Thread 3835803

Is this the best way to do a modern JRPG overworld? Modern JRPG style connected zones but when you use a boat or fly you go to a traditional overworld to go to different ports and places you can't get to via the connected areas.
That way the world doesn't feel small and boxed in like modern Tales games do

>>3835803 (OP)
It's not rocket science. I hate how overworlds died because JRPG devs assumed they no longer needed that level of abstraction.

>>3835839
Overworlds like this are boring and cheap. We aren't in the snes era anymore.

>>3835803 (OP)
I think dq11 was good but i didnt like how "pangea-ey" the world was due to having to be connected. there was basically only one giant landmass with some breaks in it

>>3835803 (OP)
The point of an overworld is to allow the player to travel across an entire world/planet, DQ doesn't do that. It is just a collection of zone entrances. It makes the world feel smaller.

That said, DQ11 is also pretty bad when it comes to open world design. Especially when it comes to enemies and just having these big empty areas with maybe a few chests/glittering pickups here and there. The Xenoblade series is another one that does the JRPG open world poorly.

The foundation of overworlds is the vehicle progression you get to traverse them. This goes back to Ultima.

Dragging Quest

>>3835875
Yeah it's a bit clunky, not my favorite map design in the series
Moving between the perimeter ocean and inland sea is just a tiny extra aggravation

>>3835849
>Overworlds like this are boring and cheap.

>>3835839
It wouldn't even be that bad if we'd get something else for it. But then devs realise that creating lifesize environments is fucking expensive, so they deliver a bunch of corridors with no exploration or copy-paste to hell and back.

>>3835880
I would argue those two are relatively good examples. There are way more egregious examples that make the world seem tiny as fuck.

>>3835849
yet all of the most beloved and fondly remembered jrpgs are from that era. curious!

>>3835849
Yes, because Tales of Berseria, Ys VIII and Trails aren't boring, cheap and don't look like trash in comparison. Lmao.

>>3835803 (OP)
>beautiful overworld with no encounters
sign me the fuck up

>>3835803 (OP)
The abstraction is best used to cut filler areas & speed up travel unless you use a Saga Frontier style region ships/map thing, which is viable if boring.

With modern tech you can implement a world map that has none of the limitations of 90s games. Close to a hundred areas to explore, monster sprites on the map, player interactions, nested vehicles, infinitely scrolling or lethal barriers to limit you to a small region.

No dumb filler bs.

Similar to game writing letting you skip all the areas in a town you can't access, but showing them in the distance & adding milling NPCs who ignore you.

>>3835803 (OP)
Chrono trigger is the only game where having an overwold was a benefit

Notice the lack of random encounters, and the changes the world goes through, and how condensed it is. Fast travel wouldn't make the game much faster, which is a good sign.

>>3837595
>I would argue those two are relatively good examples

I'm talking making the open world being nothing but a zone you run around in mainly on the ground in big flat areas with monster waddling around.
Even ubisoft games have 1000x better open world design than this. Because the point of an open world isn't to just walk around a big empty area. It's about taking in a view to see landmarks you can go to and maybe find some small puzzle or activity, explore and shit.

Aimlessly running around a flat open space to maybe find a chest just sitting there or some sparkly pickup is bad open world design.

>>3838189
Overworlds never really had that either. But at least they let you explore a little bit and find other areas, which is kind of "open world". Both Xenoblade and DQXI also still give you the option to go out of your way a little bit, even if they're technically just really wide corridors. But that's still a lot better than what Tales has since Xillia or Graces, Trails games overall and so on.

But I would argue JRPGs never jumped on the open world train to begin with. They're doing the same thing they've done for decades, maybe even worse ironically enough.

>>3835839
>I hate how overworlds died because JRPG devs assumed they no longer needed that level of abstraction.
Which is an absolutely idiotic mindset.

>>3838155
This isn't really an "overworld", just a glorified map/selection screen.

And this isn't even to say that map/selections screens can't be good. I love overworlds, but Grandia is one of my favorite games of all time despite having no overworld, because it uses that to deliberately pace your adventure—the notion that you can't just spend a few minutes backtracking to revisit someone, or hop in an airship and fly home is essential to the plot and themes of the game. Adventures mean having to say "goodbye", and overworlds don't really facilitate that.

>>3835839
>JRPG devs assumed they no longer needed that level of abstraction.
If more games deliberately used the lack of an overworld to craft a better story, it wouldn't be so bad. But I think a lot of devs just jumped on the idea of "oh neat we don't have to waste time on an overworld anymore" without actually thinking about how that changed or limited the scope of their adventure the way the Grandia devs did, as I detailed above.

>>3838189
Xenoblade's maps is asking WAY too much of Namco. Personally I think the maps since Xillia are full trash, so they might as well go back to scaled maps.
The first Ni no Kuni had a gorgeous overworld.

I have always been impressed with LOH foregoing the overworld all the way back in the early 90s. Every single route in between a village and somewhere else is a fully detailed map, kind of like Pokemon but with a way grander scale.

I've noticed that people who dislike overworlds seem to be less intelligent. Really weird thing.

>>3838189
>defending Ubisoft

and why the fuck should we care about your shitposts?

>>3840180
Makes sense, people with less abstraction skills are more stupid, and overworlds require abstraction.

>>3835803 (OP)
DQIX did it better.

>>3838348
>This isn't really an "overworld", just a glorified map/selection screen.
That's literally all an overworld is.

>>3840171
Example images?