Thread 725065720

Devs really looked at this and thought "this sucks we should make ugly as shit 3D games instead"

>>725065720 (OP)
it's up to indies now

>>725065720 (OP)
The rest of the industry moved onto 3d. So did capcom. Theyre not gonna keep a pixel shit division to make a half dozen autists like you happy.

Besides that, the only way to get a decent roster size with these graphics was to mugen multiple fighters together over the course of like a decade ala marvel or kof and then you have issues with sprites not even matching since theyre generations apart. That shit sucked. And It only looked good on crts too, which nobody even plays on anymore.

The whole 2d > 3d narrative was just an anime meme that got popular when sfv came out, sure sfv looked like shit but now that sf6, t8, strive, dbfz have all come out since then i think this really just been the end of the discussion

>>725068814
SF6 looks like shit too though.

>>725068814
Post one 3D game you think looks better than that gif so I can laugh at you

>>725065720 (OP)
>>725066078
>>725068814
>>725068889

>>725068947
Man people in the 90s were dumb

>>725065720 (OP)
It's much easier to sell cosmetics for 3d models than 2d sprites.

>>725069254
LMAO

>>725068947
>i want graphics to go back to being more primitive so i can spend MORE MONEY ON SHITTIER, SMALLER GAMES
Youre dumb as hell

>>725065720 (OP)
Yes it was dumb, but If you weren't around back then you will never understand how much technological advancement meant to people. People literally wouldn't play 2D fighters because they were "old", people would be amazed by dogshit CGI in films simply because it was cutting edge stuff, and you saw huge advancements in tech in just a few years. There was simply a hunger for tomorrow that doesn't exist anymore. In a way it was a better time because there was hope that life would just continue to get better in the future

Sprite fags want you to believe this looks good. Same game as OPs gif btw

You didn't buy KoF XIII.

>>725069424
This is one of the most important visuals in the history of video games

kino

Don't care. 3S is the only game I'll play.

>>725069398
You are posting the cream of the crop as an example and attempting to apply it to everything. ILM could not be stopped, and everything not made by ILM looked extremely amateur.

>>725068814
>ESL thirdie
>Defends the destruction of art because "muh economics"
If you shitskins understood economics, then the thirdworld wouldn't be.

>>725069608
Post your copy of kof xiii and your hands, and a time stamp NIGGER

>>725069538
prove it
get on fightcade and play me right now

>>725069552
Sony also built a top tier CGI team, the leaps in quality between the Raimi Spider-Man films were insane. Sandman would have been unthinkable in Spider-Man 1 just like 5 years earlier

>>725065720 (OP)
The development behind these games was fucking insane, the lead dev was absolutely obsessed with xmen. There's some interviews with him where he lays out the whole development process but they are in Japanese and I've since forgotten what they were called. But yeah, you can really tell that Capcom is absolutely fucked now by comparison.

>>725069923
Someone post the skeletons

>>725066078
the best you'll get is a pale imitation
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pvLxFTYMdTk

When MvC2 came out I told my friends the 3D backgrounds where ugly and they said I had shit taste.

>>725065720 (OP)
I can hear that gif

>>725070341
Clocktower is one of the finest fighting game stages ever made.
https://youtu.be/ZR6liu10mDM

this thread needs more SNK

>>725065720 (OP)
It's actually worse; they called sprites "harder" and "expensier". As if 3D game design and modeling was any easy to begin with.

>>725070564
Too gaudy and hispanic

>>725065720 (OP)
I cant wait to see venom in tokon cause peter looks pretty good imo.

>>725070564
here you go

>>725069398
I was there and I thought it was retarded at the time

The marvel sprites from that era are flat out the most beautiful representation of those characters in motion that have ever existed. It's not just that 2D > 3D they did an unbelievable job on top of it.

>>725065720 (OP)
fucked up innit. Sega was unironically right in the 5th gen planning phase, when they thought consoles weren't ready for 3D yet and were focusing on beautiful 2D instead. It was the consumers that were wrong. Even now, 2D is still superior.

mvc2 is goated

>>725068814
>SF6

>>725071617
Take you for a ride?

2d will always beat 3D, simply put because 2D requires much more creativity. /thread

>>725071758
best 3d chun li is sf ex 3 chun li

>>725071758
Ignore dix chun's busted horror engine hag face for a second: why the FUCK did they give her such an ugly granny pajama outfit? it's like they smashed the classic and alpha outfits together a million times until they got the worst possible hybrid, and then went with that one. All the redesigns in dix and jive are so fucking bad.

2.5D is where it's at

post rosters

>>725072341
>All the redesigns in dix and jive are so fucking bad.
I disagree for 5.
Some of what they made was good, like Urien no longer being in a diaper, Ken's sporty costume, Dhalsim, Sagat, Balrog...
5 was shit gameplay-wise, but it still looked good for a 3D game.

>>725072434
> NRS will never use this modeling technique to make an Injustice game that has Bruce Timm's art style

>>725072726
>bruce timm art
>they still move like constipated NRS dogshit

>>725066078
>indies
Doujin devs actually.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YnGg_QDzUKs

>>725072782
> this one post turns my dream into a nightmare
fuck didn't even think about that, how the fuck do they make such good animation during cinematics but shit animations when it comes to the actual moves in game

BERSERKER BARRAGE

>>725072793
> made by one former capcom dev
pretty good game that deserved more eyes on it, would probably get the treatment DOA got from normalfags though

>>725065720 (OP)
>ugly as shit 3D games instead
MVC3 looked good

>>725065720 (OP)
>Devs
Not the devs, consumers wanted the ugly as shit 3D games instead.

>>725073306
The great tragedy of mvc1 is that wolverine is fucking shit compared to gold war machine, everyone is. Literally how the fuck do you stop this character. And he's shit again in mvc2. MvC3 is undoubtedly the best one from a competitive perspective but I prefer the completely unhinged gameplay of mvc2 where people play like absolute fucking nutjobs, and even wolverine/red venom is extremely satisfying to play in mvc1, until I had to fight double war machine teams.

>>725073004
This guy probably considers Unity asset flip slop to be high quality games

>>725068814
>The whole 2d > 3d narrative was just an anime meme that got popular when sfv came out
You have got to be fucking joking.

>>725069098
We sure were

>>725069424
>Same game as OPs
MvC2 was a mishmash of assets. You want consistently high-quality spritewoek, you look to SNK, or SFIII.
CvS2 still looks fantastic.

MvC3 looks fucking great, fuck you, animations make it even better than sprite based games

>>725065720 (OP)
they made sf3 and completely misunderstood why it failed

>>725072601
Jive looked good when it came to characters in their classic outfit like Chun, and new characters. It was the redesigns for returning characters that I generally didn't like. Regardless, it all looks good compared the absolutely visual travesty happening in dix.

>>725066078
>he thinks todays indie devs can afford anybody who understands an iota of the 12 principles of animation
Please tell me what else you envision in this dream world of yours.

>>725073893
>CvS2 still looks fantastic.
CvS2 is one of those shit games ecelebs praise because Ken and Terry do a fistbump

>>725074074
Ken and Ryu do a fistbump; Ken and Terry eas the gif I posted.
It's a fantastic game, and looks great.
Now, if I actually wanted to be contrarian and hipster about it, I've had namedropped Tatsunoko vs Capcom.

>>725069254
You have got to be fucking kidding…

>>725074135
Compare >>725070165
You can already see a massive drop off here.

>>725068814
this but replace sfv with sf4 and sf6 with sfv

>>725074214
>It's a fantastic game,
No, this is what I call snk syndrome.
>and looks great
Sure

>>725073541
>The great tragedy of mvc1 is that wolverine is fucking shit
Stop reading there, who fucking cares? Games back then were made to have fun. I played a lot with Wolverine and cyclops because they were my favorite heroes

>>725074074
CvS2 is fantastic,. I'm not going to let some retarded nu-capbuck faggot like maxcuck liking it ruin that for me.

>>725068814
>but now that sf6, t8, strive, dbfz have all come out since then i think this really just been the end of the discussion
You're right. There is now no need at all for insipid posts like yours.

>725070034
>725070509
>725073541
>Trannymai
>Troonimai
>Groomimai
>Goonimai
>41imai
>Xe/ximai
>Splittinmai-cock
>Dilatemai-Axewound
>2ndplacenimai
>ProtrectedByTheTrannyJannymai
>Pedonimai
>5643imai
>NoSeason2nimai
>Dickgoodbai
>DEMONimai
>Onim-ACK!!!

Get your dick split, you avatarfagging AGP PEDOPHILE.

>>725068814
Blame Brits and whatever hateboner they had for 2D. They shit on Castlevania SOTN and Mega Man X4 for no other reason than those retards going "get with the times, granpa."

>>725074043
>12 principles of animation
Japs don't use them

>>725074476
You can't animate without them retard

>>725074301
>Stop reading there, who fucking cares
People who actually play the games? lol. This is real important and I'm only gunna explain it once so pay attention. If you truly love a fighting game you will ALWAYS gravitate towards the meta, because those are the best characters that exercise the mechanics of that game. Your interest will always naturally drift there.

By the way, I'll play a fighting game that looks like shit if it plays well and is interesting, but well, all modern fighting games play like shit so I stopped lol. Can only think so many thousands of hours into old games.
https://youtu.be/sGh4ZU4H5Hk

>>725074232
Well no shit. Capcom is Capcom and FB is 14 dudes in a rented out office space.
Going HD with Melty Blood was a problem of money so they decided to make UNI.

>>725073623
You'd think that people would be more careful to not out themselves.

>>725065720 (OP)
Peter tops afterwards.

>>725074643
is kohaku ok

>>725073893
CvS2 uses the same Morrigan sprite.

>>725073957
MvC3 sure looks great, but it doesn't look better than sprite games

>>725073405
I don't consider myself some contrarian and I overall love MvC3 but no, MvC3 was never a good looking 3d game. The animations were good but the textures are way too fucking shiny, the stages are way too fucking dark, the character models/designs don't look their best either (like these characters look better in literally every other capcom game they were in) also the stage designs were all fucking lame, like there isn't a single stage in that game that I would like to play on, it's all just which ones you tolerate more

>>725070592
can't do mocap with sprites

>>725075385
She's wasting meter

>>725075392
yeah but that's the morrigan sprite.

>>725073893
CvS2 is literally the same "mishmash" that MvC2 is, even same with the 3d backgrounds

>>725065720 (OP)
MvC 3 looks fine. What's wrong with it?

New Mahvel characters dropped
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFWjWsgL6XE
>Demitri
>Robbie Reyes Ghost Rider
>Professor X (Krakoa, not wheelchair)
>Cable
>Dudley

>>725075721
>Demitri
>Cable
Based. I don't care for Robbie much but him calling his car out in neutral is nice too.

>>725069424
that looks better and more fluid than OP.

>>725077718
snk could do great sprites when they tried, but is always the same reused mugen-tier edits for almost 2 decades when comes to KoF.

>>725065720 (OP)
Early 2D was sometimes really ugly but sometimes surreal in a good way. 3D will never be as smooth, practical, or beautiful as 2D, but 3D can be atmospheric and tacky in a charming way.
>>725069424
Famously, this is not exactly how old 2D games were intended to look since they were on CRTs.

>>725078608
>Early 2D was sometimes really ugly
Meant 3d fug

>hasn't been playable yet even though his game started the whole Marvel and Capcom collab
>was almost in 3 but Niitsuma-san believed his moveset would be too similar to Chris' (it likely wouldn't have)
>even maskusummon man wants him in the series
If the SF6 director wasn't into edgy capekino, I would have lost all hope by now.

>>725070514
>>725070564
Sprite artist need more exposure.

>>725070763
Blazblue?

>>725070763
>sprite trannies think this shit looks better than strive

>>725072434
>Grad 3D art courses
>So interested in the tech used to make this and GG characters on model at 2.5d
>All they did was animate the normals by vertex, by hand every single frame to the camera
>Most western studios develop proprietery tech and software workflows to breakthrough new stuff
>Asia just does asian things and folds steel a thousand times for something basic
I never want to work for or in SEA. The more I learned about west vs east, there's just taking our own stuff for granted and idolizing the exotic different 'hard workers'.

>>725075721
Where's the Rollback you fucks. There was that one guy working on it, and CE was allegedly supposed to absorb his work, but now it's all POOF, gone, in the wind. OG dev's twitter is nuked as well so there's barely any paper trail outside of a few comments and articles

>>725082208
I mean, if you want something to be good, you have to actually make it good
the reason arcsys games look good and capcom and nrs games look shit is because arcsys puts in the work. No matter how many lighting effects or particle systems they cram into MK or Injustice they are always going to be ugly games because the people making them want technology to substitute for talent and effort.

For me it's Tessa's crouch animation. Borderline feels like the sprite artist just showing off.

>>725074301
Of course youre having fun, you can keep up with your mashing retard friends, but i want to play the game online, and im barely good enough to carry a mid tier character in low ranks in any game

>>725075579
Horrid artstyle due overuse of black/shadows trying to mimic western comics look.

>>725083030

The shadows look ass, I'll give you that; but I think everything else looks pretty great.

>>725074289
CvS2 is developed by Capcom tho

>>725074546
KoF XV is kino actually

>>725083150
Not quite; the visuals are saved by the colored side of it, sure but then we have the issue added with 3D = compared to its sprite based games the animations in MvsC3 are stiff and somewhat clunky. I mean, Just the comparison of Spiderman alone exposes this a lot.

Luckily the game is very fast paced to disguise this. And Ultimate brought Vergil and Phoenix that take advantage of that

>>725065720 (OP)
It's less that 3D took over and more that resolutions became so big that making pixel stuff wasn't practical. Your image is 384x224 for a game that came out before 640x480 in MvC2 was a thing.

You'd have to octuple the resolution of the native pixels to make it look as sharp as your .gif on 1080p.

King of Fighters 13 is one of the last to use sprite work and the backgrounds (and sprites) look terrible at 1080p because it was built for like 720p.

>>725083863
Except Guilty Gear did well with that in mind. Also; the sprites on XIII have 3D implemented in them as well. That SNK was all in with that game

>>725083863
just do normal 2d animation, the reason old games had tiny sprites where each individual pixel mattered is because they had tiny amounts of memory to store frames and tiny resolutions anyway, these days you can just have high res assets

>>725065720 (OP)
Capcom use to be the king of sprites but yeah I felt the same way
snes/PS1 games have so much more sovl and effort put into them than 3D slop it's crazy.
even the sound effects and music were a million times better back then.

Breath of Fire 2 and 3 look better than anything developed in the last 15 years RPG wise.

Ps1 demakes are making a comeback.

>>725085545
>Breath of Fire 2 and 3 look better than anything developed in the last 15 years RPG wise
Mogged by p5 and p3 reloaded, mogged by baldurs gate 3, mogged by e33,

>>725068814
>The whole 2d > 3d narrative was just an anime meme that got popular when sfv came out
you're genuinely fucking retarded
>then i think this really just been the end of the discussion
more like you realized that your own argument is retarded and gave up on it before posting
kill yourself

>>725074382
>redditren

Kof jaggy fest

>>725065720 (OP)
Street Fighter Alpha 3 still look better than SFV and 6.

>>725068814
Shutup

>>725091269
Glad you're dead.

>>725068947
Are British people actually this stupid or are they just being "cheeky"? I feel like I see this kind of retarded journalism from them all the time and they can't actually be serious.

>>725069254
wtf is this mobile slop

>>725065720 (OP)
2d sprites are capped in detail at the resolutions they're drawn at. 3d is infinitely scalable.

>>725073004
>food analogy
this review couldn't be more american if it tried

>>725065720 (OP)
A console has to justify its own price and existence.

By using the latest technology, the price makes sense even though it may look like trash.

It's that relationship of price and latest technology. It sucks, especially for most movies nowadays that look like trash.

Even though ps1 and ps2 graphics may look more charming, if you have them on a ps4 or ps5, you can go:
"then what's the point of the new console at all?"

Best game on Fightcade if I like big tits???

>>725074074
>shitting on special intros because muh e celeb shit.
e celebs favorite activity is breathing.
gonna hold your breath now?

>>725069729
3rd strike player actually play the game challenge (impossible)

>>725093173
Man, 2nd Impact backgrounds looked so much better than 3rd Strike’s.

>>725068814
>The whole 2d > 3d narrative was just an anime meme

>>725097248
>Man, 2nd Impact backgrounds looked so much better than 3rd Strike’s.
Hey, what's the matter. Don't like your eyes getting burned?

>>725073004
That is like an opposite of that old Doom review from Edge Magazine where the reviewer praised Doom's graphics, but still thought the game was shit otherwise because you just shoot things in it instead of expanding on variety that games like Ultima Underworld already have in first person games.

>>725065720 (OP)
They did because game reviewers of the time thought unironically thought sprites looked old and busted.
Even as late as kof13 (whose sprites took so much effort they bankrupt the company) you look up reviews of big publications and they all say it looked "dated".

>>725068814
>sfv looked like shit, sf6 looks better
If you are blind maybe, SF6 is an artistic downgrade over the previous game by any conceivable metric.
The quasi-realistic aesthetic of the engine might have worked for RE but it backfired horribly for SF which always has been a cartoony series and makes everything looks ghoulish and uncanny valley.

>>725065720 (OP)
More like "this is really expensive and time consuming"

>>725093173
Is there any mod to bring back those backgrounds and ui in 3rd strike like the PAL mod?

>>725101279
It's good that everything worth doing costs nothing.

>>725065720 (OP)
do 3d models save that much time and resources?

>>725065720 (OP)
3D is cheaper and faster. Do you think animation studios look at 2d animation and say "this is shit, I gotta make a 3d berzerk"

>>725101969
>>725101510

>>725101279
>>725101969
Yeah good thing we went 3D so games are now much cheaper to make and have shorter dev cycles

>>725101671
yes. the sprites posted in the op were reused in games for seven years, from Children of the Atom + Marvel Super Heroes all the way through Marvel vs Capcom 2.


at the same time, the fact that every frame needs to be drawn means that every frame actually looks good and creates artistic intentionality instead of churning out heavy punch animations in an afternoon.

>>725102148
That's not on the animators

>>725065720 (OP)
Gen 7 was the official industry wide beginning of devs being so preoccupied with whether or not they could [gimmic/ trend/ fad/ target audience shift], they didn’t stop to think if they should
>>725068814
I've never seen passion for 3D installments like their 2D counterparts. You wouldn't get it

>>725065720 (OP)
It's not devs, it's customers. If you showed this to 99% of the average video game players they'd say it looks outdated and should look more like SF6

KOF13 is still one of the best fighting games ever made and the worst part is that everything about why the game's aesthetic succeeded can be perfectly replicated in 3D at this point. There are very few smush or smear frames at all with 90% of the work being tracing over 3D models in the first place but what makes it stand out over the 2.5D fighters is the snappiness and color grading, and there was also just really good sound design beyond the sprites to put it all together.

>>725070509
based

>>725103251
You're talking about normies and grafixfags, 2 groups (often overlapping) enabled and welcomed in gen 7. So it still does kinda fall back on devs. Kinda a "chicken or the egg" scenario

>>725103661
best looking*

>>725102254
Then what was the point of that post

>>725105402
Sprite-based game costs X +3(sprites)
3D-based game costs Y +1(3d)

they will cheap on art and waste resources and time on other bullshit

>>725103705
Imagine this scenario
>Devs make game uglier than past games
>Piggies eat the slop
>Financial success, make it that way again
Scenario 2
>Devs make game uglier than past games
>Nobody buys it
>"hmm, let's not do that again, they don't like it"
>go back to good style
>people buy game again
Who controls what devs make? Themselves, maybe corporate execs? To some extent yes, it's up to them to be auteurs and only craft their vision. But it's also a business and businesses cater to customers. Yes there are faggots ruining games from the top but luckily for them they have a legion if goyslaves that will accept everything they're handed.

>>725085545
Funny you left out 4 when it's the best looking game, period.

>>725105756
Games don't have to strive for realism to be pretty or successful. Look at Minecraft, looks like ass

>>725097248
3rd Strike had the gameplay but New Generation/2nd Impact had the visuals, music & aesthetics.

>>725105694
3D is so much more expensive it's not even funny

>>725065720 (OP)
Devs didn't
Consumers did
>>725109983
You are retarded

>>725068947
Sounds exactly like a post you'd hear someone make here

>>725082208
Can you really say it's something basic when it's something that's given them such a distinct visual style that it singlehandedly boosted the company's reputation and popularity by a significant amount?

>>725082584
Warzard was a treat for the eyes. From the character design to the setting

>>725065720 (OP)
Good thread. This statement must be made much more evidently and consistently if we are to truly return to the glory days.