Thread 723302017

New Silksong patch nerfed the fuck out of silk skills but especially Thread Storm, it's down 50% and the follow up basically deals no damage.

Suffice to say, Team Cherry did NOT appreciate you deleting bosses with Thread Storm.

>>723302017 (OP)
Did they go back and nerf things in Hollow Knight? If you watch speedrunners do bosses the Hollow Knight bosses die almost instantly while the Silksong bosses usually have a few rotations of their different attacks. The Shaman Crest, Silk Storm, Volt Filament combo is nowhere near as strong as that Flukenest thing was.

>>723302017 (OP)
Good, the game was too easy

>>723302017 (OP)
nerfing shit in singleplayer games is retarded

>routing my Steel Soul playthrough
>can use Pebb's key on Wormways Door to get very early Wanderer
Or
>can use Pebb's key on Deep Docks door to get early Flintslate and skip Lace 1, letting me use Shakra in Hunter's March later
Actually a tough decision

>>723302017 (OP)
Noooo they revoked my " I beat the game status"...

>>723302017 (OP)
>shaman down arrow
>hunter with up arrow
What did they do to those?

>>723302979
YOUR retarded, idiot!

>>723303130
Silk skill damage bonus from Shaman down from 50 to 40%.
Hunter's bonus damage for not getting hit up, almost as high as Beast with Fury active and above Wanderer on level 3 crest.

>>723302017 (OP)
>>723302664
It's hilarious how "PLAY THE GAME HOW WE WANT YOU TO PLAY" they are. Everything people could destroy bosses with in Hollow Knight doesn't even have an equivalent in Silksong, and they're actively nerfing new things.

>>723302017 (OP)
>Thread Storm nerf
good, the "hidden" mechanic's too strong
>Hunter buff
decent, a better reward for fully evolving the damn crest
>Shaman nerf
whatever, Act 3 crest
>Reaper
forgotten
>architect, wanderer
ydntbtg
>Opinions
the aussies just fiddle with the numbers "for fun"

>>723302017 (OP)
There is no bigger cancer of modern gaming that "balance patches" to fucking single player games.
What is even a point? Average player won't find broken builds and the speedrunners will just keep the game on older patch.

>wanderer's charged attack was already the worst part of the kit
>made it even worse
kek lmao

>>723302979
Devs nowadays are obsessed with live service slop. So they feel the need to constantly update their games like it's fortnite or league of legends.

>>723302017 (OP)
Should have added more lace encounters

Other thread went to shit, what are the hidden changes exactly

>>723302017 (OP)
Devs got concerned people might have fun with the game.

I already beat it.
I don't care

>>723304183
>shaman is arguably the weakest crest for a multitude of reasons.
>primarily because of how silk is shared between both healing and spells, the amount of hits it actually takes to get a heal or spell (4 for a spell or 9 for a heal), and your relatively low capacity (4 spells or 2 heals)
>nerf it despite being the endgame crest that you have exclusively for the secret postgame, with the crest itself being pretty well hidden.
are they actually fucking retarded?

We angst now

I just got the first ending (32hrs) (The bad ending)
Where was the difficulty spike supposed to be?
Savage grubfly was the hardest boss I fought (Given my progression), but it was skippable
Also, What do I do with this crying baby? I want to destroy it. Do I need double jump?

>>723304183
>Silk skill damage bonus from Shaman down from 50 to 40%.
Shaman had a silk skill damage bonus?
Why can't the game just have a clear stats screen with number showing this shit.

>>723306103
Nuh uh, you beat it when it was easy and for babies.
You are not a true gamer and have had your beaten the game status revoked.

>fully upgraded tool damage wisp lantern now deals roughly equal damage per bar of silk spent as base (no filament, no shaman) silk skills
>except only on one target instead of clearing groups
>and only if every single wisp hits (they won't)
why is it so bad.

>>723306260
>>723306979
Trannyslop

>>723306115
As far as I know, speedrunners exclusively use Shaman Crest for act 3. I guess Team Cherry saw that and assumed it meant the crest was too strong.

>buff Sharpdart's and Cross Stitch's damage
>even though the lower damage was obviously designed around them being defensive skills
understandable

>nerf Thread Storm and Rune Rage
>two of the skills that trade off high damage for being completely exposed and require good positioning and timing
>nerf shaman crest
>a late-game crest which increases damage but disables air healing
>nerfing shit in a single-player game
completely degenerate

now I'm remembering their interview with Schreier
>“What is Jira?” Gibson said when I asked if they used the task-management application.
>“Is it a software?” Pellen said, adding that they’d briefly used Trello before their account was deactivated because they didn’t use it enough.

retards probably don't even have a design document and don't remember why they designed shit the way it is

>>723302979
I think it's fine it's an actual bug fix like the tick rate was incorrect and it procs way more than intended.

>>723307331
They can't be unaware of how these changes affect their damage numbers, especially with how hard they clearly tried ot make every skill match in damage ratios. What bothers me is that they'd lazily fuck with the numbers instead of breaking their autistic standardization of Silk Skill costs always being 4.

Want to buff Cross Stitch? Have it refund 3 silk if you fail to parry anything.
Want to buff Sharpdart? Let it give 1 silk for every individual enemy you hit with it.
Want to nerf Thread Storm? Have the extension cost extra silk.
I have no idea why you would want to nerf Shaman, but I'll play devil's advocate and say the nerf is a lot less extreme than people make it seem. With damage numbers for skills being in the 60-70s the difference between 40% and 50% is like 6 points.

>>723306979
W art

hunter full focus + flintslate with cross stitch is like the strongest burst damage in the game now

does nobody ever stop and wonder why almost every such dev nerfs things in a singleplayer game?
Its almost like "WOOOW nerfing things in singleplayer is WRONG!!" is a mindset fundamentally opposed to the mindset that actually makes you create a good, satisfying well tuned videogame
>>723307331
they buffed rune rage
why do you care if they dont use jira lmao theyre a 3 man team
i assure you silksong is a more well tuned combat than any retarded soulslop clone made by hundreds of retards and outsourced indians using tard-wrangling sites focused on agile methodologies. Except fromsoft, they dont use agile. No wonder their games are better than whoever tries to ape them

>>723307619
>they buffed rune rage
all damage calculations people made showed the "buff" was just for nail damage scaling, but the other changes has Rune Rage doing less damage than before.

>joyless faggots made the worst resoruce management system in the entire genre with shell shards
>instead of fixing it, decided to nerf the skills not tied to it

>>723307718
they nerfed the silk skills not the red tool skills you DUMMY

>>723304183
>Silk skill damage bonus from Shaman down from 50 to 40%.
WHAT
NO WAY YOU'RE FUCKING LYING
I'VE BEEN SEETHING ABOUT HOW SHIT THE SHAMAN CREST'S EVERYTHING IS FOR THE LAST FEW DAYS SINCE I GOT IT

NOW THEY'RE NERFING THE ONE GOOD THING IT HAS???

>>723308092
read that post again anon

>>723308092
That's what he said, he's implying you now have to rely on tools even more to make up for the nerfed spells but he's probably just a shitter that spams tools to make up for a lack of skill

>>723306115
>are they actually fucking retarded?
Anon I'm literally shitting a brick right now. I was looking forward to the awesome endgame spell build, this is the worst news I've seen all week.

>>723308328
>>723308132
>>723306115
I spammed pale nails through Act 3 like it was nothing. I thought It was strong (or at least have to be decent)

Reminder that all the people whose sole argument for any form of criticism is "ur le bad" are devs or discord simps and they're shit at the game.

>>723307619
I don't care what they use, working on the same project for 8 years you're bound to forget why certain decisions were made
Bringing all silk skills to around the same damage level without considering in what context the skills are used is mindless
If they wanted people to start using some skills more and some skills less they should've made the change more obvious to the players, even something like what >>723307606 said would work
Not properly documenting said changes in patch notes is also stupid, but that's just the symptom of Cherry's lack of communication skills

>>723307619
>i assure you silksong is a more well tuned combat than any retarded soulslop
Silksong is one of the worst designed and balanced games i've played this year. They had absolutely no idea what they were doing.

>>723302979
It's been obvious for a while now that Team Cherry are conceited assholes.

Aside from the sprint attack I didn't even know Shaman was bad like so many are saying, I went back and forward between it and Hunter whenever I felt like it in act 3 and didn't really encounter any problems with Shaman but Hunter is still my favorite crest so I used it for the more difficult bosses like Lost Lace and Karmelita.

>>723309226
shaman is extremely powerful despite the bad sprint attack, not sure how people were so bad at it
i assume its all brainlets who just look at the dps number without playing the game

>>723309226
Shaman has the worst healing in the game and terrible attack speed. Pogo is its saving grace, by far the best in the game.

>>723302979
this is what ruined darkest dungeon for me.

>>723309579
What is this trannyshit?

beast have not been buff?

>>723302979
people shouldnt be allowed to breeze though the game with broken builds

>>723309747
Doesn't need it

>>723308132
You being a retard does not mean shaman crest is bad. It pumped more damage than any crest by a big gap.

>>723309901
do you get more health back if you do more damage or is it always a flat amount?
would be funny if it was the former, with the more dmg charm you could just faceroll bosses then

>>723309947
>Ooh look, this guy is mad
>Let's poke him and troll, maybe I can make him even angrier and get a laugh out of the retard
I don't understand children.

>>723310031
Always 3, 4 with Multibinder I think.

>>723310031
It's per attack and it's capped at 3, I assume multi-binder makes it 4 but I've never used it

>>723309663
Straight outta Undertale

>>723309901
>Rage lasts five seconds
>Getting hot once no matter the damage output will reduce effect by 3 seconds
>Hunter is buffed to now do near the same damage but with an easier and faster kit
It needs it.

>>723302017 (OP)
>>723304183
>Silk skill damage bonus from Shaman down from 50 to 40%.
Absolute dogshit.
HK > SS

>>723309226
worst part about shaman is not being able to heal in the air

>>723306541
Fromfags will argue that knowing too much information will result in metafagging (ignoring that people who want to metafag will look up the numbers anyway)

>>723310031
The way Beast works is strange. It only ever heals 3 or 4 masks, but the timer can be increased or decreased. Starts at 5 seconds, increases for each mask healed, decreases when you take damage. I haven't used it much, so I'm just going off what I've heard. Is it true that you don't get extra time if you don't heal any masks? So you're penalized for using the bind when your health is full? You can't facetank hits to lose health and regain it because that decreases the timer too.

>>723307331
Sharpdart really sucks as a defensive skill because it has way too much startup lag
it's a decent positioning tool sure but it's really not defensive like cross stitch is

Wasn't the entire point of silk skills the high risk high reward nature?
Why nerf them when tools are still better?

>>723310334
Because people were using Shaman Crest and ignoring tools entirely. Team Cherry doesn't want you to play the game that way.

Balancing Act 3 (dogshit) crest and Act 3 silk skills is sure gigabrain idea.
>>723310334
Silk skills are fun to use and don't force you to grind shards. Fun is bad.

>>723310409
Then why did they make a crest that gives up tools for better silk skills?

>>723310453
>Silk skills are fun to use
with how hard the bosses are no player uses them in their first run as theyre a waste of silk that could be used for healing

>>723308934
I'm all for balancing, but this is legitimately stupid. In no universe should silk spear and thread storm do near identical damage. The only skills worth using now are cross stitch and silk spear.

The dark souls 2 of metroidvanias strikes again

>>723310528
they are cheap for a ton of damage
silk hearts alone can give you 3/4 the silk required
dont tell me youre 'always' low on health

>>723310513
they themselves don't know what they were/are doing pure game design wise. Silksong is slop from the ground up

>>723310334
>Why nerf them when tools are still better?
if tools were better than skills speedrunners would actually use tools

>>723308934
This balance change is retarded, this basically weights any skill that can be started and ended quick as the top tier pick for damage. Why go for Thread Storm when it does the same damage as Silkspear, but takes longer to actually land that damage?

>>723310535
Why not? You have to aim Silkspear while Thread Storm just requires you to be close and while Silkspear pierces Thread Storm is aoe in all directions, Rune Rage is the only one I don't get because the start-up is horrendous and it's pure RNG if it'll even hit

>a few completely marginal changes
>4chan has a pity party because "nerfing a single player game is cringe", "clearly they don't have a design document or remember what they are doing"

>>723310735
You don't have to be anywhere near the enemy to throw out a silk spear. Its range is ridiculous in comparison.

>>723310559
It's over.

>>723310735
Silkspear sends out all the damage instantly, while Thread Storm has to spread that damage out for longer across multiple hits, making it possible to only do a partial hit.

>>723310678
the tool upgrades are off route and waste time. tools are stronger though

So am I going to start up my save file tonight and find out that skills I've been using for dozens of hours now suddenly deal different damage than they used to? Are they out of their minds?

>>723310705
because you can use thread storm to hit multiple enemies in a way silk spear can't, and use it from any angle of approach rather than just horizontal?

>>723303038
You can get Shakra in the first Hunter's March gauntlet even if you do Deep Dock -> Lace 1 -> Far Fields -> Fourth Chorus. I guess the trigger is reaching Greymoor?

>>723303038
You can get the Wanderer crest without wasting a key, you just have to be careful about how you drop down into the main camp area. It's possible to reach the platforms above the chapel when you drop down, and you can make your way to Wanderer from there.

>>723310875
The only advantage Thread Storm has as a skill is hitting enemies above you. If you can be left or right of any enemy and match them vertically, the spear is now the goto way to dealing damage.

>>723310804
Yeah but you still need to be on the same axis and it's only one way, Threadstorm seems more designed for dealing with little flying shits that can come from all directions, seems they have their distinct uses to me

>>723310832
That's true but that's probably why you can extend it so they walk back into it

>>723310875
You have to be legitimately braindead to think that silk spear set ups are more restricted than thread storm WINDOWS. Thread storm already relied upon requiring a long enough window to get all or at least most of the ticks. But it was worth because even a 60% thread storm was equivalent to a silk spear. Now you can just chuck out a silk spear with no regard to windows at all. You don't understand the game.

>>723310987
and only hits more than 1 enemy if all of them line up
even nerfed you sure as fuck want threadstorm and not silk spear for the high halls gauntlet

>>723311002
>probably why you can extend it
anon, part of Thread Storm's nerf is that the extension's damage is pitiful. Every hit from an extended part of Thread Storm only deals 1-2 damage, compared to the usual 16.

>>723302979
>Top 10 midwit takes of all time

>>723310740
tbqh the largest changes was the hunter buff and making threadstorm's extended cast do 0 damage. the rest arent as big

Silksong is official kusoge now.

>>723307619
>i assure you silksong is a more well tuned combat than-
half the bosses are add/pre-fight-arena shitshows specifically because the devs couldnt figure out how to make the boss harder without saying "fuck it RANDOM SHIT GO!"

>>723310740
>look at numbers (this won't affect me whatsoever)
>starting to get mad
goddamn internetmen

>>723311073
Is that not perhaps only if they got hit by all the ticks to begin with? Like I don't know how many total hits it does but maybe only after a certain amount it starts doing shitty damage but the first few still do decent regardless of when they occur, otherwise extending it does seem completely useless outside of floating for longer

still probably going to keep silk storm equipped because it feels like the best way to nuke a gauntlet wave - getting multiple enemies horizontally and vertically aligned for a silk spear just feels like a lot of time when the point of silk skills is killing before time elapses

>>723310740
I don't even play the game.

>>723311296
It could be, but nobody who's reported the numbers has really proven it. I can only assume the damage specifically drops off when it's considered extended, I don't see how they'd be able to account for how many times you hit something when you could be potentially hitting multiple enemies at once.

>>723311414
>vertically
can you throw silk spear upwards??

I love the skarrs so much, why do they have only 3 bosses, one area and like 3 arena fights.
They needed an entire colloseum of fools-like point of interest

>>723306270
Take it to Shellwood. The Bellheart NPC would normally give you that same hint.

>>723311696
dlc, the plan must be trusted

>>723311625
notice i said horizontally *and* vertically - for silk spear to work all the enemies you're trying to hit have to have roughly the same y coordinate as hornet, *in addition to* an x coordinate that's strictly greater (or less, depending on the direction you're facing) than hers within a specific range

>>723307060
I use Wisp Lantern on my Hunter build since I'm not bothering with healing and I'm busy using the regular attack

>>723311696
They have the best boss in the game, filter players early that reach hunters march or the big nigga ant and have one of the best tools in the game. I think they have it good honestly.

>>723311696
I was so mad when that skarr died

Didn't realise Witch was so long, better than Reaper even

>>723311625
...You can?

>>723309806
I think people should be allowed to play the game however they want. One the first mods released was to disable double damage, so it's not like patching the game does anything for pc players

>>723311887
Buddy fell victim tl ant racism

>>723302664
they nerfed numerous crests yeah so i don't know what the bitching is about, spamming one ability to skip all the boss mechanics is degenerate gameplay and needed addressing

>>723312191
meant to say charms

>>723302017 (OP)
Why even have other crests besides hunter/wanderer at this point

>>723311756
anon... Lining up everything horizontally literally means your definition of 'lining up them all vertically' in the first place, which is backwards
By your logic, every single enemy in silksong is automatically lined up horizontally with everyone else

>>723310935
Yes, but I'm talking about EARLY Wanderer crest. You can technically get it before even fighting Bell Beast if you buy Pebb's key

>>723310740
This. Every time I look at these DPS numbers I wonder how relevant it even is for anything but speed running. To me it looks like every hit deals roughly the same damage, I only ever notice the big buffs (equipping volt charm, flintslate, oil upgrade, etc.) everything else just seems to hit for the same every time I play.

>>723311756
And what about the z axis, so easily forgotten...

>>723311960
Indeed, but Reaper has Dragon Punch running attack.

>>723312412
The damage numbers being shared are misleading. The one people are getting really angry about is the move that allows you to make it last longer to do more damage by spam-pressing the button to use it. The issue is, with the nerf, all damage during that extended period is secretly doing literally 1 damage per hit, which is abysmal. Imagine you use that skill and hope the enemy walks back into the extended form of the spell, and you get a lot of hits off. You'd expect that to be doing real damage, but the game has actually secretly fucked you over.

>>723302017 (OP)
>Suffice to say, Team Cherry did NOT appreciate you deleting bosses with Thread Storm.
You could do that? I never tried because I just facetank bosses and delete them by spamming basic Wanderer attacks

>>723311960
witch's problem is the double hit meme
>that one enemy that cant be double hit for some reason so you just lose half your damage
just fuck my shit up

its only real upside moveset wise is that the running attack can deal some higher damage despite being a pain to use compared to hunter/architect/reaper etc
otherwise youre going all in on that damaging heal

>watched a hitbox showcase video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y9vvZ0yf2R0
>Hunter's range is actually SHORTER than Wanderer's
>Wanderer's hitboxes are just more narrow
What the fuck, I never noticed this. I guess Hunter is really mid then. Like yeah, focus 2 is good, especially after this patch, but you get it way too late for it to matter.

>>723306115
There's no reason to use Shaman anymore, it has the slowest silk generation in the game (-20% attack speed just like Reaper but no silk orbs to make up for it) and the slowest bind animation, it was only worth using for spell damage, but that just got nerfed.

I hate these changes. Practically no casual players were using silk skills, so let's nerf them some more because some speedtranniers were deleting bosses with Shaman + Thread Storm.

>>723309806
>people shouldn't be allowed to feel powerful in a genre literally built upon progression
why are Team Cherry cocksuckers like this?

>>723313437
If some specific option is too strong it will just lead to metafagging (like shaman + thread storm was) ultimately making the game less fun. This is not rocket surgery anon, don't play dumb, you know perfectly well why they did it.

>metagaming in a casual game
Bro just use the attack that looks the coolest, I'll keep using reaper no matter how much you screech at me, the fight is x2.5 longer? Good! I like this game!

>>723313515
yes, they don't want people to feel powerful in a genre literally built upon progression that's why

>>723313437
anon they are literally the ones who made the game with architect crest

>>723302017 (OP)
Doesn't matter to me, I've just used Hunter crest for the entire game.

>>723312380
ok i might have them flipped around, whatever, but even if I do the only enemies that are aligned are the ones hornet is facing towards and are within like half a screen of her
so if she's standing and facing to the right at the start of the game in moss grotto she's aligned with some trash mobs in the shaft area of moss grotto/blasted steps as well as around some of the bridges, but certainly not with any enemies in wormways and probably not anything so far right as the last judge runback

>>723311696
They don't fight for sport and fit too well into their roles to be competitive, a colosseum wouldn't fit them

>>723302017 (OP)
>>723304183
>NYOOOOOOOOO WHAT THE FUCK BROS SPEEDRUNNERS ARE BEATING OUR GAME TOO EASILY, NERF IF NYOOWW
Why do devs these days balance their game around streamers who are playing it literally for their job? Oh noooooo some fag who's grinding runs for 12 hours each day found some tech better delete it IMMEDIATELY. What's up with this brainrot?

>>723311696
Is it just me who hears "...pika" when they attack?

>>723314672
>They don't fight for sport
they literally do in Karmelita's dream fight

>>723309579
wat happon???

Wtf is the karmelita boss? She hits for 4 damage, input reads and teleports across the arena when you try to heal. Utter garbage.

>>723312545
Calm down, Woollie.

I'm at lace 2, and im just bored of the game. act 2 was too big and unrewarding, esp on the second half

Still seems strong to me, I don't know why you'd use anything other than Pale Nails though

>>723315083
First tried her by just sitting on a wall with ascendant's grip and coming down to pogo. You can also pogo on the spikes she creates btw. She has no counter to this tactic and I just lucked out into it by trying to play as safe as possible.

>>723315189
Yeah, Pale Nails are still good, they're only a bit weaker now that the Shaman crest got nerfed from +50% to +40% silk damage.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, when the devs start making changes that show they're clearly upset that their game is actually beatable without the intended level of suffering, it never turns out well. See: Darkest Dungeon getting ruined over several years of patches as the devs got increasingly mad at people finding strats to consistently keep their A-teams alive. Single player games are ultimately a puzzle to be solved and you can assume your players will solve it, and devs who think this is a problem invariably ruin things by trying to make the puzzle impossible (which ruins the fun).

>walled at boss gauntlet that ends with the two giant cockroaches with hammers
>take 2-3 day break
>come back and 1 shot the gauntlet, ending fight having used zero tools and zero silk skills
>had like 80% of my silk left too

>>723307619
>souls out of nowhere
>retarded opinion
every time

How the hell do I get the Curvesickle upgrade? I heard that you can get it in act 3. I checked the target room and found a little ant, but it burrows into the ground and disappears when I get close. I've tried playing the Needolin, waiting, finding a hidden passage, hitting all four targets with the boomerang, nothing. What am I missing? Stupid room has had me confused for the whole playthrough.

>>723315595
Use the boomerang on the targets

>>723315220
Yeah for me she just spams this sonic move 6 times in a row. It seems rng based.

>>723315398
Sleeping on it is the best way to overcome a lot of shit in life desu

>>723302017 (OP)
Full video breakdown on why thread storm is dead storm:
https://youtu.be/md6g33Sjru0?si=8tYU_KJcuoL1BmLX

>>723315337
It's disheartening to see. Same thing happened to Ender Magnolia, and it sucked then too.

I mean, the devs put 227(?) damage Thread Storm in the game. What were they expecting?

>>723315595
You need to hit all the targets with one boomerang toss.

>>723315631
I DID! I hit all four targets with one throw multiple times and nothing happened. What the hell else could it be?

>>723316313
The whole thread is talking about this video, slowpoke-san.

>>723316331
Thread Storm was probably one of the earliest abilities they implemented due to it being Hornet's iconic move from her boss fight in HK, and then they likely forgot about its numbers while tuning Volt Filament and Shaman Crest, and the fact that it can be extended also meant that these buffs essentially applied twice, which was another oversight.

>>723302017 (OP)
>nerf shit that's barely overpowered relative to other things in its class while leaving in extremely powerful things in other classes [OP Red tools]
Sick of Team Cherry doing this shit. This is like when they nerfed the fucking shit out of Flukenest and didn't touch the damage values of Unbreakable Strength or the speed of Quick Slash for years even though spell builds already had worse DPS then nail builds.

>>723302979
Why? I think Team Cherry sucks at balancing but why can't developers touch the game they made?

>>723303038
>>723310906
Personally I went straight to Hunter's Marsh without touching Deep Docks right after Bell Beast and I got Shakra there

>>723304183
>buffing the best crest in the game and nerfing the worst crest in the game
What the fuck

>>723302979
They are preparing everything for Godhome
Tools will get fucked as well

>>723317078
>worst crest
thats not Beast

>>723315337
>2025
>Still whining about Darkest Dungeon not letting you cheese the game
lol

>>723316843
Team Cherry is only nerfing what speedtrannies use and none of them bother with red tools at all as they need shard farming and that's a huge time loss.

>>723310074
Inkling guy didn't strike me as mad, and I don't think the guy that called him a retard thought he was mad either. You might have autism.

>>723317148
Correct, Beast is not the worst crest, that would be Reaper

>>723306541
>Shaman had a silk skill damage bonus?
Nigga wtf, that's literally the whole point of the crest
It says so right there on the crest menu : increased silk powers

>>723317148
Beast is awesome are you kidding

>>723308934
>me, pretending to understand any of this
IT'S OVER BROS!!!! SILKSONG IS LE RUINED!!

>>723317182
That's really stupid, who cares what speedrunners do? They're less then 1% of the playerbase and what works in a speedrun usually isn't even representative of what's overpowered in normal gameplay

>>723314873
Why do you care if you're not a speedrunner? You're not skilled enough to notice any difference.

Beastfly isn't even that bad, early game or not. I found the Chef with a huge ass 10x more annoying and yet see few complaints about that cunt.

>>723317479
>who cares what speedrunners do? They're less then 1% of the playerbase
But they're all you see when you type Silksong on YouTube, so that matters for the public image, Team Cherry doesn't want people going "oh this game is ass he's only spamming this wavy ability the whole time".

>>723317523
If a skill is substantially nerfed because in the extremely constrained context of a speedrun it's overpowered you don't need to be incredibly good at the game to notice the skill being substantially nerfed

>>723317607
Team Cherry already alienated half of Hollow Knight's audience by making the game slightly more challenging so I don't see why they would care about alienating people stupid enough that they think a game's combat sucks because they saw someone online doing a super specific cheese strat

dont mind me, just making the dream moveset
>hunter moveset+passive
>witch charge attack except not nerfed to death compared to cyclone slash ft. building up your passive with every hit
>sharpdart
>cross stitch
>thread storm

>scuttlebrace except you get it earlier so you actually have time to get used to it
>pin badge
>longclaw
>volt filaments

>>723317479
I wonder how many people here swapped their spell for Thread Storm when they realised it did like double the damage of any other ability

>>723317568
He doesn't do much and attacks are predictable and clean. Beastfly mixes up charges and trajectories and enemies can make a shitty pattern that is hard to escape cleanly. Also easy to get contact dmg. By the time you get to Chef you have a shit ton of tools and personal skill.

>>723317656
Basically, as a casul gaymer all you need to know is that Thread Storm's follow up now only does like 6 damage at max needle level, so it's never worth it, just pretend that Thread Storm cannot be extended anymore. Everything else is more or less the same, you won't notice any big changes.

>>723317656
its overpowered for everybody nigga it dealt like 200 damage

>>723317760
>scuttlebrace
>can't downward dash
no thanks

>>723317770
>>723317795
>>723317807
For the record I'm talking about the general Shaman nerf

>>723317948
The Shaman nerf is just -10% damage, it doesn't matter.

>>723317874
i beat the whole game before finding out you can use downward dash

>>723317948
10% boo-hoo, the main point of the crest is having 3 available spells at once so anything on top is already a bonus, it's not like Architect does extra damage with Tools (as far as I know)

>>723317948
>>723317994
>my crest is... 6.666% weaker on its special attacks?
>owari da

>>723317994
It's -10% to the damage multiplier on silk skills for what's already the worst crest in the game.

>>723318074
architect kind of lets you spam ridiculous ammounts of lifeblood, overdose with it, and regenerate as many tools as you want

>>723317948
It literally doesn't matter to you. You're not a speedrunner trying to shave off 0.5 seconds off a kill.

For the four big act 3 bosses, can I do them in any order if I want the green poof's heart on display in my bellhome? If I have all four when I turn them in at the snail shack, it takes the main ones and leaves the heart right?

>>723304886
>It's hilarious how "PLAY THE GAME HOW WE WANT YOU TO PLAY" they are
obviously they would be. What do you think game designers do?

>>723318207
But I have even less reason to use it over wanderer now. And that goes for every single crest since beast onwards

>>723318282
You only lose the clover heart if you don't have the 3 designated objective hearts when you turn them in. If you want to keep a different heart, you save that boss until after you turn in the hearts.

>>723317770
I've been using Shaman Crest ever since I got it, and beat Tormented Trobbio last night. My favourite spell is Rune Rage, but I had Pale Nails equipped too, and I've been trying to learn Cross Stitch properly. I eventually got sick of Trobbio's RNG bullshit and switched to Thread Storm to see what the difference was, and yeah it kinda shredded him.

>>723317568
Beastfly has adds and the second version has lava.
Chef Lugoli is a lot more predictable

>>723318476
But by that point you can clawline the fuck out of it and shred it to pieces with pogos

>>723317994
50% is such a nice, round number though. Easier to calc in your head too. Shaman Crest nerf is annoying because it's one of those things that was done for the devs' own satisfaction, rather than any sort of balance. Too small to matter to most people, fucks over speedrunners, but annoying because nerfs are never fun.

>>723302979
Chew slower

>>723318176
Playing around lifeblood is planning to lose, I'm not a big tool user but I don't think any of them are better than spells other than Cogflies and Tacks which don't require you to think

>>723318405
Wanderer is pretty crap now, if you want to melee you use Hunter

I want to GARAMA inside Hornet's SHAW.

>>723302664
Yes. Some stuff pretty hard. You mention flukenest; it went through multiple extreme balance changes. And another notable one is making quick slash take up an extra charm notch.

>>723318747
I don't understand why they buffed Hunter. It already had the best moveset and a good tool slot selection so this just seems overkill

>>723317078
Hunter's damage was actual garbage. You had to have full focus just to have charge attack damage comparable to architect and wanderer.

>>723302664
>Flukenest
There's a YT video explaining all the nerfs and changes to Flukenest in HK. Ultimately TC was never able to properly fix that spell so even in its last iteration it's completely broken.

>>723318747
>planning to lose
its hard to argue with having up to 30 health for free, or just having free passive regen if you prefer that

>>723318889
>why they buffed Hunter
shortest range in the game, 45 angle pogo

I need DLC NOW or else

>>723302979
The thread storm did need a nerf, it pretty much rendered the rest of the skills situational at best. It was by far the strongest silk skill with insane dps, just be vaguely near the boss, mash the button, repeat 4-5 times, the boss dies.

>>723318938
flukenest is fine as it is, for normal play its still worse than the normal spell if youre very good at landing multihits with the blast
its only particulary good for speedrunning because you can place it before the enemy spawns or lands

>>723318938
Eh, it went from a brainless but extremely overpowered spell to something that's basically useless without a glitch that requires quite a bit of finesse to squeeze the juice out of. You really need to know how the bosses move

>>723318889
Probably because Wanderer was better without any requirements, you should be rewarded for not getting hit, it and Barbed Bracelet are going to be absolutely impossible to balance around if they introduce Radiant bosses though

>>723319058
i trust they will go for more interesting gimmicks than radiant this time around

>>723319151
even if they do it's guaranteed there'll be an official no damage mode

>>723319151
Whatever they could go with everyone would decide that it'd be more impressive to do it hitless

>>723315189
I like how for this fight, I had an anime like movement. I spent the entire game trying to go as fast as I could, and suddently, at the end, I see that I was wasting so much energy and movement.
I started moving less, and less and less, until it became efortless to dodge her. Very cool moment.

Silk Mom did nothing wrong.

>>723317607
That wavy thing is very late game though

>>723309806
Why not?

>>723319262
This happened to me with punished trobbio. The less unnecessary dashes and movement, the easier I could react to his bullshit. Eventually I was just tapping left, right, and jumping Haere and there and barely moved at all.

>steel soul mode
>shit i need to actually go explore a new area and fight enemies

>>*go to the top of the citadel*
>>*farm grand reeds*
>>*buy 30 shard pouches*
>>*restock lifeblood*
>>*equip architect with enough cogflies and throwables to clear the pantheon of hallownest*
i beat the game

>>723319058
I think the solution is going to be adding the bindings from the pantheons to the Hall of Gods so just doing radiant without restrictions is no longer the highest mark you can get

>>723319365
You get Thread Storm in Greymoor above the Craw Lake.

>>723319262
This, once I realized I was setting myself up for failure with the constant dashing, trying to avoid the hell that's on my screen I just took it slow and won easily. Fun boss even though story wise Lace wasn't all that great.

Okay what the fuck, I went back to the ant target room and tried hitting the targets with the surveclaw again, and it worked the first time. What the fuck did I do differently this time???

>>723319423
I'd hope not, I consider P5 with all bindings more impressive and I haven't done it, at least with Radiant bosses you can just keep trying that one boss until you get the mark, you don't have to sit through a shitload of timewasting

>>723317523
>Thread storm no longer deals any damage while extended
This is immediately noticeable to everyone playing the game

>>723302017 (OP)
>nerfed the very strong silk skills
>wanderer still not nerfed for outperforming everything with a one button spam, outside architect
>reaper still in the shitter
>beast still has butchered crest slots
They don't try to balance the game, they just nerf whatever the speedrunners are abusing.

>>723319593
I do think the "your nail does barely any damage" binding is kind of lame but the rest are fine

>the AoE spell has the highest single target damage in the game
>people are surprised and offended when it gets nerfed

Are they going to nerf the crab enemies in Pharloom Bay?

All the Pale King had to do was fuck the Silk Goddess instead of the Tree Goddess, he would've won then.

>>723319442
I thought you were talking about shaman + volt. I mean, thread storm is or I guess was, very strong from the get go, but the first time you take it, its easy to get hit while trying to make it full lenght and you have to be really close and stay still, while spear still hits hard enough and is very easy to land. It seems like a logical progresion, because its hard to notice exactly how much damage its doing. This is definetly an end game / multiple playthrough kind of thing.
I'm not sure I like the damage on skills being so similar. At least storm and rage should do way more dmg than the rest just because they are harder to land, and forces you to stand still.

>>723319652
Wanderer is indirectly nerfed through the Hunter buff
Regarding Reaper I think it's supposed to be shit for some reason. I thought it was to punish you for using the crest with the easy pogo but Wanderer has an even easier pogo but gets to be powerful so it doesn't make any sense

>>723318919
They could buff Hunter's damage another 5 times in a row and it's usage stats still won't be where they want them. People don't drop the Hunter crest because of its damage. They drop it because it's pogo sucks ass and it's silk generation is mid.

>>723319704
Hornet in a bikini at Pharloom Bay.

>>723319682
That is the worst one and it's the only one you can't practice with beyond never upgrading in the first place, no Charms is gay too but mostly because it just reduces your Nail damage even more

>>723319787
>its pogo sucks ass
How so? It's one of the easier and more versatile ones

>>723302017 (OP)
The spear skill is better anyway.

Why nerf Rune Rage when it's the worst spell in the game?

>>723302979
This 100%, even further though, if its not in a competitive game nerfs are faggot shit.

I wonder if they're going to try to get Silk Soul mode into the game as a DLC or if that's been totally trashed

>>723319787
No, they drop it because they're retards who can't adapt to the game.

>>723319787
>They drop it because it's pogo sucks ass
It takes most people 5 minutes in that infamous platforming stage in the ant zone with these 5 red buds. Once you manage that, you learned how to pogo with hunter.
>silk generation is mid
You are legit retarded. Hunter's silk regen is just fine. It has the normal attack speed.

>>723319582
I think you have to watch the NPC do it first, instead of being a guide faggot trying to force it.

>>723319852
The diagonal is very clunky and robs you of way more opportunities that it gives you, it's a huge nerf to your aerial DPS. You're gonna cope about this and then when I remind you of how much better Wanderer is you're gonna tell me I didn't beat the game

>>723319984
KEKW

>>723319852
How is it versatile? Beast is probably the only one worse in how it forces you to position

>>723320037
>shitter cope.txt
embarrassing

>>723320114
Right on cue.

>>723319995
>Highest DPS of all the crests when binding
>Can basically forever upkeep your bind because the buff ups your attack speed
>Don't need to dodge because you're healing through htiting anyway
>"B-b-but the pogo is bad"
Then switch out for exploration

>>723319995
To be fair every boss goes down fast if you know the patterns well enough to facetank them and not take any damage

>>723319984
>Overshoots
>Undershoots
>Gives up
What drives a man to never try?

>>723320037
The DPS sucks but the movement with it is so fun I don't care
Nah if the developers let you use something you beat the game. That's on the developers not the player. Other replier is not me and also a faggot

>>723319984
How the fuck do you get to Red Memory and never learn how to pogo?

>>723320147
>switching out
Gay, you pick a crest and you stick with it

>>723320278
I kneel

>>723319787
>People don't drop the Hunter crest because of its damage.
I did. Or rather, I used architect a lot more than I otherwise would have. Hunter is my favorite crest when it comes to moveset and tool slots. But it felt bad knowing that all its gimmick afforded you was barely keeping pace with other crests that didn't require you to never get hit.

>>723319682
It’s honestly not bad since you can practice all the fights thanks to Radiant Health Boosts. Generally the HP boosts cover everything all four bindings cover.
The only bosses that truly will fuck you over because you can’t practice them properly would be Collector and Absolute Radiance because of Aspids and AR being AR.

>>723320147
>>"B-b-but the pogo is bad"
Deboonked

>>723310678
i dont watch speedtrannies and never will, but i am 99% sure you need to actually upgrade your tools for them to be better than silk which means going out of your way instead of following the predetermined route. dont kid yourself, spamming tools will always be infinitely easier and stronger than silk

>>723320278
Now do a platforming section that actually demands the pogo.

>>723320416
>>723320398

>>723320278
Fucking impressive.

Why is TC so mad about the players' DPS in this game? Bro, like 2/3rds of the bosses in the gamer are just blobs that charge you while summoning adds. The actual fun bosses require practice to learn the thread storm windows anyway. Even with volt filament pale nails you're gonna need like 10+ attempts on Lost Lace to learn her attack spacings. What, are you that mad that Lost Lace took Fireborn only 20 tries instead of 50 tries? Unironically get over yourselves guys.

>>723320416
Name one and I'll do it, hold on I have the Slab Mask bit somewhere too

>>723320278
>>723320398
Beastfags scare me. They're too good at this game.

>>723320592
Beast and Witch are the best crests if you're good at the game.

>>723320475
but what if the player accidentally thread storms through one of savage beastfly 2's phases and doesn't get see all the hard work the devs put into its moveset, wouldn't that be sad?

>>723305736
Horny took everything from her...

>>723320592
I was hoping with how much people loved the modded skins in Hollow Knight they'd add some to Silksong but I guess it wasn't meant to be. I think some palette swaps for the cloak color would have been cool at least

>>723320532
How about that room in the Slab where you need to pogo on a moving thingie to get a mask shard. That one's easily the hardest pogo challenge in the game.

>>723320037
>muh dps
How did this mmo shit make its way into discussion about a metroidvania?

>>723320835
Autism basically

>>723302017 (OP)
shaman crest + threadstorm + filament is a fucking stupid combo, arguably more OP than architect while also not requiring any farming. It needed nerfs.

filament+weavelight and shamans ez mode moveset allowed you to safely generate silk to send skills constantly dealing absurd dps, if you get hit while using shaman its because you're retarded and you're probably better suited for wanderer/beast

if you want to be true retard ezmode you could just run around like a bitchmade pussy spamming pale nails and never actively engage the boss because weavelight auto gens up to 4 silk for skills

>>723320835
Reminder that Silksong is a search action game not a Metroidvania.

>>723320532
I was thinking of the cogwork core upper part.
>>723320456
>>723320398
Ok that looks nice. Was that in day 1 version where you could do that downwards float thing? The movements look a bit too abrupt, nice job either way.

>>723302979
tpbp
i should be allowed to get a full refund if the devs change something post-release that makes the game less enjoyable and i'm not kidding

what happened to
>let the players make their own fun?
if people are too retarded in a way thats fun to them why am i getting punished by radical nerfs

>>723320398
That's my webm, the pogo IS bad, so is the dash

>>723320814
I just said that one, it's really not that impressive, I think they didn't want you to have double jump or Clawline when you did it and I divebomb into the thing, I guess I could go back and try to resist double jumping

>>723320532
The Mount Fay platforming challenge without using the double jump.

How the fuck am I supposed to complete this journal?

>>723319995
you could literally do the same thing with wanderer or hunter except with triple room for error

>>723320880
>shamans ez mode moveset allowed you to safely generate silk
Shaman crest is -20% attack speed, same as Reaper but no silk orb crutch, so its silk generation is actually the absolute worst in the game. Hence many people slotting in Weavelight to cast spells basically for free, but you will never have enough to heal.

>>723320962
Agree for consoles but technically on Steam at least there's ways to downgrade your games

>>723320962
skill issue cope more

>>723319779
How does that prevent Wanderer to brute force everything through pure facetanking in the game with a one button spam?

>>723320968
BASED

>>723302017 (OP)
>speedrunner trannies ruin everything again
honestly dont even know who to hate on at this point, the devs for being retarded or the retards that follow them

>>723321082
It doesn't it's extremely overpowered I'm just guessing that Team Cherry thinks buffing the damage on other crests somehow makes it not insane

>>723319779
>Wanderer is indirectly nerfed through the Hunter buff

?
Retard.

>thread storm nerfed
Nukebros... it's our turn...

>>723321159
The developers essentially are speedtroons, hence the achievements and the pantheons recording your completion time

>>723302017 (OP)
Instead of making 3/4th of the useless 'bosses' interesting, this is what they do.

>>723320974
Ok but I think that one is mostly Clawline anyways

>>723321268
So that's why gms is so badly tuned.
Is that why so many bosses of act 3 are so bad too?

>>723320270
maybe he was using some other crest all game

actually I dont know if red memory forces you to use hunter

>>723321306
>Instead of reworking the entirety of act 3 they change some number values
Whoa

>>723321268
Are Resident Evil devs speedtroons too? lmao

Speedrunning (called TIME ATTACK back in the 90's) is much older than you zoom-zoom

>>723321475
>I dont know if red memory forces you to use hunter
It does

>>723321185
>buffing the damage on other crests
>in the very same patch where shaman was nerfed

>>723320592
>Architect
>Not fat
/v/ lied to me...

>>723321159
I don't think speedtrannies are the primary focus. Was there any speedrun that used flintslate architect charge attacks? I don't think so, but they nerfed that.
They just don't want anything that completely trivializes the game, either in part or in whole. It just so happens that speedtrannies discover and popularize most of the things that do that.

>>723321018
the range makes a great difference, it lets you attack more often
and remember you can come into fights with a full silk spool

>>723320974
I can't do it, none of my autosaves are from before Fay Cloak and they removed the override for glide so I can't even not press the button

>>723320835
When they nerfed the fuck out of your damage relative to the first game in an extremely noticeable way. Up until you get Clawline, going from Hollow Knight to Silksong is like fighting with both your legs chopped off. Hornet is literally a cripple compared to the Knight's combat potential.

>>723302979
if one skill is better than any other, why would you even consider using anything else?
this shit is needed to make it more balanced

>>723322294
That's exactly the issue with ss though, everything is underpowered.There's not enough good options to pick from and now there's even less.

>>723313437
only one skill was broken and was therefor made weaker.
the follow up being nerfed to oblivion was probably too harsh and i hope they fix this in the next patch

>>723322002
Do the upper Cogwork Core then.

>>723322395
but they did buff other SS that weren't as good though.
thread storm was just too good that you didn't even want to play with anything else

>>723322103
Completely irrelevant. Talking about dps in a game with intermittent openings for attack is retarded and that's all there is to it.

>>723322002
Beastbros...

>>723322504
>beast with fractured mask
They really need to give beast a blue slot.

>>723309901
what the, beast let's you heal up to 5 health after silkbinding if you hit the enemy? why even use reaper?

>>723322875
I watched the entire clip and nowhere did he heal more then 3. Where did you get 5 from?

>>723302017 (OP)
So like is Architect in that "It's extremely broken, but it's skating underneath other broken setups" category? Because the silk skills don't matter and the whole broken Plasmium/Cogfly/Tacks thing is still intact.

>>723323239
Architect can nuke everything but you have to grind after a while.

>New Patch
>No DLC news
>No Boss rush mode
bros.........................................................................

>>723322504
I hope I was allowed to double jump here or I'll have to do it again

>>723322652
I have an Act 2 start save, what do I have to do to get Clawline and access to the Slab again

>>723323339
not that bad if you just buy a lot of shard bundles

>>723323239
Architect is the shitter "farm to win" crest, it doesn't matter, no speedrunner or boss no-hitter will ever use it.

>>723322516
This isn't Elden Ring, bro. The goal is to exploit your movement and weapons to put as constant damage into the boss as possible. If you content yourself with waiting your turn, you're doing it wrong. DPS is very much relevant.

>>723323470
Do you use any crests besides Beast?

>>723323239
>Because the silk skills don't matter
They're stronger than tools. Both in raw damage and being infinitely replenishable.
And plasmium's strength is intentional. There were two infinite healing platforming cheese setups in HK. That's this game's. But if you can survive combat without it, then it's completely useless and you'd be better off with something else.

>>723323470
Very cool and clean, but you did kinda skip a lot lol

Can you explain how the Beast pogo works exactly? From what I gathered it takes a bit for it to gain a hitbox, so you have to do it from a certain distance, and it's almost horizontal, right?

>>723323423
they'll first remove all the fun before adding more tedious dogshit

>>723323545
I did first playthrough Wanderer and then 2nd Soul Steel as Wanderer again until I beat Silk for the 5 hour speedrun, then went back for Beast and stuck with it for the 100% 30 hour speedrun for shits and giggles, I've beaten Lost Lace with every other crest (apart from Architect)

>>723323639
Would it be more impressive if I didn't skip anything

Gooning inside my Bellhome.

>>723323470
it's funny
you could use the sprint button to climb walls, but is anyone even doing that?
i just jump up the wall everytime

>>723302017 (OP)
Don't care, I already beat and 100%'d the game anyway. Does thread storm still kill flying enemies? If so then it's still doing its job.

>>723323638
I wonder how hard Team Cherry was malding in the background when they saw players equipping Hiveblood for Path of Pain on stream
>What the fuck bro the streamer only took 4 hours to beat this level, this is bullshit, it should have taken 20!
That's honestly kind of cringe to know that's undoubtedly what was going on behind the scenes.

>>723323748
together with Lace

>>723323764
You can cut a jump short to only move a little bit, not sure if you can do that with the dash

>>723323535
Nigger, there are multiple bosses that outright block repeated attacks or even teleport away. And almost no enemies in the game allow for uninterrupted attack spam without repositioning. Which means dps is completely meaningless.
Go shit up a wow or final fantasy thread.

>>723323875
So true AGPsis.

>>723323863
I don't think they were malding at all, Path of Pain has infinite soul reserves are practically every respawn point. If anything they'd be confused why you'd go for the slow regen when you can get infinite heals for faster.

>>723323863
I hate path of pain because the first time doing it takes forever and the music is the kind that gets fucking grating after 30 seconds

>>723323863
>the streamer only took 4 hours to beat this level
Wtf kind of streamers are you watching? Even chuubas only took 2 and a half hours to beat PoP
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oL3zPN2fddw

not my problem

>>723323863
Anon, path of pain has infinite soul totems. Hiveblood is actually shit there. And they made this game's hiveblood better by letting it heal more than one mask (kind of necessary with all the 2x damage). So they clearly did not think it was too strong or made things too easy.

>>723323921
Youre massively exaggerating how many bosses in the game actually behave that way and saying "erm this doesn't count as dps because you occasionally have to dodge" is retarded. Stop being stupid and bad at the game.

>>723308934
Sharpdart bros, we are so back

>>723323921
nta but dps is obviously relevant when the boss's opening is more than one attack long, which is true in most cases
that said in my experience shakra for example was much easier with reaper (low dps) than wanderer (high dps) because her openings are one hit and range matters a lot for parries

If you picked blue for your bell home you didn't beat the game.

>>723309901
Spamming cogfly and taks would be faster and easier than this btw.

>>723324435
>he didn't use clawline for Shakra
lrn2play

>>723324501
Prove it

>>723324459
It just makes sense. Hornet is red and she lives in a blue home.

>>723302664
Yeah, each DLC added more QoL stuff too to make the game easier

Post ideas for dlc tools and silk skills.

>>723324674
It's literally just the dream gate and I hate how it uses essence EACH TIME which activates my autism, so I don't use it.

>>723302017 (OP)
So what's the point in making the late game, last to unlock Crest dogshit? Do they really want people to ONLY use Wanderer or Architect?

>>723324229
>there are multiple
>you're massively exaggerating
Oh really, so there's no more than one?
>you occasionally have to dodge
What fucking game did you play? Basically every enemy ignores your attacks and will attack right through them. Which means constantly having to get out of the way and therefore not just standing there and mashing attack.
>>723324435
Being able to sneak in extra attacks more often is an advantage some crests have over others. But that's not fucking dps and describing it as such is retarded mmo brainrot.
Earlier in the thread someone pointed out that shaman crest is better at generating silk than its attack speed would indicate because of how much more frequently you're able to attack due to its range. And he was right.
So many other factors play in to how often you can land hits that dps as a concept is just completely inappropriate for discussing this game.

>>723302017 (OP)
>cogflies
>in rare cases, having their active quantity reduced by 1
>rare
Kek.

I'd need more than two hands to count the amount of times that's happened. Even lost more than one a few times on a screen transition.

>>723325037
>10% damage reaction
>OMG it's over it's dogshit now
bitch please

>>723325037
>6.66% less damage
>IT'S DOGSHIT!!!
Why is /v/ so histrionic?

>>723302979
Trvke.
Single player games shouldn't get patches other than bugfixes.

>>723325150
>>723325171
Delusional trannies. The crest was already underpowered for anything but a singular speedrunner strat. It needed no nerfs.

>>723325150
>>723325171
It already wasn't very good, so nerfing it further does make it dogshit, yes.

>>723325150
>Worst bind in the game
>No yellow slots
>No extra blue slots to make up for this
Yeah it's dogshit, and they're nerfing the fun part.

>>723325557
With this trajectory by the time godhome is added hunter, wanderer, and architect are going to be the only usable crests in the game

thread storm was not meant to be a burst damage skill, it was meant to be an aoe damage skill against numerous or evasive enemies
people using it for burst damage in lieu of anything else is why it was nerfed to be more in line with its original intent

>>723324587
I beat her a little faster than this using poison tools, that beast build took more skill. Meanwhile vid related beat the boss around the same time while dicking around for plasma heal.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpBw_qj90Kw

>>723325750
Architect will be useless in a boss rush, you'll blow your load on one or two bosses, then what?
Hunter will be the meta due to the highest DPS if you don't get hit. Wanderer will be the training wheels crest, high silk generation means a lot of margin for error.

>>723325813
I'm fine with the nerf, but the extension basically deals no damage now and you'll never use it, so basically an extra mechanic was just removed from the game and that's lame.

>>723326084
>Architect will be useless in a boss rush, you'll blow your load on one or two bosses, then what?
Consider the benches in Pantheon 5, each bench would be a recharge and you can just save your load for the actually difficult bosses since most are pretty easy

>>723326434
I doubt they're gonna give you infinite shards for the pantheons, I think it will be just 800 for the whole run, but since it's le dream it will go back to 800 when you die.

>>723326607
I could see a big shard rock thing like the lifeblood pods in godhome

>>723326689
Considering it's likely Steel based and the Steel robot lady gives you an evergrowing Shard it's possible

>>723326084
>added versatility of an extra red slot for people who only use silk to heal
>more control over rate of tool spam with alternate bind
>chunky easy to use hitboxes
>still the best charge attack even after nerfs
It's not going to be the speedtranny's or no hit autist's crest of choice. But architect will still be good for normal people.

>>723324010
???

>>723327085
But anon, doing this would mean that you did not beat the game.

>>723323639
There I went the whole way, now are you ready to accept the Beast crest as your Lord and Saviour

>>723327276
>Skipped enemies
>You didn't beat the challenge
BeastGOD I KNEEL

>>723326790
Near the end of Act 3, just mopping up before going back to the abyss, where is this? Haven't seen this lady

>>723328065
She's Steel Soul only, not sure why they hid lore and a boss within it but they'll probably add it to the basegame at some point

>>723327065
architect's pogo is so unbelievably bad that it makes all of these points irrelevant

>>723319423
>adding the bindings from the pantheons to the Hall of Gods
OH GOD NO
Fuck no that'd be awful. Fuck you for even thinking this and possibly willing it into existence, oh my god.

>>723328520
It is probably the worst in the game. But a boss rush wouldn't have much pogo'ing anyway. Barring any other boss overhauls wouldn't beastfly 2 and nyleth be the only issues?

Only I have correct opinions about this game.

>>723328835
i don't know, i used the pogo a lot for most bosses and not having it made my whole style fall apart
t. wanderershitter who tried to cheese karmelita with architect tool spam and quickly gave up

>>723328835
>boss rush wouldn't have much pogo'ing
Wtf, you pogo on the bosses all the time in this game, it's free damage during their attacks

>>723318207
In a game like Silksong doing 10% less damage can mean the difference between killing a boss and getting hit several more times and dying, the boss is going to live longer.

>>723315189
Second time I've seen someone who executes the fight well never pogo the dashes. Am I missing something here? I understand not doing it on the 2nd dash because her final attack might be the uppercut so it isn't safe, but dash 1 has always been 100% safe to pogo for me.
Is there some technical reason related to manipulating her movement/ability choices?

have they nerfed witch crest yet? its hilariously OP.

>>723306115
>>723306115
>>723313050
Not going to say the nerf was warranted but shaman has no issues spamming skills late game, three silk regens + fast silk regen trinket(adds an extra silk regen which it doesnt say it does) means you can literally just spam spells with little cooldown. Its certainly not as weak as you all are saying it is.

>Hunter buffed after the playerbase took DPS measurements and dicovered that max focus barely outpaces Wanderer
Suspicious.

>>723329215
What was the first time you saw it

>>723328320
No, it's meant to be Steel Soul exclusive just like in the first game, which also had a steel NPC appearing only in this mode.

>>723329378
>>723328320
They should lock the City of Steel DLC behind Steel Soul completion?

>>723328667
If you put all bindings on you fight the bosses naked. Make it happen Team Cherry!

>>723320398
>this webm exists because i dared beastchad to do it as a random throwaway shitpost
nice

>>723329378
Didn't he only eat the eggs which were useless otherwise, there wasn't a quest or boss with it

>>723308132
Zamm shaman crest was so bad speedrunners used it exclusively the second they get it

>>723320968
>I think they didn't want you to have double Jump or Clawline when you did it
nah, that room requires key of the apostate which is found in putrified ducts, which either means you clear bilewater or memorium. Those are both intended to be double jump areas even if people found ways around that.

>>723309226
It isnt. Its just cheesey and boring

>>723302017 (OP)
balance changes like this in a singleplayer game are extremely gay, especially because it's due to speedtrannies
but i'm probably never replaying this game due to how abhorrently shit act 3 was so i don't really care

>>723329875
>game bad act 3 too hard
your opinion on balance changes is worthless, shitter-kun

pirate chads win again

>>723329118
You can, but you don't have to the way it's mandatory in platforming sections. And it's not like architect has no pogo at all. It's just the most awkward one.
You can also just use the drill.

>>723330085
Tools are gonna be so hard to use in a boss rush without architect
You only have so much before a bench

>>723329309
some thread yesterday

>>723329993
it wasn't hard though
it was just stupid and tedious to do every gay little fetch quest to get there because they couldn't be assed to make all that completable in act 3 and then act 3 itself was just a bunch of lazy rehashes and cut content
kill yourself btw

>>723308934
>nerfed literally everything besides the most boring skills
lmao

>>723330520
Well maybe it was also me, I don't know why I don't pogo it, it just doesn't come natural

I'm still debating whether to keep Crust King or Ant Queen's heart as a memento, any videos showing them off?

>>723320592
>Witch hat with tentacle "hair"
>Reaper gets a cool scythe
>Turbo awoo mode beast
>Wanderer just has a bowl shoved on Hornet's head

>>723308934
That's a shame. As someone who had beaten the game first with Witch Crest heal nuking, I was looking forward to applying that to Thread Storm after learning it out damages it by mashing the button and using void filament.
I guess there's no reason to bother with it now or the shaman crest.

>>723327085
Yes and if a game is bad I can just not play it I guess. I'm still going to criticize the music choice, it's a good song but a terrible selection for a difficult platforming gauntlet and putting it in the Path of Pain cheapens the song.

>>723330946
ah that's the one
hunter is more understandable because the trail she leaves changes some calcs
also you execute this fight better than i do so who am i to judge

>>723302017 (OP)
>single player game
>balance patch
lmao
m
a
o

>>723329258
This. I beat Karmelita with it by spamming Pale Nails and dodging, hardly attacking with the needle at all. 3 silk hearts + weavelight's fourth and faster silk regen means more spells to sling.

>>723328667
It's coming along with brining the Radiant difficulty to the pantheons themselves! Have fun!

Wait, does Thread Storm deal lower damage than Witch bind with Multibinder and Claw Mirrors now?

I want new cloak colours. I want Mount Fay cloak. I want Bilewater Clock. I WANT PHARLOOM BACK.

>>723329482
I hope City of Steel is coming in DLC but considering Hollow Knight had "City of Tears" and Silksong had "City of Song" [Later renamed to The Citadel during development] I'm expecting "City of Steel" to be the big city location in the third game

>>723331006
No one knows what to do with wanderer because it's just the hollow knight moveset and not even its chapel has any sort of character. Throwing in a bunch of yellow tools like >>723322504 is about the best you can do.

>>723331006
It's a ronin straw hat, because "ronin" (a lordless samurai) literally means "wanderer". Basically it's a weeb joke.

>>723331006
It's a reference to Shiren the Wanderer

>>723320592
>>723331006
>>723331457
I don't dislike the ronin hat on her but my issue with that drawing (and reaper) in particular is the perspective makes no sense and the horns just no-clip through the headwear instead of there being holes for them (or forcefully pierced through by them)
Reaper's hood could possibly be an open back one, but that hat doesn't compute. It looks more like she's wearing a huge yam on her forehead.

For me, it's Wanderer.

>>723331798
Okay, maybe this one is more to your liking.

The beast "pogo" feels like they first made a spinning attack like sonic, noticed it was too good, and nerfed the shit out of it, making you vulnerable for the first part.
There's lots of moves in silksong that feel like "what if we took this regular move from other games and made it weaker". The divekick from the base moveset is clearly meant to have a bigger range but it just suddenly stops out of nowhere.

>>723307331
thread storm didn't leave you exposed at all though. It pushes every enemy and projectile away from you. I'd prefer they nerfed that aspect instead of the damage.

>>723331967
Or this one.

>>723319262
That happened to me when getting the Twisted Child ending.
I eventually realized that I just didn't need to move 90% of the time.

When are we getting the True Crest

>>723332256
There's a glitch that lets you escape this cutscene and keep the crest, it gives you an infinite silk bar, but the masks are glitchy and do not update when you take damage.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k8J3-wk4GOo

it does feel stronger

>>723319262
This but instead of thinking it was cool I thought it was cringe and lame. The best bosses are like First Sinner where they reward aggression and movement.

>>723329225
It's balanced by the unfun move set.

>>723332574
still pissed they nerfed the architect charge attack
giga drill breaker will not be forgotten

>>723332670
It seemed fine to me not that I'd use it willingly, what is meant to be bad about it

>>723331431
She could dress up like a pilgrim and carry a bunch of rosaries.

>>723332670
Witch Crest is literally the most fun one.

>>723332824
Is there actually a point to the witch crest? It seems like the most nothing crest in the game
>Hunter: Default, well rounded
>Reaper: Steal silk from enemies, slower attacks but huge pogo
>Wanderer: Hollow Knight
>Beast: Aggressive style
>Architect: Tools
>Witch: ?????
>Shaman: Spells

>>723333240
Aggressive heal is the only thing going for it I think but I don't know if it does enough damage to justify spending the silk and you don't want to get hit in the first place, at least it has 3 blue slots

For me the only good fights were weaver and trobbio. How's it for you guys?

>>723333413
>Weaver
>Last Judge
>First Sinner
>Lace 2
>(Tormented) Trobbio
>Karmelita
These are all S tier fights.

I tried doing a sub 5hr run today and it was going pretty well. I only died to Widow and Moorwing twice each, which is good considering I've only fought them once before. I made it to Sinner's Road in about an hour and 10 minutes, and then I died 10 times in a row in Sinner's Road and The Mist. Now I've lost all momentum, and I will jump out my bedroom window head first if I die to another one of those shuriken throwing bugs again. I can't even make it to Phantom. I might just start a new game and go the Last Judge route.

>>723333240
great range and hitbox on attacks, bind is fun if often impractical, 3 blue sockets

>>723333530
Sinner's Road and The Mist are areas you pretty much have to take slowly so they aren't great for speedruns

>>723333530
>Get in bro, the water's great!
How do you respond?

>>723333681
Phantom is a lot easier than Last Judge though.

>>723333681
Last Judge route requires you to ring the bells in marrow, deep docks, greymoor, bellhart, and shellwood. It's slower but it'll depend on the player

>>723333409
the damage is amazing as long as you use the right tools. Claw Mirrors are downright silly with witch bind.

>>723333843
Just go Last Judge route

>>723333530
>moorwing
funnily enough it's genuinely faster to just get the fleas and skip him

>>723333963
I KNEEL

>>723333530
>I will jump out my bedroom window head first if I die to another one of those shuriken throwing bugs again
You can just swat their spikes back at them.
Unironically I found it faster to just get Wanderer ASAP with the Wormways key, the smoother platforming saves so much time, and it skips Moorwing while giving you a faster route through Shellwood.

I can't believe you guys are bitching about a -10% decrease for Shaman's Silk Skill damage + making Thread Storm not fucking dominate in damage. They even buffed other silk skills so the Shaman nerf isn't as bad as it looks at first glance. The only bad part is Thread Storm's extension being literally useless, so hopefully that gets a second pass.

For what purpose does Mooshka keep Kratt around when he provides nothing of value to the caravan?

>>723309901
That took way too long. I am pretty sure Wanderer and Hunter are much faster.

>>723333992
What, to me quitting when I got close to death, you'll kneel to anything apparently

>>723334064
He's a flea, and Mooshka cares about all fleas, even the shitheads

>>723334106
>Hunter

>>723333963
>same dates
anyway check out my degenerate sleep patterns

>>723334106
For what it's worth I didn't have the last Nail upgrade

>>723302979
Chew the steak slowly. Savor it!

>>723334136
can't wait until lace's game set 50 years in the future where we have to stop flea hitler from taking over the kingdom.

>>723302979
they hated Jesus for telling the truth
/thread

>>723333413
First Sinner and all 4 Old Heart fights I think are perfect, with Karmelita being my favorite of all.

Seth and Lace are solid. I really liked Silk even though she's too easy, wish she got the powered up final boss version instead of Lace. Also liked Chorus and the Bell Eater also easy, wish the game did more big dumb boss monsters but it's still a step up from HK which only had Raidance.

>>723334303
Mooshka will be dead by then.

>>723333240
It's Reaper. the crest has nothing going for it. It'd be cooler If its heavy blow's effect did more poise damage to bosses.

>>723302017 (OP)
here's an exhaustive list of things i care about:
1.) not whatever the fuck you're crying about, ever

>>723302017 (OP)
How big was the threadstorm nerf ?

>>723334463
Reaper is my favorite. It's weaker but collecting orbs to spam more silk skills is a FUN mechanic if not the best DPS because you have to consider collecting them whole the boss is filling the screen with bullshit. That plus the giant pogo and the dragon punch are too much fun.

>>723334034
Yeah idk, I messed around a bit post patch and while sharpdart feels slightly better, threadstorm still demolishes groups (and especially flying enemies) just as fast as it did before. The only thing it changes is threadstorm isn't also the best boss nuker in addition to everything it did before, which seems fair.

>>723334457
they're fleas bro, in 50 years they'll have gone through like 400 generations.

>>723334013
>You can just swat their spikes back at them
I already do this, but I keep fucking up in other ways too.
>Unironically I found it faster to just get Wanderer ASAP with the Wormways key, the smoother platforming saves so much time, and it skips Moorwing while giving you a faster route through Shellwood.
I might do this next time actually.

>>723333240
>Witch
The moveset is very good, it has the only charge attack that you can extend, the dash does two separate hits and you can build around the heal damage to make by far (now that threadstorm is nerfed) the best nuke in the game which deals over two hundred damage a hit.

>>723320962
>>let the players make their own fun?
I didn't know silksong was a sandbox game.

>>723330965
Did everyone just nail the Gay Prince's heart(s) to their wall or something?

>>723335021
If you beat all 4 before doing red memory the game decides to skip that one every time

>>723332071
But it doing that is part of its intended purpose of being good against crowds.

>>723330965
what exactly do you want from a video
it's literally just the inventory icon slapped onto your wall

>>723302017 (OP)
just nerf seth scores please

>>723333240
Really good moveset including one of the better charge attacks. And an offensively oriented heal. It's another aggro crest like beast, but with a more normal moveset (particularly the pogo) and better tool slots.

>>723302979
Devs are allowed to further refine their game post-release. Being a singleplayer game is irrelevant.

>>723302979
I agree. Especially in an already difficult game like Silksong it's retarded, and when they make dumb choices like nerfing the already weakest crest in the game.
They just make the game more limited and less fun.

>>723335161
I'm aware but I figured by now that at least one person had picked a different heart on their second, third, fourth playthrough etc

>>723335271
Each one has a distinct heart beat that you hear in your home for the rest of the game. Did you play the game yourself?

>>723320278
Is there an explanation why Hornet glows in the dark without needing a lantern?

>>723302017 (OP)
>got all collectibles

what am I missing bros?

>>723302017 (OP)
Good, the game was too easy, they need to nerf the player more and buff the enemies.

>>723335946
Did you bind Eva? Go visit her when you've used enough Memory Lockets and she'll let you bind her.

>>723335492
Well problem is I deleted the playthrough where I tried other hearts to test them because i needed saveslots for more playthroughs
I think the pollen heart is best (biggest contrast to the other mementos)
khann's heart looks the most like a regular memento badge
karmelita's heart is just a regular animal heart
can't give you screenshots because no access atm

>>723328320
>She's Steel Soul only
I thought steel soul was just a fancy name for "Ironman mode".

>>723335694
they make the same heart beat as they do in your fucking inventory moron

>>723335946
https://silksong-completion.info
thought i'm not 100% on its accuracy because i had it suggest i'm missing a memory locket that i already had

>>723336617
That's great nigger but if you pick them up to listen to them it's already too late to choose which one to keep.
I'm not sure why you're chimping out on me just because your parents/education system failed you. Go punch a wall or something instead.

>>723336595
It is, but in the first game the rancid eggs became useless since they're a death recovery mechanic so they added a steel npc to sell the eggs to. In SS they seem to have added an additional breadcrumb trail to hint at future steel related things.

>>723335946
https://tureptor.github.io/silksong-save-analyzer/

>>723328320
>not sure why they have content exclusive to alternate modes
>especially content themed after said mode
Yeah a real headscratcher.

>>723336595
It is but they added some new stuff to it because why not

>>723336867
That guy is added because silkeaters are otherwise useless on steel soul

>>723336849
That's retarded, just because she's made of Steel doesn't mean she has anything to do with a perma-death mode other than it happens to be named Steel Soul

>>723336957
Yes I know I just thought it was cool

>>723336769
You know you can roll your save back, right? It's a built in function of the game.
You could've tested it yourself in this time instead of begging like a thirdie dog.

>>723337069
>why are people discussing the video game in a video game thread
I was just interested in people's opinions on what heart they preferred. Again, not sure why you're chimping out. Do you go to a party and start screaming when people are talking and listening to music? Just turn off the screen if it bothers you, go to sleep or something bro.

ZANZIBOOOOOOOO

>>723337061
>That's retarded, just because she's made of Steel doesn't mean she has anything to do with a perma-death mode other than it happens to be named Steel Soul
This reads like it's sarcasm.
>Why is this steel creature named Steel Seer exclusive to Steel Soul mode

>>723337198
ENTUMA SHISHIN

>>723336769
you could have spent 10 seconds to look it up on youtube but you had to piss and whine on 4chan about it instead
if anyone was failed by the education system it was you, since you clearly never learned to help yourself

>>723337175
>chimping out
When viewing a mirror, one tends to see a reflection.
Multiple people have been patient with you while you yell like a child. You gotta calm down if you want help.

>>723337175
>>723336769
>>723335694
Is this guy a bot? He sure posts like one
Why would someone botpost in a thread that's about to hit bump limit anyway?

>>723337478
>piss and whine
what about >>723330965
is pissing and whining and why does it make you so mad?
>you could have spent 10 seconds to look it up on youtube
No such video is on YT comparing the hearts and again, not sure why this is making you so upset. Are you just not used to having threads on /v/ actually discussing a video game?

>>723337505
>multiple people
Right. This is actually what most threads on /v/ would like with IDs.

>>723337378
I don't care about the NPC but they shouldn't have put a quest and boss behind it especially considering how likely the Steel city is going to be involved in future DLC. What I am saying is what does her quest or boss or even her being made of Steel have anything to do with when you die you die forever

>>723337778
> but they shouldn't have put a quest and boss behind it
Putting content behind alternate modes is standard. If anything, it's worse design to not have anything behind an alternate mode.
>how likely the Steel city is going to be involved in future DLC
I'd rather argue on what's definite but even then, consider it a prelude reward for playing on a more difficult mode.

>>723336361
This is what I was missing. Thank you bro.

>>723305736
BRAAAAAAP

>>723330965
I personally have the gay hearts because I collected them all before turning them in. But if I had to choose, I would pick the crust king's. Ant queen's looks too much like an actual torn out aztec sacrifice heart.

>>723335021
I currently have Kahnn's heart on my shelf because that's the one I did last. I found out you need to do the red memory first beforehand, so I don't know if it wouldn't have worked if I beat Khann before then.

>>723336867
Welp, time to install the mod "you don't lose steel soul when dying" because I'm not missing content.
>but that's cheating
yes it is. I'm still not missing content that I paid for.

look at this mother. So defenseless....

>>723338670
Good for you but you can apply that same logic to the base game.
Did you know you also get a special quills if you play without one until Act II / Act III? That's more missable content.