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Thread 3828858

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Anonymous No.3828858 >>3828904 >>3829339 >>3829918 >>3830075 >>3830226 >>3831485 >>3834518 >>3834621 >>3836528 >>3836775 >>3836865 >>3836923 >>3840116
Pokémon sucks
I tried to play Pokémon after playing some games in the "Creature Collector" genre and i found that Pokémon is so shit and mid compared to games like Cassette Beasts, Slime Rancher, Whim side, hell even Undertale is more enjoyable and has a similar vibe... and probably some other that i forgot right now...

Why cant a big company like Nintendo make actually good games like indie studios?

And let's not talk about the abomination that's named PalLand like what the fuck is that even...
Anonymous No.3828904 >>3840440
>>3828858 (OP)
The east can't create fun, nor soul.
Anonymous No.3828913
If Pokemon was made in-house by Nintendo themselves, they would be much better games. Unfortunately, it's all developed by Shitfreak/Gameshit/Shitshit hence why it's so bad
Anonymous No.3828921 >>3828934 >>3830075
Is this supposed to upset people here? This is an RPG board, nobody here cares about Pokeymans.
Anonymous No.3828934 >>3829014
>>3828921
Not rage-bait, just pointing out that a lot of players have noticed the same thing when you replay Pokémon, even the newer games, it often feels repetitive and kind of… shit compared to other 'Creature Collector' games

I came here because it’s technically an RPG, so thought it was relevant to have a conversation lmao

Also, maybe someone knows other good creature-collector RPGs? I’ve been struggling to find any that are actually fun :(
Anonymous No.3829013 >>3829131
The series, the franchise almost EVERYTHING about Pokemon is shitty and there is honestly no nostalgia anymore. I remember being ripped off more so than I had fun with this series.

>played red/blue, but wanted more of an adventure like in both manga
>played snap and it was shit
>played stadium it was ok, more so a post game for r/b with no exploration
nice battles though
>refused to play yellow because it was basically a mod
>finally play gold and I was amazed at the mechanics
>not getting crystal because I am not buying the same twice with dlc
>refuse to get Stadium 2 because it's going to be the same shit as stadium
> between the two year gap between G/S/C and R/S discover rpgamer.com and find out about other rpgs like Bof,FF,Arc the Lad, Dragon Quest, etc.
>they are having adventures like in the anime and manga
>Better monster game in Arc the lad, but no one played it here because it got to the USA too late
It also had a far superior battle tower, 4 years before it appeared in crystal
>I wish pokemon was like this
>I see R/S on display in toys'r'us and it looks like shit in comparison in comparison to other rpgs on the gba
>say fuck it and buy ffta instead
>a bunch of bullshit shill games like puzzle league, channel, trozei and dash released
when other series have good side games and it isn't a minefield

>reused 64 models and shitty graphics in both gamecube titles
>A few years later I try mystery dungeon and it's alright
Sad thing is that another developer made a game with a better ost, sprites and story than
the gamefreak.

> want to give the series a chance again with D/P
>get battel revolution included as a gift as well
>Static sprites after mystery dungeon
>bullshit natures?
>reused N64 models on the wii
> invisible iv/ev grinding just to get a decent online battle?

>say fuck it and turn my back on the series entirely


Honestly why do you all stick around?
Why keep getting disappointed?
Anonymous No.3829014
>>3828934
Arc the Lad has it as a side hustle
As you can see, your party members are fighting with monsters the tamer coerced into fighting for you.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tw4rSpaiMyw&t=78s


>DQ monsters
>Medarot as a whole
>Yokai Watch was alright
Anonymous No.3829131 >>3829223
>>3829013
This is a copypasta
Anonymous No.3829223
>>3829131
Well what do you want me to do? Write an entirely new essay every single time? Bottom line is Pokemon games are pretty shit, and you should expand your horizons.
Anonymous No.3829339
>>3828858 (OP)
Cassette Beasts is an amateurish attempt to add platforming to Pokemon. The story is a garbled mess and it's not even the good type of mess. The only good thing is its interactive type system, which is not even that unique, considering Pokemon has tried to make the types more nuanced in recent gens. But I respect its attempt. Lastly, the social sim aspect is quite shoehorned and feels like a chore.

Undertale is not even remotely a monster rancher, wtf is this comparison

Don't know and don't care about Slime Rancher

Then there is Monster Sanctuary - the devs clearly focused on the battling aspect only without caring everything else and it shows. Sadly they really fell into the design trap of buff-heavy metagame and failed to recognize that Pokemon in its simplicity has many other mechanics that makes the metagame very diverse.

Personally I'll still say Beastieball is the only one that captured the same feeling as playing Pokemon for the first time. Decent amount of originality, Pokemon-ish combat with positioning. Music is among the best I've heard in an indie JRPG. Unique UI and aesthetic choice that is nice to look at.
Plus it has a genuine story with an OK writing.
Probably the only thing that puts it down is the LGBTQ-undertones on the character creator and the way some of the characters are written.
Anonymous No.3829918
>>3828858 (OP)
I take no one complaining about Pokemon seriously unless they acknowledge off the rip these other series have inferior designs.
Anonymous No.3829920
Yes, you are right.
Anonymous No.3830075 >>3832173
>>3828858 (OP)
there are three big things to consider when it comes to nintendo:
>they make their games for the most braindead of children
>they have a massive userbase of cultists that will buy anything they put out no matter what
>within their primary markets, they have no "real" competition (also why that case against palworld is STILL going on, it got just popular enough for just long enough to make those old japs shit themselves)
all together this has made them EXTREMELY complacent all around, they wont make good games because there is literally no reason for them to do so.
pokemon then has the additional malus of being tied to modern gamefreak
>>3828921
eh i'd argue that pokemon makes stats matter just enough for it to count as an RPG.
besides you cant bring this up on /v/, that board has way too many cultists.
Anonymous No.3830079 >>3830222 >>3830259
Since you can emu all the way to the switch, I thought I would start catching up with pokeyman games. Currently hard stuck at XY due to boredom after slogging through gen 4 and 5.
Anonymous No.3830222
>>3830079
personally XY & SWSH are the worst games in the series
Anonymous No.3830226 >>3830270
>>3828858 (OP)
The only good Pokemon game is a fan game called Pokemon Unbound. It's challenging and has enough depth to be worth playing.

Reborn and rejuvenation are also "good" as a challenge but the storylines are beyond cringe.
Anonymous No.3830259
>>3830079
xy is dogshit. gen 4 and 5 are some of my favs, so if you didn't like those, i doubt you'd like gen 7 or the switch games. i'd say try romhacks or fan games.
Anonymous No.3830270
>>3830226
Nah I still like the concepts and ideas in Reborn, but yeah sadly tranny devs make tranny stories, many such cases. So yeah the reason Unbound is almost flawless was because of the basedness of the devs, with my only critique is Hoopa is a boring legendary to base the hack upon, but that's just my opinion.
Anonymous No.3831485
>>3828858 (OP)
Oh thank god. I thought I was the only person in the world who hated Pokemon.
Anonymous No.3831738
The only redeeming thing about pokemon is the romhack/fangame community. Very strong and very good.
Unbound is good as mentioned above. I'm also partial to Insurgence, Infinity, Elysium, Orange Islands, Clover, and Pisces. Drayano's hacks are perfect as a vanilla+ experience.
Anonymous No.3832173 >>3832188
>>3830075
>>within their primary markets, they have no "real" competition (also why that case against palworld is STILL going on, it got just popular enough for just long enough to make those old japs shit themselves)
Wrong. Palworld ripped shit off directly from Pokemon. Nintendo couldn't sue for the designs (impossible to prove they ACTUALLY ripped them off, even though it's obvious), so they went for other angles.

Nintendo has never, ever, ever had ANY issue whatsoever with any other creature-collecting RPG prior to Palworld. Countless Digimon games have been released on Nintendo platforms since the early 2000s. Dragon Quest Monsters has always been locked to Nintendo platforms. Yokai Watch was HUGE in Japan, and was not just tolerated by Nintendo, but was actively promoted in Nintendo Directs in the mid-2010s with Youtube advertisements starring Reggie himself. In more recent years, you've had stuff like Nexomon and Temtem releasing on Switch with no issues, or Cassette Beasts which even had a trailer published on Nintendo's YT channel.

Palworld is the literal only creature-collector which has ever drawn Nintendo's ire. It's pretty obvious why that's the case.
Anonymous No.3832188 >>3832189
>>3832173
why is a tendie on /vrpg/?
nintendo doesnt even make proper RPGs.
Anonymous No.3832189 >>3832196
>>3832188
>No argument
Anonymous No.3832196 >>3832200
>>3832189
there is no point in arguing against you because tendies blatantly lie all the time. like you pretending that palworld stole anything from nintendo.
none of the designs were copied, unless you want to argue that nintendo stole from dragon quest.
Anonymous No.3832200 >>3832204 >>3832205
>>3832196
So what's your explanation for why Nintendo never sued Digimon, Dragon Quest Monsters, Yokai Watch, Temtem, Nexomon, Cassette Beasts, or literally any other monster-collecting game?

Why was it only Palworld?

And if you say
>it's because palworld is popular and the others weren't!!!
That's wrong. Yokai Watch was huge in Japan (Nintendo's own home country), and during an era (Wii U/3DS) where Nintendo was struggling the most, and not only did Nintendo never sue them, they actively promoted the games. This was despite many Pokemon fans raging at Yokai Watch being a "rip-off", and there being a fear that the series might actually overtake Pokemon at the time.

It's clear there was something specific about Palworld that pissed Nintendo/The Pokemon Company off.
Anonymous No.3832204 >>3832206
>>3832200
>Yokai Watch was huge in Japan
in japan.
and afaik yokai watch never threatened nintendo's dominance over the physical toy market.
not only did palworld get big for a little bit but they made some merchandise deals with sony, and the case only popped up AFTER that deal.
Anonymous No.3832205 >>3832208
>>3832200
i'd also like to point out how nintendo promoted yokai watch while they were struggling, as you said.
now they're not struggling because they have endless armies of children and manchildren ready to give them 10 million guaranteed sales on every mainline game, so they're more than big enough to bully any potential competition out now.
Anonymous No.3832206 >>3832209
>>3832204
>in japan.
Yes, Japan, the only market Nintendo really cares about.

>and afaik yokai watch never threatened nintendo's dominance over the physical toy market.
They had toys and merch.

>not only did palworld get big for a little bit but they made some merchandise deals with sony, and the case only popped up AFTER that deal.
That was over a year ago and nothing ever came of it. Palworld already fell out of relevance. Nintendo never cared about how "big" it allegedly got, they just didn't like how it fucked with their IP.
Anonymous No.3832208 >>3832209
>>3832205
>now they're not struggling because they have endless armies of children and manchildren ready to give them 10 million guaranteed sales on every mainline game, so they're more than big enough to bully any potential competition out now.
This just doesn't really hold up.

All of the shit people complain about modern Nintendo (the taking-down of emulators and ROMs, the cease-and-desists to fangame creators) were very much a thing during the Wii U/3DS era too. Nintendo's action against fangames like AM2R and Pokemon Prism happened during the lowest point of the Wii U era. There was also the crazy action they took against anybody creating Youtube videos or streaming their games back then, which funnily enough stopped circa 2018 AFTER the Switch became a smash success.

They were just as litigious and protective of their IP back then, if not more so. There just was never a rip-off as blatant as Palworld back then, so there was no reason for them to care.
Anonymous No.3832209 >>3832210 >>3836705
>>3832206
>they just didn't like how it fucked with their IP.
nintendo's scared specifically because it hit FOTM status for a while and actually could've been competition had its momentum not died, it proved to their rich suits that pokemon ISNT an unshakeable giant. especially when compared to the absolute slop thats called "modern pokemon".
so now nintendo's trying to make an example of them, to both deter other potential competitors and stamp out palworld incase it has a resurgence.
>>3832208
>There just was never a rip-off as blatant as Palworld back then
(still no proof of this)
Anonymous No.3832210 >>3832212
>>3832209
>nintendo's scared specifically because it hit FOTM status for a while and actually could've been competition had its momentum not died
It was never competition, though. It appealed to an entirely different demographic.

Palworld is a co-op survival crafting game which happens to also feature monster-collecting mechanics.

>so now nintendo's trying to make an example of them, to both deter other potential competitors
Nobody is deterred, though. The newest Digimon game (Time Stranger) has a leaked (currently un-announced) Switch 2 version. And that's a much more direct competitor, being a traditional turn-based RPG as well as a monster-collector.

>(still no proof of this)
Yeah, there is. No monster-collector before Palworld ever so shamelessly stole-and-barely-altered designs directly from Pokemon. You never saw Digimon or Yokai Watch doing this, not even once.
Anonymous No.3832212 >>3832272
>>3832210
>Palworld is a co-op survival crafting game
>implying the suits understand that there are different markets for different genres
that aside,
>No monster-collector before Palworld ever so shamelessly stole-and-barely-altered designs directly from Pokemon
still no proof of this.
and if this is the argument you're going with then it can also be made against nintendo with how they blatantly copied dragon quest's designs.
Anonymous No.3832271 >>3832279
Pokemon has one of the worst gameplay mechanics of any trainer games:
-Games are either pissy easy vanilla or annoyingly grindy for rom hacks since rom hacks author justs tuff their hacks with competitive fully maxed out pokemon
-Combat is a hard counter rock paper scissor type yet the speed stats has no range and thus is the only thing that matters. Thus invalidating the entire system if you have decent attack stats. There is a reason competitive pokemon battles barely lasts two rounds mostly.
-Grinding is notoriously annoying and made even worse with the stupid ev shit, forcing you to grind against specific enemies to maximize some invisible values.
-HM's were a horrible idea that got worse in every game. Instead of having types dictate hm's you need to remove an actual useful move for a non useful move. Usually forcing you to bring a pokemon or two that were just hm slaves. This completely kills team diversity in a trainer rpg.
-Routes/caves only are decent in the first game. Past that the location get less complicated. And considering the average pokemon dungeon/route is already simpler than an average jrpg, this is ridiculous.
-Bullshit having to buy multiple versions and having timed pokemon events.Practically exclusive to Pokemon.
There Is a lot more to hate about the games, but the series is really a joke compared to dragon quest monsters.
Anonymous No.3832272 >>3832274
>>3832212
Anonymous No.3832274 >>3832276 >>3832282
>>3832272
>nintendo invented the concepts of sheep, rabbits, soccer players, wolves, deer, living jets, cats, japanese kitsune, plant girls, large cats, and dinosaurs
cool, cool.
so now that we're on the same page you admit nintendo is in the wrong HERE, right?
Anonymous No.3832276 >>3832278
>>3832274
>>nintendo invented the concepts of sheep, rabbits, soccer players, wolves, deer, living jets, cats, japanese kitsune, plant girls, large cats, and dinosaurs
Yes, how patents work. Not my fault square was too retarded to not do this.
Anonymous No.3832278
>>3832276
and now you see the problem with the legal system.
Anonymous No.3832279
>>3832271
OK since you clearly dislike Pokemon, I will list the thing I consider inferior in DQMonsters.
-Palette swap designs.
-There is no consistent elemental structure, the abilities aren't as impactful as Pokemon has
-Natures give Pokemon a bit of build variety, which DQM doesn't have
-Some designs are overly cartoonish, sometimes they just slap an object with eyes and call it a monster. Pokemon while not completely guilty (Geodude family, Grimer family) at least adds variations to the designs. Stuff like Voltorb is basically a mimic that is thematically based on the chests in Pokemon (which is shaped like Pokeball)
-Fusions, just like Persona & SMT had, basically discourages you from actually raising a monster. You are encouraged to switch immediately to a stronger one when they are available.
-Pokemon combat is more strategic. To give the easiest proof, there is a reason Pokemon have a pvp scene.
-HMs are a form of gameplay and lore integration, it is annoying for sure, but the fact that it gives birth to the concept of "HM Slave" in the first place is what makes it unique. It is also a decent way to gate progression instead of an NPC randomly blocking the way
-Grinding in older games are annoying, but that's the reason why; it's supposed to, because it's optional. With the right moveset and pokemon team they are unneeded
-Scouting is cool but I personally think Pokeballs are more interesting way to capture new monsters. It doesn't make sense to have huge monsters follow behind you, which is why I am not a fan of following Pokemon as well
-Diving. It's a gen3 only feature (5 doesn't count) but this is cool. DQM doesn't have this, it's too focused on land
-Gym leaders & elite four
-Unique strats like FEAR

I do agree that having to buy multiple versions of the same game is greedy, with the exception of Black & White 2, the rest of series isn't worth owning both
Anonymous No.3832282 >>3832286
>>3832274
But Sugimori adds his own style to it. What about Palworld?
Also no way you see the blue serpent in DQM and compare it immediately to Gyarados.
Anonymous No.3832286 >>3832289
>>3832282
they are both themed off of chinese dragons.
if nintendo can say that palworld LITERALLY STOLE MIYAMOTO'S MONEY because they dared to have a sheep pal, then i can say that nintendo stole from dragon quest by having a chinese dragon themed pokemon.
Anonymous No.3832289 >>3832290
>>3832286
Nobody sees Gyarados and immediately think it's based on Chinese dragon
Btw look at the Palworld one, you can immediately see what it's based on in this picture.
Anonymous No.3832290 >>3832853
>>3832289
they're definitely both large plant animals...
nope, thats DEFINITELY never been done before.
Anonymous No.3832853 >>3833826
>>3832290
they have the exact same face, stop being a white girl.
Anonymous No.3833826 >>3833899
>>3832853
>nintendo invented facial shapes
BRAVO NINTENDO!!!!!!!!
Anonymous No.3833899 >>3833901
>>3833826
Yeah Sugimori clearly invented those style. Look at Digimon's plant based mons, they arent similar. There isnt a plant dinosaur in digimon.
Anonymous No.3833901 >>3836713
>>3833899
yes anon you're right nintendo was CLEARLY the first person to ever think about giving a face a shape!
we must now all pay legal fees to nintendo because our faces have had shapes without their permission.
Anonymous No.3833952 >>3833961
Hypothetical pokemans gayme. Thoughts, saars?
>Battles between trainers can be up to 4 v 4, with 4 mons in reserve. (8 mons on each side in total.)
>This allows attackers, supporters, and util mons to actively contribute in battle
>On paper, I think evs and ivs to be a good idea, but found them to be autistic in execution. So, they have to go
>Pokemon you catch can be used to make other pokemon stronger through some in game training method
>This will help boost stats of the ones used
>Levels will matter and certain mons will always be stronger, but this training system would make "every mon viable" or at the very least, make an F-tier mon into a C-tier
>In theory, I think this would allow you to use your favorites, without being too penalized for them being weaker
>Less single typed leaders/bosses and more themed ones. Eg: gym leader that's an actress uses electric, fairy, and dark types, or just "pokeys that would leave the audiences in shock and awe"
Anonymous No.3833961
>>3833952
>evs and ivs
Evs should stay, but their needs to be a better way to apply them, rather than just grinding. Maybe through your mon training idea. Ivs either go, or are overhauled so you cant just max them out in every stat
>4v4 with teams of 8 each
>i'd say 3v3 with teams of 8?
>more interesting leader themes
Yeah, sounds cool
Anonymous No.3834420
Compare pokemon at the time it came out to the other available games and you'll understand why it stands on its own outside of its popularity

But yes after gens 1/2 they got more or less complacent and didn't do much to iterate, obviously that would make the newer games seem like nothing special 30 years of other games coming out later
Anonymous No.3834518
>>3828858 (OP)
ok.
Anonymous No.3834621
>>3828858 (OP)
>Pokémon sucks
it objectively doesnt theres a reason it was so popular. If you are too stupid to know why it was so popular why should I even read past your headline? It would be like listening to a down syndrome person try to tell me about their day.
Anonymous No.3836507
pokemon is at its best when it does lower stakes stuff with focus on ecology and local mischief
Anonymous No.3836528
>>3828858 (OP)
Play Pokemon Mystery Dungeon: Explorers of Sky and improve as a person
Anonymous No.3836705
>>3832209
>(still no proof of this)
im trans btw in case anyone cares
Anonymous No.3836713
>>3833901
>yes anon you're right nintendo was CLEARLY the first person to ever think about giving a face a shape!
you're blind. nothing anyone says matters, all you care about is arguing. if you want to say you don't care about copyright laws, then leave it at that. stop acting like a kike.
Anonymous No.3836775
>>3828858 (OP)
Pokemon is fine for what it is but if it didn't click with you as a kid it isn't one of those franchises that hooks you as an adult. Personally it never did much for me either. It is too dependent on busywork and mindless wandering. Those indie games are an attempt at making something a little more engaging from a gameplay or story standpoint.
>Undertale
That isn't even the same genre. That is more of an Earthbound kind of thing.
Anonymous No.3836865 >>3836869
>>3828858 (OP)
Because the series is for actual 5-year-olds.
Also, I think all the games you listed are inferior to Yo-kai Watch 3 and Dragon Quest Monsters Joker 2.
Anonymous No.3836869 >>3836872
>>3836865
Yokai watch sucks and its fanbase desperately trying to hype a childish autobattler as having anything better than Pokemon is pathetic
Anonymous No.3836872 >>3836873
>>3836869
I don't want to make this an argument since I can tell it will go nowhere. But I just want to say when I praise that game, I'm usually not bringing up the gameplay. Unless we're talking about Blasters T. I just think ironically, the monster game about ghosts is the one that feels the most alive. Also, the music is bitchin'.
Anonymous No.3836873 >>3836881
>>3836872
love the art style

so yokai watch is like pokemon with ghosts?
Anonymous No.3836881
>>3836873
Yes and no. It honestly seems like it takes more inspiration from the GBC DQMs. And while it is about ghosts and spirits, it rarely gets that Halloween vibe. It's more of a summer-core game. There are areas and yo-kai that are spooky, but a solid majority of the game is lighthearted and goofy.
Anonymous No.3836923 >>3840137
>>3828858 (OP)
I've hated every new Pokemon entry since gen 4 and yet, no other game compares. I blame the genre for being completely dogshit.
Anonymous No.3840116
>>3828858 (OP)
It's a series of games for children that was the first major game to do what it did. Any Pokemon game is guaranteed to print money. There is no need incentive to make these games "good" since there's already a built-in audience who are not primarily interested in more complex game mechanics. Wondering why these games aren't better than they are is like watching Sesame Street and then complaining that the plot is simple and the production values are cheap.
Anonymous No.3840137
>>3836923
>I blame the genre for being completely dogshit.
Digimon World,
Jade Cocoon,
You're welcome.
Anonymous No.3840440
>>3828904
brown hands typed this