Thread 723235515

VPN off, Thrall

be honest you would take frostmourne over that used up roasty

>>723236604
With frostmourne you can have elven bitches who can't say no (unless some faggot messes with your glacier)

>>723235591
kek

>>723236604
Arthas canonically came on Frostmourne

>actually explain the situation
>hear out and address Terenas/Arthas' concerns
>be willing to provide evidence of claims
>crisis completely averted
Medivh hated humanity and wanted them to die.

>>723235515 (OP)
I LIKE MY PUSS COLD, MEDIVH.
TURNS OUT THAT SLUT ISN'T REALLY CRYSTAL MAIDEN, SO I GOTTA GET DEAD POON TO HAVE MY ICY FIX

>>723235515 (OP)
Why would Jaina do such a thing?

>>723238041
>Medivh is retarded
I mean.

Yes.
Yes he is.

>>723238041
If you aren't cryptic and unhelpful you lose your wizard license

>>723235515 (OP)
When you grow up you realize humans were always the bad guys

>>723238353
Every racist character in Warcraft ended up being 100% vindicated:
>Scarlet Crusade were right about the Forsaken being no better than the Scourge
>Garrosh was right about the Forsaken being no better than the Scourge
>Garithos was right to distrust elves (high elves siding with the Alliance; Kael'thas siding with the Legion)
>Fandral Staghelm was right that trusting non-night elf races would lead to their downfall (Burning of Teldrassil)
>Daelin Proudmoore was right that the orcs couldn't be trusted (Destruction of Theramore)

>>723235515 (OP)
Kino! Off to kill villagers now.

>>723238564
>all the evils in the world happened because soft hippy cow people looked at the Forsaken and went "Oh no! Let's help them!"
Is the fault on the Tauren for being naive, on the rest of the Horde for nobody saying "No that's retarded" or on the Forsaken for being twisted psychopaths at every chance they get?

>play w3c direct strike 3v3
>teammate doesn't build at all for 12 minutes
>ask opponents to draw as he is clearly intentionally sabotaging the game
>they refuse to draw
>can't forfeit because the third player is intentionally keeping the game going
>myself and the other active teammate sell all our towers to end the match as quickly as possible as the entire thing is a waste of our time
>report the match
>redditesque moderator
>WELLL ACTUALLY YOU CAN NEVER SELL YOUR TOWERS LIKE THAT SO YOU GET A WARNING
>your opponents didn't have to draw even though being afk requires it as part of the rules because I know he wasnt afk even though they didn't at the time
>don't do this again
Why are all mods absolute fucking retards?

>>723238564
The ultimate mind shattering truth nuke is that the people at fault are the ones pushing red vs blue.
aka the Loretards, lore is just a flimsy excuse to have cool fights

>>723238920
>wc3
Fault

>>723238927
The real problem is trying to create "factions" from multiple cultural groups. There is no reason for the forsaken to work with the orcs, let alone the sin'dori or the tauren.

>>723235515 (OP)
>Arthas, forget about the forces of Death. The Burning Legion is coming, and when they come the Light will follow. But the Light is also kind of the Void. The Light and not the Void will start a war with the Burning Legion. Eventually an Arcane Titan will die and go to the realm of the dead in the Shadowlands, which is different from the forces of Death that you should ignore. This was all the Jailer's plan. If that fails, the Void that is also kind of the Light will make its final move on Azeroth. You have to focus on the Burning Legion.

>>723238158
she did it out of spite after seeing your autism

>>723236604
Nigga you wouldn’t even be you anymore. He could’ve let her get used up and had any bitch in the kingdom. If I was some random peasant or a nobody knight that’s never gonna be anything but a wagie? I’m taking frostmourne.

>>723238353
Trve, my brown brother

>>723239091
The schizophrenically retarded stuff happens in all the games, the lore follows Warhammer rules aka "we are all retarded so we can fight each other"

>>723239104
I love John Lore.

>click control group
>Doesn't focus on it
>Double click bind
>Nothing
>Quickly triple click
>Focuses on it sometimes
Huh???

>>723238564
>>Garithos was right to distrust elves (high elves siding with the Alliance; Kael'thas siding with the Legion)
In fairness it's unlikely Kael would have turned traitor if Garithos hadn't pushed him into it. I mean Garithos trusted and sided with an undead elf, we in the racist community don't claim him

The Nelves should've kicked everyone off the continent.

>>723236604
Scarlet Crusade for life. Fuck the undead. Justice for Sally Whitemane.

>>723239429
Have the nelves ever won a single battle?

Dis do be troll land, das rite box nood

>>723239104
>so what you're saying is... the city must be purged?

>>723239718
Yes.

>>723238041
What do you MEAN it isn't convincing to just barge into someone's throneroom and ramble about the endtimes?

Oh yeah... Jaina killed her father for some orcs. Then those orcs nuked her city and killed her night elf lesbian lover.

lol

>>723238564
>Scarlet Crusade were right about the Forsaken being no better than the Scourge
Was Scourge ever established to be any better? Its not like Sylvanas took over with gentle conversation. She mind controlled half the continent and used her new slaves to kill the other half.

>>723239829
>me own daughter a fookin muffdiver

>>723239376
>Dude, just trust those elves who closed the gates on humans while the Scourge was raping them.

>>723235515 (OP)
He didn't say that, but he should've

>>723239104
>Arthas, the true path of a Paladin and the only way you can save your people is to simply believe in goodness and light really hard. Find yourself a brown lesbian paladin with an ugly hairdo, hold her by the hands and just Believe. In fact Arthas its better if you convince your father to just give the throne for her, she's the future of this land.

>>723238123
Lich king flow

Garithos was right
Daelin was right
Arthas was right

women and moralfaggots(Uther and Thrall) are all wrong

>>723239091
>The real problem is trying to create "factions" from multiple cultural groups. There is no reason for the Holy Roman Empire to work with the French, let alone the Italians or the Sicilians.

>>723239894
It's because wow horde is "meant as Le baddies".
Except
>Thralls horde is the sissiest shit ever
>Darkspear aren't that cannibalistic/voodoo-esque
>Fuckin tauren
Then you have OG horde behaving undead.
Undead would all with Doomhammer's horde, then betray him, but it makes zero coherent sense otherwise.
Issue is that thrall's horse, once more, isn't the OG horde.

>>723239104
>No Arthas! The Shadowlands are all fake! The real death is when you die after you die. Then you go to the after after life.

>>723239894
The Forsaken actively hunted down and killed other undead humans who wanted to reconcile relationships with their living relatives. Sylvanas was always a massive fucking bitch.

can brown skinned 4chan talk about anything but cuck shit

If you had to swap one Alliance faction and one Horde faction, which would you pick?

>>723240317
I'd remove factions.
That said, if I had to I'd move humans to the horde and orcs to the alliance.
Why? Funny. Really. Funny.

>>723239894
She's been redeemed, not her fault

>>723240317
This but WC3.
Exchange one race from HU with one from ORC for maximum chaos.
I'd switch dwarves with trolls, no healing for you Zug Zug man :^}

>>723235515 (OP)
Why did Medivh look like Monke?

>>723240593
You'd look like that too after getting punched in the face by both Lothar and Garona.

>mfw I just found out they censored Garrosh calling Sylvanas a bitch
What the fuck happened to WoW? I stopped playing in MoP.

>>723241120
You think that's bad, anon, we can't even /spit on people anymore.

>>723238041
He had autism

>>723241120
Jews took over.

>>723241238
cant even /fart on other too

>>723240208
The issue is Thrall is supposed to be very wise from the character's perspective but also a colossal retard from an objective perspective.
He let the Forsaken into the Horde despite them openly plotting to poison and zombify everyone from the first quests in Brill. Then they actually move from open plotting to active attack at the Wrathgate, but it doesn't count because... that faction wasn't supposed to use the WMD yet. Naturally nothing happens to Sylvanas after this.
Her right hand man was an actual demon (part of the Jailer's plan), who is part of the force that enslaved Thrall's species. Orcs have to live underground if they still communicate with demons. But this was no cause for alarm either.
In fact, she faces no consequences at all until the Blizzard designated villain Garrosh sees what she is up to and finally, FINALLY she actually gets push back from a Horde leader.
Then of course Garrosh is the traitor against everything the Horde ever stood for.

Could Lordaeronians have gone to Stormwind to escape the scourge?

>>723240317
Worgen for Nightborne
We don't need two magic addict elves on the Horde

>>723237807
where's the fun if they can't say no

>>723241574
Yes? Refugees from Lordaeron made their way to Stormwind after the Third War, just as refugees from Stormwind made their way to Lordaeron after the First.

>>723239104
Shadowlands really broke the entire warcraft lore, right? Can't we just stop after legion, or better yet, tbc? Wotlk is shit because of the we must always have a lich king shit

>>723238927
Battle for Azeroth was hindered greatly by the writers and story. People say that red vs. blue is bad and tired but it's just the ineptitude of Blizzard.
They could have easily come up with a compelling story that was actually morally gray with arguments for both sides instead of SYLVANAS BAD and Horde the baddies again.

>in book before some Forsaken are contacting Alliance relatives
>Sylvanas is letting them and is even fine if some defect
>arranges a meeting in Arathi so Fosaken and Alliance civilians can have a picnic together
>Sylvanas finds out Calia Menethil is alive and involved and will be at the meeting
>takes opportunity to kill her and kills all Forsaken witnesses so her power is not threatened
>Anduin and Alliance sad and mad but can't do anything

End of book and then some other writers took it in another direction besides having Calia risen and waiting on the sidelines. If they just continued that line of story they could have more Forsaken trying to defect and Sylvanas stopping and killing them. This makes Anduin intervene and try to save them.The Forsaken and Horde argue that they have a right to kill traitors and the Alliance is in the wrong. This progresses into the Battle for Lordaeron and the Alliance trying to save Forsaken defectors while Horde defending their land. The Horde then attack the Night Elves in retaliation. The Alliance is bogged down in the Eastern Kingdoms and can't help. The Night Elves can now blame the humans and Alliance for escalation and getting their tree burned. Both sides are justified in their war efforts and hard feelings.

INSTEAD
>Saurfang suggests killing Night Elves for no reason
>Sylvanas says that's a great idea and they will take Darnassus
>night elves will then all leave and fighting end(?)
>the Alliance can not defend their Night Elf allies because...
>IT'S TOO FAR AWAY! wait what are teleports and literal space ships???
>Sylvanas then burns tree because feelings hurt
>now Alliance STUPID HORDE BAD

>>723241865
It fucked with the metaphysics that had been canon up until then, and tried to turn every bad guy up until that point into part of a greater plot by the latest Mega-Satan, who naturally was manipulating things to prevent a worse evil. So yeah, it made the setting demonstrably worse for no real gain.

Kinky

>>723241930
Sylvanas has always been bad, anon, just like every other Forsaken who was raised via Frostmourn since apparently it animates people using the evil half of their souls, meaning that there's a significant chunk of the Forsaken who are completely and objectively evil.

>>723241574
Some did. Medivh just wanted everyone in Kalimdor so they could be meat shields between Archimonde and Nordrassil.
The real question is why didn't the Cult of the Damned infiltrate Stormwind before kicking off the boogaloo.

>>723241426
uhhhh I thought kink-shaming was frowned upon??

>>723242129
>Scarabs
>Rod of necromancy
>Rush expo
I love this fat cockroach.

>>723242274
Wasn't Stormwind just some shitty litwho city that was rocketed to their position because everyone else is dead, a Worgen or pouting in isolation?

>>723236604
Arthas and Jaina were literally childhood sweethearts who lost their virginity to each other (not even kidding it's in the Arthas book). Bro fucked up.

>Sylvanas got redeemed and is still around
>Garrosh died and is gone forever
No female antagonist past vanilla has gone punished or died in WoW and never will.

>>723241865
>Shadowlands really broke the entire warcraft lore, right? Can't we just stop after legion, or better yet, tbc? Wotlk is shit because of the we must always have a lich king shit
It had been broken real bad since WotLK and the increasing desire to focus on ancient history/celestial forces, but Shadowlands was the point of no return definitely. Not only for the lore destruction, but also just zooming out seeing how bug souled the writing is. It would be like if at the end of the Lord of the Rings where Frodo is going to the Gray Havens, instead of him seeing the curtains lift on a paradise, he is reincarnated as a lava slug because he was close to lava in life.
TBC had some utterly retarded plot developments, but it still preferred to stick with smaller side stories. So the damage was limited.

>>723242569
It's a bit more complicated. The Kingdom of Stormwind was originally the greatest power in the Eastern Kingdoms, but it was razed to the ground when the Horde first invaded. However, that galvanized the other kingdoms into forming the Alliance, which was headed by the Kingdom of Lordaeron, and they were able to liberate Stormwind in the Second War. Afterwards, Gilneas and Stromgarde left the Alliance due to disagreements with Menethil's postwar policies, and Stormwind was rebuilt and resettled by its refugees. So by the time of the Third War, Lordaeron was still top dog, but Stormwind was coming back.

>>723242695
Isn't she supposed to search Super Hell for every last soul that was lost there, which will probably take her millennia?

>>723243115
She's coming back in Midnight so who knows.

>>723242569
No, Stormwind was rebuilt after the second war with Vanilla WoW's lore additions. There is only a four year gap between WC3 and WoW. Stormwind was still considerably powerful by the time of WC3.

>>723241463
as soon as thrall went from a dude who /yelled occasionally in org to a (((character))) he became a lame dindu cuck

>>723243115
She's a stronk kween dude,she already found all the souls and stuff. And she said she's sorry on top of it.

>>723243226
Stormwind was literally forgotten in WC3

I want to serve her so bad.

>>723243845
Stormwind was destroyed in WC1. Blizzard only brought it back for WoW.

>>723240317
Night Elves for High Elves
Forsaken for Ogres

Also hot take but the Horde should have never officially gotten goblins.

>>723244069
>People are upset she's going around forcing swordpoint conversions to the Light
>On a race that has backslid into fel use and demon worship literally every chance it's gotten
Hard to blame her, really.

>>723243845
It was literally meant to be destroyed and they changed it later. The WC2 manual even says Stormwind is the domain of the Stormreaver Orc Clan. The Alliance raises a castle over the ruins of Stormwind in a mission, but you destroy that as the Orcs again. That is the last we ever see of it until WoW.
It was definitely a lore change, but it was not the worst lore change. It makes sense that after orcs were all put in camps, there would be a rebuilding effort.

>>723236604
>men will see this and just think "Hell Yeah"

>>723245112
It's more that they're doing a corruption plot line for the one-hundredth time.

>>723245705
Chad Garrosh just shrugged off the corruption storyline. "Yeah, I bathed in Old God heartblood and took Y'Shaarj's power. I was in control the whole time. And I would do it again."

>>723246117
that’s bullshit they tweeted because everyone was laughing at le corrupted garrosh

>>723237807
but there's an orc living rent free inside you now. You'd be no different than Jaina.

>>723235515 (OP)
Why did Blizzard make all the humans incredibly incompetent in WC3 while wanking off Orcs who were natural murder rapists while humans were god fearing Christians that ultimately get their kingdom genocided?

>>723244069
punish her by remind her that goats are amazing dairy farm animals.

>>723238041
well, yes, unironically
he was made for that entire purpose

>>723241865
The shadowlands is being retconned in the newest wow patch, i kid you not. It's now an artificial death realm made by the titans so we haven't even gone to the real afterlives and now we're back to the titans being the strongest beings.

>>723246674
Typical "civilized white man bad", "primitive cannibal murder rapist" good narrative as usual

>>723244069
Any good BC servers? I'm pretty much done with TurtleWoW and wouldn't mind rolling up a cow.

>>723245112
This is real ironic coming from the Draenei, who are supposed to be a minority of a race that became demons.

>>723246674
Face it. "Humans" are the pol chuds white crackers of the Warcraft universe. All loser with visuons of gradure but massive failures in reality.

>>723246956
>>723247137
Sounds based. Kill all whites.

>>723246674
>>723246956
The whole orc plot is Thrall going "man, being cannibal murder rapists really didn't work out for us, let's not do that", and Grommash going "CANNIBAL MURDER RAPE FOREVER, YOLO" until Mannoroth shows up and says "guess what, fuckboy, I own you". At which point, Thrall helps Grommash detox, Grommash dies killing Mannoroth, and Thrall starts carrying a rose-tinted perception of Grom that he projects onto Grom's dipshit son years later.

>>723246939
>the story was so fucking horrible that Blizzard entirely retconned it and its events were pointless
I still wonder how the fuck WoW is alive at this point

>>723238041
yes actually, but I can't remember how or why. I just remember the demons coming was his doing all along, even manipulating the orks unto earth ... not sure about the undead

>>723236604
>everyone is loyal to you
>lich bros
>nerubian bros
>banshee hoes
Jaina can go fuck herself with a water elemental. Then you get to become king eventually. Even if you end up 50% Orcy in mind, at least you get sick shredding skills.

>>723247107
Not really. The draenei know from personal experience that fel use turned their race into monsters, a fact that orcs have vindicated at every opportunity.

>>723247325
Blizzdrone battered wife mentality.

>>723247107
the space kike lore was always bad and confused

>>723246939
Source?

>>723247273
It truly was a Rain of Chaos.

>>723245306
I really wish we could've gotten a Rebuilding of Stormwind campaign in WC3 to mirror the Founding of Durotar. It would've set the stage right for WoW. I still remember seeing the first pics of Stormwind and wondering wtf it was, all I knew and was invested in as HUM was Lordaeron, and like everyone else never played WC1. Felt cucked, man

>>723246939
the champion bumped his head at the end of bfa and it was all a dream

>>723242878
Another problem is Blizzard had a weird focus on Evolution. It's very important that we the players see the whole evolutionary tree of each race all the way back to the first rock.
It's a inherently demystifying way of looking at things.
If Blizzard hadn't been scared off of Cosmic Forces, I bet we would have seen how they evolved.

>>723247818
that’s also what starcraft is entirely about, terrans corrupted into zerg, protoss race mixing with zerg, primal zerg corrupted into zerg, it’s all just corruption and prequel to corruption

>>723248030
post tbc blizz writing doesn't matter

>>723248030
Look, mEtzen has two fetishes race mixing and corruption

>>723246674
Stormwind humans have always been the competent ones, all the other kingdoms are jobbers.

>>723240317
I'd split off Blood Elves and Draenei into their own faction alongside the Naga and Felguard.

>>723248223
he’s a jew after all, doesn’t diablo have angel race mixing too

>>723239557
They won the War of the Ancients, but to be fair, it only started because their Queen sent nudes to the Burning Legion.

>>723240317
Nelves and Tauren as a faction.

>>723248523
>he’s a jew after all, doesn’t diablo have angel race mixing too
Yes, humans are demon-angel muttbabies. And then they are corrupted by angels and demons. Hmmm.

>>723240317
humans and orcs :^)

>>723248523
Sanctuary was created by an angel/demon couple who had both gotten sick of the Eternal Conflict. They gave birth to the nephalem, who in turn gave birth to humanity.

>>723235515 (OP)
>Scarlet Crusade is the only based and strongest faction that could've rexlaimed Lordaeron

They did everything to murder it as much as possible lmao

>>723248684
Humans without paladin or archmage would be so fucking ass

>>723239829
Still funny how they were selling BfA as Jaina having enough and finally agreeing with her father but then she goes back to Horde lover like two patches later.

>>723247273
Why did Thrall have such a boner for Grom anyways? Grom was kind of a jackass.

>>723248986
Should have nuked a few more cities for sure. Her stupid mother slowed down the genocide inadvertently.

>>723248986
Well, the animatic they pushed that angle with was all about how her guilt for her choices and lingering doubts affect her, so there's strong implication that she can go either way. Meanwhile, Sylvanas burned down Teldrassil because she was offended by something one nelf said to her.

>>723249064
He was a good friend.

>>723249245
Sylvanas burned down the tree because muh jailer plan, the nelf had nothing to do with it.

>>723248986
>NOOOOOO, you can't just bomb the Alliance invasion point. Theramore's neutral!

>>723248986
>Sylvannas:"We have to stop genociding ppl n shiet, we must be better orcs"
>Jaina:"We have to stop genociding ppl n shiet, we must be better humans"

>vaporizes half of Azeroth's population

What did they mean by this?

>>723235515 (OP)
The overall plot and lore of Warcraft is so laughably bad that I still find it amusing that people are so emotionally attached to it. It's one of those fictional worlds where the more you think about it, the stupider it gets so it's best not to think about it at all.

>>723249404
The nelf saying that was part of Jay Lore's plan.

What even was Vanilla WoW's plot?

>>723249560
A bunch of different threats popping up in the world (of warcraft)

>>723240146
Blizzard is too bitchmade to swap factions (Belfs play with alliance this expansion) and simulate true complexity of shifting alliances

>>723249560
You are an adventurer and you go around the world taking odd jobs for cash.

>>723249468
best not to play it at all, i tried the legion remix and all the dragons sound like homos, the main dragon npc is a lame cunt voiced by that cunt grandma va that voices every faction leader for the past 5 years, there is nothing cool in this game anymore

>>723243115
That was just a convenient bus to put her on. They can bring her back by just making a threat that's more important than saving some worthless souls that will still be there tomorrow.

>>723249560
Just post-apocalyptic societies doing what they can to survive

>>723249064
Grom was the orc who actually taught Thrall what life was like before the Shadow Council and helped him discover his roots. Essentially, a mentor figure whom Thrall respected - but that respect strained as Grom grew more and more strung out from withdrawal over the years, capstoned with Grom falling off the wagon hard before dying to protect Thrall.

>>723249560
Unlike the expansions where there's always a main bad to beat, vanilla had multiple that were build up all over the world. Like you start hearing about the bugs from ahn qiraj in the barrens at lvl 18 and it culminates into a big ass raid way later.

>>723249685
Did you know more time has passed in the real world than has passed in WoW? Azeroth faces multiple existence-ending threats every year, it's ridiculous.

>>723243115
>>723243168
>>723243259
>>723249903
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cb_YaY9fraY
She's still in super hell and she's not coming back, we just go see her with her nephew.

>>723250623
The events of WC1->TWW are also like, under 40 years.
Orcs also die at like 40? Or so of old age.
It's actually absurd.

>>723242367
I play this strategy solely for over a decade, you can just run into their city and kill their goldworkers and block the entrance to their own city, then outproduce them slowly

>>723250730
No, Orcs just live slightly less long than Humans. Grom is 46 in Warcraft III according to the manual, and he is by no means an elder Orc.

There aren't any inhumans in this thread, right?

>>723249560
Sloppy seconds and thirds of the RTS games

>>723250949
I am slowly learning ladder WC3 and I need to learn how to do this one.

>>723242646
Most people won't acknowledge your factual post but I will. Arthas had a 10/10 cutie and instead went full retard. I loved the cougar of Theramore jokes back in the day with her grooming Anduin.

>>723251063
buy a skull from your shop, its 50 gold but quadruples Cryptlords naturally high health regeneration so he can tank much longer. He's gonna become your favorite hero too after a few such games

>>723251253
I'm already doing "ok" (badly) with my micro as cryptlord+fiend->fast tech.
I just shit the bed with the initial gathering and I am not gathering all my shit b4 5s

>>723239829
>and killed her night elf lesbian lover.
I must have missed this lore.

>>723239829
To be fair, that was after her father launched a coup and imprisoned her.

>>723251016
Negative, I am a meat popsicle.

>>723247273
>Garrosh thinks he’s a monster because he’s Grom’s son
>Thrall tells him that no, Grom ultimately had the heart of a hero and redeemed himself
>Garrosh realises his lineage isn’t tainted and he isn’t doomed to a life of violence
>promptly adopts all Grom’s worst traits and pushes the horde to be more warlike
What the FUCK were they thinking?’

>>723251950
Garrosh was sad because his father sold out his entire race to the demons not because he was warlike. Even after he went full orc hitler he was still antidemon and killed all the warlocks in Orgrimmar.

>>723252421
Garrosh wasn't very smart.
Also thrall kept sucking his dick by proxy.

>>723251950
>try to assassinate garrosh’s character
>accidentally write a verisimilar warcraft character instead of a nuwow feminist pacifist for once
>accidentally make everyone around him like voljin and thrall look like traitorous cuck idiots in the process

>>723251950
Like I said, anon, rose-tinted perception. Thrall remembered Grom mainly as a teacher and the guy who gave his life to destroy Mannoroth, not the violent dipshit that turned a simple construction project into a diplomatic incident, a case of deicide, and a drug trip gone bad all in one.

>>723251950
Blizzard doesn't plan writing even one questline ahead. They have content they want to put out and the writing morphs to fit that. Same reason Illidan didn't just negotiate with the Horde and the Alliance in TBC.
He never invaded Azeroth in the expansion. The Legion did. He had literally no reason to fight them and every reason to work with one of them if they were willing.
He needed to be the bad guy for a raid, though.

>>723252757
TBC was Illidan letting his asshole edgelord tendencies run away with him until they finally got him killed. They'd been there since the War of the Ancients, he leaned too hard into them, and he learned all too quickly that he wasn't nearly as hard as he thought he was.

>>723251428
There was a Night Elf warrior that was Jaina's bodyguard in Theramore. Her name was Pained and it was supposedly a nickname because she was scarred and mentally ill. She was assigned the duty by Tyrande but refused to leave after the Battle for Hyjal since she loves blondes with big tits.
Jaina later got a bubbly gnome apprentice named Kinndy Sparkshine. She was short and childish even for a gnome (no I am not making that part up). Jaina loved her little gnome loli more than her NE lesbian. After a while Pained gets mad about it but Kinndy is so loveable that she seduced Pained. Together they all had lots of fun and threesomes.
Until the Horde blew them up with a manabomb.After that Jaina touched Pained who crumbled into shards and Kinndy turned into dust before her eyes. Jaina did not care too much that Pained died but she was haunted by nightmares of her gnome loli for years after.

>>723253032
I mean, he got ganked by 27 heros. Bit unfair to him

>>723253152
He took on 27 heroes. The fact he still thought he could solo just proves how far up his own ass he was.

>>723252597
>accidentally make everyone around him like voljin and thrall look like traitorous cuck idiots in the process
Don't forget Baine Buckbrokenhoof, who warned Jaina of the attack on Theramore.
They should have turned him into a cowhide rug for that one.

Has Medivh ever not been a useless retard working against humanity?

>>723249560
The great thing about Vanilla was the lack of chosenite syndrom and singular world-ending threat. You've had dozen if storylines, and none of them individually dominated the entire narrative. The world has been a world, not a ram-shakle, run-down theatre.

>>723249560
There was a bunch of minor things happening that adventures could resolve. That's the best part about vanilla, it's an open adventure.

>>723253281
He had chaos damage, that does things to a mf.

>>723253331
It was his dumb bitch of a mom who set him up for failure by allowing Sargie Boy to possess him before he was even born.

>>723239432
dreadlord hands typed this post

I kind of tapped out of the overall World of Warcraft story after both Varian and Garrosh were killed off. Both characters should have remained alive and they shouldn't have assassinated Garrosh's character development just to make him a villain.

They just fucking kept slicing out the cool characters one by one and now nobody's left. What a waste of everybody's time.

>>723253632
You don't like one-armed black lady and vince mcmahon in a purple wheelchair?

>>723253764
No, they're fucking gay and lame!

>>723249560
It didn't have any plot, it had a "joke" quest where you end up returning Kel Thuzzads phylactery to a scourge agent therefore everything you did was pointless.

>>723246458
Kek.

*Voljin pickpocket 30c from you* eh mon just let the alliance have pandaria *jobs twice and makes Sylvanas “warchief” which is unisex now*

>>723246458
Having to listen to my inane rants is the rent he pays.
Hope he is ready to hear about the goblin led banking system

>>723253632
For me it was cataclysm.

It's impressive how much I disliked Jaina at the end of WarCraft 3.

>>723246939
Fuckin' lol if true

>>723254139
She is a known retard.
Also thrall never fucked her.

>>723247386
>lich bros
>nerubian bros
They were both retconned into hating Arthas.
In Shadowlands, Kelly turns into a raid boss again, mentions having always secretly worked for J'lor, having always actually hated Arthas, and then they make him beg like a bitch for his life when you kill him for the final time.
Im not too sure about anubarak, but in wrath and hots, they both have dialogue about him resenting Arthas, or glad to be free when he dies.

>>723253331
Li Li owes me pandussy

>>723251950
>>723252597
>>723252757
They definitely retconned Garrosh from "hotheaded but trying to be better" to orc hitler in MoP but his arc from TBC to Cataclysm is consistent. He was depressed because his father sold his entire race into slavery but he perked right up when Thrall told him he also ended that slavery, he was ever crying about muh defenseless humans or anything. In fact in WoD he goes to prevent exactly that.

>>723246939
I wonder if we can get a source on this because I think Blizzard is too up its own ass to genuinely retcon something they thought was the sickest shit ever. This is the development team that hates their playerbase when they complain that class changes are dog shit, I can't seriously imagine them being like "Well, okay guys you're right, we're gonna remove this part of the story for ruining things."

>>723254216
>Anub'arak
He never liked arthas or anyone, but retards keep thinking the scourge are super friends forever instead of LITERALLY ENSLAVED.
>KT
Massive dildo, but hes funny so we let it slide. He actually seems to like being a corpse.

>>723242646
And got cucked by an orc

>>723241865
>Wotlk is shit because of the we must always have a lich king shit

It would've actually been fine if WoW ended there and there was some kind of time skip til the next game. Gives them a chance to give more depth to the Scourge.

>>723254216
Anubarak was a slave he never liked Arthas or the Scourge, he literally died fighting it. KT was bullshit tho he was loyal as fuck in W3.

>>723254353
super friends forever through enslavement

>>723253632
The gay ass Garrosh Thrall fight was the moment I realized WoW was finally over.
I had fun dicking around finding mounts and secrets in Warlords despite being such a letdown after that first cinematic, but the patches with look, even more facebook dailies and then haha its demons again I noped.

>>723254007
I remember when everyone was screaming and crying for Vol’jin to be warchief
thank lord they didn’t latch onto poor Baine instead

>>723241426
>cant even /fart on other too
Goldshire will never recover

>>723254619
Baine?

>>723254296
Apparently they're willing to admit how much Shadowlands was hated by the playerbase, if only internally. Closed door meetings at GDC had them reviewing the matter.

>>723254245
By Blizzard's own admission, the people working on his questlines in Cata weren't communicating with each other. Alex Afrasiabi just added his defining character moment in Stonetalon without communicating to the rest of the team.

>Cataclysm seemed like he was going in a different direction for a while there ...
He was.

>He was? Tell us about that – why he had that shift.

>Miscommunication.

>So Stonetalon …

>Me.

>You did Stonetalon?

>I did Stonetalon.

>I didn’t stick to that path with Garrosh. I didn’t – not everyone was on board. Not everyone got the memo as it were, as we were designing – and that was my fault. Because when you’re doing, when you’re trying – because I was actually trying to bring Garrosh around, and Stonetalon was going to be the first of that. Cataclysm was pretty crazy time for us.

>You had so much to do.

>We did quite a lot of work. So I feel like there was a little bit of miscommunication on my part that kind of led to Garrosh going down another, darker path. So there’s an interesting tidbit for you.

>It was interesting though, in the aspect of seeing that glimmer of what he could have been.

>Well he was good at the other way. He did well at that. He was a good killer and plunderer and murderer.

>>723254726
Yeah I know, which is funny because they accidentally made a good flawed character and later went "wait he was supposed to be cartoonishly evil!"

>>723254461
Didn't he willingly join the scourge, hence the "traitor king" title? I vaguely recall reading that nerubians were actually very resistant to the LKs domination which is why they were a major obstacle as he was forming the scourge.

>>723254619
To be fair, Baine has basically spent his entire life looking at the other races of the Horde (the Forsaken especially), wondering to himself what the fuck his dad ever saw in them.

>>723254353
Nah, both the bug and the lich were full on friends forever in frozen throne, Sylvanas being a traitorous cunt even spells it out for you

>>723254353
Why do you fags constantly try and besmirch Beetlebro and Rattlebro?

>>723254712
>well-known story heroes were diminished
SYLVANAS NEEDS TO BE STRONGER!

>>723254932
They called him that because he was one of the first to fall and then resurrrected to fight his own people.

>>723252567
>Garrosh wasn't very smart.
Remember when Thrall tried to zap Garrosh, but nothing happened. Then Garrosh announced he had already tortured all the spirits in a ten mile radius, so they weren't going to listen to an orc basedjak anymore. Then he punched Thrall across the room.
Thrall never even checked in with the spirits until he got to throne room.

>>723255065
Doesn't make sense.
They should call him Fallen King then.

>>723254702
uuuu

>>723254712
They followed Shadowlands up with gay frogs and the power of friendship.

>>723249560
Literally just a post-apolocalyptic sandbox. Horde and Alliance were both two factions among many struggling for survival in the wake of the WC series, and the fight for resources turnedthem against each other while much larger threats infiltrated and subverted both factions (Burning Blade, Defias, Black Dragonflight etc.)

You were also putting to rest long-term enemies of your race/faction. Dark Irons, Alterac, Dragonmaw/Blackrock orcs (this one goes for both factions), Centaur and Quillboar

In other words the setting was a massive clusterfuck, but there were fun stories contained in each “section” of conflict. Often they overlapped in interesting ways, like the enmity between the denizens of Blackrock mountatin (who are both beholden to larger forces), and of course theres some shit that was limited to novels, like the raptors in the wetlands developing sentience and helping out explorers in Dun Modr

>>723254461
The original plot of Nerubians showed them to be almost immune to Scourge corruption and most of them joining up Anubarak and Arthas while still alive, because of civil war.

>>723255014
>t. Nathanos
Sylvie's simp-gimp dying and going to Super Hell during pre-launch was probably the best part of Shadowlands.

>>723255431
Clearly you needed to expand your imagination, anon.

>>723255368
>>723255538
Goldie fan-fiction and not canon.
Anub and Kel are best bros with Arthas.

>>723255781
>Anub and Kel are best bros with Arthas.
That's the point.

>>723254216
https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Kel%27Thuzad_(Sanctum_of_Domination_tactics)
Fucking grim, and lmao at the devs attempt at damage control.
Imagine being a wowcuck, couldn't be me.

>>723255538
They were immune to the plague, not necromancy. Thats why the Lich King actually had to fight them instead of just sending plagued food or something like the humans.

>>723255781
This info comes from the W3 manual, your fanfic isn't canon.

>>723255940
Add.: When in WC3FT Arthas control wanes due to Illidan's tampering, both Kel'Thuzad and Anubarak stick with him.

>>723254996
Nigger nobody in the triangle has free will.

>>723255170
Maybe nerubians are just a bunch of toxic assholes and thought if Anubbie were a proper big and strong chadthropod like me he could've fight off the mental domination of some stupid ghetto human even when he died. We know nothing of nerubian culture.

>>723256058
We just call them clingers but they still make good wingmen.

>>723256031
Anon...
Arthas isn't the one controlling them.

>>723256067
>HUMAN
Orc you dumb fucking CRETIN

>>723255721
The funniest thing about those ads is not that someone wrote it, someone gathered the footage, and someone edited it. The funniest thing is someone saw it all put together and approved it.

>>723238920
>he plays virgin direct strike instead of chad war of races
NGMI

>>723256453
Yeah, hence
>ghetto
Nerubians had no experience with orcs yet, if they saw the ner'zhul-lich king at all their only context would be as a deformed vrykul or deformed human.

>>723242646
Nothing is worth Uther's retardation. Arthas made the right choice by pissing on his father's grave one last time before leaving his kingdom to rot.

>>723255973
>This info comes from the W3 manual
No it doesn't.

>>723253032
He really wasn't doing anything. It's more like he was blasting shitty music too loud which was enough for his high school bullies to convince everyone else to kill him.

>>723256619
https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Warcraft_III:_Reign_of_Chaos_Game_Manual#War_of_the_Spider

>>723240106
Thrall did nothing wrong in W3.My Warchief would have slaughtered Stratholme

>>723256852
...but little did they know
>it was J'Lor's plan all alongo!

>>723246939
>>723254150
>Hype up the Burning Legion and Titans for years
>All the bigshot titans are actually dead/mindbroken
>Sargeras was actually working to save us from the void lords which are a million times scarier and beyond comprehension
>actually the only void lord even alive is Dimensius, that open world quest mob in TBC
>but that was just a fragment of his power
>actually no he appears, vomits, dies and the void lords are gone now
>but actually the titans...
It's like they really are just trying to see how stupid of a story they can put out while continuing to live off of MTX.

wow is not warcraft, you dont like warcraft if you like wow, you just like wow

wow has always had a shit story, but the only reason they keep bastardizing the ip is because you fucks keep paying them

>>723256852
Did they keep the one where you go back in time to stop Alexstraza's rapists from being killed because her being raped and tortured increased the overall happiness of the world?

>>723256953
>ctrl+f "Anub"
>0 results

>>723257216
I was confused by your mention of Dimensius, so I looked up the last cutscene of this expansion. Are you telling me this expansion ended with Xalatoes gaining the power she started the expansion with?

>>723241865
they should've stopped after WotLK and even that is a stretch

>>723238041
He played as a sorcerer with charisma as his dump stat and his only successes were due to the DM being his mom

>>723235515 (OP)
>Jaina this Jaina that
What does it have to do with me?

>>723241865
>we must always have a lich king shit
That was really nonsensical to me. Why were they so scared of a bunch of aimless zombies? Just exterminate them for fucks sake.

How do you actually want WoW to end? Be serious, don't just say everybody dies.

>>723258295
Probably with the cosmic forces being "reset" somehow so they're not out of balance, also pretty clear that the Titan in Azeroth is a being superior to the Titans themselves, so maybe with an actual omnipotent god

>>723257502
No she got the power she started with + Dimensius power + some weird shit she did with old god blood or some shit.

>>723257376
Lmao, Jesus Christ
https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/A_Missing_Soul
They cucked out though

>>723257216
I think Blizz is just speedrunning all the cosmic shit because players obviously don't like it. They already killed the void with dimensius, Sylvanas shows up to say the Shadowlands is not REAL death, probably gonna deal with the Light in Midnight and then the titans in the next expansion.

>>723258604
>28g for a single quest
Goddamn I remember grinding for days to get my first mount back in Classc.

>>723258295
I want it to zoom out to see Anduin, during the time of WOTLK, playing with a snow globe before Varian and Bolvar walk in:
Bolvar: He's been sitting there ever since you left this morning. Just like he does every day in a world of his own.
Varian:Careful with that, son. Remember I told you that? I don't understand this autism thing, Bolvar. But he is my son. I talk to him, I don't even know if he can hear me. 'Cause he sits there all day long in his own world, staring at that toy. What's he thinkin about?
and then leave it at that.

>>723258604
>erm...yeah this is awkward
>cuts to Alexstraza getting raped as dubstep plays
COMING THIS SUMMER

>>723258295
Alliance conquers the Horde but grants them clemency and the right to exist. Political inroads begin. Sylvanas gets nailed to a Nelf tree.

>>723258065
You don't understand. You see, Ner'zhul and Arthas merged into one being and, actually Ner'zhul took control of Arthas's body. But actually Arthas's will won out. But actually Arthas had his heart removed and put in an iceberg. But actually he is still responsible for all of Ner'Zhulselfs actions. Anyways, Arthas/Arth'zhul was holding back the undead from wiping out everyone, secretly with his last bit of humanity that was not the same as the one in the iceberg and was not related to Ner'Zhul or to the Lich King persona (who is actually Arthas).
There must always be a Lich King.

>>723258698
Did they come up with something people would like? They theoretically had plenty of material to work with that was already there pre-Cataclysm and they started deciding to just kill everyone off and rush through/re-write everything so they could get to [_________]
I have no idea what they are trying to speedrun to because they clearly have zero ideas.

>>723258295
All the big world ending threats are dealt with, people start focusing on lesser problems. Big threats may still rise but none of them are Legion/Scourge/Old Gods in their prime tier. Alliance and Horde start losing influence with some members leaving.
All that is to set up a series of single player games.

>>723256852
time travel plots are always a mistake

>>723259246
Ain't that the truth

>>723258848
against*

>>723258993
Probably not, Dragonflight was mostly original characters and it was the biggest nothingburger expansion they've ever done. The current writers are just bad.

>>723235515 (OP)
>Thrall, you need to take the Orcs to Kalimdor. And what ever you do, do not allow anyone to chop down the trees.

The game went to shit with TBC when Blood Elves were given the best Paladin racials

>>723257216
You need to understand they absolutely wrote themselves into a corner thanks to the dumb fucks coming back over from the Titan team during Legion and the franchise has actively suffered because of the choices made by Legion ever since.

>>723258698
>expansion called midnight
>players will kill the light
>brings permanent night to everything
>the farthest point of time away from light is midnight
jesus that's really what they're going to do isn't it

Hi I don't know much about warcraft lore but was the burning legion retconned or something because I thought they were the main bad guys along with the void lords but now there's the jailer or whatever.

>>723236604
Hell yeah I would. I'd take Frostmourne over just about anything.

>>723257216
Their biggest mistake was killing the Legion in Legion (heh). Cataclysm focused on Deathwing, a servant of Old Gods, who was much weaker compared to them according to the lore. They could've expanded Legion/Titan/Void Lords for many expansions and properly flesh them out and Legion could've been focused on Gul'dan. Instead, they just ended whole arcs in three patches

>>723260040
the light has sucked since it’s been space jews and wind chimes

>>723260174
As pointed out here >>723259859 dumbasses from the Titan team came back to WoW during WoD/Legion. After the failure of WoD which they purposely cancelled the expansion internally support wise before the expansion even launched, decided they wanted to do a big Burning Legion invasion expansion now instead.
The problem is, their big burning legion invasion expansion proceeded to kill off 90% of the notable burning Legion characters between WoD's ending and the expansion itself, with then ending it with the big bad of the Burning Legion being taken away to gay baby jail by the the rest of the Titans.
They then had BFA that was supposed to set up Jailer as their next big bad, but the guy who was helming this new era of Warcraft, Afrasabi got fired for being a sex pest/cosby suite drama which resulted in the story the rest of the writers at the time hated, Sylvanas is le evil and Afrasabi's original Shadowlands/Jailer plans being pivoted and reworked into something else.

The setting has been a mess for over a decade now because they burned through the Legion and the last Old God to shill Afrasabi's OC, which he didn't get to even see in the game as he got fired, but it was too late to actually make something completely new. So then the Jailer and SL stuff was ended so Sylvanas could go on a shelf and they fell back to void because it's all they had left and that's why we've now got Midnight.

>>723235515 (OP)
he said that

>>723258987
>have contract author write book retconning your most well liked tragic villain
>contradict it in the expansion anway
>have the most impactful character moment for him and the character closest to him be delivering a static NPC standing six feet away from a bunch of dwarves a necklace who delivers her best voicework over their unceasing hammering

Wrath was a weird one. It was all downhill from WC3 though.

>>723242646
Didn't she fuck kaelthas? Childhood friends always betray

>>723259246
Indeed

>>723258295
I don't care. WoW is so far beyond a setting I care about at this point, that they can tableflip the entire setting with rat-men, and I won't give a shit. It's already a shell.

>>723259723
>And I know I said "travel west", but what I really mean is "the land in the far west".

>>723260174
We sent a lil spaceship thing with like 20 guys in it to the Legion homeworld and uhh just kinda killed all the demons or whatever and sucked Sargeras into a floating space throne room or something the end

>>723260776
Are you talking about the Challenger or Warcraft?

>>723260495
>Promised Grom as final boss of WoD
>Devs get bored of WoD and wanna do Legion instead
>Waste Archimonde to be the final boss of WoD because of the pivot
>Confirm he's 100% canon dead cause he somehow died in the Nether during a mythic only phase followed by a cutscene showing him very much not dying in the Nether
>Proceed to kill off the rest of the notable Legion characters.
People wanna shit on Shadowlands while ignoring the biggest crime of Warcraft's narrative history.

>>723242646
>book
not canon

>>723260523
No she rejected Kaelthas and he stayed seething since then

>>723261097
That dumb cunt's book being canon is half the problem. People who never played WC3 take its abortion of a portrayal of Arthas as gospel.

>>723260394
Argus should've been its own expansion entirely, yeah.
Even if it wasn't, the legion at the time of Legion was explicitly founded to destroy creation because Sargaras had a spoop about the void lords.
So that means the Legion should have been fighting void lord influence somewhere else in the universe, right? Like maybe there are whole planets that are battlefields between the void and the legion. There should have been pockets of legion left, right? Maybe we could have had an 'enemy of my enemy' situation and teamed up with some splinter faction of legion that survived the destruction of argus?
No actually Azeroth is literally the only planet left IN THE UNIVERSE and legion are 100% completely annihilated no coming back the argus worldsoul was the only reason they were immortal.

Imagine being invested in this saturday morning cartoon level slop. Nerds really do deserve to get bullied.

Visions mod actually fixes reforged graphics bros

>>723260394
They did the same shit with Azshara and N'zoth, characters that had been there for years and they just killed them one after the other in a single patch. We didn't even see the naga city just some reefs and a few buildings.

>>723258720
>a world of his own.
Some sort of World of Warcraft™?

>>723239557
Not when I'm in Warsong Gulch, they don't

>>723238041
Autistic people just fail to get their points across, that's common.
I mean if there were coding wizards on /g/, the reason why they're stuck in positions they hate, is because they literally get outplayed by a low skill suit who's on like 2-3 different substances the entire time

>>723236604
/Thread

>>723254216
>In Shadowlands
Not cannon. None of the MMO is canon. If you really want to push it: then WotLK, but if you ask me, only things before major raids were added in Vanilla.

>>723240146
Yeah dude the differences between French and Germans are totally equal to the differences between a green demonblood steroid junky from literally another planet and a group of hunter-gatherer cow people

>>723261414
People who never played WC3 wouldn't be reading that kind of book.

>>723252757
Same with Kaelthas
They spent a whole fucking campaign on him figuratively breaking his back for the Belves then suddenly in TBC he turns his back on them became a Legion lackey, meanwhile they could have actuallly given him a redemption arc instead of becoming a meme.

>>723261094
I was playing since Warcraft and Archimonde being confirmed dead was the point for me where I 100% checked out. Cataclysm story sucked, MoP, funnily enough, had a few alright ideas past the Pandaren stuff, WoD was meaningless pandering and then the one-two punch of Archimonde dying permanently to people hacking his ankles and the Chronicles restarting all Warcraft lore made every single thing that ever happened meaningless.

>>723263013
There isn't tho, orcs and tauren were actually pretty similar which is why they teamed up in W3. The team up that doesn't really make sense is night elves joining the Alliance.

>>723238353
fag

>>723261094
>We have to stop the Infinite Dragonflight from saving Lil Timmy and destroying reality.
>Oh man, good save Bronze Dragonflightma'am. We better stop Garrosh from rewriting Draenor's history, too.
>No.
>Huh?
>No, that's fine. It's a different kind of time travel. It's like a "what if" story.
>So as long as we get him off Azeroth, none of that matters?
>Yes. No. The demons are the same demons there as here. They exist everywhere at once in every reality and can't be defeated.
>SINCE WHEN?
>If for some retarded reason Archimonde brings you into the nether, you should kill him there. It deletes him going forwards in time but not backwards.

>>723249560
it was more like an adventure game which was THE ENTIRE appeal of the game, you weren't the chosen one and there was no big bag to take down, you just stumbled on quests that would lead to self contained stories

I have yet to find an mmo like that again, I guess runescape did it

>>723249560
>What even was vanilla wow's plot.
Retconned to be happening at the tail end of TBC!

>>723244069
the fuck does she need glasses for?

>>723238832
Nobody should have worked with the tauren. They should have been eaten like the giant steaks they are.

>>723263478
They could have easily written Kael'thas as being frustrated that he backed the wrong horse. Illidan is going nuts, there is a giant Fel Reaver knocking on his door, Lady Vashj is sucking up all the water for some reason, they are making Orc demon vaccination facilities, the Burning Legion took over the Dark Portal, and now the Horde and Alliance are both attacking (again, for some reason).
Suddenly the phone is ringing. It's Kil'jaeden.
They didn't do any of that, though, despite the fact it is very easy.

>>723249560
Having a bunch of more contained plots on (relatively) smaller scales is part of why WoW peaked with Vanilla. Every expac being "the new world/galaxy/universe ending BBEG and muh cosmic forces" is a significant contributing factor to nuWoW being gay, soulless trash. They fucked up big time by not focusing on smaller, more grounded plotlines and leaving all the cosmic shit to be more nebulous.

>>723264204
It keeps her from brainwashing herself

>>723265080
vanilla is comfy and self contained, it’s longevity proves it is the goat

>>723258987
Also it's not like Ner'Zhul even wanted this whole lich king thing and the entire time all he really wanted was revenge on the burning legion but I guess we forgot about that and he just wants to kill everyone but he doesn't, and the undead horde would be way worse without a leader coordinating and empowering them.

>>723249560
I can't remember a single piece of classic WoW lore. Not a single quest, etc. I emptied the Scarlet Monastery because it was in my way. BRD because it was in my way. I killed everyone and everything because it was just in my way.

>>723238041
There's no realistic scenario in which he makes a king take all of his people across a journy to an uncharted continent, no matter how eloquent he is.

>>723266672
your way to what

>WoW killed all lore of the Warcraft franchise that has been in the works from WC1 to TfT

Niggers will say "WoW died after wotlk" but WoW was never a Warcraft game to begin with

>>723266873
10 boar asses.

>>723241865
>Wotlk is shit because of the we must always have a lich king shit
It could've been fine if they actually did anything with it or wrote the story better, such as what if Arthas had been holding back the legion this entire time because fighting the burning legion was the entire point of Nerzhul doing all of this and by killing Arthas you just royally fucked everything up and the legion is about to come murderape you if you don't make a new lich king. boom, we must always have a lich king crispy boy sits on the throne and continues the battle and doesn't immediately get 1v1'd by dindu elf. the later legion invasion could then be staged as the disruption you caused during the wotlk expansion weakened the scourge enough that it greatly accelerated the legions victory now shits fucked thanks for breaking it hero go fix it.

>>723238920
It takes a special kind of anal retard to volunteer to clean up messes for free. Any scrap of control they will eagerly consume even if it demeans them.

>>723238041
He prophesized that the person who would "take up that mantle" wouldn't need such convincing. So he immediately knew they were lost causes and finally found Jaina.

>>723240317
blood elves and draenei

>>723249560
You, the player, getting to explore the world of warcraft. As a setting it's basically just all the factions from WC3 during a period of relative peace trying to survive, and you're there dicking around doing whatever.

The only real over arching plots would be the political shit going on in Stormwind revealing what's going on in Blackrock Mountain, and the Silithid ramping up an invasion throughout Kalimdor culminating in the AQ event.

>>723268450
>because fighting the burning legion was the entire point of Nerzhul doing all of this
This is probably the most significant plot point that the WoW writers clearly just fucking completely forgot about. I stopped before legion so maybe they did something there, but in all of WoW I think literally the only time you ever see the burning legion and the scourge fighting each other is during a single daily on Isle of Quel Danas.

All lore post-TFT is non-canon.

Jay'lor and Sargeras's entire plot was to stop Dimensius all the Warcraft plot was all tied to stopping Dimensius.
Dimensius jobbed so now what?

>>723235515 (OP)
Oh no.

>>723269570
>Dimensius
You mean that 5 man group quest boss in netherstorm that most classes could easily solo in questing gear even at the time? What a threat.

>>723269857
They retconned his BC appearance into being only a small part of the real Dimensius

>>723269238
Everything before the anime fight between Arthas and Illidan is non-canon.

WoW is fucked lorewise. The fact they hinted at Sylvanas return, a character beyond repair is so fucking pathetic. They cannot produce memorable characters anymore so they keep milking WC3 characters they already massacred for one more expansion. I bet even Arthas is coming back. They should just nake a new RTS with revised WoW story beats and call it the new canon.

>>723270006
Arthas was completely obliterated from reality. So of course they'll bring him back.

I feel edgy

>>723260174
They were until the big bad got locked up

>>723269570
Xalatath has Dimensius' power now so she's the biggest threat in the entire Warcraft universe. Until the next expansion of course.

>>723269857
Yes the same. He is the official ultimate big bad of the Warcraft universe and just got girlbossed by Xal'atath and sucked in to a magic rock.

>>723269857
HE WAS IN THE POOL

>>723270006
Arthas is a white male. No way he’s ever coming back.

Remember that time that Medivh let the orcs into Azeroth to kill everyone because lmao. Lol.

>>723270825
Wasn't he manipulated by the previous guardian who was manipulated by Sargeras?

>>723270948
Yeah, yeah, everyone is just manipulated and it's all some grand retarded nondescript plan of someone. It's the same shit every time.

Thing about making it so that there's always someone 'pulling the strings' and there always being a *real* big threat just around the corner means that none of the shit that has actually happened matters half a shit and none of the characters actually have any depth. It's just another symptom of WoW hacky writing.

>>723270948
>>723270948
Medivh was possessed by sargeras, wow/warcraft's satan at the time, the day he was conceived in his mother's womb. Thats actually the lore.

>>723270825
>>723271119
He was literally possesed by Sargeras

>>723254216
Didn't even know what happened to Kel'Thuzad since I didn't make it to the raid. Really appreciate Shadowlands for how garbage it was that it made me quit WoW for good. I should have done it earlier when they asspulled Illidan being chosen by Naaru as some destined champion, just to build some edgelord hero like a teen's fantasy. Fortunately I quit before that negress Lothar with the haircut that every black character has these days.
>>723252597
It's obvious the nu-devs(and Metzen) hate Garrosh, but funny how the their resentment to Garrosh gave him the best ending, instead of walking that pathetic path of Illidan and Sylvanas.

>>723255431
>DF
I hated it, everything had to be safe, funny, quirky and gay.

SAY THE WORD

>>723271864
BREAK YOURSELVES UPON MY BODY

>>723271618
Shadowlands was the lowest of the low. Nothing about it was good. Dragonflight was 10/10 when put in comparison to SL.

>>723271864
LIFEBINDER
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4d0l2CniaD8

>>723246939
Retcon some elements, shit still happen and its referenced. The damage its done

>>723253404
Vanilla raids:
Killing king fire elemental before he can destroy the world

Killing god (tribal)

Killing black dragon before he can take over the world

Killing god (egyptian zerg)

Slaying a lich in his flying sky fortress before he can end all life

All of those are exactly what you decry

>>723272236
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-JTErTFhS4U&list=RD-JTErTFhS4U&start_radio=1
Oh shit I forgot about these. Thanks for reminding me.

>>723236604
>letting a ghost orc literally live in your head rent free
miss me with that gay shit

>>723235515 (OP)
>And she'll kill her father to keep doing so.
thats the saddest part about all of that

>>723238041
>be willing to provide evidence of claims
he will just pull out his laptop and show the live feed? the mages were telling teranis about the northrend plague in the intro and the king was like nah. by the time he proved it to the king it would be too late.

>>723273132
Maybe he would have survived if he didn't try launching a coup against his own daughter's self-founded city-state.

>>723271162
>>723271314
All according to the Jailer's plan...

>>723273946
Wasn't really a coup I think my man showed up and everyone was like "thank god I don't have to put up with the greenskins anymore"

>>723235515 (OP)
Jokes aside, was something Medivh could do to save Arthas? He pretty much gave him a fair warning before The Culling but the Lich King already foretold Arthas was going to fall into darkness regardless

>>723238920
>team mate goes afk to sabotage game
>also go afk because I just want to go next and play a real game with my free time
>I get reported and everyone starts screaming at me
>no one reports or blames the dude with is inting

the truth is people just want to blame someone, doesn't matter who. if they cant scream at the actual guy inting because he is not responding they will scream at you if you engage them. best thing to do is just go afk dont not say anything at all. or brainlets will use you as an outlet for their nerd rage

>>723274548
>>723273946
have to agree with my man anon here, they didnt really do much resisting

>>723274678
Considering how Arthas treated Muradin we can safely say that nobody could have stopped him.. except possibly Jaina, that's his big "what if"

>>723274678
He could've set aside his moral quandaries about being absurdly OP in a setting where absurdly OP people, him included, keep fucking everyone over and solo'd the entire scourge before forcibly transporting both himself and the frozen throne into the twisting nether/outland/some other random world.
But noooo, gotta let the little baby heroes have their day.

>>723274678
storm bolt

>>723275074
that smells like wow lore to me

>>723275179
It's something they keep using. "Yes I have the power of a god among gods but ASSPULL EXCUSE TO BE INACTIVE!"
Looking at you, Thrall and Malfurion.

>>723241865
Shadowlands is the Mass Effect 2 and 3 of WoW, complete with players not comprehending metaphysics.

>>723258987
My head! The grey matter iss melltnnnnngnggggggggg

>>723255781
They were really comfy bros.

>>723274678
Medivh's "solution" is unlikely to ever have been accepted by Arthas. In the best case scenario, most of the kingdom is still basically doomed.

This applies to most characters and actually justifies some of Medivh's bullshit. Why perfect your "the end is nigh" pitch when most characters would have spurned your advice and tried to fight the scourge anyway?

He stuck to people that listened early

>>723258987
I'm pretty sure Arthas won the mental battle the moment he put the helmet on and there's nothing else to it.

>>723236604
yes I mean I'd become a brainless thrall for nerzhul BUT I could roll up on goldshire and butcher a shit ton of flurries and trannies so I think it's a worthwhile tradeoff desu

Reminder that Gilneas survived the Scourge and the Burning Legion by building a big ass wall.

>>723272430
Out of all of those literally the only one where it applies is c'thun, and fuck you it was worth it
Everyone else, the adventurers break into their place to murder them before they can do anything
Ragnaros is literally asleep, you have to beat his servant into summoning him

>>723235515 (OP)
Funniest part about this is how specific Medivh is when he's totally vague and ambiguous 100% of the time
>You must sail weast, to the frogotten lands
>Uh, why?
>WELL I GUESS YOU'VE MADE YOUR DECISION THEN, HMM? FINE, IF YOU WILL NOT SIP FROM THIS CUP THEN I SHALL FIND ONE WHO WILL!
What was this nigga's major malfunction?

>>723278596
He's a level 9999 wizard who throws orgies in his tower. If you ain't going to listen to him the first time he's not going to explain it.

>>723238041
>be willing to provide evidence of claims
He got his back shot by a bunch of archers through the wall in WC1. He's not going to experience that again.

>>723278389
Not really tho, the dark iron are enslaved by Ragnaros and attacking the dwarves all over. Same with the Blackrock clan attacking humans and building an army in Blackrock mountain. And KT and the Scourge already did the conquering in W3 and were preparing to keep going. Not to mention Onyxia kidnapping Varian and fucking with the human nobles.

>>723278726
Nobody knew who he was cause he was ashamed of his words and deeds

>>723236604
>human Arthas
>everyone dismisses his claims and just calls him a boy
>Arthas gets Frostmourne
>actually gets treated seriously
>actually shows care for Kel'thuzad and Anub'arak
I mean, I get it.

>>723236604
She wasnt used up at that point, arthas broke her in on his visits to dalaran

>killing everyone in stratholme is bad
>why?
>IT JUST IS OKAY

The Horde was more interesting with Garrosh leading it.

>>723242695
Garrosh left because he knew the series had long gone to shit and wanted to make sure they couldn't bring him back in any way.

>>723258295
every player gets sucked into the game as a mish mash of their characters and themselves or some eldritch horror shit and the story goes on from there. like some fucked up isekai horror tale in real life. that's the only way it will make wow interesting to me after the travesty that was WoD and Cataclysm. yes I'm one of the 59 Warcraft 2 diehard fans PISSED about how they're mismanaging the characters how could you tell?

>>723270606
>dumb knife has some fat voidwalker powers
didn't I already choke that bitch with boundless mystical powers from all over the planet during Legion? how do I remind blizzard that she owes me sex?
no I'm not talking about the rotting elf corpse I want the Day of the Tentacle slut noodle inside her.

>>723280217
I understand why you would want that, but I'm sorry it still won't make you a woman.

>>723238041
really though, what would everyone bailing for Kalimdor have solved? The scourge had to sack Dalaran to summon Archimonde in the first place, seems like Medihv should've been telling them to unite with the other eastern kingdoms instead of all turtling up and letting the zombies have free reign, instead of telling them to fuck off to america.

>>723239829
Theramore will never stop being completely justified. also it was incredibly based of Garrosh to literally plan around Baine being a filthy traitor to the point where the alliance suffered more damage because of Baine telling them about the attack.

>>723240317
blood elves for night elves. Imagine an actual shamanistic kalimdor horde like we were originally promised, and alli-fags can have the worthless elves they've always wanted.

>>723274678
No there were only two people ever in the position to save Arthas; Uther and Jaina.
When Medivh confronts Arthas, Arthas says he cannot abandon Lorderan, even if it is doomed.
Uther reacting belligerently to Arthas' clear stress induced madness, and Jaina freezing up and not trying to persuade either Paladin. These are the moments that set Arthas on the path to damnation. Slight chance that Muradin could have talked Arthas out of Frostmourne if Uther didn't have the Valgarde expedition recalled.

>>723246458
>>723272963
>rent free
He gives you super powers though. How is he not paying rent?

>>723280587
He can see the future, he saw the legion would lose in Kalimdor when Humans, Orcs, and Night Elves joined forces. There was no holding Arathor.

>>723241930
you forgot
>Saurfang passes up the chance to kill Furion because... uh he felt bad okay
>Sylvanas burns the tree to cover up Saurfang's fuckup

>>723247273
>Thrall helps Grommash detox
that's the neat part, he doesn't. Grom dies in a demon blood fueled rampage, he just happened to take out his dealer in the process.

>>723235515 (OP)
>The urn holds your father's ashes, Arthas! What, were you hoping to piss on them one last time before you left his kingdom to rot?
>You wanted to grab the urn, shove your rotten penis in it, and PISS in it...? Urinate inside the urn with the remains of your dead dad right in front of me because the stupid cursed sword told you so? In FRONT OF ME? PEEPEE INSIDE THE URN?
>RIGHT HERE IN ANDORHAL?
>GIVE ME A LITTLE... ROTTEN-COCK-URN-WATERSPORTS SHOW?
>IS THAT HOW YOU SEE ME?

>>723281002
so why didn't he go to Dalaran and steal the book needed to summon Archimonde? or the urn needed to preserve Kel'thuzad's ashes?

>>723235515 (OP)
VGH what could've been

>>723281189
>What the fuck, Uther... ? You know what, keep the urn.

>>723281189
When did Death Knight Arthas die? When he lost his soul to frostmourne, or while wandering the frozen wastes once Mal'Ganis was taken care of? Did he ever actually die? Can't have still been alive after he cut his heart out, at least.

>>723281410
He didn't look dead in the cinematic cutscene when he killed his dad.

>>723274678
Arthas cares too much about his people to have ever listened, that's his problem, literally he cares too much about "save muh people by any means necessary"
>The Prophet: Listen to me, boy. This land is lost! The shadow has already fallen, and nothing you do will deter it. If you truly wish to save your people, lead them across the sea... to the west.
>Arthas: Flee? My place is here, and my only course is to defend my people!
>The Prophet: Then your choice is already made. Just remember, the harder you strive to slay your enemies, the faster you'll deliver your people right into their hands.

>Arthas: Nothing he can say will make me abandon my homeland, Jaina. I don't care if that madman has seen the future. Let's go.

>>723281573
He didn't exactly look healthy either. And his death knight portrait is straight up ghoulish. But he's never shown actually rotting or losing body parts (until the heart thing). It's pretty ambigious. Can you go straight from living to undead without actually passing through death?

>>723281758
>Jaina: don't worry Arthas, i'll abandon my homeland enough for the both of us

>>723281250
Because he's still part Sargeras.

>>723281768
he's holding a fuckoff huge life draining sword, maybe he simply withered away as Frostmourne succed him?

>>723280890
If Uther had stuck around even to try and slow Arthas' headcount down, he would have seen Mal'Ganis doing his shit and have seen that something had to be done then and there

>>723281410
Arthas hasn't died at all, the fact that we're talking about him is proof of that.

>>723281918
Yes, Stratholme is the breaking point if it happened any other way, the plot gets derailed. The scourge was all but destroyed in the Eastern Kingdoms in the previous mission by WoW lore. So Mal'ganis is trying to regain any substantial force with his attack on Stratholme.

>>723238041
>>723238202
>>723247360
>>723257749
Medivh was full on "immaculate conception" bullshitted into his mother by the Burning Legion guy Sargeras to fake-fulfill a prophecy of a great mage or some bullshit, all while tailor-made to be manipulated by the Legion when the time came.
Now, he and his mom eventually figured this shit out AND made failsafes in the form of pic related (his apprentice) for when he eventually turned full evil, including him nerfing himself and cutting off most of his power beforehand.
But I like to think the Legion was still pulling some subtle palpatine-manipulation with him before they got full control.
Making him make retarded choices, for example.

anyone remember that time Medihv had a orc-draenai-human-demon son? yeah me neither.

>>723260523
No. But she did fuck a blue dragon after Gary blew up her house.

>>723281881
So you're saying... his brade tastu'd him?
Mostu unnaturu.

>>723279349
Then they turned him into Hitler for some reason even though he was learning.

And in their poor writing and terrible planning, he was the one of very few good things in shadowlands when he showed he was one of the handful of people in Azeroth who had any real conviction.

So what actually happened with Medivh after Archimonde got detonated by night elf workers?

>>723282815
It was clear in Cataclysm the writers didn't have a concensus what was going to happen with Garrosh. Half wrote him as a necessary evil, with a divided Horde where he needed to continue through, the other half made him Hitler as you said. Then most of the player base being Alliance and hating him didn't fucking help. Meanwhile Varian started off in the same way as Wrath but was allowed to grow and develop, and is even somehow is smarter than every other Alliance leader when it comes to war. The favoritism was stunning.

Funny enough, it actually helped Garrosh become a sort of "If nobody will help me, I'll do it my own way" character, which actually made him admirable.

>>723282978
He's just kind of been fucking around in the background, popping up when cryptic hints need dropping. Think he's who Khadgar ran off to after Sargeras had his way with baby Azeroth and left her all torn up. You'd have thought he'd have more of a part to play in Legion with the demon-titan-god who possessed his soul showing up in person but eh.

>>723282727
I release!

>>723283437
Cope & seethe horde nigger. Daelin did nothing wrong

>>723279349
Garrosh is one of the worst characters every conceived

>>723278596
Your brain has been destroyed by Post-modernism, I bet you love Marvel quips

>>723284705
He died like a little bitch. Just like how you will one day, allitranny

>>723283437
>Meanwhile Varian started off in the same way as Wrath but was allowed to grow and develop

Varian didn't develop as a character one iota, he is extremely boring

>>723282167
Idk all Mal'ganis wanted was for Arthas to chase him to Northrend so he could be tempted by Frostmourne. I think things could play out similarly even with Uther around, Stratholme was gonna turn undead and get burned, that would be enough to convince the Uther/the king that Mal'ganis had to be stopped and the Northrend expedition happens anyway, Maybe Tichondorus needs to get involved earlier to put enough pressure on to convince Arthas to actually take the blade

>>723283437
He honestly did nothing wrong in Cataclysm, just gets accused of a bunch of shit he didn't do like killing Cairne even though he fought fair and square. The orc hitler shit comes out of nowhere in MoP.

>>723280890
>Uther reacting belligerently to Arthas' clear stress induced madness
Uther blamers are deranged, they'll blame anyone but Arthas who is the sole person responsible for everything, based on the choices he made even after being warned.

Game should have ended either after WoTLK or Legion at which point they should have dropped WC4 and pick up with WoW 2 set decades or centuries after WoW.
The "dude there's a new cosmic threat and a new continent for us to explore every 3 years" in canon lore is retarded.
I think they severely botched Cata and BfA in particular as potential times to do a soft reset of the setting

Both Garithos and Garrosh did nothing wrong. Imagine the absolute warcrime craft kino if they were faction leaders and all inferior races except humans and orcs were genocided.

>>723286395
Best Warriors
>Tauren
Best Mages
>Blood Elves'High Elves
Best at WMD Production
>Forsaken/Goblins
orcs and humans are mid there's just a lot of them. Actually there aren't even a lot of orcs

>>723277901
At the end of WC3, Ner'Zhul's voice says "Now we are one." This is either a complete merger or Ner'Zhul winning.
Asked on the official forums in the lead up to WotLK, the answer given was:
>Before Arthas donned the Lich King's armor, it was the spirit of the former Orc Shaman Ner'zhul whose soul was attached to the armor and then imprisoned (physically) inside the Frozen Throne. Now Arthas and Ner'zhul's spirit are one and together they are the Lich King.
In the book Arthas: Rise of the Lich King, Arthas took full control.
Chris Metzen was asked who is the Lich King, and he said it was a merger.
The Lich King says he was once a shaman during a Howling Fjord quest.
Tirion Fordring looked into the Lich King's heart during a quest and remarks that there is no Arthas Menethil anymore.
In 2010 the official forum answer to who was the lich king was:
>He didn't actually erase the persona of Ner'zhul. In point of fact, these two beings merged to make up what was collectively known as "The Lich King".
Chris Metzen changed his mind in 2010 and said Ner'Zhul is done.
When the Lich King is defeated, Arthas seems confused and asks his weird ghost father if it is all over, as if he wasn't fully aware of what was happening.
It was a total disaster for no reason.

>>723287380
It can't be understated: Blizzard did not know who the Lich King was while developing WotLK.

>>723249560
The entire Onyxia/Defias/Van Cleef/Blackrock Orcs/Nefarian plotline is better than anything any expansion shat out afterward. And that's just one plotline in vanilla.

>>723287537
I understand what you're saying but pretty much all of those plotlines fizzled out into nothingburgers or hanging threads that were never picked up later.

>>723287803
The fuck are you talking about? Those plotlines end with the end of BWL

>>723287849
The entire questline for the Onyxia/defias shit was to find the king, who you can find in that marsh area. But you can't save him for some fucking retarded reason.

>>723287849
Reminder all of the Onyxia stuff is retconned in WotLK to be that King Wrynn actually discovered Onyxia himself then went and killed her after she kidnapped Anduin

>>723249965
>>723255491
>post-apocalyptic
what are you guys smoking?

>>723257376
You know they didn't. But thanks for reminding me

>>723260657
So they had the pandarens living on a giant turtle, but what is moving the eastern kingdoms?

>>723269570
>>723270686
>>723270606
>Dimensius
I have the vaguest of memories of this character. They're really grasping for straws now.

Reading this thread made me glad I quit with Legion. You beat space satan and saved the world, the end.

>>723289746
Funny enough, Legion is sort of the end of the initial Blueprint of WoW. It was I believe back around late Vanilla where a moderator posted a planned timeline for WoW, which involved BC, Wrath, possibly Cata (had mentions of different zones but nothing about Deathwing destroying everything), Pandaria as a starting zone, and then Legion. There's some names for the Legion zones that seem to have been used for BC places, so I'm not sure what the plan was, but I always considered Legion to be the true finale.

>>723258987
>But actually Arthas had his heart removed and put in an iceberg.
>surely removing this organ will rid me of my conscience

>>723289952
It's prettier than cutting out the empathy center of his brain and sticking it in a jar or something.

>>723289746
This is how it should have ended, gaycraft dies with modicum of respect and Sargeras who was 100% correct beats the void niggers and retard pantheon.

>>723289932
It's like FF14's Ending is Endwalker. WoW ending was Legion. I'm very satisfied with both.
>>723290232
Seeing that giant sword sticking out of the planet was like "yeah, they're never topping this". Complete satisfied going from Vanilla to the end of Legion.

>>723290232
>>723290297
He’s coming back

>>723290567
Don't care, WoW ended for me with Legion. After what they did with Arthas in Shadowlands, my chances of ever coming back is 0%.

>>723281410
>>723281768
They said during wrath he never died in that sense but he did die in that he lost his soul.

>>723263927
>Yes. No. The demons are the same demons there as here. They exist everywhere at once in every reality and can't be defeated.
People like to say that legion or shadowlands killed the lore, but for me, this is what truly killed the lore. Archimonde being killed by the efforts of the NE, the Alliance and the Horde was not only kino, but also helped cement that paradigm changing events where possible to happen in the lore. By changing this death, it not only cheapened warcraft 3's ending, but also showed and proved that Blizzard couldn't keep the illusion that Azeroth was a breathing living world and not a theme park MMO.

>>723290502
Kek, I remember when Arthas said that

>>723286395
>Garithos did nothing wrong
Yes, he did. He trusted an undead