Thread 105884629

Spoken Japanese, in contrast to written Japanese, is actually very easy to learn.
Japanese is also an almost perfectly phonetic language, meaning words sound like how they're spelled.

If you won't learn a new language for your oshi, you deserve to be cucked.

burgers are too dumb to learn a second language, they have trouble with even 1

Why don't you post this in the FuwaMoco thread retard

And if you start learning now, you will be able to follow along once EN5 has their JP arc

Fauna, Mumei, Gura, Ame.. what did they all have in common. hmmm

>>105884681
aint readin allat sybau

Fubuki should spend several hours spanking Fuwamoco.

People who think they know spoken Japanese are mostly delusional and understand much less than they think.

>>105884629 (OP)
Not to mention, they had Perro doing live translation in the chat.

>>105884936
Pero is just Mococo pretending

>>105884961
Meds

>>105884629 (OP)
>Spoken Japanese, in contrast to written Japanese, is actually very easy to learn.
No it isn't. Stop lying. Just the sheer amount of new vocabulary make it much harder than Spanish, French or even German.

>Vtuber is streaming in JP during JP hours of 8AM to 10AM north american time? I won't be able to understand her live! NOOOOOOOOOOO
This problem only affects unemployed neets.
Maybe instead of studying japanese you should get a job?

>>105884681
fpbp

>>105885115
Yeah I speak 3-4 languages. Learning JP is still intimidating, it's supposed to be very difficult.

>>105884629 (OP)
>spoken japanese is easy compared to reading
>you just need to learn how to read

>>105885125
>xhe pretends only 9-5 jobs exist
tell me you're a sheltered kid without telling me you're a sheltered kid

Only newfags would cry about japanese streams.
We only had JP vtubers at the start and most people were happy to watch them even if they didn't understand very much.
Personally, I learned more japanese in these 6 years of watching vtubers than in the 20 of watching anime. I'm not fluent by any means, but I can get by with context hints.

>>105885115
Idk, not having to deal with grammatical gender is kind of a nice change of pace

>>105885434
>we had shit to eat at the start and were finally given steak
>stop complaining when you're given shit again and just learn to eat it

>>105885638
>EN
>steak
dyrbi

>>105885115
nta, but you can understand majority of the stream if you can handle jlpt N3 japanese listening test and somewhat aware of japanese culture overall. And getting to this level is rather trivial, cause its pre-school tier japanese.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lasKN-LsJwQ

>>105884681
Why aren't YOU watching them then, linguistic savant?

The ironic thing is the kind of people who put up with learning japanese would probably end up watching holoJP for natural listening practice material

>>105886725
What's ironic about that?

>>105886739
That this post is marketed to EOPs who want to watch FWMC but even after learning jp, they may no longer feel the desire to watch what they set out to learn the language for in the first place

>English speakers learning japanese
>Japanese learning english
Topsy turvy world.

>>105885332
Hi Cece

>>105885638
The steak is the high-effort quality content that JPs manage to churn out fairly regularly, like game shows and variety off-collabs.

The shit is trash EN gaming streams with predictable everything.

>>105885609
Finnish?

>>105885115
Either vtubers are all uneducated and only use the same simple words or Japanese really only has like let's say 500 common words cause I swear there's very little nuance to everything holoJPs say. They always use the same words.
Everything is sugoi or oishii/umai when in another language you might have used 10 different ways of saying that.

>>105884629 (OP)
You're a bitch

>>105889630
This is how they make their streams accessible for wider audience including international one. Pekora is a kindergarten teacher and she is THE streaming frontliner of hololive. Think about it for a minute. They are quite literally babysitting us.

Especially vtubers, they're not particularly intelligent. Only one I have trouble understanding is Raden.

>>105884629 (OP)
>Japanese is also an almost perfectly phonetic language, meaning words sound like how they're spelled.
That's pretty meaningless when most words are spelled with kanji which can have a dozen different pronunciations.

>>105892105
Reading is a different skill to train from listening, you usually dont have to deal with kanji when watching streams for better or worse

>>105892105
I don't know why furigana isn't more common. Can't use the no space argument anymore for games.

>>105892274
You will have to pry kanji from my cold dead hands. It makes reading easier

>>105892274
Because kanji is easier to read than kana.

>>105892316
>>105892328
furigana are above kanjis to show how to read it. best of both worlds.

>>105884629 (OP)
> Spoken Japanese, in contrast to written Japanese, is actually very easy to learn.
lol no. I have the opposite problem. Written is easy. Listening is MUCH harder. You don’t get subs and a lot of things can be misheard and it requires much more focus listening than reading. Reading is easier to backtrack, but listening is not as easy and even if I did back track, I still have no confident that what I heard was correct even after replaying like five times. Also a lot of vtubers have really different talking tempos and some talk slowly and smoothly enough like Okayu but then there’s someone like Raden who talks not only fast but use a lot of technical terms that you will never hear in regular conversation

>>105884629 (OP)
>Japanese is also an almost perfectly phonetic language, meaning words sound like how they're spelled
Bullshit. It's full of "homophones" that are purely distinguished from one another by pitch accent, and very few learning resources will provide details on the pitch accent.

>>105892364
Yeah but only children need it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LqT3YmVbUfI&pp=ygUkY2VjaWxpYSBpbW1lcmdyZWVuIGxlYXJuaW5nIGphcGFuZXNl
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W96LKM42YPY&pp=ygUkY2VjaWxpYSBpbW1lcmdyZWVuIGxlYXJuaW5nIGphcGFuZXNl

>>105892447
>purely distinguished from one another by pitch accent
I think this is a murrican issue. Never seen anyone else complaining about not being able to hear that.
So far I've only had issues with kansaiben and other regional stuff because they deviate from standard Japanese in both pitch accent and the syllables used for some words.

>>105892431
>use a lot of technical terms that you will never hear in regular conversation
This is where japanese becomes retarded with gigajillion syllables per word, cause they start compound like in german. But unless you're watching someone niche like Raden you wont hear them a lot, rest of them go out of their way to keep simplistic anime character charade up.

>>105885115
it has the same amount of vocabulary as any other language on the planet
>>105892447
yes i can see how a burger like you is frightened by the prospect of distinguishing there their and they're, just do your reps and get nihongo jouzu retard
there's 43 bajillion dictionaries online that give you pitch accent clarification if you literally just browse "pitch accent dictionary" on any browser and any search engine

>>105892447
Yeah. Add on that if you try to memorise all the vocab without kanji, you’re gonna run into a bunch of problems when anybody says a compound word made of 2 simple kanji you could know and now you’re staring in the air trying to make sense of it.

>>105892364
Eh, if every kanji was furi'd it'd distract from the purposeful weird readings and you'd miss them.

>>105892622
That's what i thought, it's looked down upon as a help for children. But that's not even the normal Kanji for sensei and jisho shows it's read as shi. japanese are so autistic when they try to be artsy in their kanji use.
Kanade was struggling with Persona 5 and the chat told her not to worry, they can't read it either.

>>105892816
>try to memorise all the vocab without kanji
surely this would mean rice farmers in the 12th century couldn't speak japanese because they didn't know how to read...
language isn't just words on a piece of paper or sounds emanated from a throat, it is a contextual system that you have been endowed with enough pattern recognition to understand, stop underestimating your brain and just get to listening the chuubas... you'll understand the meaning of words (and clauses) entirely through context and repetition, and it'll get faster if by any masochistic ideal you do intend to learn how to read it

Fuck japenis.

>>105892447
>"homophones" that are purely distinguished from one another by pitch accent
lol
There are plenty of Japanese homophones that have identical pronunciation/pitch accents as well, with the only way to discern them being context.
>>105892819
Its not "looked down upon", its flat out useless. Adults don't need it because they can just read the kanji.

>b-but sometimes there's a kanji some adults can't read!
So what? This happens in all languages including English. Someone uses/writes a huge word you've never seen in your life, and you have no idea how to pronounce it or what it means.
>um well at least I can sound it out unlike the nips!
1. You still have no idea what it means
2. You'll still probably get it wrong even sounding it out
3. Even in Japanese you can still make guesses at what a kanji/word might mean/how its said, so English isn't special in this regard.

>>105892819
>japanese are so autistic when they try to be artsy in their kanji use
it adds nuance if you can get it and the kind of thing that might be lost in translation

>>105884629 (OP)
I already understand spoken japanese, but I cant read it nor speak it.

>>105884629 (OP)
I refuse to learn another language to just watch the same thing but in another language. Any language I don’t know is strictly relegated to be consumed through porn.

>>105892870
Japanese wasn’t as reliant on kanji back then as it is today, and also the natives take some 12 years to really learn vocab. Do you want to sound like a single-digit age child after 9 years of learning? Kanji are there to help you.
(Also, you don’t have to tell me how to learn, I’ve only watched JP since the beginning)

>>105884629 (OP)
Learning only spoken Japanese sounds like not just a useless but also a quite difficult task, unless you can do it with someone who speaks Japanese.

>>105892993
This is where you decide whether or not its actually worth it, cause reading, writing and speaking skills won't develop without at least minimal exercise.

>>105885332
I just watched anime and japanese movies, etc a lot of a kid and I learned japanese that way. I can watch japanese youtubers and understand everything they say, but I cant speak japanese nor read or write it.

>>105893081
imo HoloJP is not the same thing as EN. there is no EN pekora or miko etc

>>105891296
>They are quite literally babysitting us.
I'm glad I'm not the only one who noticed. The only women truly cut out to be vtubers, whether big or small, don't mind babysitting manchildren in their spare time.

>>105893200
If we talk about Pekoras dirty jokes then there is Irys, if only she would stream more frequent.

also try to watch male Japanese streamer too.. Just in case you want to speak it to the natives in the future so you won't end up sounding like a faggot because your speaking is influenced by mostly women

>>105893593
I just watch ossans doing /o/tistic stuff. Male chuubas obligated to pander yume-fujo demographics and sound even more fruity than your average cute anime woman.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dgN3WlYwYrE

>>105893285
Personally I enjoy Peko as this aggravatingly overconfident rabbit persona. I enjoy this specific anime character she has built up and what she does with it

>>105893593
I just pay attention to male anime characters for this purpose so I'll sound like a presumptuous retard instead.

>>105893191
I find it hard to believe you understand everything without some effort to grind vocab.

>>105893677
They speak too monotone and slur too much for my beginner listening skills

>>105892622
Furigana is also used in light novels and adult manga.
It's not used for every single kanji, but for less common kanji or kanji that require clarification.

>>105893748
He's no different from a typical illiterate person of any language. He won't be very well spoken and will have a crappy vocabulary, sure, but they can still generally understand spoken language. The only difference is not being able to speak it since an illiterate person still produces speech.

>>105884866
Counterpoint Kronii, Nerissa, Shiori, Bijou, ERB, CC and GG don't know nip at least fluently

>>105885125
>Work from home doesn't exist
Retard

>>105894026
Besides Kronii, its probably too early to tell. Biboo might learn japanese. I doubt the rest will stay after a few years

>>105893748
I assume dude been doing this since pre-netflix-anime-mainstreamification era and turboweeb fansubs and fanlates back then contained fuckton of tl notes and sometimes even separate text files with additional context for particularly tricky titles. If you were to consume a sublethal dose of japanese media back then, you'd grind your vocab without trying much.

>>105894026
Kronii has improved massively, Nerissa hasn't really been trying, Shiori has been doing her reps recently a lot more, Biboo is probably learning (She's living there ffs), ERB hasn't tried in th eslightest, CC has been doing her reps, no clue about GG.

>>105894026
>>105894126
Kronii has made gigantic nip gains this past year actually, she's clearly been studying. She's definitely made the biggest gains of any other hololive member by far, at least for those who started learning after joining hololive.

>>105884629 (OP)
To be honest, I don't know why anyone would want to learn a language that will be dead in the not-too-distant future. The Japanese have been turbo-retarded in recent decades and their society has been in steady decline. In a few years, the official language of Japan will be pajeet with a mixture of arabic or whatever it is that the ragheads who already live there speak.

>>105894687
GG was at least doing her kana reps, most likely also doing vocabs

>>105894821
Metatron has already saved Japan from mass immigration and LGBT shit.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rfl0ZHN_3tA

>>105894026
Kronii do conversations.
Bijou can do basic essential communications in JP, she lives in Japan and deals with daily necessities. Also collabs with JP quite a bit.

Shiori/Nerissa have some skills but they havent revealed their power levels fully. You see them here and there.
ERB/CC/GG has none.

>>105894687
I don't know if ERB will ever try and actually learn, but her pronunciation has improved a fair bit from debut from singing. Probably will depend on if she thinks the UK is a lost cause and moves to JP.

>>105886023
I DO watch them. I'm CURRENTLY watching Fubuki.

>>105894159
Sentences in anime are rather simple, sometimes it's just 1-3 words. If you know 1 word then you gotta figure out 2, if you know 2 then getting the meaning of a single one isn't that complicated. Do this passively for many years and you end up picking up a rather decent amount of vocabulary. Not him but I picked up nip like this before I bothered to sit down and study it.
The brain is literally made for this task so I refuse to believe people can't do that.

good.

>>105884629 (OP)
TR UT H NU KE

>>105896436
Eh, it depends, if you dive into more niche or seinen-y stuff it could get wordy and confusing even with solid conversational vocab.
Gits 95 comes to mind, like a quarter of it is boring-political-column-in-your-daily-newspaper-tier writing so even with subtitles it could be somewhat hard to map words across the languages in real time.

>>105884629 (OP)
that's what anyone that cares should've done since like 2020

>>105897460
Thats why you watch kids stuff or slice of life anime first. They teach you basic vocab and grammar because the characters are usually made to be simple minded.

>>105897460
You don't watch just gits 95 over the course of many years. The point is that you can pick up a lot of vocab just from allocating 2 braincells to parse what they're saying as you consume nip media.

>>105888745
>like game shows and variety off-collabs
those are shit though

>>105884629 (OP)
Give AI like 2 more years and learning a language will be obsolete

>>105886023
The fact your immediate thought process was "knows 2 languages = linguistic savant" only reaffirms what he said

A civilized language
>I am going to the gym and workout my muscles.
Japanese
>gym towards go do. muscle trai do do.

>>105901252
In those 2 years you could have hit N3 easily and begun watching streams while AI would need another 2 more years

>>105901252
>yea man, car driving / drawing / formulating your own thoughts will be obsolete
>just 2 more weeks bro

>>105884629 (OP)
sure thing but if I'm learning japanese it's not going to be for them and I'll go for the superior jp dog gf Koyori

I'm going to use so much outdated slang learnt from watching streams so that when I finally travel to japan all the locals will look at me with pitying eyes. I'll be the weird foreigner.

>>105884629 (OP)
No

>>105901682
Millennials and under will understand that you learned though immersion on the Internet and don't know any better. Beats not being able to speak by a mile.

>>105901682
>>105904327
This reminds me of roboco saying that she'd be very impressed if some foreigner referred to himself as 拙者(very archaic pronoun used by samurai) and would think of him as a cool person

>>105884629 (OP)
That doesn't make sense. If we learned japanese we wouldn't have any reason left to watch a mediocre jp knockoff like FWMC. We would watch the real HoloJPs.

>>105901682
I used 流行り病 in an oral exam and apparently that word was dead for a hundred years before YouTube decided to censor channels that mention ‘the pandemic’ in any normal way

>>105895001
I'm surprised CC has not even a little. She's a bit oldfag(2hu fan) so I was expecting her to be a weeb.