They were alright actually.

!

>>11765817 (OP)
As a young lad, I was playing my copy of FireRed on my SP, when I came upon a shiny Pidgy early on. I caught it, and continued on until my game crashed while I was in a cave. I didnt save. I have never played a Pokémon game since, but I save at every legitimate opportunity in any game since.

>>11765817 (OP)
yes, except that one

>>11765817 (OP)
I grew up with gb color, and I was so happy to get my hands on firered

>>11765817 (OP)
FR/LG were great. They rewrote/cleaned up all the shitty terrible code from the originals, fixed various dumb design decisions (Dragonite can actually learn Fly now, it made zero sense that it couldn't in the originals) and had some nice little new aesthetic touches like being able to see the items as icons in your inventory. This and HG/SS are rare examples of excellent remakes.

>>11766782
I'm sorry you were too young to experience pokemania

>>11766796
Not him, but I was there for Pokémania, I even got a head start on most people in this country by emulating the American release (so me, my brother, and my friends, we all had advanced knowledge on how to play and beat the game, which people would ask us for).

I think the original games are good, they're classics for a reason and are still enjoyable to play. However, they were limited by the hardware of their time, and also there were quite a lot of little bugs (usually not very noticeable or critical ones, but there were a lot), and I think that they did improve upon the formula as the generations went, at least for a little while.
As far as "remake the original games in Gen 3" goes, I think Fire Red and Leaf Green did a very good job at doing exactly that.
Doesn't really replace the originals or anything, those are worth playing on their own (if nothing else because of the distinct aesthetics and style).

>>11766796
I grew up during pokemania, I prefer FR/LG since it's the same general game but better.

>>11766837
>limited by the hardware of their time
I don't think /vr/ is the place for you
>>11766868
I don't believe you

>>11766871
>I don't think /vr/ is the place for you
I think you're willfully misinterpreting me because you're a faggot.

They clearly had all sorts of aspirations given how they had more and more ideas for coming generations. You're a fool of think every new thing in every sequel to a game was ALWAYS something thought up for the new game, often these are things which either a dev didn't have time or budget to achieve the first time around, or it's sometimes something they thought would be good to do, but the technology they were working with at the time didn't allow it.
A lot of the most ambitious games had a lot of ideas which were cut because they weren't technologically feasible (regardless of if they were actually good ideas or not, mind).

>I don't believe you
I fail to see why it can't be believed. I was like six or maybe seven when Gen 1 first rolled out, and I was still young when Gen 3 came around.
I loved Pokémon, and I thought Gen 3 was an amazing improvement on an already good formula, the continually better sequels to a game which was already a classic by then.

I actually didn't even play FRLG back when it was new, I thought it was cool at a glance, but I already had my Pokémon Blue and I wanted new adventures (this was also why I didn't buy Yellow, or Crystal, or Emerald). Playing it years later, I thought it was cool to have the original classic reinterpreted through the framework and graphics of my favorite gen.
If anon is saying he couldn't enjoy Gen 1 at all when it was new, I seriously doubt him, it's a very solid JRPG which had phenomenal marketing and cultural presence. But if he's saying that FRLG makes to him critical improvements? Maybe I could buy that, even though I think that's not really true.

>>11766871
>I don't believe you
That's just your autism acting up. I liked Gen 1, I prefer the remakes. Good for you if you don't.

>>11766878
You're a retard if you think that Gen 3 improved on the formula in any meaningful sense. It was effectively identical to RB in format, and functionally went backwards from what GSC did

>>11765817 (OP)
This has to be AI. Literally zero people prefer the actual RGBY over the GBA versions. Same for the original second gen to heart/soul.

>>11766884
The addition of Abilities and the EV overhaul by themselves were massive improvements to the battle system, only retards who disliked these mechanics because they need the battles to be even more simplistic disagree.

>>11765858
To get triggered by a game so hard it lives rent free in your head is autism level

>>11766885
/vr/ is genwunner central, but it makes sense given the theme of the board

>>11766884
The only thing that Gen 3 went back on, and which it should be criticized for, is that it took away day and night cycles, that was a downgrade, but everything else was an advancement on Gen 2.

>>11766919
Day/Night removal was a bit of a disappointment, but they added weather effects in the overworld which carry over to battles, so I see it as more of a sidegrade or trade-off

>>11766919
Meh, I didn't really miss it. If anything, I actually don't like real-time clocks in Pokemon and prefer the more recent games where the clock runs on its own speed.

>>11766782
>This and HG/SS are rare examples of excellent remakes.
HGSS forced the following pokemon feature on you. bad decision, should have been optional. it also mixed 3D with 2D. should have been completely 2D like FRLG.

>>11766885
I think it's perfectly reasonable to enjoy to the first games, they were popular for genuinely good reasons, wasn't just fluke.
The marketing helped a lot, and it was really strong and skillful marketing, but the marketing would also have been completely wasted if the game had just fucking sucked, you can never 100% manufacture hype on that kind of scale without having something of pretty damn good substance to back it with.

But I also think that the games mostly improved as they went from Gen 1, to Gen 2, and then Gen 3. Gen 4 also advanced a number of things, but it was also the first time in the series that I felt that I wasn't entirely satisfied with the new directions.

>>11766905
This would be a good place to enjoy Gen 1, but this is also a good place to enjoy Gen 2 and Gen 3.

>>11766929
Sure, the weather effects were a great touch which really heightened immersion, but at the time I felt like I would have wanted to have day and night as well. After all, the game had a clock and all and kept track of time, so why couldn't it at the very least do day and night, if only in a visual sense?
Imagine going out in the rain in the dark of night, that could have been so VERY moody! Also imagine playing it in the evening before bed, you're traveling on routes and finally get to a town, seeing those lit windows on houses in the dark, just like in Gold & Silver.

Though I suppose that this would have conflicted somewhat with the whole sunshine weather effect for combat which Castform and Groudon had going.

>>11766937
What I find far more annoying about HGSS is how it pushes more story and the legendaries into your face. It feels like a modern Pokemon game through and through in that regard and I don't appreciate that.

>>11766885
go the FUCK away

>>11766937
>HGSS forced the following pokemon feature on you. bad decision
Especially with how the framerate of the Gen4 games is already a drag without having a critter behind you the whole time.

>>11766939
>This would be a good place to enjoy Gen 1, but this is also a good place to enjoy Gen 2 and Gen 3.
Agreed, FR/LG obviously qualify per board rules, it's just that genwunners are bullied relentlessly on /vp/ and pretty much every other pokemon community, so they really dug in their heels here once they saw a spot that they could claim.

>>11766786
I had to look this up in case this game came out in 2008 or something but it was 2004, what was so 'previous' about the GBA at this point?

Pros of FR/LG:
>New stuff from gen 3.
>Early Mankey for Charmander players like in Yellow.
>Multiplayer won't corrupt your game.
>Better AI and opponents have custom moves, making the game more of a challange.
>Extended post game.
Cons of FR/LG:
>The overall bad design choices of RBY remain essentially intact.
>Sludge Bomb is a post game TM for some reason?
>The gen 3 soundfont does NOT fit well with RBY's OST.
>New evos of old mons locked behind post game.
>Post game isn't Red going to mount silver.

the only mistake was making the One Two Three islands after the 7th badge mandatory. I can never figure out where to go, and lose all motivation to play

>>11767002
The Throwback hack moves all the islands to post-game, so maybe try that.

>>11766968
>New evos of old mons locked behind post game
And you can't get Espeon or Umbreon at all due to no day/night cycles.

>>11767071
Not gonna lie, they should've retconed them to evolve from the moon and sun stone respectively right there.

>>11767097
Or at least offered an alternative method like the second GameCube game did.

>>11766919
I disliked the night/day and day of the week stuff. It was neat, but it mostly became cumbersome. Pokemon is an RPG, not a life sim.

>>11766968
>The gen 3 soundfont does NOT fit well with RBY's OST.
Of all the countless romhacks done to FRLG over the years one I'll never play the game without again is the original music restoration, I can't put into words how much the shitty GBA soundfont and its compression destroys the vibe

FR/LG are sidegrades really. having a post game is nice but its pretty fucking weak. the sound and graphics arent as charming as the OG. feels lacking compared to gen 2 remakes.

>>11765817 (OP)
Bros

I want to try a Pokemon game with no grinding, just relying on tactical play.
What's the best one for deep gameplay: Silver, FireRed, or Emerald?

>>11767379
>the sound and graphics arent as charming as the OG
The charm in question:

>>11766837
>Doesn't really replace the originals or anything, those are worth playing on their own (if nothing else because of the distinct aesthetics and style).
I agree with this fully, I absolutely love the way gen 1 feels. It's a lot darker (both visually and tonally) and I tend to love the way anything feels when it's still finding it's footing (or was never intended to be a series to begin with). The art in gen 1 and 2, in my opinion anyway, also vastly outshines anything later in the series. This is very evident in the lass designs for 1 and 2 (who are responsbile for my undying love for kneesocks and loose socks respectively) when compared to the one used in FRLG. She's still cute and hot but in a different way, and I prefer the original.
Leaf is cute though and also wears loose socks so they get a pass for that.

>>11767523
>pic
reminder that there's an NPC in the later games that basically implies she keeps pokeballs in her pussy

>>11767396
This but unironically.

>>11766903
Are you somehow incapable of remembering things?

>>11767396
this is cool

>>11766930
>I actually don't like real-time clocks in Pokemon and prefer the more recent games where the clock runs on its own speed.

What? Since Gen 4 all of the pokemon games have been using the built in clock of the console they ran on. Meaning it was proper real time and not just a clock running off the built in battery. I would argue gen 2 and 3 ran at their own speed and not the other way around.

>>11767396
yeah, a wonky pocket monster that feels like a wild, strange creature that happens to have some cute appeal, not a polished mascot.

>>11767567
I think they mean how in Scarlet/Violet games have the day/night cycle be based on time intervals than correspond to real time.

>>11767589
it's not cute, it looks crazed with tweaking eyes

>>11767396
The old sprites have grown on me a lot, even if I prefer the sprites of later titles.

>>11767523
Those sure are some interesting sprites. I find I mostly prefer the girls from Gen 3, 4, and 5, though.

>>11767613
I like that in its own way.

>>11767627
Edited sprites aside, I do have to admit that I like Erika (hands-down my favorite pokegirl)'s gen 3 redesign with the yellow robe more than her original one. Her original sprite blows all of the ones that followed out of the water though.
>Erika will never sit on top of your desk seiza-style, facing the wall and completely nude but with her tabi still on

>>11767613
just like wild animals aren't as cute as cartoon mascots, they're weird and wonky and can look bizarre, but can still be considered cute.

>>11767567
Legends Arceus and Scarlet/Violet ditched the real-time clock. I think an in-game day only takes one actual hour now.

>>11767396
this is peak soul and how this pokemon was always mean to look, zoomers have no soul and can only appreciate the watered-down soulless boardroom-approved redesigns from Yellow onward

>>11767708
To be fair, I do like quite a couple of the American Red/Blue sprite redraws. Specifically Sandshrew, it's one of my favorite pokemon and while I like the original, the redesign is what I grew up with of course.
Though there's also others like Porygon's (another one of my favorites) where I really like both.

presenting without comment

>>11767753
these designs are completely soulless compared to R/G/B

I only like this better than the original because of the shiny pokemon

>>11765817 (OP)
Too many replies and I'm lazy to catch up, but FRLG felt like the most justified remakes as the original games were fairly broken in terms of balance and bugs, and also had pretty severe graphical limitations even compared to gen 2. They coexist with the originals for me. None of the other remakes really felt necessary to me, even HGSS (desu they're a bit ugly)

>>11767810
HG/SS were absolutely necessary, Gen 2 is extremely flawed from a game design standpoint, not so much in terms of bugs but things like the atrocious level curve, ghost town Kanto and poor pokemon availability. The problem is that they only sort of addressed these issues, they should have gone further. Having said that, HG/SS are still improvements. Even forgetting everything else, just having the physical/special split from Gen 4 alone makes them massively better than the originals.

>>11767826
>just having the physical/special split from Gen 4 alone makes them massively better than the originals.
this doesnt matter at all

>>11767826
Sneaselfag...

>>11767826
You're a fucking loser

>>11767845
It matters a lot to battling which is the main of the series- catching and training pokemon to eventually battle them.
>>11767876
Cry more, retardo.

>>11767895
main point of*

>>11767895
>matters a lot to battling which is the main of the series
no its not

>>11767826
>just having the physical/special split from Gen 4 alone makes them massively better than the originals
Explain why you think this without posting a YouTube video.

>>11767895
You're clearly a zoomer

Actual zoomers on here acting baffled that there could possibly be people in their 30s on /vr/ lol. Zooms are the only ones who would consider the original rbg superior because of historical brand recognition

>11768049
sad bait
try harder

>>11768052
I saw better trolling on sharty

>>11768049
>t. didn't buy a rom dumper to print out his diploma

>>11768031
Pokemon like Gengar being Ghost/Poison while having its stats oriented toward Special moves was retarded under the old system. Now it can actually use Special-damage Ghost-type attacking moves like Shadow Ball etc effectively whereas before they were massively gimped for no reason due to its attack stat being poor and all Ghost-type moves being considered physical moves.

>>11765817 (OP)
The original games had more grit, but i consider these one of the few good remakes: they mostly polished the gameplay, something in need, and left all the rest (which was already great) the same.

>>11768052
If you reply to bait, even to call it out, it means you fell for it and they won.
Idiot!

>>11765858
>I have never played a Pokémon game since, but I save at every legitimate opportunity in any game since.
Jesus Christ...

Anyone here plays PokeMMO? want to have some battles?

>>11768231
>this monster that is consistently high tier in gens 1 2 & 3 and has access to hypnosis, nightmare, and a ridiculous pool of other TMs needs special stab or i can't use it!
You're dumb. Sorry, but it really is just that simple.

>>11765817 (OP)
They lack the physical/special split. They should have did a different kind of remake here. Would have been nice if unlike in G/S you instead start in Kanto and then go to Johto. So similar to Ash's adventure from the anime.

>11768049
0/10 bait
>>11768231
>every pokemon needs to be able to use 90bp/100acc stab moves for its higher attack stat
Fuck off, zoomer

>>11768649
That would require GF actually doing something right

>>11768646
>>11768676
The ghost Pokémon should at the very least be good at using ghost moves, yes. Thankfully gamefreak didn’t listen to retards like you and fixed this so it won’t be an issue for tonnes of Pokémon anymore.

>>11768807
>The ghost Pokémon should at the very least be good at using ghost moves
Why?

>>11768809
seems like basic logic may, which is why they fixed it

>>11768817
>may
mate*

>>11766782
What? No! They're not great! They're far from great! The games aren't simple pick up and play fun anymore! You have to worry about EVs and IVs, and you can't beat Pokémon tower by spamming dig on every ghost because they fly now? They fly now! So you need to use strategies now! That's bad game design! Not to mention golbat being unable to evolve until the post game!!! That's the worst sin of all!

>>11765817 (OP)
FRLG and HGSS weren’t

everything after HGSS was a huge mistake though yes

>>11768825
>You have to worry about EVs and IVs
you do? how come I've played these games without ever thinking about it then?

>>11768825
>You have to worry about EVs and IVs
you literally don’t unless you’re playing competitive, retard
that’s on you

>>11768817
This is what I hate about people who ONLY play Pokemon. It's like they're incapable of anything beyond basic pattern recognition, and expecting them to engage with mechanics on any level that isn't "round peg goes in round hole" is asking too much. They're given a tool that's arguably way too good, but it doesn't conform to the one (1) strategy that was spoonfed to them, and so it's unusable.
Gengar not having strong STAB options was not an error or an oversight. It exists to be a sleep setter with access to some of the best offensive spells in the game and inherent immunity to the most common physical attacks. A job it does so well that it consistently places in the upper tiers for competitive play in generations without PSS.

If this were any other RPG, and you tried to argue that a character with a toolkit as varied and powerful as Gengar's was unusable and needed to be fixed, nobody would think twice about calling you a fucking retard. And they would be right.

>>11768825
>You have to worry about EVs and IVs
I have literally NEVER worried about EVs and IVs for Pokémon in my entire life, not once, and I have done completely fine.
I've just acted like back during Gen 1, when they didn't exist, and this does not make an appreciable difference for how the game actually plays.

>>11768887
Nah it was a problem that they recognised and fixed. You lost. Simple as.

>>11768887
>If this were any other RPG
In any other RPG, the fire monster is going to be good at using fire moves, the ice monster is going to be good at using ice moves, and so on. For Pokémon, the split made a lot of Pokémon actually viable, and more importantly pushed the meta away from the defensive stallfest that it was by giving every Pokémon more offensive capability. And for all of those who inevitably cry
>but I don’t care about battling monsters in the monster battling game!
Then you shouldn’t have strong opinions about the split either way, it makes no meaningful difference to you especially if you had no friends and only played the story against the inept AI

>>11768952
>You lost
No shit have you seen the state of the pokemon series? Every single game they released this millennium is worse than the last one. Dont worry though the pokemons good boy values got changed from being a tough dude to a smooth operator so now the combat is playable. THANK GOD

>>11768961
The Pokémon series peaked after the split. It later declined for completely unrelated reasons (overall lack of effort blamed on people playing smartphones and not dedicating enough time to video games)

>>11768965
you literally have your own board to talk about non-retro pokemon games I dont know why you are here

In Gen1 and 2, STAB was a privilege, not a right.

>>11768960
This is exactly what I was talking about; you can't even begin to consider deviating from the one strategy the game gives to you. A monster is tailor-made to shine in a specific niche, and you're stumped by it. And the fact that you somehow took a post about battle strategy to mean I don't enjoy battling tells me you're even worse off than I originally thought.

Pokemon players really are just the worst.

>>11768986
>This is exactly what I was talking about; you can't even begin to consider deviating from the one strategy the game gives to you.
Nobody is training a pokemon to have nothing but STAB moves. It just allows for more strategy by making STAB moves viable for lots of pokemon who were previously restricted by stats that in practice didn't allow for it. It's not even a question of purely buffing STAB; Hitmonchan for example has been able to learn elemental punches since Gen 2 but they were utterly useless for it since its special attack stat was so low. Now they're physical moves, so it has viable elemental options available to it.

>>11768994
>just allows for more strategy by making STAB moves viable
No it doesn't, that's ONE strategy. You're just making that one strategy more broadly applicable instead of rewarding, and ideally gating things behind, experimentation.
>b-but I taught Hitmonchan Fire Punch and it's bad :(
You fucked up and learned something, now rework your strategy. Allowing the player to make mistakes isn't a problem in need of fixing.
Funny enough, the Punch TMs work great on Gengar.

>>11769019
You're really not understanding how gimped most pokemon were by their own movepools pre-split. Your dismissal of the Hitmonchan example illustrates this. Its movepool was so limited by its stats that you could really only build Hitmonchan one way. After the split it now had much better coverage and you could fit it into various teams with different builds. Lots of pokemon that were useless of highly niche before were now more viable, which made team building more diverse, whereas things were much more centralised around a relatively small group of pokemon prior, and it was a stallfest.

>>11769032
>Its movepool was so limited by its stats that you could really only build Hitmonchan one way.
So what?
You got a monster that can do one thing well. Every monster doesn't have to work the same way, or even be on an equal playing field.

>>11769032
Shut up

>>11769050
>So what?
So the split made team building more interesting by allowing for more options.
>Every monster doesn't have to work the same way
Split or not, they don't. They're still restricted by their movepools, this just means they can actually make use of more of the moves they learn.
>or even be on an equal playing field
They never have been.

>>11768807
I agree, but they should have changed this in gen 2 or 3. 1 is obviously glitched and wrong. Dark seems to favor physical attack and yet is special based. Like... why? Gen 3 could have corrected this and simply made dark physical and ghost special. I don't think pokemon like flareon and kingler were owed att based STAB moves because they had high att.

I accept the phys/spec split, because some things were getting stupid in their over poweredness. Water was just dumb. Way too much type coverage with various ones having ice and electric moves and then no physc weakness. Though... this could have been corrected in another way, just make water weak to poison. Bug could have resisted psychic. Ice could have gotten some more resists. I'll never understand the little baby steps to touching the type chart and their aversion to making more changes to it. Dark, Steel, Fairy, all fun and great types, but they could have rebalanced in other ways.

>>11769091
>they don't work the same way, it just allows me to use them the same way and if I can't than it's bad and should be fixed
Wow.

>>11769238
It allows you to use them in more ways. Before, you'd only use pokemon like Hitmonchan the same way anyone else would, because a good portion of the moves they'd learn were useless. The split gave pokemon significantly more versatility.

>>11769261
>you'd only use pokemon like Hitmonchan the same way anyone else would
You were free to use it any way you wanted, it was just only good at one thing. This is the same reason the retard from before claimed Gengar was unusable. He was using it wrong and couldn't comprehend different monsters having different use cases.
Again, allowing the player to make mistakes isn't a problem that needs fixing. You need to adapt to the game's mechanics, not the other way around.

>>11769289
>You were free to use it any way you wanted, it was just only good at one thing.
And now it's good at more than just one thing which makes it more useful and can fit on more team builds, which is good.
>This is the same reason the retard from before claimed Gengar was unusable.
Which post was this? Gengar wasn't unusable, it was quite strong, it just couldn't use its own ghost moves effectively.
>Again, allowing the player to make mistakes isn't a problem that needs fixing. You need to adapt to the game's mechanics, not the other way around.
You can still make plenty of mistakes after the split. Actually, there are new avenues for that. By the time the split came around there were natures and abilities which could throw a spanner in your team planning if you chose wrong.

The remakes of Gen I and II are better in every way, with the sole exception being Crystal because it has too much soul.

HGSS being the very best pokemon games of all time.

>>11769308
>And now it's good at more than just one thing
Just like everything else.
>Which post was this?
You're in the thread, man. Just fucking read.
>You can still make plenty of mistakes
No, you really can't.
With infinite TMs and move relearners, and EV resetting, and IV boosting, and ability changing, etc. there's an answer to every misplay you could possibly make. The player simply isn't allowed to fuck up.

>>11769339
>You're in the thread, man. Just fucking read.
The post must have been deleted, I see this one >>11768231 but it's not saying Gengar was unusable
Fair enough to the most modern titles if that's the case, I haven't played those games, but there was definitely a period of time after the split where you couldn't just change IVs and EVs at a whim and could fuck up your builds easily

>You were free to use it any way you wanted, it was just only good at one thing. This is the same reason the retard from before claimed Gengar was unusable. He was using it wrong and couldn't comprehend different monsters having different use cases.
>And now it's good at more than just one thing which makes it more useful and can fit on more team builds, which is good.
Short of shit like Street Fighter and Counter-Strike (and the GOOD games of those series that were made to be fun competitive games, not the shitty ones later that were made to look good on a livestream), competitive gaming is completely and totally retarded. You know what the point of pokemon is? To use the pokemon you like because they're cute/cool and the type advantages are just to mix it up a bit. If you think that's incredibly shallow that's because it is, the heart and appeal of the first two pokemon games come in the overall design and charm of them.
The only thing the later games are good for are the fap bait and maybe a couple of small thematic things like the Arceus and creation stuff.

>>11768825
>> You have to worry about EVs and IVs

Yes, I prefered when we had to worry about DVs, said no one ever.

>>11769374
Pokemon was designed around competitive play before they even started coding the games. You'd catch pokemon, train them to be strong and then battle them against other players. The single player story served the same purpose as a campaign in an RTS game. They were holding official tournaments in Gen 1. The Stadium games had rulesets centred around irl tournament rules IIRC. You didn't have to care about it, you still don't, but it was always a factor, and the reason they immediately started making significant balance changes to the meta in Gen 2.

The split made my bro viable.

>>11769423
Based Kinglerbro. I remember watching him in the anime and thinking he was cool as fuck, then putting him on my team and being disappointed by how weak he was. Crabhammer hit like a wet noodle despite being its signature move.

>>11769374
The campaign doesn't pose any significant challenge and literally every monster is viable for a playthrough. If you're struggling with using a Hitmonchan, you might be clinically retarded.

>>11769394
>>11769439
You know, I wasn't siding with either of you and was actually saying that both of you are retarded, but the combination of
A) you not picking up on that
B) you didn't think to just reload the page
C) the other guy giving a a good response I didn't consider
doesn't do you any favors at all.
also,
>Of course you're a pedophile/furry/both.
The fact you thought I was talking about the lolis or pokemon is projecting HARD.

>>11769458
you're struggling with pokemon
calm down

>>11768887
You'd have a point if that was Gengar's gimmick, but then Misdreavus was the same and Dusclops was the same.
On BANETTE was good at using ghost moves, such thing becomes way less special and unique if it's the majority.

>>11768984
...except if you're Psychic, Fighting, Dark, Fire, Water, Grass, Ground, Rock, Flying and Normal.

>>11769238
Motherfucker do you think every competitive set is just pokemon with all 4 move-slots being STAB or something?

>>11769860
Electric too

>>11769860
>>11769864
you allergic to using tms or something?

It's so weird that whenever this discussion comes up it boils down to "things were GOOD when they were BAD! I like that 60% of the roster was utterly LIMITED by the way the game worked when I was a kid!", it's honestly hilarious because most the time the argument isn't even true or honest in the context of gen 1, I can see why /vp/ supposedly bullied you guys.

>>11769871
Most of those only get their STAB options through TMs, actually.

>>11766903
The word is "traumatized", anon

>>11769879
then you're using the wrong ones

Why didn't game freak make a physically oriented Psychic then?

>>11769892
Why?

>>11769895
They did, multiple in fact

>>11769920
Not in the retro games.

>>11769895
Medicham and Claydol both have equal attack and special attack stats, but learn mostly physical attacks.
Medicham also ONLY has the Pure Power ability (in the games that matter), which doubles its attack. It's very obviously meant to be a physical attacker.

>>11769924
Yes, in the retro games. I can think of at least a few from Gen 3 on GBA

>>11767097
>>11767147
Game Freak is weirdly autism about evo methods
>NO, you CAN'T change the evo method because the pokemon didn't evolve that way in the prior games!!
>oh magnemite was just pretending to be poisoned before we added Steel type or something lol

>>279230143
nta but I don't care what the board rules state, nothing past 2000 is "retro".
You could never look me dead in the eye and tell me GTA 3 is "retro".
Now, I'm happy it allows as recent as it does because it means they get to be talked about here instead of exclusively on /v/ but again gen 3 is a little too recent and also the first game they made under the title "The Pokemon Company" (legally that is, I know the actual games still used the Game Freak logo and everything and they didn't stop doing that until Black 2)

>>11769931
>>11769943
My bad, I always think of Medicham as more of a fighting type than a psychic

>>11769957
How old does a game need to be in your opinion to be retro? Gen 3 released 23 years ago. In the 90s, did you consider Atari and Arcade games from the 70s which released the same amount of time earlier to be retro? We're getting older, it's a strange experience, but we have to be realistic here. "Retro" is on a sliding scale.

>>11769958
Metagross and Solrock are some others too. There were others that were balanced and could go either way, like Deoxys and Claydol

Gen I has it's charm but let's be honest, the reason so many are quick to defend it from any criticism is pure and simple nostalgia and emotional attachment.

>>11769971
I am quick to defend gen 1 because I get annoyed when people that dont understand the truth attempt to deny it. Even people like you that dismissively state that it "has its charm" come across as completely ignorant.

>>11769971
I'll freely admit to some nostalgia, and it has a lot of rough edges to it, but at the same time I also think it's still a really solid little JRPG and that's really why it caught on so well.
Again, you can't just conjure up that kind of hype and momentum out of thin air, you need some real substance behind it, and the game was that substance, most people liked it because it was simply good.

It's the same with Pac-Man, Tetris, Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, Ghostbusters, etc. Hell, Minecraft later on.

>>11769970
>>11769943
>>11769956
I guess gen 3 had to make up for the lack of them in Gen 1-2.

>>11769979
Honestly, a big part of the Gen 1 dragging is sheer resentment over how hard Gamefreak leans on it. The games got stuck in this rut of "Hey guys, 'member KANTO? 'member CHARIZARD?"
I still like R/B/Y. I like Kanto, and my first starter in Red was Charizard. But I can understand how this shit could get old fast.

>>11769895
They did.

>>11770053
Mew doesn't count

>>11769979
>>11769990
>>11770029
Nah, it's nostalgia

>>11769971
I'll defend any game from unfair criticism, even games I don't like.
Pokemon Gen 1 just happens to be a pretty good game that attracts a lot of unfair criticism.

>>11770070
>ur favorite game is 28 years old, nostalgia fuck, move on
>my favorite game is 20 years old, nostalgia plays no part in my opinions on anything

>>11769971
I won't deny that but like I said here >>11767523 a good amount of it for me is because of how visually and tonally unique 1 and 2 are compared to the rest of the series.
I don't spend all day every day playing Pokemon, after re-starting the whole game roughly every six months since I was little, I completed the original pokedex when I was in high school and pretty much knocked all the Pokemon gaming in my system out after that.
Usually whenever I see anything pertaining to Pokemon now it's either hentai of the later games or old artwork and promotional material for the first couple of generations. Like I said then, I really love the old art
and so it has a lot more permanence in my head than anything else that followed.

>>11770069

>>11770086
The series definitely underwent a soft reboot of sorts with Gen 3. Whether you like the later games or not, it should be easy to agree that it's only logical for some not to like the direction it shifted in.

>>11769991
Gen 3 is where they corrected and noticed a lot of gaps in pokemon. Like Att based ghosts and Spec based dark types. It also made dark and steel available early on. As much as the game is about battling, its also about exploring and discovering. A major complained of Gen 2 was a lot of gen 2 pokemon were too hidden and too deep into the game. Gen 3....well Ru/Sa is a well made game. FRLG, I haven't thought about it as much, but I suspect it's weaker in some regards.

>>11770110
>A major complained of Gen 2 was a lot of gen 2 pokemon were too hidden and too deep into the game.
I loved that about the game. It made finding those rare pokemon really memorable for me.

there's no reason to play the gen 1 remakes unless you absolutely can't handle gameboy graphics.
even then, the gba environments don't look much better than the originals and you can tell it was a gen 3 asset flip.

gen 1 doesn't just stop with gameboy. bringing your team and pokedex to pokemon stadium was huge.

>>11770130
>even then, the gba environments don't look much better than the originals and you can tell it was a gen 3 asset flip.
FR/LG has new tilesets and sprites, I don't think much was reused from R/S

>>11770130
>there's no reason to play the gen 1 remakes unless you absolutely can't handle gameboy graphics.
Or if you prefer the mechanics of Gen 3, where types and moves were re-balanced and fleshed out and moves that were bugged in Gen 1 work as intended.

>>11770120
But it wasn't really fun at all, specially with how weak they are for the most part.

>>11770165
It was fun for me. I like that there were pokemon that lived in hidden or hard-to-reach locations that you had to explore to fill your pokedex. Doesn't feel like you have rare creatures to search for in the later games, everything is just easy to find and legendaries are shoved in your face during the story so even they don't seem elusive.

>>11770178
The thing is that they were rare even compared to the rare pokemon in gen 1.

>>11770198
I know, it was great.

If RBY was designed like GSC, Licktung would be locked behind Unknown dungeon at 1% chance to encounter in exactly 1 floor, but wait! In order to even unlock that encounter chance you'd have to get the phone number of some random NPC in the other side of the map and wait an uncertain amount of time until they call you to tell you that a licktung was spotted there.
Then you do encounter the licktung and it's very underleveled + has a 20% to dodge your pokeballs.

>>11770258
This shouldn't make you this upset, they immediately reversed this decision with the franchise reboot and made every pokemon easy to find. Now you don't need to search for any pokemon anymore, you just stumble into them all by playing normally.

>>11770258
How'd you feel about pokemon like Scyther, Pinsir and Chansey in R/B/Y?

FR and LG were shit, but they introduced some nice QoL to gen 1. Romhacks have already solved gen 1 and in a much more faithful fashion, so they're pretty much obsolete now unless you really have a hard on for GBA pokemon graphics.

Gen 3 is just so fucking ugly man. FRLG’s lavender town is so lazy and just kills the whole vibe.

Pokemon can be less common but the fact that Rattata is MORE common through the whole game of Gen 2 compared to Gen 1 should raise a flag at least a little

>>11770258
They already had pokemon like this in Gen 1 minus the phone which wasn't a mechanic yet. Magmar in the Pokemon Mansion only appeared on one floor and had a very low encounter chance, and Japanese Blue did a similar thing with Jynx in Seafoam Islands. Electabuzz wasn't quite as elusive since the Power Plant didn't have a bunch of floors, but it was also rare and off the beaten path, easy to miss completely in a casual playthrough since you never have to go there.

>people sperging about gen 3 remakes being better cause battle system got better
>remembered gen 3 as dead zone where olderfags were gone, and too cool for pokemon anymore
>battle system got more detailed with gen 4 but only remembered it as the bandwagon gen for younger people that didn't play the pre DS era pokemon and in general there wasn't that much meta game autism then

You guys were aware of all the meta stuff in 2004/2005 to care? GBA had no wifi and gen 4 era was just casuals mainly. I played emerald a lot back then and could barely find anyone else that played gen 3 pokemon to care about battle autism.

>>11770337
"serious" battlers found out about netbattle which was a precursor to shoddy which was a precursor to showdown. This stuff boomed to a new level in gen 4 but all the battling stuff and its online footprint were already there. Used to be competing sites too but Smogon basically won out highlander style

>>11770271
There was no swarm in RBY, so at the very least I know that i don't have to unlock the chance to encounter them.
Besides, they are far cooler and better than Licktung.

>>11770348
Those were the days. I like Gen 1 and 2 the most overall, but I think Gen 3 is where the competitive scene was at its most fun.

>>11770263
Proof?

>>11770130
I strongly prefer Gen 1 but I still think FRLG is worth playing at least once.
The different movepools/types/special split/other changes make completely different strategies available. At worst it's an enjoyable novelty.

>>11770304
Magmar was a 5% encounter.

>>11770304
At least there was variety. Tin Tower in G/S/C is literally nothing but Rattata, with the odd Raticate and Gastly at night.

RBY/GSC/Stadium1+2 is best seen as a single entity. Bringing your mons to, from and across different games is a key aspect of the experience, and gens 1 and 2 are the only games that actually worked in this way. As a single entity, it is Pokemon at its best.

>>11770524
Technically you could also do this with FRLG, RSE, Colosseum, XDGD and the Gen 4 games.

>>11770479
Yeah, Gen 2's shitty pokemon variety is, along with the awful level curve, among the most common criticisms about that generation.

>>11770130
>unless you absolutely can't handle gameboy graphics.
I can, I just happen to love Gen 3.

>>11770092
kek

>>11770524
And FRLG/RSE + Colosseum/XD don’t count because….?

i like Gen 1/2 more than the rest of the series too but stop saying retarded shit like this. It just sounds like nostalgia bias

>>11770130
>2026

>>11768887
A lot of RBY's so-called faulty game design is more the game working on risk/reward and figuring out how to maximize a Pokemon you have even if it lacks hard hitting attack moves.
STAB in Gen 1 and 2 was a bonus, not a right. Cheesing with delays or status moves is promoted too. Its not perfect but there's a method to it's madness.
I get why it's changed, but it also feels very patronizing when there's an elemental equivalent for every move.

>>11770271
nta, but that just reminds me of how great the variety of Pokemon is in Gen 1 midgame.
Once you hit Celadon and especially when you complete the Pokemon tower quest after, you have access to pretty much any Pokemon short of the legendarily. You can walk into Celadon, gamble, and get Pinsir or Scyther depending on the game, or Dratini. The Pseudo Legendaries kept getting tossed to later and later in the games, until Diamond and Pearl sort of brought it back to midgame, then later games started pushing it back.

>>11770531
>>11770696
Stadium had a better campaign than Colosseum or XD.

Let's release a remake 6 years later

After removing half of all the pokemon from ruby and sapphire

>>11770531
>>11770696
You can't transfer mons to/from Colo/XD until the postgame (so each GCN game is its own experience in itself), and likewise between RSE and FRLG. Gen 1 & 2 are the only games where you can trade between gens. Don't get me wrong, I like Gen 3 and Colo/XD, but they are not companion games to the mainline games in the same way as the Stadiums are

>>11770178
I think it was over done. Steel being gatekeeped behind trades or even version exclusivity, and dark types being in kanto was too much. Heracross being in trees was great, friendship evolution is fine, but tyrogue being deep in a cave and only if you have room for him? That's shit.

>>11771168
Have fun spending all day looking for some shitty pokemon with a 1% encounter rate tucked away in some backwater section of the map. Gold and Silver killed pokemania with non-stop bad design choices. No surprise Tajiri bailed on their development.

>>11771181
You just want everything handed to you on a silver platter

>>11771181
I had a strategy guide growing up that gave commentary on every pokemon as you encountered it and so many of the Johto ones were "eh it's pretty lame, not worth the effort to use or hunt down".

>>11771198
Whoever wrote that guide was a dumbass. Heracross is one of a select handful of strong and useful Johto pokemon, and Psychic types were nowhere near the OP monsters they were in Gen 1.

>>11770524
I agree, gen 2 was a direct sequel and just felt like an extension of the first game. Gen 3 rolls around and just feels like a reboot, then a literal reboot, then its reboots all the way to oblivion.

>>11771181
Gen 2 killed Pokemania Tajiri quit as director baby pokemon for girls trying to sell dolls leveling curve dead kanto see you next thread

>>11771206
Gen 2 felt more like an expansion pack instead of a whole new game. Especially with how much Kanto there was everywhere. It's why fans refer to Johto as "West Kanto". But then you got to Kanto in the post game and there was nothing interesting to see or do. Such a disappointment.

>>11771213
Nice melty laddie

>>11771216
no meltdown here I just have very important information to share in this pokemon thread. The people need to know the truth

>>11771219
>no meltdown here
We all saw it mate

>>11771203
>finally make a bug move that isn't like 20 power
>give it to a pokemon weak to psychic types
Just GameFreak things

>>11771206
I agree

>>11771203
>Psychic types were nowhere near the OP monsters they were in Gen 1
No, but they were still among the most powerful, given how the new type made to counter them was woefully underbalanced. Splitting the Special stat into its own Att/Def was more of a nerf than the Dark-type.

>>11771229
They didn't do that kind of stuff in Gen 1, Masuda just had no idea how to make a good pokemon game

>>11770743
I feel like the logic with late pseudo-legendaries is that they're something you catch and train for postgame, so that the catching and training aspect of the game continues even into the endgame.
I do still prefer to have them earlier. I think the ideal would be to have them hidden behind some tricky puzzle or sidequest.

>>11771203
>>11771479
Really demonstrates the level of intellect we're dealing with from anti-Johto fags.

>>11771182
Why couldn't things stay as rare as they were in gen 1?
Just because GF overcorrected something, doesn't make it less of an issue.

>>11771479
>>11771490
>thinks thunder can hurt you
You get struck by Lightning, not thunder.

>>11771289
Yea, they advertised ghost beats psychic, which actually lick was coded wrong and didn't affect them, and the only ghost family is weak to psychic. Oh lick is weak af too anyway. This is worse.
>>11771229
Bug should have resisted psychic. Solves a lot of issues. I love that everyone is focusing on this very real criticism of heracross and not mentioning at all what a dud Aipom is. I can't believe how underwhelming so many gen 2 pokemon were. No wonder digimon was doing so well.

>>11771902
Gen 2 was when they started phoning it in. Weren't most Gen 2 pokemon just rejected designs from Gen 1?

>>11771926
Nope. And the ones that were got rejected a second time. RIP little electric tiger guy.

>>11765817 (OP)
>The remakes were a big mistake!
It gave us the Sevii Islands, which were the closest thing to the orange islands arc and turned out a better island adventure than alola could ever be, so no they weren't.

>>11771902
>every pokemon needs to be super powerful with a massive movepool and be viable in competitive!
You're a loser

>>11772238
Sevii islands were a great idea, poorly executed

>>11772306
>I want more normal types with worse stats and lower encounter rates and I am NOT kidding

>>11772238
Don't utter the name of that cursed hawaii garbage again.

>>11771371
Having them earlier plays into the whole risk/reward thing. Dratini sucks relative tot hat point in the game where you start getting more powerful Pokemon, and will take a long time to level, but if you go through the effort of leveling it up you have one of the strongest Pokemon in the game as early as you want.
Plus having the Pokemon for the playthrough builds more attachment for casual players who won't play the metagame much and at best will casually play with friends.

>>11766896
You're fooling yourself if you actually think it was meaningful in any way shape or form considerong all that info was incredibly obscure and cryptic to the point you WEREN'T SUPPOSED TO KNOW what Natures did or if even EVs and IVs even existed.

All this depth you claim you love so much had to be datamined and the process to manipulating it was so incredibly autistic and tedious I don't think you were supposed to actually do it.

I just can't believe anyone who says Natures, EVs and IVs were a significant change when none of us back then even knew they existed or what they did.

>>11772306
The mental gymnastics of a pokemon is a dud to it has to be uber. That's so binary in thinking. I don't care about competitive. I care about in game. And in game aipom sucks. It does nothing unique worth getting and training. You didn't actually say anything about aipom tho, so you're not actually even defending it as a pokemon.

>>11772503
Aipom is cute

The remakes were fine up until Alpha Sapphire Omega Red.
>still not having proper Emerald content, just making an extra endgame episode on top instead
>arbitrary changes and removals because they were getting lazier per remake, especially since this shared so much with X/Y
>The Battle Frontier Project Has Started!
At least FRLG and HGSS were good remakes.

>>11772536
The Battle Frontier isn't even as bad as how they essentially retconned and rewrote all of Hoenn to turn it into a second Kalos.

>>11765817 (OP)
i never played a pokemon game. are these all the same game?

>>11772590
https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Pok%C3%A9mon_Yellow_Version#Changes_from_Red,_Green,_and_Blue

>>11772434
Of course you were supposed to do it, if you wanted to match the NPC pokemon at the Frontiers. The game had NPCs who would basically tell you how your training was coming along. The precise details were sold in strategy guides, it's Nintendo we're talking about here and we know they love their money-grubbing.

>>11772536
>>11772547
>"Hey, remember Wattson, that jolly old Gym Leader? Turns out he was a corporate bastard who betrayed his employees to save his neck when their projects failed to turn a profit."
>"Also, he turned Mauville City into a shopping mall because he loved Kalos so much that he wanted to build his own tribute to Lumiose City."
God, I hated this OR/AS retcon so much.

>>11772590
Red & Blue are the same game but differing versions, and I think that the only differences are which kind of Pokémon you can find in the wild, some will be available in both, others can only be found in one or the other.

This was to encourage trading, and thus also battling, the end goal being to catch all 150 Pokémon by trading with your friends (some Pokémon will only evolve if you trade them). You didn't really get anything special out of completing your Pokédex except for bragging rights, however.
Later generations made this increasingly daunting by introducing more and more Pokémon, and then also making some only evolve or become available at all through sometimes needlessly convoluted and tedious methods (GameFreak can get fucked for those goddamn "Feebass tiles").

Yellow was a special edition, and it had some tweaks and additions to it to make it more like the anime which was very popular at the time. This would be things such as having what's supposed to be the Pikachu from the show as your starter (you being Ash Ketchum and all), him following you physically in the game world, special interactions with him, as well as adding in Jesse & James.
I forget if Yellow had the Pokémon availability setup of Red or Blue, or if it had its own distinct one.

>>11772590
Yellow's a little different, Blue and Red are mostly the same besides the mons. Generally if you like the idea of more anime references like Jessie, James and Meowth, and having a Pikachu following you around that can learn Surf through an obscure cart link bullshit method with Pokemon Stadium, then hey, Yellow was the most up to date version of the time. If you want a pure experience, Red or Blue work instead.]

>>11772620
>I forget if Yellow had the Pokémon availability setup of Red or Blue, or if it had its own distinct one.
It had its own selection of available Pokemon. I know Meowth, Ekans, and Koffing weren't catchable since those are associated with Jessie and James. It did let you get all the regular Kanto starters from NPCs, with references to the episodes where Ash acquired them.

This thread does make me want to give good old Pokémon Gen 1 a go again, might have been 15 years since I last played it.
I did actually find my old copy of Blue a few weeks ago, and my Game Boy Pocket, but the save battery is dry and I honestly can't be fucked to switch it.

What options exist for me to use Super Game Boy features for emulation? I remember that it'd do special colors for Pokémon.

>>11772626
It's kind of funny they made and released it before the anime was even over, so it leans hard to trying to evoke the show as much as it can early game, and then just gives up about half way because the series wasn't finished yet. Like how Blaine doesn't even have a Magmar.

>>11772631
I thought it was already over in Japan by the time Yellow came out. To my memory, it's never revealed that Gary had an Eevee as his starter until the episode where Ash returns home from the islands before he starts Johto, and your rival in Yellow also has an Eevee.

>>11772613
It wasn't a retcon, they pulled the whole "alternate universes" thing. If nothing else it ended lots of autism in the fanbase about "canon starters" and "canon versions" and such.

>>11772590
Red and Blue are basically the same game, Yellow is close to the same game but with light anime theming and remixed boss rosters

>>11772590
I recommend Red or Blue for a first playthrough, the bonus stuff in Yellow is better to add something fresh to a return playthrough.

>>11772639
I'm watching through the series again and I just got up to that episode and I'm 99% sure you're correct.

>>11772590
If you're looking to start, choose Red or Blue version, and make your decision based on which group of pokemon you like more in pic related

>>11772665
If anything, it only made it worse. Before Gen6, nobody playing questioned that there was a multiverse. It was just something assumed and mostly disregarded. Once the games started calling attention to it, it all went right down the shitter as everybody bickered and argued over what was and wasn't "canon".

>>11772698
Damn, Red's just better huh

>>11772745
Negroid I was on pokemon forums back during Gen 3 when I still cared about the then-latest titles and people were arguing over which was the canon starter choice and whether May or Brendan was the canon protag, mostly because of the anime focusing so much on May. Now we know there is no canon choice so those arguments are sheer retardation/baiting.

>>11772751
I don't believe you

Just played a few hours of red and a few hours of FireRed and here's the fact check:

The remake is better

Thread closed.

>>11772747
unless you want porygon. Payday spam from meowth and cheaper porygon. Can be a neat grind/play through. I do recommend it.

>>11772818
Payday's a good point

>>11772698
>>11772819
one thing that always gets my OCD was that Meowth being blue only means it's the only Gen 1game where you can farm money(however measly it is) outside of the Elite Four so if you run out of money, have beaten all the trainers, sold all items, and just have one Pokemon, you're fucked for getting more pokemon until you beat the Elite Four
You'd have to play like a complete retard to do so, but the fact that there's no money generating ability outside the Elite Four except for Pay day bugs me as an oversight. It wouldn't be a softlock thanks to Lapras if you've gotten past the sequences that need cut, but if you release Lapras it could be. Having Squirtle as your only Pokemon might also softlock you if you run out of money and items/trainers before the areas you get after cut, since he's the only starter who doesn't learn it.

>>11772874
Payday is a TM

>>11772874
>>11772912
If you throw away the payday TM and all your other items, release all your mons except for one magikarp, black out until you have no money, and smash your cartridge with a hammer, you can softlock your game!! What an oversight, I hope those peaky devs committed sudoku for their unacceptable behavior

>>11773023
like I said, it's completely stupid but it just feels uneven to have a wild pokemon that can have it in one game, encountered at a level where it'd have it, but not in the other. The move itself exists entirely as a way to make small money as a backup source, so it's just strange the gimmick Pokemon for it is only in one game.
Meowth appears in both FR and LG instead of being version exclusive(and of course more importantly, there's the VS seeker) in the remakes which I thought was interesting

>>11773060
Gen 1 doesn't have an endgame really. It wasn't thought of. You really were meant to just beat the elite 4, catch mewtwo and call it a day.

>>11773083
Stadium exists, mate

>>11772795
Not my problem.

>>11773023
Yellow lets you into the Safari Zone for free with only one Safari Ball if you can't afford the entrance fee, so that you can at least get the important items needed to progress.

>>11772874
>>11773023
a competent developer's response to this situation:

>>11772698
>With the very exception of Electabuzz, all of Blue's exclusives are better for in-game or competitive.
Lmao

>>11772795
I believe him.

>>11766868
Same here. One thing that's really dumb but bothers me most is that in RGY you don't have that meter showing you how much exp. you have on any given pokemon

>>11767531
Wait wat

>>11773378
Is there any romhack which adds just that to RBY? Maybe also make the low health beep go the fuck away, that was the only part I never liked at all about the original games.

>>11773651
If there isn't a hack that only does that, it would be incredibly easy to make one, in fact here's a tutorial which basically just involves cloning the decomp repository, editing some files in a text editor, and adding a .png to be imported into the game as sprites before building the project as a ROM:
https://github.com/pret/pokered/wiki/In%E2%80%90battle-EXP-bar

Couldn't tell you how exactly to remove the critical HP sound but that should absolutely be doable somehow with a small code change somewhere as well.

>>11767523
What the fuck is this shit?

>>11773659
What the fuck am I supposed to do with this?

>>11773906

>>11767935
NTA but you are a retard. Battling is without a doubt the main point of the entire series

>>11774484
Maybe to you, but your opinion doesnt matter considering you were born after the first game came out.

>>11774496
In its earliest concept art they were designing a game where you'd battle monsters that you caught from the wild. What would you say the point is if not battles? That's the vast majority of what you do in any given game.

eventually gba remake fans will get replaced by let's go pikachu/eevee fans.
removing random battles destroys the game imo.
they kept the same dungeon layouts but you can walk from entrance to exit without encountering a single pokemon.
and if you do get an encounter you walked into, you just throw balls.
no battles outside of trainers.
its fucking awful.

>>11774519
I'm not so sure if they'll ever get fully replaced, LGPE was just a one-off thing they tried and it was more of an excuse to have a Switch tie-in for Pokemon Go than anything else.

>>11773378
Just check their status screen you lazy fuck

>>11774510
Its a role playing adventure, the point of the game is going on an adventure. When you make fire punch scale with attack it doesnt affect the adventure in any meaningful capacity.

>>11774131
I ain't no programammer, you expect me to write and compile code and shit?

>>11768049
>Zooms are the only ones who would consider the original rbg superior because of historical brand recognition
Wrong.

I like the originals better because I was in from day 1, and I remember what Pokemon was like before it BECAME a brand and got "refined" into an evergreen style. I get more nostalgia out of the wonkey gritty Gen1 sprites or this early manga Pikachu design than I do any of the streamlined post Yellow Version artwork, because that's when I was most in love with the series

>>11774585
You don't need to do anything really except open those files in a text editor and change the lines to what it says. I had zero experience with any of this stuff and made a Crystal hack that fixes all the bugs and added in a Linking Cord item so trade evolutions could evolve in single-player. It's actually way easier than it looks thanks to these tutorials that tell you exactly what to do.

>>11766919
>it took away a feature that was seen as a total slog and pointless to players
Gen 3 did nothing wrong.

>>11767396
HOLY SHIT K.ROOL IS BACK

>>11766782
>HG/SS are rare examples of excellent remakes.
>>>

>>11766796
Pokemania was the sole reason GameFreak fucking fumbled in Johto, they went for a safe route because they knew they weren't going to strike lightning twice. They wanted to try and go back but the Pokemania reserves are all gone by Crystal's release.

>>11774772
>>11766919
day/night cycles were annoying. an interesting concept, would work if this was a PC game not a quick play session handheld. nobody wants to have to wait until 4AM to catch the Pokemon they want on their team, or need to cut school/work, or interrupt dinner, etc

>>11767523
>Didn'tSaveArtistNames,Sorry.png
His name is Hiroshisaiwai.
It's a dot artist who draws parodies of retro video game titles made and released in Japan.
Also a scat artist, and also started doing scat related game parodies, since it's a popular guro fetish now.

>Inb4 ewwww why did you mention that!!
Because I fucking hate you /v/eddit normalfag coomers so much, get filtered or go back to twitter.

>>11774550
It ruins the adventure when my cool boxing champion I'm journeying with that the game tells me is the most powerful puncher ever sucks at punching things.

>>11769895
They're were a too busy playing Scamco garbage like Xevious

>>11774815
Cool buddy you can play all the non-retro pokemon games that you like and talk about them on /vp/ with all the other zoomsters.

>>11770802
Pokemon and Smash fags have it too good whenever a dev has to haul their old favorite toys to the upcoming title.

Remember when Game Freak invented the Dark type and made it Special based for damage and suddenly every pokemon that knew how to Bite suddenly started sucking at it?

>>11771490
>anti-
Do you live in a cult?

>>11772238
I wish Legpee actually adapted the orange islands but all we got was more nu-gen wankery like the alola paint girl appearing in the game for the fairy type gym.
>inb4 but she lived in Kanto
Don't care.

>>11772536
and we stop getting these type of remakes, possibly a even less held back one, for even more garbage 1:1 remakes because you guys bitch way too hard on ORAS.
now GameFreak thinks they either have to sell a meme Legends game or some garbage chibi funko remake to avoid any bitching and profit loss.

>>11772698
>Red version is just staight up garbage

>>11774785
Right looks better

>>11774830
Even the new Dark-types sucked at it, with the sole exception of Houndour which was tucked away in the Kanto victory lap postgame despite being a Johto pokemon.

>>11774881
the only dark type you could get before endgame in g2 was umbreon, a defensive pokemon who isn't good offensively lol

g2s pokemon distribution and type availability was pure ass

>>11774897
I remember a strategy a lot of people would use was teach Eevee Bite, then evolve it, now your Espeon was a powerful Psychic Type that could also kill ghosts easily. Because Biting is magic.

>>11774881
Dark type being special was dumb as hell (or a mistake) considering even the newly-added dark moves were all physical themed like mugging or harder biting, but
>Johto pokemon
It was a "newly discovered pokemon" at the time, not strictly linked to Johto in the way future generations all did with their new dexes. The formula hadn't been locked in and having a (stripped down) Kanto shoved in gave more room to spread them around for better or worse.

>>11774918
>It was a "newly discovered pokemon"
That's dumb. Somehow Houndour and Murkrow and Slugma etc just magically spawned in Kanto in the roughly three-year interim between RBY and GSC. Would have made way more sense for them to have been in another region that you simply couldn't visit back then.

>>11774918
Only the anime tried to claim that, not the games.

>>11774929
The games never claimed that the 100 added pokemon are Johto specific. In every generation afterward you have "Regional" and "National" pokedex listings, in GSC it's just "New" and "Old". The very first thing you're told to do is get a mysterious egg from one of Elm's buddies that turns out to be a pokemon egg, a brand new discovery that Elm is surprised by. The guy in each gym to tell you abut their type and weaknesses says "Jasmine uses the newly discovered steel-type. I don't know very much about it." Pokemon are mysterious, magical creatures and now there's more of them! And they do new things!

The additions in Gen 2 were consistently described as outright new, which was retconned when they realized that doesn't make sense if they want to keep adding more and more Pokemon or explore the setting further. Gen2 was a direct sequel to Gen1 in a way future generations weren't.

>>11775012
>The very first thing you're told to do is get a mysterious egg from one of Elm's buddies that turns out to be a pokemon egg, a brand new discovery that Elm is surprised by.
In the remakes his initial reaction is something like "uh this is just an egg who cares"

>>11775012
>>11774918
Nice, thanks for this info.

It's consistent with the idea that they weren't really planning far ahead with pokemon as many say, they were likely surprised at how Pokemon took the world by storm and were trying to ride that wave as best as they could.

>>11774864
I won't blame what happened to Diamond/Pearl on ORAS because ORAS was mostly positive reception besides some shit parts. What happened to DP was outsourcing to a fucking budget company that's even more budget than GF themselves, who phoned it in for a lazy Unity remake.
Never blame the fans for what choices are made at Game Freak. They don't actually listen to feedback much at all, they just do whatever the fuck they want. Scarlet/Violet is the perfect sign of that.

>>11772610
Terribly obscure mechanics and systems were not exclusive to Nintendo.

>>11775012
>newly discovered
>steel type
Trying to pretend that all this stuff was just there the whole time and nobody noticed until three years after the events of the first game is fucking hilarious for all the wrong reasons.

>>11775101
I mean typings in Pokemon are basically elemental/magic forces. No steel type doesn't mean steel literally didn't exist in their world, even Pokemon made of it, just that they didn't know there was a such thing as a steel type, aka steel mana/steel energy/whatever you wanna call it. Steel could have existed and obviously did, they just wouldn't know that it too is an elemental force like fire types, earth types, etc

And yes that's still stupid but this is a franchise for five year olds who's rules were made up as they went along

>>11775101
They're literal magic. Magnemite and Magneton became more metallic as time passed, blame the lavender radio tower or the power plant being repaired or whatever justification you want.

>>11775119
>just come up with some nonsensical headcanon to explain away lazy worldbuilding on behalf of the devs
Nah, don't think I will.

>>11775012
They retconned the Fairy-type in the same way. In X/Y, it's spoken of as a recent new development in Pokemon, but then OR/AS comes out and suddenly Fairy is treated as having always existed.

>>11775018
HG/SS also retcons the Togepi egg to be intentionally given out by the Kimono Girls as part of their trial to summon Ho-Oh/Lugia.

>>11776098
>HG/SS also retcons the Togepi egg to be intentionally given out by the Kimono Girls as part of their trial to summon Ho-Oh/Lugia.
Nu-pokemon is such trash.

>>11776104
No argument here in this case, which is why despite its own flaws, I consider Crystal to be superior to HG/SS.

>>11776139
Stuff like that is a defining feature of games after Gen 2. It's what the current audience is into, and part of why they have such trouble playing the original Gen 1 and 2 games. Complete shift in direction.

>>11775101
At the time Pokemon were meant to be more mysterious

>>11765858
The first shiny I found was in Crystal, in the National Park with the bug catching contest or whatever. It was a Venonat, and I thought my game glitched, so I panicked and turned the game off.

>>11774496
There's a good chance I am older than you as I quickly outgrew Pokemon yellow.

The games are about battling. Most of the gameplay is battling wild pokemon, trainers, gym leaders, evil teams the elite four and the champion. All of the secondary mechanics fuel to battle. In the early games you traversed the world through battle moves. You trade and level up pokemon to then battle them. Later games have added more variety and minigames wile cutting down on the grind since, but that doesn't change the core gameplay.

The point of the games is to battle monsters against each other. That is the entire concept. You are a retard.

>>11776816
nta, but I do think there's always been plenty to the games. Exploring, catching/collecting and the main story. Battling is certainly the number one thing in the games, but you can do a lot of other things with minimal battling if you like.

>>11774924
Eggs and baby Pokemon were also recently discovered.
>>11774929
Play GSC and Stadium 2, it's clearly spelt out in both cases

>>11776964
>Play GSC and Stadium 2, it's clearly spelt out in both cases
Where exactly is it mentioned? Is there some NPC that tells you this?

>>11776970
Other anons mentioned where in GSC, see >>11775012, for Stadium 2, in Earl's Academy on mechanics introduced in GSC refers to them in the same way

>>11774924
And houndoom is one of the best pokemon in penguin.

>>11774924
It says that they were recently discovered, what's so difficult to understand about that? They could have migrated in from elsewhere, maybe they previously lived in seclusion from humans and expanded into the routes between towns and cities

why even argue about this stuff when it's clear they didn't really put any real thought about pokemon's origins and foundations until gen 3? The world was just the real world with pokemon slapped on which is why you had stuff like LT. Surge being American, Mew being found in South America, ghastlies killing elephants, etc. Gens 1 and 2 they were essentially an extremely invasive "species" which definitely had to be cleaned up if it was going to be a long running series

>>11776983
Because it's a key difference between "old pokemon" (gens 1-2) and "nu pokemon" (gen 3 onwards). I don't think they didn't put any real thought, I think your comment actually shows that they did, it's just that it transformed into something so completely different with gen 3 that zoomers who never experienced RB when they first came out, or pokemania at all, get very confused when they try to understand what pokemon was originally trying to do

>>11776985
I find that most new fans understand what the first two gens were trying to do by now, they just think it's shit compared to what they did gen 3 onward. A lot of it is handwave-y "well these new pokemon just magically appeared one day!" and they prefer a relatively grounded explanation that they are basically the animals of the pokemon universe which have always been native to certain regions, with that naturally being reflected by regional pokedexes.

>>11776994
>just magically appeared one day
It's clear that you actually have zero understanding of what gens 1 & 2 were doing. I'm sorry you're a zoomer who missed out on pokemania, but you need to get over it

>>11777007
If it was doing something else, please do explain. Otherwise you're just covering for shitty worldbuilding that they threw in the rubbish bin and retconned.

>>11777007
You're talking like someone who started on gen 2. Explain slugma.

>>11777015
Slugma what?

>>11777020
exactly.

>>11777020
slugma dick, but not hard just a firm but gentle slug. Then repeatedly slugma dick until I magcargo all over your face

The real reason the Johto pokemon are treated like they don't exist is because we know GameFreak was waffling on every single one of them up until the game's release so they just treated them like none of them mattered while they finished the rest of the game.

>>11776816
>The games are about battling
No, you can battle in the games and you battle to progress but the main point is not to battle. The main point of Pokemon Stadium is to battle, the main point of Pokemon Showdown . com is to battle.

>>11777049
The main point is to battle. Everything you do in the game is just an excuse to battle, or to facilitate future battles. To catch pokemon, you battle. To train those pokemon, you battle. To get badges, you battle.

>>11768887
Pokémon is not about competitiveness, it's abour collecting wild monsters.

>>11777525
why did you reply to a post from last week while also choosing to ignore the entire rest of the discussion?

>>11766884
Abilities, you fucking retard

>>11777069
I told the same thing to another guy in this thread, go battle in the new games with the damage type split and the X moves and the dinogigamax and the extensive depthful battling. Noone is stopping you. Those games are obviously better because the battles are so great.

>>11774785
>Nooooo they changed Lance's personalityyy reeee kusogeee kusogeee

Retard

>>11778260
Oh you mean this super cryptic mechanic that no one had any idea what it did and had to be DATAMINED? Yeah, really fucking good addition.
If anything it only made people's autism worse making them think they're actually """"skillful"""" at a turn based game.

>>11767002
>mandatory
You can just reject following Bill, who then waits for you at the Cinnabar Pokemon Center if you decide you want to go later. They're not mandatory.

>>11778893
>you mean this super cryptic mechanic that no one had any idea what it did and had to be DATAMINED
You must be thinking of something else, because Abilities are stated plainly on your Pokémon's status pages.

>>11777525
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z4JeRKo3Rr4
Very first sentence spoken in a pokemon commercial is a girl asking "Do you want to have a Pokemon battle" to someone

>>11778928
>Insomnia
>Prevents sleep.
OH MAN THAT COULD MEAN ANYTHING THIS SHIT IS JUST WAY TOO COMPLICATED

>>11772238
In my eyes the thing that made the Sevii Islands perfect was the spread of gen 2 Pokemon that you could find throughout them. It was the perfect mix and rarity to really make those stand out, not to mention that gen 2 Pokemon were already super rare if you had played Ruby/Sapphire previously. They would not be able to do something that these days because nothing is rare anymore in terms of Pokemon species since you can just trade online with people. I think the only thing that they could have possibly done to take it over the top was perhaps allow people to freely go to Navel Rock and Birth Island by locking those two things to ridiculous post-game completion while of course still having the actual events for people to go to at that time to get a shortcut (maybe Navel Rock requires you to do everything else in Sevii Island including catching all available Pokemon there, Birth Island you need to complete that + enter the HoF 100 times). Maybe it's because I was young or maybe it really was done with surgical care while building upon the previous pair of games expectations but it certainly was a good experience.

>>11778935
SAVE ME DATAMINERS!

saying pokemon games aren't about battling is one of the most asinine things I've ever seen

>>11778958
I didnt say they weren't about battling I said its not the main point which reinforces my assertion that editing a pokemons battle stats and giving them a move that does more damage doesnt meaningfully change the games experience. I can't wait to restate my position again after another person misinterprets it or someone changes their previous statement then starts arguing that instead.

>>11765817 (OP)
All remakes are mistakes.

>>11778260
One minor change to how battles work, meanwhile the actual formula is a carbon copy of gen 1

The /vp/ zoomers have arrived, there goes the thread.

>>11778994
the zoomers never leave, they are always here. Ironically this board adores remakes

>>11778994
>>11778997
Maybe pokemon threads belong on /vp/ or something

>>11779004
I just want to talk about gens 1 & 2 without having to deal with braindead adhd retards

>>11779004
no one actually talks about the games on vp, it's all just retarded coomers

>>11778917
Doesn't the Viridian Gym remain closed until you've finished your first island trip?

>>11779008
when a remake exists all discussion becomes a compare and contrast argument and the community is permanently fractured. This is true for every series and its my #1 complaint about remakes.

>>11778993
Abilities make a big difference, as do double battles, and weather to a smaller extent. Adding that and bugfixes onto Gen 1's combat I'd say is a great improvement.

>>11778893
>Oh you mean this super cryptic mechanic that no one had any idea
It literally tells you what they do on the stat screen, you retard

>>11779046
Stadium did all the bugfixes necessary

>>11779004
Sure, and every retro RPG belongs on /vrpg/, and every retro strategy game belongs on /vst/, and every retro multiplayer game belongs on /vm/

>>11778941
sevii had a boring plot and no replay value whatsoever
ruby and sapphire had a lot of shit to do of varying quality, you could make secret bases, grow berry plants, go through the battle tower, fill out the museum portraits. frlg has nothing comparable, trainer tower is boring since it never changes and doesn't give prizes, there's nothing to build or do or collect

>>11779725
When listing side-content in RSE how can you forget about contests and going for ribbons, one of the best ways the series has used its battle mechanics and moves for an entirely different purpose

i remember playing ruby, wishing i'd got sapphire, then feeling cheated when fr/lg came out because i just wanted to play with the good ones, not the weird ones.

>>11767895
The enemy is on the same playing field as you either way

true

>>11779870
Pokémon is legitimately the only series where I’ve seen people on this website insist that a remake is better.

>>11780287
RE

>>11778928
>>11779076
I think xe got it confused with either hidden abilities (which weren't in gen III) or natures, because I personally never figured out what natures did until I looked up up just now because the game doesn't really tell you from what I remember.

>>11780368
>the game doesn't really tell you from what I remember
did you really just reply to an image showing that the game tells you what abilities do and replied that you think the game doesnt tell you what abilities do?

>>11780372
oh sorry you said natures, I dont remember if gen 3 color coded the stats that were boosted by natures or if that was gen 4

>>11780374
I too have no idea what nature does

>>11780376
Raises one stat by 10%, lowers another by 10%. It's used for minmaxing competitive builds. You probably won't notice too much unless playing in the post-game facilities or against competent players.

>>11780439
Thank you. It's a fun detail

>>11779761
that was implied by "fill out the museum portraits" but sure i agree

>>11780482
There are neutral natures too, they raise and lower the same stat effectively doing nothing

>>11778975
Pokemon is about battling, retard

>>11778928
Of course I'm talking about natures, EVs and IVs, don't play retard just to make me look worse.

Abilities are fine even if some are clearly OP while others are just useless.

>>11778928
>>11779076
I might have replied to the wrong post, I meant EVs, IVs and natures, not abilities.

>>11780368
Yes, that's what I meant alongside natures and the other hidden values, I'm afraid I replied to the wrong post because now I see it mentioned abilities.

>>11781040
>Pokemon is about WHAT I say it is, fuck Tajiri's initial vision

Consider getting a Celebi, traveling back in time and doing an abortion on yourself.
Pokemon was born out of Tajiri's love for collecting stuff, battles were an afterthought added by Nintendo to help the game sell and add a small layer of investment and to justify the link cable.

If you think you can just go out there and tell Tajiri's what his own game is about you must be insane. You just CAN'T look at the huge autism fest and tedium that is raising A SINGLE STAT competitively and think it's ok and fun. It's not.

>>11781093
>>11781097
Everyone makes mistakes, but mind that people are gonna interpret the words that you use, even if they weren't what you really meant. Clarifying mistakes like these are a good habit.

Anyway, I'm actually not that much in favor of IVs and EVs, but at the same time, I've flat ignored them ever since they were introduced, and since I don't care about any tourney shit or even bother with any multiplayer fighting, this has no real consequences.
Pokémon are mostly easygoing games, I don't take them that seriously, and it's how I like them, if I want a challenge I prefer other sorts of games. I really like Abilities because of how they make Pokémon a lot more distinct from each other, making them a bit more than only their numerical stats and typing.

While I don't particularly care for EVs and IVs, I can tolerate them. However, Natures feel like just bad design given that what they do is to randomly boost or handicapp a Pokémon if you're the kind of person who actually WANTS to do the powergaming with EVs and IVs.
Your starter or legendary got a poor Nature? Oh well, reset and try again or go fuck yourself. Doesn't affect me, but it's gonna be needlessly fucking annoying and tedious for powergamers, and while G R I N D is certainly the powergamer's lot, I don't feel that this is a particularly good or compelling type of grind. This is why I ignore EVs and IVs.

>>11781134
NTA but vision or intent =/= actual execution.

The entire core of the gameplay and almost all of it's mechanics revolves or funnels around battling monsters.

You are the same type of people who would go on about "MUH MEDIA LITERACY" because some retarded director intended something to be a certain way despite how it's actually portrayed.

>>11781587
That guy continued my argument that I gave up on but hes wrong too. Apparently noone on this board is capable of even the simplest forms of abstract thought.

>its a game where you battle so the point of the game is to battle!
>its a game where you catch pokemon so the point of the game is to catch pokemon!

>>11781596
Catching pokemon is just another excuse to battle.

>>11781606
I already quoted your opinion you dont have to restate it to me

>>11781596
You don’t have to catch a single pokemon to reach the credits. Not the same for battling.

>>11781617
>it's just ur opinyun
It's a fact. Battling is at the core of everything you do. You can't refute that.

>>11781621
>>11781623
you people are literally so fucking stupid its not worth replying. I have no idea what youre even reading and I cant even fathom what you think my opinion is despite me making it clear very frequently in this thread.

>>11781621
>You don’t have to catch a single pokemon to reach the credits.
You got a path for this run? Like which gift pokemon do you need to get for the HMs and such.

>>11782130
Pretty easy I imagine
>Charmander/izard learns Cut, Strength
>Gift Vaporeon/Lapras learns Surf
>Flash/Fly are completely optional and only for convenience

>>11782146
Zard can learn Fly in Yellow, and Jolteon can learn Flash if you really care about access to all HMs

>>11782146

You can get an Abra and use Teleport and Flash. Teleport works fairly well as a Fly alternative.

I'm just gonna throw out there the definite fact that only like 20 percent of the gameboy owning population actually even owned link cables to battle with

Pokemania in gen1 was such a huge craze, prob like 70 percent of the people playing it like played the campaign, grew out of it, and moved on, and then only a small number of super nerds (i was one) really got into playing through link cable

>>11782164
Flash only matters for Rock Tunnel so by time you can get the gift Eevee it's pointless.
>>11782205
You'd have to catch one, and this was specifically no catching.
If you really wanted to bend the rules you could also use Stadium 1's feature of gift pokemon you get for clearing the cups/gym leader castle for more starters/fossils/eevees/hitmons.

>>11782343
True, this actually sounds like a fun challenge

>>11782237
I didn't know a single person with a GB/GBC link cable (unlike in the GBA era where third party cables were very cheap and accessible), but my friends and I did all our trading through Stadium 1/2 since most people who were into Pokemon also had an N64 with Stadium and a transfer pak

>>11782343
You can win an Abra playin slots.

>>11782606
Oh, touche. I completely forgot the Game Corner. Still, post Rock Tunnel.

>>11782237
>>11782351
Did you guys slither out of favelas? I went to an inner-city public school and pretty much everyone had a link cable, even the blacks.

>>11782343
>Flash only matters for Rock Tunnel
Lowering accuracy is incredibly useful and something that doesn't fall off even by the end of the game.
It's just one of those things Pokemon players can't wrap their heads around because "it doesn't do damage so it must be bad".

>>11782237
>>11782351
Your experiences are not universal.

>>11782237
>>11782351
Seems crazy to me, my friends and I battled and traded all the time on the school bus, though pretty sure I was the only one who ever completed the Pokedex. Even when I visited other cities I'd meet kids with Pockets and Colors who would trade mons with me, I met one kid with a Gameshark even.
The cards were kind of the opposite, lots of kids collected them but nobody knew how to play the card game. I had to teach my friends (and I only knew how to play from playing the Game Boy TCG game)

>>11782914
Exact same for me regarding trades. I think the bus driver got annoyed by how the various link cables would be stretched over the aisle.

>>11782914
>>11782961
In my neck of Florida, I never once saw anybody play Pokemon. Given how likely having your Game Boy stolen was, if they were playing Pokemon, they only did so at home.

>>11783192
i grew up in an affluent area and never seen anyone with a link cable

>>11782747
>less accurate sand attack
I'll pass.

>>11782747
Boosting your evasion with something like Double Team is more useful than lowering accuracy. In a game as easy as Pokemon, you're better off boosting your attack and speed stats to one shot everything instead.

>>11775012
what did it feel like to get 100 new pokemons when the pokemania was in full force?

>>11765817 (OP)
no u

>>11782343
>If you really wanted to bend the rules you could also use Stadium 1's feature of gift pokemon you get for clearing the cups/gym leader castle for more starters/fossils/eevees/hitmons.
Even still, none of this gets you flash before the rock tunnel. Jolteon can only be obtained once you have a thunderstone, which is in celadon. You'd have to play pokemon yellow and have pikachu for flash.

i tried it for a few hours the other day and its dogshit. they tutorialised the hell out of it, sanded off all the rough edges, its total slop for children. none of the appeal of the OG.

>>11783340
Way too many felt underwhelming and cutsey. Marril, Snubbull, Pichu? Felt like a direct response to Digimon having baby forms. Then you had things like Stantler and Qwilfish that just looked like animals, or Sunflora, just a sunflower. It was incredibly flat and didn't feel like there was 100 new pokemon. I certainly don't mean things need to be edgy or "cool" like Scizor or Houndoom. I think Sudowood is a great, a tree that's petrified wood so its rock, or Ampharos is a unique looking creature that comes from a sheep. Nearly 20% of the 100 new pokemon are connected to old pokemon. And you know, I think Elekid is neat, but did we really need it? Is it more neat than Electabuzz? It didn't feel like the 100 new pokemon did enough, they didn't move the series forward.

>>11783703
Elekid allows you to get an Electabuzz early...in theory, but GameFreak only wanted you to get it through breeding an already fully grown Electabuzz or the extra Egg in crystal.

>>11783842
And you can't even catch an Electabuzz until Kanto.

>>11783668
For me it seems about the same, except I have nostalgia for the original.

But fucking hell these games are slow as fuck. Playing with fast forward would be fine if it didn't disable sound.

>>11783842
Pre-evolutions are just a very stale idea. The minimal thing they do now is expanding a movepool. Tyrogue is obviously different. Introducing him and Hitmontop was a neat idea. Needing to get new pokemon through hatching eggs, only for them to be weaker forms of those pokemon? It's cumbersome and disappointing. They could have done something daring with the babies, like give them each one freakishly high stat. Like, you'd have Pichu, with mostly low stats, but it's faster than Raichu. That's better than just being the muppet babies of the franchise.

>>11783881
>The minimal thing they do now is expanding a movepool.
Mostly with cutesy status stuff like Charm and Sweet Kiss.

Honestly, I would completely buy the baby forms if half of them weren't given to pokemon that already looked like babies.
Like, instead of Pichu, Cleffa and Iggly, we got baby Tauros, baby Lapras or baby Kangaskhan.
Lapras specifically would be cool because it's been established as an endangered species in gen 1 so it having a baby form would be a real discovery.

>>11783910
I agree, but they probably weren't thinking about game lore or battling when designing the babies. It was more about making cute designs for the anime and merchandise.

Tauros and Miltank not getting a connecting Baby in Gen 2 is exactly the shit Im talking about. They had opportunities to expand lore and do neat things. Instead its Smoochum.

>>11783928
They did that... with Tyrogue! (lmao)

>>11765817 (OP)
I feel like without the flaws of the original titles, Kanto gets exposed as the boring region it truly is. That's the reason why gen 1 continues to get so much love. Most know that it's barely held together with duct tape but that's the charm. It feels far less corporate and soulless compared to the arguably more polished games that came after. That combined with the nostalgia of Pokemania as a whole make Red and Blue fun to return to. At least Game Freak being incompetent back then made sense because they were literally creating a new IP from scratch.

>>11784047
>most open ended region is the most boring
I guess you like being told which hallways to walk down at every point, huh

>>11783934
I wish Tyrouge could have done the concept better. Imagine if the egg moves it got were moves it got as it leveled, to make it seem like it was learning how to fight the styles it'd eventually grow into. And imagine if Hitmontop was a proper balance between punching and kicking instead of just "more kicking".

>>11784049
I meant boring in that all the regions that come after it have way better landmarks and cities that stick out better whereas the cities in Kanto definitely feel like a first attempt at an idea that isn't fully realized yet that's also hurt by the technical limitations of the time. The fact that it's more open ended doesn't really matter because the end goal is still the same.

>>11784063
The first couple gens felt more grounded, later on they focused too much on making regions feel like themeparks full of tourist traps. I gave Hoenn a pass since a tropical island feeling like a sightseeing vacation made sense and you were actually playing as someone who just moved from Johto, but after that it got kind of old. I can see why people who are into that would find the opposite boring however. There are lots of things that seem to split the fanbase around these gens.

>>11784150
Hoenn would entirely make sense as a reasonable geographic area if the desert was west of Mt Chimney rather than east. Humid air blows in from the east, hits the volcano and is forced to rise, dropping that water to form the rainy, overgrown areas in the middle of the island and an arid region on the other side. Even beyond that the only particularly outlandish feature is Sootopolis being in a big crater or caldera of some kind.

>11784428
autism

>>11774519
I agree that as bad as Fire Red is, Let's go is infinitely worse. It's soul less, lacks all challenge, and neuters the plot even further. Your rival gives you gifts. WTF.

>>11767384
Late af but definitely emerald. The cool post game battle frontier facility offers the most tactical single player content of the series up to that point. The gym leaders are quite good in that game too, but not ruby/sapphire as they have worse ai/teams/movesets in those. Also double battles are pretty neat.

>>11784462
Soulless vs soullesser

Pokemon isn't about battling!!!!!!!
Can you beat the game as a pacifics?
No...
Game is about battling than.Like any other jrpg, which Pokemon is.

>>11784518
I have no idea how they managed to do it. It's like Pokemon has less soul every gen for the mainline games.

>>11786129
You're getting older.

>>11777525
>I would lose in a competitive world

>>11786448
games are more commercial and made by multibillion dollar companies that have long since abandoned making art in favor of making millions of dollars.
including the fact that many are publicly traded which means that profiting investors is legally required by law.
also there's the fact that many, many people could lose their careers if a game fails (with regard to big companies), so "risky" design choices are avoided.

>>11786491
You're an adult and have become aware of realities.

>>11786493
>>11786681
Fuck both of you faggots.

>>11777043
>>11777015
In one thread someone theorized that it emerged due to the volcanic activity that destroyed cinnabar island- the volcano blasting it out of the earth, i suppose eruptions can blast stuff far away

>>11765858
>until my game crashed
I've legit never experienced a game crash on any gameboy ever

>>11774785
HGSS is such unbelievable dogshit

>>11787278
The eruption did reach as far as Fuchsia City as they're still clearing out the debris on the southern beach until you reach Pallet Town and surf far enough on the water routes to the south.

>>11786129
I truly enjoyed PLA, but I'm not sure if it's just because it was actually good or if my expectations were just insanely low by that point.

>>11786129
It's actually really easy to understand. Games are being made under a microscope, a ton of bureaucracy, committees and corporate bullshit more than ever.

>>11787372
Yeah, and GSC was even worse.

>>11787367
I have experienced many, but I only owned bootlegged gba pokemon games back then

And then there's the Diamond-Pearl remake.

They killed the game corner because "gambling" and replaced with with a blank room and a closed sign. Why they couldn't have come up with a replacement game is beyond me. It's not like Pokémon Pinball didn't already exist. Or Surfing Piklachu as a minigame. Just give tickets based on score like in an arcade.

>>11787961
It's actually even worse than Lets Go. At least sometimes there is an attempt at soul in that one, even if nerfed to hell and back to appeal to the Pokemon Go crowd. Pic related.

>>11787961
dp isn't retro, and so neither is its remake

>>11787971
>September 28, 2006
Off by one year. Getting very close to retro.

>>11788057
go read the sticky again

>>11788073
Never mind, it was very early DS not Gameboy Advance. You're right. Soon, though. Soon. lol.

>>11787961
Yep, and for those not in the know you can than the European ratings system for the Game Corners being axed (one of the worst parts of HG/SS desu). PEGI told them to either remove it from all of their games released in that region, replace it with something explicitly non-gambling, or deal with an adult rating for the game. GameFreak didn't want to have to keep programming entirely different Game Corners for one region, so they just dropped the concept. G/S/C originally had both a card game and slots, so for HG/SS they split the two, where Japan got the slots and the West got the card game, which was reworked to have gambling elements removed and turned into a minesweeper sort of thing.

>>11789118
>than
thank*

>>11789118
South Korea banned the Game Corner first in Diamond and Pearl, then Platinum extended the ban to Europe. In both cases, they dummied out all the slot machines to be non-functional. Instead, you can check the machines daily and some of them will randomly have leftover coins in the bin.

>>11789158
Even just having the machines was too much after a certain point, they were told they needed to be removed entirely

>>11789197
Given how the Game Corner is a crucial element of the Team Rocket storyline, the Let's Go games changed it to a non-gambling game arcade. Still don't get to play the machines, though.

CAN'T LET THESE KIDS GET ADDICTED TO THE SLOTS

>>11789993
There's so many slots in Celadon that you don't know where to begin.

>>11789993
This was such a garbage decision, because nothing about the slots in Pokemon games was enjoyable.

>>11772698
Magmar > Electabuzz
Pinsir > Scyther (I prefer Scizor to both)
Persian > Primeape (In the original RBGY)
Victreebel > Vileplume
Ninetailes > Arcanine

Blue Wins no Context

>>11791270
>Pinsir > Scyther
I respect it, but I think this is actually the first time I've heard this opinion

>>11791270
Is this personal reference or has some gameplay metric?
Magmar being the prefered one is a hot take desu.

>>11791876
I've seen some people who really like Magmar.
It's not like the design is bad, so I get it even if I don't agree.

>>11789118
> GameFreak didn't want to have to keep programming entirely different Game Corners for one region, so they just dropped the concept.
Should have just dropped the region

>>11791270
>Persian > Primeape (In the original RBGY)
I like Persian, but Primeape is an early and great fighting type. It's a really solid pokemon

interesting how no one can actually articulate what gen 3 did that was backwards relative to gen 2 (in terms of mechanics)

>>11793064
Does emerald have night time? Weird if I never happened to see it

>>11793064
Compiling the arguments I've seen on /vp/ and /vr/
>little to no use of real time clock (it's in RSE but used less than in GSC, and isn't in FRLG at all)
>no transferring old pokemon to the new games
>ugly sprites
>ugly pokemon designs
>can't visit old regions
>too many new pokemon, especially ones that are copies of old ones
>no new types
>have to buy a ton of games to catch em all (they even took the catchphrase off the boxes)
>worse villains
>unnecessary Shonen plots with legendary pokemon
>natures are likely to make your pokemon worse, and add little of value to the game
>abilities aren't that interesting and are often just annoying to deal with
>gba sounds worse than chiptune, soundtrack is too brass heavy

>>11793128
>>ugly pokemon designs
The designs were an improvement over Gen 2, which was a massive, corporate-directed regression

>>11793448
I agree but that is what they argue

>>11765817 (OP)
Lazy cash grab. It's not completely pointless however. Because of this game and HGSS, every good pokemon gen can be played on the original DS.

>>11772639
Gary's starter was Squirtle in the anime, he just also has an Eevee

>>11789118 >11787961
HGSS gave us Voltorb flip which is at least a fun replacement

>>11793064
That one autist who was complaining about EVs and natures despite seething about competitive. Not even compfags think the stat exp system was better.

>>11794110
This wouldn't have been as shitty if they still let us buy coins if we didn't feel like playing it. Japan got that privilege.

>>11765817 (OP)
I prefer the originals but I'm still very grateful for FR/LG because they created a great foundation for romhacks.

>>11768226
It took me a second to figure out how you did this. That's pretty neat.

>>11794693
>take away 200,000 yen
>give myself one of the beam/bolt/flamethrower TMs
thanks pkhex

>>11765858
I used to constantly replay Crystal as a kid. Both me and my brother had a bootleg cartridge, and once I got a GBA, I'd use his cartridge and our old GBC to trade any important Pokemon over before starting a new game. Ended up with an army of red Gyarados, shiny babies from that egg, a shiny Noctowl and a damn shiny Lugia, but my cartridge's screw got lost somehow so the thing was pretty loose and I was constantly worried the battery might move and erase my whole collection. I ended up finding an original copy on eBay (this was before the prices went insane), transferred everything over and put it on the shelf, my mind finally at ease. Like a month later I decide to check up on it and
>The battery has run dry. The save data has been deleted.
Up until that point I was under the assumption that this couldn't happen on an original cartridge and saves were permanent there.
Anyway, thanks for reading my blog.

>>11770258
this is not how that mechanic worked. "swarm" pokemon (marill, snubbull, yanma, etc) were always available at a 1% encounter rate. the "unlocking" you are describing actually instead increased that 1% to 30-40% (or even more if the swarm encounter is behind fishing)

>>11789213
I would be perfectly willing to forgive losing the Game Corner if it was replaced with an arcade full of fun playable minigames.

>>11789213
>>11795194
>Team Rocket, the eeeeevil criminal organization, with the insidious plan to... run a legitimate on the books business.

>>11794695
I wish everything from before gen 4/5 was fanhacked into gen 4/5 remakes

>>11793041
>Fighting type in gen 1
>Great
Anon....

>>11795632
yes, being a good fighting type in gen 1 is great. suggesting otherwise just because psychic types exist would be like scoffing at using a fire type in gen 1 because water types exist.

>>11795698
Fire types have flamethrower and fire blast. I'm using a Machoke in my current blue playthrough and being fighting really isn't a big upside. Your entire set of options for using your type against normals (rock gets stomped on by the surf user you're required to have) are: Low kick, 50bp, 90% accuracy, or Submission, 80bp, 80 accuracy, with self-damage as an extra fuck you. A good fighting type in Gen 1 is a chunk of attack to throw around earthquakes and body slams and hyper beams, not to actually use its typing.

>>11795878
You don’t need to have STAB on every Pokémon. The games weren’t designed like that originally.

>>11796420
I'm not an "Every Pokemon needs a 100bp, 100 accuracy STAB move or it's garbage" person, but the only thing Gen 1 fighting pokemon bring to the table is a beatstick of an Attack stat and a weakness to the best type in the game. Plenty of others do the first part just as well, but also with more varied movepools and more useful resistances. Kingler is an example of a Pokemon that doesn't need to be decent at using its STAB. It has the Attack to punch things to death with the usual Normal TMs or its levelup moves, and also has the option for weaker Water or Ice moves and Swords Dance to go hog wild. Fighting types don't get that.
If Focus Energy worked I wouldn't even be so down on them, both Mankey and Machop get it and fishing for crits to Fist of the North Star opponents would at least be thematic.

>>11795279
Sometimes you need a legit looking front.