Thread 40861560

>>40861560 (OP)
No you should add to him

>>40861599
wrong

>>40861599
you cannot add to somthing that isnt there 0+1 should equal zero because there

>>40861560 (OP)
I mean should or shouldn't doesn't even matter really. All that would do is remove the idea of zero in this sector but others who are waaay out there and beyond reach would still have it so sooner or later it would show up again anyway

>>40861560 (OP)
Why if there are 2 zeros does it still equal zero? No you shouldn't take zero away, instead you should command your knowledge to summarize the new next digit. Imagine if 2 Flipflams = 2 Zeros.

>>40861560 (OP)
We def need to expand knowledge of zero not get rid of it
Such as -0
And 0^-0

>>40861599
This
/thread

>>40861864
yeah why 200 of zomthing multiplied by 0 equals 0 where did my 200 go?

>>40861906
The Dog ate them

give me one good example as to why zero is relevant in any important equation btw all of which are "close enough" to be considered foundations.

the pie number only adds to this. There is no "perfect" number which is what humans created. zero is not natural in any way. not in mathematics and not in the maths of actualy nature that man didnt create

Zero is the butterfly effect

think of it like a wave counting from 1 to 10 (10 being the top or tip of the wave) it essentially has no meaning in terms of the wave, we gave it meaning where that meaning is nothing and has nothing to do with the rest of the wave. its just a point that lets us follow patterns easily. zero has been dilluted though. Its easy to once we are conditioned to think zero is the starting point to become completely disoriented in what we think we know.

They say you will use math everyday and its the most important thing. When have you ever had to multiply 0 by somthing in everyday situations? When have you ever ever had to do so in hypotheitcal? Or theoretiocal? You literally never can use zero except as a deception.

zero is not compatible in our reality. its a probability not meant for mathematics

its akin to daylight savings. it does nothing but complicate things.

>>40861828
This one of them genius type niggas

>>40861560 (OP)
400 * 200 ~ zero is a placeholder.Even the
F'n Mayans knew that!

you always ahve to have 1+1! there is no 1 or zero they are entangled and we have accept that our species is locked in the frequency we evolved in. And trust that higher frequency is achievable. But not by belief. But trust. If you think you know trust think again.

>>40861828
In multiplication, 0 *1 is 0. In addition is 0 + 1 =1.

>>40862025
Every day.
https://youtu.be/asDlYjJqzWE

https://youtu.be/HumePIkmTtQ

https://youtu.be/gZHob0FuPHA

https://youtu.be/3wk7C64kaP4

I was taught this and still only believe this. That god was here first and that he knows all. Designed all. The science of this is quite simple. Its taught in every biology class. There is no matter how you spin it a superior that takes the stage. Consciousness has already been in the works for a while and in small amounts. Morals maybe. The first foundation of being distinguished as a just system driven "thing" versus" a thing that makes choices due to actions.

>>40862638
Wouldn’t you like to see something strange?
https://youtu.be/8-r-V0uK4u0

>>40862638
yes it works congratulations for proving what we already know. you should think deeper. math was better before we added zero. the pyramids were built before zero was invented most of every odd our of place monolith was

>>40862675
that is true for either timeline you believe in

if you want to find the devil in the details you should look into math (the details) its there and its old

>>40861560 (OP)
No, turn it into 1 with the power of your mind

With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible

>>40861560 (OP)
>should we get rid of "zero" the non existent "integer"
but then what would we do with "non-zero" "possibilities"

>Remove zero
>nothing happens

>>40861599
Anything you added onto zero would just be the number itself:
>0+1=1
>0+2=2
>0+453287=453287
You could just write the number itself, there's no need to have a "zero", it's not even a real number.

>>40861560 (OP)
Zero, Nil, Void, Absence, Darkness, Emptiness, etc. as a concept always fascinates me... We know it as an idea but is literally nothing. Like not something that we named "nothing" but the complete lack of something altogether. It's honestly such an incomprehensible idea to truly imagine nothing, since it's isn't anything at all. Your mind gets caught up in a loop sometimes thinking about the idea.

Also I think it's poetic and very interesting the fact that matter, existence, and presence are fundamentally and originally made to be good things brought about by God, and the evil beings use these things for their own gain, even though the final end goal of evil is literally nothingness. With God you have eternity, where things will exist indefinitely in motion, but the enemy will eventually be destroyed. If not by his own hand or by entropy, eventually by God. The end goal of evil is "wearing one's self out" until you're whittled into dust. Nothing. Doesn't sound too appealing to me.
God bless you anons.

>>40861560 (OP)
many learn math few learn mathematical philosophy ie why would we get rid of zero when she was constructed for a concise reason ie google zeroing the horizon (an asymptote that exists in juxtaposition to the vertex/vortex and renders all real number systems functionally median if not mitigated)

how do you write 10 without 0?

>>40864488
i was kuist thinking that the tyhing with
>taxes already in the price
in europe is kind of like adding zero?

>>40864488
I think this is more about the integer or the "amount" rather than the symbol used for numbers like 10 or 1000

>>40864488
X or 十

>>40864517
retarded

>>40861560 (OP)
Do you have any idea how removing the mathematical concept "0" would fuck up programming.
You'd have off-by-one errors galore and worse.

>>40864525
it's not, he's right

>>40864540
that's actually smart because there's a star in the center of our solar system and we count the planets from 1 to 8 or 9 depending on where you draw the line, but the sun always exists so the sun must be 0 but we can't reach it because it's too fucking hot uwu

>>40864593
kek, based

>>40864574
It absolutely is, numbers immediately lose consistency if you pull some shit like that. How will you represent the teens, what about numbers like 100, or higher than 10 that also end in 0? Are you going to do 十7, keep it as 17, do things like 十十, or what? The moment you end up having to do things like 十十7, it's like you're working in two entirely different number systems.

>>40864695
>What about numbers like 100
C

>>40864713
Hmm.
If that was superior, we do you think we moved from that system towards the one we currently use?
The value of mathematics isn't in representing things that exist, but concepts. The concept of zero is useful. The concept of negative numbers is useful. The concept of imaginary numbers is useful. And so on and so forth.
That they don't reflect things that tangibly exist is well beyond the point.

>>40861919
>give me one good example as to why the axis is relevant in any important equation btw all of which are "close enough" to be considered foundations.

>>40861919
Gosh, if only they had a place where they required people to go for twelve or so years where you could have learned this.

>>40864863
If 0 is nothing, how come it is at least a container, as if you add 1 to it, 1 is collected, rather than diminished?

>>40864869
It's an abstract concept.
Abstract concepts are good and useful, particularly when we use them wittingly and unwittingly every day.

>>40864869
0 is a state of vacant affair

jesus fuck /x/ is retarded

>>40861560 (OP)
0 is important, it has many desirable properties in math and is very useful (keywords: group, ring, field).

>>40861828
>have no apples
>buy one (1) apple
>wtf i have no apples because 0+1=0????/??

>>40861864
?????????????????????????????

>>40861901
-0 = 0. There. I expanded your knowledge.

>>40861919
It allows you to:
- define negative numbers
- many types of equations are often rephrased to [left side] - [right side] = 0 to make them easier to solve (e.g. quadratics of the type 3x^2+2x = 7x - 5 would become 3x^2 - 5x + 5 = 0, whence you can use the quadratic formula)
- 0 is known as the additive identity in algebra, so it's required in most (interesting) algebraic structures (additive groups/monoids, rings, fields, ...) to give them certain important properties. The real numbers being a field, for instance, guarantees that every number except 0 can be divided by and that you can cancel addition and multiplication (e.g. a * b = a * c implies b = c)
- it is the cardinality of the empty set
- your le heckin' epic 0 equation: e^{i * pi} + 1 = 0

>>40861934
define your "the maths of actualy nature" and what "perfect" numbers are supposed to be

>>40862025
Many jobs require basic arithmetic, which is what you seem to be complaining about, though they usually require an IQ above 80 to perform, which is why you've never needed it.

>>40864488
Look up bijective numerical bases, they're kinda cool.

Ultimately, as >>40864804 points out, mathematics is semi-arbitrary, as in, we (somewhat arbitrarily) define some basic rules and look what they logically lead to. And for the sorts of things we need numbers for, we have found "0" to be fairly useful, which is why we've defined it into existence, as in, there would likely be a lot of things we couldn't do in math without it.

(Cross-posting in a few threads)

Tried to find a sort-of numbers/geometry thread

There was an Anon that posted in a different thread a while back about Numbers and Such, and he posted some of these Screenshots of this Program he was apparently using.

Couldn't find a reference to it, or name, or a link in the thread, so reposting here to hopefully find it, or if that Anon can help.

Any idea(s)?

#2

#3

>>40866261
there is no such thing as a negative number
you have no apples. nobody can take one away because there are none. you don't suddenly have negative apples because someone "took" your nonexistent apple

>>40864488
"ten"

>>40866261
Very well said.
When I was younger and dumber (25+ years ago, back in high school - now I'm just dumb), I was interested in theology and philosophy. Wanted to be a philosopher.
One day I was at Starbucks and got into a conversation with a local philosophy student. Fairly smart guy. And we were talking, and I explained how I hated math, and he stopped me to point out that math is philosophical to its core, and very much the backbone of philosophy.
I was wise enough not to argue the point with him, and spent years pondering it instead. And it's true. It's a deep rabbit hole on its own, deeper if you consider regular philosophy, and endlessly deep if you get into esoterism.
The abstract doesn't need to be readily apparent in a tangible manner to be worth considering. Yet you still need concepts which reflect those abstract ideas.
And math is the ultimate abstract language.

>>40866592
>You owe me 5 apples
>You tell me you have none at the moment
>I accept that instead of killing you because I want apples and dont feel like killing you
>You now owe me 5 apples
>The next 5 apples you get you dont have because they go to me
>negative apples

>>40866612
there no negative in that scenario. you either have the apples or you don't, i don't suddenly have -5 apples just because you feel like killing me for not having any apples. that doesn't make any sense

>>40866663
>meanwhile, he typed this response on a machine that is absolutely dependent upon processing some negative numbers at this very moment to continue functioning properly

>>40866689
it processes 1 and 0 (should be 1 and 2 really)

>>40866698
1 and 2 would be impossible, it processes on and off, a binary state.
Something and nothing.

>>40866663
>there no negative in that scenario
There is a negative. You now "owe" apples. You're now in debt, a concept I'm positive you recognize. In one quantum instance, you do not have possession of the apples. You can choose not to fulfill that debt, but in doing so it means that in your head you have recognized the idea of zero and having negative apples.
>If I give him those 5 apples I'll have zero left for me.

>>40866698
>>40866702
To expand on the binary point, if you are to write 1 as a byte in binary, you'd write 0000 0001. 2 is 0000 0010. Three is 0000 0011.
Under a 1 and 2 system where you just moved stuff up, it becomes 1111 1112, 1111 1121, 1111 1122 respectively.
By getting rid of "0" you've made something already complicated a hell of a lot more complicated.

>>40866718
i either have 5 apples or no apples, i cannot have negative apples

>give me negative 5 apples. no you just gave me 5 apples, i want negative 5 apples
>give me zero apples, no not don't give me any apples, give me zero apples
numbertards actually believe this

>>40866809
>>40866818
Math is just a language.
You are quibbling with the language's ability to express debt.

You can't add or subtract it, multiply or divide by it. It doesn't exist in nature. You can't see it, hold it, measure it or experiment on it.

Maths is just j*wish mysticism.

>>40866850
>language is just j*wish mysticism
this is what you sound like

>>40864488
>Bro doesn't know about Roman numerals

>>40866850
>Maths is just j*wish mysticism.
Mhm.

>>40866880
That's cool.
Now express MLIV in Roman binary in a manner that would be useful to a computer.

>>40866899
No.

>>40866927
;)

>>40861560 (OP)
Why does OP's vote get to count just as much as mine? It's not fair.

0 is the natural variable of the universe.
It is a null void. We replaced it with letters that don't naturally occur. 1 becomes no value in this, but not null.
This way, there is no problem anymore with division.
x/0=y; x=0y=0; x=0; x/x=1; x/0=1;

>>40866693
>>40866691
>>40866686
>>40866671
Why are you posting this slop man.

>>40866592
Not all kinds of numbers make sense for all applications. Of course you cannot use negative numbers for counting, but that's not what they're for. It's like concluding the color green can't exist because happiness can't be green.
Negative numbers are used for relative offsets, differences and things where the zero-point is arbitrary. Take for instance elevation, where we define sea level to be 0; things below sea level then end up having a negative elevation.
And again: negative numbers are real because we say so and because we find them useful. They make sense mathematically, using them does not lead to contradictions and in many fields of mathematics you absolutely need them.

>>40866606
In a way... Mathematics and Philosophy were once one and the same (as was all science; philosophy is the mother of all science, after all). But mathematics separated out, since the things it dealt with were abstract (and thereby simple) which allowed for them to be reasoned about with pure logic. The structure of a mathematical proof is very similar to that of a philosophical argument, since both are fundamentally based on logic, and you can in theory express philosophy in terms of math.
You should also consider that mathematicians like mathematics because they consider it beautiful; contrary to what your average normalfag thinks, mathematicians don't sit all day in front of a calculator (in fact, it's rare for them to do much calculation at all, or even for some, to see numbers!). Rather, they think about abstract objects defined by arcane rules that fifteen other people in the world have ever heard of and try to reason and find out something new about them. In that way, I guess, it is a lot like philosophy.

Quite the contrary, zero is the very foundation of Mathematics: the Empty Set. There is nothing but emptiness inside emptiness inside emptiness...

>>40861560 (OP)
Stfu Sheldon Cooper

>>40864320
Congratulations you are now jewish here is your complementary matzo ball made with the blood of innocent children
make sure to hate your mother

>>40861560 (OP)
-1 is something missing
+1 is something extra
0 is completion. Totality. Wholeness.