The one true Christian Church is probably like 1% of every major denomination. And of that leadership, probably only like .001% because most church leaders care more about money and church membership than being truthful.

Doctrine doesnt matter as much as many Christians think it does. We are all in need of God's mercy for our errors, and love will cover a multitude of sins.

People just cling to the idea that their institution has a monopoly on Christian truth because they idolize the institution and try to turn it into God.

>>40653865
What's the heresy

>>40653885
you're kind of stating the invisible church heresy

>>40653776 (OP)
The one true Christian church is that of every single true believer of Jesus Christ, by the definition put down by Jesus Christ. All gatekeepers and exclusionists are apostates to his preaching.

>>40653903
>The idea of a solely "invisible church" is considered a heresy by some Christian denominations, particularly those emphasizing the visible, institutional nature of the Church. This concept, often associated with Protestantism, suggests the true church is comprised only of genuine believers, invisible to the world, and not necessarily tied to any particular physical or organizational structure. However, other Christians, including Catholics and Orthodox, maintain that the Church is a visible, tangible entity with a structure, leadership, and sacraments.
This is just them trying to guilt people into not leaving their institution

>>40653946
interesting. I've been a Catholic all my life and always, or at least for as long as I can remember, considered the "true church" to be in the heart of true believers and not a physical or worldly institution.

>>40653961
I respect the Catholic institution for its contributions to theology and such. But there's so much corruption at the high level, like the Marcel Maciel stuff, that I don't think it can be considered a serious Christian institution at this point of time. i wouldn't want to identify as Roman Catholic because I feel that it would oblige me to defend things that are indefensible

>>40653946
anon the church and the worship of God has structure, it has authority and tradition. this is clearly what is taught in the new testament and in the old.
you cannot just go gung ho on ur own expecting to make sense of any of it.

>>40653967
If you're waiting for everyone else to be perfected Christians before you will, then you're not a Christian, you're a coward

It's a bit arrogant and calloused to presume you can preer into the heart and mind of every professed to determine if they are or aren't "true Christians" and your rhetoric is incredibly divisory, which also isn't Christian

>>40654022
You're a Pharisee who got lost in the maya of exteriority.

>>40654022
you, by the same words you say to others, cannot expect people to follow an organization of Christ that has twisted the words of the faith and comitted heresy of their own while trying to cover it up.

true faith in Christ through prayer, belief, and meditation on the words of the Bible is all one needs.

>>40653967
Jesus would consider it a hideous form of idolatry to identify with a denomination, which is essentially a conspiracy to deify a man-made structure of dogma (mostly concerning topics of dubious spiritual import, to begin with).

By whose authority do you interpret the Bible?
Who compiled the Bible?
What did the Church Fathers say about the organization and beliefs of the Church?

>>40654193
You're asking too many questions at once which makes it hard to have a conversation
If you'd like, pick the one that's most important to you
>>40654022
>anon the church and the worship of God has structure, it has authority and tradition. this is clearly what is taught in the new testament and in the old.
Sure. But no one institution has a monopoly on these things, and they're all flawed to some degree. It's ok. That doesn't mean they should be hated or dismissed. But it's important to recognize this.

This is What the Catholic Church has ALWAYS taught.

>Are you Validly Baptized(With Water saying "I baptized (you) in the Name of the Father Son and Holy Spirit")?
>Do you Believe in The Trinity. The Father, The Son, The Holy Spirit. That they are 1 God?
You are Christian.

However that does not mean you are free from errors caused by our Fallen Nature. You cannot just read the Bible and be your own Pope. You don't have Apostolic Succession meaning you can't do the things Jesus Commissioned the Apostles to do.

>>40654226
By whose authority do you have to interpret the Bible and where in the Bible did Jesus give you such aithority?

>>40654257
The Holy Spirit
https://biblehub.com/1_corinthians/2-10.htm

>>40654102
Ding ding ding. A true Christian is just someone who believes in Jesus Christ and the words that he said. Catholics and Orthodoxers and all the other fake Christians always get incredibly enraged once you start quoting red letter scripture at them. They're legitimately demonic, the synagogue of Satan that Christ preached about. Always looking to divide, exclude, and suppress.

>>40654247
>You cannot just read the Bible and be your own Pope. You don't have Apostolic Succession meaning you can't do the things Jesus Commissioned the Apostles to do.
This is institutional fear mongering

>>40654247
All religious institutions are of the world, thus thoroughly corrupt to the core. One must keep thoughts of such worldly things far from mind when contemplating God.

all I read are emotional arguments and nothing that at actually refutes the catholic or orthodox church.

>>40654309
Pope john Paul ii's papal motto was "everything I have belongs to you" addressed to Mary. The only reason this isn't considered idolatry is because there's no clear boundary for where icon veneration ends and where idolatry ends. They'll say something like "well it's idolatry when the person thinks the icon is God" but how this manifests itself in worship is ignored.

For the record, I am not against icon veneration, only it's lack of coherency within the church as to how it works. It can only be explained with long rambles of technical jargon that aren't meant to be understood, so that the speaker can say "whoever does not understand simply does not have the Holy Spirit"

>>40654297
Anyone who says you don't have the "authority" to think your own thoughts or interpret the word of God on your own is Satanic. I had a friend who fell to the devil through some orthodox church and this is what he acts like now. He lived his entire life fighting, doing drugs, and committing adultery and now his drug is acting holier than thou. He sure does pray loudly over every meal and have many idols of various prostitutes and murderers the orthodox church decided to venerate as saints over other brothers and sisters. He sure does go into a demonic, spittle flinging rage if you quote the direct words of Christ to him. That's the nature of those who follow Satan and not Christ. The secularists with their ironic Church of Satan are more committed Christians than these people.

>>40654309
They self-refute by supplementing the words of Jesus with their own superfluous doctrines. It's not that nothing beyond the red letters can be speculated about, it's that such speculations should never be considered a legitimate basis for imposing social structures that divide the followership of the red letters.

>>40654338
>the followership of the red letters
I would join a cult with this name

Most of the arguments against Orthodoxy or RC are through omission

If you read the bible and then pretty much any book on early Church history (as in the first 300 years before it became institutionalized) you'll realize a lot of Ortho and RC stuff are tacked on holdovers from mystery religions and paganism. Like there isn't anything there about that sort of dress code. And if you ask them about it, you have to read a 10 paragraph essay about how it's a callback to ancient Israel.

Just fyi I'm not attacking them as false churches. I'm just saying that if you don't like how protestants conform to modern beliefs, RC and Ortho did that many years ago already. Not to mention the other more modern examples of deep corruption. If you consider these institutions your home then fine, but you shouldn't idolize them as having a monopoly on the title of true Church.

Christianity was always meant to be liberating. Institutions keep you shackled because they see you as dollar signs or statistics