Why did Pokémon peak so early

Do you hear that unnerving sound? That's the autist posters approaching.

thats not emerald

that's not silver

>>11845589
you don't have to announce yourself, just post

They had a blue print and plans for exactly two games. Everything else after was:
>Well I guess we're doing Pokémon now
So the true vision was already tapped. From generation three and onward it was just perpetuating the series by any means necessary. Sure they did some mechanical changes, but those weren't much of a shake up unless you're an autist that breathes PvP Pokémon.

>>11845605
Noono, I've nothing more to post on this matter, I'll just sit down and watch the shitshow unfold now.

Crystal was peak? Serious question.

>>11845580 (OP)
>>11845652
This is basically it. They didn't expect to milk it like a cow with festering utters pulsating puss as a putrid porridge of dairy delight. In this case it would be slowpoke tail... Ever think that game freak uses players as a vicarious method collect all the pokemon, because they obviously couldn't catch them all the first 7 times.

>>11845580 (OP)
Bad Pokemon type distribution, too many Gen1 mons, day and night cycle makes it a pain, and it doubles down on useless HMs

These are my logical reasons for preferring Gen1 and 3, you can sperg about it if you want

>>11845771
Based. Hoenn mogs gsc

>>11845771
Agreed. Gen 3 is hated on too much. It's got a shit ton of pokemon and useful upgrades that extend the scope of the games genre. Best end game replayability, best distribution of pokemon, unique music you either hate it or love it( I definitely love it) and an awesome layout, with maybe a bit too much water... Overall it scores big over the convoluted mess that penguin was.

>>11845767
Gen 2 as a whole was peak, as a third version crystal doesn't adds much because the phone shit was Japan only

>>11845580 (OP)
because it stagnated after that. The made too much money curse

>>11845771
Every argument against these complaints is cope too
>Pokemon distribution
You don't need a balanced team!
>Gen1 repeats
You don't need new monsters!
>Day night
Play the game on its terms not yours!
>HMs
It's not annoying!

>>11845580 (OP)
It wasn’t just pokemon. Life itself peaked in the 90s. Best culture games music food ext. Society and pokemon has been in a free fall decline ever since.

>>11846052
>Life itself peaked in the 90s
>I had no worries and responsibilities in life
Because
>I was a (pre-)teen

>>11846081
I agree with him and i didn't exists for the majority of the 90's

>>11846081
Do you have any idea how much easier it was to just live a basic life in the 90s compared to now? The west wasn't flooded with third worlders, so the labor market wasn't oversaturated, jobs were relatively plentiful, pay was decent, and cost of living was low as fuck. The dating scene wasn't destroyed completely with third-wave feminism, dating apps, social media, and smart phones, etc. I could go on forever. If you think live is just as good right now you're either delusional or the rare lucky few who make decent money and probably got married forever ago.

>>11845580 (OP)
>removes Mareep for no reason
And this is why G&S are better.

>>11845771
It was mechanically not the best Pokemon, but it had the most soul, because it was a very good representation of the Kansai region. Like, they created Pokemon based on real life equivalents, like how Stantler only appears on route 36 and 37 (Nara region). There's the radio tower in Goldenrod City (Osaka) and so on. Even the Alph ruins are based on a real life location (Asuka village). For a Japanese, especially Kansai residents, Gen 2 was a microversion of their home, never seen in this detail in a video game before, despite the technological restrictions.
You gotta admire that. Gen2 has the most soul and Crystal is the best version of gen2.

>>11846090
then you can't really contribute to this discussion.
>>11846116
Third worldlers are not the problem, they are a symptom. Don't drink the kool-aid. Thinking that is what they want. People back then took credit from the future and now we pay interest. Also, you only have the American perspective. Other countries went through harsher times, had other "golden ages".
I.e. Germany had to pay for the reunification, it slowed down development and recession peaked in the 00s. EE countries suffered from the crash of the Soviet Union. Japan's economy is still stuck in the 90s.
>The dating scene wasn't destroyed completely with third-wave feminism, dating apps, social media, and smart phones, etc.
most of these things are controlled by giga corps, you know that right? Blaming society is just fighting the symptoms again. And if you're afraid of women, know that now is a transitional phase, like the blacks' fight for rights in the 60s and 70s.

Anyway, Cyndaquil best starter, by elimination. Also, gen2 is a great gen for non-typical typed teams (fire, water, grass). The amount of new water and fire types is quite low, there's 2 new types and bugs got some cool additions.

I wish the cellphone functionality was still avaliable to the non-Jap versions instead of being axed.

>>11845767
Gens 1+2, including Stadium 1+2, are a single, cohesive experience, and Crystal is the pinnacle of that experience.

>>11845771
>waaah we need a soft reboot with >150 new shitmons with terrible designs!
Fuck off, gen 1 mons have the best designs full stop

>>11846171
I'm Australian and our country, economy, society absolutely peaked in the 90s. I don't give a shit about central/eastern europe or Japan

>>11845580 (OP)
Didn't like it as much as the gens around it

>>11845807
It's just 1 vocal autist crying about pokemania. He used to spam /vp/, but once it got filled with posters not agreeing with him he migrated to try his luck here.

>>11845580 (OP)
Gamefreakz were literally amateur doujinsoft people. years later they still couldn't make a decent 3D game.... play the spinoffs for better 3D pokermans.

>>11845580 (OP)
>Why did Pokémon peak so early

pokemon crystal version = pokemon geneation z version.

honestly everything it does just seems done better in the remakes

>>11846217
So you didn't play Gen1, started with gen2, and vicariously had a Gen1 experience through it while people like me already beat red/blue 100 times. Got it

>>11846038
>Play the game on its terms not yours!
This is how you should play every game, really.

>>11846586
Most games don't dictate what time of the day you can play
>just use the pokemon you find!
No, I'm a pro trainer. I meticulously plan my entire team before the journey even starts.

>>11845598
the gen 1 remakes were the only good use of the gen 3 engine. hoenn games are garbage.

As you can see, Gen2 has some real issues

>>11845909
The phone stuff really wasn’t much either, plus you got charged a fee on your phone bill when you used it

>>11846642
>I meticulously plan my entire team before the journey even starts.
There are people like this, and I just can't imagine that being fun.

>>11846776
The game isn't over yet.

>>11846908
>The game isn't over yet.
It pretty much is. Kanto is really just a victory lap as nobody except maybe Blue can hope to beat you, and Red is an optional superboss.

>>11846908
>The game isn't over yet.
Then why did the credits play?

>>11846776
Seems like you were too dumb to get a fire stone from the school boy

>>11846767
FRLR are shit remakes with shit music.

>>11846970
And miss out on flamethrower?
Also, this could he GS instead of crystal.

>>11847002
So you decided to keep the Growlithe for flamethrower, what's the fucking problem then?
Old pokemon is like that if you want a Breloom with spore you have to keep a shitty shroomish the whole game

>>11847002
>Also, this could he GS instead of crystal.
It's Crystal, you can tell by the sprites

>>11847007
Spore isn't mandatory for Breloom to be good.
But Growlithe HAS to have flamethrower to be any good unless you spend all your money on the game corner for Fire Blast or trade it to RBY to get it from Blaine.

>>11847018
Oh yeah, Feraligtr doesn't have that shade of blue in GS.

>>11847007
>just dont use fire or electric types you dont need to
But considering the only point of Pokemon is building a custom team of your favorite monsters, you should be able to. Every type should have at least two viable fully evolved mons by halfgame

>>11847025
The mixed sprite poses too, Crystal drew from both Gold and Silver

>>11845580 (OP)
I dont argue about pokemon on this board anymore but im just stopping in to say, yes pokemon peaked in gen 2.

>>11847034
based and true

>>11847023
You don't need flamethrower to beat the story mode
At least you could argue spore is much more valuable in a playthrough of Emerald because of the frontier
>>11847027
You can evolve Growlithe as soon as you catch it

>>11847039
>You can evolve Growlithe as soon as you catch it
You can also jump into spikepits in Sonic

>>11847039
You realize that Crystal has the battle tower, right?

>>11847002
Growlithe learns Flame Wheel at level 34 which is definitely good enough for the story mode, you can then evolve to Arcanine
>but I want Flamethrower for post-game stuff/Stadium 2!
You can teach it to Arcanine at the Move Tutor in Goldenrod

>>11847058
That only works at certain days, and you need to dump 4000 coins into it.
After the league btw.

>>11847042
I said you can, the option to evolve its always there
>>11847051
Battle towers are the worst kind of post-game, at least you could have said there is Stadium 2

>>11847065
The point was that Crystal's battle tower is just as unfair if not more than Emerald's frontier.

>>11847058
>i will make excuses for bad game design
copium

gen 2 is a sloppy series, it's fine to have nostalgia, but it's objectively the worst game of the retro titles

>>11847058
Most of the pokemon weak to fire in-game by that point are either too weak to bother or have better counters.

>>11847070
>gen 2 is a sloppy series
Arcanine not learning Flamethrower was not an exclusively Gen 2 thing, it was the same in Gen 1 but the difference is there was no way around waiting to evolve Growlithe after Level 50. You may not like the Move Tutor method they added in Gen 2, but it was at least something.

>>11847073
You had a TM for fire Blast right before the league.
Nvm that Gen 1 is less demanding than Gen 2.

>>11847078
What do you mean by less demanding?

>>11847070
>gen 2 is a sloppy series, it's fine to have nostalgia, but it's objectively the worst game of the retro titles
It makes sense, they spent time developing Gen 2 to be something else completely at first, before scrapping the whole concept mid-development with the original director resigning and a new one taking over and having to basically redesign the whole thing. Gen 2 never had a chance to end up good, unless maybe they were given several years more for development which wasn't happening.

>muh flamethrower
Just give Fire Punch to any other pokemon

>>11847085
Trainers in gen 1 had no DVs and hardly had custom movesets and if they did it was just ONE move.

>>11847090
>Just pick Cyndaquil bro

The reality is, GameFreak didn't start taking balance seriously until Gen 3 or 4, that's when you started to see key utility moves becoming more accessible in the form of TMs, the DV and Stat EXP system reworked into EVs, movesets overhauled in a more sensible way, etc. They were basically just winging it for the first two gens. Maybe it was Masuda's idea to do this, since Gen 3 was the first gen he was able to completely design from the start. Millennial ostalgiafags aside, it's generally accepted that pokemon peaked as a series during Gen 3-5, under Masuda's watch.

>>11847092
Literally just catch any Pokémon with decent special and arms

>>11847163
What's the point of playing Pokemon if you're not gonna LARP as having your own custom team

You may as well play a real JRPG instead, Pokemon has no gratifying gameplay elements beyond the fantasy and pet LARP

>>11845767
gen 2 was the last time pokemon was impressive in whatever hardware it ran on

gamefreak were technological pioneers at this point, on the bleeding edge of portable games. I'm guessing they experienced some kind of brain drain near the end of gen 3

>>11847264
Then own it and use your favorites even if they are shit? I personally just use whatever works the best

>>11847312
If you don't care about role playing as a trainer or have taste in certain mons, and only care about what's technically the best, gen2 still isn't it, gen3 fixed nearly all the flaws gameplay wise, so i'm just confused by your insistance that it's the best

>>11847264
>Pokemon has no gratifying gameplay elements
Gen 3 Battle Frontier was great, only people filtered by having to plan and build a competitive team disagree

>>11847318
>role playing
Gay as fuck larp shit
>and only care about what's technically the best
You don't need a team full of smogon tier pokemon for the campaign that's what I'm fucking saying, just use whatever suits you the best
>so i'm just confused by your insistance that it's the best
Night and day, two regions lot of places to explore, hoenn is second best but it feels like a step back, hoenn pokemon are all not that great either but that doesn't matter in a single player run

>>11847365
>>role playing
>Gay as fuck larp shit
this, only fags role play in an RPG

>>11847365
Nobody brought up competitive usage, moron.

>>11847365
>i play pokemon for the mechanics
Idk what to say other than, why, you could play any jrpg from 1995 and get the "adult" version of it that takes four braincells instead of two. You're like a dude talking about riding Big Wheels like "nah bro idc about nostalgia, i just think they're better than bmx"

>>11847114
Tajiri just wanted to make a bug-catching simulator. Masuda's influence made an actual game out of it, for better or worse.

>>11847406
Pokemania happened when it was a "bug-catching simulator", as soon as Masuda took the reins Pokemon stopped being a pop culture phenomenon

>>11847406
>Bugfag makes a game about his Bug catching hobby
>Bug type is one of the worst types
What a fucking scam.

>>11847406
Tajiri made a passion project, Masuda made turned it into a boardroom-approved husk of its former self

>>11847415
>>11847423
Even Gen1 wouldn't have become what it was without Masuda.

>>11847423
>made turned it into
tried to edit before the auto post timer ended and lost the race

>>11847428
He was good at his initial role, as a director the series went off the rails

>>11847415
>>11847423
To be honest, i don't think anyone could've kept the same feel Gen 1-2 had going forward, and when they tried it (see FR/LG) it looks sloppy.
That was a necessary evil.

>>11847434
Exactly.

>>11847434
What was "off the rails" with Gen 3?

>>11847442
Forced legendary plot

>>11845580 (OP)
crystal was when pokemania died out

>>11847446
That was beginning to be a thing in GSC

>>11847446
...that's it?

>>11847450
Not really, you can completely skip catching the legendary

>>11847450
It was only a thing in Crystal, which Masuda directed.

>>11847369
Yeah, playing pretend is dumb, just do whatever you want
>>11847391
Then why bitch you can't use flamethrower?
>>11847404
I'm literally saying to play the game casually

>>11847457
You can but G/S was when legendaries became mystical beings/gods of pokemon instead of just rare crypto-pokemon or genetic experiments

>>11847457
>>11847458
You had to awake the legendary dogs as soon as you fight your rival.
You also don't need to catch any of the legendaries in either game, at that point it's just a glorified trainer battle.

>>11847468
You can thank Masuda for that. He took over after Tajiri dropped out mid-development.

What's wrong with Legendaries being mystical? Seems like a nice progression from what was in gen 1, no?

>>11847479
It's the most logical direction to go but also lazy, and loses the unique feel gen1 had too. In the end it just brings Pokemon closer to other typical jrpg fare instead of standing on its own as this weird contemporary suburban/urban scifi kaiju thing

Like, even in the Pokemon anime the biggest thing hinted was that Pokemon were actually aliens of some kind, it felt more scifi than fantasy up to about "The First Movie", then they just went more toward a mystical angle for the whole franchise

>>11847481
Pokemon "from space" kept being made though.

>>11847481
>In the end it just brings Pokemon closer to other typical jrpg fare instead of standing on its own as this weird contemporary suburban/urban scifi kaiju thing
Tajiri specifically wanted the series to be about new technology encroaching on nature, which is something he experienced while growing up in the areas around Tokyo. If he remained with the series, Pokemon could still be a cool scifi series, instead we now have literal god-pokemon who created time and space and the universe and whatever. The plot just kept rehashing that "you are the chosen one who must save the world from the evil team who is using the legendary pokemon to destroy the world/universe" thing.

>>11847484
Pokemon is actually much more sci-fi than it has ever been when you consider the ultra beasts and in-universe time travel and hint of multiple realities.

>>11847487
It's forever tainted by the existence of ridiculous god-pokemon. Not the same series I enjoyed anymore. More power to you if that's your thing.

>>11847489
My point was more so that pokemon never truly detached itself from the sci-fi elements.

>>11847490
Perhaps not completely, but enough to no longer be interesting.

>>11847487
You can blame Ohmori for that. He's even less adherent to Tajiri's original vision than Masuda was in that he wants to turn Pokemon into Avengers Endgame.

>>11845580 (OP)
how did they keep interest going after gen 1 and gen 2 anyway I remember tuning out once they introduced another 100 Pokemon in 2002 or something. now when I see screen shots of Pokemon today there is not a single first 150 in sight.

like who was even a fan of Pokemon between 2003-2008 cause zoomers were not even a thing at that point so millennials were having to keep up with 1000s of retarded pointless new Pokemon.

>>11847494
A bit of brand loyality and gameplay.

>>11847494
>like who was even a fan of Pokemon between 2003-2008
Millennials who still enjoyed the series and early zoomers born in '97/'98. The games didn't quite match the astronomically-high sales of before and the media got bored of ham-fistedly referencing pokemon and moved on to other things, but the series still remained among the top-selling video games every time.

>having to keep up with 1000s of retarded pointless new Pokemon
By 2008 there weren't even 500 pokemon, and many of the ones released singe Gen 1 regularly beat out many of the original 151 in popularity polls to this day.

>>11847494
Late Millennials and early Zoomers. Pokemon never reached the heights of Pokemania but it firmly embedded itself in pop culture regardless, every gen has some portion of Pokenerds

Honestly, it's impressive, no series has really done that from overseas quite as much as things like Transformers and Jurassic Park that have never left toy shelves, Pokemon joined that ilk.

>>11847468
I remember the legendary birds seemed to be presented as at least somewhat mystical in Gen 1, iirc Articuno's lore was that it had the power to always appear to hikers lost in snowstorms in the mountains or something like that.

>>11847494
I started with Gen 1 during pokemania and was 12 when Gen 3 came out, still enjoyed it

All this shade at Masuda reminded me of these:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2GZvQrfoQk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RNhUOgLRhrU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZnuKCd-yI8

>>11847512
I thought that was for Moltres.

>>11847524
Moltres saved Blaine, that was it for it's lore.

>>11847512
More importantly look at the 2 Wiis in that picture.

>>11846579
?? take your meds
Gen 1 is my favourite, though I also love gen 2. I think I have replayed Red more than any other game

>>11847423

To be honest, while Taijiri is a great creator, he's not a very good game director. Red and Green's production took 5 years, probably restarted production several times. When strapped for cash it was his idea to fart out Yellow and Blue for a quick profit. And finally, Gold and Silver was a fucking mess presumably months before it was meant to go on sale in 1998 given the Spaceworld 97 prototype we have during the time he was the game's director. To give Masuda credit, after Yellow and the Red/Blue localization wrapped up production, he restarted production on Gold and Silver and got it out in a year.

It's interesting that every detractor of gen 2 is a mentally deranged freak

>>11847000
and still the only thing with any merit that uses the gen 3 engine.

i legit thought i had ust outgrown pokémon when i first played sapphire. then i got pearl and realized that hoenn is just fucking garbage. after that the series was at least playably good until sword and shield killed it for good.

>>11847489
This

>>11848004
My experience was pretty much the same as yours

>>11847997
He must be a good game director since RGBY are the only genuinely good pokemon games

>>11848004
I felt the opposite, I enjoyed Ruby and Emerald a lot but couldn't get into D/P/Pt despite normally loving cold/snowy settings

>>11848002
Gen2 is like the Gen z sissy choice so that's an ironic statement

>>11848045
That's gen 5, zoomers love their ice creams and garbage bags

>>11848045
The relative few Gen Z who were even alive were shitting their diapers when Gen 2 was going on, they prefer Gen 4 and especially 5

>>11846116
Blame Americans for that.

>>11848146
Which pathetic nation are you from that is forced to follow every American whim?

>>11848094
Zoomers love to try to be Millennials while also being contrarian to them. IE Limp Bizkit/Nickelback obsessing, claiming Space Jam was good, and that gen2 Pokemon is better than gen1

>>11848183
They all just get bombed and eat crappy food , reason to be salty I guess

>>11848201
Gen 2 is better than one, even 3 and 4 are better than 1

>>11848201
>Zoomers love to try to be Millennials while also being contrarian to them.
Dunno about that mate, go to any dedicated pokemon board (this very website has one) and the zoomers there tend to be staunchly anti Gen 1 and 2. The most famous internet thing made by a zoomer regarding Gen 2 is a video that is entirely dedicated to tearing the Johto games apart and explaining why it's the worst gen, and it's regularly referenced/posted whenever the subject arises.

>>11848205
>implying gen 3 is better than anything
lol

>>11848205
It has the most fatal flaws, like a giant portion of the prime team training time being full of MULTIPLE HM gimmicks that makes you long for pushing rocks around

>>11848207
zoomers can't cope with greatness of times past. They can't cope that video games before them were the best ever created and that they have to deal with modern slop like always online live service games, gacha shit and 500GB day one patches. They can't deal with their hobby is being reduced to a money-making scheme where passion and care can only be found in 2D sidescrollers and low-poly strategy games,. how ironic.

>>11848002
>Johtimmy arguing with himself long after everyone else left the conversation
>spams threads because no one wants to engage with it and therefore starved for interaction
>everyone else is mentally deranged

>>11848337
No idea what you're talking about, take your meds

>>11848019
Nothing about RBY is sighnificantly better than the other /vr/ pokemon games unless you nitpick every little thing.

>>11848210
Gen1s biggest flaw is HMS
Gen2 adds all the same ones, but more

>>11848207
>The most famous internet thing made by a zoomer regarding Gen 2 is a video that is entirely dedicated to tearing the Johto games apart and explaining why it's the worst gen
That youtuber is 30 years old

>11848337
Back to vp Yawnie

>>11845580 (OP)
ken sugimori's watercolor concept art is just oozing with soul
aside from that gen 1 and 2 also had pokemon designs that were more clearly based on actual animals whereas from gen 3 onward pokemon start becoming too weirdly abstract and alien like.

even as a gen z kid, i thought the newer pokemon games were just flat out lame because of this. the designs simply didn't appeal to me and still don't to this day.

>>11848210
You are going to lose your mind over rse and dppt if you think gsc has too many hms

>>11848686
GSC and RSE have the same HM count only swaping whirlpool for dive, unless you're not counting rock Smash cuz it "technically wasn't a HM".

>>11848412
>aside from that gen 1 and 2 also had pokemon designs that were more clearly based on actual animals whereas from gen 3 onward pokemon start becoming too weirdly abstract and alien like.
Funny, I've read posts from older fans here insisting that the older pokemon designs were better because they were more like strange monsters/kaiju and newer pokemon are too animal-like

>>11848686
>>11848210
The whirlpool segment of Gen2 makes me want to pull my hair out
>need two HM slaves
>highest concentration of strong trainers, so the ideal level up section before endgame

>>11848705
>>11849601
>whirlpool
Literally you are only forced to use whirlpool only at the dragon's den for a non battle event

Compare that to gen 3 deep sea cave, now that's bullshit

>>11849610
or waterfall, whatever, i get them confused

>>11849601
There's also no Pokemon Center between New Bark Town and Indigo Plateau, so until you've cleared the entire gauntlet for the first time, you're fucked if you have to go back and change Pokemon because you can't Fly back to Johto unless you backtrack over the waterfalls again.

>>11845580 (OP)

>>11845605
Fucking this, way to ruin the thread faggot.

>>11847447
Trvke

>>11847318
the best
You are such a retard. Caught up on such ambiguous terms so you have to change them to suit your little agenda.

>>11848342
nah
its way cooler than you think
there wasnt any JRPG that was anything like it. maybe the first dragon quest. it was extremely open-ended and allowed you to play using any combination of mons
theyve never successfully replicated that kind of design even in the new ones where theyre literally openworld

then theres just the esoterica that surrounded those games. the word-of-mouth-nonsense-that-sometimes-turned-out-true. accidentallying your whole blastoise because you caught a glitchazard. gamesharking outside boundaries. lying to your cousins. getting lied to by your cousins
it was a perfect storm of high-speed internet gradually coming online for ppl, and literally everyone in the entire world knowing wtf a pokeymans was

Maybe Taijiri shouldn't have whined about Mother 1 using it's story as a grand reward for fighting foes and exploring, then Pokemon wouldn't have lost its soul since Red/Green.

Johto is just fucking soulless shite.

>>11848208
>cyclefags still seething
Weather is better

>>11849729
Johto never stood a chance at being good, it was cobbled together last-minute with a completely different Director after the original Gold/Silver, which was something else entirely, was scrapped.

>>11845771
Do you hear that unsettling sound? That's the tampon monkeys and redditors angerly responding to this post.

>>11849737
It's more heartbreaking to see the game just lose its identity more as soon as they use it as a promotional device to harbor movie watchers.
>replaced by a female pooltoy furry
fucking Shudo.

>>11849723
>Gen 1 was better due to stuff outside of the actual game

>>11848291
This. I worked with a bunch in my last job and they are retards that obsess over 4k, FPS rate, and gobble up whatever latest Steam slop is out there.

They have zero respect for anything and are computer illiterate.

They are Mongoloid retards. I know Boomers that are leagues smarter than some of the Zoomers I had to endure.

t. Millennial

>>11849767
Gen2 is just a Gen1 post game
>Here's the same monsters, but less, and a worse world, worse plot, worse rival, and more annoying mechanics
Thanks! There's a reason the only people who favor gen2 are emotional nostalgics

people get really mad about pokemon here
it's like /vp2/

>>11849734
No idea what you're talking about, take your meds

>>11845652
This

>>11849836
Ok, and what are your critique of other pokemon games?

>>11846171
>most of these things are controlled by giga corps
Naive. Corporations work in tandem with states and secret societies in order to curb population numbers and control the masses through deceit. And it's working beautifully. Even India's birthrate is completely collapsing.

>playing Pokemon Pure RBG on my Steam Deck recently
>taking my time, around 20 hours in, having fun with the changes
>go to boot up the game today
>save file corrupted
>mfw

Is there anything like Pokemon Pure RBG for G/S/C or Heart Gold and Soul Silver?

>>11849945
That's what you get for playing autismo romhack slöp

>>11849973
>autismo romhack
nigga I was playing it cause it just let's you get all the Pokemon without trading shit and having to play two different versions of the games cause my friends wouldn't play as well

>>11849985
>It makes the bulk of the 151 original pokemon all more obtainable and usable in the early game, with better movesets and more balanced stats.
>Many moves in the game were rebalanced or modified
>Many options to enhance the game visually and mechanically were added.
>There are a couple entirely new things added into the game to facilitate quality of life fixes
Yeah, sure thing anon

>>11849992
>It makes the bulk of the 151 original pokemon all more obtainable and usable in the early game, with better movesets and more balanced stats.
>Many moves in the game were rebalanced or modified
Immediate garbage.

>>11849907
I don't have any critique of gen1 other than HMs having always been gratuitous nonsense. As for gen3, I don't remember any flaw in terms of gameplay, I just didn't care for some of the thematic/vibe elements because I really thing Pokemon lost it's original vibe immediately after gen1

I never played any other Pokemon game, because by the time of the DS I was too old to buy Nintendo consoles

>>11850008
HMs are actually soul. Your team is made up of partners who help you tackle obstacles and traverse the world. It's a symbiotic relationship

>>11850051
I hate putting my team in the box.
>Ok starmie, get in the ball. You're going into the box.... Forever

>>11850056
Teach your partner team HMs, unless you're a turbo autismo who will only use competitive sets in a regular playthrough?

>>11850056
>Starmie doesn't know surf
Huh

>>11850056
Why wouldn't your Starmie know Surf? It's the best water move in the game.

>>11850089
I specifically use a singular pokemon for surf... Seal in gem 1 and lapras in gen 2, wailmer for gen 3, etc... starmie is used as a water psychic thunderbolt calipso in my gen1 team.

>>11850113
This is some advanced level autism.

>>11845580 (OP)
Everyone I knew played Red/Blue-Gold/Silver when those came out. Never met a single person in my life who played Crystal.

I remember 10-15 years ago, if you brought up that you thought the games had gotten worse, you'd get absolutely dogpiled by a billion angry pokemon fans insisting that the series had only gotten better. Now I just see people constantly saying that it peaked at gen2 and went downhill from there. What changed?

>>11850051
HMs suck because more than half of them are useless moves in a game where you only get four moves with like 10 uses max

If they wanted Pokemon to have outside battle abilities, they should have just done that and not made them moves that take up a slot. Or alternatively, make every HM a very useful attack in battle.

>>11850158
girls who were ecstatic that krys was a playable character fucking loved it. also fags.

>>11849992
I told you why I was playing it, just to get the pokemon I wanted and I didn't care about the rest

learn to read, esl-kun

you can turn all that stuff off in game by the way

>>11850206
I don't hate any Pokemon game, to be honest. Some are better than others, some worse, but I still manage to get a decent playthrough out of any of them because in the end, it's all the same game every time.

>>11845580 (OP)
In the 90s Frank Tuturice tried to convince everyone in Eastpointe MI that R/B had secret evolutions for Charizard called "Charmonster" who was covered in spikes and chains and "Charcoal" who was pure black

>>11850113
You are mentally ill, that's not the game's fault
>>11850216
I agree

>>11845771
>bad type distribution
as opposed to 50% of Kanto pokemon being poison/bug?
>too many G1 pokemon
G2 was supposed to be a definitive rerelease of G1, not a distinct gen. zoomer.
>day night cycle
just change the clock if you're so much of a NEET you can't get up in the early morning.
>muh HM overuse
but enough about Gen 4.

>>11847091
>the anti-Johto contrarians has switched from 'GSC is too easy' to 'GSC is too hsrd'
lol

>>11850158
Pokemania was dead and Pokemon was uncool by the time Crystal released

>>11850312
>as opposed to 50% of Kanto pokemon being poison/bug?
It doesn't matter, you can get all types you could possibly want halfway through the game. Pikachu is available as early as before Pewter City
>G2 was supposed to be a definitive rerelease of G1, not a distinct gen. zoomer.
Hey zoomer, I'm a gen1 fan and all gen1 fans prefer gen1, you're not fooling me. You weren't born until 1995, you're fucking genz. You need to have experienced the EARLY 90s to qualify as a Millennial, I don't give a fuck what you say, the definition is how I say it. Late millennials = zoomers.
>just change the clock if you're so much of a NEET you can't get up in the early morning
The fact that I'm not a NEET would be the issue, I have a wife, child, and social life outside of playing fucking Pokemon faggot.

>>11850206
It's one Johto autist who used to spam vp before a demographic change forced him out. Ideally we'd have generals for each gen with mention of other gens being bannable, that way the spergs would stay contained.

>>11850631
What demographic change are you referring to?

>>11850631
Every Gen2 thread on this board goes exactly the same way, so yeah it is one fag
>Gen2 is supreme!
>Why did Pokemon peak at Gen2?
>Gen2 has more soul than anything
Etc
>reasonable complaints about it, to combat the arrogant provoking statements
And then
>FUCK YOU ZOOMER GEN2 IS THE BEST I REFUSE TO GIVE REASONS WHY AND YOUR STATEMENTS ABOUT ITS FLAWS ARE DUMB
Etc, clearly LARPing as Gen1, when we all know real Gen1 fags will never see anything as better than the originals. A hollow attempt to put gen1 fans in their corner idiotically not realizing, this is the retro board and people older than 27 do in fact post here

>>11850662
Younger folk starting to use the board, and discord started being a thing. There was a narrative shift at some point from Gens 2/4 good and Gen 3 ruining the series to a free for all where most gens have a critical mass of defenders.
As a hoennfag, can't complain, gone from not being able to have positive threads at all to being able to have them once every two months.

>>11849938
>it's le SEKRIT CONSPEARACY with LE GUBMINT and LE JEWS to CONTROL LE POPULATION and LE KILL EVERYONE!
85 IQ brainlet take. i know you desperately want the world to be in a "us vs. them, good vs. evil" dichotomy so that your peabrain can better interalize all the quarter-baked takes /pol/ has fed you with, but unfortunately reality is much much more complicated than that.

in the case of that poster mentioning modern dating practices/apps, it's 100% companies capitalizing on changing trends in society. there was no grand conspiracy that caused the Match Group conglomerate that we have now. it is a problem? does it suck? yeah, but there's no secret jew cabal pulling the strings cackling about how much harder it is for young people to fuck and start families now. if anything, that's a greater problem with how we much we (don't) regulate our laissez-faire version of capitalism
>inb4 you start screeching about me somehow being a commie because i brought up capitalism by name lel

>>11850740
kek I didn't even mention Jews, just brought up a simple fact and your brain starts imploding in pure rage

>>11845580 (OP)
there's simply nothing that gets better with 20+ installments, so your peak will always be between 1-5

>>11850938
>1-4
Fixed it for you

>>11850902
>yes i said secret societies and controlling the masses but i didn't mean the jews :^)
that plausible deniability shit ain't working on me kid, we know what you meant. also don't act like you haven't seethed over them hundreds of times before

>>11850740
Hopefully this is pilpul. It's really sad to observe goyim defending the people enslaving them.

>>11850206
What changed is that they actually did start getting worse, but not until much later. If you go in talking about how the series peaked in Gen 1 or 2 you’ll still get dogpiled.

>>11851170
Nah, I've seen threads on /v/ get to the bump limit with people pretty much in agreement on that. Gen 3-4-5 are worse than 1-2, this was always the truth. The "genwunner" spammers just gave up in trying to force a narrative.

>>11851180
Post them.

>>11851187
Not them but the general sentiment is that gen 1 and 2 go together as the classic era just like people pair up 3 and 4 with sometimes 5 as the modern era then everything since 6 as the shit era

>>11851198
I just want to see these /v/ threads full of people insisting that it peaked in Gen 1-2

>>11851180
Lol, I hope gen Alpha gets on here to say that Pokémon Go was where the series peaked. It'll make those gen 3/4/5 worshippers feel old.

>>11850984
Gen 5 is good

>>11845580 (OP)
Because game freak started phoning the series in when they realized fans would accept slop. That's why the best pokemon game wasn't even made by them but by chunsoft.

>>11851221
Are the mystery dungeon games really worth playing? Never tried them.

>>11851230
It's just Mystery Dungeon with pokemon branding, you play as a person who got turned into a pokemon. If you've already played any of the others in the Mystery Dungeon franchise, there's nothing really new. It's similar to the various Dynasty Warriors IP crossovers. If you've never played one in general, it's a roguelike dungeon crawler.

>>11851238
I thought mystery dungeon was a pokemon series. I didn't know it was a separate franchise.

>>11851247
Mystery Dungeon started as a Dragon Quest spin-off.

>>11851252
I see.

>>11851247
The Pokemon brand is what really put it on the map for western audiences. There were lots of titles before that.

poasting the meme

>>11846776
What "issues" are you trying to point out here?

>>11851290
In light of recent developer interviews, you need to remove GSC from Soul Era and move it down to Transitional Era

>>11845580 (OP)
As a kid, I always thought that GS logo was for some extra device that linked to the Game Boy for special features. Like it was a stamp indicating compatibility with whatever this "GS" device was, but it never ended up releasing and just disappeared. I found out many years later that it was just Gamefreak's attempt at a logo-based Gold/Silver branding that they ended up giving up on. I prefer what my kid self imagined it as.

>>11851257
>>11851230
i think there used to be a /vg/ and /vp/ general thread for them but most 4chins hated it. the best version was probably Super. then it eventually got a remake of the first game in 3D on Switch.
there was also a fanmade MMO that got killed by nintendo. no one on 4chins cared about that one.

>>11851290
>Pokemania has expired
>Tajiri steps down as director and the role is given to Masuda, who slowly starts to take off-hand liberties with the series
>Legendary pokemon are now Gods that can control and manipulate the elements

These all started with Gen 2

>>11847023
>Growlithe
i remember i just used it as a fast firetype. didn't care if his FIRE power was weak. otherwise i would have evolved Eevee to its firetype or get Ninetails. or Houndoom.

>>11848201
most zoomers i knew don't even play pokermans though? they're playing Minecraft or Roblox if that shit counts as "acting millennial". Gen X here btw.

>>11845767
Undisputedly.

>>11845580 (OP)
If there's one game series I could erase from existence, it would be Pokemon. I was very happy having my gameboy with pokemon blue, and trading cards with kids at the pool when I was 8. That was fine, they were good times and good memories, and it should've ended right there. This, instead, spiraled into the most disgusting thing imaginable, that quite frankly puts the Sonic fandom to shame. I legitimately do not understand the appeal of these games beyond playing them as a small child and enjoying the zeitgeist of the era. Every dude I've ever known that played this shit beyond his young teens turned into an absolute autistic failure. I know, "says the guy on le 4chan", that's fine, but for all of my faults, I haven't done anything half as retarded as manbaby pokeman fans do on a daily basis. I used to be friends with a kid who grew up wearing sneakers and T shirts and liked action movies, he was a cool and mostly normal boy, who is now a 34 year old man that dresses up as Primarina for cons, carries a 2DS around in a purse and uses his Home Goods paycheck to buy card card tins from Walmart. This shit is a disease. I am warning you, stay away.

>>11851290
>>11851318
The thing about old-genfags is that they fail to grasp that Pokemon's change was a response to fan feedback from gen 2-3.
Like a few years ago, /vp/ had that one regular who always argued that nobody genuinely liked the whole "new pokemon belong to the region they are introduced" and it was a corpo mandate that everyone just begrudginly accepted, until an interview came out saying that Game Freak changed because pokefags at the time told them New pokemon being that rare was dogshit.
You still see someone advocating for that every once in a while even on here, but now it has the vibe of an opinion and not "this is an objective fact, you weren't there to prove otherwise!"

>>11851348
>that quite frankly puts the Sonic fandom to shame.

give me an example of Sonic-chu levels of shame, but for pokermans fandom.

>>11851352
If you told me I had to wear a sonichu necklace for one day or dress up like this for three hours, I would happily go out and zap to the extreme.

>>11851352
Sonichu is a blend of Sonic and Pokemon autism

>>11851308
Not happening

>>11851365
Of course not, it's just blatantly dishonest.

>>11851348
>dresses up as Primarina
I don't know what that is but it sounds feminine and something a tranny would like.

>>11851358
looking gud, chris. too bad he went trannycore.

>>11851365
>Gen 2 fans need to outright lie about their own gen to try and squeeze their games into the soul era
figures

>>11851351
>Pokemon's change was a response to fan feedback
In other words, it was the devs imagining what the general fanbase was thinking.

>>11851373
It's this >>11851356
And if you think that's bad, you don't want to see the rest of his instagram, trust me.

>>11851386
>>11851356
Fucking lmao modern men are beyond fucked

>>11851391
it's not a modern men problem in general, it's just a white guy thing

>>11851391
If only you knew how bad things really are.
He's Jewish by the way

>>11851398
>>11851396
they make the AVGN autist look normal.

>>11851396
Let's be honest, it is a modern male issue. I'm white, I have kids, and I've never had the desire to wear a wig and a dress. This disease extends to whites, blacks, asians and everything in-between. It's a result of a crumbling family unit, weak or absent fathers, and children being raised by jewish mass media programming with a nice dose of estrogenic microplastic exposure on top, and a cultural feedback loop that rewards degeneracy with praise and encouragement. This is why I'm telling you guys, stay away from shit like Pokemon. If you want to obsess over some old shitty game, then so be it, but the minute you turn it into an identity you will end up like my friend.

>>11851412
No, it's definitely an overwhelmingly white male problem. There are of course exceptions to the rule.

>>11851417
Might I remind you that there's an entire country of asian "men" that look like this, and if you don't think extremely gay nigs or mexicans don't exist en masse, then I advise you not to visit your local shopping mall any time soon.

>>11851425
>there's an entire country of asian "men" that look like this
bishounen culture, that's what asian women in their age group are into
trannies in west are not attractive to women, quite the opposite in fact- they do it out of pure mental illness

>>11851425
>the results of playing ragnarok online and eating pure soi bean paste for 20 years straight
>this is now considered looking "cool"
i'm worried about the future bros

>>11851425
>if you don't think extremely gay nigs or mexicans don't exist
That's a double negative

>>11851437
>it's just their culture bro, the chicks dig it
Wait until you learn that half of trannies dress up in freaky clothing so they can get closer to women.

>>11851384
No, they were literally told what people wanted to be changed, this isn't a "battle frontier was cut" case.

>>11851447
The difference is younger Asian women actually do find bishounen fashion attractive and this is a centuries-old aspect of Japanese culture (overtly macho men are the gay stereotype in Japan), troons on the other hand are repulsive to western women

>>11851447
The Asian culture you're referring to doesn't even involve crossdressing. They sometimes wear flamboyant clothing, but it's flamboyant male clothing. They don't wear clothing actually designed for women and most importantly they don't claim to be female. It's more about the physical androgyny, similar to the new wave/new romantic fashion trends of the 80s in Western nations. Guys like (the artist formerly known as) Prince who were drowning in pussy.

>>11851457
>>11851474
There's no difference, it's all just flavors of the same faggotry and men trying to change themselves to conform to what they think will make them seem unique and accepted, for pussy or otherwise. You say troons are repulsive to women, I'd agree for the most part, but you're almost arguing aginst yourself with this. If you walk around looking like Prince and you have no money or notoriety, women are going to think you're a freak just as much as the guy wearing a skirt and a choker. Likewise, there are plenty of guys who dress up in literal women's clothing, perform on a stage and get covered in vaginal drippings. Point being, if "I get pussy" is your only standard for what should be socially acceptable, then you're basically admitting that bending culture towards accepting outlandishly gay attire is fine as long as it results in heterosexual intercourse. I can't get behind that. It's a slippery slope that just results in a society of weak, feminized men.

>>11851512
You don't understand it and are unable to differentiate the concepts because you're completely retarded when it comes to fashion and what women find attractive.

>>11851526
>trannies bad
>men dying their hair and wearing makeup to get laid good
I don't know what else there is to understand, you're okay with men dressing like fags and I'm not. I hate to pull the "my le wife and kids" card, but I've been with the same girl for 13 years and I have two sons. I know pretty damn well what at least normal women find attractive, and if you're living in a society where you can't get laid because you wear jeans and a t shirt, then I'd advise you to move somewhere less gay posthaste. I'd caution you to remember that hollywood fags dressing like Prince and Boy George had a trickle down effect on society as a whole, ergo the situation at hand.

>>11851545
>>men dying their hair and wearing makeup to get laid good

yes hot kpop men get sum fug, while you are here, on a weekday, LARPING as a boomer with kids. and we're suppose to just believe you? and getting austically buttmad about it?

topkek. post your kids with banana timestamp on >>>/b/ if you dare. this is a fucking gaming board.

>>11851545
every time i go out im expecting to see stacy with some gigachad but more often than not i just see hordes of decent looking girls with some fat manlet wearing a band shirt and they have like 4 kids in strollers.

idk what these other dudes are talking about because even in places like korea where dressing up like a clown is the norm, they have a negative birth rate. women don't like sissy boys, the only sissy boys they like are the ones with money and fame who can afford to look gay as shit. you can literally be a fat retarded douche and pound prime puss, it ia unironically and completely about being confident

>>11851575
>hot kpop men
Brother, talking like this is part of your problem.

>>11851578
you wanna get laid or pretend to be; don't do it on a gaming board. you are fricking autistical.

>>11851579
I'm being honest with you man, take it or leave it. I think it's sad that society has fallen so far that guys like you think having a woman and kids is an unbelievable feat to begin with. There was a time not too long ago where being married by 25 was the norm, not the exception. That's why I'm telling you that if you want to have a decent, normal life, then don't be playing pokeman at 30 and convincing yourself that makeup is the gateway to sex.

>>11850158
It's the lowest selling Pokemon game for a reason. Pokemania was definitely dead by then.

>>11852004
crystal sold poorly because it was exclusive to the worst selling game boy variant for the 3-4 months between it and the gba launching in japan
and by the time it got localized, the gba was already on shelves internationally with news of the new games in development already making the rounds

>>11852004
emerald being that low is a sin

>>11852117
I would imagine Yellow, Crystal, and Emerald all sold poorly......most of the people aren't going to buy a minor altered version of the same game they already own. The people who bought those were the people who were late to the party or didn't care that much about Pokemon

>>11845652
RS only had 202 pokemon, only a handful were familiar from the first 2 gens

then they release LG/FR only 6 years after the originals the quickest remake in vidya history?

also RSE never had Kanto or Johto, even GSC, a game boy color game, was bigger than this supposed next gen pokemon.

diamond and pearl are unplayable now because muh end-of-life online games zoomers and alfies are used to

>>11852004
>Sword and Shield are the most profitable games outside of RGB despite being the debut of dexit
Grim

>>11852165
I feel like GF should've kept the thread of beating the previous protagonists with each passing game.
Sure, we don't need to have 2 regions in every game but RSE would be so much better if you fought Gold at the end.

>>11852165
Not retro, but you can still play gen 4 online. Gen 5 is dead because of the dream world

>>11851351
>response to gen 2 hiding it's new mons eventually lead to gen 5 hiding the old mons

>captcha:ASMRR

>>11852458
I hate gens 3 and 5

>>11852165
GSC is trimmed and empty
it doesn't compare to Hoenn's map (widely agreed best regional design alongside [standalone] Kanto's)

>>11852480
>I hate the worst of the pre-3D gens
as everyone but zoomers does
>I hate the best of the 2D gens
you're in the minority

irrespectively

>>11852489
Gens 1 & 2 (incl stadium 1 & 2) are best

>>11852156
you can thank gsc for killing pokemania
but don't worry, emerald is literally the most expensive mainline pokemon game of all time and a real cartridge is the holy grail of collections

>>11852492
>& 2
lmfao
sit down baby bro

>>11852496
??

>>11851318
this
johtoddies lack self-awareness

>>11851308
this would completely mindbreak the johtoddlers if they had to face the reality that tajiri johto was a literal abortion that masuda frankenstein'd back into something shippable if though rushed and simplistic

>>11848208
>the second (2nd) most interesting plot/story
>the best pacing
>the best graphics
>the best group of town themes
>the best group of battle themes
>the best opening and ending theme
>the best soundfont
>the best competitive foundation and the best balancing
>the best movedex
>satisfactory technical progression
>the best performance
>the best extracurricular activities and "sidequests"
>the best postgame facilities
>the best character designs
>the best isolated dex
>the best region and map design
>the best level design
>the best encounter design (though missing mons)
>the best cover
>the most sought after and expensive cartridge
>the best looking cartridge
>best spinoffs
>best companion remakes
I'm thinking emerald clears

>>11851351
>pokefags at the time told them New pokemon being that rare was dogshit.
I hate anyone who thought/thinks this. Adding 150+ new mons every generation is fucking retarded.

>>11848019
Masuda literally saved R/G development twice

>11852542
We get it, it was the first Pokemon game you played

>>11852546
>Adding 150+ new mons every generation is fucking retarded.
no it's based and didn't happen enough

>>11847494
>how did they keep interest going after gen 1 and gen 2 anyway
by reversing the shit design decisions, or lack thereof, of gen 2
quite simple
sales started going back up with gen iii and gen iv
>like who was even a fan of Pokemon between 2003-2008
late millennials

>>11852549
Fuck off, you retards celebrate shitty soft reboots and rehashing the same thing over and over instead of actually developing the franchise in a meaningful direction. Now pokemon is utter shit that appeals to braindead retards and the lowest common denominator, great job

>>11852556
I'm a late-ish millennial and I thought RS undid virtually every good thing that gen 2 added and improved on. Gen 3 irreparably ruined the series

>moronic hoenn manchildren come out of the woodwork to shit up the thread
No surprises there

>>11848205
Gen III > Gen IV > Gen I > Gen II

>>11852559
>actually developing the franchise in a meaningful direction
but that's what the 2nd duology did
>Now pokemon is utter shit that appeals to braindead retards and the lowest common denominator
but that's what gen 2 was

>>11852562
no you sound like a tailend mid millennial toddy

>>11852574
>>11852576
Fucking retards, fuck off, I hate you people so much you killed Pokemon

>>11852165
You’re a fucking mongoloid, Emerald has much more single player content than Gen Poo. So do Diamind and Pearl

>>11852579
Not an argument fuck off

>>11852582
GSC are the only games to have more than one region (no the shitty islands don't count)

>>11847447
>>11849715
*gold/silver prerelease
these are the figures of a sophomore slump the public took one look at and realized was exactly that before it even dropped
crystal was just the nail in the coffin confirmation; look at the percentage difference between gs and crystal sales compared to rs and emerald's

>>11852559
>shitty soft reboots and rehashing the same thing over and over
Ok but gen 2 literally did the same shit with the 3 starters and collecting 8 badges to beat the Elite 4 and watch the credits, only they recycled most of the original characters

>>11852580
>>11852583
johtoddy seethe literally gives me life

>>11852579
>classic watercolor art style
Soul. You convinced me, gen3 truly killed pokemon.

>>11852586
It was stated in the gen 3 Sugimori and Masuda interview that Hoenn is slightly bigger than gen 2 Kanto and Johto

>>11852596
you're nostalgiablinded ofc

>>11852601
sovl

>>11852597
Hoenn is actually a complete region rather than half of a complete region like youknowwhat

>>11852603
Gen 2 fags talk like Johto is the same size as Hoenn or even gen 1 Kanto like dude don't kid yourself

>>11852607
it's because they're going off their memory of their childhood imagination
no defense of johto is ever factual, it's essentially a contradiction in terms

>>11852603
Jesus christ, almost half of it is water.

>>11852615
Almost like the theme of the game is about the battle between land and water
I thought the water current routes were neat

>>11852615
well yeah that's the theme
land and sea
it's even shaped like a yin-yang

>>11852501
Just Shitnova fags being mentally ill as usual, pay no mind to it.

>>11849836
truthbomb

>>11850670
uh bro, little newsflash but that's been the johtoddler playbook since GS released
johto in top game lists was never organic, it was always just toddies being the vocal minority that went largely unchallenged during an era where there was way too much generous optimism surrounding the franchise to provoke critical retrospectives on such unironic absurdities like "Yeah man I hecking love Johto, the best part is the moment you leave Johto and then get to go fight the protagonist from Kanto!"

Thankfully now nugens being shit has embittered enough people that it forced serious reappraisals where nothing was sacred and off-limits anymore.

Johtoddlers had a monopoly on the discourse for almost 2 decades, and were so unbearably obnoxious about it that they accidentally forced people to awaken to the fact it's the worst of the quadrilogy.

>>11852649
You like hoenn, opinion disregarded

>>11852692
vast majority of the fanbase does
only toddies don't
besides, the facts speak for themselves

>>11852716
Not an argument. You and your fellow retards killed Pokemon, congrats

>>11852589
>sophomore slump
>the second best-selling games in the series on the list
not bad

Johto is shit, it replaces the dark scifi of gen1 with typlical Japenese mystic temples and spirit animals blah blah

>>11852612
top is how bottom looked in my mind back then

>>11852791
trvke

>>11852791
They tried to do something new with the theme each time
Gen 1 is about urbanisation and sci-fi
Gen 2 is about rural life and folklore
Gen 3 is about tropical living and weather
Gen 4 is about cold living and religion
I don't know what the rest are about, I dropped out of the series after that

>>11852791
I agree, but gens 3 & 4 did this too an even greater extent than gen 2 did

>>11850206
Dexcut and the newer fans now think it‘s cool to hate on pokemon/gamefreak. That‘s it. People lust for drama and TORtanic

>>11850206
No idea what you're talking about. Genwunners have always existed, and gen 3 was hated by many old time fans since it was disconnected from the previous games and wasn't a sequel in the way gen 2 was.

>>11852004
looks like the frachise was revived by remakes rather than new games from this list.

though IMO anything that sells less than half of the original is a flop.

>>11852162
>The people who bought those were the people who were late to the party or didn't care that much about Pokemon

no those were the better versions of Gen 1 and 2. Emerald no, not AFAIK. the harder core fanboys bought them because they were mechanically better.

>>11852872
>Genwunners have always existed
Poor reading comprehension. Obviously the post was referring to people calling you a genwunner if you admitted to the fact that the series peaked with the original 2 generations, and has only gotten progressively worse since then.

>>11852483
combined together they had more content than moderner pokermans.that's the point right? why you kept cherrypicking the kanto map like it was the only map in GSC?!? autistism med wearing off?

>>11852527
>>11852496
what's with this weakb8ing schoolyard insults? i'm literally older than moot, hiromoot, and probably fugged your zoomer moms. and i say Gen 2 was the best.

>>11852791
then every other gen was shit by your logic....

>>11852924
My point is that both groups (gen is best & gen 1+2 are best) both exist. There were in fact people who did not like gen 2 when it released

>>11852926
>combined together they had more content than moderner pokermans
Combined, they actually had LESS than even Gen1 Kanto.

>>11852556
>sales started going back up with gen iii and gen iv
Nope.

>>11853034
I'd say they normalized once the initial hype and the lesser follow-up hype faded.

>>11852596
The watercolor art-work in not present in the game

>>11852597
Just looking at it, I wonder if there are more water tiles in Hoenn than there are walkable tiles in Kanto total

>>11852580
the shitty johto anime killed pokemon, why was ash dicking around for 10-20 episodes between gyms? there was so much filler that everyone stopped caring

>>11853351
Just 20? Seemed more like at least 50.

>>11852790
>off the back of the best selling game and still sells only a fraction of it
sophomore slump

>>11853034
learn to read

>>11852162
>Yellow and Emerald
If you played the other games in their generations, both worked on the hardware you already had. Meanwhile, if you played Gold/Silver on a regular Game Boy, Crystal required buying a new piece of hardware.
Spending $40 on an "update" was egregious, but $190 would make even the most dedicated Pokemaniacs think twice.

>>11852162
>The people who bought those were the people who were late to the party or didn't care that much about Pokemon
I worked hard earning and saving money to buy Yellow as a kid, after already owning Blue and playing it to death from release. I was really into the anime and thought it was very cool how Yellow followed the anime.

Johto deserves to be dragged forever for killing pokemania.

I was big Pokemon fan growing up. Skipped Diamond and Pearl because I thought they were lame. I remember how exciting it was to get back into the series with this one.

I still maintain HG/SS is the zenith of the series. Everything after, you are autistic for caring or just younger than the people who grew up in Pokemania and cannot sing the Pokerap.

>>11853351
nah, people lost interest when they changed Ash's hat.

>>11853690
Why did they remove trainers resetting on the SS Aqua with every new trip? Why did they make the Safari Zone far more annoying to use than any other? Like any other remake it had some good ideas but also a bunch of dumb decisions that made it miss the mark.

>>11853701
I can't argue with you. I was no purist. I just remember it being cool that you could capture all the legendaries from all the previous games all in one game.

>>11853671
don't worry it's happening, has been happening for years, and will continue to happen for the foreseeable future

nobody outside of its own fanbase defends johto in any capacity except hgss zoomers

>>11853690
yadda yadda yadda

It's objectively exciting to find that you can return to Kanto when you complete Johto in Gen II.

>>11853690
>Everything after, you are autistic for caring
this but everything after gen 3

>>11853728
>twitter screencap

>>11853784
oh, we're in agreement. I loved Ruby and Sapphire. I mean after HG/SS. I still played BW1 but after that I was so out. Never played another one. Have no idea how anyone who grew up on Gen I / Gen II could still care after that.

>>11852601
The second ones are more dynamic and cooler, first ones are too static

>>11853785
Twitter and Reddit agree that Johto is bad, why don't you?

>>11853745
and it's objectively disappointing when you see how hollowed out it is. I could tolerate things like mount moon being 2 rooms, but not even being able to explore stuff like silph co was such a letdown

>>11853826
It's my fault for coming into a thread clearly full of people who care a lot more than me. You are probably right. Don't be discouraged by my half-hearted opinion.

>>11853826
>>11853861
Thought about it some more and I will contend that fighting Red at the end of Gold and Silver is worth any sort of stripping back of content. That is too fucking sick.

>>11853785
>>11853817
That's like saying the posts above prove 4chan doesn't like Johto.

>>11853949
Nobody likes Johto apart from Johto nostalgics.

>>11853410
10-20 between each gym

>>11853972
even on /vr/ the only retro Pokemon threads with unanimous love and enthusiastic engagement were Kanto threads

>>11854107
>even on /vr/
not saying much when people like this are on /vr/ >>11853817, who hold twitter and reddit opinions in high regard

>>11854115
That post is clearly ironic, anon.

>>11854148
He should have cited the actual posts ITT which seriously tried to appeal to twitter and reddit when talking about how Johto is bad

>>11846127
oh no, not MAREEEP

>>11854327
Yeah anon, it's that bad. You don't belong out here on the front lines. Go back inside and have some chicken tendies and chalkie milk.

>>11852179
this is a very old list (since it doesn't have scarlet/violet) but Scarlet/Violet is extremely high up there too, I think both Sword/Shield and Scarlet/Violet have surpassed Gold/Silver at this point. Very grim. The Switch was a mistake.

>>11852542
>>the second (2nd) most interesting plot/story
How? Team Magma/Team Aqua still to this day have the dumbest plan, with only Chairman Rose rivaling them in stupidity.

>>11854532
Scarlet and violet are at least fun. Sword and shield is gay af.

>>11854538
Rose's plan should have leaned more into being a corrupt CEO who commits sports scandals so that his corporate shill Leon always wins.

>>11853531
Stop coping and learn to be less of a retard who makes false claims.

>>11854327
The only electric type, yeah

Shit typing distribution, impossible to make a custom team

>>11854680
The shit pokemon distribution and level curve are Johto's most commonly-cited complaints. The reason G/S/C is so poorly designed likely stems from the rushed re-development on Masuda's part. He didn't really get to cook until Gen 3, which was much better-designed all around. Pretty unforgivable that HG/SS didn't go farther to fix the bad design, but I guess they didn't want to upset the nostalgiafags.

>>11854538
>Team Magma/Team Aqua still to this day have the dumbest plan,
no they don't
you don't understand ecology enough to understand the plot

>>11854707
truthbomb

>>11854538
Team Magma was justified, if they won Hoenn wouldn't be 50% shitty water routes

>>11854327
Mareep is literally half the team in many Johto playthroughs

>>11845580 (OP)
I love the refined simplicity of the shapes and the colored pencil shading its fucking immaculate
Horrible digital slop comes after
gen 3 is okay tho

>>11854680
>The only electric type
Chinchou, Voltorb, Magnemite are available to you before you fight Morty. With Magneton being the best Electric type in the game, and Voltorb getting the traded exp boost.

>>11854776
>Chinchou
you get the good rod in olivine city
>Voltorb
the trade is in olivine city
>Magnemite
in a route after ecruteak city
>m-muh nonlinearity
no one skips morty upon reaching ecruteak
wow a j*htonigger being disingenuous? who would've thought

>>11854803
>wow a j*htonigger being disingenuous? who would've thought
unthinkable

>>11845580 (OP)
>never played pokemon
>never watched friends
>i am proud of these facts

It’s funny how you can tell the critical gen2 comments calling anyone a johto n is just two guys samefagging their own points at best
Lmao

>>11854803
>you get the good rod in olivine city
Yes. You can go to Olivine before fighting Morty.
>the trade is in olivine city
Yes. You can go to Olivine before fighting Morty.
>in a route after ecruteak city
Yes. You can go to Route 38/39 before fighting Morty.
>no one skips morty upon reaching ecruteak
People who play the game do. It's no different from going to Route 16 before fighting Erika in Gen 1.

>>11854817
>People who play the game do.
I've just been lurking but no, nobody skips Morty like that. Stop being a disingenuous faggot.

>>11854817
>People who play the game do
lying and gaslighting now, are we?

>>11854776
No classic fans use objectmon or humanoids, only animals

>>11854819
>>11854824
>i don't do that so it doesn't count!
Ok.

>>11854826
>i do that so everyone does that
>despite having zero evidence of that being the case
ok.

>>11854829
>>i do that so everyone does that
Nobody said that. All that was said is that it's possible.
Meanwhile, you proclaimed that "nobody does that".

>>11854826
Kek. Look at any Johto playthrough and nobody is going to Olivine to catch a Chinchou. Johto fags like you will never be accepted here.

>>11854832
nobody is using chinchou regardless lmao

>>11854836
Thinking about it, I never found one when I played Gold. The first time I encountered it was in Ruby when diving I believe.

>>11854832
>Look at any playthrough
Why? I don't need a YouTuber to show me how to play the game.
Is this why you didn't know? Because whatever playthrough you watched didn't do it?

>>11854843
>YouTuber
Why did you go straight to Youtube? Are you not aware of old lets plays done through forums like Gamefaqs? Fuck off zoomer.

>>11854848
>Youtube
Because that's where "any playthrough" is uploaded, you fucking retard.

>>11854849
What? In forum playthroughs, you post your progress with text and screenshots. Go back to /vp/ where you belong, zoomer.

>>11847269
Pokemon was never impressive on any hardware

>>11854851
So the GameFAQs playthrough* that showed you how to play the game didn't do it, and that's why you didn't know about it?
That's not really any better than if you watched it on YouTube, so it's interesting that that's what you took issue with.

>>11854857
>playthrough*
why are you mixing his words
kill yourself nigger

>>11854803
>>11854819
>>11854824
Fucking retards

>>11854859
You feeling alright?

>>11854860
But enough about you

>johto is bad because... uh... i-it just is okay!!

>>11854861
here's a lesson, my retarded esl. that implies there's many playthroughs, which there were back in the day. now fuck off back to >>>/vp/

>>11854776
>shitmons
Just use Raikou

>>11854776
>>11854817
Voltorb and Magnemite aren't even good in GSC.
Their lack of Arms and shitty learnset means you will have to rely on the thunder TM for the rest of the game until you either trade to RBY for TBolt or get it in the move tutor.

>>11854865
You're still not denying it. You're embarrassing yourself.

>>11854873
>zoomer brainrotted from tiktok dances can't read
sorry, can't help you

>>11854870
I forgot you can catch all the beasts before Morty in gen 2. The roaming feature was annoying but it's a weird decision.

>>11854872
I don't really agree, but at least you know what you're talking about so I appreciate that you've actually played it.

I tend to give Magneton Rain Dance when I use it, since it benefits from weakening Fire anyway and it's effectively a 5-turn Lock-On for Thunder. I get that not everyone wants to dedicate two move slots to using Thunder, but I've never had a problem with it and Magneton doesn't need much else to be effective.
You're right that 'Torb/'Trode is a bit harder to swing, but I'm also a weirdo who likes to keep it around for blowing up. It's basically a guaranteed KO on whatever you're up against, and you can usually take out one or two monsters before resorting to that.

>>11854889
>Rain Dance/Thunder
Why are you pitting Magneton against fire moves?
>blowing up
On what, Red's Snorlax? Exploding doesn't give anything exp, it's a waste.

Unless you're playing Stadium 2, competitive, or some autistic romhack, all of this is complicating a kid's game in an unnecessary way.

>>11854813
Why are you proud of that?

>>11854863
Because it has bad Pokemon distribution, re uses Gen1 pokemon while being worse than gen1, has a retarded levelling flow, has asinine gimmicks like time cycles, doubles down on annoying HM usage, locks in the interesting dark pokemon to the post game, and overall feels unfinished and anticlimactic to complete

>>11854894
>Why are you pitting Magneton against fire moves?
Ideally you wouldn't, but it's a benefit of Rain Dance that can't be ignored.
>Exploding doesn't give anything exp
And? Too many people think blowing up is a non-option despite it giving things like Electrode and Forretress an incredible niche. Exp. Share exists if it's lagging behind anyway, there's nothing stopping you from doing it.
>all of this is complicating a kid's game in an unnecessary way
Again, I disagree. They're options available to the player, and serve to make the game more interesting if you don't mind putting some thought into how you play.
You don't need to be playing Stadium to justify playing creatively.

>>11854903
Good for you, but little kids figured out better strategies 26 years ago. Try using that creativity and brainpower in harder games, not vanilla Pokemon.

>>11854897
It's also mythosly retarded
>No, the new land isn't home to the new Pokemon, the new Pokemon live in Kanto, they JUST evolved into existence now!

>>11854707
But you get to make your own team with eggs for replays, so it doesn't really matter past your first play through.

>>11854906
I do play other games. I just enjoy playing Pokemon from time to time, and it's nice to play the game differently each time I do.
You can use the same team every time if you want, but I find that boring.

>>11854897
Classic zoomer "complaints". Get new material

>>11854897
No lies detected

>>11854897
>bad Pokemon distribution
I disagree
>re uses Gen1 pokemon
Not necessarily a bad thing.
>has a retarded levelling flow
Not really. As long as you have a full team and don't grind, it's pretty hard to break the level curve.
>has asinine gimmicks like time cycles
That's a positive. Especially for a kid back in the day, it gave you a reason to play at different times and on different days.
>doubles down on annoying HM usage
Legitimate complaint.
Three mandatory Water HMs (one of which is just a worse version of another) IS egregious.
>locks in the interesting dark pokemon to the post game
This might only be true for Murkrow and Sneasel. Houndoom is really good and doesn't have any business being available before the E4.
>overall feels unfinished and anticlimactic to complete
I think beating the previous game's protagonist is about as satisfying an ending as you could ask for. It had finality.

A personal complaint of mine is that the rival kinda sucks.
He undergoes character growth by bonding with his Pokemon, but this is presented to you through him explicitly telling you "I'm changing and I hate it", every time you see him. And while he does eventually evolve his Golbat, his Crobat is exclusive to optional rematches after you've already fought him in Kanto. I'd bet that 80% of players never even saw it.

>>11854897
truthbomb

>>11854918
Zoomers played gen2, people born in 1989 like me played Gen1

Stop pretending gen2 is Gen1, you're not a prime millennial

>>11855097
>Zoomers played gen2
The very oldest zoomers were born in 1997/8, Gen 3 was already out in 2002

>>11845767
Yes.
>t. enjoyed gen 3 and 4 as a kid but gen 2 will always be home

Johto
>most routes look the same
>small region
>a lot of dead space where more trainers or treasures could be included, routes are big but with few things you can interact with
>has dead ends, you can only reach locations from the same angle every time
>all the region is flat
>only 10 towns, with just one being a proper city, which adds to the feeling of repetitiveness
>most areas are not worth revisiting, so you end up ignoring most of the map once clearing
>has battle tower

Hoenn
>every route looks drastically different, varied terrains and layouts
>huge region, at least double the size of Johto without even counting the water routes
>filled to the brim with varied encounters at every corner that make every route feel even more unique, no space is wasted
>everything is looped and interconnected, so travelling around stays fresh
>has many mountains and valleys that you can explore
>15 towns, many villages and cities
>many places worth revisiting: contest facilities in many towns, daycare at the center of the map, secret bases
>has battle frontier

Even if you play gen 2 for the Kanto section, you're better of playing gen 1 directly instead of the demaked version for babies who get scared of the Lavender theme.

>>11855117
>Even if you play gen 2 for the Kanto section, you're better of playing gen 1 directly
Or better yet, play FR/LG. R/S/E and FR/LG are the definitive pokemon experience. It never got any better than that.

>>11854870
Game Freak's oversight making it miss out of bite makes it not much better than either mite or torb.

>>11855109
Rare based zoomer

>>11855118
FRLG are worse than RBY by every conceivable metric

>>11855154
Nope, you're objectively wrong. Have fun dwelling in the minority on that one mate.

>>11855167
>the majority believes thing, therefore it's true!
Fantastic argument, anon

>>11855169
It's true regardless of the fact that majority accepts it as true. RBY is a clunky mess that doesn't even work the way they intended. It's not worth the argument though, I'm right, you're wrong, and no amount of back and forth will change that. Have a good'un.

>>11854908
Not a single Johto proponent has ever properly defended the fact that there are Johto pokemon exclusive to Kanto despite never being there just a few years earlier. They just spout headcanon nonsense to try and justify it.

>>11855171
Pretty much the only "arguments" I hear from Johot is the best believers, are purely subjective/anecdotal aside from one point
>it's the best because.....the soul! the vibes!
subjective nonsense
>it's the best because.....gen1 pokemon are cool
only really a plus if you didn't play geb1 first already
>i LIKE the day/night system
fair, and yet still subjective but you are free to like it and that would make it the best to you, so that's ONE reason at all it would be "the best" that i've ever heard whatsoever

>>11855170
>duhh le glitchies
Fuck off, zoomer

>>11855171
They were just recently discovered, as were eggs and baby Pokemon, just as evolution itself was only recently discovered by Oak in Gen 1

>>11855218
>They were just recently discovered
There's no official material stating this. It's just headcanon.

>>11855317
Elm says it.

>wonder why this thread is so predictably shit since OP posted
>we're raided by /vp/ autists

>>11855337
>posted a day ago
Most so we have tourists who post here and /vp/ back.
But it does explain why we have so many off-topic retards bring up non-/vr/etro games and board boogeymen for no apparent reason.

>>11855337
>https://archive.palanq.win/vp/thread/56446241/#56447692
What a read.

>>11854836
I did once. It was decent enough given the limited non-Kanto options in Crystal, but anything's decent in the single-player anyway.

here from /vp/ to say OP is based and only underages don't like johto

>>11855365
Now this is autism

>>11855337
>implying the OP isn't a vp autist himself

>>11855498
Look at the OP from >>11855365. Same image, same filename style, same writing style. It's the same /vp/ autist.

>>11855117
truthbomb
west kanto is empty

>>11855218
>>11855336

>>11855218
>>11855336
>>11855807
Something that is 100% official/canon and yet absolutely bullshit to believe.
There are multiple fossil pokemon which means they have been there for as long as the prehistoric and yet there no documented info on their breeding until 3 years after Red left? Nobody went to the tall Grass at night? Ghastly line just pretended to not be affected by Bite?

>>11855875
goes to show what a lazy hackjob gsc is lore-wise

>>11855875
>Pokemon are mysterious creatures! (TM)(C)
The equivalent of "It's just a show, you should really just relax".

All this samefagging and not one post has been able to give any reason why GS are bad games.
It's always so funny.

>>11856089
Pretty sure the critiques here are mostly hyperbole for shitposting purposes because just saying something is mediocre or subpar is not enough to get (You)s.

>>11855336
>Elm says it.
He says nothing about new species of pokemon magically appearing in Kanto.

>>11854327
HGSS undid Crystal's retardation, how about you undo your faggotry now.

>>11856168
I hope Mareep sees this bro

>>11856168
NTA but my biggest problem with HGSS is its insistence on railroading the player toward the box legendary. It takes what was originally a reward for putting the pieces together yourself and turns it into a mandatory pitstop on your quest, making sure to remind you several times throughout the game that you're the prophecy's chosen one and not just an average kid from the province of Bumfuck Nowhere, Japan.
The originals did not have that problem, and whether you encountered them at all was entirely left up to you. It's the worst part of Gen 4 clumsily shoehorned into a game that wasn't made for it.

Regarding Marreep, I don't like that it was placed before Falkner, making his intro dialog pointless. The point was to teach the player that there are other ways to deal with Flying Pokemon.

>>11856246
You could already beat Falkner with Geodude or Onix.

>>11856281
Thank you for re-stating the point.

>>11853701
Man you sure are miserable

>>11856285
I thought you meant other ways as in not use their weaknesses

>>11854817
>I did the thing once, ergo, everyone does it

>>11856296
>be someone who plays the game
>do thing
>people who play the game do this thing
It's objectively true. I don't know why you're trying to paint it as something that wasn't said.

>>11856327
Turbo autists like you shouldn't be allowed internet access.

>>11856289
So much this. Stop questioning things and just be happy with remakes. They're a gift from the corporations to us.

>>11854803
The only rod you need is the old rod on Route 32 after Violet City to catch a Magikarp so you can get a Gyarados shortly after and steamroll the game.

>>11856327
You took the original message of "impossible" too literally. Low functioning autists tend to do that.

>>11856246
>The originals did not have that problem
That wasn't a problem.

>>11856465
You said something that wasn't true, and now you're claiming it wasn't what you meant.
The term for this is "backpedaling".

People who grew up on R/B being their first remember Spice Girls, Marilyn Manson, Beast Wars,and Mighty Morphin Power Rangers

People who grew up with Crystal, remember Paramore, My Chemical Romance, Transformers RiD2001 and Power Rangers Zodiac Force (or whatever)

These aren't the same generations, sorry faggots, Gen1 was played by people born in the 80s

>>11856482
What do you think the target age for Pokemon is?

>>11856487
4-9

>>11856504
So when it got localized in late-98, that would be kids born between 89 and 94.
Sorry to tell you, but kids born in 89 are not 80s kids.

>>11856482
Hey spergy, Red and Blue released in 1998 in the west, Crystal just three years later in 2001. Why are you acting like this necessitates some huge generational divide? It's completely possible that people started playing pokemon at around 9 and then aged out of it after Crystal at around 11, like myself.

>>11856510
>9
meant 8, that's about my age when R/B released

>>11856504
By these standards, the majority of zoomers would have started with Gen 3, not Crystal, and it would have been primarily millennials who played it

>>11856508
>but kids born in 89 are not 80s kids.
No shit, theyre 90s kids. Real 90s kids were born 87-93. Any later or earlier, you're more of an 80s kid or a 00s baby.

>>11856510
Three years is a long time in kidworld retard. I was a kid when Gen1 hit and EVERYONE was into it, three years later you got bullied and everyone was getting into rock bands or whatever.

>>11856517
Late Millennials, I made that distinction clear didn't I? They don't remember Korn on TRL, they remember Fallout Boy on MTV2, theyre late millennials, not prime

>>11856523
You got bullied because you are very obviously on the spectrum.

Gen 2 is zoomercore and the original 151 are the only real pokemon, I don't care what anyone says.

>>11856526
I was born in 1991 and I remember all of those things. My peers and I all thought Gold and Silver were the peak, but by the time Crystal released we had mostly moved on from Pokemon or were content with sticking to Gold and Silver. I don't even remember Crystal being advertised.

>>11856523
I don't think you were there.
I was born in late 1990, and everyone was still into Pokemon by the time Gen 2 rolled around. It only started to die off after Crystal dropped.

>>11856548
He probably grew up poor and they couldn't afford the GBC upgrade to play Crystal where he lived.

>>11856527
I didn't get bullied, I began my transformation out of nerd-dome as a grungey classic rock kid who wore AC/DC and Ozzy shirts with long hair and I actually protected the full spergs still into Pokemon, because I was a closeted geek. I saved Brian Sass in 7th grade from the skater wanna bes who were throwing around his Pokemon book by grabbing it and a simple "enough, leave" because I was known as the anger issues kid, so they did.

I played Gen2, I just didn't tell anybody about it. You know who was REALLY into Crystal? My cousin Carmela, who was 4 years younger than me, and had no real experience of Gen1 other than me and her older brothers being into it, seeing the anime as a toddler, and thinking like Pikachu and Jigglypuff were cute.

>>11856550
But even then, you didn't need a GBC to play Gold and Silver. So no part of his story makes sense.

>>11856542
>>11856548
>>11856550
samefag

>>11856554
>I began my transformation out of nerd-dome as a grungey classic rock kid who wore AC/DC and Ozzy shirts with long hair
And this was what year?

>>11856558
I only had a GBC, you realize it came out the SAME year as Gen1 right? Oh, you didn't, because you're a late millennial not prime millennial.

GBC came out literally a few days before my birthday and I got it bundled with Pokemon Blue as my main gift. I never had a handheld before that, only Sega Genesis and PSX. Your fake story falls apart because you don't have a real memory of the era.

>>11856560
He doesn't seem to mention Gold and Silver, his point was made about Crystal, three years after R/B released.

>>11856563
So Pokemon was your first and only Game Boy game? We all had Game Boys before that, some of us even had Pockets.

>>11856564
meant to also reply to >>11856558

>>11856528
Heracross is better than the majority of the original 151.

>>11852987
and how did you calculate that? it had more pokemon, more types, more landmass, more postgame stuff to do compared to Gen 1.
poor trolly b8

>>11856554
Don't be using the real names of people you know on this cesspool of a forum if you have even an ounce of respect for human life, you absolute idiot. Stop it with that shit.

>>11856621
zoomers on twit, leddit and this thread just spent a whole week shitting on Gen2.... it's doubtful they ever played Gen 1 and 2 in the first place given zoomer attention spans.

>>11856657
how many carmelas you knew got doxxed on /b/ or /vp/? and why would you ever believe a thing blogposters blog about?

>>11845580 (OP)
I have a ziplock bag full of Pokemon Silver and Gold carts that need new batteries. I have a single copy of Crystal. And it's the only copy I've ever come across.

>>11856567
Yeah because this is a Crystal thread and the known Gen2 loyalists worship Crystal specifically, because most Gen2 loyalists I've noticed, are not Gen1 fags. nobody who owned GS bought Crystal just like nobody who owned RB bought Yellow

>>11856567
It was my first, not my only. I had pretty much every noteworthy GBC and GBC game along with a litany of shovelware I bought because it was about shit I liked. Then I never owned a Nintendo console again until somebody gave me a Gamecube for 50 bucks

>>11856659
Ok???

>>11856657
Sorry marty

>>11855807
>>11855875
In Gen 1, it was implied that Pokemon themselves were only recently discovered, or even that they recently appeared (or arrived) on Earth. The generic shit fantasy slop that begun in gen 2 and pushed to the extremes in gens 3-6 is very different to the original vision for what Pokemon was meant to be: modern and urban with sci-fi elements.

>>11855317
It's mentioned in both GSC and Stadium 2. You would know this if you actually played the games

>>11856704
the gen 1 explanation never made any fucking sense due to the sheer amount of pokemon infrastructure in the world including the goddamn global cockfighting contest. It is funny to imagine the elephant genocide at the hands of rabid ghastlies though

>>11856704
>In Gen 1, it was implied that Pokemon themselves were only recently discovered, or even that they recently appeared (or arrived) on Earth.
No it wasn't. This is often repeated in these threads, but there's nothing official that says this.

>>11856712
>It's mentioned in both GSC and Stadium 2.
No it's not, which is why nobody has ever shown where it's supposedly said. Pokemon have always existed in the pokemon universe. The most that happens in GSC is that Elm is surprised by the egg that Mr. Pokemon gives.

>11856714
>11856717
Dumb zoomers. Play the actual games. I know they're from before you were born and that's scary, but you can do it, I believe in you

>>11856720
>it's totally in the games bro, trust me!
It doesn't exist you retard. I've played the games and it never says that.

>>11856721
It's explicitly stated in Earl's Academy in Stadium 2

>>11856725
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TaV-15LTwOo
No it's not.

>>11856729
Yes it is. Again, play the game. If you look at info for moves/mons that were introduced in GS, it'll say something to the effect of "X wasn't discovered 3 years ago"

>>11856713
>>11856714
First of all, it was, and in the anime Pokemon were heavily hinted at being aliens. Pokemon were also treated as explicitly NOT animals

In later gens, they decided Pokemon just ar that worlds animals, which makes no sense. You mean to pollinate flowers you have five foot tall Beedrills swarming your hard in the dozens? Retarded

And as dumb as the gen1 idea that Pokemon are "recent" are, you realize history is relative? We call the colonial days of America "Recent history" and it was like 600 years ago, that's because it is recent in the grand scheme of recorded history and PRE history

>>11856773
it's right in the name, "pocket monsters", pokemon were conceived to be monsters, so yes ET, supernatural, or unnatural in origin. Yes, the Japanese idea of "monster" tends to often lean more into strange animals or "kaiju" rather than the Wests more fantastic ideas but that's a cultural thing because Japanese people are animalphobic/view animals with contempt much more than the West, who tend to base monsters more on humanoid entities or simply "threatening" animals like bugs, large predators, and snakes.

in either case, they were meant to be monsters of some kind or more aptly kaiju, not naturally occurring Earth animals

>>11856731
I'm playing it right now. The closest thing to what you're claiming is that some moves say "Its effect is different than it was three years ago." It says nothing about pokemon just being discovered.

>>11856810
That's for highlighted moves that have changed, like Bite, not for new moves and mons

>>11856773
>First of all, it was, and in the anime Pokemon were heavily hinted at being aliens. Pokemon were also treated as explicitly NOT animals
Never happened you lying fag. The closest thing to this was that is was speculated that the Clefairy line came to earth from meteorites, because they are often found near meteorites. It never says they were a recent discovery. This talk of pokemon just recently being discovered was quite literally made up by Johto proponents to justify retarded shit like Houndoom and Murkrow being exclusive to Kanto back then. It was a lie repeated so often that people started believing it.

>>11856814
New moves don't say anything like that. Tell me where to look and I'll grab a screenshot.

>>11856830
It also doesn't even mention anything like this when you try and trade a Johto pokemon to a Gen 1 game

>11856830
>11856851
Cute little zoomie downloading his first n64 rom. You're making it too obvious that you've never played Stadium 2 before

>>11856853
I've played it before and am playing it right now. I went to the Pokemon Academy and it never said that. I went to Oak's Lab and tried to trade a Gen 2 pokemon to a Gen 1 game and it doesn't say it. You made it up, or are parroting something someone else made up.

>>11856717
>The most that happens in GSC is that Elm is surprised by the egg that Mr. Pokemon gives.
And then in HG/SS, because eggs got retconned to have always existed earlier in FR/LG, Elm initially doesn't care about the egg since it's common knowledge.

johtofags making shit up and seething about zoomers? the sky is blue

The dialogue exists, but you need to have one of the pokegods in your party for it to appear.

>>11856773
>you mean to pollinate flowers you have five foot tall Beedrills swarming your hard in the dozens?

how is this any worse than shit like magcargo existing without causing harm every moment of its life or 5000 IQ Alakazam with magic powers just lurking out there? Pokemon never stood up to any kind of practical scrutiny. Larvatars eat mountains a day just to grow. It's fantasy, cartoon logic where you're not supposed to think about stuff too hard

>>11854714
basic elementary/middle school ecology highlights how retarded they are. Even back in the day we all made fun of it for being stupid.

>>11856704
> it was implied that Pokemon themselves were only recently discovered, or even that they recently appeared (or arrived) on Earth.
Gen 1 has 3 fossil pokemon.

>>11856773
where?

>>11856897
In a world where a Torterra could probably shit an island, things like mountains become renewable resources. Furthermore, Beedrill is a wasp. Combee is a bee and he's only 1' tall.

>>11857186
They're from space originally
>>11857262
>Beedrill is a wasp
>Isn't called Waspdrill
Hmm

>>11857458
>They're from space originally
It only says that about the Clefairy line and it's presented as mere speculation.

>>11857516
The original intention was that all Pokemon have an extra terrestrial origin

>>11857571
hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

>>11857571
This is another thing like "the games state that pokemon were just recently discovered" which is a lie that just gets repeated endlessly without anyone ever backing up the claim (it can't be done, of course)

I wonder how much online Pokemon discussion throughout the years was just made up bullshit.

>>11857593
Tourist here. It's something Johtoddlers use as an excuse for poor design choices in the Pokemon distribution - they're annoyingly rare and suck ass because they're newly discovered!

>>11857594
The first gen had a lot of myths like the pokegods and Bill's secret garden etc, but gen 2 has a lot of flat-out lies used by nostalgic fans to try and defend really bad design decisions

Crystal is so kino

..

>>11855807
Wow just like a real scientist!

>>11857458
>>11857571
Aerodactyl, Omastar and Kabutops were never stated to be intelligent enough to travell from another planet to earth, nevermind that Kaboto line used to a purely aquatic creature according to dex entries until it adopted to Hunt on land as well.

>>11857585
>There were never any regular animals in the Pokemon world!
>That's why the majority of pokemon are described based on what type of regular animal they resemble!
>mouse pokemon, cat pokemon, lizard pokemon, turtle pokemon...
>in a world where mice, cats, lizards, and turtles never ever existed
I will never forgive this retcon, it's so fucking stupid. The idea that pokemon are relatively new to the world and that the study of pokemon is an up and coming field permeates all of Gens 1 and 2; removing that aspect weakens the worldbuilding immensely. Even as a kid, I had the impression that pokemon were foreign creatures who came into the world and eventually out-competed and replaced normal animals. They even make a point about how they've recently started discovering ancient pokemon fossils and how surprising that is, implying that the researchers also believed pokemon were a more recent occurrence and that the fossils changed their understanding of when and how pokemon actually appeared.

>>11857186
Dinosaur fossils in the real world were only recently discovered. The first scientific description of a dinosaur happened 200 years ago, which is part of recent history. What's your point?

>>11857990
Yes, but we knew about nearly all the creatures that evolved from them, they also didn't just appear out of nowhere like that anon implied.

>>11858010
Maybe pokemon showed up at different times in multiple waves, with some showing up in prehistory, going extinct, and then more not showing up again until more recent times.
Maybe they were mistaken for animals at first, especially when their population was still low and types were still sparse.

>>11858031
That's you filling the holes Game Freak didn't bother to cover.

>>11858114
No more than you were. I don't think anything I said was unreasonable and it fits in with the clear ideas that are communicated about pokemon being recent and existing alongside animals.

Again:
>Pokemon are mysterious creatures! (TM)(C)

Basically, GameFreak didn't think the setting and lore all the way through and didn't expect anybody else to, so they just repeat that line again and again to brush off any debates or conflicts.

>>11858138
Nothing i mentioned wasn't directly stated in the games or Game Freak themselves.

>>11858226
Anything Gamefreak has to say about the matter post-gen 2 is a retcon, as evidenced by the way pokemon were treated and referred to in the first two generations compared to all other subsequent ones.

>>11858235
Well, yeah, they rebooted in Gen3. And then again in Gen6, but that argument's beyond the scope of this board.

>>11858235
I literally only mentioned stuff in gen 1-2

my fav is x/y. yes, i was born in 2007

>>11858235
How were Pokémon treated differently in Gen 3 compared to 2? Got any examples? The Gen 3 reboot is honestly overstated. The games didn’t connect to the GBA, some competitive mechanics got reworked and the new regional evil teams started going after legendaries, but there was no massive lore overhaul or anything like that.

>>11859024
Mostly just adding the new types and eggs to Kanto and saying they were always there.