Thread 718409228

This game is so fucking based. Throws you right in the deep end and then still progresses the story if you game over. It gives you a real sense of loss when you have to go back to Ciel without having beaten the enemy. Losing missions also accelerates the pace at which the end of the game closes in. It really feels like the stability of the Resistance is up to you. As a bonus, new game+ lets you keep your experience and cyber-elves, meaning you can go back and play a much longer game by doing things the right way.

Yeah but it's not as based as Mega Man Zero 2

>>718409395
Having only just played Zero 1, I have already heard that Zero 2 gets rid of the hub world and puts you back in a stage select like traditional Mega Man games, and I'm kind of dreading it. The hub world and interconnected levels make the experience so much richer. I'm still going to play Mega Man Zero 2, but I'm bracing myself for that particular disappointment.

>>718409578
ZX goes back to something like Zero 1.

>>718409228 (OP)
Can't play this game with the unfathomably tight ass window. Can't see shit captain.

Tried playing this multiple times. Just too hard.

>>718409760
>>718410173
I had to come back to it like three times throughout my life and only this time did I even progress to the second half of the plot. It's fuckin HARD but you just have to get good I dunno how else to say it but the Resistance needs you do you just gotta.
>>718409659
That's awesome, I guess I'll enjoy that four whole games in the future.

>>718410372
>do you just gotta
>so you just gotta
hamfingered it

>>718409395
How great is the sequel compared to the pioneer

>>718409228 (OP)
The mega man zero series is so fucking cool.

>>718412573
Indubitably.

>>718412164
For me it's 3>1>2>4

2 is more polished but has some really bad levels/objectives and unlocking forms is too gimmicky. 3 is the best one but the sunken library might be the worst level in the whole series and 4 sucks outside of the story.

>>718409228 (OP)
Nah this series sucks.

>>718409760
Yeah this is a huge problem for me too. I hope one day the game gets decomped and the FOV can be extended.

>>718410173
The only hard part is the bomb defusal

>>718409228 (OP)
I sold my copy of Zero 4 because it sucks.

>>718412692
Unironically my favorite thing about this thread so far. A gentleman's agreement that Cyber-elves and despair are high culture.

>>718409578
On the upside Zero 2 and 3 have a very cozy resistance base. ZX also goes back to an interconnected world and it's honestly cozy running through the city with this playing.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4QumCcqS6NU

It's a shame ZX Advent lacked any heavily populated city full of NPCs living in blissful ignorance. I wish I could've seen the fallout of the events of ZX for the average NPC who was made to think that Serpent was a paragon when he was the farthest thing from it.

>>718409395
3 is the best but 2 and its forms are up there

>>718418997
2 also had far more engaging stages.

>>718409228 (OP)
>What if you couldn't continue after losing all your lives and had to reload your save?
>Well that was retarded, let's change it back.

>What if the mission briefings told you nothing about the boss that you're gonna face?
>Well that was retarded, let's change it back.

>What if failing a mission permanently removed it from your playthrough?
>Well that was retarded, let's change it back.

>What if we got rid of subtanks?
>Well that was retarded, let's change it back.

>What if cyber elves were so retardedly expensive that realistically you couldn't use more than one or two in a playthrough without grinding?
>Well that was retarded, let's change it back.

>What if to exploit a boss weakness you had to level up your weapons first, making the start of the game the hardest part?
>Well that was retarded, let's change it back.

This game is a joke. Inti tried so hard to differentiate it from the old Mega Man format for sake of it, just to realize that those were staples of the series for a reason, and shamefully backtrack everything in later games.

>>718418995
I liked ZX but Advent was genuinely horrible.

>>718419242
I liked the boss fight between the two trains
The problem I had with ZX in general that no one ever seems to talk about is how all of the boss fights are just boxes with a bad guy in it. Most of the stages are OK but are generally just straight-line corridors with color-coordinated barriers for the Bio metals to break.

Nothing compared to 2's Silver Wolf or 3's Giant room of Spikes you traverse using the tonfas.


>>718419362
I played like a couple hours and stopped. I wonder if I missed anything good.
I just wanted more adult Aile.

>>718409578
You get a hub, it's just not vania-esque.

>>718409760
>>718410173
How you can tell that a person dashes everywhere on their first time through

>>718419483
>I wonder if I missed anything good.
You didn't. You get Aile for like two more short scenes, one after Albert makes his final move and one at the end. All are nothing to write home about.

>>718412954
It's actually 2>3>4>1, but I'll let that slide. 4's level design is just fine and is more in line with some of the better X stages. 3 is almost better than 2 but suffers from being way easier. They're all great but 1 is the weakest entry.

i never played megaman zex since i got a psp instead of a ds
is it fun? i usually like inti's games, but this era of capcom was pretty retarded

>>718419362
I liked advent but the A-trans mechanic was too retarded for bosses, most of them are terrible to control and only useful for some mandatory element that requires the boss to clear, but using them is a chore so even that becomes really tiresome

>>718415601
Try the NDS widescreen mod
>>718418995
Advent perfected the blend between interconnected hub world and level select imo. Zero 1 was fine but ZX took it too far and was retarded about which transervers teleport or not.

>>718419275
>EVERY GAME SHOULD BE THE SAME
You are the reason this franchise is dead.

>>718419956
ZX series has the worst story but the gameplay is up there. Advent gets too gimmicky sometimes but the novelty of playing as bosses is kinda neat.

>>718420074
>perfected the blend between interconnected hub world and level select imo
It felt like it couldn't actually make an interconnected world due to time constraints and put a a bunch of isolated stages behind the teleport pad halfway through the game.

>>718419483
ZX bosses had bigger problems than bland arenas (which were corrected for the most part in Advent to be honest). It had the major issue of the weak point system.

>>718409228 (OP)
Ever notice how every single thread where the OP image is pulled off google is just awful?

>>718420294
ZX isn't bad story wise. ZX Advent trying to lead into Legends is retarded.

>>718420697
Weak point system was nothing compared to Advent's stupid medal system.

Z4 is the best
Most foot, body and helmet chips just get in the fucking way so I have no incentive to interact with the crafting system, cyberelves are now usable without being punished with the partner elf, the Z-Knuckle comprises all previous rod weapons and introduces an Axl-like "copy" system by ripping weapons away from enemies, EX skills have chip elements tied straight to them instead of to equips which skews boss strength a fair bit less towards Zero (Zero is still nutty strong compared to bosses) and incentivizes getting EX skills, and Weil is a WAY better boss than all three preceding games' own

>>718420976
>Axl-like
*Kirby-like

>>718409228 (OP)
>Losing missions
how? I'm not a casual fyi

>>718420885
Why? Medals are purely cosmetic at the end of the day. Weak point punishes you with forcing you to grind like a fucking wagie for energy crystals.

>>718421797
>Weak point punishes you with forcing you to grind like a fucking wagie for energy crystals.
Hardly. Unless you're purposefully hitting them. You should have enough EC passively to just repair everything afterwards if you damaged them.

>>718422283
In fucking hard mode it took a whole run's worth of e crystals just to upgrade it to the max level possible and that's just for one fucking biometal. Also that fucking fire lion has its weak spot ON ITS FUCKING FACE

>>718422403
Most people have a weak point on their face, faggot. Mine's my eyes and I take damage every time I read one of your inane posts.

>>718422403
So don't hit him in the face nigger, this isn't rocket science

>>718419909
I don't even get to kiss Aile this is a ripoff

>>718420697
I thought the weak points were fine, I liked that you had to skillfully attack a boss a certain way but could just take the easy way out if you were fine grinding for crystals to repair the metals.

IT was better than Zero 2's "Make an A rank on this stage or don't get the boss weapon"

>>718420976
I liked the Elf system in 4. All elves should be satellite elves

>>718422591
>Most people have a weak point on their face
Not really, most other bosses have usually sensible locations for their weakpoints like the monkey with its arms, which force you to attack them during certain moments, the difference is that they spend a lot more time in "it's safe to attack now" position than the lion fag or their bodies are big enough to actually not aim anywhere near their weak spots. Lion fag is a small body with a good chunk of it dedicated to his weak point, you think hitting the arm is safe but he often pulls it back, leaving his face exposed so you often run right into it at the worst possible moments. He's just a fucking piece of shit boss who I ended up hugging so tightly my Z saber swings ended up landing on his ass despite being right in front of him.

>>718409228 (OP)
>>718409578
Rare to see someone else appreciate the interconnected levels. Theres something comfy about just being able to go out and revisit the levels at your own pace.

>>718409228 (OP)
>have a sword
>attacks are slashing attacks
>charged attack has you slam like some sort of blunt object

thanks, I fucking hate it

>>718425261
I found it way easier to just hit Fistleo from the back. But yeah, that's a big reason why I think ZXA is the better game. Though Medals are kind of silly too.

>>718419275
>>What if you couldn't continue after losing all your lives and had to reload your save?
Zero levels are short, complete non issue.
>>What if the mission briefings told you nothing about the boss that you're gonna face?
This was good because the elemental chip system makes it way easier to tell what boss weaknesses are compared to X and classic so this was a reasonable handicap. Future Z games just let who see who youre up against for easy boss takedowns via chargespamming.
>>What if failing a mission permanently removed it from your playthrough?
Punishment for skill issue, reload your save.
>>What if we got rid of subtanks?
Theres still subtanks they are just locked to cyber elves which gives you a score penalty which is reasonable for using an item that makes the game easier.
>>What if cyber elves were so retardedly expensive that realistically you couldn't use more than one or two in a playthrough without grinding?
Youre supposed to use elves when youre in a pinch or stuck. Using more than one or two of the bigger cyber elves requires grinding because its punishing you for resorting to using them when you could beat the game without it. Thats why they die upon usage, to make you feel bad about it and encourage you to progress without them.
>>What if to exploit a boss weakness you had to level up your weapons first, making the start of the game the hardest part?
filtered by aztec falcon also shield boomerang gives you an early charge attack.

>>718420976
I like Z4 the best too but the crafting system is really confounding
Theres like 4 recipes you get and a few hints from npcs, did they expect you to just randomly discover the rest by building up a huge stock of parts over replays? It feels like the kind of system you cant use fully without a walkthrough, not that its any more necessary than cyber elves to beat the game.

>>718426724
Its a beam saber, he can do that

>>718427757
You forgot to mention that there are 2 enemies that only show up in one specific intermission stage that isn't replayable, thus making their parts missable.

Either Z2 or Z3 is the best. Which one is better depends on whether you want a more in depth combo system or better platforming segments.

>>718409228 (OP)
>Ciel...Believe in me!

>>718409228 (OP)
if only the screen wasn't so zoomed in.

>>718427268
Agreed, these were all amazing additions, not downgrades from mechanics that already worked perfectly fine in classic/X, and they were so well received that they kept them all in the sequels.

>let's just take stuff from the X series and make it worse just to be different
The Zero improvements begin and end at making the Zero "buster" work just like the Mega Buster

>>718424784
Well the trade-off is that the boss fights are also easier if you don't have A-rank, so it cancels it out. Not to mention, if you're not good at the game, then the EX-Skills probably aren't gonna make a difference anyways. The EX-Skills are mainly useful as combo extenders, they don't have a ton of value outside of that since the charged slash generally does more damage and has a wider hitbox.

>>718429894
Yeah and chargeable saber but even X6 did that.

>>718429894
The buster still kinda sucks due to its shit damage compared to the saber. That said, it completely fucks up Omega because he's virtually harmless at a distance.

i feel like the grinding mechanics were in because inti thought people would do it during train commutes or something

>>718431182
Too bad they're counterintuitive to every other mechanic in the game.

>>718430970
Fighting Omega with Model X in ZX felt like cheating too. Thank god I did the right thing and beat it without it the first time.

3>4>1>2

2 is dogshit, it doesn't really improve any of the previous game's faults and the levels have even more random spike pits everywhere than normal. I'm not sure what people are smoking when they say it's good.

>>718429224
>ad populum
They were removed because it made the game too hard for most people and all their removal did was make the sequels easier, not better.

>MMZ2: Allows you to pick up two free sub-tanks without sacrificing any elves
>MMZ3: Two free sub-tanks and a bunch of useful equipment
>MMZ4: Fuck it, do what you want.

>>718431757
It did away with the retarded idea of making cyber elves that drop from enemies exclusive to missions (so no gtinding them in the overworld). Overall 2 Polished the biggest flaws 1 had and introduced staples like EX moves and had the far easier to obtain form changes. Also had a killer OST.

>>718409228 (OP)
>Losing missions also accelerates the pace at which the end of the game closes in
Huh, never knew this about Zero 1. Figured a game over was basically the same as reloading your save and it's back to picking one of the 2-3 missions available at any given time.

>>718433787
Most form changes were kind of whatever.

>Energy Form: Retarded saber combo, only good for picking up life drops.
>X Form: Makes your buster a little stronger, so if you prefer to use that then it can be pretty decent.
>Defense Form: It's shit.
>Erase Form: Why does this exist?
>Active Form: Conditionally useful if you like the Rolling Slash.
>Power Form: Maximizes Zero's power and makes it so he can only perform the final slash of his combo, but since doing the full combo will still outdamage it there's no real reason to use this form.
>Rise Form: An objective improvement over the base form.
>Proto Form: Hard Mode form. It's bad on purpose.

>>718419362
Advent was so bad that I literally forgot I even owned, or beaten, the game, until I was looking for my Zero collection after the new Zero+ZX release came out on last-gen platforms.

>>718433787
Also liked how often elements came into play during stages, you regularly got to use the ice chip to freeze fire obstacles/hazards as well as being able to delay the deactivation of those electric switches that turned off the fences, allowing you to get closer before they went down. There was also burninh entire forests to kill falling enemy spawns and find hidden items.

Which was the fucking game that penalized you for daring to hit a bosses' weakpoint, even by accident? Was it ZX?

>>718434356
Yeah, ZX. You basically damaged the biometal which resulted in your biometal's energy bar being shorter unless you repair it.

>>718434389
It's not the first time they did this. I think in Powered Up, not using the bosse's weakness on them allowed you to unlock them as playable characters.

>>718434471
MMPU was a fucking nightmare for completionists.

>That one medal in ZX Advent that required you to beat the vulture boss using only and ONLY the Giga Crush
>This meant that if you upgraded your energy like a sane person you actually had to wait for longer to refill your entire energy to use it again
>Also one of the characters had a higher chance of accidentally shooting right through trash fodder enemies into the boss with their charge shot (forgot who had the traditional charge shot and who had the bouncing laser)
FUCK EVERYTHING ABOUT THE JUNKYARD STAGE

>>718409228 (OP)
it's weird but mmz had a very understated morality mechanic, so understated that it arguably doesn't even exist. Your upgrades are tied to raising and sacrificing elfs. You have to kill off little collectible creatures in order to make the game easierm and people will do so with no hesitation. A lot of games let you make moral choices with a good and evil option but there's rarely an actual incentive to be immoral outside of curiosity. It's weird.

I really hated the missable shit in Z1/4/ZX/ZXA.
I guess technically 2&3 as well if you don't maintain A-rank.

>>718434982
It isn't helped by Rank not mattering at all in Zero 1. The sequel corrected that, further discouraging killing Elves to ease the difficulty if you care about EX skills.

>>718434990
I don't recall missables in ZX and Advent.

>>718435046
The irony is that aiming for EX-Skills actually makes the game harder. Strictly speaking, it's not specifically the skills that you need A-rank for. Maintaining A-rank will also trigger the A-rank version of the boss fight, causing them to use an ability that they normally don't if you're at a rank below A. Failing to maintain A-rank means that all bosses going forward will be nerfed, making the game overall easier in exchange.

The idea is that Zero can only unlock an EX-Skill if he actually sees the boss use that skill. If the boss doesn't use the skill, then there's nothing for him to copy.

>>718434062
Exiting any of the desert missions or failing to kill the mid-point boss will automatically activate the mission before Neo Arcadia

>>718410372
>>718410173
The game is only really hard at the very start. It gets easier and easier.

Insanely Goated game and by far my favorite iteration of Zero.

My biggest regret was selling my GBA and that game

>>718435284
It'd be less of a pain if deaths didn't weigh so heavily against your ranking.

>>718435452
Sounds like the speedrunner any% strat in that case?

>>718424784
A Rank is easy if you just dont retry, use elves and kill enough enemies

Im all for Elves being your morality system to do better at the actual game

Zero 3 is a great jam packed game but it makes a lot of concessions and a lot of its level design just pisses me off from how much you have to lab the level to not utterly get blindsided

Why am I racing this giant submarine in a stage full of spike walls?
What the fuck is this library?
I get its many peoples favourite but its so fucking dull
Volcano sucks compared to the Power Plant
Train mogs the shit out of the recycling factory

Zero 3's level are so fucking shit mate
What the fuck are these fire turrets, why is everything so obtuse

In Zero 2 if you know the level you can absolutely glide through it
Z3 is just a fucking chore

>>718435720
If the game didn't penalize deaths, then the ranking becomes pointless.

>>718409228 (OP)
i used to not care about Z1, but the playthrough where I went out of my way to get all S ranks on each stage really made me appreciate it. levels are generally pretty short and i enjoy the game's OST, so replaying stages so i could slowly come closer to perfecting them honestly felt pretty rewarding. only gripe i can really recall is that getting the full enemy score on certain levels was pretty retarded and required you to grind for a bit; duel in the desert was especially rotten about it given that you can't scroll the screen back in that stage
it probably has my favorite atmosphere out of the other Zero games as well. being able to continue after failing a mission is noteworthy, but aspects such as the dilapidated state of the resistance base as well as the more low key soundtrack relative to other zero games help give the game a more oppressive tone

>>718435981
They already penalize you for taking damage. Just make that factor in a bit more instead across your lives.

>>718436010
Enemy score was why I settled for A. You can't just 'know' ahead of time when you're good for S-rank, unless you look it up ahead of time, and already memorized all of the enemy spawn points to farm extras when needed.

>>718435972
forgot to mention this in my post, but holy shit these things fucking suck when you're playing blind; they're oddly sturdy and you're given little time to react to them given the screen crunch and their movement speed. absolutely abysmal choice to put them in the first real stage of the game

>>718425261
>Not really
Does this nigga forizzle

>>718435720
>Retry penalty
has always been stupid in these games
SD and gameover to reset it

Or use save states at start of missions to save yourself from even the long chore of sding for a mission reset

Games have dumb shit in em like the weapon level system but if you just farm them for a while and then reset the mission via gameover you can just play the whole game like that without needing to farm your weapon levels ever

>>718436047
Dying is the ultimate failure. It deserves the highest penalty. There is no greater humiliation than death.

>>718435972
honestly only a problem in the train level because they blend in with the BG

>>718435828
>Zero 3's level are so fucking shit mate
Not the guy you're replying to but I wholeheartedly agree, stages peaked hard at Z2. So many of those stages are just well designed. Z3 has too many snoozers like the elevator stage, the twilight desert stage, the fucking library stage. Sure it has that one Neo Arcadia stage with the spike wall climb but that's still one stage. I even prefer Z4's stages to Z3's stages even if I dislike a lot of other stuff about Z4 like the Z knuckle being half baked or the dumb crafting system and the braindead elf system.

>>718436204
>>718436047
>>718435981
>>718435720
just gameover the mission and retry
problem fixed lol
these games dont take deaths seriously
if you kill 1 enemy less than the quota or kill an elf thats a third of your points gone however

>>718436115
Yeah in Zero 1 they really expected you to kill too many enemies, a lot of the stages have "stealth" options that are actually bad ideas since you kill far less enemies than in aggressive routes unless you go out of your way to farm kills. Thankfully Z2 fixed a lot of the flaws with grading.

>>718430970
Omega is harmless period unless you jump into his telegraphed dash jump combo

Maintaining A-rank isn't that hard. MMZ1-3 run off the total average of all your scores across the game. So just try and maintain the highest possible scores at the beginning of the game. The longer you maintain high S ranks at the beginning, the more leeway you have towards the end.

I wanted to like this but I remember the game was kicking my ass.

>>718436302
>Z3 has too many snoozers like the elevator stage, the twilight desert stage, the fucking library stage
the elevator and library stages straight up ended my S rank playthrough due to how much i detested the idea of having to play a dumbass memory game or endure another tedious side scroller. it's a shame, because the batch of stages that preceded them (the ones with the resurrected Z1 bosses) felt great to play and was giving me a similar feeling to what I felt with replaying Zero 1 stages, but the following batch of stages felt awful to play

>>718436594
I didn't really like the desert stage for anubis in Z3, it was completely flat and consisted of just jumping across quicksand while being pestered by enemies. Even the desert in Z1 had more dynamic landscape with ups and downs and enemies being placed to fuck you over if you went too fast without knowing. Also just remembered the snow stage of Z3. That stage literally played itself the second you hopped onto any snowboard, like seriously, there are only a tiny handful of enemies that can threaten you from up there and you can easily dispose of them with a charge shot/slash.

>>718409228 (OP)
Too bad GBA limitations hold it back from its full potential

>>718431298
Nta but I don't hate it. Makes early game victories feel more earned, however I refuse to play hard mode where you never get to level up.

for me its mmz4
z knuckle is the best thing in the series

>>718436163
If the series had a built-in "Retry mission" start menu option, that reset you to a clean state, it'd be far less aggravating aiming for A/S-ranks.

>>718436847
It's conceptually cool, but 90% of the weapons you can steal with it are useless. Realistically, it's clear that most mob weapons were always gonna be trash.

Nobody ever talks about how the final boss music in Z2 was kind of boring and lame.

>>718436919
It's a shame in a game full of banger tracks the final boss track is eh.

>>718436475
Maintaining 100p S rank isn't hard either but it's the most insufferable, miserable, fucking thing I've ever done in a video game. Fuck Megaman Zero.

>>718436847
it's quite possibly the worst thing in the series

Simply know when and where they’ll show up

>>718436847
Only ever bothered with it to grab shields and those swords that Weil summoned during his boss fight that served as lightning rods.

>>718433787
>2 did a few good things
So did 1. Doesn't make them better than 3 or 4.

>>718437020
> those swords that Weil summoned during his boss fight that served as lightning rods.
oh is THAT why they have so much health?

Story wise, 3 should have been 4
Absolutely nowhere to go from Zero defeating himself for the final time

>>718437016
Engraving bad level design and enemy placement into memory doesn't excuse it.

>>718437183
Yes, you're supposed to yoink them out in one pull.

>That Zero collection that came out with native ports
>No efforts made to source the original music samples or re-arrange it
Why. God damn that series was hard to play with a pair of headphones due to the crispy 11khz samples in the music.

>>718437267
>native ports
They're not native ports.

>>718437008
>energy sword
>blood stain
hm?

>>718436761
I mean just look at this shit, embarrassing.
https://vgmaps.de/maps/view.php?m=22846

>>718412692
>>718418640

>>718434982
>You have to kill off little collectible creatures
UM @PALWORLD!? @FBI!?

>final Omega phase 2 has the coolest form
>the fight is boring dogshit
Why oh why is inti like this

Jackson was the coolest.

>>718440958
They couldn't think of a way to make it work on a gba.

>>718437184
4 had much better story. 3 is hard carried solely by Omega having Zero's body.

>>718440958
All of his forms are boring dogshit. He's just inherently a boring dogshit character.

>>718441067
Did they forget about shit like putting big enemies in the background? They pulled it off in 4 when they wanted to reference X3.

>>718412164
Stages and music are way better. I like it a lot more than 1.