you has already spent hundreds of thousands of hours in similar games.

>>718150376
Nioh 2's level variety is pretty sick actually. It has pretty much every trope covered from snowy mountains to geisha bathhouses, it's like 50+ unique maps, many of them being very large.

Also
>this greatsword has a unique heavy attack animation, wow it's like a whole new weapon
Is not a better game design. I want a full moveset, not these bread crumbs. The weapons in Nioh are purely stat sticks like in Monster Hunter, but you have massive base movesets that eclipse everything the From games can offer.

>>718150425
But it's fun poking enemies to death with a spear

hey

>>718150208
May be that I'm unaware of some movesets for like flail or scythe that were reused, but while weapons look similar they are not reused models. Post an example if this is not true.

>>718145205 (OP)
souls character action like game

>>718150376
There are 20 giant levels and a bunch of smaller levels for side missions, shitposting retard

>>718150815
The retard probably thinks NG invented kusari gamas and tonfas lmao.

>>718150913
>there's 20 giant levels but you won't know that because they start repeating long before they even come close to cycling through them all
That's even more retarded.

>>718151038
The main missions never repeat levels. Just play the game, you tiktok brain.

>>718151087
>you have to skip the shitty part of the game to make the game enjoyable
why is team ninja like this

>>718151236
What shitty part? Who tf are you quoting? Are you high?

>>718149580
Severance maybe? So yeah, old idea.

>>718151278
>playing the same levels again is good design!
>I don't understand the implication of the things I say!
not my problem

>>718151038
>they start repeating
The game never repeats main missions. It uses small chunks of levels for certain side missions, usually as an arena or by separating a small chunk of the area and forcing you through an alternative route. Even then, there are several levels crafted specifically for side missions. Literally nothing to complain about because it's just more gameplay.

>>718151438
You can only play the main missions which are all unique levels. The side missions are just that, side content. Although a fair amount of them are also unique levels.

>>718145205 (OP)
nioh1 is actually the best game of all time

>>718151367
Severance has iframes? I thought it was positioning based

>>718152367
I remembered stepping sideways dodged moves but turns out it has lower hitbox or something.

How are there other games? Wo Long seems a lot like Nioh but with jumping.
Stranger of Paradise seems weird with the job thing
Rise of the Ronin looks like it's ubijank

>>718145205 (OP)
nioh is an RPG

>>718149296
In my case, yes. My fossil can barely run Nioh, at single frames per second. It crashes when it tries to enter Nioh 2's CC screen.

No

>>718153995
>Nioh
In my top 10 games
>Nioh 2
Nioh but better
>SoP
I respect Jack's strength and the job system, but loot grinding focus in DLCs hurts it.
>Wo Long
Classic parryslop, very enjoyable, less depth than Nioh, doesn't really stand out
>RotR
Open world slop but also railroaded by recommended levels. Combat isn't on Nioh level either

>>718149296
quite simply it's fun to complain and to annoy people who have differing opinions to you
retarded fucking cockatiel

>>718153995
SoP is a very fun game. Jobs are basically just weapon and ability types, not so different from swapping from fists to switchglaive. No stamina means you can relax and just focus on the action.
Plus Jack is cool as hell

>>718150154
>>718150154
Tbdesu I stopped reading after the first paragraph. I see what you're saying with NG assets being repurposed to build a new combat system for a soulslike game.

>>718145205 (OP)
Neither. It's mission based with shitty level design so doesn't qualify as a souls like. The 1v1 with stamina meter is not cuhrazee enough to be character action.

>>718153995
>wolong
much more arcadey than Nioh, sacrificing depth but still a lot of fun
>SoP
pretty much the best action JRPG of the last decade
>rotr
I hated rotr's open world, first TN game I couldn't finish.

>>718145205 (OP)
>character action game
It's literally just a fucking "action game," you insufferable dweeb. There's nothing "character" about it. it's just action.

>mogs nioh and souls
Why the fuck are retards calling this a soulslike? It is a action adventure game.

>>718147136
does rotr have unarmed combos

>>718145205 (OP)
kill yourself

>>718148165
i wish i could get into fist autism, but i couldn't juggle all the shit, or be bothered to lab all the stuff you could do.
i still used them because royal guard was cool, even if hard to do, and the basic combos were powerful as hell.

i'm usually a sucker for just-timing attacks, but the fist's felt weird, dunno why

>>718145432
>>718145994
yeah, you can also tell because he gets winded upon depleting his own ki by attacking

>>718145205 (OP)
I really liked the first one, played the second one for an hour and stopped even though people say that one is better.

I'm still mad they made the waifu the most expensive skin in the game.

>>718163941
The waifu skins are much cheaper in 2 lol. In 1 all female skins are 70k glory (while the dudes are like 2-5k), in 2 the dudes are the same cost, but the girls are now 10k

>>718165334
They were like "we know you want this skin so we are going to make it ridiculously expensive lol". I think they got a bunch of complaints and fixed it cause no one wanted to grind that much for just a skin.

For me, it's Fuku. Those thigh windows shouldn't be legal.

>>718165334
>>718165447
I mean, you also just have the CC to bypass that if you want to play a grill

Playable beta for 3 when?

>>718166152
it already happened

>>718166404
I thought that was the Alpha?

>>718160862
same reason they called remnant from the ashes 1 a souls-like despite being a destiny-roguelike

>>718145205 (OP)
Its a anti-strand like

>>718166404
That was the alpha and I already played that.

>>718145205 (OP)
You can't attack suspended in air, so it's a soulslike

anyone played Blades of Fire? worth getting?
I liked the demo, cool combat system with directional attacks

>>718146847
damn team ninj-uncs be cooking (another slop) fr no cap

>>718145205 (OP)
I want to burning oil jar _______

>>718145205 (OP)
It's diablolike action game with rpg elements

>>718165878
Real shame you can't get best girl Ginchiyo's armor, though

Diablo style loot kills this game and Stranger of Paradise

>>718168816
The Warrior of the West set is in Nioh 2 actually (dropped as a smithing text from Daidara Bocchi and Shuten Doji), but the female version still looks the same as William's, just slimmer. Missed opportunity for sure.

>>718145205 (OP)
It's a niohlike. See SoP, Wo Long, Khazan.

>>718145205 (OP)
Neither. It's an action game, and Nioh 2 is the best one ever made.

>>718169875
Nah, that's Sekiro silly.