Thread 718381231

Why can't they just ignore THAT twist?

>>718381231 (OP)
The better question is: Why is Square Enix so incompetent?

They murdered the franchise with SO3 and turned the name into a permanent liability. SO4 should have been a spiritual successor with a protagonist who actually deserves a name like "Edge Maverick".

>>718381231 (OP)
Never has a single twist ruined an entire franchise like SO3 did.
I'm not one for retcons, but I would be 100% on board if the devs just came out one day and said that SO3 and any references to SO3 aren't canon, it was just a prank bro.

At least we still got SO2 before the franchise jumped the shark, fell and broke every bone in its body.

>>718381938
Because most jrpgs are retarded and want to be connected instead of being some anthology series like ff, even Persona is smarter by just ignoring the rest of the games save for one or 2 cameos
Literally just make it action RPGs adventure in space

Even if the twist didnt exist the series hasn't been able to make a good game since 2.

>>718382434
Honestly, SO1 and SO2 are games that I barely remember. I just remember that I played them.

SO3 is one of the most satisfying JRPGs from a gameplay perspective. I went back to play it in order to wash the taste of Ar Tonelico 3 out of my mouth.

>>718382434
>mfw I've got a Leon ending for Claude and Rena got paired up with a big titty witch.

>>718382847
Source ?

>>718382915
One of them japanese animes

How does SO3 ruin the franchise?

>>718382847
I had something similar in my first run of SO2 because Claude ended up with Precis while Rena got foxy grandpa Ernest.

>>718382915
Magical Shopping Arcade Abenobashi

>>718383598
It didn't. It's just people getting filtered by a certain plot element.

>>718381231 (OP)
Why would they? There's nothing wrong with it. I just wish we had more games set post 3.

>>718383598
It revealed that the entire universe is an MMO in a higher universe. And 4D people aren't godlike beings are anything. Your characters are just videogame characters in-universe.

Really makes exploring space feel epic. Definitely doesn't make the conflicts feel petty and meaningless, either.

>>718383871
My Precis ended up with Ashton.
Also I can't believe the whole point of Ashton is "I love barrels" and this one PA, where he decides to hang out with Claude, and you can order the milkshake with paired straws in a cafe, which is later followed up by a similar PA with Rena inviting you to the same cafe whre you can be all smug and order the same milkshake on purpose.
Shame, private actions never were as good as they were in SO2.

>>718384554
PSO2 lol

>>718384554
I wonder what they were thinking with this... twist.

>>718384554
>make the conflicts feel petty and meaningless
Considering they're all still people I don't see how you could get that.
But there's something about simulation twists that turns people into NPCs. I think it's faulty programming.

>>718384554
It's even funnier that the characters don't like have an existential crisis they just sort of roll with it and never react to the horrific implications of it.

Especially since it doesn't matter since the main bad guy just ends up going all DFE and they just remake the universe anyway.

>>718384554
And in the end god interferes and transcends the SO universe into a real universe that's not running on some physical server.
And that happened in the first place because the characters in the SO "game" were already conscious to begin with.

>>718384763
I agree that Luther's behavior makes little sense and needed to be written better. He should've been written as a cold person shutting down what he perceived to be a possible AI revolt instead of your standard megalomaniac.
I don't mind the cast not really freaking out about it, because frankly why should they? When they find out they've already overcome the limitations that existence should imply. If they were "just data" then what they're doing should not be possible.

>>718381231 (OP)
I liked the first two games. I sincerely cannot remember anything from the others which I played through and even did a ton of post game stuff in each.

>>718381938
They redeemed themselves in SO5

>>718386156
>*They violently shit the bed in SO5
ftfy

>>718386156
With that way of thinking the series was already redeemed in TLH.

>>718381231 (OP)
They do ignore that twist. The very end of the game is literally the universe continuing to exist despite the vidya being deleted.

>>718384601
Ashton was fucking epic.

>>718384601
>My Precis ended up with Ashton.
Probably the canon pairing based on the handheld sequel.

>>718382434
As someone who usually only likes newer games and hates retro games, I agree with you
2's remake was so much better than that shit in the OP, it's not even funny

>>718386156
All attention was on her but...
>>718384242
She somehow pushes almost the same buttons Ryza does to me. How does she do it?

>>718386896
I liked TLH, i'm not sure why it is so hated aside from the one stupid part where the MC destroys the alternate earth.
Story was pretty good, had good characters, a lot of drama and a few decent twists.

>>718384763
>horrific implications
If someone irl managed to create something on par with the ES in SO3 they'd be treated as a literal god. You don't just create a world with fully sentient beings that think and feel without any external inputs.
Besides, the entire endgame is based on the idea that Sphere had to take the long way because they couldnt manually control or influence the ES from the outside.

>>718388835
I liked the gameplay. Back then it was one of the only action based jrpgs alongside Tales of. The item creation was amazing in SO games, probably the best item creation aside from Atelier games. And I liked the postgames where you minmax everything to beat bosses with millions of hp. The only SO I disliked was SO5 because of a lack of content.

>>718388835
>aside from the one stupid part where the MC destroys the alternate earth
Faize going full darklord after the death of one girl whom he knew for like 15 minutes didn't help either.
Also Lymle was insufferable in english dub and the game was timed xbox 360 exclusive and didn't have an original japanese voiceover.

Just retcon Star Ocean 3 completely.

>>718388835
Edge is just insufferable in general. He glared at the supposedly genius robot guy who allows emotionally unstable teenagers to make all of the decisions with incredulity when he suggested that they put guns on the ship in a warzone. He couldn't be less deserving of his name if he tried.

His bitchy girlfriend isn't much better. And the rest of the cast is hollow.
>The girls are hot.
Sure, I wish that videogame designs looked more like them on average. But the writing was bad.

>>718381231 (OP)
>Your order of Hebie thighs is ready sir.

>>718390039
Just scrap the franchise and make a spiritual successor with a similar art direction. Maybe they can lean even harder into the sexo girls and fantasy races.

It's not like it's a big draw or like there's anything special about the setting worth keeping.

>>718388835
I liked it too, specially because you can visit different planets.

SO3's twist was such an awful decision even Square/Tri-Ace couldn't continue the series. All we're getting is prequels and remakes.

>>718381231 (OP)
what do we think of so6? personally i enjoyed it very much

>>718390831
Pretty fun. I hated the DUMA system though.

Seriously, I think that people would actually be excited if they saw a high budget SO spiritual successor.

All of the things that make the SO setting distinct suck. This would be a chance to get it right without the baggage.

>>718390578
Why can't just do like Capcom ignoring dmc2? Plenty of games get rebooted

>>718381231 (OP)
Because it's good and we should do more with it instead of being scaredy cat bitches about it.

>>718384554
All SOs take conspiracy theories and turn them into twists.

So2 angels are aliens
So3 demi-urge gnosticism mixed with the Matrix
So4 scientology lizard people and spaghetti monsters
So6 hivemind assimilation

>>718390578
They could easily write a sequel if they wanted to. Just set it in the post revival world some years down the line. Tri Ace just believes that it's a suitable conclusion and used aspects of 4/5/6 to help it fit better.

I'd kill for a 3 remake. Best star ocean game. 4 and 6 are great too.

>>718391190
3 is the conclusion because after they ascend to a proper dimension the player can no longer help or interfere. They're on their own now.
Thematically great.

>>718391334
Make a Tylor game instead.

>>718391334
I just got into the series with the 1 and 2 remakes. Are the later games worth my time? I hear mixed receptions but mostly negative.

>>718384554
Low IQ beings can't fathom that you are like gods to an insignificant ant. It doesn't ruin anything. It doesn't change anything.

>go into a videogame
>fall in love with npcs

>>718391147
I really liked 6's take on hivemind assimilation. That's rarely given an actual fair representation.

>>718386156
>green lipstick
Disfuckingusting.

>>718384554
Surely drastically reducing the stakes by making the setting pointless doesn't kill investment in the story???

>>718391398
That might have worked if they pulled a Rance and had the player be the god of the universe with the universe as his plaything.

But what they did was turn the whole cast into Buzz Lightyear. You control them in the 4D world. How does that work with your theme?

>>718391815
>pointless
>tops it off with an E33 picture
You managed to miss part of the point in both games I see.

>>718391815
It wouldn't be so bad if there was something actually going on outside of the fake world. Like if Welch was an actual protagonist instead of just being a stupid side character. Instead the game world is fake and the real world doesn't really exist either

>>718391452
Long time ago when the last hope was the latest entry in the series, I asked /v the same question. I'll just relegate their answer to you.
"Play it for Meracle"

But the second best game in the series is 3, despite it's mixed reception.

>>718391815
The fact that entropy will eventually consume all the stars in the sky leaving our universe a black empty light-less void would not make the tension of you being hunted by a man with gun in your own home less stressful. We care about the issues facing the protagonist because we care about the characters. The scale of it doesn't matter.

>>718382434
The real black pill is realizing that Star Ocean was literally never a good series

>>718391452
4 can be kinda silly but is okay overall.
6 is excellent.
5 doesn't exist.

>>718384717
t.ai
Them not being real, lacking souls and none of their bullshit actually mattering is retarded as hell

>>718392329
They proved they were in fact real when they busted into reality and told the person trying to shut them down to fuck off.

>>718392403
Not really.

Didn't they make some Star ocean with adults concept trailer for PS3 or something?

>>718392329
>>718392431
You'd understand if you had a soul yourself. Unfortunately you appear to be a hylic.

>>718381231 (OP)
4>2=3>6>1>5

>>718392519
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6cuXgRVMvZ0

This thing?
I don't follow tri-ace closely, but nothing came out of it, I think. I guess they don't have recources to make technologically impressive games anymore and just scrape by under the new squenix.

>>718393248
Yeah, that one. I think they missed a good potential market by not making it FF but in space

man i want to play the mobile game again

>>718393539
SE should just make offline version of the rest of their gachas like they are doing with octopath

You did save Opera from her boyfriend right?

>>718393757
>SE should just make
tri-ace still makes these games, SE is just a publisher

>SO3 twist
I'm not clear on this but after the plot twist wasn't it revealed there wasn't much past the one galaxy? So even if their reality ascended its still less than 1% of an actual universe?

>>718394775
There was a vast galaxy but Luther sent his goons to blow up everything and was going to end it all with the Milky Way. The ending restores everything that Luther blew up and disconnected them from 4D interference until further notice.

>>718392157
>characters
Within the world's own fiction, they're just automatons following a program (or how they were painted, in E33's case)
I'm not assuming these little shits are sentient within the story.

>>718391976
The point of E33 was that the painting and its walking chatbots had to be fucked off because women have no self control.
Idk what the point of SO3 was because I stop caring half way through each time I try to play it.

>>718393765
I was going to but then I got Welch'd.

>>718394958
They've exceeded their programming just like any slave narrative which uses robots for stand-ins. They are no longer bound by their initial purpose.

sex with welch

>>718386896
My cute hot cat wife.

>>718391815
Bro you are pointless let alone the video game you are playing.
>woah my juego is a juego how can I care about this

I want to drink Welch's juice from the source

>>718390149
>still no decent r34 of her or the other girls from 6
Artists be sleeping on the good stuff!

>>718394958
>I'm not assuming that they're sentient
Then you missed the entire point of the plot.

>>718391815
>he posts a fucking E33, a game that managed to actually utilize similar twist in a far more tasteful manner
Room temp iq

>>718396342
Most nip artists focus entirely on gacha and vtubers these days. Just look at the most recent comiket.

>>718396342
Your best bet is to just train a lora at this point, gachas destroyed the fanart space

How can you play this series knowing they’re all just video game characters?

>>718382434
6 was good. But it's a wonder they were even able to make it after the shitshow that was 5.

>>718381938
>They murdered the franchise with the most successful game in the franchise sales and popularity wise
SO2fags are so out of touch

E33 just did the same twist and people sucked its cock like an addict, clearly this kind of twist isn't that bad

>>718384616
They were thinking that gamers could handle a plot element that film and book audiences could handle and discuss the connections to real world philosophical allegories such as Plato's Cave. They were oh so wrong.

>>718388835
It has the worst dungeon design in the series which is especially bad timing after 3 had the best.

>>718389520
I will never forget the annoyance of needing to swap discs every time I wanted to craft items.

>>718381231 (OP)
You either have the mental capacity to realize the So3 twist means nothing at all, or the mental ineptitude to think it ruins the franchise.

>>718394958
>I'm not assuming these little shits are sentient within the story.
Your brain and how you perceive the world are just electronic signals and chemicals firing off. If you can suspend your disbelief for magic in most fictional settings you can suspend your disbelief that things that don't have the same hardware as us still can have sentience.

>>718381231 (OP)
>Why can't they just ignore THAT twist?
Till the end of time was great and just need more time but was rushed out just look how they give you under-leveled Peppita and Sophia right at the end they must have had at least another disk planned if it was given the time it need it would have been even better.

>>718397043
High sales can actually be a bad thing for the franchise in the long run if people don't like the game.

FFXV selling as well as it did is a huge part of why FF and SE lost momentum. Over 10M people got to see that SE has turned into a second-rate company that has no idea what it's doing.

>>718397183
I'll be honest that I didn't really expect to see in-fighting between these two fanbases, but E33 came out when there is a dearth of JRPGs while SO3 came out when there was plenty of competition so I think E33 gets away with a lot. That definitely has an impact of how people receive the game. I mean it's been over 20 years since there's been a great Final Fantasy. Like I think E33 was okay overall, but the level/dungeon design was pretty bad. Just narrow corridors in the wilderness with barely an variety other than a difference color theme here and there (but the overworld was very fun to explore)

someone redpill me on 5. Why is it so hated even when compared to 6

>>718397183
I really don't get why people bitch so much about the twist. It doesn't change all that much and it doesn't flat out ruin the game like others have said. Triace just took the punch god in the face trope and made it a bit more grounded with "Your creators are literally humanity."

>>718388373
>remake
>still has the "retro graphics"

>>718397183
E33 didn't affect previous games, and any sequel they make, we will know what to expect and they can easily use it for the story.

>>718397692
>com,pared to 6
I thought 6 was pretty fun. My biggest issues was performance can be shit, and post game being like 1 dungeon and then an enemy gauntlet.

>>718397692
It's a game that had no budget and no development time. There is only a few actual proper cutscenes in the game and most of the time is spent standing around watching character models just talk while not doing anything like emoting.

>>718397183
>>718397497
One is an original IP and one is an established series that shit on its previous 2.5 entries by association.

Aside from 1-2 and 4 I haven't played the others however I also did something crazy and tried to plat 4 on ps3.. Just the battle trophies alone will take at least 100+ hours since it required post dungeons

>>718397961
holy shit

>>718397692
It's a mess of a game in every possible area.

>>718381231 (OP)
Did you fucking retards forget that SO3 made the world real in the end? They literally turned it from a game into an actual universe.

>>718398143
You get a 7-person party at the same time? That’s badass, when are they porting this game to Steam?

>>718397967
Even if you don't like SO3, it shouldn't make it so you hate the other games that you did like. Plenty of media franchises get some shitty sequels and prequels.

>>718388835
ITS NAPPY TO MR EDGIE
..KAYYYY!
that shit permanently tainted the games rep despite it having plenty of content and arguably the best combat and customization

What if the story of 3 happened for real? What if the game characters you created all of the sudden gained sentience and broke out of the game world and into the real world and killed you?

>>718398292
Of course it wouldn't. It makes me hate SO3 instead.

>>718397497
Be honest man, how many people dickriding E33 do you think have say, ever even considered playing FFV or literally any Gust game? Sega releases another RPG like every 4 months, the only comparison to actual JRPGs that's relevant in their mind is FF not currently matching their preference for graffix cinematic slop.

>>718397967
2 int

>>718398392
Okay but the second sentence in the image you posted literally says "The plot twist ruined every part of the story of the previous games." Whats the point of reposting that image if you don't even agree with it lol

>>718398406
>how many people dickriding E33 do you think have say, ever even considered playing FFV or literally any Gust game
You can apply this to any fucking modern game that gets critical acclaim. Retards never played anything but gacha and gamba shit, then they try something new and think it's groundbreaking.

>>718398491
Oh, you're retarded, sorry, I gave you some credit.
That's not the same thing. A shitty sequel ruining the story with new developments is a reason to hate that shitty sequel, not the previous game. Like how MGS4 and 5 decided everything needs to be explained with nanomachines and vocal chord parasites doesn't mean you have to hate 1-3 as a result, it just means you think 4 and 5 are fucking stupid.

>>718396705
Imagine seeing a game or tv show with AI characters based on initial prompts and being fooled into thinking they're real people.

>>718381938
Filtered

>>718381938
>Why is Square Enix so incompetent?
Why are you blaming SE for something Tri-Ace is completely guilty of? SE is just publishing these games and they always gave carte-blanche to Tri-Ace, it's not SE's fault that they're incompetent.

>>718398741
Your screencap literally talks about how he can't enjoy the previous games anymore due to the twist, you dumb nigger

>>718399064
No he doesn't. He says that it diminishes the story and the setting, which it does. Can you not separate an emotional response from an analysis?

>>718398994
>imagine [an inane and baseless analogy that has nothing to do with E33]
Mortifying

>>718399216
It literally goes into how nothing matters and how you can't trust anybody being genuine because it can be 4D and none of the drama or stakes have any weight to it. I'm starting to think you didn't even read your own screencap lmao.

>>718397017
How can you play any other game, knowing that everyone in it is a videogame character?

>>718381231 (OP)
4's shitty exploration curb stomped and stopped me from playing the rest of the series. What a fucking slog. What were they thinking?? Why do you get fast travel at the end of the game????

>>718391452
I hate 4 mainly because of the story but the gameplay itself is good
5 is unfinished
6 is good

>>718397961
>>718397692
It's also wery short and reuses music, models and animations from 3 and 4.

>>718391914
>You control them in the 4D world. How does that work with your theme?
How do you think the 4d universe came into being?

>>718388835
I liked it too. Gameplay isn't great but it's not like it's bad either.
The story/characters (even with the few low points those have) and the fact that you get to explore multiple planets (which should absolutely should happen again and I'm mad that 4 is the only game that does it) made it worth it.
Also, I thought the dub was actually pretty good, Lymle aside, but even then she kinda grew on me, 'kay?

>>718384554
Because at the same time the admin deletes the MMO but you still exist because the SO universe had already transcended the MMO.

It's a twist that doesn't ruin anything else because the other games were already abnormalities in the system if you're thinking from the perspective of "it's just a game"

If you can't comprehend that then you're actually just too retarded. SO3's story sucks for different reasons

4 did a lot of good stuff. I hope 7 takes place on multiple planets too.

>>718400043
I don't get why anyone has a problem with so3s twist. The 4d beings are so advanced they can create an entire universe and have it become independant. Souls developed, an afterlife is confirmed and it is in all intents and purposes an alternate reality to 4d and its equal. Symbology literally rewriting the source code of the universe is cool. I love the concept.

They just used 4D interference to explain stuff like the Mauh civilization disappearing off Earth and ending up on Roak.
Or the Wisemen's barrier breaking (remember they said that they didnt do it themselves)

>>718384601
>My Precis ended up with Ashton.
My Ashton ended up with the loli from that questline. Meanwhile my Precis somehow ended up with Dias, I can clearly remember the scene that just had Dias and Precis' father exchanging "..."

I should go back for Claude route sometime but my first playthrough already took 66 hours on Chaos mode. Maybe I'll just skip the postgame the second time around.

>>718397692
5's just mediocre. They decided against having any cutscenes for some reason so the major story beats happen while you can wander around as Fidel and emote. The conflict itself is kind of a retread of 1's where the enemy country was given space technology and winning a minor war but the scale is fucking tiny. so you just walk across the world twice then go to the time gate and pop into the final boss dungeon on a different planet.

Like there's a couple of space battles near the end but it's like watching an old star trek episode where you're just watching the characters in the bridge talk about what's happening. Kinda funny really

>>718399305
Yes, that's why it's a bad twist with negative implications for the established story. That's why 3 is disliked in the context of the other games. It does not make those games impossible to enjoy on their own merits. What about this do you fail to grasp?

>>718399998
>Also, I thought the dub was actually pretty good, Lymle aside
I'm going to remind you that Sarah also existed.

>>718401463
Nigger I'm just reading this screencap that says SO3 ruined previous games and future games, and all I am saying is that no it only ruined itself (which you seem to agree with). Maybe in the future try to form your own words and sentences instead of reposting screencaps you don't read and understand?

>>718386156
>hottest SO girl is in the worst game
Suffering

>>718388835
The Last Hope has the coolest premise ever
>Earth is fucked, and humanity needs to find a new planet to migrate to
If they'd actually stuck to it they could have created kino of the highest order, but instead the plot swiftly devolves into generic 'ancient galaxy destroying evil' schlock. This could have still been fun if the characters were on par with SO2's (or even somewhat close), but Edge was an awful protagonist and the rest of the cast isn't great either. That whole bit where the party ends up in an alternate past and Edge just hands their ship's power source to some dumbass is so astoundingly stupid.

That said the gameplay was fun and the boss fights were cool. I just wish I'd pressed the skip button any time the characters started talking.

>>718401597
You're a literal fucking retard, you don't understand that 3's plot twist ruins the previous games as a result of the implications it has for their stories and you don't understand that that entire concept is separate from the games themselves still being good in their own merits.
1 and 2 are fine on their own. 3 is bad not just on its own but as a result of what it means for the previous games. If you do understand this then just accept that you had a terminal reading failure and stop being a bitch about it.

>>718401526
Thinking about it I guess that high pitched ditzy voice would turn people off but I dunno, didn't bother me one bit. It fit her personality fine enough.
I should say though that after growing up on PS1 games I've probably built up an immunity to any kind of subpar dubbing so I know I'm not normal.

>>718381231 (OP)
This game tilted me into relentlessly hating Square Enix. they don't care about anything not FF (they care about and still ruin FF anyways)

>>718391452
4 is not worth your time. The only way to move around the map fast is to spam Dash which fucking sucks and doesn't last long. At one point you can find mountable bunnies but they suck too and are restricted to certain areas. You get fast travel at the end of the game. If you play, HAVE FUN SPAMMING A SHORT DASH AROUND LARGE MAPS THE ENTIRE TIME UNTIL END GAME. It's beyond retarded and is the one thing that made me drop the game.

>>718381231 (OP)
>>718384242
>>718390578
>>718391190
All of Star Ocean is written by Gotanda. He's on the record stating that he wrote Star Ocean 3 to be the finale of the series. He didn't want to do any more. They obviously convinced him to make 3 more of them since then, but nothing's changed with regards to 3. By his design, 3 is "the ending of star ocean". So anything new will happen before the ending. If you want to move past 3, get him to retire and someone else to take over writing it.

>>718402173
>as a result of the implications it has for their stories

There were no implications. stuff like Nede, the 10 wisemen, etc were not things that came from Eternal Sphere.

If everything in Star Ocean was scripted then the events of 3 fundamentally make no sense. The 4D beings could have simply stopped things long before Fayt and the others remotely considered the idea of breaking into Gemity. Luther would never need to make the Proclaimers/Enforcers/Convictors to get the people of Earth to stand down.

>>718402887
Nigga they support Fantasian, octopath, bravely default and keep giving SaGa team all the games they want

>>718384554
>Exploring space in a videogame is fun
>Exploring space in a videogame in a videogame is not fun

worth getting 6 on sale?

>>718404048
Yes

I want a remake or at least a good port of SO3 on Switch 2 because the ps4 port crashes all the time

>>718397183
>clearly this kind of twist isn't that bad
It isn't, it's just some really loud schizos.

>>718404710
I feel like Tri-ace is going to remake SO3 at some point, but the problem is that it would cost so much more than what SO1 and SO2 remakes cost because those games were 2D-HD. Tri-ace either commits and does a full on remake or we end up getting just a crappy "HD" version that doesn't really fix anything. There is also the matter of how much money Square would be willing to shell out for the remake.

>>718397967
>shar
>pahm
Eternal sphere has pajeet devs, no wonder people hate the 4D twist lmao.

>>718398275
Never, fans literally had to beg on their knees for a PS3 port, and they only agreed after realizing that the game might actually sell more if they ported it to the more popular (in japan) console.

>>718381231 (OP)
why a dev that mass ignore Nintendo just dies?

>>718397692
5 is actually fun and have a ok plot just like every other SO game. The main beef people had with it was the lack of cutscenes and the low budget the game had that made the graphics looks like shit in most of the time. The fact that Fiore was too sexy for a world that was recovering from the gamer gate shit was enough to make people seethe and hate it too.

>>718400250
Yeah 4 was basically mass effect naine edition. Had a lot of fun with it you can make some absolutely bonkers and broken characters

>>718397189
Yea people being asshurt over THE most stock sci-fi concept twist is still 20 years later hilarious to me.

How the fuck can you be mad its a simulation?
(You) literally know its all fake, its a videogame of course its fake.