Thread 11956207

>see this game get dunked on for decades
>purchased it on GOG sometime in the past 10 years for probably $1
>see it in my library recently and randomly decide to try it
>play it
>actually enjoyed the game a lot

I realize I have the benefit of playing with the unofficial 1.3 patch but most reviews act like the game itself is shit and not just the technical shortcomings of the pre 1.3 versions. Hell, I left sidekicks and save gems turned on and still fucking loved it.

Am I alone? Has anyone else actually given the game a proper chance now that the technical issues are by and large fixed? Or is it just people parroting what they've seen people on YouTube say?

>bad game.....GOOD!!
yawn

the n64 version of daikatana is legitimately one of the worst games ever made

>>11956207 (OP)
The game got dunked on because it had an insane hype campaign surrounding it and when it released it was buggy and mediocre.

>>11956264

Can't vouch for or against that since I've never played the N64 one though I've seen videos about it. Specifically talking about the PC version here.

>>11956283

I grew up during the hype train for it. I remember the infamous ad in the magazines I've read. It never was going to live up to that hype. I certainly know well the technical issues it had on launch but I'm mostly referring to the fact that even today people make videos parrot how it's one of the worst games ever made from a purely gameplay standpoint. I really think they've either not played through it or went in with their opinion already decided from the past reviews.

>be contrarian
>hear popular opinion
>decide to prove it wrong
>do so
so brave

>>11956264
The n64 version is superior for the simple fact it didn't include the sidekicks during gameplay.

>>11956207 (OP)
I couldn’t make it passed the horrific opening fmv or movie clip whatever m. The writing was so atrocious I never got to the actual game play. That and the graphics were just a huge turn off. I’ve heard the n64 version is rage inducing w the partners so, I may give that one a try because if you’re going to beat a bad game at least do it on the over the top bad version for bragging rights. I’d literally come on here and brag like an idiot if/when I do it.

>>11956306
Oh really I thought the 64 version was considered the absolute worst (but I’m a 64 fag so if I play it, it’ll be on that system) but yeah I guess it’s not if they nerfed how awful the companions were.

>>11956258
>>11956301
>chuds contribute nothing of value to discussion

>>11956207 (OP)
If nothing else it has great music

>>11956312
No, the n64 version is WAY less rage inducing, there are no sidekicks.

>>11956258
>>11956301

>person plays a game that most people dislike
>ends up liking it
>"OMG YOU ONLY DID IT TO BE CONTRARIAN!"

>>11956295
Voicing your opinion online is now a commodity to be sold, so of course it's all fake.

>>11956363

Truly the end times.

game has soul, i'll say that for it

>>11956330

The music really is fantastic. This track from episode 3 is either my second favorite or tied with Phendrana Drifts from Metroid Prime for best "ice music".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlP3EpITOLA

>>11956207 (OP)
you know you've run out of contrarian opinions when you start blowing fucking daikatana.

classic case of "My favorite YouTuber says a game is bad therefore anyone who says otherwise must be a contrarian!"-itis

>>11956482
bro, the general sentiment that daikatana is total fucking shit predates the existence of youtube by many years. i bet you think zelda 2 is the best zelda game as well, given that you seem like a retarded fag and all.

Has Romero ever apologized for the embarrassing ad campaign for Daikatana?

>>11956492

He did if I recall. It was also not his idea. It was Mike Wilson's idea and when Romero wasn't sure about running it because he thought it was a bad idea Mike told him "Don't be a pussy."

>>11956484

lol man can't handle differing opinions, you straight up admit you are only going on established opinions despite having no frame of reference. he also never said it was the best fucking game ever simply that he enjoyed it. also, Zelda 2 is fucking great, it's not the best but it is good. learn some fucking nuance

>invents the fps genre
>can't even make a half-decent fps a few years later
shit, what happened? too much cocaine, too many whores and fast cars?

>>11956512

it is decent though, just was an overhyped, buggy mess at launch. Ego is a hell of a drug in your 20s when you're nouveau riche.

>>11956508
>also, Zelda 2 is fucking great
lawl, called it.

>>11956512
Romero fell in love with a D&D campaign he had with the other Id guys and had these grandiose ideas of game that would be an RPG and action game with time travel and whatever else ever since. Quake was gonna be it until everyone sane saw that it wasn't gonna work, and got reworked into what we have now. Daikatana is Romero without anyone telling him some of his ideas are stupid.

>>11956207 (OP)
I'm on episode 4 right now.

>With the 1.3 patch the companions definitely aren't as much of a headache as I've heard they are, but they're still kind of annoying to deal with
>episode 1 was shit, but the rest were a little better
>shitload of weapons but I didn't bother with most of them because they seem to hurt you more than the enemies
Far from the worst thing I ever played, but I don't see myself replaying it anytime soon.

>>11956207 (OP)
It didn’t actually retail for $1

I can't leave this thread without my buddy Superfly

>>11956725

I actually liked Episode 1. The level design was much better than some of the others in my opinion with Episode 4 being my least favorite. Agreed on the companions and the weapons. Interesting effects but splash damage is insane.

>>11956735

Not the retail version. Saying I picked it up on GOG for $1 at some point. See image.

>>11956662

Ironic part is his actions in that D&D campaign caused Carmack to canonically end it because Romero took a huge risk.

>>11956876
>Not the retail version. Saying I picked it up on GOG for $1 at some point. See image.
That's not the point. When this game first came out , it was a full-price boxed retail release, and patch 1.3 didn't exist yet. People were pissed for a reason.

>>11957089

Okay I misunderstood you. My bad. Thought you were saying it has never cost $1.

With that, yeah, I definitely get the issues people had with it back then and that it was deserved. What I'm talking about is now that the fan patch exists and the game can actually be evaluated on its gameplay merits rather than ripping on its technical issues I think, while not perfect, it's an enjoyable game and not the garbage make it out to be.

I hate faggot ass cocksucker computer games

>>11957052

are they playing SMB? Is this when they were trying to do a Mario port to convince Nintendo?

>>11957274

Yeah this photo is them in the lake house making "Dangerous Dave in Copyright Infrigement" which was the port of SMB3 to PC to try and woo Nintendo after Carmack's brilliant invention of adaptive tile refresh.

>>11957119
::comes in thread. Has insane outburst. Leaves, never explains himself, never comes back::

>>11956496

kek, man stayed true to being an insufferable jock chad to the end.

>>11956207 (OP)
It could have really done with ditching the limited saves, a lot of the level design requires trial and error and you end up replaying way too much for it to be fun when dying constantly.

>>11956258
/v/ jr. looking a lot like modern /vp/ now

>>11956207 (OP)
HOW'D IT FEEL TO HAVE JOHN ROMERO MAKE YOU HIS BUTT FUCKED BITCH? HUH?

>>11956207 (OP)
>The fact this game should really have been called "OHTO".

>>11956207 (OP)
The patched version doesn't have all the nastier bugs you would have likely experienced on top of those two getting stuck and forcing tedius level restarts. Being able to make them invincible and even just completely disappear makes the game far more fun.

>>11958107

pgood

>>11957615

An option to disabled the save gem system was added in the first official patch 1.1. It should have been an option from the start if they were deadset on the save gem system but at least they added it.

>>11958275

I mean yeah the unofficial patch is a godsend.

>>11956328
>>>/pol/

>>11956306
it doesnt even have the daikatana sword itself

>>11956207 (OP)
>purchased it
Next time just pirate it you idiot.

>>11958749

>0.97 for a guaranteed non malware riddled GOG copy

pirating in this instance would be absolutely retarded

>>11959115
>Scared of the malware boogeyman in 2012+13
ngmi

Did people really care that much about the "make you his bitch" advertisement?
It sounds like a forced narrative from media people who were sick of Romero's celebrity status.

>>11959645

I think it's more the combination of the perceived ego of such an advertisement combined with the state the game came out in that caused people to take issue.

STOP RIGHT THERE. IT'S ILLEGAL TO TALK ABOUT DAIKATANA AND NOT DUNK ON IT!

>>11959645
I only heard about it because of people having a good time making fun of it. I think maybe that's the only reason it became famous? I doubt that more than a tiny fraction of people were seriously offended. But the spectacle of somebody seeming to try so hard to be cool and macho, only to famously and colorfully fail, was fun to gawk at. So basically, people loved pretending the advertisement was bad, which kinda makes it good? Just normal mob-behavior nonsense.

>>11956462
>you're not supposed to think about it

It's allowed to like things that are famous for being bad, and people find ways to like all kinds of crazy stuff. Some people genuinely enjoy being kicked in the testicles. Don't pretend OP is guaranteed to be acting contrary for the sake of acting contrary. That's just a way to serve (without pay) as a political correctness enforcement officer of the sort that people on 4chan normally pretend to despise. (Here I am referring to the fact that in video game communities, it is politically correct to consider certain games, including Daikatana and E.T., to be irredeemably bad.)

>>11959862
>admonishing a guy for claiming another guy is pretending to hold an opinion
>whilst claiming an entire group of other people are pretending to hold an opinion

alpha screenshots for this game are fascinating

>>11956301
What?

>>11956207 (OP)

I remember the hype, and the delays, and then the disappointment. I think what people don't get is that this game and Duke Nukem Forever they were both insanely hyped, and then massively delayed. The combination of both made the advertising for Daikatana even more comical (John Romero's about to make you his bitch, and about means in about 5 years time, right?) And had very much already predisposed reviewers to not recieve the game well.

Someone posted the Alphas below - one of the big delays was that they changed from the Quake to the Quake 2 engine half way through. I can't help but wonder if they'd stuck to the original plan (as Half Life did) whether they may have had more success.

I played the demo when it came out, and it was distinctly meh, but i don't know really if it was any worse than any of the other meh shooters of that time period. I do need to give it a go with the unofficial patch.

>>11956438
design is law-Romero when he had a career

Haven’t they patched the ai in ways they wouldn’t have been possible at its initial release!
Unironically the gameboy version is the best one.

>>11956207 (OP)
>I realize I have the benefit of playing with the unofficial 1.3 patch
So you aren't actually playing the game but a fan mod?

>>11956484
I do enjoy Zelda 2 and Castlevania 2, I do not enjoy Daikatana but it's far from the worst fps I've ever played.
The issue comes from people taking hyperbole too seriously, when someone says "this is the worst fucking garbage I have ever played" they probably aren't being literal in that unless stated otherwise.
Now to speak on Daikatana specifically, it suffered the same issues a lot of late 90's shooters did, they had absurd levels of hype only rivaled by the likes of Todd Howard and Peter Molyneux. They were never going to be perceived well unless they were quite literally the best game ever made to that point and even then it would still probably be a little disappointing. It's an incredibly mediocre game marketed as the next best thing. People will have emotionally invested into the marketing and when they are presented with a subpar (and buggy) product they are going to be more upset than if you just told them it's middle of the road from the start. Issue there is marketing can't really sell on middle of the road, so conflicts of interest will lean in favor of the most profitable option, regardless of long term consequences. John Romero killed his reputation over night but no one cared because they got a fat paycheck.

Basically, trust no one and just try shit for yourself.

>>11961174

Nothing is changed by default except bug fixes and AI pathing updates. There is a bunch of optional stuff as well but it's the same game.

>>11956207 (OP)

It's one of those gimmick games that has you time travel to different cultures. That's always a great indicator of a lame game.

Romero was a talented designer, but not a strong developer. Carmack, on the other hand, is an exceptional developer but not a great designer. id Software was "perfect" due this "John" tao.
Daikatana is "good", but it is a, let's say... a technical "mess"... and the... "opposite" could be said about Carmack's Doom 3.
Daikatana needed Carmack’s technical expertise, and Doom 3 needed Romero’s design flair.
At least is what I think about it, I might be wrong.
If Daikatana is considered "good," then Quake 2 was "perfection." I’m not sure if I’m getting my point across, but I’ll admit Daikatana isn’t bad. Its main issues were its marketing and that infamous poster.
It’s sad... Romero had immense talent that went to waste...
Is a shame what happened to id Software but is understandable, Carmack was too naïve and too young.

>>11961318
Except you are not playing the game people back then played. The bugs and AI pathing is exactly why people hated it so much.

>>11961726

That's kind of the point of the post. Yes, the bugs and AI made the game total shit at release but that doesn't mean the gameplay itself is bad. Now that they're fixed it's easier to judge the game on its merits rather than just lambast it on its technical problems. This isn't a critical look at how it was at launch but rather how good (or bad) the underlying game is.

>>11961949
>Now that they're fixed it's easier to judge the game on its merits rather than just lambast it on its technical problems.
That kind of apologism is why shitty game design practices will forever be the leading choice when making a game. People like you will defend it as soon as the bugs are fixed.

>>11956207 (OP)
>Am I alone? Has anyone else actually given the game a proper chance now that the technical issues are by and large fixed?
Lost my webms for it but it had one of the most indigestible starts to some of these shooters I've played through: Starting in a swamp, having to shoot noisy small things, a starting weapon with feedback that looked like green goo was shooting at you, evilass turrets...
I got a few hours into it to where the starter weapon was a bit better, but I didn't get further than that. I'm also not a fan of the "world hopping" level theme idea.

>>11962172

I mean the sound design is undeniably bad. Especially in that first episode.

>>11959645
Nah magazines were full of super edgy, blatantly sexualized 90's EXTREME ads at the time. This was hardly shocking, it was mostly just noticeable because unlike the other tryhard ads it could barely be bothered to say what game it was for. Like most harmless nothingburger "controversies," it was mostly just feigned outrage for free publicity, and it did what it was supposed to do: get people talking about the game
>we jut wanted to give an interview where we say we're so sorry about our offensive ad
>for our new game
>Daikatana
>coming soon
>we feel real bad about that ad though
>for Daikatana
>coming soon
The real problem, as >>11959684 said, was that they succeeded in securing everyone's attention and then kept them all on hold just to release a flop. Any ad campaign looks silly when it turns out the product was shite all along. But no one knew that was the case until after the fact. I know, I was there

>>11961516
Why is every "other" word a "quote" it makes it kind of "difficult" to read

>>11962769

It's "too" cerebral for "(you)".

>>11962769
He has been tainted by Sandro.

>>11963581
>esl

>>11962765

I still don't blame Romero for that shitshow. Everyone there at the time says it was Mike Wilson's idea and that Romero really didn't want to run that ad but acquiesced.

too bad ep4 is dogwater overall, this weapon is actually great

>>11964367
Romero overstates his objection to the ad. His initial response was "fuck yes" then later said he wasn't sure. All Mike Wilson said was "don't be a pussy" and he was reconvinced.
These days he pretends he was never for it.

I don't care about the ad one way or the other aside from it being amusing in hindsight due to Ion Storm's hubris, but Romero acting so wormy about it and pretending he was a victim of marketing is worse than the ad ever was.

>>11965216

I mean I don't really care about it either but I still don't blame the man. I don't think has acted particularly wormy when discussing it.

>>11956207 (OP)
I didn't want john Romero to kick my ass so I never gave it a chance.

>>11956581
>first thing that comes to my mind while seeing this is goatse

Please tell me that I'm not the only one.

>>11967312
It wasn't, now it is. Thanks

>>11956207 (OP)
The first level sour people because no one likes shooting mosquitos and frogs. It's just not fun, and their noises are annoying.
It gets better but first impressions matter a lot.

>>11956258
>talk about nothing
Shut up you stupid twat.

>>11956343
The contrarianism comes from insisting a universally panned bad game is actually good. There are bad games I like too, but I recognize that the game does have a lot of problems and there is a reason most find it bad.

Likewise there are universally praised games that I don't like, but I don't consider them bad, I just personally don't like them.

>>11967335
A great appeal to the masses!

>>11967335

>>11967335

No one said the game is perfect and didn't have a ton of problems. The OP simply said he enjoyed it not that it's objectively good or even great. That's contrarianism?

There's a difference between a game having a lot of problems (and Daikatana certainly has a lot) and it being the "the worst game ever made" as some people will proclaim.

>>11967335
>>11967452
Public education moment.

>>11961516
>Its main issues were its marketing and that infamous poster.
The game came out 3 years after that ad. I seriously doubt anyone still cared about a boastful ad after that long. The long development time would be a bigger negative than some ad from years prior.

>>11956283
>when it released it was buggy and mediocre
So it was a decade ahead of its time.

i remember going to a launch party for this in the playing fields (a early lan cafe in london), the multiplayer side was very good anyway. i still havnt completed the 1.3 version though

>>11971068
>underestimating the power of memes

>>11971541

Multiplayer is still alive and well on the 1.3 patch. Small but dedicated community.

Despite its many other flaws this game has impeccable player movement.

>>11957637
Guess the Indians found this board

>>11972370
i had a few sessions on it a some years back, that city level with the rooftops is still a beast.
im going to try and finish the game in the coming weeks, maybe sans ai teammates