Thread 58120105

>listening to a champion theme on youtube and make the mistake of reading the comments
>"I'd love to see them fight Cynthia"
>"we all know Cynthia would stomp"
>"actually Red would stomp because he's the epic awesome sauce"
>full of blatant mentally eternal 12 year olds all wanking Red/Cynthia

Ok I'm really tired of this mindset. Here are the rules
Every champion faces off in a round robin style tournament where everyone faces everyone else one time.
All mons are the same level. All mons have perfect IVs, full EVs and a beneficial nature.
In the case of anyone not having a held item they now have the most competitively viable one. Everyone leads with their ace Pokemon. Jolteon for Trace, Dragonite for Lance, Metagross for Steven, Milotic for Wallace, Garchomp for Cynthia, Volcarona for Alder, Haxorus for Iris, Gardevoir for Diantha, Charizard for Leon, Urshifu for Mustard, Glimmora for Geeta, Hydrapple for Kieran, and Archaludon for Drayton. Red, Blue, and Nemona lead a random mon like in the PWT
Switching mons is only allowed after a KO and the opponent brings a new one in
All regional gimmicks like mega, dynamax, terra, etc are allowed

With 15 opponents for each character who is getting the most wins?

>>58120105 (OP)
You are missing Peony and the answer is Kieran, his team is actually competitive

>>58120105 (OP)
inb4 mysterialfag spams mysterially

>>58120113
I didn't include Peony because he's the only
champion who never has a full team of 6 at any point. Plus leaving him out leaves it at a nice even number. Though I could have included N since he's technically a champion.

>>58120121
He's literally not, unless you think Team Magma grunts can become champions by beating Steven in the doubles battle in Emerald

>>58120147
I mean, for the very short timespan between you seeing him win against Alder, and you beating his ass, he WAS champion, exactly like how Blue was champion in RBY.

>>58120147
Wasn't Ns entire goal to become the champion so that his authority/declaration to release all Pokemon would be considered valid? Either way that's besides the point. I'd have left N out of it as well since I don't think he ever uses a full team of 6 if you remove the legendary

>>58120105 (OP)
>listening to a champion theme on youtube and make the mistake of reading the comments
>"I'd love to see them fight Cynthia"
>"we all know Cynthia would stomp"
>"actually Red would stomp because he's the epic awesome sauce"
>full of blatant mentally eternal 12 year olds all wanking Red/Cynthia
Post 5 comments showing this

>>58120156
No, retard, he wasn't, why the fuck would he be a champion?
>he beat Alder!
So if the current boxing world champion is about to fight for his title against a challenger and some cult ilegally enter the building and force a match between their leader and the champion the result changes who is the official, actual boxing champion?
Alder is the champion until you beat it in the postgame, N is just a pokemon trainer and gang (fake) leader.

>>58120175
i dunno, nothing is shown in-game stating that he illegally fought the e4
the castle is raised AFTER his fight with alder

>>58120115
I would’ve said Palmer or Brandon, but he’s also got my vote.

>>58120105 (OP)
Nemona casually has the strongest team
That said simulations indicate the strongest team of the verse is professor Sada

>>58120105 (OP)
Isn't Steven's title "THE STRONGEST"?

>>58120195
I think I saw that same video. Kind of unfair when the entire team is all paradox mons and the better past ones.

>>58120195
>Nemona has the strongest team
>Ribombee
>Pawmot
She's the terror of ZU

>>58120189
What about the fact Hilbert is a legal challenger and two of them shouldn't be able to enter the league at same time? You could even strecht it if it was a gen 1-4 or 9 league because those follow a certain order and you technically could fight Elite 4 number one while someone else is beating number three or something, but what stops two challengers from going after the same Elite Four member? Can you battle them right after someone else so they are tired? And what if both challengers beat the fourth Elite Four at same time? Who gets to fight the Champion first? N was clearly not an official challenger against Alder.

Also I'm pretty sure he literally says he doesn't want the title anyway so even if it was legal he was never a champion

>>58120202
It's not just paradoxes, gen 9 is busted, it's the antithesis of gen 6

>>58120204
For the OP I did an attempt at recreating what the games did with Blue. Blue had a rotating Gyarados/Arcanine/Exeggutor depending on your starter but future games just gave him all three to not canonize a starter for him.

Nemona has Ribombee, Milotic, and Dusknoir rotating out alongside her starter as well as Decidueye, Greninja, and Infernape. I swapped out the starters for the first three instead.

Same with Leon, he has Mr Rime, Rhyperior, and Seismitoad rotating out alongside a starter but I took out his starter and Haxorus since he drops the latter in some of his teams anyway

>>58120213
What are their teams in mastersex? That's usually a good way to find official teams.

>>58120361
Their official teams are in the actual games not in gachashit spinoffs that give Mightyena to Hilbert, Diancie to Diantha or Rayquaza to Zinnia, retard

>>58120361
They don't have teams in Masters EX I believe, they just get single mons per version. And lots of them are legendaries which shouldn't be allowed.

>>58120105 (OP)
Wallice. He hard counters most of them.

>>58120512
>rare as fuck encounter
>still put it on two other champions teams later
They know they made an OP mon with that one. Hardly anything anyone else has can one shot it and it just uses icy wind once to out speed then spam water moves and recover. It would definitely fuck up Lance, Steven, Cynthia, Kieran, Iris, Leon, Geeta and Alders leads

>>58120512
>Lance, Iris, and Drayton are 3 dragon type champions
>Steven and Peony are steel type users
>Wallace is water type
>the only monotype champions just happen to all use some of the best types in the game
Next gen will have a fairy type champion

>>58120105 (OP)
CYNTHIA LOST TO ALDITH SO STAY CRYING IN HINDI

DIE MAD IN YOUR SMELLY SHITTING STREET

>>58120879
Not even a Cynthiafag. I honestly don't see her getting too many wins, her Garchomp is good but unlikely to sweep and the rest of her team isn't that great. Better then Trace though

>>58120888
HER GARCHOMP DIES AND IS USELESS LIKE HER

HOW GOOD IS ALDITHS TEAM THEN HAHA

they did a simulation and cynthia won and everybody cried like bitches about it

>>58120105 (OP)
Prime Mustard.

>>58120105 (OP)
Lance's team should be HGSS not B2W2.

>>58120207
>and two of them shouldn't be able to enter the league at same time?
Says who? Gens 1 and 7 canonically allow multiple challengers to take on the E4 at once. Your headcanon is irrelevant.

>>58120202
I mean, even lore wise the AI professors analyzed how other champion trainers fought and collected data to suit their style I think they are a bit overqualified on top of their busted teams

>>58120105 (OP)
>wanking Red/Cynthia
Just like GF! (and DeNA)

>>58120105 (OP)
>Who is the real strongest champion
BDSP Cynthia, strongest in-game team

next question

>>58121860
Levels are completely arbitrary. Kieran also has a higher average level than her.

>>58121942
>Levels are completely arbitrary.
? they are fixed in the games
>Kieran also has a higher average level than her.
by like ~0.5+ or something, thats error margin
His team is worse overall
And he's not a champion, lore-wise he got stomped by nemona

>>58122112
You realize the second half of your argument dismantles your initial one right? If Nemona stomped Kieran despite being lower level then that means levels don't matter and Cynthia having the highest leveled ones means nothing.

>>58121845
>Red canonically loses to Ethan/Lyra, Nate/Rosa, and Elio/Selene
>Cynthia loses to Lucas/Dawn, Hilbert/Hilda, Nate/Rosa, and Elio/Selene
>they still get wanked as being the strongest ever
Literal genwunners and zoomers who started with gen 1/4 are ruining this fanbase

>>58121458
>gen 1
Headcanon and like I said, it makes more sense in Elite Fours in a fixed order, not so much in those you can tackle at any order.
>gen 7
The one that wanted a final Champion VS challenger match for the league debut? Not an argument.
Now read the post you replied to again, but slowly this time. N isn't, wasn't and will never be a Champion.

>>58121188
They did a simulation and the guy couldn't stress enough how above the rest gen 9 was lmao

>>58122112
>but levels..
So you agree Cynthia is inferior
>his team is worse
His team is actually competitive unlike anyone else's
>he's not a champion, he lost two Nemona
Both of them are Champions, play the game, sinnohfetus

Leon and Mustard are the only real arguments if you’re talking canon, Leon was the final boss of the Ash anime and the games said Raihan could be champion in another region if he stopped autistically challenging Leon. Mustard retired undefeated and has higher average level for storytelling purposes so you could maybe argue he’s stronger but that’s more ambiguous

>>58125471
>talks about canon
>brings up the anime
Discarded.

>>58124593
retardbro, all of those are just (You) the Player
any videogame NPC ever will always lose to the Player
That doesnt change the fact that Cynthia and Red are obviously meant to be the strongest NPC trainers and everyone knows it - GF, DeNA, fandom

>>58125544
>any videogame NPC ever will always lose to the Player
Holy shit play more games
>these are obviously meant to be the strongest!
That's why they are given a lower leveled team sure kek

>>58125471
>gen 8 shitters
kek

>>58125553
>too scared to reply
>posts a pic that confirms champion status
Classic retardo

>>58125544
>Cynthia and Red are obviously meant to be the strongest NPC trainers and everyone knows it
Does anyone actually doubt that?
>Two excerpts from an interview with DeNA when Ash’s Pokemon Masters EX event was announced
Interviewer: Ash, the main character of the Pokémon anime has finally made his appearance in this game. It’s a very trending topic, so how did it come about?
Nishizawa: Among Pokémon trainers, Ash holds a special place. I’ve had the ambition to bring Ash into “Pokémon Masters EX” for a very long time, and actually have been preparing this event for over a year. In the TV anime, Ash will challenge the Masters Tournament of the Pokémon World Championships, while at the same time appearing in Pokémon Masters EX for the third anniversary so both titles can be more thrilling.

Interviewer: I’m looking forward to the ever expanding sync pair Team formations. The third anniversary not only includes Ash, but also Red and Cynthia. What was the reason for their inclusion?
Nishizawa: Red and Cynthia were chosen because they are the two most impressive trainers in the Pokémon franchise. I wanted people to remember the moments where these strong trainers stood in your way on Mt. Silver and the Pokémon League.
>Red and Cynthia were chosen because they are the two most impressive trainers in the Pokémon franchise.

>>58125562
kieran is a Temu champion of some shitty school - 1 school
Nemona = proper regional champion - entire region
as anyone with a brain understands - regional (real) champion stomps meme "champion", which is exactly what happened in the DLC

Kieranfujos are truly retarded

wait, people really consider Kieran on the level of a champion? by the logic Arven and Penny count as well, the same goes for every single challenger Eilo/Serene get in the champion title defense line up in gen 7, Kieran isn't on the level of a champion narrative wise neither are the leaders of blueberry and orange academy, hell, the franchise doesn't even treat the other main charaters like they're actually as strong as champions any going by the gacha, Red is the only one confirmed a champion and on the level of one where as every single other lead still isn't confirmed or reated as teh current champion of their region for each lead that they ppicked to go through the game's story, do you know why that is?

It's because Red's entire character was becoming pokemon champion, in his game his journey ends with the player defeating or capturing Mewtwo after becoming champion. Ethan,Brenden,Lucas,Hilbert,Nate,Calum, Eilo,Victor,Chase,Rei,Floren and soon Paxton whenever he's added are never said to be their region's champion in that gacha even if they reference game events that happened in post game like Gloria does with the isle of armor and crown tundra and even the darkeset day, Leon is still treated as the champion and she referes to him as such, the game holds true for every single protagonist from Lance still being considered the champion of Kanto and Johto and Alola having no champion even in the anime Ash is officially still Alola's first champion and representing them in the masters 8 and Geeta represents Paldea even tho in that region there are multiple champion ranked trainers or implied to be, in story the only other person who has defeated Geeta is Florian/Juliana and Nemona yet G

>>58125573
>Kieran isn't a champion well he is but not in a way I approve of okay? I bet you are a woman btw
Nobody cares about your damage control.

>>58125594
>schizo rambling genuinely saying nobody but Red is champion level
Nostaltards are beyond salvation

>>58120105 (OP)
HGSS Red based purely on his absolute total base levels (everyone else needs a bunch of rematches to get up to his level)

>>58125602
Levels don’t mean anything narratively they’re just a game mechanic, like other anon pointed out Kieran is weaker than Nemona despite being higher level and as far as between different gens you’d have to believe Lance got weaker after R/B since he’s lower level in G/S

>>58125602
HGSS red is already a post game/post Pokemon League fight in the first place, so its the same thing

Cynthia is the only correct answer, as she has the most going for her
-lore-wise - she is a regional (aka real) champion, so already among the strongest NPC trainers in the world
-gameplay-wise - she has the same avg lvl 85+ team as the other highest leveled teams in the series
-but unlike some of them - the rest of her team is good too (6 items, max IVs, EVs, good movesets etc.). So its not only just naked levels like Red

There's no other NPC character that has all 3 of these at once

>>58125594
>less deranged genwuner be like "onl yRed is champeon level look the gacha andr anime"

>>58125623
We know it's you. Learn to write.

Gen 9 wins again

>>58120105 (OP)
The only real answer is: it depends on what you’re focusing on.

If you mean in terms of in-game levels and teams, I’m not sure. You could easily set up a tournament to test that. In fact, someone did on YouTube and found that Mustard came out on top, with Cynthia in second place.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7qKlcvf8HI
But honestly, I don’t find that angle very interesting.

From a narrative perspective, though? Probably Cynthia (and maybe Lance). She’s consistently portrayed in the games and the anime as the best of the best. I think that’s a much more interesting measure, even if her Pokémon levels are capped for obvious gameplay reasons.

>>58125603
>>58125553
Are you not posting when the same plotline calls Kieran a champion because you are too much of a bitch shitposter or because you don't know It happens because you never played it?

>>58125637
champion* of 1 school
walmart champion
not a real champion

>>58125626
Concession accepted

>>58125642
>retard is a frogposter
Of course.

>>58125634
>She’s consistently portrayed in the games and the anime as the best of the best.
The anime literally had an arc where Leon bodied every champion he fought why would you ever bring up the anime if you don’t want to say Leon? It would make no sense narratively for her to be stronger

They already have a level GF put there showing you how much of a challenge they are

>>58125609
>Levels don’t mean anything narratively they’re just a game mechanic, like other anon pointed out Kieran is weaker than Nemona despite being higher level
Levels are clearly aligned to the narrative but theyre not everything and trainer skill matters more between trainers in the same class with similar levels. Nemona is a more skilled battler than Kieran despite having slightly weaker mons
>you’d have to believe Lance got weaker after R/B since he’s lower level in G/S
He could have switched to using lower level mons, he doesn't have to always use the same team and mons
>>58125610
The credits roll after he is beaten so it's considered to the true ending of the main game and the Johto fight just the normal ending. It also makes sense narratively that the Gen 2 trainer fights and defeats Red since they are surpassing their precessor to become the new strongest trainer rather than stopping at the champion since Red already did that so it's nothing new. Red is maingame fight and at his absolute weakest he has level 80 mons that are clearly meant to indicate just how strong he is.

>>58125649
Cynthiaturds aren't specially bright, their brains don't get enough oxygen since all blood goes to their dicks

>>58125653
>a level GF put
They sure did

>>58125649
anime is not canon to games
and anime Leon never beat or even fought Cynthia/Steven and in the end he also lost to Ash, same as them
If he at least tied with Ash, you'd have some point. But he didnt

>>58124593
The "people" ruining muh fanbase are autistic golems(You) who still play these shitty games

>>58125663
Not him but you are the one who mentioned the anime first and Leon was still ranked number 1 so yes, anime-Leon is confirmed stronger than anime-Cynthia you dumb cuck

>>58125660
Yup, they put levels that make Cynthia and her level 88 Garchomp weaker than fucking Let's Go Red. That's the magic of having team battles instead of 1v1 matches, cynthiakek

>>58125663
But the games also say Raihan could become champion in other regions, but chooses to stay in Galar because he wants to beat his boyfriend.

>>58125667
>you are the one who mentioned the anime
no I didnt, that was some other anon
Its not canon
>Leon was still ranked number 1
irrelevant, that was from some prior season where only Lance the jobber was shown taking part in
in the actual show season with all champions participating he didnt win
and like I already said - he never fought Cynthia/Steven in the anime
>anime-Leon is confirmed stronger than anime-Cynthia
nice headcanon
Her Mega Chomp stayed undefeated btw
unlike Gmax charizard

>>58125671
BDSP Cynthia >> any Red (whether HGSS or LGPE)

>>58125674
Uhh no in BDSP even lvl1 Rattata can beat Cynthia with friendship mechanics.

>>58125671
Good point but wrong trainer, both Red and Cynthia are weaker than gen 9 best and Red is on average still weaker than SHIThia

>>58125672
>But the games also say Raihan could become champion in other regions
Nope, just a rumor made up to sell merch
Rumor fully disproven by him always losing to Melony (a gym leader) and only being able to barely beat Piers (gym leader) because Piers doesnt use Dmax

>>58125677
That just means Melony and Piers are also champion tier
>Nope, just a rumor made up to sell merch
I feel like it’d be really bad writing to have the game lying to the player with extra information obtained in the post game lol

>>58125649
"Best one" never meant "undefeated". If so, Ash is superior to Leon, and A.J. is superior to Ash, so A.J. is canonicaly superior to Leon. There you go. A.J. is the best trainer of all time.

>>58125682
AJ is obviously excluded from the conversation he’s too far above everyone else

>>58125653
>stronger than any kantonian, johtonian, hoennian, unovan, kalosian, alolan and galarian MCs aside
Oh no no no no no... memebros... what about Gogoat?

>>58125703
Love my wife

>>58120105 (OP)
>the strongest ch-

>zhaun seethe
That means Cynthia won

>>58125924
MTN NAME ISNT SHAUN AND YOU HAVE THE MOST DELUSIONAL LOGIC IN THE WORLD

STAY COONING WITH RAGE

Pokemon is stupid.

>>58125682
>>58125695
>AJ vs Tobias
Now that's a real tournament match.

>>58125724
I want her to look at me with disgust

>>58127139
>>58125724
>>58125703
>poogeeta so ugly, OP has to samefag ERP with ximself because no one else likes this street shitting gypsy

>>58127166
got her ass.

>>58127166
And since nobody likes her I suppose anon drew those three pics himself too

>>58120105 (OP)
cynthia is the strongest because her fight is the hardest

>>58127253
On Planet retard, maybe

>>58126979
Thread would be over after the first post otherwise

https://youtu.be/AB5A91zoGAw?si=JO2O70udLo6gBqpn&utm_source=ZTQxO

https://youtu.be/bFDjtAYRPw0?si=AF6mSr0qYA_dFpH4&utm_source=ZTQxO

https://youtu.be/JbPkbhPAKPk?si=2acLz7vrKluG7Pqj&utm_source=ZTQxO

https://youtu.be/8KkQ4uBFDQM?si=LRBJuc9oqGIzjAPz&utm_source=ZTQxO

https://youtu.be/nmuJ8kTuYXg?si=WhQ9313dDZ9MlkK8&utm_source=ZTQxO

>>58127267
which is where we live