Thread 718432001

why are the Starcraft games the only RTS to take off competitively and get big prize pools? meanwhile there are loads of shooters and ffighting games and MOBAs with a healthy competitive community

>>718432001 (OP)
Because competitive mongs don't want to drop the only game they're good at for something better.

>>718432354
their skills would obviously translate across the genre

>>718432501
No they don't. Being good at controlling 12 dragoons doesn't make you good at flushing in AoE2. You can become good at any shooter if you aim good and spend time. If you're a gook who only played SC his entire life those skills don't carry over because the only skill in SC1 is controlling multiple groups of 12 units.

>>718432001 (OP)
Shooters and MOBAs are actually popular and have large communities.
As for fighting games, that genre is as dead as RTS. You have Street Fighter, Tekken and nothing else.

>>718432001 (OP)
because all the other RTS are bad.

I guess this game already came and went since there's no threads up for it but should I buy this if I want to play competitive multiplayer?

>>718433452
Also SC is an incredibly static (boring) game with nearly no randomness to it. There are at most 2 build orders in every matchup, no random maps, nothing that requires you to adapt. Pro players play the same 8 maps against the same 4 build orders, and the game is decided by whoever can micro 12 units better.

>>718433603
no. all the competitive ones are free.

>>718433748
huh, what do you mean?

>>718433631
can't imagine being this low iq

Because BW and SC2 are the only good RTS games.

Only in korea because of it's history and still has willing sponsors to fund it. It's dead in the west outside of community driven tournaments with little to no budget. Gambling sites tend to go to cs2 league dota valorant.

t. Followed the scene since 2004

>>718432001 (OP)
Brood War was incredibly popular in general and is actually interesting to watch, SC2 is riding BW's coattails.

>>718433802
sc1 sc2 are f2p.
no other game comes close to approaching that healthy of a competitive scene.
stormgate is f2p, but it may not be around in a few years, it's been poorly received, marketed as sc3, aoe is paid but low pop, beyond all reason is low pop because total annihilation was never that popular.
am I missing any?

StarCraft is just the game with the biggest appeal because it's the most casual and least strategical RTS. Other games feature deeper scouting, economy, and military mechanics, but these require a higher skill than simple gookclicking.

>>718432001 (OP)
Because a lot of Koreans became obsessed with it due to Internet cafe culture in the 90s/00s, it’s been riding that popularity ever since

>>718432001 (OP)
Because until 2010, whichever genre Blizzard touched, they made the best games in. There is no reason to play any rts but Starcraft/Warcraft. There is no reason to play any arpg but Diablo. There is no reason to play any mmo but WoW. And so on and so forth.

>>718432001 (OP)
Competitive RTS just has niche appeal. Your average gamer is unlikely to care. SC has what it has because of the Korean scene, as others have said.

>>718434045
I mean that's not really what I was asking I was asking if Dawn of War is a good game for competitive multiplayer in an RTS? It got a big infusion of players and I just like 40k.

RTS is high commitment, a single match takes as long as the average fighting game set. it's harder to develop skills across multiple games and tournament organizers don't want to run a bunch of different RTS games at once.

>>718434885
Nobody bought that game for competitive multiplayer bro

>>718435568
grim and true

>>718433452
>>718432354
This. StarCraft isn't a proper strat game. The way they do this is more akin to chess. They memorize every possible opener by the numbers.
>1 barrack double command center
>Double gateway
>2 factory
So on and so forth. They can literally predict it what units and how many will be on the field by builds. And it's ludicrous how 2~3 types of units get spammed to death because there is no strat. It's a build based spam fest.
This is why it is so popular. It is fucking simple, so noobs can watch eSports, and actually understand pros, or at least mimic them.

>>718435568
Striving to be good at what you like to do is not sweat or bad.
The writer is just admitting that they are lazy scum looking for easy gratification and victory.
This man is basically saying everyone should just go be a drooling gambling retard.

>>718436602
>1 barracks into double command center
In what MMR does your opponent let a Terran do this?

>>718434885
did you see me list dow?
is there a single tournament for the game?
a remaster isn't going to change that.

>>718435568
idk wtf he's talking about, not reading all that shit, but casuals play the campaign and play co-op against the computer or arcade games in sc2.

>>718437632
those casuals playing arcade games in warcraft 3 went on to create the 2nd biggest (#1 in prizepools) genre in multiplayer gaming

>>718433603
if you want to play competitive long-term, no.
i'd recommend company of heroes 2/3 for a similar squad-style as dawn of war.
other competitive RTS games are Age of Empires 2: Definitive Edition or starcraft 2. i personally recommend aoe2:de over sc2 since it's more laid back, but if you find sc2 more interesting (or want a free game to play) then play sc2.

>>718432001 (OP)
Because of Korean autism who had that shit on television by mid 00s. In the West, while popular, it really didn't have a proper esports infrastructure. Mostly it was limited to few annual big tournaments that might've had qualifications for them, such as World Cyber Games and Blizzcon, but Warcraft 3 also had these.

As to why SCBW popped off in South Korea that early, I do not know. Of course it was popular in net cafes and what-not, but so were a lot of other games. It's quite amazing how they had a proper league system set up with multiple teams (some sponsored by massive corporations such as SK Telecom and STX), and these teams also had their own in-house feeder teams where the best "B-players" would compete for spots in the A-team. Even Korean Air Force had their own Starcraft team, full of early 00s SCBW pros who couldn't delay their mandatory military service anymore. In 2010 they had a tournament with Korean Air as the main sponsor, and the finals between Flash and Effort were held in a airplane hangar. I think it's safe to say that it had gone mainstream by that point.

I'm not sure Blizzard would've invested that much money into SC2's esports had it not been this popular in South Korea. It's pretty funny that early SC2's best Koreans were often players who had failed to climb from this aforementioned feeder team system.

>>718433631
>Starcraft has nearly no randomness to it
lmao

Starcraft Broodwar has tons of randomness to it. Just for an obvious example, ranged attacks have a random chance to miss while shooting targets on a higher elevation than you.
https://liquipedia.net/starcraft/Damage#Misses
There's other examples too, but this one is the most clearcut.

This is one of the biggest reasons why when someone says "Competitive games don't have RNG in them." you should laugh at them.

>>718441217
>All ranged attacks just have a chance to miss no matter what
lmao, isn't this an even bigger issue? People are hating on Pokemon 1st gen for the 1/256 miss issue, this is the same shit.

>>718434774
No, and fuck you for having such a retarded opinion.

>>718432001 (OP)
Because Koreans are obsessive retards and Starcraft rewards obsessive retardation more than any other RTS.

>>718432001 (OP)
They're not the only ones, just probably the most popular.

>>718433603
No, DoW was never competitive. You want BW, SC2, AoE2, CoH3, or BAR.

>>718440903
>>718443451
Why does nobody ever mentions AoE4? It's always SC1-2 and AoE2 but this game supposedly has the same amount of pvp players than AoE2. I don't play any of these (just in case), I am not a shill, just genuinely asking.

>>718441217
SC2 has no RNG whatsoever
apart from assholes playing random

>>718433603
despite being very fun, DoW is terrible as a competitive game
>t. chaos player

>>718444871
i haven't played aoe4 so i may be off in what i say
it's just not that interesting compared to aoe2:de. instead of trying a different era of history, they went for aoe2 2.0 which a lot of people didn't bother swapping to since they already like aoe2. a lot of people dislike the graphics or the change in gameplay compared to aoe2 which wouldn't draw so much attention if it wasn't the same exact era.
in aoe2, civs are similar in that they all draw from the same tech tree and have exclusions or buffs to certain units if they're cavalry-focused, infantry-focused, etc. aoe4 has factions take much different approach more like starcraft where factions are more wildly different. the campaigns are also much better in aoe2 than aoe4 and there are so many different campaigns along with community-made campaigns from years of support. someone that isnt a filthy casual like me could probably explain more in-depth/better.

>>718432001 (OP)
The popularity of Starcraft Broodwar was single-handedly propped up by the fact that some Korean broadcaster decided to air matches on TV in the early 2000s. That caused a popularity feedback loop. It was also the best RTS by far at the time. By the time CoH or WC3 came out, Broodwar was already established
>meanwhile there are loads of ... MOBAs with a healthy competitive community
Yeah, no shit. Because MOBAs replaced RTS games since its easier for viewers to keep up with.

>>718445848
>which wouldn't draw so much attention if it wasn't the same exact era
Man, this game really needed to be in the same era as AoE1. That game is so archaic that nobody would care for a "repeated era"