Thread 719171692

Specifically in Reload and I would say hes underrated in FES.
But anyway hes completely overrated because of a skill he gets at the end of the game that he gets to use only against the final boss and maybe the final monad door. Hes still good to use but for other reasons. His charge theurgy is good for the midgame with Aigis and Junpei while for the lategame after fuuka powercreeps his charge theurgy hes useful for hitting 3 weaknesses.

le heckin reddit pupperino will not be critisized >_<. how can you look at that heckin chonkers holesum little face and talk bad about him :( hes such a good boi!!!

>>719171864
This but for Yukari.

>>719171692 (OP)
Every Baldurs Gate 3 companion is bad. They all suck.

>>719171692 (OP)

only played FES and P3P, never really diverted away from a Mitsuru-Aigis-Akihiko team when i had them all.
Dedicated buffer, debuffer and healer to back up the mega DPS from door-kun is the only way to play. Junpei DA MAN though.

>>719172372
Okay but which one is the most overrated

>>719172123
nts gf

>>719172434
Junpei is the strongest party member in all 3 games

>>719171692 (OP)
Makoto in vanilla P5. No, getting +10 (20 due to glitch) in all stats after you beat everything isn't useful and doesn't make up for her being objectively worse than everyone 90% of the time because of her horrendous level up learnset.

>>719174105
Party members are a meme in 4 and 5 regardless, the mc does 80% of the damage.

>>719174241
>meme in 4 and 5
>kanji with power charge and primal force
>broken ass traits on makoto, akechi and ryuji on 5

>>719174105
What makes Makoto broken is her passive, especially after its upgraded. Granted I’ll admit that before that shes pretty underwhelming. I gave debilitate to Morgana and ended up using him a lot more.
Yukari would be a lot better in 3r if she had access to better debuff support as well, as it stands shes pretty much the worst party member in all the games, well maybe not fes or portable, id say mitsuru is the worst there

>>719171692 (OP)
>teammates
Laughing my ass off from a solo run.

>>719178074
Show me your solo run videopre-Siegfried.

>>719172448
I don't know. I think Shadowheart is the most popular, so her I guess.

>>719172681
He lags behind mid game, likely on purpose related to his character arc, but always winds up on top by the end.

>>719174105
>mediarahan, better salvation because of sp conservation
>marakukaja
Nah man she's good.
>nuke element, arguably the best element in the game because of technical hits
>+10 stats gun

>>719178447
>mid game in fes
>re patra, hits 4 weaknesses

>mid game in reload
Only party member with a passive crit rate boost, assuming you’re not retarded and do his hangouts over some stupid useless bullshit like healing apex or ailment burst
Hits 4 weaknesses, 1 more than Ken or Koromaru whos main advantage is that they hit two magical weaknesses and one physical one
Get him slash boost and Junpei will clear harder than Akihiko until brave blade.
The king party setup for midgame is Junpei, Aigis and Koromaru cause Fuuka doesn’t have upgrade oracle yet and Aigis and Junpei are the only ones with physical theurgies. After that its Junpei, Aigis and Akihiko/Ken depending on if you need Divine Intervention or not.
Koromaru is always one the best for tatarus exploration though

>>719171692 (OP)
Technically not a single player game and extremely niche but I highly believe people overrate the RAmar class in PSO.
I would also say the same about FOnewem.
RAmarls higher MST lets her perform better with Heaven Punisher and RAmars higher ATA is pretty irrelevant outside of solo’s or FOless games. More importantly RAmarl is just better in FOless games while casts are unparalleled in party games.
FOnewem is completely overrated for similar reasons, I’d say FOnewem is the worst just because of lack of support tech range

>>719174105
She's the best healer/support though, also I don't want to use Morganna (he's better as an off battle heal anyway because of his larger SP pool).

>>719171692 (OP)
Mathematicians in FFT. You have to grind JP to learn the required skills in the actual class which has dogshit stats after you already had to grind in every single magic class to learn their respectable spells.

>>719180083
Morgana is technically better than Makoto if you teach him debilitate and I would say better in general until Makoto learns Mediarahan.
Makoto I’d say is only strictly better in Maruki’s dungeon after her trait upgrades and she gets aoe debilitate (specifically with Akechi) and even then Morgana has access to cheaper Debilitate if you choose to teach it to him while giving you cheaper salvations.

>>719180321
Well said

>>719180467
Access to debilitate doesn't really matter, you get enough of the item version of the skill through the mementos runs.

>>719171692 (OP)
Every New Vegas party member. Fallout 4's followers are overall more interesting.

>>719180619
If we are bringing items into consideration here then none of the party members except Ryuji have any value anon.
The only consumables that are plentiful in persona games are healing items, which is why characters like Morgana and Yukari are considered to have useless specs while characters that have a ton of utility skills are said to be more useful as support, like Makoto or Teddie.
While its true that you will collect more than necessary utility items for most if not all of the endgame fights you are definitely not gonna do all of mementos and palaces with the amount of debilitate sprays you will consistently obtain throughout the game, much less buff/debuff items

>>719174105
Makoto in general, fuck makoto.

>>719180732
TRVKE

>>719181718
Items can't replicate attacks like God's Hand or Brave Blade. In terms of using up those items, you're not going to be spending one every single battle, buffs/debuffs are used for the tougher fights, and a proper Persona with Auto-ma skills covers the first 3 turns of battle, more than enough for trash fights. If you ever need to recast buffs, Joker once again does it better than everyone else because he gets access to Thermopylae. Yusuke is a close second but the high SP cost is actually a problem for him. So if Joker can handle buffs at the start of combat better than everyone else, and can recast buffs better than everyone else, and everyone has equal access to items for healing or debuffs, the value a party member has at that point is through their damage potential, Persona trait, and unique skill.
>Ryuji: full charge, God's Hand, chance to increase physical damage for anyone in the party
>Ann: full concentrate, second highest fire damage spell, chance to reduce SP consumption for party when using magic attack
>Morgana: meme crit chance attack, only gets Garudyne instead of a Blazing Hell equivalent, chance to increase the power of healing skills in a game where you'll be using only full heals by the end
>Yusuke: luster candy, Brave Blade, increased chance for allies to dodge physical attacks
>Makoto: SMT debilitate, Atomic Flare, increased chance for physical ailments to proc
>Haru: tetrakarn + makarakarn, One-shot Kill, reduces party ailment susceptibility
>Akechi: Laevateinn, chance to reduce ally support skill cost
>Sumire: Party wide rebellion, chance for a party member to not get downed
I'm not considering Akechi and Sumire's tier 3 Persona skills since those are only available for 1 day. The party member's stats should also be taken into consideration. You can modify them with juices but that takes time. If we look at this, Ryuji, Yusuke, Haru, Akechi, and Sumire have value for a physical team. Ann and Makoto have value for a magic team.

>>719184005
The sp cost for yusuke, ryuji or makotos ultimate skills is irrelevant if you take akechi. The party members that actually do something items and Joker cant either in terms of damage or utility are ryuji, makoto, akechi, haru and Ann.
Using buff items for every major battle means you won’t have many left if any at all for the actual relevant battles in new game+ so yes having access to debilitate is very useful.
The only thing you wrote thats actually correct is Joker being better than Yusuke at aoe heat riser but this also means using Jokers turn for that so it doesn’t make Yusuke entirely useless.
This leaves Morgana as the only party member who is completely replaceable by plentiful bead items unless you give him debilitate and Sumire who is just generally useless outside of aoe rebellion.
>auto-buff
We are talking about debuffs and theres no auto-debuffs. I also never once specified random battles.
Morganas passive is actually useful as salvation spam which is the only thing an item cannot replicate consistently so giving him debilitate gives him something to do in off turns besides fishing for crits and that can be potentially better than Makotos AOE one on lavenza.
For the record: phys lets you blow through the most of the games easily, but it is only relevant for one phase of Lavenza. If we are talking about the actual hardest challenges in this game then the best party member is haru combined with Akechi.

>>719184005
If you are using a proper auto buff persona then the buffs should last 4 turns or 5 turns after you can make laksmi around level 67 i believe (or pay early to make her).
Even with this I don’t think theres a single boss fight, post auto-matarukaja that will last only 4 turns or less

>>719171864
brownest post of the month award

>>719187823
why are we whites groomed like this

>persona thread actually discussing gameplay
It'a a fucking miracle.
I love using Makoto to capitalize on Ann/Ryuji/Yusuke's elemental status effects.
Also koromaru is really good but I have a hard time justifying using him when Junpei is there glowing like god.
Then Aigis. I use her strictly because I love her but she's a bit underwhelming compared to Fes. She does good pierce damage but it's not enough.
I love how much better Ken is in reload too. I used him all through the answer.

>>719186582
>bringing up new game plus
The only new game plus fights are the twins and Lavenza. Sure you can fight the twins as soon as you unlock Mementos, but you have all the way until December to do it. You also lose your levels, so you're going to be back in Mementos which gives you plenty of time to grab enough for both fights. Natural debilitate access does not matter. You're also severely overestimating how many buffs you'll need for major fights throughout the game that you would think you could run out of buff items. At most you use matarukaja, rakunda, and tarunda or their item equivalents. Takemedic all and its variants covers the healing required for most cases, and in cases where that's not enough healing you have beads. You mention buff/debuff items so it's only natural i would touch on buff access. The only reason I brought up random battles is because you made it seem like the items are scarce which is not true unless you're using them in random battles. If we want to focus on debuffs only, then again items cover everything and Morgana having debilitate access is not important.
>salvation spam
How many fights are you running into where you're taking enough damage that warrants a Mediarahan and you're also getting hit with status ailments at the same time? Lavenza does this, but she's one fight and is new game plus only.

>>719182330
I do want to fuck Makoto.

>>719188524
Funnily enough Aigis is amazing in reload and garbage in FES. Its funny how overrated things are never properly backed up by actual information.
In FES she was probably the weakest damage of the party, on top of being in permanent buff duty (3 turns to buff, and 1 to attack) to make matters worse buffs didn’t overwrite so unless she went last it frequently breaks her pattern. Orgia mode was an actual waste in FES too (3 turns of double damage followed by 3 turns of doing nothing where you take double damage)
Meanwhile in reload orgia mode is massively improved and shes one of the only two party members with a physical theurgy. Her buffs can actually overwrite in reload, she is one of the 3 characters that actually gets a damage multiplier passive, and her second theurgy competes with akihiko in the phys department easily on top of all the sturdy passives she gets.

>>719190027
You don’t need to use buff items or buffs at all for any fucking boss fight in persona, new game+ or not but especially in new game+. The only boss fight in the game where your statement of debilitate doesn’t actually matter COULD apply is lavenza and the twins, because those are the only two fights where you will prioritize item use, but even then you’re using Haru for them meaning you will likely have one of the 2 debilitate users in your party which will be either Akechi or Morgana assuming you gave him debilitate and and no I’m not counting makoto there.
>how many fights warrant mediarahan spam
In the endgame? Yaldy in a regular playthrough.
Lavenza and the twins in NG+.
You aren’t going to be using Mediarahan with any party member before Yaldys palace. However, Mediarama is consistently useful throughout the entire game. Even with auto-buffs Okumura isn’t such a simple boss fight and Shido is an HP sponge. The only boss fight that I found to be legitimate cakewalk was Sae.

>>719188524
It amuses me how OP they made Ken in reload. People basically didn’t notice in the base campaign but then the big name youtuber suddenly realizes that a party of Ken, Koromaru, and Metis covers every single weakness without input from aigis while also having heals, Revives, dekaja, matarukaja, and Karns.
Yeah totally not op lol

>>719194395
Ken/Koro/Metis already did that in FES

>>719192997
So you agree that Morgana is completely fucking useless if the only fights where item usage matters are in new game plus meaning you will have plenty of items to use debilitate whenever you need to, and salvation is pointless since Yaldaboth is the only fight that needs Mediarahan spam (this also isn't true, Takemedic All-Z heals for enough) meaning Makoto can cover everything Morgana would be doing.