Thread 719685765

When did you realize Wind Waker was the weakest entry in the franchise, and why did it take you so very long?

>>719685765 (OP)
Weird way of spelling TotK

nothing is lamer than triforce heroes

Probably when they shoved a segment with half baked stealth mechanics near the start, it only got worse from there.

>dude what if we got rid of all the gritty elements that were essential to zelda's aesthetic
>dude what if we made the ocean huge and empty with the same repeating blue color throughout
>dude what if we got rid of all challenge from every aspect of the game
>dude what if we told you how to solve a puzzle in the final dungeon when the solution was a door over
>dude what if we got rid of a few dungeons and replaced them with stupid triforce hunt shit
>dude what if we had the worst dungeons in 3D zelda
>dude what if we tried to give ganon a sympathetic motive at the final battle, never expanded on it and killed him anyway
>dude what if we added a multi-weapon mechanic but made it useless since it drops after opening a door and are all shittier than the master sword anyway
>dude what if we permanently fucked up the timeline
>dude what if we made it so you constantly have to change the wind pattern to even navigate through the shit overworld
>dude what if we made it so that the biggest side quest in the game involves a camera with an extremely limited photo inventory
>dude what if we copy pasted shitty enemy gauntlets all over the world for padding
>dude what if we made the teleporting mechanic limited to a couple squares of the world
>dude what if we had the first major area in the game open up with a shitty stealth segment for no reason
>dude what if...hear me out...what if we made the players farm for butterfly charms to progress

>>719685798
wind waker is worse than totk

>>719685765 (OP)
You cannot say that in good faith when Skyward Sword exists.

>>719685765 (OP)
it's my favorite

>>719686049
red pill

>>719685765 (OP)
Gay sex with Toon Link!

>>719686129
Skyward sword has a few good dungeons and lanaryu is cool. WW has nothing

>>719686050
disagreed

>>719686049
>dude what if we made the ocean huge and empty with the same repeating blue color throughout

not only are you wrong but you seem to not understand the concept of an ocean

ive never looked up the cutting room floor but i feel like this game had lots of cut content
it feels so short and half the game until you unlock teleport is spent just afking from one end of the sea to the other

>>719686049
>dude what if we made it so you constantly have to change the wind pattern to even navigate through the shit overworld

this is the only valid criticism

It's not THE weakest because multiplayer Zeldas exist, but those outliers notwithstanding it probably is. I'd maybe put Spirit Tracks lower for the train bullshit but the dungeons, bosses and Ghost Zelda are all actually pretty good. Hmm.

>>719686287
A few good dungeons sandwiched between the worst swordplay and pacing in the series by a mile. Big whoop.

>>719685765 (OP)
When Nintendo gave me this instead of a kickass game based on the Space World Zelda demo where Link is fighting Ganondorf.

>>719686696
Pacing isnt as bad as wind waker

>>719685798
BOTW and TOTK are remakes of WW.

>>719685765 (OP)
It's the best. It has the best link, and by extension of the best link, he had the best original story/village and that isn't going into the fact king of red lions is the best companion in all of Zelda over midna fi, or whatever fairy waifu slop or hat. Then on top of that you get the best tetra, and by the end of links through the sequels he's founded an entire new continent, named it Hyrule and fucked Zelda for eternity.

No other links can compete. It's pictograph kino was also the most sovlful collectathon out of all of the Zeldas.

>>719686780
Yeah bro I hecking love having to revisit each area twice while fighting the Imprisoned a gajillion times!

>>719686385
you would be surprised, all kinds of cuts.
-Link ages throughout the game
-Second overworld under the ocean
-Ride fishing hooks to the surface
-Several dungeons
-Gamecube island
-A flying sail

>>719686629
Spirit Tracks is underrated, it's such a difficult game puzzle wise, even the bosses too. If you're just criticizing it for the overworld, just pivot back to Wind Waker, a complete waste of that open world.

>>719686921
midna clears the faggot boat even if your not a coomer

>>719686921
>king of red lions is the best companion
>you get the best tetra
what kinda retarded shit are you on

>>719687110
Tetra is the best written Zelda bar none.
Kotr is also the best written companion bar none.

Midnafags will seethe and hiss at the truth though.

>>719685765 (OP)
I don't care about anything after Twilight Princess.

>>719687179
you're just so stupidly wrong, amazing

>>719686696
>the worst swordplay
Eh, it's honestly more of a puzzle solving gimmick than "swordplay". The Ghirahim fights are cool at least.

>and pacing
SS definitely isn't high tier in this regard but it's a lot less jank than WW's. Forced to connect the dots on the map for half the game before "I guess you should've looked for triumph forks shit while we kept you on that leash". I would say the near allergic avoidance to exploration in SS is more of an issue than the pacing. SS can stick to its story for the most part, but God help you if you want to do a whole lot else. I guess there's the gratitude crystal stuff, and for what that's worth the sidequests are better than WW's.

>>719686923
That all sucks but still isnt as bad as WW's monotonous ocean travel or the triforce hunt

>>719687048
If we're comparing high points then Spirit Tracks runs away as the better game. That said, I really cannot think of a mechanic I despise more in Zelda than ST's train, and that's no hyperbole. I'd crash through a dungeon and then put the game down for almost a year every time I had to do some shit on the train. Every time I brought myself to pick it up was suffering until the game became fun again. Seriously, it probably took me about 5 years on and off to beat ST. It's great until it fucking isn't.

>>719685765 (OP)
It beats every other Zelda game in the soul department.

>>719687445
Which might matter more if you're watching someone else play it, but not when you're slogging through it yourself.

>>719685765 (OP)
Honestly, strip out the triforce shard hunt (or streamline it even further than HD) and I think it's fine. That was fucking boring. Game is alright otherwise, it has some cool stuff. Not my favorite but definitely not the worst.

>>719687538
The Triforce hunt should've been the entire game. WW should've been Zelda 1 on water. Here's a sword, a boat and a sail - figure it out. Instead, it's a bad OoT for 10 hours before even partially entertaining the idea of being an actual fucking seafaring game.

>>719685765 (OP)
when it released on switch 2 and all i wanted was twilight princess

wind waker takes place 3x generations after TotK and before ALTP

Other Zelda stories can't really compare to Wind Waker cause you got a little sister you're out there saving and you just happened to fall ass backwards into becoming the green suited hero of legend, and you can always come back home to play with the pigs or take a combat lesson with your island mates and finish the day up with grandmas soup.

Windfall isle also has to be one of the best hubs in all of Zelda from the music to the vibrant population.

I realized when i played TP for the first time, they fucked up big with Wind Waker.

>>719688312
Certainly wasn't the first time you played twilight princess because the first 5+ hours of that game to the uninitiated is a complete slog

>>719688423
if youre gonna cope about TP at least do it believable
>tutorial that is supposed to be a slog in replays is also a slog the first time you play it
>WW has 10 hours of just roaming around on the overworld

So which way is it?

>>719685765 (OP)
when it came out, but then everything after it was worse and in retrospect ww wasnt so bad anymore

>>719686049
I can tell that you never played a zelda game because most of those complaints are also in other Zelda games

>>719688863
>when it came out,
based
>but then everything after it was worse
aaaaaaand you lost me

>>719685798
I played both and I had more fun with TotK desu. But idk maybe it's because of the way I emulated it. WW was just so sluggish

>>719686869
>BOTW and TOTK are remakes
That explains why they're so shitty.

>>719686049
>It's another ocarinafag talking like he knows the series despite only playing oot and mm
I'm tired of watching this rerun

>>719688792
Sailing is one of the most kino activities any human can do ever and finding new things on the uncharted horizon will never not be fun.

The twilight princess tutorial and first temple is just a massive fucking slog to get through that I haven't managed to ever replay the game. Reinstalled it and dolphin 5x times and just never go deeper cause the beginning is such a slog.

Comparatively it's the triforce hunt that's a lot later in windwaker that's a slog and by that point the island vibes have completely sucked me in anon

>>719685765 (OP)
Every Zelda game is the weakest entry in it because ive never played any LOZ game besides Links awakening on the GBA and a emulated version of Ocarina of time for about an hour. Overall I rate Awakening pretty high up and the rest uh lets say 7/10

>>719689153
WW's intro isn't much better. The first 10 minutes are great but then you immediately lose your sword after a rope tutorial, and everything between here and landing on Dragon Roost is a slog.

>>719689385
Try the Oracles duology if you liked Awakening.

>>719685765 (OP)
SS is still the weakest entry, WW is the weakest entry that gives a shit about the formula.
>>719686287
SS has one good dungeon (Sand ship is pretty good up until the boss), one par dungeon (Cistern would be better if it was designed like a Zelda dungeon, not an Aonuma dungeon) and one very mediocre dungeon (free choice). Lanayru is only cool, because it's the only good area.
All of that is still cancelled out by all the rest of SS being and abysmal, disjointed and ugly mess.
>>719686780
The pacing is fuck-awful, you can't even skip text boxes, you need to sit through all the scrolling.
>>719687271
>Eh, it's honestly more of a puzzle solving gimmick than "swordplay"
That makes it the worst swordplay in the series. Combat segments are supposed to be about turning your brain off and thinking about short term crap, not just more individualized puzzles.
>I would say the near allergic avoidance to exploration in SS is more of an issue than the pacing. SS can stick to its story for the most part,
The pacing in SS repeatedly falls off a cliff every time it brings up some mediocre twist of "Oh no nothing happened, guess you need to collect 3 more of a thing", at least in WW something changes or happens in response.
>>719686869
Those two games have more in common with SS though. They were made so that the meandering and incompetent dev style of current Zelda management could shit out a meandering and incompetent game that played around those weaknesses.

>>719685765 (OP)
It can't be when Twilight Princess exist.

>>719689637
>It can't be when the best Zelda game exist.
I'm not following.

>>719689716
You only like it because of Midna.

>>719689770
Not really but okay.

>>719689770
Well Midna is a good ass reason for naning Twilight Princess the best Zelda game of all time, I mean c'mon, fat goblin ass gives you a 10/10 on the ratings alone

>>719685813
This. Anyone labeling a mainline console release as "weakest" is either trolling, a retard, or a casual who hasn't played more of the franchise. Tri Force Heroes is weakest not only in story, but also in gameplay. Go ahead and try to play it solo, I dare you.

1. Ocarina of Time - Best game ever made
2. Link's Awakening - Best world design
3. Majora's Mask - Best side content / atmosphere
4. A Link to the Past - Jack of all trades master of none
5. Oracle of Ages - Most complex puzzles
6. Oracle of Seasons - Excellent when Linked with Ages
7. The Wind Waker - Soulful Pirate Adventure
8. Minish Cap - Difficulty is the only flaw here
9. A Link Between Worlds - Excellent modernized ALBW
10. Twilight Princess - Best set pieces, nostalgia, 3rd best dungeons, awful pacing, writing and design
11. Skyward Sword - Best bosses by far, second best dungeons
12. BOTW
13. Phantom Hourglass
14. Adventure of Link
15. TOTK
16. Zelda 1
17. Spirit Tracks

>>719690004
What makes Ocarina so great? If you remove the nostalgia lens what do ya get? Honest to god question, I never played it so im actually asking

>>719690089
Literally just played SM64 in 2002 as a kid before OOT and i hate it now, i don't care for GTA III or Halo or RDR1 either. OOT is just perfect

>>719685765 (OP)
It's not perfect. but it's one of the few games that actually triggers the joy of of exploration and discovery. Don't tell me you played this and felt nothing. Kill me if I ever get this jaded.
Cel shaded graphics were also kino and held up much better than anything that came after until BOTW.

>>719689770
I give TP a pass because midna is hot and I dont have to actually play it again. the main games after it are however irredeemably bad and only have positive points when compared to each other which is terrible

>>719690004
good until you stopped explaining things. botw and totk should be lower and zelda 1,2 and ST are too low

>>719690004
>botw higher then its better version spirit tracks
>zelda 1 and hourglass lower then either switch release
i applaud you putting that trash low but atleast try to maintain some credibility

>>719685765 (OP)
I’m glad people are finally waking up to this.

>>719689140
bizarre accusation, the pavlovian response against WW criticism is usually TP

>>719690162
I hate how obnoxiously surface level WW is. If you're gonna play with a concept as grand as "Zelda on the open sea" then go hard. They clearly wanted to as well, but they had to rush development and it really feels like we got maybe half the game they actually wanted to make. Shit sucks, but it doesn't change how disappointing what we got is.

>>719691124
>Surface level
Lol

>>719685765 (OP)
when the lobotomy surgery was successful

People who hate windwaker just never read the Odyssey as a kid and it shows

>>719690004
1. alright
2. sure
3. ok
4. idk haven't played
5. idk haven't played
6. idk haven't played
7. ok
8. Is it that hard? Or maybe too easy?
9. idk haven't played
10. ok but I don't think the writing and design is as bad as you say. Midna is the only interesting three-dimensional character I can think of in this series out of the games I have played.
11. liked it but world design was pretty game-y
12. fair
13. fair
14. you like zelda 2 more than 1? Well it is fun, but for me it was difficult.
15. lower
16. I don't remember most of zelda 1
17. haven't played but the trains put me off. nice music though.

I probably like minish cap and twilight princess more than you do.

>>719687407
If it matters it my last playthrough of Wind Waker took 6 years because I got bored and put it down 2 times. I dont see myself playing it again unless through a randomizer.

minish cap was gooooooood

I beat minish cap and wind waker.

>>719687538
>strip out the triforce shard hunt (or streamline it even further than HD) and I think it's fine.
I will fix Wind Waker pay attention


The triforce has broken into 20 shards, your goal, the goal of your father or grandfather was to find them and discover the mysteries that perplexed your ancestors. The entire game is finding the triforce shards. The dungeons are optional, they provide you with valuable tools, tools that you can afford to buy instead if you treasure hunt.

>>719692995
It has like maybe 600 checks if you wanna do an Archipelago. Last time I tried it I was the last to finish my game. Tower of gods is a pain if there's an essential item in there.

>>719687620
150%

>>719688219
and Twilight Princess mogs Wind Waker because you're saving your friends, and then an interdimensional princess and restoring the memories of the girl you love.

>>719693181
Twilight realm is lame

>>719689153
The other activity is flying. and uhhh, personally I lump Skyward Sword with Wind Waker at the bottom of the barrel.

>>719693243
Flying isn't near as based as sailing was.

>>719689964
>Anyone labeling a mainline console release as "weakest" is either trolling, a retard, or a casual
retard, when this topic comes up everyone is overlooking the low hanging fruit of CDi Zelda, and multiplayer Zelda, and for future reference neither is mainline.

>>719690004
>1. Ocarina of Time - Best game ever made
>10. Twilight Princess - Best set pieces, nostalgia, 3rd best dungeons, awful pacing, writing and design

TP succeeded OoT and you need to stop pretending.

>>719693372
Intro Sequence

You spend 2–3 hours in Ordon herding goats, rescuing a cat, learning slingshot/fishing.
By the time you hit your first dungeon, you’ve already slogged through chores.
Compare to OOT: 3 hours to get to Dodongo's Cavern and 6 hours to beat Child link section
Wolf Link/Tears of Light
Three full “collect bugs” segments — nearly identical each time.
They grind momentum to a halt. MM’s 3-day cycle repetition is brilliant because it changes how you play; TP’s wolf hunts are just padding.

Between-Dungeon Chores
Fishing for Reekfish to unlock Snowpeak
Escort mission with the wagon.
The fucking statues
Long travel sequences across empty Hyrule Field.
Following the cat through Castle Town

>>719693318
>CDi Zelda
Not a real Zelda game, not developed or licensed by Nintendo. Also not part of any Zelda history books Nintendo has published like Hyrule Historia.

>and multiplayer Zelda
Nobody brings these up because there has been exactly one multiplayer-only Zelda game: Four Swords. FSA is perfectly beatable solo, and Tri Force Heroes has a dogshit tacked-on singleplayer aspect, but it's still present.

>and for future reference neither is mainline.
I never said they were. OP didn't specify a mainline entry, only one from the franchise, and Tri Force Heroes counts for that.

>>719693482
Intro sequence
game world builds and character develops
you do two dozen different activities ending with the completion of the first dungeon

from dungeon 1 to dungeon 2
fight enemies on horseback
joust over a bottomless pit bridge
learn sumo wrestling from a mayor
prove to gorons you're stronger than a brick house

>>719693567
retard, the nigger above brought up triforce heroes are you drunk

>>719693684
Are you illiterate you fucking mongoloid? I agreed with the guy who brought up Tri Force Heroes, because he was right. Everyone else here is talking about Wind Waker, BotW, TotK, Skyward Sword, and Twilight Princess. Fucking MAINLINE TITLES.

>>719693812
He's not right because everyone of sound mind ignores those entries. Fuck off moron.

>>719693829
>Which Zelda game is the weakest?
>No not that one, I meant the console titles!!!!!

>>719688219
This Anon gets it. WindWaker is the best because it's a lad thrust into heroism in order to save his family. Not simply to save a girl you barely know, but your own flesh and blood.

>>719688219
I don't care what anyone says WWHD looks like ass

>>719688965
I can tell you've never played TRUE Zelda because you think WW is true zelda

>>719690004
>Zelda 1 that low
>Adventure of Link that low
>Fake zelda dogshit like OoT and Item Switching Simulator Awakening that high
lmao OoT babs can't meme no wonder your shitty game introduced breakable weapons

>>719685798
/thread

>>719685765 (OP)
there are lots of weak Zelda games. I didn't bother finishing Phantom Hourglass or Spirit Tracks because they hurt my hands to play, BotW was so boring I quit it an hour in and never even tried playing TotK, TP had a very weak start but once I through that it was fine, SS recycled The Imprisoned and had annoying QoL issues. I don't actually like Zelda games that much despite playing most of them so the best game in the series imo is Adventure of Link.

>>719695239
Unfathomably shit taste

>>719695239
>BotW was so boring
go back and try again faggot, it sucks to be so wrong

>>719698196
It really is. There's no reason to ever replay it.
Infact when I played ToTK all I could think of is how much I messed up playing BoTW first because it took away from the ToTK experience.

>>719698324
There's such good reason to replay it, try again it would suck to miss out on this just because you're young dumb and full of cum.

>>719698354
There's absolutely zero reason to replay it.
Not for the dungeons, bosses, story, certainly not for the shrines, koroks, and empty world.

>>719698447
There's huge reasons to play it, stop being such a zoomer. There's zero reason to write the game off when it's such a monumental entry in a 40 year old franchise.

>>719698196
>damage sponges, minigame shrines, and ubisoft towers
no fucking thank you

>>719698514
Nta but I also got bored of BotW. I liked the first few hours after plateau, as well as some characters(Purah), but otherwise it was very repetitive and story was the annoying "all the cool stuff happened in past" deal compared to other Zeldas where you were active part of the story.
If you can give some examples for huge reasons to play it, do list them. I think it would be more effective and convinciny than calling someone insults.

>>719693812
If it's on the timeline then it's mainline. Those are the rules.

>>719695239
>Phantom Hourglass or Spirit Tracks because they hurt my hands to play
There must be a good setup to play these on emulator with a controller by now

Should I play the GameCube or Wii U version of Wind Waker?

>>719685765 (OP)
They fixed it with the faster sail in the HD release. I don't think it gets enough credit for the dungeons particularly the earth and wind dungeons were p.good.

>>719701851
Only play Wind Waker if you're four years old. If you're any older than that the game is simply too easy and made for babies for a person.

>>719689010
>WW was just so sluggish
The whole game plays faster on Wii U, especially text speed.

>>719685765 (OP)
but that bussy doe

>>719685813
spbp

>>719685765 (OP)
sex with tww link

>>719693482
I like how a major point of contention with TP is that it doesn't use its overworld enough, and yet posts like these admonish the times it does use its overworld as "chores".

>>719693916
Being unable to infer context is a telltale sign of autism.