Thread 11838490

I'm gonna say it, it left me disappointed in 2001, and over the years I still haven't warmed up to it. No amount of zoomer revisionism will change my opinion of the game.

Yeah man we get it literally everything is zoomer/Youtube eceleb revisionism and every well regarded game used to be hated back in the days and we were all disappointed by everything that wasn't the Saturn or Neo Geo Pocket or some shit

I'm gonna say it, it left me disappointed in 1983, and over the years I still haven't warmed up to it. No amount of zoomer revisionism will change my opinion of the game.

4 and everything after is significantly worse

>>11838490 (OP)
>No amount of zoomer revisionism will change my opinion of the game.
Your brain is actually so fucked up. You have words that arent properly allocated to the correct meanings up there and you very clearly cannot observe reality in a healthy way. Serious mental decline and its very dangerous. You might need to start over and read dr seuss books or something I dont know what to tell you

Imagine buying ZoE just to get a MGS2 demo. feels good man

>>11838490 (OP)
by far the worst MGS game
yes even Portable Kino is better than this glorified Movie Game

>>11838578
The most damning thing for me is how no one ever brings light to how dogshit the gameplay loop is. Everything gets hand-waved by the meta narrative and Kojima predicting the internet (which defo didn't exist in 2001) but no one ever says anything about how awful the entire plant chapter is to play.

>>11838490 (OP)
I could not care less about the new graphics. Everything looks too plasticky and fake. Gameplay is boring after the first ten minutes and characters/locations are bland

>>11838490 (OP)
I liked the part where you run around as a naked twink

>>11838578
Not even close to being the worse. The worst is a tie between portable ops and the open world field simulator.

>>11838595
>gameplay loop
This isn't open world bethesda slop. There is no loop. It has beginnings and endings.

>>11838490 (OP)
I liked the oil rig, despite everyone seemingly hating it. It was a nice sandbox where you could go berserk and play GTA style, plus it had a nice atmosphere with the pigeons and it was something different.

>>11838639
ok, call it moment-to-moment gameplay, gamefeel or whatever tickles you fancy. I feel like actually playing through the plant chapter is miserable, and there's a reason why people only discuss the ending narratives and themes. even the boss fights were underwhelming

>>11838537
Holy shit I love brutal posts like this. It's so true, I worry for a lot of anons who just resort to ad-hominem instead of tackling a conversation with an open mind.

>>11838639
>gameplay loops only exist in games with no ending
That's not what it means.

>>11838490 (OP)
I remember being absolutely floored by how brilliant MGS3 was in the early 2000s. I remember thinking it was my favorite game of all time, and telling myself right then that no matter what I ever played, it would never top this.

I went on to play MGS1 and MGS2, and both were "good" but neither had that same magic.

>>11838543
ZoE is pretty fun, so I wouldn't have complained at the time.

>>11838490 (OP)
That was MGS3 for me. I was obsessed with mgs1 and mgs2 blew my mind. I must have played through that game 20+ times as a kid, but I was severely disappointed in MGS3 when I open it up on Xmas. I even replayed it recently on a ps2 with a crt and I can't put my finger on it. It just feels cheap or something. Its ugly brown & green shit filter doesn't help. There's alot of dumb mechanics like camo, eating, healing, etc. Maybe its because mgs1&2 had a similar style to them. Nice clean interiors where everything is easy to see and simple. Fuck mgs3, its the beginning of Kojima really smelling his own farts

>>11838490 (OP)
>>11838537
the game is alright and is probably the last best "traditional" metal gear game before the series shifted towards immersive sims & millsims but the psudes that pretend it was this misunderstood masterpiece we just didn't get at the time is are just retarded.

there's enough documentation on MGS2 to disprove most of MGS2's storytelling "nuances" that people like to wank dead author theory over.

>>11838490 (OP)
That's your problem, anon. It's my favorite game of all time, but I couldn't give a shit whether (you) like it or not.

>>11838490 (OP)
Are you still mad you got bait and switched into playing Raiden? It's still a classic stealth game

>>11839205
this. so many people were butthurt because raiden put a tickle in their tummy, so they pretended they were tricked.

>>11838647
I think it's fine. you have several overarching missions to complete to keep you going and a few bosses here and there. maybe it never amounts to anything impressive but I don't really get saying it's shit as something glaringly obvious that everyone would just immediately understand why.

>>11838490 (OP)
I like everyone else was disappointed by the bait and switch and the time we got with snake and otacon being painfully short but I got over it. It's a pretty clever sci-fi conspiracy thriller with some fun novelties along the way.

>>11838490 (OP)
There isn’t zoomer revisionism, because zoomers never played it, but millennials will swear up and down that it was brilliant for its time because it was. The graphics were crisp and the controls were tight. You didn’t need to be a shooter kid to get good at it, just use your wits and there were so many ways to engage the enemies. I played this game around 2004 just because it got a 10 and I had to say it was very well deserving of its 10. I wanted to say that it was the perfect shooter game but again it wasn’t made for shooter bros. I felt like Halo/Halo 2 was a better shooter game at the time, but MGS2 was a better game overall. 20 years later it still looks good and is fun as hell to play. That said, most of its praise was from magazines, not schoolyards, though you would occasionally see the solid snake fan. I don’t think a shooter game got real schoolyard praise in the same way that Halo did until Bioshock came out. So now there you go I just changed the topic of your thread. Will any amount of tween revisionism warm you up to the original Bioshock?

>>11839259
Bioshock isn't as good as mgs2, but I thoroughly enjoyed getting good enough to take on big daddies in hand to hand combat. But now I hate those puzzles due to the mini game. I actually liked them but it's so tedious having to play it everytime youre hacking something. Abysmal. Mgs2 definitely just feels better to play. I love the movement in both mgs2 and 3. They don't play like anything else and there is a great video about a similar topic here:
https://youtu.be/jCmmYF4rOwo?si=kG2bwIZU-rH5K6Rs

>>11838940
MGS3 was how I learned what fps was. 2 ran at a silky, consistent 60fps while 3 ran at 30 with drops when things got hectic. 3 grew on me over time but as one of the few people that actually really liked 2, 3 seemed to have a shitty story and had bad performance on the ps2 and felt like an all around step down at first

>>11838950
Milsims? Nigger you are fucking retarded

>>11838940
I actually really enjoy all the dumb little mechanics in MGS3 despite the facts that the menus are a pain in the ass. I would switch to random camos just for like five seconds of coverage in a unique environment then switch back. I found all the food and animals including The End's parrot, the hive of pain hornets and the tsuchinoko. Stamina killed the Fear with poisonous food. Threw tree frogs at Volgin. Also shot all the kerotans and boy was a pain in the ass.

Sometimes it was honestly more trouble than it was worth but I wasn't gonna *not* do all of it. In for a penny, in for a pound.

>>11838490 (OP)
Splinter Cell is so much cooler than this poser shit franchise

>>11838490 (OP)
It's not my favourite but I understand why some people think it's high kino

FUCK METAL GAY SOLID
FUCK SPLINT INCEL
FUCK SHITMAN
AND FUCK QUEEF

For all the zoomers who want to pretend they were there: 3 was the one that everybody loved, and the popular consensus was that 2 was still good but inferior because you had to play as a long haired gay guy instead of Snake.

>>11839491
>gay guy
>has a gf
just say you are jealous of his bishonen beauty, anon.

>>11838628
PO>PW
Roy>Kaz

I am so glad that MGS is still filtering retarded gamers after 20 years

>>11838950
>the series shifted towards immersive sims & millsims
>psudes
incredible level of retardation on display here

>>11839491
wdym snake is the gay one, he chose otacon over meryl

>>11838950
Millsim is not a meme.

>>11839432
>How can I make this non OoT thread into an OoT thread?
you guys are mentally ill. I mean it seriously.

>>11838490 (OP)
>filtered

I disliked Raiden on release and was left confused and wondering
>Who are the Patriots and how can they be dead over 100 years ago?
>How can they have a physical location that Liquid/Ocelot was bringing RAY to if they have been dead for 100 years?
>How much of this was real?
>How did we end up on top of Federal Hall from the previous cutscene? (wasn't aware of the censorship)
However I always loved playing MGS2 and over the years I've come to appreciate Raiden's role (lol) and what Kojima was trying to say: any of (You) could be Solid Snake, he's not special.

Despite Kojima's hatred of Solid Snake post-MGS1, I still like the speech Snake gives to the player at the end telling them to focus on the memories and feelings you've had over the years since you know those are real, then pass those on to the next generation using all the means available to us in this time of global communications.

>>11838490 (OP)
it has the best gameplay in the series and 60fps. yes the story is retarded but its metal gear. playing 3 after this is such a downgrade with 30fps and all the "survival" slop.

>>11839920
If calling things "slop" is a valid argumentation tactic, then MGS2 is pacman slop

>>11838537
But what he said is true and what happened. Zoomers rewrite history by saying X was always good or bad when the games were received entirely different in reality. You sound like an angry zoomer.

>>11838490 (OP)
Idk what zoomer revisionism has to do w MGS2. It sold 7 million copies on the ps2. Pretty sure a large majority enjoyed the game at the time. I know I did. In fact, I’ve put more hours in that demo alone then most games I’ve played to completion.

>>11839926
Pacman levels are bigger

>Ending is Snake saying to the camera "Live, love, laugh"
>This made Kojima a genius in the eyes of everyone

>>11838490 (OP)
The tanker is brilliant, everything after is garbage. Hated it.

>>11838490 (OP)
Will you feel better about it if I say la-li-lu-le-lo 10 times fast?

>Another codec call where your AI girlfriend trauma dumps on you for 30 minutes
>"wow this is genius!"

>>11840476
Truth is always obvious.

>>11839816
>how could the Patriots have been dead for over 100 years
Holy shit you’re gonna make me have a spergout about how much I despise MGS4 pussing out of a real explanation for this. I know back in 2008 or whatever I was probably the only person on planet earth that was hoping 4 would double down on the craziness of 2, but I honestly think “ghosts are real and they control the internet” would’ve been 1000x cooler than “oh btw big boss is still alive, lol I guess liquid was retarded and MGS1’s events were actually pointless sorry”

>>11839929
But why put so much weight on what people say or have said? You can dislike the game without going "muh zoomers", that sounds retarded.

>>11838490 (OP)
i liked it when it came out

>>11839538
>>11839509
>>11839538
>t.never played PO, PW, GZ or TPP
i know they're not retro but if you didn't see a shift after MGS3 then you either dropped the series after 3 or were in a coma for at least 20 years. if it's the later then you're in for one hell of a culture shock...

>>11839509
i'm sorry that you're not as smart as you think you are. maybe you should make a youtube essay explaining why i'm wrong.

>>11841514
3 killed off corridor stealth and I think the subsequent games did a great job iterating on the mgs3 gameplay formula. I think all the games play great in their own way except 4 (but that’s because I still feel like I barely know how to play it because there’s only like 3 hours of gameplay and half or more of that is gimmick shit)

The big shift after 3 is the massive decline in writing quality, which is honestly a shame because PMCs and AI turning foreverwars into a cornerstone of the world economy (4) and the English language being a powerful vector in destroying non-Western cultures (V) are way more interesting concepts on paper than ‘alliances change over time’. If kojima wasn’t so far up his own ass, he could’ve given a real writer some amazing story concepts that could’ve been great.

>>11841607
>The big shift after 3 is the massive decline in writing quality
It started with 3 not after it. It had no soul or meaning like the previous two.

>>11839491
my sense was that as polarizing as 2 was it still had hold of the zeitgeist, it was still bigger than just one game series. when 3 came around its relevance had shrunk to people were fans of mgs, it wasn't a phenomenon..

>>11841654
I will always beat this horse to death: following up one of the best selling titles in ps2 history w a prequel after leaving the series on a cliffhanger was THE dumbest thing I’ve ever seen. Even if mgs4 was retro I’d act like it didn’t exist. The opening interview is such cringe inducing shite maybe it’s better we never got an actual ending because obviously Kojima either lost his fastball or was intentionally trolling. Either way I will always seethe at 3.

Metal Gear Solid games are cut scene games, aren't they? MGS2 was the first and only one I've played so far and played it a couple years ago and was underwhelmed by it.

>>11841887
>the metal gear solid trilogy

>>11838490 (OP)
unironically its dated now.

>>11842762
frfr wheres the ots cam with double analog control scheme

>>11842762
I agree. An invisible hand controlling the flow of information maybe sounded far fetched in 2001, and it was shocking in 2015 because it started becoming apparent that this was really happening to normies, but after 2020 it’s so obvious that it’d be like saying the big M Night Shamalon tweest to your story is that smoking causes lung cancer or something

>>11838490 (OP)
At least it doesn't have a stupid anime plot and characters like 3

>>11838578
Peace Walker is shockingly good all things considered. It is probably in the running for the overall best highest effort PSP to be made. And a story that isn’t convoluted gobbledygook? And the mother base development making way more sense and being integrated into the story better than TPP? Looking back it’s crazy to me Peace Walker exists as it does. Doesn’t really translate off PSP so well though since it becomes piss easy with a second analog though.

Portable Ops sucks though and feels more a tech demo than a game. TPP had good gameplay but Ground Zero is better and represents what V really should’ve been more of. They padded the absolute hell out of TPP and make you get in that god damn chopper way too much.

>>11840830
But Liquid was retarded.
Showing it is like 40% of MGS1.

>>11841887
If 4 had never been made, it would’ve been one of the greatest big-dicked chad moments in all of vidya
>decided to arbitrarily squander the opportunity to create the most hotly anticipated game of all time by turning it into a vanity project about some postmodern doomer books he was into at the time, completely alienating and irritating the audience
>refuses to elaborate, decided to make the next game a vanity project about 60s movies complete with self insert Tarantino-esque dialogue where the characters talk about their love of 60s movies

If he wasn’t such a hack he would’ve stuck to his guns and not made any more metal gear games after 3.

>I HATE METAL GEAL
>I HATE MONEY
>WHY EVERYONE METAL GEAL SORID
>I WILL MAKE SEQUEL THAT EVERYONE HATES
>WILL ALSO RUIN MY REPUTATION AND SHIT ON MY MAIN SOURCE OF INCOME ON PURPOSE
>ARGG NO STOP LOVING NEW GAME YOU WERE SUPPOSED TO HATE IT
>NOW I WILL MAKE PREQUEL TO FUCK WITH EVELYONE
>NOW I WILL MAKE THE KILLEL APP FOR THE PS3 THAT IS ALSO A LOVE LETTER TO MY ENTIRE WORK ON THE SERIES BUT JUST SO YOU KNOW I HATED MAKING THIS ONE TOO

Nobody seriously believes this right?

>>11839491
>because you had to play as a long haired gay guy instead of Snake
NOBODY cared about this.

>>11844585
This is the guy who said he made DS2 worse because the focus test groups liked the game too much

>>11838490 (OP)
You could just say you don't like the game and even though a lot of people have warmed up to it (probably because they weren't duped by the marketing) you still don't enjoy it.
I don't like MGS2 and never have which is odd because I love 1 and 3 hell I even like 4 and all the PSP games. But 2 stands out to me as just not that good. I think it's mostly down to the levels being the worst in the series by a large margin, the writing is fine and the characters are good. I just really hate playing 2 I can watch others play it and sure it looks fun but actually playing it is not.
See? If you explain your reasons for disliking it, no matter how retarded they are, you might be able to generate discussion on a game instead of claiming that those damn kids ruin everything by liking bad games.

>>11844593
literally everyone in 2001 complained about having to play as an effeminate fag instead of snake

>>11844598
He's too close with Refn
https://webmshare.com/play/wdY6R

>>11844593
Everyone cared about it, not only was snake beloved from the older titles but the fact you were baited and switched into believing this was another snake game before you're hit with this literally who faggot. Raiden is a good character but to pretend like his introduction wasn't the gayest shit on the planet is just wrong. MGS3 is how you introduce a new character.

>>11844643
But in retrospect it's funny to watch raiden get emotionally fucked with the whole time. Rose is such a typical bitch, it's great. Like Raiden isn't in an insane life threatening environment and she just expects him to be emotionally available 24/7. Then at the end when he's just getting fucked with at every angle and he's naked running through an unknown location getting messages about schizo shit. I always enjoyed that part.

>>11844891
>the older titles
Title, singular. Don't pretend anyone in the west gave a fuck about Metal Gear or Snake as a character before MGS
>inb4 zoomzoom u didnt play the NES CLASSIC

>>11844927
Everyone knew SOLID SNAKE from METAL GEAR: SOLID and METAL GEAR: SOLID - VR MISSIONS and METAL GEAR SOLID 2: SONS OF LIBERTY - TRIAL EDITION

>>11844927
While they were few and far between they did exist, my dad was actually a big fan of the NES titles, he hated solid though funnily enough and never touched the rest of the series.

>>11838772
That's why everyone remembers that purchase so fondly. They bought the game just for the demo, the demo was awesome but then the actual game turned out to be pretty good, too. All around a great marketing ploy

>>11844641
>hell I even like 4 and all the PSP games

You say that like you're slightly apologetic but there's no need. All the MGS games are good though ymmv with any individual title. 4 in particular is suffering from some historical revisionism but aside from the ending being a movie unto itself everyone liked it. I enjoyed the shit out of the PSP games although it was a little hard to go back to Portable Ops after Peace Walker. But they all have their unique merits

>>11840830
Knowing that the Patriots were intended to be completely artificial intelligence changed how I viewed MGS2, but back then I just wanted an answer as to who the fuck was behind all of this. Little did I expect that MGS3 would be created to invent the people who would become the Patriots... MGS4 was really a mistake in many ways but IMO Act 1 and Act 2 feature my favorite stealth gameplay in the entire series and I love that you can aid a side so that they no longer go on alert when they see you.

>>11844641
>I think it's mostly down to the levels being the worst in the series by a large margin
they have significantly more meaningful stealth gameplay than mgs1 which outside of 2 or 3 areas didn't really constrain the player in any way to make guard patrols a concern. you can dislike their aesthetic but their easily better thought out gameplay wise.

>>11845695
Mostly refering to PO and PW being a step down in quality to the main games, 4 gets a lot of hate but I've always enjoyed it, yeah the cutscenes can get a bit obnoxious but you can just skip them all.

>>11838490 (OP)
I say the same thing about the PS2 in general.

>>11843924
>any MGS
>let alone fucking 4
>most hotly anticipated game of all time
lmao

>>11845948
I can agree with this, I mostly just dislike the overall look of 2, all the environments just put my ass to sleep.

>>11838950
>there's enough documentation on MGS2 to disprove most of MGS2's storytelling "nuances" that people like to wank dead author theory over.
Like what? Are you talking about alleged references to later games.

I know that the sequels make MGS2 canonically real events but that there are a ton of hints within MGS2 that its just a simulation.

>>11839432
>FUCK METAL GAY SOLID
metal gear solid, obviously.
>FUCK SPLINT INCEL
Splinter cell, obviously.
>FUCK SHITMAN
Literally what???
>AND FUCK QUEEF
Literally what???

>>11838490 (OP)
MGS2 is great but people are too blindsided by the concept of its themes rather than the execution of how it explores them. Conceptually the game sounds amazing until you remember 90% of what it covers is done through codec exposition dumps.

>>11848742
"It was all a dream" is always the laziest most unsatisfying shit

>>11838490 (OP)
>>11839816
seriously... another thread about understanding MGS2, so its entire English translation was sabotaged by Agness Kaku?!?!

>>11848746
Execution is the thing that actually matters.
Any retard can throw a bunch of themes up a wall. Only talented people can make them actually work well inside a decent story.

>>11848745
Hitman and Thief I would assume

>>11840495
>blue curtains
What is the implication of this image?

>>11844598
>This is the guy who said he made DS2 worse because the focus test groups liked the game too much
Really?

>>11848757
>Hideo Kojima "changed stuff" in Death Stranding 2's script because playtesters enjoyed themselves too much: "If everyone likes it, it means it's mainstream"
https://www.gamesradar.com/games/action/hideo-kojima-changed-stuff-in-death-stranding-2s-script-because-playtesters-enjoyed-themselves-too-much-if-everyone-likes-it-it-means-its-mainstream/

>>11848765
*sighs*
Time to update the lost media wiki...
*starts drafting new article*
KOJIIIIIIIIIIMAAAAAAAAAAAAA

>>11848765
Is there real value in this kind of thinking from an artistic or even a marketing perspective?

It reminds me of Silicon Valley a season or 2 in when they have to reject the overvalued stock offer since a realistic correction downward would not stop. It would keep crashing down.

Kojima needs his fans to set themselves as niche defenders. If he broadens his appeal to casual babies too much he becomes a Shigeru Miyamoto making baby games that shit on longtime fans.
Holy fuck. I started this sarcastically but I'm actually selling myself on this mindset.

Fuck yes!

Hail Kojima!

Broad appeal and failure to categorize your brand is also a concept explored in the 22 Immutable Laws of Marketting.

>>11844720
The difference is Refn makes great films and kojimbo falls flat on his ass when not tard wrangled by Konami.

I have been playing Ghost Babel and I really want to play throught the MGS games again, at least 1, 2 and 3.
Is the Master Collection even worth the money? Is it worth pirating?
I know I can easily use Duckstation for MGS 1, how is the emulation of MGS 2, 3 and 4?
I do have a PS3 and the Legacy Collection, but my PS3 controller is pretty worn out.
Pls help.

>>11849616
>how is the emulation of MGS 2, 3?
You're gonna need pressure sensitive buttons for that, if you don't have an actual Dual Shock 2 or a Sixaxis, it's going to be a headache to play, so master collection might not be a bad choice.
>4?
PS3 emulation is still pretty bad but if you have a beefy computer, maybe...

>>11838490 (OP)
I'm 35 and I've always thought MGS2 was good.

>>11848748
The ricans don't care.
They prefer to debate based on a poor translation rather than trying to understand what Kojima was trying to say.

>>11838595
>predicting the internet
jack dorsey's stated vision for twitter once it became huge--creating context in a sea of misinformation--mirrors kojima's concept so well that he might have lifted the language straight from the game.

Never forget: They Have To Tell You What They're Doing

>>11839205
>>11839208
nobody, and I mean fucking nobody likes a bald twink, anon

>>11838595
b-but you can watch icecubes melt, realistically

>>11848752
Damn even the shitposters forget about Tenchu

>>11839498
she was his handler, numbnuts, that's how glowies operate

3 is better

>>11849602
The point was he copies everything, every thought he has is unoriginal. He is a Snatcher

u played ts in 2001? unc how old are u go get in a retirement home

>>11848765
The way the title and intro of the article puts it is pure clickbait
Makes more sense when he elaborates
>I want people to end up liking things they didn't like when they first encountered it, because that's where you really end up loving something
Which is exactly what he was going for with DS1. Nobody thought a game about making deliveries would be fun yet it turned out addicting as hell.

Say what you want about Kojimer, but he made three games (MGS1, 2 and 3) that are extremely good and all different from eachother.
Problem is he was almost forced to make MGS4 and that was basically a movie and it's so full of retcons it's ridiculous, even though he made an effort to "finish" the story.
And I'm not even going to talk about PO, PW or MGSV. That's just a fucking mess and I rather they not exist.

>>11852191
>I rather the best game in the series (And the one that did as best as it could to re-retcon the retcons in MGS4 to make them somewhat less retarded) not exist

ok

>>11838490 (OP)
>I didn't like it therefor everyone else must not have liked it
This is a zoomie tell OP. Come back when you're 18

>>11852210
Do you really think TPP is the best game in the series?

>>11838490 (OP)
The e3 trailer blew minds and the demo was super fun though

MGS2 is my favorite in the series. I just wished I played MGS1 before it. That said, PP/MGSV hands down have the best actual gameplay in the series

>>11838661
>>11838647
>>11838639
Remember when we just called it "gameplay"? Adding fuckin "loop" to it doesn't enhance the meaning whatsoever, it just adds an extra syllable for no reason.

>>11838490 (OP)
That's exactly how I feel about BW

>>11838490 (OP)
That's exactly how I feel about HGSS

>>11848745
>>11848752
I didn't get Thief either but you're a retard for missing Hitman

my favourite game of all time

>have to beat the game like 4 times (while putting more effort into each playthrough) to get simple unlocks
wtf were they thinking? in 1 and 3 you just have to beat the game once or twice to get cool items

They tried new things, tons of new gameplay features and so on, but I don't think they got the new formula right until 3 Subsistence with the new camera angle. It's fun to be able to do so much shit with the controls but I don't think the narrow corridors in 2 were a good vehicle for that.

The story is whatever, I stopped giving a fuck after MGS. That game is fine as a self contained story, and I see the sequels and prequels as fanfiction.

>>11853178
>this game has more cutscenes and codec calls than gameplay, we should pad it out!
substance is even worse, 100%ing vr missions is a joke.

>>11853249
MG-MGS2 is parkour
MGS3-MGSV is menus

>>11853330
Are they Quake or Half-Life, however?

>>11853339
>Are they Quake or Half-Life, however?
Half-Life is quake dummy
There's Quake and Myst.

>>11848742
>>11848747
The point is that it's not meant to matter whether it was real or "real". The experiencies Raiden and the player had were real, and that was good enough. It's the central message of the game, about the collecting of information to pass on to the next generation. MGS2 itself doesn't retroactively change, only whenever you're actively playing MGS4.

>>11838940
>There's alot of dumb mechanics like camo, eating, healing, etc.
Those are kino though

>>11841756
What alternate timeline do you come from. MGS3 has always been the fan favorite, it's the reason it's the one being remade just like SH2 was remade over SH1. Everywhere you look, people lose their shit over Snake Eater.

>>11845835
>MGS3 would be created to invent the people who would become the Patriots
That is not the reason MGS3 was created, if anything because it actively goes against PO/MGS4's explanation: its credits timeline states the American branch of the Philosophers renamed themselves to the Patriots.

>>11841607
>If kojima wasn’t so far up his own ass, he could’ve given a real writer some amazing story concepts
How do people still don't realize that *every single game* Kojima has ever made is self-biographical? Why would he direct a game for someone else? Not to mention he did intend MGS2 to be his last Metal Gear? Both 3 and 4 started development without him, he was called back. The info is out there.

Same for >>11841887. The cliffhanger was *on purpose*. Kojima didn't want to reveal who the Patriots were, at least not personally. His team was meant to take over Metal Gear, passed on to the next generation just like Snake passes his memes to Raiden. He didn't write Vamp running up walls with the grand intention to reveal he had magic tape all along as said in MGS4.
>because obviously Kojima either lost his fastball or was intentionally trolling
"No Place for Hideo"? Did none of you read his blog from back during MGS4's development? Or see MGS4's first trailer made in MGS3's engine that shows the director as Alan Smithee? Seriously it's not fucking subtle, MGS4 was Kojima's midlife crisis made videogame. Again, every single one of his games are autobiographical. MGS2 was about passing on memes, MGS3 was about the times forcing you to do something you don't want to, MGS4 was about the circumstances in which you *don't* get to choose or pass on what you meant to.

>>11848746
A lot of the execution was lost in translation. Like how Solidus and Olga are meant to have Solid and Meryl's VAs which is why both characters are introduced by voice before you get to see their faces, or how the first proper room in the Plant (the one with the elevator you see Snake using) is built like Level 1 of MGS VR Missions

>>11852210
I sure hope you don't mean MGSV is the best game in the series