>Libraryhttps://controlc.com/f90157e6
>MysticismHindu โ Raja Yoga, Hathayoga, Shiva Samhita
Taoist โ Foundations of Internal Alchemy
Theravada โ Knowing and Seeing
Sufi โ Sufism for Non-Sufis
Jewish โ Jewish Meditation
General/Thelema โ sacred-texts.com & hermetic.com/figures/index
>GrimoiresAgrippa's Three Books are core
Arbatel should be the first; afterward Heptameron, or Goetia, or Abramelin, Picatrix, etc
The PGM tend to be modular
esotericarchives.com/
>Buddhism & VajrayanaIntro to Tantra, Refining Gold. Look to centers in your area & others that offer empowerment online. Avoid NKT, Rigpa, and Shambhala. Garchen Rinpoche and HHDL's whole YouTube catalogs; you can take empowerment and transmission from their recordings if vows are understood, but really you should have a teacher.
The Facebook group Vajrayana Events regularly posts online empowerments, lungs, and teachings.
accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/
studybuddhism.com
>Golden DawnCicero's Self Initiation into the Golden Dawn, Lyam Thomas Christopher - Kabalah, Magic & the Great Work of Self Transformation
Find a Temple: pansophers.com/golden-dawn-locations/
>Aurum SolisMagical Philosophy (70s editions go from I-V, modern from I-III), then Planetary Magick
The Practical Guide series
>Aspire to AโดAโดHave a basic understanding of the Golden Dawn system. Read Liber ABA, then go through this reading list:
ordoaa.org/studlist.htm
Focus on Liber Resh, E , RV, O, Astarte, and HHH
For a full curriculum, Mystical and Magical System of the AโดAโด
>Chaos MagicLiber Null & Psychonaut, Condensed Chaos, Liber Kaos, Hands-On Chaos Magic
>Tradcrafthttps://pastebin.com/KB7QhL7u
>Astrologyhttps://pastebin.com/euWACNrK
Previous thread:
>>40540139
I'm doing the ritual again tonight. Wish me luck, girls.
>>40598801What's the ritual?
Reposting in the new bread as promised:
Does the Jyotish anon still come here/browse this board? Referring to the one that made these threads 5 years ago, they were a great contribution to /x/:
>>archive.4plebs.org/x/thread/25090733
>>archive.4plebs.org/x/thread/25114104
>>archive.4plebs.org/x/thread/25156377
>>40600799is this dagoth ur
>>40601182m-mercury edition, then...
>>40598752 (OP)If you are not using magick to win the lottery then you are stupid.
If your magick cannot make you win the lottery then it's useless
made this today what do (You) think
>>40603222based anon. making your own ritual implements hallmark of an adept.
HELP OCCULT FRENS
Is pic related a good astrological timing for Jupiter? I'm thinking it is but I need to be sure I'm not missing anything
>Pros: Jupiter in 1st house in Cancer, conjunct both Venus and the Moon (or close enough), Mercury in acceptable shape
>Cons: Saturn in 10th, Mars in 4th, possible whole sign square from both, square from Chiron (though I'm not to bothered about that desu)
>>40603765Also, Saturn in Aries ofc, but canรคt really avoid that.
>>40600054I did it. It happened. I can't believe it worked.
Hi peeps I really need someone with knowledge of alchemy asap, Iโm in serious trouble. the moon aspect has a lot of chaos so donโt do it if youโre not prepared to do it and definitely write down your actions in case you forget. Just be prepared to finish each aspect in one day or else write down your actions in case you forget.
Did another planetary ritual.
This time I felt a little less connected than I did the previous two times, maybe because I was in a rush not to miss the timing. Still, I feel my trust in this magic growing. Particularly when I was making my petition to the planet, I could feel some energy movements in different parts of my body as well, as I made each request. Someone more sensitive to energy may have perceived more.
After I end each ritual, I also feel a little bit of a "high" after that. It's pretty subtle but I can feel an effect lingering. I still feel the one from a few days ago, and now I am also feeling the effect from this one. I can see why some people do daily ritual just to attune - that would probably be incredibly powerful in sustaining and strengthening this spiritual ambience.
hayley it's dallas can we talk again
>>40603222Looks awesome but also a bit syncretic. I don't know some of these symbols so I can't tell what the purpose of the object is or what it means.
It seems like it could be alchemy related, but there are also other elements that suggest magic, as well as the seals of some modern planets which are not typically associated with the alchemical tradition.
>>40603765What is the aim of the election? Is it for a talisman, planetary ritual, or some other form of pursuit (electional astrology is general purpose)?
Whatever the case, I think you should try to get the ascendant closer to Jupiter (like 10-11 Cancer). This may also move the MC/IC axis closer to Saturn and Mars, however, so be careful with that. It may be worth checking where they are in Porphyry/Regiomontanus houses, ideally they will be in succedent or cadent houses rather than angular.
Another couple of things would be the Moon and Venus. If your aim is a Jupiter ritual, you will want the Moon to be applying to Jupiter. In this chart, the Moon and Jupiter area already separating. If you are also trying to prioritise the Jupiter-Venus conjunction, here again they are separating by quite a bit. It's okay to use a separating conjunction (especially because you can't have the Moon apply to Jupiter without that), but to get its best effects, it should be separating fairly tightly, I would say within 3-4 degrees.
Specifically for a ritual, there may be additional difficulties depending on how the planetary hours look in your location. You may also be able to use Taurus Moon elections, which may help with that (just keep in mind that for a Jupiter ritual, the Moon should be applying to Jupiter next; so no squares with Mercury or anything).
>>40603774Saturn in Aries doesn't matter unless 1) it's badly afflicting something in the election chart or 2) you deliberately invoke Saturn for a Saturn ritual.
>>40604865I am a chaos magician I just do what feels right
I had an ego death a couple of years ago and I feel oppressed by the regular world I used to work so hard and thrive in.
How do I find my light again when everything I fought for most of my life was based on thin fake vails and egotistical pretensions of greatness?
>>40605206>I just do what feels rightI don't think that's chaos magic, per se.
>>40605206Fair enough! It looks good, as I say. I just don't know what it means.
Can anybody here suggest me a couple of books of magick that are known to be a 'quick and dirty' book of practical magick, I've read a lot of theory books like Liber ABA unabridged, Bardon's Hermetics Initiation stuff, Abramelin (this one's practical but too outdated), Chapman's beginners book, and a couple others related to ceremonial and chaos magick. I have a solid theoretical foundation and want to move onto applied practicals based on my ground.
>>40606469The Arbatel is a good place to start in terms of actual practice. It's a short read and you can just jump in.
The process is basically read book, make lamen, call spirit, dismiss spirit. There aren't really any pitfalls to look out for. The digital ambler blog has a load of free content on it.
>>40606717Thank you anon, is the Peterson translation good? I have read Arbatel doesn't have sininster implications which is very cool.
Any TechnoMagick practitioner here? How does one get started????111!1!1???
>>40604865The aim is a Jupiter talisman. Since I'm not too sharp at the arts and craft bit I picked a starting time to have as much time with Cancer in the 1st as possible, so the asc would move closer during the making.
>If your aim is a Jupiter ritual, you will want the Moon to be applying to JupiterAgiain, talisman, but this seems like generally good advice over all. Problem is that if i get the Moon closer and applying to Jupiter within the same rough time-frame it will square Mars. I could put the operation a month earlier or later, but the same issues more or less remain.
Thanks for the advice!
>>40606748>Peterson translation Absolutely. It's a dual translation, so you can go over the Latin yourself if you're so inclined. He posits that the northerly secrets, which aren't explicitly stated in the text, could be "harsh"- i.e. the potentially destructive ones. But they're not ones you'd be working with, so everything else is safe. Good luck!
>>40605514What do you think it is?
>>40606115>What it meansIt's for channeling energy during ritual
>>40606767>The aim is a Jupiter talisman. Since I'm not too sharp at the arts and craft bit I picked a starting time to have as much time with Cancer in the 1st as possible, so the asc would move closer during the making.Yeah, that's fine, just keep in mind that if you are showing someone else an election to be evaluated, you should show the time the talisman will be completed/consecrated/both.
Also, I have heard it said that you should only work on a talisman during the correct planetary hour. So maybe check how that works out.
>Agiain, talisman, but this seems like generally good advice over all.Yeah, it applies to both the completion of a talisman and also the consecration ritual.
>Problem is that if i get the Moon closer and applying to Jupiter within the same rough time-frame it will square Mars.If you roll it back 24 hours it would probably be at around 3 degrees Cancer, enclosed by both malefics. So yeah that would be really bad. But I don't think you would be able to do that anyway without messing up the planetary hours, you'd need to go back a week, (which would put the Moon in another unsuitable sign, most likely).
There may be other suitable options at different times of the year, or else while the Moon is in a different sign. IIRC in my location there are valid elections for both Taurus Moon and Cancer Moon versions of a similar talisman.
>>40606717Fuck me it didn't take long before it turned into a christcuck suck fest. Is there anything that isn't mired in this bullshit?
>>40607759I am not a Christian but that wouldn't stop me. You can interpret "the Son" metaphorically if you prefer. I use the names of the archangels as a fixed part of a purification ritual, even though I do not follow Christianity (and in fact am pretty hostile towards it).
Just take the ritual sincerely and see it through, if you actually want to obtain the end result.
>>40607759In my experience the easiest grimoire to de-Christianize is the Verum. That's considered to be one of the most sinister grimoires, which to me is ideal because it means it preserved the most pagan methods of conjuration. But maybe that's a deal-breaker for you. If so you'll probably have to work more modern neopagan or reconstructionist materials
>>40607759Actually if you don't care about a complete grimoiric system, you could look at the PGM materials along with Techniques of Graeco-Egyptian Magic by Skinner
Iโm serious about the problem Iโm having, I know a few clues from public sources.
Heart and 69 is the same thing. I need a โresetโ both soft and hard! Because I donโt know how I got into this starting point in the beginning, all I know was that I was curing my body of dis-ease with 12 compounds that I thought were just supplements.
>>40607894Yup. I'm
>>40606717 and have been working Verum more or less exclusively for a few years now. It's fantastic but I wouldn't recommend it for someone who's never worked a system, so I didn't. The Arbatel is safe and gets results but yeah, it's heavy on the godly shit. As I see it, I'm not Christian but the system is. So you run it as it's presented then muck about with it when you have everything up and running. The angry mongos like
>>40607759 have plenty of other options but, as usual, it's easier for him to have a little cry and talk about what he hates than actually actually the question.
>>40608215>actually actually >throwing insults because someone doesn't like your magic jesus pamphlet Ah omg at it's finest, seriously such a strong mind
>>40608285That's fair. I was up at 4am working this stuff and am now half cut. My point still stands- it's much easier to complain than to contribute or actually do something. If you're so hung up on religion it's triggering to even consider working something that uses it as a framework, you should probably ignore that suggestion or do a bit of work on your issues before touching anything magical.
>>40607190>Yeah, that's fine, just keep in mind that if you are showing someone else an election to be evaluated, you should show the time the talisman will be completed/consecrated/bothThat's fair enough, could have been clearer on that point.
>Yeah, it applies to both the completion of a talisman and also the consecration ritual.>There may be other suitable options at different times of the yearHighly annoying, since the main issue is the Moon being a single degree and it otherwise is as close to an ideal chart (within reason) I have been able to find thus far. Pic related, 2 months ahead, might be a bit better. Even though both the Moon an Jupiter are aspecting the malefics its at least with trines and they are not in angular houses.
>Also, I have heard it said that you should only work on a talisman during the correct planetary hour.Not sure there is a single acceptable time to actually complete the talisman in that case. I'm no expert in electional astrology (as you can tell) so I'm not sure what to prioritize, but I will need to have some leniency on at least one of the traditional rules, unless I want to wait 12 years to make a Jupiter talisman.
I did it again. I think I was meant to be a magician.
>>40608856The ascendant in this chart is still too far from Jupiter, that's 9 degrees. IIRC Warnock's maximum is 8 degrees, and personally I would try to keep it within 5 degrees of the ascendant, applying or separating.
The Moon's next aspect is also not relevant. It will aspect Mercury, Mars and the Sun before it aspects Jupiter. You need it aspecting Jupiter next.
Another thing to keep in mind is planetary speed. If the Sun gets too far away from Jupiter, Jupiter will become slow. Once Jupiter moves at like 30% of its average speed, it is not suitable for talismans.
And yes, all this stuff is annoying. Sometimes I get furious thinking, "if only this minor factor was slightly different, this would be a great election!" But this is just how this type of magic works. If you are using the power of the planets to do magic, then you need the correct planetary alignments.
If this is too frustrating, you could try a more relaxed approach on conditions. I try to go for the best conditions possible, so I don't keep the more limited rules in my memory. But try Warnock's books I recommended before - I think he gives a list for less demanding conditions as well.
> Even though both the Moon an Jupiter are aspecting the maleficsNot an issue at all with soft aspects, the bigger problem is that they need to apply to each other first.
>Not sure there is a single acceptable time to actually complete the talisman in that case.Try to research this matter as well, but I am relatively confident that you can start working on a talisman at a prior time (so long as the relevant planet has dignity, and it is the correct planetary hour). The important part is completing the talisman during the final election, and then consecrating it right after.
What some people do is do the design early, and then finish the inscriptions at the time of consecration.
>I'm no expert in electional astrology (as you can tell)You are doing really well for someone without a strong background in it.
>>40608856You may also benefit from reading De Imaginibus by Thabit Ibn Qurra, edited by Warnock. That book deals with house based talismans, which are "more complex", but I actually find the elections easier and more practical since planetary hours are not necessary for those.
I have a question.
Why is it so difficult to do magic that contradicts known reality? Why is it always subtle shit that could just as easily be chalked up to coincidence? Why can't we shapeshift or make illusions or conjure visible spirits or elemental constructs like the things seen in legends and folklore?
To what extent is it truly magic, if we can't actually affect reality to a noticeable extent?
>>40606997>What do you think it is?I don't know, a form of magical experimentation? But not "do what feels right." That's more like masturbation.
>>40604320>>40608123Never mind I figured out how to do it correctly now. I would of start with first instead, since I have a myiasis problem doctors refused to take seriously, which is why I need a miracle to solve my medical problem. Now I made a mess using zinc compounds and copper compounds that need to be reset to before I messed up. As you see I have more pictures, but I canโt determine who I will teach beside ages 33 or older because Jesus Christ died aged 33, or perhaps some homeless people also ages 33 or older.
>>40611469The point of a video game cheat console is to cheat in things that are a part of the video game, not to break the whole programming and graphical interface of the video game. If you reliably get what you desire after doing magic to get you that thing, then the process is working exactly as intended.
>Why can't we shapeshift or make illusions or conjure visible spirits or elemental constructs like the things seen in legends and folklore?Some say they can do it. I think it is possible. I just don't really care for it.
>>40611492>I don't knowYeah I can tell
>>40611469People report these experiences, but almost nobody can do them reliably. If someone was able to do them reliably then that would be like a Jesus figure, or in modern times Dudjom Rinpoche. You should expect them to found a new branch of religion. Not exactly the type of person you see everywhere even in occult spaces, you know?
>>40611346>The Moon's next aspect is also not relevant>You need it aspecting Jupiter next.Not sure I'm understanding you correctly here. Does the Moon aspecting Jupiter matter or not? I have tried to aim for conjunctions in the elections though I don't think that's strictly necessary, but I'm assuming having the Moon in it's domicile would be a nice bonus. Also, just for the sake of clarity are we counting conjunctions as aspects in this discussion? This is a technicallity but I know some astrologers put conj. in their own category.
>Once Jupiter moves at like 30% of its average speed, it is not suitable for talismansThanks, that's another rule I wasn't aware of. That might limit my options quite severely if that's already an issue in the last chart I posted, which I'm assuming it might be since you brought it up. But I will look in to that more thoroughly.
>And yes, all this stuff is annoyingHoly fuck, tell me about it. I'm used to regular electional astrology being annoying (haven't done it much but I've noticed there's always at least one thing fucking the charts up, even with my scant knowledge) but once you add planetary hours as a necessity things spiral out of control.
>Not an issue at all with soft aspects, the bigger problem is that they need to apply to each other first.Which planets are "they" here? The malefics or Moon/Jupiter? Sorry if I'm being retarded here but it's not clear to me what you mean.
>You are doing really well for someone without a strong background in it.Thanks, that good to hear. I'm much at natal (though I'm not an expert in that either), and I assumed transfering some of the same principles would at least be a good start.
>>40611357Thanks for the book recs. Will have to check them out
>>40611346>>40611357Just as a summary, as far as I've gathered these are the things I need to keep an eye on:
While working on it:
>Jupiter in dignity>In the correct planetary hourThis is easy enough
When finishing/consecrating:
>Jupiter within 5 degrees of Asc or MC>Moon in an applying, soft aspect to Jupiter>Neither of them suffering hard aspects from the malefics>Malefics preferably tucked away in non-angular house, far away from axises>In the correct planetary hour>Jupiter not too far away from the sun >Mercury in ok shapeJesus fucking christ dude. I'll try to meet these as well as I can, but most likely I will have to figure out what to prioritize here. Surely all of these can't be equally important (knowing astrologers there's probably even more conditions I'm not even aware of)
>>40611968You don't care for non-UPG results in magic?
>>40612529I don't want to be a religious leader though. I want to be a wizard.
>>40612541>Not sure I'm understanding you correctly here. Does the Moon aspecting Jupiter matter or not?The Moon's next aspect is a trine to Mercury, which is not a relevant aspect for the election. What you need is an aspect to Jupiter. That's what I meant, but I can see the ambiguity.
>I'm assuming having the Moon in it's domicile would be a nice bonus.Domicile, reception, or exaltation are all great. Other options are mediocre. Capricorn or Scorpio are horrible (barring special circumstances).
>Also, just for the sake of clarity are we counting conjunctions as aspects in this discussion?Yes. Although they are not technically aspects, conjunctions work just as well as sextiles and trines.
>That might limit my options quite severely if that's already an issue in the last chart I posted, which I'm assuming it might be since you brought it up.I haven't checked, but I said that because if you elect for the next Taurus Moon about three weeks later, Jupiter will probably be getting quite slow and preparing to go retrograde.
>Which planets are "they" here? The malefics or Moon/Jupiter?Moon and Jupiter need to apply to each other.
>Thanks, that good to hear. I'm much at natal (though I'm not an expert in that either), and I assumed transfering some of the same principles would at least be a good start.In a way, yes. Besides that, there are some concepts in horary that are also relevant, like having important planets apply to each other. Keep in mind also that talismanic elections are a bit different to normal elections.
>>40612562You could add more to that list. For example, the Moon shouldn't conjoin an afflicted or retrograde planet. Conditions like combustion were also managed in previous conversations. And the Jupiter thing is strictly about speed (distance from the sun is just a rough indicator of that). Mercury is not relevant for your election (unless this is also a Mercury talisman in some way).
>>40612562You can also study Warnock's elections if you wish, they are on his website. Check and see what kind of charts he elects. He is a bit more flexible with the rules, so for example, I think he sells a Mercury cazimi talisman that has Mercury on the IC. Which I think is conceptually absurd; the IC is literally referred to as the nadir of the cosmos. But Warnock has been making talismans for nearly 30 years, and has produced thousands of them. I have not. He also makes the point that you need the conditions to be practically suitable - there is no perfect election, so you need to compromise at some point, or else you won't get anything done.
I am pretty stringent about my requirements because from my point of view, t makes sense that great talismans should be relatively rare and hard to produce. In addition, there are the other conceptual notions in my mind that I can't force myself to disobey, such as placing the planet only on the ASC or MC. My inner cynic also feels that Warnock might have relaxed his requirements in order to mass produce talismans a little bit, since he has become so famous and in demand. At the same time, he also strikes me as a good person and a generous teacher, and everything that I know, I know because of him. So I feel like if he does things one way, I should be able to recommend his way of doing things to others.
In any case, whatever you choose to do, I am sure that you will find the approach you are most comfortable with. Have faith and keep going.
Also, as an unrelated side note, I think I spoke with you before about using a respirator during carving. Well, for most of the process, it may also help to do the carving outdoors or in a workshop if you can. You don't want to breathe metal particles during the carving, but you don't want to breathe them in after the carving is over either.
>>40611346>What some people do is do the design early, and then finish the inscriptions at the time of consecration.nta, was thinking of working with a guy that works in a jewelry, is it fine that I make him do some of the work at any time and then just consecrate it at the right time? Or what I need to complete it?
>>40612646>What you need is an aspect to Jupiter.Thanks, then it's as I suspected.
>Domicile, reception, or exaltation are all great.Hmm, didn't consider reception. Moon in Pisces opens up the the options a bit. Will try to aim for Pisces, Taurus or Cancer in that case.
>Moon and Jupiter need to apply to each other.Thanks again. Assumed so just needed to clear it up. A lot of intricacies to keep track of.
I'll add keeping an eye on retrogrades and afflicted plantes to the list, thankfully I don't think this will be a massive issue though. Same goes for combustion. I've heard that mercury should be in good shape for talismans generally, though I don't have a spurce for that so I can't explain the reasoning.
>>40612660I'll have to look into Warnocks stuff then. This is the first talisman I've attemped to make. Been somewhat interested in it for a while and I thought an Exalted Jupiter talisman would be a great place to start, especially considering that the planets aren't actually THAT bad. I've complained a bit about the rules here, but the hardest part will be getting Jupiter on the Asc/MC during Jupiters planetary hours. The other stuff should be fixable without too many headaches.
>I am pretty stringent about my requirements because from my point of view, t makes sense that great talismans should be relatively rare and hard to produceThat absolutely makes sense. However, as I see it, not getting absolutely every condition spot on (as long as there is nothing catastrophic involved) should serve to weaken the talisman, not make it absolutely unuseablt or detrimental. I might be wrong about that but I think the rationale holds up
>Also, as an unrelated side note, I think I spoke with you before about using a respirator during carving.Not me, as I said above this is the first time I plan on making a talisman (thus the many questions), but I've already taken that into account. Not too keen on breathing in metal flakes lol.
>>40612660>In any case, whatever you choose to do, I am sure that you will find the approach you are most comfortable with. Have faith and keep going.Thanks fren. This discussion has been very helpful. I always get very happy when someone on /x/ actually engages in discussion instead of just name-dropping some random book then proceeding to call me a retard. I remember one time, years ago now when I first posted my birth-chart in an astro-thread just for shits and giggles and then got a (by 4chan standards) a massive reading with a lot for scarily accurate information. Basically had no other option but to start believing in astrology there and then.
But again, thanks for the help dude!
>>40612660>I think I spoke with you before about using a respirator during carving. No that was me, I think we are 3 doing planetary talismans now. Talismanic general when? (never please).
Anyway do you know anything regarding doing talismans when in your chart you have that planet fallen or in detriment, should I be worried? Cause reading about what this anon was saying made me think that Jupiter is slower than Venus, so I should focus on that, but my Jupiter is in fall iirc.
>>40612708I don't know. This is a challenging question to answer, even if you do experiments. And I haven't done any experiments like this.
I don't have any evidence to support my position, but personally, my gut instinct is that so long as the talisman is completed at the specific election, it should still have all of its power. I just lean on the side of caution because of what I have heard. If that works for you, you could probably commission a jeweller to do 90% of the work for you, and then you just do the inscriptions at the time of the consecration (for example, the name of the user). Then you consecrate it. Just keep in mind that you will need some empty space on the material, so the jeweller should leave room for that. Alternatively, you can find an occult-friendly jeweller (Warnock has his jewellers to do the initial consecration).
>>40612716>Moon in Pisces opens up the the options a bit.Moon in Pisces is great, just make sure there are no bad aspects to Saturn or Mars within 13 degrees.
>I've heard that mercury should be in good shape for talismans generally, though I don't have a spurce for that so I can't explain the reasoning.I think I missed my shot. Not sure how Mercury in Gemini looked like, but IIRC when I checked the Virgo Mercury elections for this year in my city, there wasn't a single one. I will probably check again around August or so.
>Been somewhat interested in it for a while and I thought an Exalted Jupiter talisman would be a great place to startWhat's the design? The Picatrix white quartz enthroned man seems like a pretty good option.
>the hardest part will be getting Jupiter on the Asc/MC during Jupiters planetary hours.One quick tip: you can skip by a week to retain the same planetary hour/ASC (or MC) alignment. Helps cycle through possible elections more quickly, and typically means I only need to check 8 possible elections per month.
>>40612725How long ago was that? It's not impossible that I gave that reading, lol.
>>40612822>No that was me, I think we are 3 doing planetary talismans now.Possibly 4 including the jyotisha guy. Maybe 5 assuming that this
>>40612708 isn't you, or even up to 6 people if I can find that guy from /astro/ again.
An unexpected boon for sure. Makes me wonder if I should pick a name, trip, or start avatarposting. I'd hate to lose contact/track of interesting people, but at the same time I find 4chan posting a lot comfier than Discord or whatever.
>Anyway do you know anything regarding doing talismans when in your chart you have that planet fallen or in detriment, should I be worried?Warnock has free resources on this, since it's also relevant for clients. His verdict is that it's a "yellow flag" - proceed with caution, maybe test it out, and if it doesn't work for you, find a good way to dispose of the talisman and don't try to engage with such talismans again.
>Cause reading about what this anon was saying made me think that Jupiter is slower than Venus, so I should focus on that, but my Jupiter is in fall iirc.Yeah that was me saying that! But I am not sure what you are referring to here? Currently both Venus and Jupiter are moving fast, so you can in theory make talismans for either planet. (The Venus window is closing now since it will soon hit a conjunction with Algol. In my city, there are not more suitable elections.)
If you have Jupiter in fall natally, that would make Jupiter talismans a "yellow flag" issue. You can try it out, but if you feel like they are delivering weird or counter-productive results, you will have to look at alternatives. Warnock gives some. One option is to try other benefic talismans (like Venus) assuming you have the relevant planet in a good condition. The other option is fixed star talismans.
You are wasting your time with this astro nonsense.
I spent all this time not knowing what the point of sex magic is. Turns out, people use it for alchemy. Cool.
Daisy
md5: 8b161a6b009dc6c4ccde54dc890d7464
๐
>>40598752 (OP)Wouldn't it be wild if Satan and Hell with it's 9 layers was just a misinterpretation and it was just Saturn and 9 of it's moons have demonic life on them.
>>40613695Fake news: Saturn and its moons only have ANGELIC life on them.
>Source? I was there.
>>40613837Well if the stories are some what true then the Devil is a fallen angel who was the head of the quire or something like that.
>>40614083That's a natal chart.
>>40614961I don't want to make him vomit live spiders. It's just not fun anymore guys. Grow up.
>>40615412>I don't want to make him vomit live spiders.Can... can that be done?
Could we do that to someone else?
>>40598752 (OP)Ok flags, time to spill the beans
Which is the most effective magic you have practiced?
>>40617650Blood magic and negative karmic transference.
>>40613078>What's the design? The Picatrix white quartz enthroned man seems like a pretty good option.I'm thinking Agrippa talisman. It's a classic, and if it's good enough for Joseph Smith it's good enough for me lol. An added benefit of the Agrippa designs is that they're dead simple to make as well. I know having a prayer along the edge of the talisman some times is customary, so I might add that if I find a decent one. I'll take a look at the Picatrix one you rec'd as well though!
>One quick tip: you can skip by a week to retain the same planetary hour/ASC (or MC) alignmentI've done this a but but the Moon tends to start acting up IIRC
>How long ago was that? It's not impossible that I gave that reading, lol.Haha, that would be a fun synchronicity in that case! It was around November of 2020. The astrologer in question was extra nice to me since I "signed" my posts with pictures of the Moomins in that thread, and he liked the Moomins. I still have that reading saved somewhere. It wasn't 100% spot on but a lot of the info was so earily close and specific I just had to conclude "this stuff is real", which spooked me to no fucking end lol (was a materialist atheist/agnostic at the time). I got so spooped it took me several years to even begin to study Astrology myself.
>>40611492There's a lot of masturbating in chaos magick too lol
>>40619204>I'm thinking Agrippa talisman.The sigils he offers are great. But what about the materials? What do you plan to use?
>I've done this a but but the Moon tends to start acting up IIRCYeah, basically every option I considered for this month was a dud due to Moon/planetary hours stuff.
It also seems like it wasn't me but another anon who did that reading for you.
>>40598752 (OP)I know that Pluto is supposed to be a higher octave of Mars, but isnโt Saturn also a gateway to Pluto since before Pluto was discovered Saturn was used for underworld type workings?
Speaking of which, itโs funny that I read bats listed as being associated with mars somewhere
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>>40614083nothingburger if chiron isn't on your asc
>>40614083Ok, millennialโฆ
>>40620098>But what about the materials?I've bought some thin silver plating (10x5 cm) for relatively cheap and a suitable engraving pen. Gonna practice my engraving on wood or similar just to get the hang of it, and since the plate is rectangular I'll have enough silver to make 2 talismans if I want to, but I'll probably save the other half for later. Don't think I need to have 2 Agrippa-Jupiter talismans. Not sure If I'll cut it into a circular shape yet. I probably will for the aesthetics but that would give me less space to work on.
>>40620153Pic related.
>>40620331That sounds really cool, well chosen. Personally, I recommend you cut a square shape, since the square is IIRC the shape that Jupiter rules. You can look this up in Agrippa as well just to be sure, but I am pretty sure this is how it is, and is also why Jupiter rules the number 4.
This is very much an optional thing, but might be nice to do anyway.
Also, how much did the silver cost, if you don't mind me asking? I got some pretty small silver bits for about 50 dollars each. Maybe about an inch in diameter.
>>40620434>Personally, I recommend you cut a square shape, since the square is IIRC the shape that Jupiter rulesShit, that makes it easier! I'll double check that but worst case scenario it won't hurt and it will make the process A LOT easier
>Also, how much did the silver cost, if you don't mind me asking?Not at all! The silver was about 180 dollars in burgerbucks. I didn't buy the absolutely cheapest option, but I figured that since it will be good for two talismans, it's stirdy as fuck and what ever I make on them will be good for a lifetime I could afford to put some cash into it. The only thing I wish I'd have changed was making it a bit thinner. It's 1mm in depth but I could have gotten it a bit cheaper for 0.7, and it would probably be just as stridy.
>>40611469>https://youtu.be/QyRN4eHOZtg?si=_E4uybZSHarHZZrQ
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I *might* finally have found an appropriate time!
>Cancer in 10th
>Moon in applying conjunction
>Hour of Jupiter
>No hard aspects from malefics
>Trine from Mars, but he's comfy in Scorpio
Sadly a square from the sun, but Jupiter is in the superior position (unless I'm mixing it up, which I don't think I am), and I don't think it should matter anyway. Still not sure about Jupiters speed here, I'll have to look into that, but Otherwise I'm pretty happy with this. It's early in the morning on a week day, which is annoying practically speaking, but I can work around that.
>>40622053Just looked it up and yeah, Jupiter is really slow here. But at this point I have several elections, all with some flaw or other. I need to figure out what to prioritize.
>>40620331NTA but bumping to say it's fucking excellent to see someone getting it.
In the hypothetical scenario where one was to summon the archangel of death to visit the day of judgement, but plead the Creator for safe return from the waters above, would he, and by extension God, keep a grudge or debt that would come back knocking for troubling the natural order?
According to some islamic sources, the angel of death would manifest himself only to those who lived holy or saintly lives before their time comes. For the greeks the only ones who come back from the Elyseum fields were at first mythological demi-gods, then "ordinary" heros.
If you have other parallels from other religions or cults i'd appreciate.
>>40606753>TechnoMagickNo idea bruh. Train an LLM to act like a living statue and use it for Theurgy? Do some traditional digit-mancy?
>>40622248Again, pretty new to this so not sure how much I'm actually getting. But thanks anon
>>40620716>a whole episodeWhich part are you using as an answer? Because if this is the one with the birds, or with "Alice Bailey," I worry those might still be chalked up to (very strange) coincidences.
Maybe it would be nice to re-listen to the Skinner episodes though.
>>40620533I see, interesting. Thanks for letting me know.
>>40622053>>40622101If you checked all the times until the retrograde period and there is nothing, you can check how things look after the retrograde period, starting roughly in March 2026. You will want for Jupiter to pick up speed again, but there should be another window of time after that which may be suitable.
The problem with the election you posted is that the Moon applies to a square with the Sun first before it applies to a conjunction with Jupiter. According to Warnock, you don't want hard aspects like this in your talismans.
Didn't know we had so many queer astrology girlies here.
>>40624465There are about as many women involved in astrological magic as there are in pure math.
>>40624465astrological magic is the highest and purest expression of magic. its master level wizard shit. great way to out yourself as a baby occultist why dont you go back to jacking off on sigils.
>>40598752 (OP)>Library>https://controlc.com/f90157e6Is this the same as last year's torrent?
Is it missing anything?
i have most of the old torrent still so I'm checking out for missing material before deleting anything
For the talisman guys, I found this cool description of a complex Saturn consecration ritual. It's definitely very "extra" compared to the normal process, but I like it a lot. This person is treating his talismans as masterpieces that receive special attention, rather than just any old object to be made and used. A lot of charm to that, and I suspect it probably makes a difference.
>>40625064>forgot to post the linkIncredible.
https://digitalambler.com/materia/saturn-talisman/
>>40624105>Thanks for letting me knowNo problem
>The problem with the election you posted is that the Moon applies to a square with the SunIt's always something. Don't you think this is softened a bit by that the fact that the Moon overcomes the Sun here? It's not ideal, I agree, but if this doesn't work I'll have to chck post retrograde as you say, or maybe go for the conjunction in August. Not sure that works though since I don't think the ASC or MC is correct during Jupiters planetary hour.
I'll check post retrograde but if I don't find anything good then I'll have to make do with one of the ones I've already found (there are a few I haven't posted as well)
>>40624465You'll die of AIDS in your next 6th house profection year.
>>40625064>>40625072>digital amblerThanks for reminding me on this guy! he probably has some good advice on consecration generally. I was in his hermetic discord for a while, and that place is sadly exactly as gay and reddit you'd imagine it being. But he's got some cool resources!
>two months ago
>draw Seal of Lilith on a sticky note at work
>no real intention which is silly in retrospect, just wanted a protection seal
>leave it under mousepad
>sexual and romantic life are flourishing
>gotten a lot of personal growth done
>make this realization while talking to roommate (who has worked with her)
>talk for a while, feel presence behind me
>like a hand is caressing my head and telling me I'm safe
I've never worked with entities like this before but also never had an experience like this before. I read that she like red wine, dragons blood, and roses. Are these good offerings? Should I do this under a specific moon? Take it to another general? Am I thinking too hard? I just want to give proper thanks and do it right
>>40625277>I'll check post retrograde but if I don't find anything good then I'll have to make do with one of the ones I've already found (there are a few I haven't posted as well)If it comes down to that, I can try to help look, too. Assuming you'd be comfortable with that.
I think there should definitely be at least one good election though. Whatever the time zone, I can't imagine there not being a single good one for the whole year. And that's for a normal planetary talisman, to boot.
>digital amblerI actually know absolutely nothing about him. But I saw this link posted elsewhere, and it was really interesting. Not exactly how I would do it, but I would definitely want to approach the ritual with this level of detail.
Sad to hear this about his Discord group. To be honest though, I don't really know what people tend to be like in the occult sphere. When I have looked, I've mostly run into dodgy characters, frauds, or mentally disturbed people. Sometimes all of those at the same time. So I keep my distance, and study on my own.
>>40625655>I can try to help look, too. Assuming you'd be comfortable with that.That's very nice of you! I'll have a look first but if I don't find anything I can share my general location. It's not like you any one pin me down from that alone.
>I can't imagine there not being a single good one for the whole yearMe neither, but the options generally aren't great based on our conversation. Though you are more adept at this than me so you might be able to see something I'm missing.
I will probably have to get myself an edition of the Picatrix to be able to check this stuff easier. I have pretty good astrological resources, but very few on talismans (Agrippa being the main one, but I haven't found to much by him on elections and consecration rituals, weirdly enough)
>I actually know absolutely nothing about him. But I saw this link posted elsewhere, and it was really interestingHaven't read every thing the guy has done but I've visited his site a few times and he's got good info there and is obviously very knowledgable. I think I found him through some podcast talking about classical hermeticism. If you adjust the correspondances in the link you posted you can probably make a great Jupiter consecration out of that.
>I don't really know what people tend to be like in the occult sphere>I keep my distance, and study on my own.Same here for the most part. The few times I have talked to Occultists they tend to be as you said. DESU I'm mainly interested in the occult from a philosophical perspective any way (hence why I'm not to sharp on the practical side), and most occultist don't think through their basic worldview nearly well enough.
>discordI checked just now and I'm still in that discord so I might double check with the guys there as well, but as i said, IIRC they are a VERY left-leaning "all perspectives are heckin valid" bunch.
>>40625871>It's not like you any one pin me down from that alone.Especially if you live in a big city, it's very secure.
>Me neither, but the options generally aren't great based on our conversation.I wouldn't know, honestly. I actually haven't looked much yet. I found a couple of options in my area but I was pretty random and lazy about it, they are just tentative. Probably as Jupiter stops being combust I will start to look into the immediate future and check if there are any upcoming elections. I'll take it little by little.
>I will probably have to get myself an edition of the Picatrix to be able to check this stuff easier.The Picatrix is kind of all over the place, honestly. Not very easy to use, and some of the stuff said in it are kind of weird. I found it much easier to just use Warnock's requirements, which he derived from the Picatrix. Trawling through that mess with the intention of compiling a list of conditions sounds like a huge nuisance to me.
Still a good text to own and read. It's just not a super conveniently written text. Personally, I prefer Agrippa.
>If you adjust the correspondances in the link you posted you can probably make a great Jupiter consecration out of that.Yeah. The hard thing for me to replicate would be the materials, crafting, space etc. The visualisation meditation would probably also be a bit of a challenge - I only tried something like that once, and it was an extremely underwhelming experience. The "meditation" was supposed to show me an objective vision but it was obvious that it was just pulling random crap from my subconscious. And the instructions were littered with warnings too about how it could damage your astral body if you don't follow the instructions right or whatever. So I tried it once and never looked back. Might pick up scrying or this type of meditation again at some point in the future, but I wouldn't be able to do it right now.
>>40625871>DESU I'm mainly interested in the occult from a philosophical perspective any wayMostly a similar case here. I am looking for anything that can help me set root into the spiritual part of life. I believe in enlightenment and posthumous states, so that's something I want to succeed at. But in the meanwhile, theurgy to guide my development and also magic to help me live an acceptable material existence sound pretty good. Then one day, hopefully, immortality in the spirit realm.
>IIRC they are a VERY left-leaning "all perspectives are heckin valid" bunch.Yeah it's a "stuck between a rock and a hard place" situation. Most people you are likely to run into in the occult sphere believe in vibes based magic and have a totally new age approach to things. The rest tend towards neuroticism and will make everything sound potentially lethal or catastrophic or absurdly complex and unworkable. The people in the golden mean are, in my experience, not very many.
11aug
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>>40626091>Especially if you live in a big city, it's very secure.Gothenburg, Sweden if you want to have a look.
>I wouldn't know, honestly. I actually haven't looked much yetThe main issue is the planetary hours. I have a few good elections in August, but matching the hour is tough. Pic related is like one hour off, annoyingly enough.
>I found it much easier to just use Warnock's requirementsI know you brought him up before, do you have any specific book you could recommend? His website is a bit hard to navigate and his info seem to mostly be behind paywalls.
>The visualisation meditation would probably also be a bit of a challenge>the instructions were littered with warnings too about how it could damage your astral bodyI've found that's something you have to practice regularly, more or less in a non-occult fashion to get good at. I'm not great at visualizing, but one method that works for me is imagine as vividly as you can walking a route your very familiar with, and describing all the details you can for yourself. When you've done that a few times it gets easier.
And I mean sure, you don't want to ignore those warnings, but lots of things weaken your astral body without being catastrophic. As long as there are no parasitic entities involved I don't think you'd be on too thin ice.
>>40626095>I believe in enlightenment and posthumous states>theurgy to guide my development and also magic to help me live an acceptable material existence sound pretty goodWe sound pretty similar in our outlooks. I got into esotericism to begin with through philosophical concerns and a few (honestly pretty minor) "paranormal experiences", like the astro reading I mentioned a few posts ago. Started with the Corpus Hermeticum and Kybalion and I've more or less become a neo-platonist since. My main issue is probably that I haven't picked a proper tradition to follow. If I could I'd just go for Iamblichean Theurgy, but as far as I'm aware those techniques are to a large extent lost. Basically just doing meditation, prayer at the moment and some homebrewed contemplative practices ATM. It's difficult to find a practice that doesn't feel LARPy, in that sense I do think "vibes" are important. I've considered just becoming a Catholic for the structure, but I'm not exactly a christian so that would feel wrong.
>>40627027Scandinavia! Home of seidr!
I will take a look at the charts, probably tomorrow. You are pretty far north, so things may get a bit wonky with the midheaven. Let's see.
The one you posted would be perfect, if only the Moon applied to Jupiter. It is even a bit funny because the Moon has mutual reception with both benefics.
>I know you brought him up before, do you have any specific book you could recommend? His website is a bit hard to navigate and his info seem to mostly be behind paywalls.I mentioned a few in the previous threads, but maybe it was in a conversation with another anon.
The big ones:
>Secrets to Planetary Magic>Secrets to Planetary Ritual>The Celestial Way>Astral High Magic (for house based talismans only, but really cool)>Fixed Star Magic + De Quindecim Stellis (for fixed star magic only but also really cool)This will give you like 90% of the stuff that he has in his course. In fact, I am pretty sure the course is pieced together from the books.
The only things you won't find in the books will be his reference tables for planetary rulerships, which are available for free on his website anyway. Check this link, and also the Cornelius Agrippa sidebar where the links to the other planetary pages are given.
https://www.renaissanceastrology.com/agrippasaturn.html
Also, check out the previous few /omg/ threads if you weren't there. There was some useful discussion and some resources mentioned. Although this post is kind of a recap/summary anyway. On top of that, you could check his full list of published books and pick any other stuff that sounds interesting. I've left out the mansions of the Moon, for example, since it doesn't seem like super trustworthy magic to me. But it has a long history anyway.
>>40627027>I got into esotericism to begin with through philosophical concerns and a few (honestly pretty minor) "paranormal experiences"Exact same situation here. Started with a philosophical search for meaning, ran into a crypto-Hermetic author, and that was my gateway into more traditional and spiritual stuff, including magic and Platonism.
>more or less become a neo-platonist sinceI've become a full blown Neoplatonist. The astrological magic stuff is great for me too because it works well enough with Neoplatonic cosmological and metaphysical views. Like you said, the original Neoplatonic theurgy is largely lost. Although I hope that I will be able to use astrological magic for the most part as a substitute, or maybe as a basis to start my reconstruction. The rest I will supplement with whatever I can make work best for me. Most likely, different types of alchemy and meditation. Hopefully, it works out.
What kind of approach or method are you gravitating towards? Energy cultivation/development? Meditation (and perhaps a particular kind, like awareness, visualisation, what have you)? Some kind of devotional practice? I can try to help settle on something good.
>>40607759All traditional grimoires on ceremonial magick are religious.
>>40623385>to (very strange) coincidences.Synchronicity is the name of the game in magick. If you are going to discard anything as a coincidence you re not going to succeed. Lon Milo Duquette says it: Assume your magick is working. If you see no result is because you are affecting something you are not seeing.
Of the two things you mention, only the bird one i can say its bullshit. The alice bayley one, however laughable can be, is a classic example of spirits working. That's how they operate, influencing other people. That's how you produce real tangible results.
If you ean to go lolrandom fireball, then i have bad news for you. But if you want to bien a building, a spirit will make a pyromaniac do it.
You can conjure visible spirits, that's why they have a description in grimoires. You can ask them to do things, and you will get them.
>>40627366My intuition on people like Warnock and Opus are they're not very impressive people and as such don't inspire much confidence in whatever magic they're selling. I don't know.
>>40627366>Scandinavia! Home of seidr!Gonna practice Utesitta on the July full Moon! Haven't picked the exact location yet but luckily in western Sweden we have plenty of ancient locations to pick from.
>You are pretty far north, so things may get a bit wonky with the midheavenYou're telling me lol. It's rare to see a charth with the MC in the 10th up here haha.
>The one you posted would be perfect, if only the Moon applied to Jupiter.I might be missing something, but I'm p. sure the Moon is applying? Moon is at 9 Pisces and Jupiter is at 13 Cancer.
>Warnock stuffThat was a different anon, so thanks for the summary! Gonna check if I can find digital versions of these, if I can't I'll have to order one or two of them. The link you posted is from the first book of occult philosophy, so that's about the only thing I alrady have access to haha, but it's convenient to have it on a web-page any how. Come to think of it I'm farily certain I've come across his site before, looking after correpondances.
I'll check out the previous /omg/ threads as well! This discussion has been immensely helpful so far, so I'll have to check in here more often
>>40627374>Exact same situation here. Started with a philosophical search for meaningDo you remember the specific questions? For me it was the metaphysics of music and beauty. I couldn't reconcile the idea that those things were mere epiphenomena of evolutionary pressure, and my personal, almost transcendental experiences regarding beauty. I also managed to fall very deeply in love at that same time, for the first time in my life, which made the questions feel more serious. I realized (far) in retrospect that I must have experienced something akin to the ladder of Beauty in the Symposium, but I got into hermeticism and such before I actually read Plato himself.
>I've become a full blown Neoplatonist. The astrological magic stuff is great for me too because it works well enough with Neoplatonic cosmological and metaphysical viewsAbsolutely based anon. People tend to forget how impoertant Neoplatonism is for astrology, and how important it is just in general.
>The rest I will supplement with whatever I can make work best for me>Hopefully, it works out.I fairly certain it will anon. Just hang in there!
>Like you said, the original Neoplatonic theurgy is largely lost>What kind of approach or method are you gravitating towards?I've done some traditional norse practices, as we can reconstruct some of them and Iamblichus recommends following you particular gods traditional worship. I don't do that too regularly though. I mainly gravitate towarsd meditation and mysticism, but again; I don't have a fixed set of practices here. It's mainly basic mindfullness and breathwork ATM. I have done some energy cultivation, but never stuck to it.
In short, I'd say devotion and meditation. The goal is to experience "beauty itself", or be "alone with the alone" so to speak.
>I can try to help settle on something good.Please do! Again, you've been very helpful so far so I'll consider your recommendations if you have any!
>>40627443>>40627521I think I found you one suitable election, by the way. Pic related. I normally use whole sign houses, but as a Warnock student I use quadrant houses for my talismans (for now). Regiomontanus to the rescue.
My mind nags at me with obscure horary rules, but as far as astrological elections are concerned, this one should be just fine. Jupiter is sufficiently close to the midheaven, and the Moon is applying to a sextile within 3-4 degrees, from the 11th house. No hard aspects, no combustion, no slow planets. Only things that could be improved would be moon phase and Jupiter's separation from the midheaven. Unfortunately the planetary hour restricts how early we can start, but it's still workable. You might find yourself in a bit of a rush though, to finish the creation of the talisman and do the consecration on time. What I would do is get 99% of the work done earlier, and maybe leave a single letter to complete the talisman - do that on the election, and try to get the ritual done fairly hastily. Maybe do a practice run without the talisman first, just to see how much time it would take to go through the ritual itself.
Assuming a very exact geographic location, the election would start at 11:55:09. My recommendation is to maybe wait a bit, perhaps until 11:55:35 (or 40), and then begin as quickly as possible (light the candles, incense, do the carving, then the ritual and the suffumigation). (You can do the water purification before the elected time.) IIRC Warnock's rule was that the astrology becomes unsuitable if the relevant planet is separating from an angle by more than 8 degrees (you can verify that yourself). So the end time is at the latest 12:12:00. I think 12:03 (within 5 degrees) is more preferable, and 11:59 (within 4 degrees) better still.
You can probably continue the ritual and ponder the purpose and do visualisations about it for a bit longer after that, but I'd definitely try to wrap up the invocation and suffumigation in time.
>>40627366>This will give you like 90% of the stuff that he has in his course. In fact, I am pretty sure the course is pieced together from the books.I started his course recently, he gives you his own books, tells you which chapter read when giving you instructions and adds stuff from it, his books are basically course materials for it.
Plus he gives you programs he has made to find good election times in your own zone, I've tested them against astro and they are correct, still haven't tested them in practice with talismans.
His interviews regarding the mentality/mind model the ancient had was really interesting, basically the first lesson is all about that.
>>40627433I don't know who Opus is but Warnock's books and methods are good. I would not necessarily buy his talismans. But his books are good.
From his talismans, I would maybe buy any of his fixed star talismans. But the requirements he uses on his planetary talismans seem pretty lax.
>>40627443>>40627521Oh yes, I might also check for more elections tomorrow. But this is probably enough for today.
>Utesitta I actually don't know what that is! But whatever it is, I hope it goes for the best.
>I might be missing something, but I'm p. sure the Moon is applying? Moon is at 9 Pisces and Jupiter is at 13 Cancer.It is, but it's not the first application, it is the second one. The first is to Venus.
>WarnockTry to get all the books if you can. The first three are definitely indispensible since there is important content scattered across them.
>first book of occult philosophy, so that's about the only thing I alrady have access to hahaI can't remember, are the sigils also there? IIRC they are in the second book. Definitely get the Agrippa sigils, archangel names etc.
>I'll have to check in here more oftenPersonally, I'd be happy to have you. I am normally reluctant to take communications beyond 4chan, but if you drop a discord I could add you, today or tomorrow. You seem to be walking a pretty similar path.
>Do you remember the specific questions?It was the practical problem of the meaning of life. I ended up thinking about it seriously, and naturally stumbled on the matter of spirituality.
Yours is also a very valid and interesting path. I am also reminded of some claims that during the early modern period, with the decline of religion, art and transcendental beauty became the main path to spirituality for Europeans. Which is probably where the inflated reputation of art stems from even today, despite the comparative drop in level.
>>40627443>>40627521>spiritual pathSo you don't have any specific methods that you are attached to, but is there a path you want to go down? For example, if you had to choose between working with energy and developing your energy body, or learning all the spells in the world, or servitor magic, or something along the lines of higher self conjuration (Holy Guardian Angel, Abramelin, etc), or advancing in meditative states. If you prefer, you can start with a goal as well: becoming a Buddha, beelining for enlightenment, prioritising bodily health. Some paths are also more chaotic than others. See what you feel is best.
I should note that most forms of meditation and breathwork operate on the energy body. Personally, I am looking at some basic forms of pranayama right now. I am going to mix that with qi gong as a path to internal alchemy (which leads me to my goal of immortality and enlightenment). Meanwhile, magic and astrological ritual are there to improve my life outcomes and make me feel more connected to the spiritual domain and the cosmic powers. There are also various talismans that can be made for spiritual power and advancement. Finally, astrology itself is a good form of divination to help me know what to expect. This is why I pursue the practices I do. If you have any specific goals, choosing practices becomes easier.
>>40627641>Plus he gives you programs he has made to find good election times in your own zoneThis is not available in my version of the course, is all I can say.
>His interviews regarding the mentality/mind model the ancient had was really interesting, basically the first lesson is all about that.If you are referring to what I think you are referring to, you can probably substitute that with the Tillyard "Elizabethan World Picture" book in the reading list. I have had an interest in magic and the premodern worldview for years now so for me there was little that was new in the worldview lecture.
>>40627684I think that anon mean the Rufus Opus. For me his books are also just kinda meh.
>>40627712Mentioning his full name made me remember that I once saw people discussing his Seven Spheres book. Haven't read it myself. Other people's opinions seemed mixed.
>>40627684>From his talismans, I would maybe buy any of his fixed star talismans.Also here it should say "maybe buy some of his fixed star talismans". After reading De Quindecim Stellis (Warnock's translation, incidentally), I am pretty convinced that the gems are essential for those types of talismans. If I had money to spare and the talisman was made of the right materials, I would probably buy a Pleiades talisman. But as it stands, it would be less than 20% the cost to make that talisman myself and also to include the gem, which Warnock's version does not have.
>>40627598Massive thanks man! I think I'll be able to work through the rush if I do proper prep work. Will probably leave the one number unfinished on the magical square, and finish the rest before hand during the hours of Jupiter. Now I'll just have to look more in to the consecration part. Thanks again!
>>40627684>Utesitta Not to many detailed sources on it, but basically: go to a sacred space, sit in silence from sunset until dawn (utesitta = "sitting out"). Supposed to lead to communion with ancestal spirits. Some details might have been lost here but working with general occult principles I think you could reconstruct those.
>It is, but it's not the first application,Right, that's what I was missing
>I can't remember, are the sigils also there? IIRC they are in the second book. Definitely get the Agrippa sigils, archangel names etc.You're correct, that's the second book. Only have the 2nd and 3rd digitally. But I will still definitely use his designs.
>Personally, I'd be happy to have you.>if you drop a discord I could add you, today or tomorrowFun to hear! I know I've said this a few times now, but generally I expect jack-shit from 4chan, so this conversation has been a pleasant suprise! Feel free to add "hassenatorn" on Discord. Not sure if you need the numbers in the @ nowadays, but I think that should work. Write here if you can't find the profile.
>the meaning of lifeA classic. the sure-fire way to either turn to the divine or get addicted to heroin!
>with the decline of religion, art and transcendental beauty became the main path to spirituality for Europeans.Interesting perspective. Haven't heard that before but it seems to be true, both personally for me and historically.
>>40627710I probably should flesh out specifics my goals and path more. Ultimately speaking it's henosis, but realistically speaking that's a few lifetimes away (at least). The "goal" is something like becoming closer with the divine. Experiencially It's pretty tangable for me when I'm closer to or further away from God/the Gods, but those states are somewhat unpredictable for me.
Practices that attract me so to speak tend to fall on the mystical side. "Experiencing" or "making contact" with the divine. I guess what you call "higher self conjuration" would fall into that, but intuitively I'm leaning more to the meditative side (though I would assume those would mutually reinforce eachother).
>qi gongDaoist prectices intuitivelly interest me, but I have no actual knowledge of them what so ever. I just really like the Dao de Jing lol
>magic and astrological ritual are there to improve my life outcomes and make me feel more connected to the spiritual domain and the cosmic powers.Bog-standard traditional astrology works suprisingly well for that, yes. One of the reasons I'm interested in it is to find my dharma, to borrow from the hindus. It's also a good reassurance to see it working time and time again.
Not sure how well I summarized my thoughts here. They feel a bit disjointed but I hope I cleard it up at least a little bit.
>>40627776>>40627849Also, ignore any weird phrasing. I often go back and re-write previous sentences without fully making sure they fit in with the context lol
do hex or love jars work. I tried both and went ham on the hex one and love one and not sure if they didn anything. i started "watering" the hex one daily after awhile but im not sure that shit works. the love jar is nice though.
hey Iโm curious can anyone tell me the real story of Genesis 6
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logozes23
Going through the self-inititation process in Lyam Thomas Christopher's book. Currently at Zelator grade but today I've been in almost constant ecstasy of just seeing how everything "raises" and "dyis", be it people's complexes reincarnating when they complain for example or just anything happening around.
I call it extremely bliss and beauty. Also ego seems to disappear and rebuild all the time, sometimes seeing that there is just awareness looking at things and no free will for example. While reading a book I had an experience where I felt like I was torn apart in a light but resisted it. The physical world is just shells that are burning and dying constantly and most people confuse the Yetzirah and Assiah without seperating the cross from the subtle. Material world = Qlippoth?
Maybe I'm just delusional or just getting glimpses of what reality really is but at least I am now "initiated" which ultimately means nothing. Feeling extremely bliss and beauty at times and have a plan for future.
None of this shit is real. Grow up.
nigga
md5: 6530357249580582fc78b3727cbf0c95
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>>40628437>goes to /x/ to complain about people discussing /x/ things
>>40598752 (OP)Hey guys, what are you using magic for? Iโm curious as to what are the uses people give to it? I came to the conclusion I do stuff on my dreams that I have no idea what is for, I was just having a beautiful dream (4k vividness and lucidness) where I atended a sort of magick/law school, and used my powers to uncover a killer, used magik to kill the killer and send his soul to the rape dimension, then used a dragon fire spell to burn everything (but only evil people burned) and at the end I saw Hitler and Emma Watson wearing gold and clapping for my victory (they were a couple), woke up fresh as fuckโฆ I think I went full schizo but I feel great.I always have these dreams where I perform tasks, kill enemies and fix stuff.
made a hex jar/s and a love jar.
>hex jar has assholes name in full with acouple signs/sigels.
>also added piss, nails of various size, lots of hand picked rose thorns, dead stuff, some dog shit/etc
>buried in out of way area and vist it daily to dump piss/etc on it and shit talk it
love jar.
>honey, a small gift from her/plants and flowers she likes/roses/my cholone she likes/etc
>keep it buy my bed and talk to it a couple times with afirmations and such
anything else i should do or should i just abandon it all.
>>40627776>>40627849You are welcome! I think the planetary ritual book and the Celestial Way book should have some good information on the altar setup, suffumigations, invocations etc. Warnock's incense recommendations should be somewhere there too.
Agreed with you on reconstructing ritual. Once you've read enough traditional sources and get a feeling for the way to establish magical connections, it is not too hard to fill in the blanks. I think the Neoplatonist doctrines on the world soul, the connection between heaven and earth, and the chain of being also help provide good orientation with these topics.
Sent you a Discord invite just now by the way. Tell me if you didn't receive it.
>Ultimately speaking the goal is henosis, but realistically speaking that's a few lifetimes away (at least).With questions like this, estimated timescales are determined by rationality and the level of pessimism. The really important things are the goals themselves. You may well be able to achieve henosis in this lifetime.
>Practices that attract me so to speak tend to fall on the mystical side.The problem is that these terms have very diverse meanings, so I don't know exactly what you mean by this. The same goes for meditation (there are very many types).
Would this be accurate? You are attracted to mystical/theurgic stuff, which is based on the distinction between the self and the deity, as a way to spiritually vivify and energise your life and give you the connection, attunement and power to chase the great heights of spirituality. At the same time, you also want to realise the divine principle within yourself unitively, united with the self, which is why you are drawn to meditation (with a focus on energy meditation in particular, since it indicates direct and effective connection?)
>>40627776>>40627849For higher self conjuration, ceremonial magic is probably sufficient. Abramelin is probably the big one. I don't know what kind of cultivation/afterlife possibilities that offers though, haven't seen anything on the topic. As far as higher self conjuration goes, there are also other ostensible options besides the Abramelin and Crowley's HGA, some are even astrologically based. But I can't speak for the results, since I haven't used any of these methods.
If you are more concerned about being unable to achieve henosis in this lifetime, I think you could consider something like pure land Buddhism. But I think that with a little bit of luck, that probably won't be necessary.
>DaoismI have some pretty whacky views about Daoism, lol. Neoplatonism, Advaita Vedanta, and Daoism are the paths I hold in highest esteem, and I rank them pretty close to each other. Daoism has great energy techniques, too.
>AstrologyI agree, astrology was one of the things that proved to me materialism is false. Just recently I got into an argument with a talented and forceful speaker, and since I take arguments and truth-seeking seriously, I started questioning the proofs I have. But I have a good few of them at this point, and while the other guy raised good arguments, he could not explain why traditional astrology works so reliably. Having multiple proofs is a great insurance.
In my case, astrology didn't exactly help me find my dharma, but it helped me understand my temperament and the material and mental influences operating in my life. This has helped, and especially combined with magic I hope will help even more, with ordering my life according to my mission and helping make my life suitable to it. This mission being enlightenment.
can you perform black magic without the need of spirits/demons? like cursing someone or changing their fate to the worse
>>40630854yes, you can. black magic is the absence of light
those demons arent the darkness around them.
you can ride the flow of the darkness, like a minnow between sharks
even though your magic will be much lesser, you can escape their gaze
your soul remains intact but if you cast spells improperly you go insane.
>>40630861thanks man, do you have any tips (like books) on where to start? i am particularily interested in chinese magic but i welcome anything you could give me
>>40630918internal alchemy is the best! i love that area of mysticism. to be honest the latest book of black magic i read was cornelius agrippa's books on occult philosophy. thats the classic one
>>40630563>the planetary ritual book and the Celestial WayWill prioritize getting those then!
>reconstructingLuckily for me norse rituals (at least traditional blot) is almost more well preserved than even greek or roman ones. Seidr sadly isn't as far as I can tell. Most info on Seidr seems to be heavily syncretic modern guess work from what I can tell
>Neoplatonist doctrinesThe forms generally make pretty good sense of correspondances as well. Planetary energies could almost be thought of as Logoi which specific objects participate in.
>Sent you a Discord invite just now by the way.Added!
>The problem is that these terms have very diverse meanings, so I don't know exactly what you mean by this.I don't blame you, me neither to a large extent. I have as I've said mainly been interested in the metaphysical side and been somewhat neglecting the practice side. I wish I could be more specific but I genuinelly can't. My knowledge is too scant here and I can't refer to many speficic practices, and the ones I can refer to I generally haven't tried.
>Your entire summaryThat's a pretty good estimantion, yeah. I will add that I do find energy cultivation highly interesting, what makes me apprehensive about that is that that's what I've probably done the most of, and not gained many results. There is one minor exeption, but I can mention that later if it's relevant.
>>40627710>This is not available in my version of the course, is all I can say.Do you have the big course? The one with 13 lessons? If so it's the PMP zip file.
>>40628334>Material world = QlippothNo, this place is Malkuth, the qluppoth is another thing, you would not like to be there.
Liked that book by Lyam, I'll probably start it this or next year, it's a pretty long journey.
>>40630571Btw, I've gotten two adds on Discord, so tell me if I added the correct one. I can add you too, other guy, when I figure out who is who here.
>AbramelinProblem with that is I don't have 9 months to go into hiding lol.
>there are also other ostensible options besides the Abramelin and Crowley's HGAI've heard that the headless rite could be used for that. On a related note, how important is it to actually memorize the entirety of a ritual? That's one of the things that's been holding me back from ceremonial. Memorizing nomina barbara isn't easy lol.
>there are also other ostensible options besides the Abramelin and Crowley's HGA>pure land BuddhismGonna be honest and say I haven't heard of that
>But I think that with a little bit of luck, that probably won't be necessary.Thanks anon. I consider it (at least) a life long project anyhow.
>Daoism, Vedanta, NeoplatonismThay are highly metaphysically similar any how. There's not much I disagree with in Vedanta or Daoism, even though I haven't studied those as deeply.
>I have some pretty whacky views about Daoism, lolI would love to hear them! That's maybe for another time but that's up to you
>Astrology generallyIt's a difficult thing to argue for. Not because of a lack of evidence, but most people just dismiss it instinctively, no matter how many how unlikely "coincidences" you can provide. I think part of the problem is that people who don't understand the rationales behind astrology can't really see how extremely well certain specific placements or transits manifest, and just assume you are reading into things arbitrarily.
>it helped me understand my temperament and the material and mental influences operating in my lifeThat's good to hear, and same here. It's a very good tool to "know thyself".
>>40631106>Most info on Seidr seems to be heavily syncretic modern guess work from what I can tellIn my country it's the opposite, the theological stuff is almost all lost but there's still a continual tradition of village witch magic that's lasted to this day (syncretised with Christianity). I have no connection to it though. My entry was through astrology and Hermetic and occult revival stuff.
>Planetary energies could almost be thought of as Logoi which specific objects participate in.Yes, there is also a tradition of interpreting the sphere of the fixed stars as the place of the symbolic visual representations of the platonic forms themselves. Although things get a bit messy if you dig into the details of it. There are multiple layers of symbolism for the same things in the physical cosmos so I have left a smooth formulation of my views for later. For example, in traditional cosmology you often see the 10th sphere depicted as God, but Sol has a very strong claim too.
>I don't blame you, me neither to a large extent. I have as I've said mainly been interested in the metaphysical side and been somewhat neglecting the practice side.Fair enough. Personally, it took me a very long time to form my personal definitions and understanding of these terms and my understanding is most solid only on the couple of things I have settled on pursuing.
On energy work, I have had some limited results. Cultivation itself has proven challenging. Just recently I was researching the anatomy of the "astral body" more, so that I could approach the issue more precisely; for the foreseeable future my focus will be to clear some energy arteries, basically, and condition my body and read more on the side for future work. Keeping it simple. I may also do chakra meditation but although I think I get results for those, it's hard to evaluate them. So I prefer more qi gong oriented stuff. Pranayama seems simplest so I hope it will carry me where I want to go.
>>40631106>>40631154Some options are also more suitable in certain situations. In my case, I have some time available not but it's hard to guess what the future will be like, so I try to get some preparatory work done on my energy system and then use some radical methods to pursue an accelerated development. For someone with steadier circumstances, steadier methods will probably be better and more suitable.
>I've heard that the headless rite could be used for that.That's the PGM one right? I am not too familiar with it.
>On a related note, how important is it to actually memorize the entirety of a ritual?I am going to be honest. I just read it out. It does take me out of the mystical state a bit, but I am willing to accept that in exchange for knowing I said the whole ritual correctly and also delivering my petition with the exact wording I want it to be delivered. Speaking out loud is a special form of lending life to things, so in my view, just me speaking should generate all the necessary effects and the "reality" the incantations need, regardless of whether I am reading or speaking from memory.
With stuff like the barbarous names etc I don't think it would even be possible to pronounce them correctly without the text in front of you. It seems like a necessity, and I have read at least one account where a magician read a ritual from a scroll.
>I would love to hear them! That's maybe for another time but that's up to youThat would probably take us to a whole other subject, so best leave it for another time.
>AstrologyYes, it requires a bit of instinct to click that there is a logic to how these readings are given. Recently though I have had an easier time talking to people about it, sceptics excluded. With the sceptics, it's a non-starter since they have already dug their heels in.
>Btw, I've gotten two adds on DiscordYep, I can see you on my friend list.
>>40631115>If so it's the PMP zip file.Oh lol I do have it, thanks for telling me.
>>40631235>In my country it's the opposite, the theological stuff is almost all lost but there's still a continual tradition of village witch magic that's lasted to this dayThat's cool! Where are you from, if you don't mind me asking? I do think nordic folk traditions are more well-preserved in Iceland, but here they are almost non-existant.
>astrology and formsYeah I don't think you could do a one-to-one mapping of the forms/noetic beings to specific constellations or planets. "All is in all but appropriately in each" and all that. But I think it does make sense that the symbology and energies in the spheres are more unified than on earth, more unified in the logoi than in the spheres, more in the nous than in the logoi, etc.
>in traditional cosmology you often see the 10th sphere depicted as GodThe Empyrean, right? I think the 9th represents God in some Hermetica as well
>Sol has a very strong claim tooPersonally I'd say he has the best claim, but I'm biased since you're basically a Sun worshipper by default if you live up north.
>it took me a very long time to form my personal definitions and understanding of these termsSame here. I'm a pretty mercurial person and came into this from an atheist background, so getting a good understening of the philosophy of it all has been important for me. It's just quite recently I've been able to orient myself in my worldview. Henc why I've kept the practices pretty exoteric and minimalistic.
>qi gong>PranayamaWill have to look into those more. I have been interested in them before but never studied indepth at all.
>>40631238>That's the PGM one right? I am not too familiar with it.Yeah, Crowley remade it into the the Bornless rite. I believe it's an exorcism to begin with, but it's highly adaptable from what I've heard.
>I am going to be honest. I just read it out. >I have read at least one account where a magician read a ritual from a scroll.I thought so. Certain things you can memorize, like shorter prayers and such but entire several page rituals with Barbarous names seems impossible to do that with. Perhaps the ancients could, but modern people aren't on their level of memory. And reciting from magical scrolls must be a trope for a reason. It's a common idea and it can't come from nowhere.
>Yes, it requires a bit of instinct to click that there is a logic to how these readings are givenWhen I explain it, or the few times I've done readings for people I always make a point of at least briefly explaining the reasoning behind the correspondances. Otherwise I can see why people would get confused. It actually is pretty intuitive once you get a good hang of the basics, though that is also the most difficult thing to get a hang of in some sense.
>>40631154>when I figure out who is who here.I'm
>>40631115 the guy that was working on the vanus talisman a few days ago, you are not the guy that was answering my questions there, right? Let's just add each others, since we are now working on talismans.
My discord name starts with Va and ends with "m".
Anyway this night I'll be making my venus talisman, I think I'll burn some rose petals, maybe I'll find something better before the time comes.
>>40631238Regarding the headless, yeah I've used a small text as well, it still works, certified by anon (and tons of other occultists).
>>40631434>you are not the guy that was answering my questions there, rightNo lol, I'm in no position to answer questions on Talismans. But I'll add you! As I said, just needed to figure out which anon was which.
>Anyway this night I'll be making my venus talismanI wish you luck in that case!
>>40631395>>40631418>Where are you from, if you don't mind me asking?I'm open to talking about it, but for now I probably won't share it openly on the forum.
>The Empyrean, right? I think the 9th represents God in some Hermetica as wellThe terminology is used variably by different sources. I think in the ancient account of things, the Empyrean should be the sphere of the fixed stars (8th sphere). But in Dante's poetry, it is AFAIK the highest heaven, the heart of heaven. In the early modern/medieval account they also placed the primum mobile as the 9th sphere, hence why I named God as the 10th sphere, assuming that God would be placed on a higher sphere still, although now that I think about it I think Christians identified God with the prime mover, so they would probably still be using the 9th sphere.
>SolI would say the symbolism is an opposition between what is highest (the 9th/10th sphere which is significantly above the Sun) and what is most central and the source of light-reason (which is the Sun). An argument could be made for both, and honestly, probably both are true simultaneously on an occult level. It just makes things harder to systematise.
>Will have to look into those more. I have been interested in them before but never studied indepth at all.I am not very familiar with pranayama either, but it was recommended to me as a practice where one or two simple techniques could provide the preparation I am looking for.
>Perhaps the ancients could, but modern people aren't on their level of memory. There are spells for memory too, so you could perhaps try that. I don't think I will be exploring that option for a long time to come still.
>>40631434>I'm >>40631115 the guy that was working on the vanus talisman a few days ago, you are not the guy that was answering my questions there, right?That was probably me, actually. I think I have answered most or all of the talisman related questions for the past few threads.
>>40631434Also, roses are a good cool. If you have time, I'd say get some rose stick incense. Make sure you have a candle setup as well.
Rose petals fit Venus well, just remember that you need smoke for the suffumigation and need to put the talisman in that smoke. No smoke, no talisman. Doesn't have to be a lot of smoke. But putting the talisman in the smoke is a required part of the consecration.
>>40631434>>40631675>roses are a good coolI think that's supposed to be "good call". Don't ask me how that happened. Probably due to lack of sleep.
>>40631675>>40631681Ok, now is it my impression or is Venus conjunct with the South Node and really close to Algol?
Because if it is so the program of the course has a really big blindspot.
Anyway as I said to H. add me so we can talk normally, I'm V..
>>40631800If the program fetches good elections according to the other conditions, sorting out the occasional dud is not an issue IMO.
And yes, that Venus is pretty exactly conjunct Algol, with the Moon right on the South Node.
>>40629171Sell it on etsy
chair
md5: 3f792c9a2bd88ddb31ffe09a8e4dacee
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>>40631831F U C K
Checked all possible timing this year with a good moon according to the program and Algol is always RIGHT THERE!
There is apparently a good one next year.
>>40631869Have you checked Libra Venus elections too?
>>40631873The program did not find a single one regarding Libra, so they are all probably with an afflicted Moon and/or not in the planetary hour. I'll check by hand a bit.
>>40631885Well, I hope you can find some good Venus elections anyway.
>>40631915No, I checked all the month of this year for the Libra election, could not find nothing.
So apparently the program works in that regard.
Moved on to Jupiter, look at this sweet election.
Only apparent problem is Moon trine with Saturn, but dunno if that counts for anything, besides there is conjunction between Venus, Moon and Jupiter, getting all that benefic influence ahaah.
>>40630934thanks, I have it here as well but man it really doesnt speak to me
>>40611937I accidentally made things worse, but I donโt care anymore. Because i donโt have the luxury of Hermes to be able share the knowledge with his 2 children. Anyways clue: this picture shows what everyone has inside them, but you have to know how to rearrange them and double check even triple check otherwise youโll messed up, also best to prepare the chemicals/potions before hand because mixing them in your mouth have consequences. Iโm saddened that I donโt have a student I can teach. Donโt bother requesting to be my student because I have misplaced my brain today, still donโt know how to reverse such a mistake. Iโm going to delete the rest of data from my phone.
>>40632211No, that's not the only problem.
1. Presumably this is a Jupiter talisman, but the Moon is applying to Venus instead of Jupiter.
2. Mars is exactly conjunct the ascendant.
The second problem is a very major issue with the election.
>>40631624>Christians identified God with the prime mover, so they would probably still be using the 9th sphere. No I think youre right in your first assesment. I regonize the 10th sphere as God as well. Was thinkng of the Ogdoad Reveals the Ennead from the Nag Hammadi library. As far as I'm aware that's the main place he's in the 9th
>most central and the source of light-reason (which is the Sun). An argument could be made for both, and honestly, probably both are true simultaneously on an occult level.This is probably the correct interpretaion. I tend to lean more towards the Sun because 1. The lifegiving power of the sun is PALPABLE up north since it's gone half the year 2. Plato usually represents him with the Sun 3. the Egyptians are cool lol
>>40632720I think the 9th can also make sense, but it depends on how you classify it.
>This is probably the correct interpretaion. I tend to lean more towards the Sun because 1. The lifegiving power of the sun is PALPABLE up north since it's gone half the year 2. Plato usually represents him with the Sun 3. the Egyptians are cool lolLOL.
I tend to default to the sun as well, since the sun is so much more, well... visible to the local cosmos. Of course, technically speaking the sun, as a part of the whole, cannot be the supreme principle. But it can act as a symbol for the supreme principle, and in some versions of Neoplatonic theurgy (as that practiced by Julian), it is a kind of embodiment of the One. In my view, it is the best symbol for the One/the Intellect. Although I think the Intellect is also well represented by the 8th sphere, as I mentioned earlier. There is a kind of doubling of symbolism.
>>40632752>technically speaking the sun, as a part of the whole, cannot be the supreme principleIn my view, it is the best symbol for the One/the Intellect.
My view as well. It can also serve as a symbol of the Monad as opposed to the Lunar Dyad, but depending on which Platonist you're reading the One and the Monad can be the same thing any way. I tend to lean towards the One being beyond the Monad and Dyad but these are very fine distinctions.
>There is a kind of doubling of symbolismThe fun thing with symbolism is that there almost never is one solitary perfect symbol. If there was, the symbol would just be what it symbolised. The Sun as a symbol captures unity, grandeur, beauty, emanation (in it's rays), etc. The highest celestial sphere (which ever one we're going with for the sake of discussion) symbolises trancendance and totality and so on.
>>40632811>My view as well. It can also serve as a symbol of the Monad as opposed to the Lunar Dyad, but depending on which Platonist you're reading the One and the Monad can be the same thing any way. I tend to lean towards the One being beyond the Monad and Dyad but these are very fine distinctions.I agree. In my case, I associate the Sun both with the One and the Intellect, although honouring the Sun as the One would require some special considerations. I view the Moon as the symbol for the World Soul.
>The fun thing with symbolism is that there almost never is one solitary perfect symbol.True! Although that can problematise systematisation, and also theurgy. But it's not an irresolvable problem, especially from a purely practical perspective.
>>40633007>although honouring the Sun as the One would require some special considerationsI'm not sure "honouring the One" stricly speaking even makes sense, at least in a ritual context. I think the Hermeticists probably were right when they said the most appropriate way to honour God is with silence. I'm fairly certain parts of the Christian mystical traditions agree with this as well.
>I view the Moon as the symbol for the World Soul.On a tangential note I think I should pick up some Moon-veneration practice. I don't really have a particular reason to (out side of everything in the celestial hierarchy being worthy of veneration), I just want to. The Moon is truly beautiful.
>True! Although that can problematise systematisation, and also theurgy. But it's not an irresolvable problem, especially from a purely practical perspective.I'd imagine it could almost make it a bit easier some some respect, right? Sure, it makes systematisation more difficult, but practically speaking one thing having more valid correspondances is a practical boon. It also makes composing prayers easier if your poetically inclined in that, since you get more symbolism to work with.
I've tried composing prayers in traditional scaldic style before, and the more things to alliterate with the better lol.
>>40631836sucks. the hex one sorta helped with just getting some of the anger out at least but now its living rent free in my mind and i feel "compeled" to "water" it. i dislike this dude but i can't let it eat my brain. i like the lady more then i hate the dude. is there any kinda stuff to help with the lady stuff or at least not fuck my brain up?
>>40624894>Is it missing anything?And how!
Oh, you mean from the original Mega. No, I don't think it is.
>>40633062>I'm not sure "honouring the One" stricly speaking even makes sense, at least in a ritual context.I generally agree, the Intellect/Sol is probably a better candidate for ritual worship than the One. But IMO the one can also be worshipped. I like to think of the One as being "beyond qualities" rather than as having no qualities. And the former still leaves a lot of room for an essence and power that are simply incomprehensible from a human perspective but otherwise very real. With the right attitude and considerations, a ritual would be possible, but silent prayer or contemplation would probably be more suitable than ritual worship.
One thing that I can certainly say is that without the ability to be silent, there can be no henosis. I definitely agree with that, at least.
>On a tangential note I think I should pick up some Moon-veneration practice. I don't really have a particular reason to (out side of everything in the celestial hierarchy being worthy of veneration), I just want to. The Moon is truly beautiful.I agree, I think that just looking at the Moon can induce spiritual states given the right attitude. Personally, I pray to Moon as the power and intellect of the cosmos not too infrequently. Particularly in matters of magic and divination.
>I've tried composing prayers in traditional scaldic style before, and the more things to alliterate with the better lol.I can't write poetry but I have tried writing something reminiscent to prose poems. I am relatively pleased with those, though I have found no ritual use for them yet.
I miss Vajranon. Hopefully the buddhistbros comeback since /bg/ is dead too.
>>40598752 (OP)Aren't goetic spirits the same as Djinns who were captured on a bronce jar by Sulayman king according to Alf Laylah wa-Laylah?
>>40633842>>40633842>And the former still leaves a lot of room for an essence and power that are simply incomprehensible from a human perspective but otherwise very realThe One is also beyond essence though. It's still a bit unclear to me what exactly is meant by "beyond being", but I tend to take Ousia in that context to mean precisely essence, essence meaning "that which makes something what it is" (or something to that effect. To be fair, I of course don't think there is anything wrong or illicit with worshiping the One. I just don't know exactly what worshiping that which is utterly beyond all, even noetic, comprehension would look like. Even when monotheists refer to God, I take it they usually mean the Nous/intellect or the entire divine order, but my Polytheist leanings might shine through here a bit.
>One thing that I can certainly say is that without the ability to be silent, there can be no henosis. I definitely agree with that, at least.100% agree. Most of my meditative practice so far has been aimed at cultivating inner silence.
>I agree, I think that just looking at the Moon can induce spiritual states given the right attitudeThat has happened to me a few times. Lovely experiences.
>Personally, I pray to Moon as the power and intellect of the cosmos not too infrequentlyGonna have to start doing that as well.
>I can't write poetry but I have tried writing something reminiscent to prose poems. I am relatively pleased with those, though I have found no ritual use for them yet.Offering them to the Gods is traditionally seen as valid. I'm not to good at poetry either but I think it adds a nice effect to write prayers in verse.
>>40633436I don't know, man. The way you described your methods for the hex jar just sounds like it's halfway a witchbottle. I wouldn't have introduced my own biosamples in it. I would've put the target's biosamples along with graveyard dirt. I don't see the sense of putting your markers into the magic such that it loops back to you.
>>40634636NTA but would that also apply to his "love jar"?
>>40634656Well for the love jar I would have used my own biosamples and combined it with the target's. You can use graveyard dirt, or employ some kind of "slander spell" a la PGM. Working in some appropriate planetary day/hour timing together with moon phases, etc etc.
>>40634668Ooh like combining her hair with your hair or something?
That actually makes some sense although I wouldn't ever use it.
>>40634738I used some gifts from her for that. She got a tiny frog for my windshield. Donโt have any bio waste from her or anything.
>>40634636I donโt have anything directly from him at all. I read that urine/etc is a good fuck you birthday Iโd be curious to see what works better.
>>40635442>I read that urine/etc is a good fuck you birthdayEh... I wouldn't include MY own markers in a hex spell is what I'm saying. If I do make a hex jar and the target is some asshole (other than me huehue), why would I include my own urine in there? The hex would just as likely come back to me. That's all I'm saying. If you have some other rationale and you're more compelled by it, then fine. I have no need to convert you to my religion or whatever fuckshit lol. You do what you wanna do. But the thing with hexes or even love spells or any other magic, you gotta watch you don't form an obsession. Gotta know when to do a Buddha and just letggo dat shit. If you're obsessed with "watering" it, that's no good for you.
>>40635442>I donโt have anything directly from him at allSome image of him with his name written on it would work.
From where shall I start reading if I seek money wealth and material prosperity?
Thanks in advance
>>40635484Yeah. Thatโs the whole thing. At first it was genuinely pretty good for my mental health because I got it out of my system. But now itโs burrowed in my brain. Meanwhile love jar is fine and healthy. Iโm gonna try focusing on that one.
>>40635531Been using paper with his full name on it
>>40635683Mmm... how unique is his name really?
Between one John A Smith and another John B Smith.
I know is weird to think of magic as an exercise in multiple redundancies.
But an image of him with his name would just be more precise.
Maybe that's why the other anon is wholly sold on using biological materials.
>>40635871Itโs pretty unique name and all the pics of him have family of him and I have no issue with them.
>>40633886I'm still here. I haven't had much to talk about in regards to my Buddhist practice, but I'm still plugging away
>>40633769no, the most recent one
wish i could have saved the mega, that was well over 13 years old and my ssd backup stopped working years ago
anyway, I'm deleting everything unless anyone needs something else
Black holes arent real or observed right? Just theory? Doesnt believing in such a concept mess with reality
>>40634533>the OneI guess to put it another way, I view the one as fully transcendent, so it doesn't have any traits or elements that can be found within the cosmos or the Intellect - these latter are its products, so they cannot characterise it. But I can't rule out that the One may have its own mysterious - maybe not being, but a kind of "super being", beyond-beingness. Connecting with the one would be akin to connecting to pure transcendent reality. This occurs fully when henosis is achieved, but I think it may be possible to take small steps towards it outside henosis as well. That's my view. But it's certainly just one perspective among many.
Personally, I don't see myself as a polytheist because I feel that the term "polytheism" implies a kind of individualism within the grand hierarchy. None of the gods are separate from the divine order generated by the Great God, the One; each has its own power and honour while remaining a subordinate principle in the great whole.
>>40636041Not him, but what has your Buddhism journey been like?
It doesn't end. Existence is Now, forever.
Anyone have any resources on the links between gnosticism and the Solomonic grimoires?
Do any sigils or etc work for helping a lady get a spark for me or anything like that. Maybe to empower the jar
Remember to do your meditation today.
>>40639182If meditation is so important why no older grimoire mentions it?
>Grimorium Veru,? No>Red Dragon? Nope>Key of Solomon? Nuh-uh>Grimoire of pope honorious? nada
>>40639432>>Grimoire of pope honorious? nadaYou are telling me a Pope wrote this grimoire...?
>>40639556>Grimoire of Honorius was described by A.E. Waite as "perhaps the most frankly diabolical of the Rituals connected with Black Magic." In deals directly with the most hated and feared of demons found within Judeo-Christian traditions, such as Lucifer and Astaroth. In addition, its reputation was built up by famed Nineteenth Century French occultist Eliphas Levi, who described it as horrible, wicked, and profane. Honorius amalgamates elements from other grimoires, such as the Key of Solomon, with Catholic priestly ritual. The result is truly bizarre. I believe its compiler was merely trying to cash in on the notoriety of the authentic 13th century grimoire, The Sworn Book of Honorius.https://www.esotericarchives.com/solomon/grimhono.htm
should I write ape an email and ask him about a specific question where i cant find answers in the library? does anyone know if he answers?
I think southern hemisphere zodiac signs are wrong because the seasons are different there.
Like, scorpio should be taurus and taurus should be scorpio, etc.
Then people there are born with the qualities of taurus in october-november etc, but identify as scorpio because of reading about astrology, so they get everything wrong about themselves. E.g., being strong-disciplined like taurus but identifying as being weak-wise like scorpio.
>>40639854>a specific question where i cant find answers in the libraryI mean, you could just ask us, someone else might have the answer. Or is it specifically about the library?
It's not like it's entirely comprehensive.
>>40637681>I can't rule out that the One may have its own mysterious - maybe not being, but a kind of "super being", beyond-beingness. Connecting with the one would be akin to connecting to pure transcendent realityThis is absolutely fair enough. And yes, if we take henosis to be possible at all you have to be able to "connect" to the One is some way or other. The philosophers differ a bit on this, but Plotinus at least claims it is very emphatically.
>Personally, I don't see myself as a polytheist because I feel that the term "polytheism" implies a kind of individualism within the grand hierarchy. None of the gods are separate from the divine order generated by the Great God, the One; each has its own power and honour while remaining a subordinate principle in the great whole.I basically agree with every thing you said here, and in an emanationist metaphysics I don't think the question between mono-and polytheism even is that relevant. Both agree on a unitary transcendant principle and a succesion of less unified principles. I guess the difference for me is that I don't think polytheism implies individualism in that sense. The Gods are subordinate to yet higher Gods and ultimately to the One, and they reflect eachother in their activities and their essences depend on each other. But they are still particular Noetic or Henadic beings though in my view, and as such are worthy of worship. Especially if you take the Proclean view that everything in the cosmos is suspended from the chain of a particular Henad.
I do also feel a personal draw to particular pagan Gods, and it seems demeaning to recast them as angels or daimonia.
>>40633886I hope they stay gone, pajeet shit needs to fuck off
>>40640771>I guess the difference for me is that I don't think polytheism implies individualism in that sense. The Gods are subordinate to yet higher Gods and ultimately to the One, and they reflect eachother in their activities and their essences depend on each other. If that is polytheism, then I am most certainly a polytheist.
>I do also feel a personal draw to particular pagan Gods, and it seems demeaning to recast them as angels or daimonia.Very much agreed, although the difference between gods and angels can be a bit obscure. For example, Seraphim exist on an extremely high level in the angelic hierarchy and are described as singing praise to God in his immediate vicinity. This would make them emanations that are extremely close to the Intellect, and therefore I would classify them as gods. In pagan faiths, I would probably say that any entity that is not an intermediary would also be more accurately referred to as a god than a daimon.
>>40639432They tell you how to do the rituals, but they donโt tell you how to do the magic
>>40640955>https://youtu.be/1SZO-RBYs34?t=1021>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1JHKJ-OB9Ds
>>40640871>If that is polytheism, then I am most certainly a polytheist. That is at least the sense in which the philosphers were plotheists. There are pagans that disagree with this to be fair, but they tend to be either 1. "hard" polytheists 2. mythical literalists, or 3. crypto-materialists, which makes their opinions on anything theological worthless to begin with. Hard polytheism would imply either multiples independant grounds of reality (multiple Ones, basically), or a basically chaotic first principle. Both of which are untenable.
>although the difference between gods and angels can be a bit obscureAbsolutely. As far as I can tell this is basically up to christians, Pseudo-Dionysius in particular subsituting the word "Gods" with the word "angels" but keeping the same traditional metaphysical system of emanations by similarity. I will mention that I don't think that's a totally invalid move, but to me it's largely a semantic difference. In Dionysius in particular it's very clear that he simply corresponded the ranks of angels to Proclus' theological scheme (Seraphim, Ophanim and Cherubim I believe corresponding to the highest Noetic triad).
One actual difference between mono and polytheism would be that angels probably wouldn't be seen as being of any cosmogonic signifigance, as all is created directly by God. I think this is a point in favor of polytheism, since it retains the scheme of creation by similarity.
>In pagan faiths, I would probably say that any entity that is not an intermediary would also be more accurately referred to as a god than a daimon.This is my view. I'm fairly certain both Daimon and Angelos mean "messenger" as well.
One potential meta
>>40641081>One potential metaIgnore that lol. I'm retarded and forgot to delete some thought I didn't bother to finish
>>40639432My dude, what do you think all those excessive prayers are?
Lived under Thelema for a few years.
It really helped me turn my life around, got a AAS a few months back: Unsure if I could have pushed through some of the harder courses without the law.
I do think, however, that living with Thelema - and always being driven by the sole, singular goal of fulfilling your True Will is inherently dangerous to a degree? At the least, it doesn't necessarily guarantee a life of happiness.
It doesn't really offer you room for failure. It doesn't give room for doubt - it doesn't give room for the human experience. Either you are pursuing your True Will and living by a rightful means, or you are one of the charlatans Crowley talks about in Liber 4.
I know Crowley himself lived a life of sin, and lived a life of relative failure despite his wants and goals in life. (Thelema is, after all, mostly 'aspirational'--rather then 'inspirational')
Has anyone here actually followed through and practiced the tenants of magick-as-philosophy as I am talking about? I have seen a extreme amount of larpers on /x/ over the last few years (Mostly kids wanting to summon demons).
It's sad to see people not actually engage with the works that Crowley wrote sincerely.
>>40611469Magic(k) is the force of action in the world. In physics, this is seen as a fundamental quality that defines the dynamics of 'the system' (Everything).
Our world is made of action, and inherently operates by rules as ordained by the first mover.
To perform 'Magic(k) that contradicts known reality', you have to perform a action that contradicts all of the action that has proceeded you, and all of the action that will follow you.
Phenomenon and action collapse into the most likely or neutral state. There is a reason that people don't spontaneously unravel into accordions: There is no reason for it.
If contradictions (Paradoxes) are to occur, then mathematically its more likely that such faults of logic are to be smaller, rather then larger.
>>40627433I know Opus personally and your read on him is pretty correct. He's definitely trained and someone you can learn magic from but his results aren't the most impressive and you will outgrow him if you have more ambition.
Warnock however is pretty solid materially. He's probably the leading authority on astrological magic alive, definitely a torchbearer for *tradition*, and he's used it to live a pretty successful worldly life as well. He's a lawyer and materially pretty well off while still having an incredible output of material within the occult. I will say though he's not the most innovative/creative wizard as he's very by the book and into the established tradition. When looking at wizards to learn from you want to see if they are not only authorities on magic but have success in a different field as well as material success. Then those who excel at creativity on top of this are how you get Agrippas, Barretts, Ficinos etc etc. Career occultists, as in, all they do is write about occultism and talk about occultism are bad wizards as they aren't capable of using their magic for anything outside the very small cottage industry that is the modern occult. Warnock meets the criteria so a good wizard.
>>40642083I think the word tradition would have been better rendered in quotation marks. I think of him more a revivalist, the way JSK was kinda sorta a grimoire "traditionalist" until he starts mixing lodge magic methods into GV stuff. Plus, I know quite a few millionaire lawyers who also specialize in ***small claims and appellate litigation landlord tenant law*** without ever having practiced magic. But I get your point about magicians whose magic only seem to be about selling magic. Does anyone know if Liana Saif ever finished working on the Ghayat Al Hakim?
>>40636041Oh shit, that's cool. You and ape really helped me out with questions when I was started taking Buddhism more seriously. I just recently started going to a tibetan buddhist dharma center near me the past couple of months for public Shamata sessions since I have to wait until August to onboard as a student. It looks like they do have connections with authentic lamas, but I guess I won't know how serious the juice is until I get deeper into the organization.
Sometimes I feel a bit discouraged because I come across the 'anything but Theravada is heresy' people or the early Buddhist purists that take ascetic withdrawal from ordinary life and the sense pleasures as the only true path. But I guess I'll only ever truly know after I commit to a Vajrayana saddhana and see for myself, while continuing trying to keep the 5 precepts/Sila and basic shamata/vipassana/metta practice.
>>40641994In what sense does that make it "magic," then, if you can't do something magical?
>>40598752 (OP)Hello anons
I'm a novice witch/sorcerer or whatever you call it, I did my connection somewhat recently and I wanted to come here and ask what does my birth chart says in terms of the occult, Magick and all that's related.
Recently I got into tarot and someone that has a lot more experience than me told me I got something going on in terms of divination or sensitivity, but I wanted to see if there's some secrets on my chart if there's anyone that knows about it
Thanks in advance btw
>>40643377Everything has, and is, Magic(k). Liber 4 outlines this pretty concretely.
If you look to the Feynman path integral model (for Quantum Mechanics), every transitory particle curve ('Action', or 'Magic(k)') has in it the whole sum of possible curves that that particle could move, it's just decided to settle into a more likely orientation, as the less likely outcomes (Paradoxes) annihilate eachother and cancel eachother out.
To be a Magician (under Thelema) is really a mechanism by which we can manipulate our own Magic(k) to attain the place in the world we want.
Modern science doesn't preclude 'magical occurrences' (Ridiculous, one-off anomalies), it's merely that during particle transition those events are found to be exponentially less likely then actions that are sensible through existing systems that follow cause-and-effect.
Theoretically, you could hold out your hand and a Fireball could appear in your hand through spontaneous quantum noise. It just would have the same likelihood as a Boltzmann brain appearing in your hand, or anything else absurd. Those 'impossibilities' are usually destroyed by our universe before they come into existence.
>>40641081>Absolutely. As far as I can tell this is basically up to christians, Pseudo-Dionysius in particular subsituting the word "Gods" with the word "angels" but keeping the same traditional metaphysical system of emanations by similarity. I will mention that I don't think that's a totally invalid move, but to me it's largely a semantic difference.>One actual difference between mono and polytheism would be that angels probably wouldn't be seen as being of any cosmogonic signifigance, as all is created directly by God. I think this is a point in favor of polytheism, since it retains the scheme of creation by similarity.Agreed.
Seems like we have brought this conversation to a conclusion as well. Very nice chat, thank you.
>>40643442You have L3 conjunct the ascendant and Mercury is in good dignity, which will probably give you talent at divination.
In your case I would look to L9 for magic and that's less prominent, it's still in the 1st whole sign house but it's separating from the ascendant by 14 degrees and is also under the beams of the Sun.
Jupiter is in an Air sign which may assist further with divination but be less helpful for psychic or magical activities.
Still, I would say you have above average aptitude for magic and good ability for divination.
>>40640579no its specifically about practice, I asked here a few threads ago but did not get a satisfying answer, but i also donnt want to spam the threads with the same question over and over again
>>40642174dhammahub in youtube is pretty nice.
>>40644188>Seems like we have brought this conversation to a conclusion as well. Very nice chat, thank you.Thank you as well! I've enjoyed this discussion very much. I'll see you around and post occasional updates on the Jupiter talisman.
>>40644188>442Thanks a lot for your help anon! Will keep it in mind
Does anyone know a good, preferably traditional source on the meaning of the different geometrical shapes and symbols?
Circles are great for protection, pentagrams for control and command. What about the other ones? Nonagrams? Octagrams? Anyone written on this? All I can find is Agrippa basically saying "it's complicated".
940
md5: f7972d53bc0520df6e3283eea9381cfb
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>get 90% of the way through a spell
>the next ingredient I need is an incredibly toxic planet that is hard to source and even harder to use safely
wow... so this is the power of grimoires...
>subscription paywall
>bite the bullet
>there's a course progress limit that forces you to stay on the subscription for much longer than necessary if you want to access the content
>>40647528Looks like this is what you need
>>40647949Anything like that is probably a scam teaching stuff you could easily learn from books
>>40647528Sourcing the weird stuff is part of the fun. At least try to figure out why it's being used before substituting it. E.g. nettles are martial because they sting; they don't sting because they're martial.
>>40648132Oh that looks pretty good, actually. I only know of this one.
>>40650466Honestly, I don't even want to try to substitute it. I don't know if it would produce a similar effect, when in this case I want a very exact and specific effect. I may try doing more research on this plant and see if I can handle it properly. If I cut it into little bits and seal them in glue it should probably be safe. Probably. Just gotta make sure it's safe to cut too.
>>40647949>>subscription paywall>>bite the bulletshiggy
>>40648141>>40652031The guy is legit though and has valuable knowledge. He's just extremely annoying about it.
Hey anons. I'm interested in making a birth chart for myself and maybe my family members, but โ since I learned to read from pornographic magazines I found in public restrooms โ I'm getting filtered by all the autism. Is there a good and reliable piece of software I could use? I've used https://astro.cafeastrology.com/ before, but it feels like something from a women's magazine. Any recommendations?
>>40652077What course are you talking about?
>>40652227It's Damo Mitchell's fucking Nei Gong course. It unlocks one lesson per week and there's like 300 of them. You literally have to stay subscribed for 300 weeks. That's a minimum of 3000 dollars assuming constant uninterrupted progress through the course.
I think I may stick with it for about three months to unlock some of the juiciest stuff and then drop it.
has anyone used or worked with pic related? is it good for beginners?
>>40652605damn that sucks, was interested in his book and courses as well
>>40652896>damn that sucks, was interested in his book and courses as wellThe books are great, definitely worth reading. It is probably also worth it to subscribe to his course for between one to three months, learn the content of the first few sections of the nei gong course and also learn all the content to the open courses that are not time-limited. He's got a few of those - qi gong, dao yin, breathing etc.
>>40598752 (OP)I callled out to the demons from the books to appear but nothing ever happened.
Did I not call out long enough how many hours do I have to call out?
Why can no one make a photo of these supposed demons when they appear?
>>40603222looks fancy and useless
>>40611469yeah that is where I am at. I am starting to think magic is all bullshit and psychology
look at traditional shamans, a dude who smokes toxic plants and puts on funny cloths and changes his voice and pretends to be possessed by supposedly powerful spirits.
spirits who in their stories/myths appear physically and visibly like as real as a tree or a rock, but somehow even though these same spirits supposedly want to communicate, they never appear or speak clearly, no no.. they need to "possess" the shaman.
man it's all so tiresome
>>40653007>The books are great, definitely worth reading. It is probably also worth it to subscribe to his course for between one to three monthsthats good to hear because im on a search to find some good teacher for qigong and neidan, at least for the basics. I really want to perform magic I just dont want to relly on spirits/demons
>>40636379My external SSD broke too, I've recently been using a thumb drive for my new library. I feel like I'm still missing a bit, but it touches many more subjects. Ape's library was the original foundation though, for sure.
>anyway, I'm deleting everything unless anyone needs something elseWhy would you delete everything?
>>40644202Just go ahead and do it.
>>40653121>look at traditional shamans, a dude who smokes toxic plants and puts on funny cloths and changes his voice and pretends to be possessed by supposedly powerful spirits.Yeah, if I take a handful of magic mushrooms I'll probably see spirits too.
I just want magic to be real, you guys.
>>40652605idk dude... whether or not he's legit, i just don't much care for manipulation like a "course progress limit"
>>40653650>I just want magic to be real, you guys.me too... me too..
but lets keep our critical thinking and lets not get lost in wishful thinking
My life is gay as fuck, depressed, broke, cant sleep at night, cant wake up in the morning, overall im unlucky as fuck, uncapable of finding love. I used to be so fucking great, had a gf, good grades, my dick worked perfectly, i had hopes and dreams and one day all of a sudden everything got fucked, i lost everything, im uncapable of inventing or imagining a way to make money, i have bad grades, etc.
What the fuck can i do to aleviate this cursed fucking shit life, im not asking to win the lotto or marry Sydney Sweeney, i just to catch a fucking break. Even if it mean getting fucked in the ass by lucifer himself, God doesn't seem to give a shit about me either, he killed my fucking dog for no good reason recently. I honestly feel like im curse, but i dont have the balls to killmyself for now, as long as my mom is alive. What the fuck should i do? some fucking exorcism or whatever?
>>40655982You are still in school, so you should probably give yourself time, try therapy, and try to get enough motivation juice to keep you working away at your studies.
This doesn't seem like a magic related problem.
>>40656933Sorry I was crying while typing this shit yesterday. I was hoping for some ritual/work/procedure to either help my gay ass situation, idk maybe some luck or some way to attract those things that i yearn for. Or, worst case scenario, some sort of procedure to โshieldโ my mind from the negativity or whatever, sometimes my anger and my desperation makes me wanna hurt myself and others, wish I could control that a bit.
>>40657261From the sound of it, you are young. Unmanageable highs and lows are normal for young people. This is why I said to give yourself time. You may not see that as a useful recommendation right now, but time really is very powerful.
Most of your problems may have non-magical solutions as the most common sense option. For example, try getting in touch with administrative and support staff at your university/school. This can be helpful.
There are many forms of meditation suitable for creating calm and peace. Virtually any calming breath meditation that is performed with correct posture will do this. A one minute meditation is enough to reset my nervous system and get rid of any excitement, agitation, sadness, confused thinking, and so on. Longer stretches of meditation are more effective and have a longer lasting effect. If you are interested, I can try to find something specific for you.
>idk maybe some luck or some way to attract those things that i yearn forWhat are those things?
y05
md5: 0ba173daee98ae1a1c48aaffca347053
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Does anything about stuff like this feature in some kind or genre of book, at least?
>>40646083 Can it be found in sacred geometry books? Any recommendations?
>chiron under sun sign on natal chart
That can't be good, now can it?
jjk3
md5: 9ee0fbfa6c60aa0c4aae0016dba4448d
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>>40658773I don't believe in Chiron.
>>40658848Why? Genuine question, new to this...
jjk12
md5: d6c03d1029be7ebdbb3508a6bdef3ea3
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>>40658848It's just an asteroid.
>>40659083>>40659103That was meant for you whoops.
Ifa Odu : Voudon Gnostic : Lacan : VGW Sex Magick
Irete : Sun in Aries : JA : Prostate
Okanran : Sun in Taurus : Symbolic : Right Anal Base
Owonrin : Sun in Gemini : Real : Left Inner Thigh
Ogbe : Sun in Cancer : Phi : Right Testicle
Oso : Sun in Leo : Imaginary : Base of Penis
Iwori : Sun in Virgo : Meaning : Left Anal Base
Irosun : Sun in Libra : JA : Left Testicle
Otura : Sun in Scorpio : Symbolic : Low Perineum
Oturupon : Sun in Sagittarius : Real : Upper Perineum
Ika : Sun in Capricorn : Phi : Rectum
Idi : Sun in Aquarius : Imaginary : Mid Perineum
Obara : Sun in Pisces : Meaning : Right Inner Thigh
Ofun : Moon in Aries, Leo and Sagittarius : Master Discourse : Under Left Testicle
Oyeku : Moon in Cancer, Scorpio and Pisces : University Discourse : Base of Spine
Ogunda : Moon in Gemini, Libra and Aquarius : Hysteric Discourse : Head of Penis
Osa : Moon in Taurus, Virgo and Capricorn : Analyst Discourse : Under Right Testicle
>>40653121>I callled out to the demons from the books to appear but nothing ever happened.Did I not call out long enough how many hours do I have to call out?
Why can no one make a photo of these supposed demons when they appear?
You need sight. They don't appear physically 99% of the time. They visually come in trance states or through scrying. They can however make shit move in your house, touch you, or knock shit over.
pqmx
md5: 98045cc419d300182e04efd236008c5f
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So I want to write a fantasy story and I am thinking of including a whole bunch of techniques and principles of actual magic into the worldbuilding. Most of it would be abstract, but sometimes it will get pretty specific, and if the same action is performed IRL, it would have a real effect.
Would this be irresponsible?
>>40665745But is it relevant?
>>40665911Relevant for what?
>>40641487>being this ignorant on purposePrayers aren't supposed to just be babbled mindlessly, this is confirmed by christ in the Bible who criticizes the pagans for turning their religion into a public spectacle (comparative to modern public evangelicism)
Prayers are meant to be meditative. Read over the works of the desert fathers and cross compare to Jesus commanding that you go somewhere QUIET and ALONE to pray.
If you aren't getting meditatively absorbed in your prayers, you're doing it wrong.
>>40667071For the story at hand
>>40665745Just do it. I'm doing practically the same thing. If people catch on, more power to them. The information was probably already available anyway.
>>40660215My tired brain missed the word "Voudon" and thought you were discussing something Japanese. Despite the fact that some of these words couldn't occur in Japanese.
Any protection spell guides? books?
heka shi'irma
the king in black and red, the first fool, sorcerer of the Chromocapilus, one favored by isis-tyche, has awoken
heaven and hell have begun to weep, for they know of the mandate that is being filled
>>40660215I have been reading the voudon gnostic workbook. This guy is insane lol.
>>40668588Jason Miller has a book that's supposed to be good
>>40669381>This guy is insane lol.He definitely is. But there's some stuff in there, like with Grant's Typhonian stuff, that does yield interesting results. I think it's just the right side of batshit to connect to some sort of current and produce weird phenomena.
Scribd has his Monastery of the Seven Rays documents if you want to go deeper down the rabbit hole.
>>40669659Thanks fren, I will check it out.
>>40598752 (OP)Can I get a how to guide for petitioning Marbas for help from start to finish? Its urgent
>>40598752 (OP)Saturn is a proud pedophile btw
>>40672308Bleed on his sigil and recite her enn chant
>inb4 demonolatry is retardedDon't care about you oldheads. This method works.
>>40672367Is blood the ideal offering or does he like something else? I've heard wine, even oranges one guy said
Anyone ever drop Vajrayana / Buddhism? I started to realize I could get the benefits of meditation, at least the basic forms of it like Shamatha without needing to believe in it.
Plus Vajrayana practitioners including the well respected Gurus are often total degenerates who clearly cant follow the teachings themselves which is problematic because Vajrayana is highly reliant on guru devotion. I met a Nepali fellow who grew up in a Buddhist community a few weeks ago that told me how common it is for monks from the Tibetan traditions to molest kids, especially boys who are sent to various monasteries for monastic training.
I also learned the current incarnation of Kalu Rinpoche was molested multiple times as a young boy during his first 3 year retreat, but also that the prior Kalu Rinpoche was a degenerate sex pest that frequently alienated entire Sanghas trying to fuck peoples wives. Also this shits fucking EXPENSIVE. You're going to be shelling out thousands for frequent retreats and told how you shouldn't be attached to material shit, only for the Lama to drive off in a benz.
whole thing is like an acient pedo grift.
>>40672666Nice trips, lol. I practiced for a few years and came to a similar conclusion. There are definitely legit teachers, but finding them and studying with them takes a lot of time and money. Most Vajrayana teachers say practicing alone at home isnโt enough for liberation; you need serious, long retreats, which are very expensive.
One big problem with Tibetan Buddhism or Vajrayana (the only other living Vajrayana lineage is Shingon in Japan, and the few Shingon priests that do exist in the West canโt formally admit people to the tradition) is that the Tibetan diaspora, including the monks, have had a hard time adapting to modern Western society or any society outside Tibet.
Tibet was, and in many ways still is, a very backward place. Until about 80 years ago, life there was like the dark ages, with all the horrible stuff that implies. Monks lived like kings, doing whatever they wanted: raping wives, punishing people brutally for minor offenses (like poking out eyes with needles or chopping off hands), hoarding food and money while villagers starved, molesting children, enslaving groups of people, and forcing them to work until death. This all happened within the last 80 years.
None of this is shocking if you look at Tibetโs history. For example, the Sakya school, one of the four major schools, was founded by a Mahasiddha named Virupa, who wrote a guide on choosing the most precious โDakinis,โ saying younger is better (one of his consorts was famously like 9) and explaining how to use them for sexual Anuttarayoga tantras.
Hey fellas, what method, be it rituals or meditation, would you recommend to achieve the following 3 things?
i)Mental calm and focus, for studying to afront everyday life in general, i find myself too vulnerable to emotions and happenings
ii)Following the mentioned above, to help me study and succeed in a couple tests im facing, also to improve energy and discipline
iii)To awake that "inner eye" or instinct, to make the right choices in general, be it simpler things or greater decisions.
Im struggling, between the copious amounts of schools, methods, etc and i feel a lil bit overwhelmed, consider im a literal noobie
lol they deleted it immediately
>>40672373>needs a higher being to do some favors for him>offers some cheap shit that risks nothingngmi
>>40672666Just jerryrig some of the the techniques, eg 6 dhammas of Naropa, Chรถd, etc. If like Ape you try to pry your way into X-thing without a wang (lol) and some dharmapalas show up to gangbang you, then just drop whatever that is and find something else.
>>40673882nah, ape was trying to do something before he completed preliminaries
he was empowered and, according to him, held the innermost secret khandro practice whoever the fuck
>>40672666Sexual misconduct or misconduct in general is part of every organized religious group. I'm not educated enough to assert if it's a specially egregious problem within Tibetan Buddhism compared to other institutions, but I can understand why that would put people off. I haven't gotten deep into Vajrayana so I haven't experienced or seen any abuse first-hand, but I don't think that's enough to throw out all of the system entirely. It might be enough to cut ties with your local Sangha if you think abuse is going on there however.
I do think whenever abuse happens that it should be talked about. A lot of westerners view eastern/tibetan cultrue with rose-tinted glasses, and almost projecting some sort of spiritual racism, thinking that a lama can do no wrong because he comes from the east. Some people try to rationalize or give excuse to horrible things in Tibet's history as
>>40673518 pointed out, there are A LOT of problems with having a state religion.
Religious organization is subject to all the human afflictions of any type of human organization, not every monk is a Buddha, and the most wise and skilled monks are most likely to stay in the east. Sometimes these monks get corrupted with all the freedoms western society offers. Trying to transmit actual wisdom without the misapprehension of your every Joe Blow is also hard. Specially considering the average westerner's interface with religion/spirituality for the past 100 years has been "just like be good and pray to jesus".
It's also incumbent on the practitioner to really walk the line with discernment, a lot of people just blindly get into bad situations because of FOMO.
>>40673866How do you get the blood out?
>>40672308Why Marbas specifically? If you're in a rush you'd be better finding a sympathetic power like one of the planetary intelligences to petition, as they take a lot less time and effort. If it's a disease thing, for example, you probably want Och, the solar intelligence.
>>40672308Check out Demons of Magick by Gordon Winterfield or Goetia Pathworking by Corwin Hargrove
>>40607759You call it Christcuckery but Jesus is literally God? As in, creator of the universe.
You are on paranormal, so I'd assume you are able to concede that there are values like truth, logic and love
There. All values of God that we can observe.
>>40675973there's products for diabetics who need to check their blood
like lancets attached to punch down plastic cases
>>40675686Good things to point out. Its not worth throwing the entire system away, but its genuinely worth approaching with caution and care. There are genuine predators everywhere in Vajrayana, just like every other esoteric religious system.
One thing I want to add on, according to DJKR and also the current Kalu Rinpoche, is that the major monasteries are 100% NOT sending their best to teach in the West. The monastic institutions are sending the monks who struggle the most, and then Ngakpas just do what they want anyways since they don't formally belong to any groups a lot of the time, or report to any central authority.
One of the prior iterations of Patrul Rinpoche said 200 years ago most monks, teachers, gurus, etc were nothing but complete fucking degens not worth spitting on. Wonder how much worse it is now? Remember, this is the age of dregs and dharma decline, according not only to Tibetan Buddhists, but Mahayana Buddhists in general. Do the work, but know that you're right to keep a very critical eye on anyone in a position of supposed authority.
>>40608123that's odd, the symbol for Fire (the upright triangle) is the same as what the Nazis used to identify gays in the camps. And what are gays also called? Flamers.
>>40677044The good news is that the main thing that can safeguard you from abuse apart from genuine aspiration is doing your fuckin' dhamma homework, and it's never been easier to (1) get access to the dhamma and (2) parse through it with dedicated research. Genuine teachers from different lineages and sanghas as well as learned practitioners are most of the time an e-mail away.
A lot of people think that finding a guru is this anime-style destined thing where the enlightened teacher tailor-suits the teachings to you perfectly out of enlightened omniscience as if straight from a fucking sutta. And while that might happen in India to a fuckin Tulku or eventual Lamma, it is absolutely not the norm, specially not in the West.
So yeah, the world is kinda fucked and we do live in degenerate times but if there's any positive thing about the age of Aquarius is the availability of information, which should be an advantage to anyone with genuine aspiration.
>>40677141WOOPSIE DAISY, apparently i'm wrong (or rather, the web article i read had bad info). It wasn't an upright triangle the gays had, but an upside down triangle i.e. Water symbol.
>>40677400I personally gave up and just went to Theravada fullstop because I couldn't find a teacher I liked at ALL. Very few of them are walking the walk. But you're right, we have easy access to enough information that falling prey to sex pests and grifters is harder than ever.
Unfortunately people still do. Look at Shambhala in Boulder, they've STILL got ongoing scandals, they openly admit they are STILL working through tons of shit, and yet they've got millions to throw around because people still support them and their college anyways.
>>40673600Meditation is enough for those things. For the start just stay still and let the ideas flow for 30 minutes / 1 hour a day (can be in bed). By still I mean STILL, don't move anything (tongue included). Imagine your a corpse but you still breath. Don't day dream either. If your head hurts, it's a good sign. Some will say it's your brain lacking oxygen but it's your inner eye working. After some times you will stil feel it but it won't hurt anymore and you will see the results.
Just stop alcohol, at least for a while. I can't meditate for days after a drink (for weeks if I get wasted). That's some potent shit and have to be used with outmost discernment.
Masturbation is not advised either if you don't use it for sexual magick. It drains you and will kill you confidence and drive for some days/weeks (if you go full gooner), so don't waste it.
The most important thing you have to understand is that your actions are sacred. That what a ritual is, you aknowledge that an act is sacred. Act with intentions and care. Don't half-ass rituals. Don't multiply rituals either, just one at a time.
What should you study first ? Seriously just ask what you want to know out loud with presence and follow the synchronicities/ bread crumbs. You will find what you need.
>>40677426I also gave up on Tibetan Buddhism/Vajrayana and just went back to my original tradition I was born into.
I realized Vajrayana is mostly practiced by old hippies with a TON of money who couldn't stick it out in the more austere, rigid traditions of Buddhism and liked the habitual line stepping nature of the non Gelug schools because it didn't make them feel guilty for being unable to put the weed down.
>>40677748lol... the im-a-mad-sage crowd
>>40677756You have no idea how many "crazy wisdom" boomers there are in Vajrayana circles dude, its fucking idiotic. They are the reason CTR got such a big head and started torturing dogs and trying to molest children.
Fuck a couple years back, some girls came out, backed by their parents who witnessed it and even other Sangha members, that CTR made out with people's literal children, and certain Shambhala members still defend it.
>>40677961meh... chogyam, drukpa, or whoever the fuck else low tier raperface
fuck all that shit. steal the techniques. to hell with empowerments and gurus
>>40677979Meh, I just don't practice it at all, the practices never worked for me, despite massive time investment. I completed a full 100k stack Ngondro cycle, received pointing out instructions, etc.
The only technique you 100% can't steal is Dzogchen, anyone claiming to practice that without direct intro from a teacher is fucking memeing.
I get more out of basic shamatha and vipassana than anything in Vajrayana.
>>40678002idk man, i got some compelling results nigrigging naropa's six yogas
tsultrim allione's secularized chod was also helpful
but yeah samatha and vipasana are mainstay core practices for me too
Keep running into different views on whether natural magic works because natural objects (like crystals, plants etc) actually have occult powers, or simply because they work on our imaginations and help us attune our psychic fields to our intended goals.
Pretty sure it's impossible to figure out the truth with reason alone, either. Sucks.
>>40679030If it's just your imagination, then you can imagine anything without material or external props. No?
>>40679030It's both. They have "physical" occult power, but everything is Mind. The dichotomy between physicalism and idealism is irrelevant imo.
>>40679056>but everything is Mind>but it's both>but dichotomy between physicalism and idealism is irrelevant>but everything is Mind with a capital MThe metaphysics of the confused and listless.
>>40679040Presumably, but that would suppose a special talent, since it would mean your imagination is as strong as your sense perception.
>>40679056That's a great point. I am not sure why the authors I read did not raise this point as an option. It would probably pair really well with Advaita Vedanta or Platonic metaphysics. I guess in that case it would be the divine mind operating on the divine mind, so it doesn't really matter whether the effects are coming from the objects, the mage, or both, since everything is interconnected. A similar rationale is given on why magic works at all, anyway...
>>40679103What I'm saying is that idealism can encompass what appear to be relatively objective physical properties.
>>40677748I got into it because of the really fearsome wrathful yidams, but the realization is that everything you do has to be for the benefit of others, so if you're sort of a left-of-field sorcerer type like me, you're not going to have a good time.
That said, I feel strongly some of those wrathful beings are ancient spirits in their own right, but I guess now they are trapped in the Dharmic paradigm. It sucks.
>>40598752 (OP)Why do they love Saturn so much anyway?
>>40679253Whatever you say, Deepak Chopra.
>>40679030It can work for multiple reasons.
The spiritual world is consciousness based, but overlaps with the material world.
So it is easy to bind a spiritual influence to a stone, although auspicious gemstones will already be magnets for auspicious celestial spirits and powers.
The influx of the stars, and their spirits, energy and powers, fall onto the earth and are attracted to their like things. So auspicious objects attract auspicious spirits. And inauspicious objects attract inauspicious spirits.
Place some gold and emeralds next to your religious shrine, and now will be a stronger magnet for good spiritual influences.
>>40678002How quickly did you chant?
I've done some ~100k Hindu bhakti style ones, with burnt offerings. They are very strong to totally change the mindset they correspond to.
Like for Moon to have afflictions like anxiety, negativity, shyness, sleep problems, and have they totally transformed into peace, happiness, easygoing friendliness, good sleep.
I chant slowly though, so it takes like 300-400 hours for 100-125k cycle.
Success in mantra is measured by the degree of purification of mind, not by speed of recitation.
>>40680753Just sounds like you're swapping one mental illness for another.
>>40680779I wouldn't spend 400 hours doing practices, multiple times, if I wasn't getting profound benefits
Hindu scriptures are completely filled with mantra sadhanas.
Stay mad lazy boy.
>>40680753Not him but speed is pretty irrelevant when it comes to Ngondro. Its a combination of purification practices. Also the full Ngondro cycle is 400k repetitions. 100k 100 syllable mantras, 100k vajrasattva recitations, 100k prostrations and 100k mandala offerings. Takes the average person 5-6 years.
Whether or not it works is more dependent on your karma than anything, what dharmagate you align with more, etc. Buddhist tantra won't work for everyone, full stop.
>>40680931Bruh... you just described some intensely obsessive behaviors.
But yeah... "stay mad".
>>40680753What do you mean "Moon" ?