Thread 720168481

Remember the time normalfags treated this guy as a symbol of an invading species and destroyed his entire franchise out of spite?

>Destroyed franchise
Lol, Sonic's back harder then he has in decades thanks to Shadow.

He still clashes with the classic games, I prefer 3D though. He also kind of made Knuckles obsolete

Shadow was polarizing. Put yourself in the shoes of people playing 90s Sonic. SA2 was the last Dreamcast era game. Shadow comes along and the whole vibe of the franchise shifts to something more edgy. The future of the series was uncertain. Then it really did fall apart during 2006.
By now though the people who like Shadow's story are big part of the player base.

If you don't see the huge tonal shift Shadow brought to the series, you're a moron

>>720170993
Good thing there's all those games that kept the old tone by just not using him that game like Unleashed.

>>720169709
Shadow was always popular.

>>720171336
Unleashed excluded everyone because it was a soft reboot

>>720171867
Back when SA2 was first released, people felt that Shadow and his story didn't really fit the Sonic series. And they were right. Nothing about Gerald Robotnik, Maria, GUN, or Shadow has anything to do with the Sonic mythos.

>>720172542
Only the sort of insufferable fags who would use /v/ to whine about nonsense thought Shadow's story was bad. Those complaints didn't age well because Shadow is borderline more popular than Sonic himself now.

Older millennials hated him because it was a sign of them aging. Shadow represented the 2000s just the way Sonic represented the 90s.

>>720168481 (OP)
I'm pretty sure the franchise was destroyed by a bunch of shitty games. I don't dislike Shadow, though I think SA2 is pretty shit.

>>720172598
Shadow remained 2nd most popular at worst even during the 18 years of barely acknowledging his existence.

>>720172598
Nobody said it was bad, just that it didn't fit Sonic.

>>720172719
Probably because Shadow is a badass lone wolf type, so Sega ignoring him only makes him look cooler.

>>720172660
Except Shadow is even more of a product of the 2000s than Sonic was of the 90s. He's more dated now than 90s Sonic ever was.

Shadowfags don't show any respect for Knuckles and how he was the true rival of Sonic at the time.

>>720172891
Knuckles isnt even the coolest black guy in this franchise

>>720172719
They barely acknowledged ANYONE'S existence for 18 years

>>720172862
You don't remember 90s Sonic then. Or are trying to pretend American AND British Sonic never existed. American Sonic was a mohawk wearing Bart Simpson clone who jammed out to hip music and said catchphrases. British Sonic was a roight daft bloke, like the Beano, always out for a laff, even at the expense o' the lads.

Shadow was only good in SA2 and Heroes, when he actually had emotions. Now he's just stoic or angry all the time, and it makes him a really dull and flat character because he doesn't play off of the characters well at all.

>>720173265
He's good in that most recent DLC. The problem with Shadow is he's surprisingly complex, dumb people think he's just an edgy douche when he's supposed to be tormented.

Sonic represents the 90s (too cool for school)
Shadow represents the 00s (edgy yet sincere)
Silver represents the 2010s (naive and headstrong, yet always feeling misplaced in time)
Surge represents the 2020s (nothing to live for, her entire life is a life)

>>720173401
>her entire life is a life
woah

>>720173401
>her entire life is a life

>>720173487
>>720173491
(I'm not sober but I meant 'her life is a lie'.)
But yes. Her life is a life.

>>720173491
Shadow's life is tragic, but he has closure and purpose. Surge does not.

>>720172891
Knuckles was a rival for like half of a game really. Okay well a full game maybe two if you wanna be technical

>>720168481 (OP)
>saves the entire fucking franchise out of NOWHERE with the slightest amount of focus
ALL HAIL SHAAAAADOWWWWWWW

>>720173265
Shadow Generations singlehandedly disproves this, meanwhile Sonic isn't even allowed to cry anymore.

>>720172542
>Sonic mythos

>>720173401
Then what does her hot hypnotist creator Doctor Starline represent?

>>720168481 (OP)
I will grant you one wish

Niggas hated Shadow but wanted to fuck Sally Acorn

>>720176390
HEROES RISE AGAIIIIN

>>720176390
It was actually Sage... and movie Sonic... and Jim Carrey

>>720176390
i still have no clue how he did it
>3rd in line of a mid movie that overstayed its welcome
>re-release DLC, priced at full fucking price
>ian flynn retroactively blaming sega for writing shadow like shit in the comics when its proven its all him

>movie is the best in the trilogy and is the 2nd highest grossing video game movie of all time
>shadow generations actually sells and plays fucking great
>does shadow an absurd amount of justice and every other sonic character fan (that isnt GODnik of course) seethes endlessly

all hail shadow

>>720176390
My problem with shadow is that he's effectively cucked knuckles
Both as sonic's rival, and as the one Rouge orbits
I have no idea why knux/rouges dynamic appears maybe 1/10th as much nowadays

>>720172598
>Only the sort of insufferable fags who would use /v/ to whine about nonsense thought Shadow's story was bad.
Nobody said his story was "bad". Shadow's arc is literally just a repeat of Gamma's from the previous game, except with worse pacing.
The point is about stuff involving government conspiracies and coverups about murdered innocents not really feeling like it was in the same lane as everything else Sonic had already been up to that point (e.g., 1 through SA1), which focused more mystical shit and ancient societies.

This a big reason why Heroes ended up having a very classic-esque presentation, as Sonic Team were basically trying to "course correct" after the style and tone of SA2. And then they proceeded to veer in a bunch of different directions with each following game, because they're Sonic Team.

>>720176534
Sonic isn't the type of character who should cry in the first place.

>>720168636
>Sonic's back harder then he has in decades thanks to Shadow
That would actually be due to pic related. Shadow Gens wouldn't have even happened if the movies hadn't convinced Sega to start pumping more projects out on a yearly basis.

>>720177472
It's more like he doesn't get put in any situations that would warrant it. Shadow didn't even cry when Maria died, yet got put in a situation where he did.

>>720177401
>Shadow's arc is literally just a repeat of Gamma's from the previous game, except with worse pacing
hearing you explain this ought to be good

>>720177626
>That would actually be due to pic related
Half true, the one with shadow is the one that made the most. Best believe that the 4th is going to give him way more focus than the games.

>>720177748
>It's more like he doesn't get put in any situations that would warrant it.
It's happened. He's a bit more stoic than that. Or he used to be, up until Shadow became a thing and they intentionally started making Sonic less stoic so there'd a bigger contrast between the two.

>>720168481 (OP)
no?

>vegeta's popularity compared to goku's
>shadow's popularity compared to sonic's
Which is closer?

>>720177852
I don't understand why it even needs to be drawn out for you.
>artificial creation carries out his creator's scheme until he breaks his programming and sacrifices himself for the greater good
Oh, and in both cases Amy is used as the catalyst for breaking said programming. Kinda funny. I guess she wasn't doing anything else in SA2.

>>720177870
>Half true, the one with shadow is the one that made the most.
And? There's a bigger domino effect with the first movie being a surprise success than with the third movie making a bunch of money around a year ago.

>>720177472
should or would? outside of archie (where it happened a couple of times), sonic would 100% bawl if tails died

>>720177148
>every other sonic character fan (that isnt GODnik of course) seethes endlessly
As an Omegachad since Heroes Gammafag before that I welcome our new GODow overlords

>>720178284
A single crack would be understandable, but Sonic is simply too put-together in most scenarios to start bawling about anything.
An understated tearshed would have a bigger punch than some melodramatic outburst anyway.

>>720178387
Yeah my favorite part about Shadow blowing up is that it automatically props up Omega alongside it
Best and STRONGEST robot

>>720178162
shadow is cooler than vegeta because shadow practically isnt allowed to lose, unlike jobgeta
I just think they really fucked up with shadow in the long run. ever since they started bringing him back, his writing and line delivery sucks IMO. it just reeks of jap-nuance that doesnt carry the same weight when copy pasted to english, its really corny.

makes me think of metroid other M, just not nearly as bad. MAYBE this take sounds retarded because his first appearance in sa2 had the same problem with stuff like "i'm the coolest",
but I dont think a single line from sonic prime or crossworlds sounds as decent as 06 or even shadow the hedgehog 2005

>>720178408
>best friend who is practically your little brother dies
>shed a single tear, if any, and thats it
PSYCHOPATHnik isn't canon, unfortunately.

>>720174816
Shadows memories of Maria aren't even real, they were implanted in his head

>>720178582
maybe in Sonic X
the only memory of shadow that is fake is maria wishing for revenge

>>720178547
I get autists need characters to make big huge emotions to understand how a character feels, but a character can be depicted as really sad/depressed without outwardly turning into an explosion of tears.
You might call that nuance.

>>720178171
>I don't understand why it even needs to be drawn out for you
probably because its fucking stupid, thanks for the nonsense explanation

>>720177472
Sonic screamed in anguish when Emerl and Elise died, what are you on about?
The only reason we don't know how Sonic would react if any of his closest friends were killed is because the only time he could've had an in-character response to that was when he was being written by pontaff, where he gets just a little bummed out once he thinks the Zeti have killed all his closest friends. Eggman seemed angrier at the Zeti than Sonic ever has despite having so much less to lose to them.

>>720178771
Why even respond if that's best you could do.

>>720178582
Even if they hypothetically were fake, which they're not, they're all he has, they fundamentally matter to him regardless of their authenticity.

>>720172542
The Sonic mythos had the depth of a kiddie pool outside of SA1. The introduction of SA2 greatly expanded what Sonic had to offer. Shadow and his story expanded what Sonic was allowed to be.
We could have epic stories, actual death, betrayal, redemption, character depth. Sonic had a WORTHY rival. Knuckles was and continues to be a nothing character so he couldn't carry that role. Mechanical Sonics had no real character to them before until Metal Sonic started becoming more villainous, having more depth, and acted more like an ACTUALLY evil Shadow.
SA1 deserves the credit for introducing more than surface level lore, monstrous and epic creatures, and genuine consequence with the destruction of cities.
SA2 elevated all that and truly expanded the franchise into all directions.
Without SA1 and SA2, the series would be just living in Mario's shadow.

>>720179396
>Knuckles was and continues to be a nothing character so he couldn't carry that role.
knucklesbros...

>>720176749
>nooo it's a videogame so it can't have a canon or lore or worldbuilding

>>720179396
CHAOS TRVTHNVKE

>>720179396
>and genuine consequence with the destruction of cities
I like what you're doing, because I also like it when the status quo can go fuck itself, but no.
The story is over once Perfect Chaos destroys Station Square, the only things that concern the aftermath of that event are retroactively applied to that event after SA1, with some of them only being theoretical, because to Sonic and the player, the damage may as well already be repaired since the next time we see it, it already is, so the only consequences are:
>G.U.N. is given much more funding, after Chaos showed how much less capable they've become since they managed to contain Shadow (maybe, it seems plausible, but nothing like this is stated)
>the public is now aware that Sonic's appearance can radically change if he uses the power of the Chaos Emeralds, he also appears to be the only person like himself
>Tails is given a Chaos Emerald for preventing Eggman's missile from destroying the city
>ABSOLUTELY NO ONE DIED, Sega cannot seem to stress this enough, there wasn't a single casualty from Perfect Chaos flooding a city and firing energy lasers capable of destroying the Egg Carrier on impact at the ground, at worst the people living there needed new homes, no one died, no one was even injured
This all amount to just set up for SA2, MAYBE that one scene in Rush if you want to count that, and I do, so I will.

>>720172542
this is because the writer is on record in an interview saying he didn't like the classic games and wanted to make his own spin on Sonic.

>>720177030
I wanna plap Sage

>>720172542
>>720172598
>>720179396
KINO

>>720168481 (OP)
I don't like those noodle arms and legs bending like tubes. And the mono eye. Why do people even think Sonic is cool? lol

Anyone who didn't see the tone SA and a lot of future games were going for probably didn't have their eyes open playing 3&K or CD.

>>720177396
Shadouge? Practically canon. Done? DONE.

>>720185142
>>720177396
Sadly Knuckles is only attracted to his emerald

>>720178162
Shadow is more popular than Sonic isn't he? At least it doesn't really feel like much of a debate compared to Goku vs Vegeta.

>>720185530
No, he is not.

>>720185530
Nah they're pretty much 50/50
I like Sonic more than Shadow myself though they're both cool

>>720185142
The ultimate life form is above roasties. Sorry bitch.

>>720185530
>>720185663
>>720185759
Relative to how much content they each get, Shadow is definitely more popular, dude has 2 solo games and everyone hated the first one and he's just as popular as the guy the IP is named after.

>>720172891
Knuckles isn’t a rival, he’s a retard that got tricked by Eggman in his debut game

>>720186537
And his second "solo" game isn't perchance a rehash of a game that used to be a "solo" Sonic game?

>>720185530
That's impossible.
However, Shadow is closer in popularity to Sonic than Vegeta is to Goku.

>>720178547
What the fuck is this image supposed to imply? Does Shadow love Sonic?

>>720187225
>See ominous black shading
>Think of romance

Remember when Shadow had personality traits besides "brooding"?

>>720187210
I dunno. Vegeta is very popular. I would say he's more popukar than shadow too.

>>720187340
>I would say he's more popukar than shadow too.
same for goku & sonic, i do think the gap between goku&vegeta is way more than sonic&shadow however, but its more of just the sheer love of goku desu

There are many Sonic type characters. Sonic isn't special in his universe.
There's Espio, Fang, Dillo, Jer, Shadow, Silver, Blaze, Suck.
So why do they treat Sonic as the special one?

>>720187571
He actually solos the gods that threaten their world, and is bound by no duties to be somewhere else. Shadow is really the only one that can come sorta close, and even then, it took him being genetically perfect. Most of the time he doesn't even show up.

>>720187571
Suck?

>>720187950
Yeah man, Suck the Cock.

Is that your favorite?
>>720187823
Wdym? He needed Silver and Shadows help to beat Solaris, who is the strongest character.

>>720187571
According to SA2 lore Sonic is the true ultimate lifeform. Shadow was an artificial imitation.

>>720187125
Anon, if you are implying that Shadow Gens is bad, that's another discussion.
Me saying people liked Shadow Gens is a statement, one that stresses how much less material Shadow gets compared to Sonic despite being just as popular.
If most people hated ShTH as well as Shadow gens, and Shadow himself was just as popular as he is right now, he'd be even more popular relative to what he gets.

>>720187225
sonic (in this context) doesnt understand that throwing his weight around is extremely unsettling to others due to his power to defeat even gods

>>720168481 (OP)
>and destroyed his entire franchise out of spite?
Most of them only played a classic Sonic game or two back in the day. It took a long while for Sega to appeal to the Sonic autists who actually bought the games.

>>720168636
Sonic is back? Sonic is not back. The Sonic Franchise for quite a number of years now has been staying alive due to stinky Nostalgia Farts. Seriously...

Sonic Generations
Sonic Mania

These games started the trend of the franchise getting high off its own nostalgic farts. And it bleeds even into new games like Sonic Frontiers with the constant Self Referential dialogue shit. And then you have Sonic Superstars which is blatantly a callback to Classic Sonic. And don't forget Classic Sonic randomly being spammed in Sonic Frontiers and then you have alternate media blatantly relying on Nostalgia Farts like the damn movies which are generally rehashing the same plot elements fans already recognize like Knuckles with the Master Emerald and Shadow the Hedgehog.

The entire franchise has been living on Nostalgia Farts. So much so that we recently got Shadow Generations which is ANOTHER stinky nostalgia fart. The only "original" thing that Sonic has done in recent times is reinvent Amy Rose as a Feminist Girl Boss Bitch for Sonic Movie 4.

That aside the entire franchise is running on the fumes of farting nostalgia for aging Millennials. This franchise is cashing in before it finally kicks the bucket because once the nostalgia well dries up Sonic will go back to being as insulted as it was during its Dark Era. Any time you see a franchise notably relying on nostalgia for an extended amount of time that's bad news.

>>720168481 (OP)
StH (2005) was total shit and always will be.

>>720173265
My take with Shadow is that him being stoic and angry doesn't make him dull or flat rather a bastard. It's like why would anyone want to pretend to be friends with this asshole? Shadow always being emotionally angry and put off by everyone who is alive except Maria just makes him annoying. It's like "Get out no one wants your negativity!"

Shadow was written that he was moving on with his life after resolving his trauma with the death of Maria but from what we see he doesn't give a damn about anyone. He fights because mechanically he's put to fight but he doesn't care about any of his friends hence the Sega mandate "Team Dark does NOT exist!" So Shadow has no friends now. Who knows if that's been changed but Shadow as he currently is, some asshole who only shows empathy for a girl who has been dead for generations is just annoying.

>>720177396
Oh shut up about this terrible idea. Why would Knuckles and frankly ANY man want Rouge the bitch is simply a greedy gold digger whore. There's a reason not even James Bond seriously dates greedy women femme fatales, he knows they are shit.

And if you really want to blame Knuckles for getting cucked blame...

1) Sega for making Knuckles the only echidna alive in the Sonic Universe. Of course Knuckles will never find a female echidna to mate with.

2) Ken the attention whore who caused problems to ensure that not even Sega can create new echidnas for the franchise. Sega both doesn't care about making new echidnas but also are put off in even trying to make new echidnas because of the lawsuits Ken started.

So as a character Knuckles is now stuck in this situation. It's a matter of his creators NOT caring enough while allowing Ken the troublemaker to raise a stink.

>>720168481 (OP)
People weren't ready for the edge kino of the 00s

>>720177870
The fourth movie is about Feminism Amy Rose if anything that's the movie that will kill the Sonic Movies. Boys are really angry at feminism shit especially in current times. These days boys can detect shitty feminism agenda shit and they reject it more quickly than in older eras.

>>720172939
Shadow’s probably the most white coded character next to Sonic though, nothing about him is niggerish he just has black hair. Knuckles and Vector are the only “black” characters.

>>720187571
Because he is always the one who show up and stop Eggman. Also, Blaze is not from his universe.