Thread 721095537

Unless you played them as a kid, most retro >games aren’t actually fun to play.
>They’re clunky and full of odd quirks.
>Most 7/10 modern indie games are more enjoyable than they are.

>>721095537 (OP)
Virtual barbie collectors are not games.

>>721095537 (OP)
that's just your opinion friend, not a hard to swallow pill
i had more fun recently playing the megaman legends series and mario the lost levels than any indie game in the last 5 years

>>721095537 (OP)
hard to swallow pills about video games
>your perfect game will never be made
>no eroge will ever get enough funding
>you cannot make a good game in anything but a start-up environment (i.e. new corp or indie)
>large expensive games will only be as good as the interests of the people playing them
>the popular mascot platformer is dead
>you cannot achieve enlightenment through making games

>>721095537 (OP)
They're a waste of time because inevitably your hobby and niche franchise will go mainstream and get raped to death by the lowest common denominator AKA retards who need the game completely changed so they can enjoy and buy them

You shouldn't make a video game if your idea doesn't work well as a mod.

>>721095537 (OP)
If the only way a game director knows how to tell a story is through cutscenes and exposition, they shouldn't be making a story driven game. Failing to utilize the medium is a failure of the medium, and movie games are disjointed dogshit

A game can be conventionally weak in the mechanics department and still be good, provided that there is proper context and justification for said mechanics. Survival horror as a genre is pretty much one long case study of this.

>>721095537 (OP)
Consoles in the 2000s were already deliberately retro, because they were trying and failing to make late 90s PC games work on deliberately old-fashioned controllers. Any console that even now insists on its own dedicated do-everything-poorly, jack-of-no-trades controllers is more retro than an indie pixel platformer or low poly game.
>>721095958
A lot of popular vidya for the past 30 years can best be described as something that worked well as a mod.
>>721096113
Movie games fail to use any aspect of film making in their gameplay and any aspect of games in their story, exposition and narrative, so it would be fair to deny them the dual appellation of movie and game.

>Be zoomer
>Try out some retro game that's hailed as a classic
>It's great and worthy of all the praise
>Talk about it online
>Some cynical basedllenial tells me it's actually bad and I only like it because of nostalgia

There is straight up no such thing as bad game design. There is only "did the game achieve what it's trying to do?" and "do I personally enjoy what the game is?"

People saying shit like "Oh a boss having a walkback is Bad Game Design" when you have entire genres now based upon losing literal mountains of progress off of a single mistake is just asinine

>>721099628
right before the cynical millenial insists to you without a hint of irony that BF4 was the best game of the generation

>>721095537 (OP)
bump

>>721095537 (OP)
Nah. Just nah.
This is just cope you're using to justify your abhorrent tase in games.

>>721095537 (OP)
Let me guess a zoomie tried a NES Castlevania game and in his ultimate wisdom concluded every single retro game is the same kind of garbage?

>>721099982
If the core design of the game is punishment then people won't complain the punishment
If the core design of the game is difficultly, then yes, people will complain about unnecessary punishment
Sadly modern gamers conflate more and more hard = good and punishment = hard

>>721095537 (OP)
>"retro" doesn't mean old
>it means something modern imitating old things
>Undertale is retro
>Super Mario Bros. isn't retro

>>721099982
>There is straight up no such thing as bad game design.
This statement is the equivalent of claiming that there is no such thing as good art.

>There is only "did the game achieve what it's trying to do?" and "do I personally enjoy what the game is?"
This literally is game design criticism in a nutshell.

Evaluate the subjective merit of the artistic vision and then evaluate the objective merit of the designer's execution of said vision.

Assuming that a game's vision is executed perfectly, one can still argue to the value of the vision itself based upon its subjective value in the eyes of humanity because humans are the only ones who benefit from the creation of art. If the vision is offensive to all of humanity, it is of no value, and if a vision benefits all of humanity, it is of the highest value. Beyond that, additional value can be attributed to the significance of the benefit in question.

This is why games like Hatred can easily be panned. Even if a small number of individuals enjoy going on an unhinged mass murder fantasy, it's hard to argue that the game is beneficial to society in the grand scheme of things. No amount of executional quality will save it from being a bad game.

>>721095537 (OP)
I have been playing a lot of 90s retro games for the first time lately and enjoyed them more than modern slop

>>721095537 (OP)
This only applies to gen 5, the PS1 gen. Early 3D games kinda sucked balls but by the PS2 era you had a lot of bangers. gen 3-4 were great and are still fun to play. gens 1-2 nobody ever mentions so doesn't matter

>>721099982
>heh every bad game is hecking valid because developer WANTED to make their games unfun actually
Asinine argument. But then maybe you wanted to make an asinine argument so who am I to criticize it, right?

>>721103241
You're like one of those people correcting people on their use of Frankenstein. We all agreed to call old games retro, it happened like 30 years ago, get over it.

>>721095537 (OP)
Nostalgia isn't a bad reason to like a game. So long as you're able to understand that people born past the time it was popular might not share or understand your love for it.

mega man x is better than silksong
super metroid is better than hollow knight

those games are only highly regarded because zoomer don't have any frame of reference, they prefer actual mobile tier slop over well crafted games made with passion.

>>721105806
>We
You need to go back.
>>721105950
If nostalgia is all you have, it is. I liked the Teenage Mutant Ninja (or Hero if you're a terrorist) Turtles cartoon in the 80s. I don't still like it because it's a bad cartoon and kid me had terrible taste. Propping it up with "well, I liked it when I was a kid" is dishonest.

>>721106110
>>721105950
that's understandable for dogshit games but most retro games > modern trash and it's not even remotely close

>>721095537 (OP)
most of them are, but the ones I like are good

>>721106375
Sturgeon's Law still applies. The pool was just much smaller back then.
>50 games get released in a year
>finding the 5 good games is easy, especially with a bunch of magazines that aren't pushing an agenda
>50000 games get released in a year
>finding the 5000 is incredibly difficult due to the huge amount of trash you have to sift through, and agenda-driven "journalists" who want to push the box checking game for great social justice

Will never have a proper RTC 3/2 like theme park making game with cutting edge tech that will allow you to make animatronics, sound and visual effects, and tinker and toy with park Ai and make buildings and areas of recreation and much more freedom. Everyone at Frontier games should be executed for making such a shitty sequel to planet coaster

>>721105497
Any 5th gen game where the player was expected to "do alot" was mad shit. JRPGs were good, you just move and turn based battle. Star Fox 64 and Ridge Racer Type 4 are super good, you just pilot and drive. Controls are great. Resident Evil and Silent Hill Parasite Eve all those horror games you were just "walking around".

But anything with action combat was unplayable even back then.

>>721095537 (OP)
>Unless you played them as a kid, most retro games aren’t actually fun to play.
As a huge 2D gaming fan, that isn't a hard pill to swallow. I've pretty much said it anytime someone tries to jerk off ye old games to tear down new ones, 90% of games are pure shit. Most of the great games people talk about and remember are in that 10%. With how many games were made back then, that still leaves several hundred quality titles across a bunch of platforms.
>Most 7/10 modern indie games are more enjoyable than they are.
Indies are self published and don't need to be shipped to stores so the percentage of trash to gold is much higher. If you stick to the well reviewed games or can sort through the trash, then yes those games are about as good as anything in the past
Currently I am playing Silksong and looking forward to that new He-Man Beat em Up. With all the old games free to play via emulation and new games coming out every month, it is a good time to be a 2D enjoyer.