Thread 3817456

its a nice piece of world building. but does his model need to be ALL RPGs?
this genre would be better off without him, lets be honest.

Just because a lot of rpgs have elves and dwarves doesn't mean they are anything like LOTR.

>>3817460
they are, just worse.

>>3817461
You have never played an RPG in your life, have you?

>>3817473
you have never read Lord of the Rings, have you?

>>3817530
literally who

>>3817535
Fritz Leiber, author who inspired Gygax and D&D. Try Two Sought Adventure.

>>3817538
who was another Tolkien fanboy. try again

>>3817540
No, he was a Lovecraft fanboy. His stories were published long before the LotR trilogy.
Him and his friend also created a wargame set in the Nehwon setting in 1937, the year The Hobbit was released.
What do you mean "try", I'm educating you. You are simply repeating memes and don't know the history of D&D, Tolkien's influence is one of many authors.

>>3817460
I’d love to clobber anyone who includes elves and dwarves in their story until they stop moving. Why can’t you invent your own races please? It’s called fantasy.

>>3817555
Because many players eye's will glaze over by the time you finish explaining the lore and abilities of your races. Elves and dwarves are a shortcut and people love to use shortcuts, another one is animal headed people.

>>3817456 (OP)
>timeline where tolkien doesnt exist
>everything is still derivative, but based on worse shit
There aren't enough creative people with experience and knowledge to draw from like Tolkien. One in a billion

>>3817456 (OP)
It's not his fault that other people are unoriginal and uncreative. The genre would be better off without the mindless hacks that can't do anything but copy others.

The funny thing is very few RPGs are actually like tolkien outside of window dressing

>>3817555
>It’s called fantasy.
No, it's called Fantasy,.It wasn't abut novelty, Tolkien didn't write "fantasy" + you are retarded.
>>3817557
There's nothing wrong with archetypes but animal headed people aren't archetypes.
>>3817581
>>3817611
>>3817622
These guys get it.
There are "people" in this thread who think Tolkien wrote power fantasy pulp as if he was some incel alcoholic.

>>3817555
Name races with accompanying world building that actually beat elves and dwarves is why.
I agree with the OP to an extent, but the world is full of liberal critics that have never actually produced anything better of note. That is why Tolkien keeps being the standard and the entire fantasy genre is measured by his works.

Orson Scott Card's How to Write Fantasy and Science Fiction should be required reading to post here because he outlines this pretty well: It's extremely difficult for humans to write believably about alien races, alien value systems, etc, which is what elves and dwarves are.

Tolkien also distilled a lot of mythology into them, which has a cultural resonance for many. This is usually painfully evident when you see some furry race with some nonsensical world scramble name by the latest leftist to shit out a game.

>>3817641
>animal headed people aren't archetypes
Animals have archetypal properties. The loyal dog, the fierce hawk, the wise owl, the capricious cat. Animal headed races often evoke these as a shortcut to familiarity.

>>3817641
>There are "people" in this thread who think Tolkien wrote power fantasy pulp as if he was some incel alcoholic.
to be fair, how do you translate "writing 2 pages just describing the scenery to the point that you can see the entire thing in your head" to a videogame? There's a reason every version of this scene, including illustrations before even the Ralph Bakshi animated film, look the same. It's because that's literally how Tolkien described it as looking.

>>3817456 (OP)
He coudn't ruin something that didn't even exist in his lifetime

>>3817456 (OP)
Name five RPGs that actually have the world working on the same principles as Arda. You literally can't.
We really are reaching the levels of ignorance that should not be possible.

>>3817555
>Why can’t you invent your own races please?
Don't do this, anon, it makes nu crawl.

>>3817555
Yeah, more heckin tieflings and dragonborn please!!!

>>3817456 (OP)
>his model need to be ALL RPGs?
you can play Shadowrun and Cyberpunkish RPGs too.
Taiwaneses also made some wuxia RPGs, but they never sold well outside of their country?

>>3817642
>It's extremely difficult for humans to write believably about alien races, alien value systems, etc, which is what elves and dwarves are.
Scifi games did make many funny races. but most of them just behave like certain human civs. what is "believable"? in theory alien races should very different from any human civs and impossible to communicate with, which would make them kind of unfun to play with, and limit plot development options.

>>3817641
>wrote power fantasy pulp
RPG genre would be more fun if Buck Rogers pulp fiction had a bigger influence IMO.

>>3817555
because fantasy is based in european mythos and folklore
european mythos and folklore has elves and dwarves
nobody does tolkien elves because they are white-only and racist as fuck and tolkien dwarves because they are greedy jews in modern fantasy btw

>>3817980
You are a soulless liberal who never read Tolkien. Go kill yourself, hit the fucking bricks, bash your head against the fucking wall, you ugly, unsightly, noxious, horrible monstrosity. You are soulless.

>>3817456 (OP)
It isn't even applied to most rpgs. Not even to most pen & paper (real RPGs)
You're really showing yourself a fool anon

>>3817642
When the ilk such as OP do make the attempt, they come up with the goofiest shit like human-faced wow-murloc, like in pillars of eternity.

>>3817555
Why can't you perpetuate your own race?

>>3817644
To the demented smooth brain who need a blatant visual association. But that shit is just goofy to normal people, who don't need the crutch

>>3817456 (OP)
That's wrong though.
The number one Japanese RPG in the world? It takes place in a modern day-like setting and you catch monsters to do battle.

>>3817456 (OP)
>fought in WW1
Tolkien couldn't conceive of a world where grown adults ("adults") not only played with toys but had no shame about it and publicly bragged about being pathetic as if it were some sort of achievement.

You are not men in any meaningful sense of the word, and you never will be. You die alone as virgins, and you deserve that and much worse.

>>3817456 (OP)

How is his fault that his work is used poorly?

>>3818108
You're a retard putting on airs, bro. Shit goes back to ancient Egypt.

Cultivation setting is cool and I wish there would be a good RPG with it already.

>>3817528
You're gonna have a lot of fun when you discover Tolkien wasn't the first.

>>3817540
Fucking child. Get the fuck out and read a book. Try a book on the history of development of adventure novels, if you're actually interested in the topic. But for now, your breathtaking ignorance is sickening and offensive to the senses.

>>3818143
>fpb
He could conceive of it very easily, you mongrel.

>>3818143
And I'm sure you're the pinnacle of masculinity, you who feels the need to visit a mongolian basketweaving board just to shit on people.
Get real. Better yet, get yourself killed.

>>3817456 (OP)
This genre wouldnt exist without him

>>3817456 (OP)
If more stuff was more heavily based on Tolkien's writing we'd have better stuff. I hate this "It's the fantasy Nazis dressed up like the catholic church" hack bullshit.

>>3817456 (OP)
my problem with fantasy settings is how magic is always fucking boring
it was supposed to be this whimsical, unexplained power that defies your expectations of what is possible, but it turned it le fireball le lightning bolt le healing every single fucking time, it's all so predictable
magic is no longer magical

What are good resources for victorian/steampunk settings?
With magic preferably.

>>3817456 (OP)
It's not Tolkien that ruined RPGs, it's every hack writer after him trying to be the next Tolkien but only managing to create derivative slop, as well as the publishers encouraging this and making "Tolkienesque" the default for all fantasy.

>>3818359
>it was supposed to be
Source? Whomst supposed magic to be a "whimsical, unexplainable power" and more importantly how do you implement something "whimsical and unexplainable" in gameplay? I see people spout "magic must be inexplicable!" all of the time, mostly on /tg/, but I have no clue where they got the idea or what they actually want other than being vaguely contrarian against the status quo

Why do brown people think European mythology was invented by some christcuck in the 20th century?

>>3818083
seems like you got triggered and started projecting hard

>>3818359
It's a game bro, it has to have rules.

>>3818354
>Robert Kirkman
Such short and dry early life section.

>>3818376
Probably some percentage from certain folklore, some from writers building upon the same bits of folklore. I don't agree with his view but at the same time the extremely utilitarian approach we have ended up with, at least in the more popular modern applications, doesn't make me happy either.

>>3818377
Elves, goblins and dwarves in traditional European folklore are nothing like the ones in modern fantasy, they were nebulous spirit like creatures and often interchangeable. Their modern versions were invented entirely by Tolkien.
That said I think most modern fantasy is more inspired by Conan the barbarian in regards to themes and story, with just the aesthetics of Tolkien thrown on top.

>>3818143
>I'm a manlier man than you'll ever be
>on a 4chan thread in the RPG games board
I REALLY don't think you are

Daily atheist browns seething at Tolkien thread.

>>3817456 (OP)
I have yet to seen an rpg that is actually "tolkienesque"

>>3817460
Fpbp

>>3817456 (OP)
>>3817461
>>3817555
>bro dont you see Elves and Dwarves are booooring which is why in my setting I have tree loving plantpeople that live in tune with nature and shoot bows and badgerpeople that love drinking, have a scootish accent and live underground
>look how creative I am

The weird nu-fantasy movement has been a disaster for fantasy.

Whenever someone seethes about Tolkien its safe to disragrd that person completly.

>>3818143
You're the tryhard wannabe cool edgelord and probably the largest virgin and insufferable faggot on this entire website.
Tolkien fought in WW I and saw actual horrors of it, that's what he valued peace. People having time and energy for their small hobbies instead of dying from shrapnel wounds and dysentery is exactly the world that Tolkien wanted to see. Appreciate that, dipshit.