Thread 720512123

As someone who has gotten the first ending for this game and wanted to see what the hype about Silksong is about I gotta say this game is not a good Metroidvania. This game lack something very important for any Metroidvania. The feeling of power. In this game every boss encounter feels like you are weak as fuck and any win you have feels like you got lucky. The lack of significant health upgrades while enemies get stronger and stronger is not fun for a Metroidvania. Even when you get every power up you are still weak as fuck. This is not fun game design because you should feel like a BADASS in this types of games by the end. It's also obvious the game took inspiration from Mega Man X but instead of having you feel like a bad ass you again are a wimpy little bug.

Is Silksong just as bad in this department because if it is I might not play it.

Silksong plays out in a similar way, yes.

>>720512123 (OP)
>>720512496
silksong has schmoovement which saves it
I dropped hollow knight for similar reasons but I'm actually liking silksong a lot just because you can actually fucking move around in this game

>>720512123 (OP)
I don't really care about facerolling the early game, for me it's about the movement. The main attraction of the game is the boss fights, and everything is balanced around them. Therefore, movement can't ever feel strong enough to go around the map really fast, so you have to rely on fast travelling.
They did better with the movement in Silksong, but the game feels more challenging as a result.
Both are 10/10 games btw

All you get in HK is the optional shadow dash hidden in the butthole of the map, barely any health upgrades, no defense upgrades either. Making progress in HK is adding more screens of spikes, flying enemies with counter projectiles and general bullshit. It means stopping and fighting EVERY single enemy so they can leave you alone, it means turning the endgame with the ghost hunt into some miserable walkback and it means realizing you haven't gotten any better, your arsenal got bigger but you're still a pussy ass bug that dies in 3 hits.

>>720512895
I don't think I can ever replay Hollow Knight after experiencing Silksong's movement, it would just be too boring.

>>720513745
Fucking this holy shit. This is exactly how it feels. I'm trying to get the other endings but I wanted to throw my controller away trying to fight the fucking harder boss ghosts.

>>720514154
The movement of a man that was ended by last judge 20 times.

Since when is power important in a metroidvania? It's about exploration - having good challenging combat is the icing on the cake. You want Metroid? Castlevania? Those are fucking braindead games difficulty wise (Especially Metroid bar Dread).

>>720514457
Actually, I went through the back door on my first playthrough

>>720514714
The gameplay is its own reward, I agree

>>720514714
Because the point of playing a single player game is to be a power fantasy for the player. You want to feel like all those hours exploring the world made you feel stronger.

In Mega Man X for example you start as a weak pathetic Android that needed to be helped by his much stronger Red colored pal but by the end you are so strong you avenge your friend. You become a killing machine.

Castlevania Symphony of the Night you are the son of Dracula who had his shit stolen away by Death. By exploring the Castle you gain all your gear plus more becoming stronger than your father. Plus the RPG element meant that every enemy you defeat makes you a bit stronger.

Super Metroid you chase Ridley in order to save the Baby Metroid. During your quest you gain power up to become stronger and stronger becoming a Tank.

My point is that the games Hollow Knight took a lot from all have that feeling of becoming stronger.

Hollow Knight lacks that. You can say it makes boss fights more intense but the point of this types of games is to become strong enough that you can cheese every encounter if you use the right item or weapon. Sure you have Charms but for the most part because of how weak the Knight is they don't help as much as you want it to be.

>>720515229
Basically not once in Hollow Knight did I felt like Mega Man X with all his power ups or Alucard with the best gear equipped or like end game Samus. This could have been fixed by having more health upgrades, more weapon options beyond the Nail and the shitty spells that you won't use because you want to heal and so on.

>>720512123 (OP)
Silksong is a huge improvement over the first, in almost every way. Bosses are harder, but it also does a far better job of capturing that Megaman Zero feel where it's also fast paced and exciting and you feel like you have a lot of creative approaches at your disposal.

Hollow Knight 1 is like the worst of both worlds where it's both easy and boring. And it's boring because they thought restricting anything fun would make the game more challenging, when Silksong is proof that's not the case.

>>720512123 (OP)
Silksong is way way worse than this

>>720514714
>Since when is power important in a metroidvania?
Ever since Super Metroid and Symphony of the Night let you run around at full power at the start? Since fucking always? Metroidvanias are about getting more power and more tools as you go, Hollow Knight keeps the power ups at minimum but throws 20 fucking areas at you and you're supposed to go back and forth between them like a bitch. Really, reaching HK endgame is realizing that was it, you weren't shit at finding health upgrades the game is just fucking devoid of them, the game wants you to die, the game wants you to walkback, the game actively punishes you for exploring but the plot requires you to do fucking explore. It's masochist bullshit

>>720514714
The hole point of Metroidvania is exploring unlocking power ups.

>>720512123 (OP)
t. ESL retard who has no idea how game design works

>>720516484
>Burger
Ok nigger

>>720516484
>t. Zoomer faggot who first Metroidvania was Hollow Knight

>>720512123 (OP)
>The feeling of power. In this game every boss encounter feels like you are weak as fuck
lmao maybe YOU feel that way because you're trash at the game. This shit has been pretty easy so far, and hornet controls like butter.

>>720516297
I love Metroid, SotN, and Silksong, but I think Hollow Knight was just really mediocre

>>720512123 (OP)

I definitely did not feel like each boss win was a product of luck, it felt like a product of my skill with the move sets and tools provided to me. Your complaints are fair enough although I think you're in the minority on that one. I enjoy overcoming the challenge and developing the ability for some skill expression. Beating Hollow Knight or DS1 back in the day felt like I was flexing on my earlier inexperience. 4chan is literally the worst place to try to have an actual conversation about a videogame where the thread is 90% shitposting btw.

I would say Hollow Knight's bosses were too easy and bland, actually. Hollow Knight fans loved to posture about being super hardcore Soulsfags and that's surely why all other Metroidvanias sucked, but then when Silksong had actually difficult bosses that were also actually fucking good and interesting for once, all of Hollow Knights poser bandwagoning fag fans started crying WAAAAAH SILKSONG IS TOO HARD

>>720512123 (OP)
It's even worse than you know. Upgrading your weapon increases enemy health.

>>720512895
>One tech
Is that seriously all you had to show?

>replay Hollow Knight
>notice how telegraphed boss attacks are
>notice how repetitive fights get
>realize the "difficulty" comes from players getting impatient and tanking damage to land more hits

>>720517883
Really?

>>720517618
All of the worst bosses in Hollow Knight has bullshit artificial difficulty where you could learn the patterns and execute everything flawlessly but the die anyway because two rock projectiles fell out of the ceiling right next to each other and the only place to dodge to is where the boss is about to hip drop. Fucking bullshit. I watched some Silksong footage and will say that at least the Bell Beast tosses shit at you in a way you can actually react to and not the bullshit rng of the original.

>>720518457
People are misremembering how simplistic Hollow Knight's bosses were

>>720518457
>difficulty" comes from players getting impatient and tanking damage to land more hits
It always was. Souls work the exact same way, you can kill a boss with very low skill over time, but since that's no fun most players will try to spice things up or get impatient at the 20th attempt.
That's why you can spend 4 hours on a boss one day and beat it next day on your first try. More expressive systems (bayo, DMC, ninja gaiden)is the usual fun way to do those

>>720518457
Soul Master Rematch was fun. That's what I thought the whole game would be like.

>>720512123 (OP)
>pic is from the first hours of the game
YDNBTG lol

>>720518457
>>720518873
This. Playing it right after Silksong it's astonishing. In SS they just feel so much more organic, whereas in HK they're so unbelievably stiff and repetitive. Yea, with bosses like that no shit players got impatient

>>720519035
I agree with that. Soul Tyrant is a genuinely good boss.

>>720512123 (OP)
What are some metroidvanias that do this right? Particularly modernish ones?

>>720512123 (OP)
git gud

Base game HK is easy as fuck what the hell are you talking about?

>>720512123 (OP)
You put it perfectly. Hollow knight has super drip fed upgrades
>>720514714
Portrait of ruin and Ecclesia are the perfect balance of hard and rewarding and diverse. They are such better games than anything Team Cherry would ever make

>>720519272
Record of loss war and luna nights com to mind

>>720519091
His critique is more valid than any of the many redditors who played the game for 300 hours and think its the best thing in the genre (of which theyve only played 1 of. 2 as of September 4th)

>>720519384
The soul system in Castlevania is one of the best things they could have done. Somehow Castlevania balance is just spot on, once you replay the game it's kind of easy but still fun, but first time it's the right amount of difficulty. All of it while getting crazy op abilities

>>720519272
Bloodstained RoTN hard mode
Tevi Hard mode/possibly expert
Ender magnolia Hard mode
Those games make you a badass but its still difficult

Use your spells dumbass.

>>720519640
I honestly do not give a fuck about difficulty that much. SotN is probably the easiest out of all of them, Silksong is probably the hardest out of all of them, but both are still among my favorites.

>>720519640
Souls are overrated, theres a lot of filler shitters. Also the Sorrow games suffer from extremely simply boss design and terrible shops. Broken stats, no lv caps.
I said Portrait and Ecclesia for a reason

>>720519723
Yea the thing about Hollow Knight is that healing only fucks you over more in a lot of cases, but when you focus instead on not getting hit and using your spells you start melting enemies

>>720512123 (OP)
I just don't like the art style, that's my only issue. It looks so Disney I guess? I don't how to explain it

>>720512123 (OP)
>In this game every boss encounter feels like you are weak as fuck and any win you have feels like you got lucky
skill issue

>>720519156
Silksong also iterates on a lot of Hollow Knight bosses. Clockwork Dancers are Mantis Lords, but they're more organic (ironically); the Mantis Lords are a great fight, but they're so heavily scripted that they feel like an environmental hazard. Grand Mother Silk is similar to Radiance, but with improved presentation and a few extra attacks. And then there's all the fucking ghost bosses in Hollow Knight.

There's also more nuance to the mechanics of Silksong's combat, making even the simple bosses like Savage Beastfly fun to fight - although I miss Hollow Knight's charms.

>>720512123 (OP)
>the first ending
You're about halfway done

>>720516871
Whose asshole WHOSE
I'm ESL and even I cringe at your shitty ass grammar

On topic, if you don't feel powerful you haven't actually explored the map and found good charms/spells/upgraded spells
You remain a tiny little bug but through progression you start feeling like a god, via upgraded nail, movement, powerups, spells, or a combination of them

>>720520081
Worse, funkopop core

Am I gimping myself for never taking off the Wanderer Crest ever since I found it? I'm fairly deep into Act 2 now.

>>720516871
First and only, the zoomer classic

>>720519723
I love spamming the up soul attack but unless it's some flying fuck there's no way to take advantage of it.

>>720521334
No, Wanderer is the best basic bitch crest in the game, the only thing you're gimping is your creativity by experimenting with other crests, and your ability to cheese encounters with tools. Wanderer is a very good all-around crest that shits out needle damage with a minimal downside.

>>720517618
noob

>>720521334
No, it's probably the best one for awhile. Hunter, Architect, and Witch all become really strong too though.

>Need to waste a slot on the charms just to have a functional map
Masochist behaviour desu

>>720517618
whats wrong with you subhumans constantly shittalking HK? HK was very hard in endgame. Especially with the DLCs, it had the perfect difficulty. Everyone agrees, just you fags dont.

When you try to shit on HK, thats how we know Silksong must suck ass.

>>720521473
>>720521526
Suits me fine since I like basic. Thanks. I tried out Reaper for a bit because I like slow and big damage too but wasn't impressed.

>>720520584
Shut your bitch ass. Them anglos ain't gonna think you one of em Jeet.

>>720519272
Bloodstained is a really good one. But honestly the classics are so good. If you want a hard Castlevania of the Metroidvania style check Order of Ecclesia for the DS. It's punishing but you feel like a BADASS the more shit you get.

>>720519378
I beat the base game, I'm doing all the other shit.
>>720519091
Not my Pic. I defeated the Bad ending Boss. Doing all the other shit to get other endings.

>>720521595
Holy shit fucking this.

>>720512123 (OP)
not every game needs to have the same appeal
but i do feel like im powerful as fuck regardless so whatever

>>720520128
>Grand Mother Silk is similar to Radiance, but with improved presentation and a few extra attacks
you are crazy, shes not even 1/3 as interesting as the radiance

>>720520128
man i wish this crest was good compared to the others
but no blue slots practically kills all of its redeeming qualities

>>720522958
>post game shit is hard
no shit dumbass
god I hate zoomers

>>720523254
It's just confusing what they thought was so good about it that it deserved to have no blue slots. The damage and attack speed buffs from binding are good, but they're conditional unlike Wanderer's disgusting attack speed and the resultant damage. I honestly hope it's patched to have just ONE blue slot, because then I think it'd be fine.
It's also just annoying to use because binding causes your hit VFX to be blindingly bright. I already submitted a bug :^) report about it with a crude children's scribble to illustrate the point.

>>720522593
All crests have the same base damage, swing speed is the only thing that changes your dps.

>>720514714
>Since when is power important in a metroidvania? It's about exploration
hold that thought, you probably thought you were onto something but you failed to connect the dots there. Metroid games are about exploring to find powerups, to assist you in fighting enemies. Power is not Separate from Exploration, in metroidvanias.

>nail upgrades and spells
>not power ups

>>720525215
>Do more damage
>Still get 3 shotted by every enemy
>Still have to runback to every death
But now the dude dies in 20 hits instead of 30, amazing

>>720525414
unironically git gud

>>720525490
That's all you retarded niggers can regurgitate

>>720525624
the game is piss easy dunno what you want retard

>>720525215
>saw someone bitching about the conchflies in Blasted Steps not "giving a reward"
>one screen away from the NPC that rewards you with the charge attack
People are so fucking stupid it's unreal it's just a shame that charge attacks fucking suck in this game...

>>720517883
Oh lord, now thats just poor game design.

>>720512123 (OP)
Agreed. On top of that, playing just feels so boring... hardly any upgrades give cool moves or neat powers, it's all gimick shit, or plus 5 percent damage. Putting me to sleep here.

>>720525414
>still get 3 shotted by every enemy
you take 5 hits to die by default
you can go from 5 masks to 9 masks and massively amplify the power of your healing. you can get additional masks from health charms too if you want
but now you also have super powerful spells and various bonuses that make you much harder to kill and much easier to heal and damage with more moves
>>720525804
it depends on the crest
its great with architect and shaman. helped me a lot for the cursed ending too
the faster charge pin is good

>>720525215
Yeah bro let me find all those nail upgrades hidden around the map
>only 1 pale oil can be picked up that isn't tied to side quests
Oh

>>720517883
>>720518843
>>720525805
>yeah i increased my damage by like 30% but this one boss now has 10% more health. thats bad game design because i said so okay. it doesnt matter if theres no possible circumstance where i dont deal significantly more damage
people will whine and moan about anything they hear in theory instead of thinking of how it works in practice

>>720525935
the game only has 2 forms of normal damage upgrades, one of them gives outright 50% damage and the other increases your nail from 5 damage to 21 over the course of the game
you never played it
>>720526043
theres an ore you can simply pick up in crystal peak, one in ancient basin, one behind nosk, and one in the colosseum

>>720526048
>how it works in practice
My damage upgrade is shit
That's how it works in practice, retard

>>720512123 (OP)
This game and Silksong gives you all the tools you need to be stylish. It isn't going to make it easy so smooth brain retards like yourself can feel unearned accomplishment.
Not enough health? Stop getting hit and figure out where and when you can heal.
Not strong enough? Stop using all your focus on healing like a little bitch.
Not feeling enough variety? Swap out your charms.
Stop blaming the game when it's you who's coming up short.

>>720526119
>NOOO i deal 25% more damage against this one specific boss instead of 30% more damage, my damage upgrade sucks!!

>>720526180
>spells, you're only other form of offense, become less effective against bosses due to their damage not increasing with nail upgrades
>but you're stronger i swear

>>720526180
Yes retard
I want to kill the bosses
The runback is because of the bosses
I expect the damage upgrade to affect the bosses

>>720525490
Play a metroidvania that will let you have a boner and use it

>>720526125
Play your second metroidvania

I'm playing for the first time and this happened.
Was i not fast enough or does it happen no matter what. Also, i was shaking and could barely swallow my spit as the fight went on, especially with his wave attack where you have to shadow dash into it.

>>720526717
Unironically this

>Kill a boss after a few attempts with a nightmare runback
>Get nothing
thanks

>>720526790
Yeah once you rescue him he will always help you in this fight
Rescuing him after killing this boss will just make him show up in town, say that there are no real challenges around and leave the game.

>>720512895
>schmoovement
>hello /v/ I have never played a metroidvania with actually good movement
Silksong doesn't preserve or even have a system for momentum. It's incredibly gay. You press a button and go x speed. Use another move, and it sets your speed to x. Where's the expression, or the incentive to move with more skill?

Gay.

>>720527717
Some nigger found out you can wavedash
And by wavedash I mean your dash is slightly longer than normal

silksong is unironically much better, like going from a 7/10 to a 9

>>720528079
More like a 5/10 for HK to maybe a 7.

>>720528145
fair enough, i havent finished SS yet but its real good

>>720512123 (OP)
hollow knight has actual issues but power progression isn't one of them.
you get higher attack, more range and health. its basic and not creative but its there.

double jump and dash/airdash helps a shitload too. sadly the shinespark isn't an attack.
also your dash gets invincibility near the end.

>>720512123 (OP)
kek, thiserino
>Get pure nail
>Get the mask shards
>Get the fucking notches
>Get all the vessels (the mana thingy whatever)
>Fight some bullshit boss like mantis traitor lord
>You can't mess up the rhythm as he does not stop attacking and dashing (no time to heal)
>He has a bullshit 'walk-towards-you-randomly' secret mechanic that messes up your rhythm
>The background is also the same color as the boss' attacks and the boss itself so there is no visual clarity in the fight
>Die 69420.9/11 times

It does revolve around luck if you're not an autistic chinese speed runner. I remember beating the dung beetle boss and you get the charm where you leave damaging farts. I abused that charm so much so I wouldn't hit any of the bosses and would just come close to the bosses, hope they sniff my farts, and rely on the tick damage.

>>720518457
>mfw spent 4 hours trying to pass the colleseum final gauntlet and failed
This shit is just so painfully long, and with a team boss with weird attacks at the end as a cherry on top.

>>720512123 (OP)
>feels like you are weak as fuck
Upgrading doesn't even feel rewarding in this game, it's more like making nuisances be less annoying to deal with
>any win you have feels like you got luck
The bosses aren't challenging enough for that to be the case.
Flying enemies feel more dangerous than the bosses.

>>720515229
the power should come from your skill, not an upgrade that lets you faceroll enemies and bosses
aka git gud

>>720528224
If HK has good progression then no game has bad progression.
I cant name a single worse game at progression then HK except Soul Reaver

>>720526256
you deal 50% more damage against the boss and the boss has 5-10% more health. sounds like the boss was affected successfuly
>>720526239
they become slightly less effective in relation
but its impossible to deal less damage
your primary form of gaining soul is nail strikes. Even with a maximum charm build and Spell Twister, theres no boss in the game where nail upgrades can make you actually lose out on damage, because you will inevitably be dealing that damage to acquire soul unless you go out of your way to wait until Weaversong+Grubsong farms it all for you

stop being a retarded monkey for one second and think things through.

>>720528724
post scriptum
also this affects like 10% the bosses in the game lmao get a grip. this goes for none of the major bosses and dream fights

>>720528224
>you get higher attack, more range and health. its basic and not creative but its there.
Sure, but the enemies also have more attack and health. The void enemies in Act 3 of Silksong are the absolute worst of this; the same basic movesets for most enemies, but now they're le heckin spooky void boys, have a bajillion HP, always do two masks of damage, and every now and then do one of a handful of void attacks (projectile, tentacles, or saw blade). All so the Act 3 fetch quest can be drawn out and made even more annoying.

>>720512895
>schmoovement
You're pressing dash after you land that's not impressive at all.

This shit about moaning about health scaling is the absolute peak of not playing videogames and seeking reasons to be angry with them because of how they play on paper. The absolute /v/ special

You can pick the most extreme forced example possible and its a non-issue
>Xero has 200 HP if you have zero nail upgrades and 570 HP if you have all nail upgrades
>If you have all nail upgrades: 21x3 nail hits to get a spell for 63. Assuming you only have the lowest damage spell in the game with zero upgrades and no charms boosting it, and no multihit, you deal 78 damage (15~% the boss HP)
>If you have zero nail upgrades: 5x3 nail hits to get a spell and once again 15 from the spell, so you deal 30 damage (15~% the boss HP)
So the only way to feel like you havent gotten stronger is if you get all nail upgrades, get the dream warriors that have the highest health increase, and in the process dont acquire an enhanced spell, no charms to boost soul gain significantly and no charms to boost spells significantly. AND spend ZERO soul whatsoever on healing.

>>720512123 (OP)
>Is Silksong just as bad in this department
Its unironically worse. Neither the advanced movesets, skills nor the charms give you anything even remotely close to a good and well designed powerlevel

>>720512895
Okay and what is the practical use for this sperg "tech" besides potentially bumping into your enemy

>>720514714
The core mechanic of metroidvanias is gaining more power through exploration, retard.
"Metroidvania" doesn't just mean "non-linear platformer" like you brainless zoomers seem to think.

>>720529264
Health scaling is always bad no matter how you spin it.

>>720529264
What's the point of power upgrades if the enemies scale with them to minimise/trivialise said upgrades? You don't feel stronger if the basic bitch enemies you take 2-3 hits to kill at the start of the game still take 2 hits to kill when you are at max upgrades. Difficulty should scale with progress sure but inflating HP on everything just because you do more damage is fucking retarded. It also makes backtracking feel miserable because you expect enemies to be weaker in old areas but they are not.
Silksong also has a lot of stuff do 2 damage at base and in Act 3 things can do 3-4 damage, even the basic enemies when void infused can do 3 damage now.

>>720512123 (OP)
if you want to feel like God and curbstomp everything just play turn based slop unc

>>720526717
Play JRPGs. They should scratch that itch of overpowering the game by grinding you seem to want.

>>720529264
How about you make the game better next time instead of having a retarded Dark souls 3 soft cap system in your game with no gear or levels

>>720512123 (OP)
Works on my brain.

>>720530116
> the enemies scale with them to minimise/trivialise said upgrades?
they dont unless you practically fabricate a circumstance that makes it true
> You don't feel stronger if the basic bitch enemies you take 2-3 hits to kill at the start of the game still take 2 hits to kill when you are at max upgrades
in the lategame every basic enemy that took 4 shots now takes 1
theres only a single normal enemy that scales health in the entire game, going from 25 to 28
>inflating HP on everything just because you do more damage is fucking retarded.
It inflates the HP of 10% the bosses in the game

>silksong
thats a different matter, we were talking HK1. in silksong you have the void niggas
Back when i arrived at coral chambers it took me 20 seconds to kill the large tall guards at the top even with perfectly landed attacks and silk skills. During the end of act 2 it took me 10 seconds by just attacking. At the end of act 3 i took 10 seconds to kill them with my best attacks and 20 seconds to kill them by doing nothing except slashing
so once again literally what the fuck is the problem
>in act 3 things can do 3-4 damage, void infused enemies deal 3 damage
jesus have you tried actually playing the game? you are literally just talking out of your own imagination
The only attacks that deal 3 damage is Great Mother SIlk's grab and Lace 3's aoe slash if you get grabbed by it. Every other attack does 1-2 damage, all void enemies just do 2 damage

>>720517618
The main failure I see of most people struggling with this game is that they move around too spastically and panic trying to dodge and get hits in, like trying to turn everything into a damage race.
The game becomes considerably easier when you calm the fuck down, stand in one spot and wait for the enemy to move and then react accordingly, while eventually learning when its safe to get in a hit.
There is literally no penalty for not attacking the boss and just dodging for a while, there is no enrage timer or anything.
Just calm the fuck down nigga

>>720530191
See >>720519721
Its time to play your second game in this genre you know nothing about but claim to be an expert on

>Bile water requires long ass run back
>Even the hidden bench nearby is cancer to find/run back from
>Fight First Sinner
>Runback is you spawning at the door

They did that shit with bilewater on purpose, everything about that place screams blight town.

>>720512123 (OP)
.

>>720515229
You are an extremely sad person and I can say for certain I am better than you at every conceivable metric.

>>720529264
Does spell damage scale with nail upgrades too?

>>720530467
I thankfully cleared all of Bilewater on my first run through and didn't have to do any runbacks but I could tell that dying to the boss there would've been the worst fucking runback in the game.
>>720530337
The void shit enemies shoot can definitely do 3 damage, Karrmelita can combo you for 4 damage or my game is bugged, pretty sure Khan can also hit you for 3. I didn't even know Lace 3 could do 3, what made her hard was the sheer amount of bullshit spam in phase 3 and 4.

>>720515229
>not one reply actually engaged with anons well thought out argument
Why are git gud fags illiterate?

>>720512123 (OP)
>In this game every boss encounter feels like you are weak as fuck and any win you have feels like you got lucky
??????????????
Hollow knight is a piss easy game and only gets marginally difficult with DLC content. I hit a point in this game where I literally just ignored enemies or even face tanked the attacks because after spam hitting them I just heal to full anyway.
How far in did you get exactly?

>>720515229
Metroidvanias aren't obligated to let you faceroll endgame content by getting all the collectables. It's not the subgenre staple you think it is.
>>720530930
>Well thought out argument
>"the point of this types of games is to become strong enough that you can cheese every encounter if you use the right item or weapon"
Literally saying the point of Metroidvanias is to find the best way to not play them properly. lol.

>>720531520
>It's not the subgenre staple you think it is.
Cool, name some metroidvanias where you don't become a powerhouse by the endgame.
Surely you can find them

>>720530772
>Karrmelita can combo you for 4 damage or my game is bugged,
im pretty sure youre just not dodging out of her subsequent hits

>>720515229
Your argument is that a single player should be a power fantasy to be good? That's the entire point? Braindead take from someone who probably gets no fulfillment from their real life so they need an escapism teat to suckle on. Even going off of your argument. Is the power fantasy not all the more fulfilling when it's hard fought and earned, opposed to handed to you via progression on a silver platter? You're very clearly infantile if you can't see it that way.

>playing Hollow Knight for the first time
>got idk like 90% completion blind
I dunno how I was supposed to find some of the things I was missing to be honest, though a couple I think I should've found and felt foolish for missing.
I think I might like Nine Sols better, and I don't know how much of that is the areas having a visible completion percentage
thanks for reading my blog, love you homo

>>720514714
>Those are fucking braindead games difficulty wise
That's the point. They're meant to be comfy games to unwind with, not high stress games to test your reflexes. Like, in an optimal scenario the game supports both. You can play on easy mode and have a nice fun time, or you can do a challenge run with limited resources, but at the very least the game should support the easy mode. HK just feels like they only made the challenge mode part.

>>720512123 (OP)
this game takes more after I Wanna Be the Guy

PAIN is the point

>>720532737
>Nine Sols
I think some of the Nine Sols bosses are more infuriating than some of the HK/SS bosses, but it's hard to beat the satisfaction of nailing the encounter in Nine Sols. The final boss alone is an absolute masterpiece.

In hindsight, Lady Ethereal is an oddly Hollow Knight esque boss, but I like it more than the average HK/SS boss for being just a bit snappier.

>>720531520
>It's not the subgenre staple you think it is.
It's what the good ones do

>>720512123 (OP)
>any win you have feels like you got lucky.
Nigga what? I get that you can't just grind a bunch and faceroll everything with a level 80 Alucard or whatever but it ain't that hard.
Also, with the DLC, you can turn the game into piss baby ez mode thanks to making the OP charms unbreakable.

>>720512123 (OP)
>Metroidvania
You mean Hollowvania.

>>720526114
>the game only has 2 forms of normal damage upgrades
Hence the boringness...

>>720514154
lel, this is like a parody of what a platformer is, if you have infinite walljumps why not just give the player the ability to fly?

>>720514714
>having good challenging combat is the icing on the cake
it's more like the turd on the cake that makes the whole thing inedible
Dark Souls bosses where you have to memorize i-frame dodge timing is NOT what the metroidvania genre was missing

>>720535467
Have you ever played Mega Man X?