Thread 723493092

>Completely guts the RPG aspects of previous games and implements voiced protag with simplified Mass Effect dialog wheel.
>People say that's okay because it has the "best gameplay" of any Fallout
>Said gameplay is still worse than every contemporary FPS/TPS at the time
How did Todd trick so many people into this mentality? Everytime I see Fallout 4 threads, there's always at least a few people acting like the shooting/melee is vastly improved from 3/NV, when it's really just slightly more polished with the same bullet sponge enemies and weapons that lack punch

>>723493092 (OP)
because the RPG elements were already gutted

more RPG elements a good game does not make
it's always been the worst part of bethesda games and im glad they gutted it

>>723493092 (OP)
It has the best gameplay. Sprinting, best gunplay, best enemys and set pieces for combat. Best variety and customization. You gameplay over storyniggers always have a few "exceptions" to your rules. 4 was the best fallout. None of them had good stories attached especially the 3d ones. The RPG elements were borderline useless in the 3d games regardless. Could it have been better? Yea of course. Was it worse than any previous game? No it was the best. The only fallout game better than 4 is Underrail.

>>723493303
They were still better in 3 and NV. Actual dialog menus with more than 4 options, where you see exactly what your reply will be is much better than a 4 option dialog wheel where each option is only a brief description of what you will actually say. I haven't played 4 since launch, but I also remember the perk/skill system being even more streamlined and meaningless.

In exchange for this, we get slightly less clunky melee/gun combat, that some people seem to think is on the same level of Doom Eternal or something.

>>723493656
If you don't give a shit about story, then maybe RPGs aren't for you and you'd be better served playing a dedicated shooter that will undoubtedly be a tighter experience than FO4. Like if you don't care about any of the narrative, why play FO when there are so many better games for combat?

>>723493092 (OP)
it's the best Fallout if you care about gameplay, for story you're best sticking to Fallout 3

>>723493092 (OP)
I genuinely do not get it either.

>>723493656
i have never cared about dialogue options in 3 and NV. they're usually just advancing questlines with an occasional usually poorly implemented speech check. dialogue trees are one of the worst aspect of RPGs.

>>723493971
I'm just curious, what are some of your favorite RPGs?

>>723493775
Meant for >>723493523

>>723494047
fallout 2, underrail, and atom RPG

>>723493092 (OP)
3 has such bad RPG design that simplifying it to Far Cry Plus gives them a lot less room to completely fuck things up.

>>723494125
I like the sandbox and setting. The overarching narrative doesn't matter to me. I do my quests and make my own fun on the way. Immerse into the environmental story telling rather than the prewritten garbage.

>>723493303
Fallout 3 was ok for its time IMO, even if Bethesda made a story that's basically "good guys vs bad guys" (though the Enclave quite literally are the bad guys). I think the fact that the Brotherhood of Steel are the good guys in 3 is overhated because it's probably the most realistic interpretation of the BoS yet so far; their chapter is stuck in one of the worst places in the post-apocalyptic America, the water is heavily irradiated, there's an active super mutant presence that kidnaps people and dunks them in FEV and there's barely any vegetation at all, they went rogue not just because it was more humane than adhering to the BoS' toaster-stealing ideals but also because they needed to recruit people to replenish their own numbers. Their return back to toaster-stealing ideals (with a dash of rabid hatred for the humanlike synths, because they needed to not be THE good guys) is more of a downgrade.
I don't think the RPG element gutting really started until Skyrim, Fallout 3 had the excuse of being the adaptation of a retro IP and it was difficult to port Fallout 1 and 2's elements 1:1, but Fallout 4 was a straight downgrade in that regard, though Far Harbor wasn't bad.

>>723493092 (OP)
Okay but why don't you tell the truth instead of whining and crying for an entire decade?

>>723495334
The truth being...?

>>723493971
>rollplaying is one of the worst aspect of RPGs

>>723493523
Besides the combat, everything else is half assed. It is as if the developers had this mindset that "modders" will add xyz to fix it so they didn't bother fully fleshing out most of the game. The armor/clothing are half assed, crafting system is half assed, settlement building is half assed, questline so barebones you might as well ignore it.

>>723495428
not sure who you're quoting but dialogue trees are one of the most limited aspects of rpgs because of how much is pre determined. you click out of a handful of options and one of your skills is occasionally checked. compared to combat when there's 10X the variability in your stats/gear vs your opponents stats/gear and all the decisions you both make in a given encounter.

>>723493092 (OP)
The bar is really low but Fallout 4 wins by default because there is literally nobody else making games like it.

>grounded setting without magic
>character creator
>first and third person
>be in base
>sort out gear and grab what you need
>open map and pick location or quest
>head out
>2 minutes later something to fight
>2 minutes later something to explore
>2 minutes later something to interact with
>2 hours later
>completed 2 quests
>explored 1 dungeon
>looted 2 new pieces of gear
>encountered a new companion
>now you are at your target location to do what you actually wanted to do
>do the thing
>you've played the game for 4 hours and return to your base
>do some maintenance, eat, sleep, head out again

Especially if you add mods that introduce completely new mechanics, characters, world spaces you can spend 100s of hours in the same game of Fallout 4 without ever touching the main story. Forget the lore rape and terrible inconsistencies. Modded Bethesda games are all about exploration and emergent gameplay.

>>723493871
The problem is most people don't play RPGs for gameplay, and I'd argue most don't play for story either. People who love RPGs to death just want a large padded out game with lots and lots of filler.

>>723496794
I prefer "gameplay with RPG" to "RPG with gameplay as an afterthought"

>>723493092 (OP)
par for the course
>fallout 1 and 2 have a skill threshold to make checks appear along with a check to pass the option
>fallout 3 removes the threshold and makes the chance visible
>new vegas removes the chance for a threshold with 100% player transparency
the next game you will be reverting to a single [talk to NPC] option that doesn't even lead to a dialogue tree

>>723493092 (OP)
Bethesda has slowly been dumbing down its audience with wvery game they release, lowering RPG expectations as they go.

Truth is, 4 never had any chamce of having questline or leveling systems as good as New Vegas. It completely shifted focus to being a junk collector as it adopted the same dungeon delving loop Oblivion and Skyrim had. The issue with Fallout 4 vs Skyrim/Oblivion is the lack of cities/towns becuase of the settlement system and the focus on collecting junk to craft/upgrade rather than finding meaningful loot upgrades.

Even mods don't fix or change Fallout 4 from being a junk collector at its core. With one of the weakest MSQ Bethesda has ever made, besides Starfield.

>prices for everything are completely different
>shitty engine, everything looks fat
>pipboy map movement controls are flipped
>have to install a mod to negate the piss poor load times
>have to install a mod to get rid of mouse acceleration
>have to install a mod to get rid of the autoaim
>even more create-your-own ammo bollocks ported from new vegas
>skill tree is a convoluted mess
>have to make an autoexec to correct the shitty npc lighting

the combat is somewhat fun however, which is the only saving grace

>>723493092 (OP)
>Completely guts the RPG aspects of previous games
You made a mistake there, you wanted to make a thread about Fallout 3 but put 4 in the OP.
>>723497349
>Bethesda has slowly been dumbing down its audience
>slowly
>slowly
>slowly

>>723493092 (OP)
fo4 wasn't that popular from the get-go

What I like most about 1/2/NV is the world and how much you can influence it. 4 is absolutely awful in that regard since nothing much changes based on your actions.

>>723496892
I see, I prefer gameplay.

Some of you need to come to terms that you don't like RPGs, you like playing pretend in a sandbox. Minecraft might be more up your alley.

>>723499051
I mean, yeah, that's the entire Bethesda fanbase in a nutshell. They don't care about anything RPG related, to them "roleplaying" is just walking around a shallow open world map, killing some enemies then going to a city to look at NPC's walk around before getting bored & switching back to Netflix.

Fo4 is one hell of a drug.