Thread 723483679

>No Bubsy
>No Rayman
>No Super Monkey Ball
>No Bomberman
>No Dr. Eggman
>No Pheonix Wright
>No Battletoads
What sets Smash Bros. apart is that isn't supposed to have a roster full of FUN characters. But it doesn't. A lot of them are just "serious anime person", even half the DLC is just "anime fighter", and then they say that it's not meant for competitive play or something, why are they like this.

half of the most wanted characters for the game are serious anime sword/gun person if that means anything

>>723483679 (OP)
All the goofy ones are in there, you can't get into specifics when you have a billion fighters to squeeze in. You also have to consider the fact if the fighter even fits into the smash combat style, Pheonix wright fits a MVC3 style more than smash because its hard to imagine him jumping all over the place.

>>723483978
they aren't though, Bubsy isn't in the game, etc.

>>723483679 (OP)
>Those picks.
This isn't /v/ 4chan fighter.

>FF7 and Persona characters
I snooze.
Can we stop asking JRPGweebs their opinions on things?
Smash needs characters with strong individual themes not "anime twink with sword" repeated ten times. Even Popeye would be better.

>>723483978
the issue, and it's way more glaring when you're playing 'random', is that all of those sword fighters look the same and I really don't care about the nuances or want to play them at all because they don't feel like unique Nintendo picks.
The more generic characters in the game, the more painful it is to have to play against more of them.

>>723484098
I don't know, only a complete autist would want Kazuya or Ryu or Byleth or Robin or... etc. etc. to be in Smash Bros.

>>723484150
yeah the DLC is just Banjo and those other guys, I mean Sora at least doesn't have that super serious look but it was a bit lacklustre.

>>723483978
>All the goofy ones are in there
Not even close. You could mine another hundred characters minimum, just by looking at Nintendo's back catalog.
That's not getting into third parties. Namco, Hudson, Taito, Capcom, Konami. There's so much stuff to pull from.

>>723484380
I can't help but see Kazuya, Sephiroth, and Snake as a flex on "Playstation Allstars".

they really could have made Dr. Eggman from a Bowser Jr. echo if they wanted to, I mean they have Sonic, so how difficult would it be to have him in that egg-machine.

>>723484615
Snake has a unique enough moveset and looks so out of place it kind of loops back around, but the others are just so very boring.

Reminder we still have one Sega representative, and that's Sonic.
No Dr Eggman, no Knuckles, no Alex Kidd, no Aiai, no Ulala.
There's stuff you can work with here.

>>723483978
>because its hard to imagine him jumping all over the place.
Indeed so you do what little Mac does, make him absolutely terrible in the air

>>723484542
it doesn't make any sense, I mean Steve, nobody associates Steve with Nintendo.
The game feels great when it's a celebration of just Nintendo toons.
They have so much and they just don't bother.

>>723484150
>>723484528
What do you have against Hero?

>>723485052
his design isn't iconic, it's like with Incineroar, he's not memorable.

I hope they get over the
>MOST FIGHTERS EVER
schtick, because no one cares about Dark Pit or Dark Samus or Daisy, just make them skins please like Bowser Jr.
It's like those late 90s CDs where you'd have 4 great songs and the rest was just skits and fillers for 50 minutes so you thought you were getting more great music for your money.

>>723485195
Maybe not the latest but one of the Hero designs is absolutely iconic.

the fans are just going to keep asking for more Fire Emblem characters until people stop buying the games

>>723483679 (OP)
No Crash, GOD DAMN IT! No Crash Bandicoot!

Put Gilius Thunderhead in the game, god damn it!

>>723485626
after Naughty Dog, or maybe Twinsanity they zombified him. Imagine playable Nitrous Oxide and his final Smash being turning the map into a concrete parking lot.

>>723485518
I know the games are popular but Hero's not Dr. Eggman or Battletoads level

>>723483679 (OP)
I would rather they put Jelly Boy in the game than Byleth.

>>723485982
I think you're overestimating Battle toads

Cloud, Erdick, Sora? Who the fuck even are these characters?

Where's Zool, James Pond, and Super Frog?

>>723486145
they had a lot of games, lots of kids knew who the Battletoads were.
>>723486097
they should just do an update where if you pick a Fire Emblem character, there's a random chance that you actually have to play as Jelly Boy, and your only move besides jumping is that stomach punch.

>>723484806
Bayonetta and Jonkler are also owned by Sega.

>>723484806
Sonic is one sega rep too many.

>>723486324
>they had a lot of games
Are you even aware of how many games Dragon quest has?

Third parties ruined smash

>>723484806
Aiai has a lot of potential

>>723486447
I thought Nintendo owned Bayonetta

>>723486543
If you like playing Hero, play Hero

>>723486097
Japanese or European Jelly Boy?

about half of the Pokemon characters shouldn't be in the game, Smash has franchise bloat issues.

>>723483679 (OP)
Smash 64 has my favorite roster, even with the Mario/Luigi overlap and Cuntpuff. It felt appropriately wacky, and it made the concept shine through a little more brightly. I don't think all extra-Nintendo inclusions are bad (I think Sonic, Mega Man, Pac-Man, and Simon Belmont are all great choices, among others) but the games became extremely bloated.

>>723486621
Platinum owns Bayonetta. Sega has publishing rights over the first game, and Nintendo has publishing rights over 2 and 3.

>>723487019
I heard there was a custom Smash64 that has a good roster too. It seems like the future of gaming is just modding already good games.

>>723487010
We need at least a minor reboot when they make another one. Preferably a major reboot. Whittle the cast down to only essential returning characters, then give us some new stuff to play with.
Maybe even make essential characters different (get rid of Fludd and give Mario Cappy or the cat dive, for one thing). Have one of the newer variants of Pikachu, instead of just regular Pikachu.

>>723486937
the european one and the Here Goes Jelly music overwrites whatever music was meant to play and just keeps going and going and going

>>723487430
I think they want to do that, they just know lots of people are going to get really upset because they play a character that doesn't feel very Nintendo.
I mean if you play Donkey Kong you're probably safe, but a lot of them just don't deserve to be there, they have minus charisma.

>>723485982
This nigga really said that Dragon Quest Hero's design is not as popular as fucking Battletoads

>>723486097
Byleth turns into a woman and then turns into jelly and then turns into a duck.

>>723487714
>they just know lots of people are going to get really upset because they play a character that doesn't feel very Nintendo.
So mostly, if you play someone like Cloud or Sephiroth. Though I imagine most of the 3rd party characters outside of Pac-Man or Sonic will be leaving

>>723483679 (OP)
Ultimate represents the current state of modern gaming pretty well
It's not about fun, it's about hype, bloat, and trends
The inclusion of casuals and normies during gen 7 has turned gaming into a media as inauthentic and lowest common denominator pandering as music, tv, and movies
The worst part is, most gamers who've been around long enough to remember what the early gens were like, don't care because they fell for the premium gaming and specfagging memes

>>723487714
my dream would be just flat out everything is new. Instead of Mario, have Paper Mario. Instead of regular Link, have classic NES Link with a raft and a ladder. The plot could be that the old Smash Cast all got sealed in a crystal by a new villain, and the B team has to come in to save the day.
They're never going to do that, but I'd think it was cool.

>>723488123
It could be like that, after I saw they added Steve to the game, I thought Smash was just going to be moneygrubbing from here on out. I mean when they added K.Roll and Dedede those were obviously good, fun choices. It's just a shame that the other half the playerbase want to play Street Fighter or something but won't admit it.

>>723484380
In what world is Ryu not a perfect fit for Smash? He even has all his old fighting game inputs.

>>723488125
Smash has a big roster but you get the feeling that after all the tier-lists, only maybe 20% are actually used by people who regularly play the game.

>Is that Sephiroth, one of the most famous gaming characters of all time, in my big video game crossover fighter?
>RRRAAGHH why didn't Sakurai include my favorite 90s platformer/indie metroidvania mascot? This game's for weebs

>>723488589
because the novelty of Smash is seeing how a Nintendo character would fight and not just be dropped into the game with zero effort from a game that has the same exact concept that Smash has.

>>723488149
>64 cast replacements: Paper Mario, classic Link, Raichu, Meowth, Lolo, DK Jr, Waluigi, Samurai Goroh, Slippy Toad, Saki, Paula, Birdo

>>723488931
Sephiroth might have been big in the '90s, but not anymore.

It's funny that you lob that critique at scrimblos.

>>723488931
Literally yes. Stop asking.

>>723488931
>implying Sephiroth is not from THE weeb game
nice

>>723488687
Yeah
I have mains, sure. But usually if I'm playing on squad strike or something, I almost exclusively play random
The handful of times I bothered to play online, it was a fuckton of ness's spaming pk fire, and the usual "top tier" suspects
What I like is the modes, which severely got sidelined to accommodate rosterfagging of the highest magnitude, and a glorified event mode
Melee had the best adventure mode (only above sse, because imo you at least fealt like you were in the worlds of each character, sse just felt like bland generic areas with the exception of halberd)
Melee also had the best break the targets because each was specific to a character, although I can also appreciate one uniform level to test each character equally against each other
3DS had my favorite mode though, I'm certain I've put 1,000s of hours into smash run, doesn't help that I loved that city trial mode from kirby air rider

>>723488956
What major Nintendo character is there left to add? Waluigi? They gave all the /v/ boomers everything they wanted with Ridley, K Rool, and Banjo. You people seethe when they add someone from a Nintendo franchise like Xenoblade or a new Pokemon from the most recent games

>>723483679 (OP)
>zoomers unironically roster fagging for bubsy
i want to live in this timeline

>>723489232
Bubsy is a likable character now. 4D is turning everything around.

>>723483679 (OP)
>A lot of them are just "serious anime person",
Some of them are silly as hell and willing to play along in goofy or over the top situations. That's like saying the entire medium has never had characters that were never serious.

>>723484150
>japanese company puts japanese characters into their japanese game
mind blowing isn’t it

>>723483679 (OP)
Serious newcomers in Ultimate:
>Ridley
>Simon
>Richter
>Chrom
>Dark Samus
>Ken
>Joker
>Byleth
>Sephiroth
>Pyra & Mythra
>Kazuya

Goofy newcomers in Ultimate:
>Inkling
>Daisy
>King K. Rool
>Isabelle
>Incineroar
>Piranha Plant
>Banjo & Kazooie
>Steve

In the middle:
>Hero
>Terry
>Min Min
>Sora

You aren't entirely wrong, but the ratio isn't that far off. Got to remember as well that this is every fighter up until that point, so the goofy to serious ratio is going to lean back on the former more as a result of that. Besides, Aiai and Bubsy? Former seems like an odd choice for a fighter and the latter is just desperate.

>>723483679 (OP)
around the time ultimate was getting new characters, nobody even considered liking bubsy. i can sort of see it now as a funny pick for the next game but let's not pretend ultimate is at fault for not picking a guy that wasn't loved until basically this year.

>>723489160
FF7 is weeb shit the same way Dragon Ball is weeb shit.

>>723489501
FF7 WAS weeb shit
Haven't you heard? It's for normies now too, or did you not play remake or rebirth? In stores now!

>>723489429
>JRPGweebs failing to comprehend that "femboy with sword" does not account for every Japanese character ever designed
Still waiting for Advance Wars characters, Goemon or Bomberman to appear in Smash. Where are they?
Put Lupin the Third in there, for all I care. At least he has charisma.

>>723489136
He's from the most famous JRPG of all time, he'll never be irrelevant.

>>723489479
Bubsy is just what if Incineroar was cool and put a shirt on.

>>723489629
>Advance Wars characters, Goemon or Bomberman to appear in Smash
All forgotten sorry, Sephiroth and Sora are both thirty times more popular than they will ever be

>>723489628
No it wasn't, it made a niche genre in the west super mainstream due to marketing and it outsold every game on the PS1 besides Gran Turismo.

>>723489830
Can't account for the masses of people out there with terrible taste. This is why democracy is a bad idea.

>>723489496
Ultimate's fan base has thought for years that putting Master Chief in the game is a good idea.

>>723489136
>Sephiroth might have been big in the '90s, but not anymore.
He got new exposure from Kingdom Hearts and other Final Fantasy projects in the 2000s, and he's returned in the recent FFVII Remake trilogy. First part of the latter is at least over 7 million in sales and getting a Switch 2 port in a few months. Obviously the original game release was a phenomenon, but acting like Sephiroth just faded from conscience is an insane assertion. You're going to very likely know who he is unless you're quite young or just not interested in video games outside of very few. Not sure why either camp should take priority when discussing who should join a roster focused on video game history.

I'm also not sure why you act like lobbing the criticism at mascot characters is that funny. The anon you replied to didn't even call them more obscure, and neither did OP for that matter.

>>723489628
That's why he mentioned dragon ball dumbass. It was always normiecore and isn't even considered weeb anymore.

>>723489960
Halo 1-3 are fun, so is it a bad idea? Not sure it's a great one per say, sure, but he's an iconic character who could make for a decent Smash fighter if he somehow did join. Only really annoying part was when he became THE bandwagon pick for a few months, but that's passed by now.

>>723490187
John Halo is a pretty bland character. I'd rather it were Duke Nukem, if you need someone to represent FPS.

the biggest argument against Sephiroth is that he's like a Dead or Alive character, maybe even more 1-dimensional, in fact they should have replaced Pyra/Mythra with Tina or Kasumi in PS1 with the ridiculously bouncy breast physics, just so that you could play with the TOPLESS HIMBO vs. the TOPLESS BIMBO.

>>723490187
He is a terrible pick, he's the Xbox mascot, he's stealing Bomberman's spot, he's also sort of like Samus, and stealing Snake's gimmick of being a super realistic addition.

>>723490283
Duke was never as relevant as Master Chief and the last nukhem game being trapped in gamedev hell for a decade only to be released and be mediocre completely killed off the franchise.

>>723490465
>He is a terrible pick, he's the Xbox mascot, he's stealing Bomberman's spot
What? Wouldn't he be stealing a slot from Crash Bandicoot, who Microsoft swooped up, and Doomguy, another FPS character who Microsoft also swooped up?

>>723489501
When I was at school, there was a girl who liked Final Fantasy, and she wasn't fat or anything, in fact she was well liked and people still treated her like a weeb. For some reason a lot of people to this day still refuse to play FF Online because it's "weeb-y", they'd rather pay Bobby Kotick another thousand just to pretend they aren't a weeb.

>>723490627
Crash or Doomguy wouldn't be as fun as Aiai, because Aiai screams fun vaguely-nintendo character.

>>723489479
Daisy and Isabelle are clones and no one asked for Piranha Plant. Out of the rest only Inkling and K Rool are near universal in terms of fan appeal.

>>723490940
Crash is literally Playstation's "we have Mario at home" character, how is he not vaguely Nintendo?

>>723490940
Aiai's main gimmick is being in a ball, which seems like it would translate poorly. Hard to make a whole moveset around it, especially when the physics are what make Monkey Ball special. He'd also only be able to use it for some moves due to items, rather than it just being how he is the entire time.

>>723491174
he was the Playstation mascot for about 6 years before someone ported that remake slop to the Switch, c'mon now.

>>723491337
that's why he would be a great pick though, he's not a fighting character, just like Pac-Man isn't, adding a hundred Ryu clones because they "just work" is how Smash Ultimate got like this

>>723491127
Chrom and Dark Samus are also clones, and if Isabelle isn't different enough you can throw Ken on top of them too. Then there's Richter, who barely counts as his own fighter despite being a cool addition.

If clones don't count, then the ratio ends up closer to 7 - 6 before the toss-ups, which is pretty damn close.

On a separate note, if >>723490940 is you, that brings up a whole other issue. Metroid, Fire Emblem, and Xenoblade are Nintendo series. Castlevania is very associated with the company's consoles, and Street Fighter is a semi-frequent presence on them. If this is partially an issue of Nintendo ties, then that mainly is just an issue for Joker, Sephiroth, and Kazuya.

>>723491403
The first third-party character added was a character from a series synonymous with PlayStation and the second was the character whose games started the first console war with Nintendo

>>723490484
I don't care thoughever. I think characters that I want to play as should be in Smash, not characters who win polls.

>>723491514
>adding a hundred Ryu clones because they "just work" is how Smash Ultimate got like this
Out of the five fighting game characters that got translated into Smash thus far, I'd say the ones that are the biggest issues are the two that don't fight at all like Ryu. Hell, Nintendo owns one of those two characters. I've rarely seen people complain about the shotos or Terry compared to so many other fighters on the roster, past Terry's super special moves coming up here and there.

>>723491785
a lot of people still say Snake doesn't feel like a Smash character

Aiai could be a super slippery character who hits hard. That could be really fun if executed correctly.

>>723489479
Goofy
>Inkling
>K.Rool
>Isabelle
>Piranha Plant
>Banjo
Steve isn't goofy, he's an insanely popular greed pick that's in the game because Nintendo are whores, Daisy is a literal who clone, Incineroar is serious, no one plays plant, probably because his moveset is undertuned or butchered for no reason, so that's 5, but realistically 4.

>>723492709
getting used to ice physics on the platforms could be really fun to master, nice idea

>>723491817
kek at least you're honest

>>723493327
I'm genuinely confused as to why you think that's a wrong answer.
If you let "the people" decide everything, every game will just be filled with boring characters from flavour of the month games, and boring characters from insanely popular games (like Master Chief).
It takes someone with a certain critical eye to say "Master Chief is fucking boring actually. Find a character with personality".

>>723493570
Example: Nintendo should have had the wisdom to say "Joker is boring, but maybe we could put Jack Frost in the game".
If people are attached to Joker at all, it's because he constitutes an avatar that they played as in a 50 hour game. He's not an interesting person, and doesn't have a cool design. But people think they like him, because they like the game, and people are stupid.

>>723493570
And there are people who want characters you don't want, that don't/arguably don't fit those descriptions either, most likely as well.

>>723483679 (OP)
I got all of my most-wanted characters.
>Piranha Plant
>Hero
>Ridley
>Literally any FE character that uses the whole weapon triangle

>>723484039
bubsy would be a joke character, and soccerguy is never going to add a joke character that isn't from nintendo.

>>723494379
those people are dumb, and don't know why they think Master Chief is a good character.
Does he have charisma? No
Does he have a good design? No
Does he have iconic attacks? No, he has an assault rifle.

>>723494293
retards want characters like Kris from undertale in the game which makes zero fucking sense.

>>723483978
>Pheonix wright fits a MVC3 style more than smash because its hard to imagine him jumping all over the place.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TApdupKj0vs
I dunno, he looks like he works here to me.

>>723494752
I'd rather have that than Masterchief or Joker.
The Undertale games at least have their own strong iconic look.

>>723494561
this is either shit bait or you have shit taste in video games which caused you not to play enough halo

>>723495180
Remember Master Chief's classic iconic line...

>>723494561
>assault rifle
Chargable plasma pistol can be directly translated to smash attacks, then you have the needler, energy sword and spartan laser can be the final smash
>>723495021
kris has fuck all for moveset, genuinely kill yourself

>>723494561
My man. The point is that a character doesn't have to be "FOTM," or "Popular," as you put it, to be a character you don't want. You probably have characters that you don't care for, that aren't those either.

>>723495237
Kris is a silent protagonist retard.

>>723487430
I agree with this. I'd be fine with a 20 character roster, genuinely.

>>723495507
Yes, but he looks unique.

>>723495619
>he
Kris doesn't even look distinct enough to tell if it's a male or a female lmao

>>723495237
>blocks your path
https://youtu.be/ePLDO68lcA4

>>723483679 (OP)
>no bubsy
none cares
>no rayman
none cares, nt even ubsilop
>no super moneky ball
none cares
>no egg man
none cares
>no phoenix wright
none cares
>no battletoads
none cares

go beg for your shitty ultraniche personal wishlist to other game

>>723496507
>I don't like anything award
oh brother this guy stinks

>>723494541
Bubsy did nothing but jump and die and he still has a stronger identity than Incineroar

I don't know what Smash Bros. Pros. see in this game, every other character feels like a chore and half of them don't even have a strong theme, like the devs just said, "ok, well, he can punch?"
I mean just a complete meh, save for a few characters like Bowser for example who actually feels like they gave a shit.
I just don't get it.

>>723494379
Master Chief is objectively a bad choice.
Mario is objectively a good choice.

>>723496940
this

>>723496507
>dr. egg man is considered ultra-niche
neck yourself

>>723497081
slopnic was never good

>play as Ganondorf
PUNISHED
>play as Dr. Mario
PUNISHED
>play as K.Rool
PUNISHED
>play as Dedede
PUNISHED
>play as Villager
PUNISHED
>play as Plant
PUNISHED
>play as Bowser Jr.
PUNISHED
>play as Kirby
PUNISHED
>play as Duck Hunt
PUNISHED
>play as Banjo
PUNISHED
>play as Ridley
PUNISHED
>play as Wii Fit
PUNISHED
>play as Ice Climbers
PUNISHED
>inb4 git gud
and that's at least half, maybe even 2/3rds of the most fun/non-serious fighters too

>>723495579
the size of the roster is fine, it's just been abused by people who use Smash for whatever reason to act out humanoid anime fighting.

>>723496507
Excite Truck is a better fighter than whatever you can come up with

imagine if Piranha Plant was the best character in the meta, and it was all plant fights, too much soul, it could never happen, it had to be minecraft Persona 9 fights.

rosterfags should be gunned down in the street

>>723502978
>enjoys nothing award

>>723483679 (OP)
What we need are more hot and cute girls

why did they give Sora the ability to do a three homing-missile combo just by pressing a button

>>723503425
Ashley is by far the best choice here, Warioware has so much potential

>>723504576
How they haven’t added Body Rock yet is beyond me
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vvg6iXxt_W8

>>723483870
Other than maybe Crash and Master Chief, who else had a chance to get in if they did another season pass?

>>723483679 (OP)
you listed unpopular 3rd party trash

>phoenix wright
would be awful as a fighting game character

>>723505539
Nintendo presumably owns tons of licenses to great franchises so >>723504576
but the season pass included Steve so probably someone from Fortnite and Roblox and Call of Duty so we can put this plane out of its misery and in the water

>>723505767
underage