Thread 40929947

Logically, the only pursuit that is worth it is immortality. Dying completely negates the individuals efforts. While their actions flow along the current of energy that is the world(s) the individual acted in. They are dead. There is no proof that an individual being will retain its memory after physical death. There is vague proof and the opportunity to experience subjective transcendental states hinting at something „beyond“ physical life. However, it is stupid to try to make up a theory from this liminal and vague data and cling to it. Assuming death after physical death is the best approach, as the focus to attain absolute immortality (freedom) is held that way. Instead of giving in to vague hopes that might be wrong. Hopes like a heaven or reincarnation. Who knows, maybe entering heaven is a form of death for the individual? Maybe reincarnation and losing the memories is death as well?
Well, how does a simple human then get the fuck out? How does a human attain immortality?
Discuss ways, practices, etc.
There not only merit in trying to make sense of the liminal. Physical „immortality“ via biotech or a physical transmutation of being would be nice as well. But that form of existence still has severe limits that would have to be overcome to attain true immortality.

>>40929947 (OP)
not readin allat but this picture lowkey tuff

>>40929947 (OP)
"no."

>>40929947 (OP)
>Well, how does a simple human then get the fuck out? How does a human attain immortality?
>Discuss ways, practices, etc.
who the fuck knows
taoists are the only ones who talk about immortality
but no amount of semen retention made anyone immortal (that we know of)
so who the fuck knows

>>40930010
Taoism is about more than semen retention.

>>40929947 (OP)
biology should not be esoteric cunts

>>40930067
Because the average humans mind is filled with simple surface level desires, they naturally find the depths of biology esoteric.

Esoteric: "intended for or likely to be understood by only a small number of people with a specialized knowledge or interest."

No amount of dumbing it down will help this issue. Otherwise the knowledge becomes useless.

>>40930060
no shit

>>40929947 (OP)
>Dying completely negates the individuals efforts.
I disagree and assert that we are merely droplets of water in the infinite ocean of the collective unconsciousness. Moreover, all that lives will die. All that dies transforms. To transform is to transcend once one accepts the nature of, well, nature. Memories cannot be forgotten because nothing is lost when all droplets become an ocean.
>how does a simple human then get the fuck out?
1. They can't.
2. Why would they want to?
>How does a human attain immortality?
Live. Experience. Die. Repeat.

tl;dr: Go with the flow, bro.

>>40929947 (OP)
Harmony

>>40931257
Peak defeatist mortal mindset. Get out of the thread if you want to preach ignorance, vague philosophy and submission to death and dissolution.

>be me
>build house
>raise family
>die
>house disappears, family disappears, future disappears because i dont perceive it anymore
this is just a solipsism thread smdh

>>40931315
Read the OP with a bit more focus

>>40929947 (OP)
Are you trying to use daoism (just looking at picrel) as the undercurrent here? Immortality is pretty much the main or one of the main topics in daoist cultivation, but most of it is reserved for after you die though.

In daoism once you die you have a couple routes towards immortality, you either become a yin ghost or get willingly "abducted" by a "net official" or "heaven emissary", both routes imply cultivation even after death of the physical body.

The emissaries or xian shen are pretty much the "beings of light" from NDEs. Tricky part about these things is they can either throw you into the wheel of reincarnation or hook you up into their realms and train you to become one of them. But you don't know if they're being truthful when they meet you, so you're kinda gambling if you decide to go with them. They're not depicted as malevolent in daoist texts though, they just don't give a fuck about you unless your shen is exceptional and has potential.

If instead you decide to wander around and become a yin ghost you'd have more freedoms and the chance to cultivate your shen or "spirit"/consciousness, although being a slower process and more daunsting and self-reliant than being hooked up into a heavenly realm by these emissary things where you'll pretty much have access to "food" whenever you need it.

Most people can't make it as a ghost, their shen is too frail, can't keep their yin qi together so they end up dissolving into reincarnation. And most people who decide to follow the emissaries get thrown into the reincarnation cycle. So the run for immortality is reserved to gifted individuals or the ones who have cultivated their qi and shen while alive.

>>40931322
All I can make out is that it somehow equivocates immortality with freedom, as if it isn't exactly the opposite. Immortality always means less and less agency and volition the older you are, because of the continuous increase in knowledge and resources.

>>40931324
Different anon
This is interesting stuff - can you recommend any sources on this and on shen cultivation?

>>40931294
>Peak defeatist
Just like good and evil, it is the perspective one takes upon my assertions that signifies its meaning. I wrote that as neutral as possible and find those concepts beautiful. What is your point of view? It seems you forgot to include that while you attacked your perception of my mindset.

>>40929947 (OP)
In Toaism to attain immortality you must complete all the elemental cycles.
The first is the Microcosmic Orbit(most people 95% never do this)
The second is fire(cut out another 95%)
The third is water(cut out 99.9%)

After that I'll let you guess.

>>40931381
Nta but
To build the shen, strengthen the bones.
Build the foundations.

>>40931395
How?

>For I know that my redeemer liveth, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth:
>And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God
Job 19:25-26

>Thy dead men shall live, together with my dead body shall they arise. Awake and sing, ye that dwell in dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead.
Isaiah 26:19

>Then he said unto me, Son of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel: behold, they say, Our bones are dried, and our hope is lost: we are cut off for our parts.
>Therefore prophesy and say unto them, Thus saith the Lord God; Behold, O my people, I will open your graves, and cause you to come up out of your graves, and bring you into the land of Israel.
Ezekiel 37:11-12

>And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
Daniel 12:2

>I will ransom them from the power of the grave; I will redeem them from death: O death, I will be thy plagues; O grave, I will be thy destruction: repentance shall be hid from mine eyes.
Hosea 13:14

>And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
>And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
John 6:39-40

>>40931324
See https://archive.4plebs.org/x/thread/40867158/#q40871511
and scroll up to the three greentext blocks in a row, those are the excerpts referenced

I think there are a lot of immortal people but there is different ways to reach it with even small differences in the results
For one kind of immortality i think it is actually harmful to meet anyone who is not around a specific level....that is why you dont see immortals ..... They protect themselves that way...
But all the methods involve quantum physics or reality mechanic hacking i guess orbeven more

>>40931381
>This is interesting stuff - can you recommend any sources on this and on shen cultivation?
This is kinda tricky, the afterlife mechanics are scattered and half coded, usually only hinted, pretty much like in every tradition, even if daoism is more direct with it. There's a bunch but traditional texts that deal with all of this but the ones with english version are "Baopuzi" (Ge Hong, "Zhen'gao", "Huangting Jing"and "Qingjing Jing".

I wouldn't recommend any of these to anyone who's trying to understand things though. You'll be better off following a mainstream traditional daoist "book list". But i don't mind answering specific questions about the topic, at all.

Also, i'm not a daoist, i just find it to be the best framework to communicate a bunch of these metaphysical elements. Every tradition has their own parallel, daoists just tend to be more direct.

>>40931601
>Baopuzi

>>40931324
That sounds cool, how does one become a yin ghost?

>>40931389
how do I complete the fire cycle andd the water cycle?
I done some microcosmic orbit, does thaat mean I compleaated it?

>>40931686
Die and be real ignorant about it.

>>40931691
The fire and water cycles are different for everyone.
You haven't finished microcosmic orbit until you've burned it in which is roughly 1 hour a day of it for up to a year

>>40929947 (OP)
Seekers of immortality chase it because it sounds nice. They don’t understand the totality of it nor the curse it would be.

Detachment, loneliness, and the sense of alienation from the mortal world.The loss of loved ones, and the monotony of endless existence. How do you find finding meaning in a life without end? It’s
our awareness of death gives life its poignancy and urgency.

Any level of immortality is going to have the following drawbacks: Loved ones die. You no longer relate to people who were not born in your time. Eventually you have to consider yourself as inhuman. One of the hallmarks of humanity is death. You no longer die. You cannot fully relate to the rest of the world.

>>40931427
Do you mind? We're trying to have an actual discussion here

>>40931731
Thats why its so hard to attain immortality, you have to overcome all those objections positively.

>>40931723
also microcosmic orbit is confusing, like it doesn't even make sense to me.
like I don't even know why energy is supposed to flow in a certain direction, seems made up.
also I think direction of energy flow in microcosmic orbit can change, so this is super confusing,
not to mention I don't see any effects beyond usual effects of calming down meditation
also I am not sure if there are even meridians on the route the energy is supposed to take on the front of the body.
like idk, seems all a bit weird and made up to me

it implies movement of energy creates or refines energy? like why would movement of energy do that, it makes no sense
Also how is that suppose to be a requisite of immortality?


>The fire and water cycles are different for everyone.
super vague alert, I guess you couldn't be less vague right?

>>40931731
>How do you find finding meaning in a life without end?
If you need life to end for it to be meaningful then that's a skill issue on your part

>>40931266
Harmony

>>40931748
OP asked how to become immortal, I answered. So far I’m the only one ITT who answered the question.

>>40929947 (OP)
Picrel looks like a gnome is controlling him.

>>40931686
>>40931696
Not really, living people have jing, which produces qi (divided into yang qi and yin qi), which then refines shen. Jing is physical essence, lost when the body dies, as well as the yang polarity of qi.

In other words, a ghost is a shen (spirit/awareness) traveling in a yin qi vehicle. The thing is most people lack a coherent enough shen to endure the shock of death. The shock of death refers to the shen or awareness being supported only by yin qi and losing the jing physical anchor. Since ghosts don't have a physical anchor in jing they need to rely on shen a lot more than living humans do. So most living humans don't "live up" to the standards of a shen that can support a coherent ghost life.

This means most people have their shen fragmented when dying. Most of them will just dissolved immediately and be recycled, some with just fragmentation will be able to somewhat hold onto the yin qi leaking out of the corpse to form the vehicle, and but since their shen is fragmented they'll only have focus for the most relevant fragments of their consciousness, obsessions, phobias...etc. They'll act almost on instinct or driven by these fragments, they'll feed inefficiently and sooner than later dissolve into reincarnation.

A big minority have a solid, stable shen that can keep the yin qi vehicle together even after death. These are the ghosts that have full coherence and cognition, just like when they were alive. They're more likely to find ways to feed on yin qi and yang qi efficiently and survive indefinitely as yin ghosts. Overtime they become more powerful as they feed and form a yin core into their shen, kinda like a battery. Living people would do this with their "lower dantian" but ghosts don't have one.

In any case, a ghost being ignorant of their condition means their shen is fragmented and they won't last, as a fragmented or weak shen leaks and disperses the yin qi, and the yin qi is pretty much the body of the ghost.

>>40931752
I don’t think those are things you can overcome. They are inherent background conditions. Nobody truly grasps the meaning of forever if they desire to live that long. It’s a red flag for shallow thinking expressed by every member of the cult of Christ.

>>40931773
>The ‘man-machine’ with whom everything depends upon external influences, with whom everything happens, who is now one, the next moment another, and the next moment a third, has no future of any kind; he is buried and that is all. Dust returns to dust. This applies to him. In order to be able to speak of any kind of future life there must be a certain crystallisation, a certain fusion of man’s inner qualities, a certain independence of external influences. If there is anything in a man able to resist external influences, then this very thing itself may also be able to resist the death of the physical body...But even if something survives, its future can be very varied. In certain cases of fuller crystallisation, what people call ‘reincarnation’ may be possible after death, and, in other cases, what people call “existence on the other side’. In both cases it is the continuation of life in the ‘astral body’, or with the help of the ‘astral body’. You know what the expression ‘astral body’ means. But the systems with which you are acquainted and which use this expression state that all men have an ‘astral body’. This is quite wrong. What may be called the ‘astral body’ is obtained by means of fusion, that, is, by means of terribly hard inner work and struggle. Man is not born with it. And only very few men acquire an ‘astral body’. If it is formed it may continue to live after the death of the physical body, and it may be born again in another physical body...Fusion, inner unity, is obtained by means of ‘friction’, by the struggle between ‘yes’ and ‘no’ in man […] if a struggle begins in him, and particularly if there is a definite line in this struggle, then, gradually, permanent traits begin to form themselves, he begins to ‘crystallise’...
(P. D. Ouspensky, In Search of the Miraculous, 1969)

>>40931758
Nah anon. That’s you showing your lack of experience and philosophical limits. It’s not up for debate, you just haven’t discovered it yet.

>>40931802
This is interesting and i have a differentiation to make. In daoism the yin qi body which the typical ghost uses, that's why they're called yin ghosts, gets diffused or "unraveled" when it comes into direct contact with heavy yang qi carriers. Some of the most common yang qi carriers are salt, dry wood, iron, sunlight and garic.

In western traditions "etheric beings" happen to be dealt with with these same carriers. Which means by all practical purposes "yin qi" and "ether" are the same element, just talked about in different frameworks with different terms for it.

As for the "astral body", it only fits as a parallel for a "shen projection" in daoism. Which means it's a purely mental body, no charges, no density, no mass. This is why depictions of "astral projection" or "shen projection" talk about the person being able to travel anywhere with a thought and they're not affected by sunlight It's because they're not "ghosts" they're just mental projections, the body still alive.

>>40931773
what are the signs of a solid stable shen sufficient to become an immortal yin ghost?
how is this sort of solid stable shen attainted?

>>40929947 (OP)
Salt.
If you want to be immortal just get your body stuffed with salt. That's what the last buddhist monk to achieve immortality did.

>>40931876
Shen even though it can commonly be referred to as spirit or soul it refers to the psyche of a person. It's a modulator of the mind, memories, awareness and ego. In daoist cultivation jing constantly produces qi to maintain the functions of the body and mind, and that qi if circulated cleanly it refines into shen.

It doesn't need to be complicated, qi and shen are plastic. If you practice stillness that alone will stabilize your qi flow and consequently strengthen your shen. Or you can meditate on your awareness alone which will directly strengthen your shen and consequently stabilize your qi an cultivate it.

A living being has their jing reservoir to produce qi and passively maintain the shen. A ghost doesn't, as a ghost you need to actively "BE" in order to be, it would be kinda like manual breathing for a living being. So a person who can't focus their awareness with enough consistency will struggle maintaining their shen in the yin qi vehicle and they will eventually dissolve. This is just theoretical, but it's very likely this is only the case for the initial phase of being a ghost, it's probable you'll automatize the act of maintaining your yin qi field after a while, if you're shen is polished enough to last that long.

The signs of a strong shen are what you'd expect after understanding what shen is. You're able to focus awareness and maintain it focused for extended periods of time. You have a strong sense of identity, your attention and structure doesn't fall apart when flooded with different qi configurations that can trigger certain emotions, you're naturally introspective...etc.

>>40931257
All excuses for death are unprovable copium. You remember your past lives or you just schizo?

>>40931979
It’s self evidently the reverse of what you are arguing but don’t let me stop you from being gay.

>>40931753
in chinese medicine energy flows both ways along meridians. the microcosmic orbit goes up the back and down the front, but technically could go either way
i think in some buddhist tantra stuff they raise the energy up the front and down the back
>>40931381
>>40931425
since that another anon is being vague, I would get started with Damo Mitchell. I picked up pic related from one of the other threads and he has a nice writeup on neidan (alchemy).
for best practice results you should already have a foundation in qigong and he has earlier books that outlines the basics/preparatory work

>>40931773
"Die and be real ignorant about it" was a joke anon.

>>40931876
Focusing on shen is not how you get there.
Focus on building jing, I.E. your foundations, your Qigong.
Without strong foundations there is no reason for your shen to adapt and become stronger.

>>40932148
They're not separate elements and jing can't be really worked on unless you're talking about methods to reduce its "leakage". Jing is the fixed pool of unrefined essence or energy you're born with. It's not meant to be restored and even advanced cultivators can only restore a small fraction of it. If you want to focus on the afterlife as a yin ghost you need to focus on shen, you won't even have jing as a ghost, so if the focus is preparation for a ghost, then shen takes full priority.

>>40932125
That person was asking about specifics on the metaphysics of being a yin ghost and shen cultivation, not about general qigong practice, anyone can access that through a quick google search, in fact Damo Mitchell will probably be one of the first results on the list. Mitchell won't talk about the occult and metaphysical aspects of cultivation in a traditional framework, so he's the one being vague, not me, i'm sharing pretty clear specifics.

>>40932279
>That person was asking about specifics on the metaphysics of being a yin ghost and shen cultivation
thats whats in the book homie
you're being specific... up to a point
in fact if anything you're being too theoretical, no actual practice

I think the "Pursuit of Immortality" is also a motivator for why NHI do what they do.

>>40932179
Do you not understand that a tree can only be as tall as its roots?

>>40932308
I shared the two most practical and accessible methods for shen cultivation. I understand people want to "do the right thing" and adopt whole practical frameworks like qigong but that's only "the right thing" if you plan on spending a whole life of cultivation.

In the context of preparing for the afterlife one needs to focus fully on polishing their shen, there's no need for stretching your fascia or practicing poses. Only your shen matters when you're dead, and you'll polish your shen faster with simpler methods such as the ones i mentoned, even if they have worse direct engagement with qi cultivation.

>>40932379
i mean yeah, and im saying that the specific book i recommended has more focus on neidan and shen cultivation than his earlier books, which are more qigong focused
so if people are interested in reading more, it has more useful info than you may initially think

>>40932179
And what school/sect of Taoism taught you that?
I ask because you should have credentials and certs if you're not full of shit trying to talk from "authority" like this.

>>40932397
I get it, but he still focuses on living cultivation and people asking me are asking based on daoist cosmology and afterlife mechanics because that's what i've been talking about.

They won't stick to a long term cultivation practice, but if it's only the shen they can realistically improve it, even if it's just because they want to "secure a spot" as a wandering yin ghost and have a chance at living their "i'm a powerful ghost" fantasies. And yeah i realize this sounds condescending but it's what's happening here, this is /x/.

Ideally though, sure, read Damo Mitchell, he's the best shot at introducing western people to cultivation.

>>40932511
asking for credentials on an /x/ thread kek you must be new

>>40932529
I'm just telling everyone to take your advice with a grain of salt because Taoism is mostly an oral tradition, and if you only have books as references you don't even realize how much you've got wrong.
The books intentionally obsfucate the truth becayse you could hurt yourself with it.

>>40932650
who do you recommend learning from?

>>40932650
I haven't explained or recommended any cultivation techniques that could harm anyone. I've just laid out the energetic framework of the tradition and how it functions in the afterlife based on traditional texts. Direct shen cultivation is inoffensive.

And even if i were to tell people about dangerous neigong practices like how to cultivate a core, they wouldn't be able to do so without first developing a sense for the different charges in their qi. That alone takes years of practice if you're not naturally gifted with subtle proprioception.

It's not that serious.

>>40932653
If you're stateside, there are a lot more Taoist temples than you might think.
If you practice without a teacher you're just engraining your mistakes.

>>40932913
>If you're stateside, there are a lot more Taoist temples than you might think.
cool cool... so any one tradition or teacher you recommend more than others?

>>40932924
I study Quanzhen.
I wouldn't focus so much on sects as finding a real DMQ to teach you though.
The best teachers are the ones willing to initiate you who also know what thats going to cost them.
If they're legit they'll likepy teach advanced classes as week long seminars working towards TMQ, or DMQ certs.

>>40932913
This is in the vast majority of cases, pointless. Most teachers, specially in the west won't do anything more than pouring theory and regurgitated techniques from texts into you. Count yourself lucky if your teacher is able to direct qi smoothly through their body, and that's something that takes relatively little effort to achieve. Feeling your own qi reliably is something that can be achieved even from day one, and directing it smoothly only takes passive cleaning of meridians through regular basic exercises.

Consider it a miracle if your teacher is able to perceive the different charges in their qi and project it. At that point i would accept their guidance is more valuable than being self taught. I'm not gonna even bother considering the possibility of you finding a teacher that has a stable, solidified core.

Many people think you absolutely need a mentor in order to succeed in cultivation because otherwise you could harm yourself with your own qi. Forget that, most mentors you'll find won't save you from that. Careful study and consideration will, if you understand the fundamentals and develop the necessary steps without rushing you won't need a mentor.

>>40933003
>week long seminars working towards TMQ, or DMQ certs.
are these abbreviations of medical qigong?
>>40933006
>I'm not gonna even bother considering the possibility of you finding a teacher that has a stable, solidified core.
can you recommend any teachers who have achieved this?

>>40933029
>can you recommend any teachers who have achieved this?
No

>>40933041
always the same circle jerk in threads on taoism

>>40933047
There was no right answer for you. Solidifying a core isn't an easy task, it takes years of mindful and careful compression. Many of the cultivators that get to that area decide to stop at being able to project different charges of qi.

I also don't know where you're seeing the circle jerk here though.

>>40933067
you're talking a lot about the method but not a lot about what the actual method is and who is teaching it
you're acting like its a mystical and hard to obtain thing but when pushed for specifics suddenly mum on the details

>>40933081
I've been spouting specifics in every message in this thread when i've been asked. What do you want to know?

>>40933090
what is the method for building the core and who is teaching it and what teachers meet the criteria you describe in >>40933006

>>40933029
Yeah, Therapist of Medical Qigong and Doctor of Medical Qigong.
Also there are literal directories of teachers online.
https://www.qigonginstitute.org/directory
There's definitely some nobodies on the list, but many of these people have medical and temple practices.

>>40933006
>Many people think you absolutely need a mentor in order to succeed in cultivation because otherwise you could harm yourself with your own qi.
You'll still harm yourself, but you wont fuck your whole life over like you will without a teacher. Plus any teacher worth their salt will help you with deviations when they occur.
Qi deviations are a bitch, and careful study wont save you from your own hubris, but someone telling you that you're retarded might.

>>40933093
For "building" it the only requirement is to be able to circulate qi smoothly through your body. This is achieved simply by clearing the channels through simple exercises, either physical or meditative, better if both, qigong tends to be the popular option. It takes a few months to a few years if you're seriously fucked.

Once you're able to circulate your qi smoothly you can start compressing it into the lower dantian. If you imagine the dantian as a ball of wax and your qi as hot wax, you compress it into the ball and then let go and let it expand into a field again. Repeating compressions overtime build up the core, which acts as pretty much a battery or a well of qi.

Cultivating it further than that requires you to feel the different charges in your own qi, and this takes longer. If you're not able to differentiate the charged currents in your qi (yang and yin) you're just circulating and compressing undifferentiated qi. You can build a core with that, but you won't be able to use it efficiently until you're able to differentiate and feel the positive and negative charges.

>who is teaching it
A handful of secretive neigong schools. It doesn't matter, once you're able to start compressing your qi and you eventually start differentiating qualities in your qi flow you know what comes next. Most people don't even attempt to go further than compression and separate projection of charges. If you mess up playing with opposing charges you can kill yourself, and you don't need any master to tell you this, you'd know before even trying.

>>40931770
Your solution is worse than just dying. Sucking jew cock for eternity is not an eternity worth suffering.

>>40933221
>A handful of secretive neigong schools
sounds like mo pai

>>40933147
This is just mystique. Clearing channels isn't rocket science or difficult, and it will prevent organ damage or tissue scarring if your not retarded. Most you'll get if you fuck up is an intense burning sensation in the area for a minute or two, and you won't repeat that mistake again.

>>40933243
Now I'm fully certain you're neck-deep in the dunning-kreuger gap.
You know just enough to be dangerous, but not enough to know why.

>>40933300
I'm sharing my reasoning with you, based on experience. You're just trying to insult me.

>>40933310
I'm sorry you feel insulted, and you're getting some things right, but your whole perspective on Taoism appears to be skewed and you're downplaying a lot of the danger involved, which isn't fair to laypeople.
To me you sound like someone who has studied the theory out of books, but was never initiated and never had proper pedagogy so you don't even know the scope of what you don't know because you have no direct transmission through lineage.
Like I said before Taoism is still mostly oracular, the books contain a fraction of the knowledge, even books like Jerry's Chinese Medical Qigong Therapy which I had to study for year in temple.

>>40932179
Could it be that “jing” is the “worlds” energy/attention/intent keeping you hooked into this place? And it’s absolute stability and coherence comes from so many people being here? So basically jing is the lifespan of the individual in the world. And what matters then is to use this allocated lifespan, this “physical” time to exist and the “physical” resources for energy, to cultivate and refine qi and shen?

So yin qi is a stabilizing/material agent, yang qi is a psychic/immaterial agent.
Without yin qi the yang qi would be formless. Without yang qi the form would be without awareness. But I suspect the separation of yin and yang is an illusion. Shen refines from qi. Shen is attributed to the mind and spirit. Which to me sounds like logos. Which means the fundamental ability to have a reality existing/assembling at all, by nature of qi, which can be variously modulated (yin/?/yang spectrum).
How does Shen play a role in immortality?
Is a refined Shen then a realization, a unification of mental divisions coming from the yin/?/yang illusion?
And what then is emptiness, that Shen returns to? Is it silence? Is emptiness the only Way to get away from the deep subconscious rules that hold our fate?
Finally, what about earth and heaven? Do these symbols refer to qi?
Thanks for the people discussing in this thread.

>>40933221
I don't understand why one would need to differentiate chi? Do you need two cores? One yin, one yang?

Also, thanks for all the information, I really appreciate it.

>>40934544
Also, if one needs two cores where are they located?
Did you become this knowledgeable on your own, if yes can you share some good books or sources of information?
How far ahead in your journey are you?

>>40932322
“NHI” is a misnomer, they are all very much “human” intelligences. Those are the “yin ghosts” the other anon keeps talking about. They’re people who lived and died long ago but managed to avoid getting tossed into Hades right away so they could stick around here a bit longer.

>>40933231
Clearly eternity isn’t your goal then. The only eternity you’ll get is in union with God. I think what you’re after instead is “staying conscious for a long time after I die” —which is still just a blink against eternity

>>40931723
>The fire and water cycles are different for everyone.
>You haven't finished microcosmic orbit until you've burned it in which is roughly 1 hour a day of it for up to a
just stop fucking typing, its bad karma to give out dogshit advice on spiritual training

>>40931753
you have to fill the pot with water before you heat it, same as if you try to boil some water but forget the water, you'll scorch the pan
turning the water wheel before this is done is kinda useless
mco is distributing refined energy to the meridians
that other anon doesnt know what he's talking about enough to do anything more than confuse you

>>40932179
>Jing is the fixed pool of unrefined essence or energy you're born with. It's not meant to be restored and even advanced cultivators can only restore a small fraction of it
are you even aware of contradicting yourself?

>>40933432
Like i said, you've spent the whole post trying to build a cloud of mystique and danger around the praxis because you're offended i underestimate the catastrophic and mysterious consequences of circulating qi up the wrong meridian. When someone dispels this you lose your shit, it's always the same with you people.

I was never initiated, that's why i know it isn't necessary. I understand "the bad" and i know people aren't gonna run into it through mindful, structured practice with understanding of the fundamentals. We should save ourselves some time. Tell me what you're scared of, no vague warnings, i'll tell you why a non-initiated practitioner shouldn't be scared of it.

>>40933745
You got a good instinct, i'd just comment on a few things. Jing isn't collective attention, it's your individual, fixed reservoir of "essence" or raw vitality. It's the densest form of life force and it holds the blueprint, like DNA. If you were a candle the wax would be your jing, what makes you physically a candle, the flame would be your yin qi, the heat emanating from the flame would be your yang qi and the light illuminating the environment around you would be your shen.

Your yang qi and yin qi distinction is a bit rigid, yin and yang are relative categories, for example liver qi can be yin or yang depending on context. Yin is consolidating and yang is dispersing, yin tends toward form and yang toward function. These are the "magnetic" and "electric fluid" of modern western occultism, the sulphur and mercury of alchemy...etc. Sometimes you get a quicker understanding when seeing how other traditions utilize the same concepts in their frameworks.

When you project qi out of your body for example you need to use yin qi as a carrier for yang qi. Even if yang qi is the active force it will disperse as soon as it leaves your body if it's not traveling through yin qi. This is why learning how to feel and differentiate charges is such a threshold for practical results.

(1/2)

>>40929947 (OP)
suppose you achieve "physical immortality" and live for say 3000 years for starters
do you think (You) can keep going?

>>40934774
>How does Shen play a role in immortality?
Shen is the modulator of mind, memories, ego, awareness. It's shaped overtime by your qi and in turn by your jing, so it has a personalized shape or print. What makes it immortal is its stability and coherence after death, if it's refined enough it won't scatter with the jing, it can maintain identity beyond dissolution. The mediums around your shen can change overtime, but if that shen can endure each transition it's the one element that plays the role of the immortal.

>And what then is emptiness, that Shen returns to? Is it silence?
That's more a buddhist point of view than a daoist one. In daoism the xu (emptiness) is sort of an ineffable "field" that allows qi to move freely. It's not about escape, it's about "becoming transparent" so Dao flows through you seamlessly. This is very similar to a lot of other esoteric traditions, western ones included. Also, in daoism earth and heaven are mostly seen as polarities, heaven is pure yang/celestial and earth is pure yin/material. Qi and its qualities is defined by its flow between these two poles.

>>40934544
>>40934556
Imagine you have a bowl full of cold and hot marbles. You'd use hot marbles for some things and cold marbles for other things, sometimes you'd want to use both while controlling how many of each type you're using. People when they first learn how to feel their qi and circulate it aren't able to feel the difference between hot and cold marbles, they're just sticking their hand in the bowl and stirring it. Without developing a perception to differentiate the marbles you can't use them effectively.

And no, one core handles all qi.

>>40934728
Replenishing jing isn't a goal in cultivation, it's inefficient, jing isn't meant to be replenished. What you're supposed to do is learn how to introduce alternative sources of qi into your system so your jing depletes slower.

(2/2)

>>40934774
>>40934860
anons dropping knowledge thank you

>>40934774
Ah there it is, thank you for being honest.
I'm personally not scared of anything, I just hear the mechanical disrespect for Qi in everything you say.
I wish you good luck in your learning, and I pray you don't accidentally kill yourself.

>>40934702
My guy, that was the exact training I had to go through under a Taoist abbot.
I did an hour of microcosmic orbit daily after my Daoyin cultivation. You also have to attain a specific level of Daoyin development before doing it.
During my burn in I also had to stop:
>smoking
>drinking
>masturbating/having sex
>drinking caffienated beverages
>eating refined sugars
>going to bed after midnight
All of those things will delay or stunt your Qi development during burn-in.

>>40935891
>gatekeeper is unable to give any actual response

Earth is like a trap that traps non-existence and forces it to exist. Like Jesus we were born from God (earth) and man (your mom) You ascended from space and found yourself stuck inside of a man.

>>40935926
purge the wrong channel a bit too hard
>oops you have a months long illness you can't use Qigong to fix now
Build Qi with the wrong intent
>oops you shifted the tables of your own fate, hope you don't die
use the wrong advanced practice too early
>oops, you're completely delusional now because your Po took advantage of your weakened state

https://gorgeouslypink.tumblr.com/
https://www.tumblr.com/search/shifting%20motivation

>>40929947 (OP)
Alex Chiu solved this problem with immortality rings at least two and a half decades ago. Last I checked he is still alive. So until he isn’t he is immortal and that’s a a fact.
Behold a video from 18 years ago before the old internet died.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WePrOeMcXSk

>>40935950
I think we might actually be getting something helpful now.

Can you explain why qigong wouldn't be able to fix an illness that is caused in that way you describe?

What precisely does it mean to build Qi with wrong intent?

I appreciate your response. I am especially interested in the answer to the second question.

Its just the vague warnings given about just about everything nowadays cannot be taken seriously by themselves because of a "boy who cried wolf" situation, especially when those who are supposed to be the deferred-to authorities are so often incompetent.

>>40935950
>purge the wrong channel a bit too hard
Why are you actively or manually cleaning channels? Most blockages dissolve passively if you stick to a solid pillar technique. Qigong has no shortage of these and it's the most popular framework for cultivation. People shouldn't have trouble with this without being "initiated" by a mentor.
>Build Qi with the wrong intent
>oops you shifted the tables of your own fate, hope you don't die
Highly inconsequential unless you feed the same intent over and over again overtime. Hard to imagine someone feeding a core with dubious, ill intent every time they sit down to practice. This is a made up concern.
>use the wrong advanced practice too early
Why are you doing something you don't understand?

Like i said, people aren't gonna run into these issues if they're mindful and structured in their practice, and they understand the fundamentals. You don't need a mentor for this, specially not one that comes from a fucking lineage of cultivators.

Besides, i've always noticed how you people overcomplicate things when it comes to working with the meridian network. When i see people who paint it this way i immediately know they've been duped by a grifter or they're larping. Most cultivators will die of old age before they even get to work with their meridians individually throughout the whole network. Most of the meridian work is indirect and holistic, it's a side effect of a mindful and structured practice as i said.

When i started compressing my core i had pulsating sharp pain through a bunch of meridians in my body, specially one down my leg that was most likely coming from one of my kidneys. I kept compressing the core regularly, they eventually cleared.

>>40936072
If you practice Qigong while sick, you just embed the sickness further into you, deeper into your own body where it can do even more damage. You can't clear active sickness from within the sickened self, you either have to let your immune system do its thing, or get an intervention from a teacher.

>the wrong intent
Thats the insidious thing, the perspective of intent is known in hindsight, not foresight. So while ateacher can look at the path you're on and say "I've been here before, this is not the way" you cannot do that yourself while walking the path for the first time. It simply doesn't matter how much theory you have, the map is not the terrain. What you want is not what you're gonna get, and a teacher with lineage can stop you from taking incredibly self-destructive tangents in your own idiocy and hubris.

>>40936116
Your response says everything. It sounds like you haven't even learned the scope of the basics. Decided you were too advanced in theory and then skipped straight to advanced stuff like a fool. Then you even double down with
>Why are you doing something you don't understand?

I pray you don't kill yourself on accident or worse, because you clearly lack basic preventative and maintenance techniques.

>>40936150
then why do lineages like Yiquan specifically advice sick people to do QiGong (Zhan Zhuang)? and say people with a cold or flu should do it extra?

>>40936150
I didn't skip anything, i followed my natural progression while understanding the fundamentals of what i was doing. The fundamentals aren't hidden or guarded by schools, everyone can access them.

What you call "basics" are a bunch of self sabotaging breaks instilled in you by masters that had them instilled in them for the sake of preserving tradition. And formal traditions care more about hierarchy and bureaucracy than safety. They're not keeping you safe, they're keeping you in place.

As a side note, even if i have qigong knowledge i'm not a qigong practitioner. Like i said i derive my cultivation directly from the fundamentals, i took note of traditional texts, compared their warnings with my experience. Developed my own methods and was mindful of what i was doing, still am. I haven't had any problems and i'm far more advanced than your average qigong instructor out there. In cultivation pain is a teacher, pain shows the way, trying to mute it or prevent it becomes a roadblock in itself.

>>40936166
Because what that anon said is borderline superstitious and not a real concern. It would only be a problem if you practiced while your shen is modulating the sickness as its primary state, in other words, you can't stop thinking about the sickness while practicing. And even then it would be very rare for the sickness to consolidate like that.

Circulating your qi with qigong exercises or any other method you're comfortable with while sick, will improve recovery.

>>40931770
>>40934700
just browsing, no dogs in this fight, but holy shit christfags are the most insufferable of all. the smug certainty and intellectual incuriousness is disgusting. the dominant religion of your culture just happens to be 100% true? wow dude damn, what luck

>>40936166
So I'm not going to critique the validity of your claim as much as what it implies

Firstly Yiquan itself is not affiliated with TCM or Taoism, and is a 20th century martial arts practice. Their version of ZZ is completely different from the packing tonifying and sealing version Taoism typically teaches. Yiquan teaches more of a venting version and they believe it may help disperse external Qi. Even then they recommend using it sparingly if acutely ill.
Yiquan does however recommend ZZ for chronic illnesses, and this is a valid interpretation, Wuji Stance as the most basic form of ZZ is recommended for many chronic illnesses.
It also depends on if you're actually sick, or if you just have pathogenic Qi in your field. The latter can potentially be dispersed, but if you have a fever its a bad idea because the pathogen is already inside you. Even in the case of in-field pathogenic Qi you still want to keep ZZ short and limited to a few minutes.

Tl;dr: Yiquan lines that say “stand when sick” are assuming a regulatory, dispersive version and/or chronic contexts, not acute illnesses.

I'm waiting for this to turn into stereotypical cultivator "You have eyes but cannot see Mt Tai" speak

>>40936244
This explanation makes sense, circulating and building while focused on bad things would increase and further bad things. This is the kind of thing I thought his "build Qi with wrong intent" was referring to

>>40936263
>Their version of ZZ is completely different from the packing tonifying and sealing version Taoism typically teaches
Can you please elaborate? I am very interested in ZZ. In one of his 2 major books, the current linage holder of Yiquan teaches to "seal" the Qi after practice in the lower belly, is this something different than what you're referring to here?

His other book does indeed say to do ZZ for extra time when you have a flu, and i did it myself when I had the flu and it seems to have helped. I have mostly learned about ZZ from this and am open to new knowledge regarding it, that is why I am asking

>>40936210
>more arguments from unearned authority.
>I'm better than a real Qigong practitioner
You are an incredibly arrogant condescending person

I would advise anyone reading what this anon says to consider what he said seriously. He is NOT a Qigong practitioner, has no affiliation to Taoism as a lineage, and everything he's saying is his own deluded self-centered perspective based on what he read in books.
He knows just enough to be a danger to himself and other, but not enough to know why he's dangerous.
A perfect example is this pseudery explanation of illness >>40936244
It doesnt matter if you're thinking about the illness, it matters if you're passing Qi through the pathogenic areas of the body as it circulates through you. Even a badic practitioner could tell you this, but anon here cannot bevause he only has book learning and personal experience.
He's basically a McDojo bro.

>>40930077
nice doubledoubs. do you generally make comparisons to all of the average huemans for every statement you read on the internet or just mine?
esoteric - eso outside teric the earth - outside the earth - context that which comes from outside the earth
>No amount of dumbing it down will help this issue. Otherwise the knowledge becomes useless.
true fax

>>40936349
ἔσω (esō) literally means within, inside or inwardly, coming from ancient greek.
Teric is somewhat like belonging to something.
So esoteric would be belonging to the inner.
It also makes sense that way. The opposite would be exo, exoteric.
Teric doesn't mean earth, although I see a subtle connection via belonging. Earthy element of stability.
Either way, making stuff up won't get us far, even if it's entertaining.
No clue what you want to say with your first sentence.

>>40936303
Please, stop throwing tantrums, i can't deal with you performative purists.

The """pathogenic areas""" are cleaned the same way blockages are by mindful circulation. Even if not at the same rate or efficacy, all those things vary from person to person anyway.

Look, people are free to take my information and judge by themselves. Whoever does will realize i haven't deviated from the fundamentals of daoist cultivation. And i'm ok with you trying to "kick me out" of qigong, i already said i'm not a qigong practitioner and that i use more overarching and personal methodology. And you're also right to say i have no lineage affiliation.

So if the taoist/cultivation experts could "refine" their understanding on how to attain immortality, please do so.
What are the concise, clear steps. Why are they working? What is the logic?
How could you explain other systems working?
Why is reality the way it is?
Etc.

I also appreciate anything else like western inner alchemy, contemplative practices, meditation, sorcery, magick, etc.

>>40936386
Immortality has been discussed plenty in the thread. Are you talking exclusively about physical immortality maybe?

>>40936260
The best and brightest of humanity coalesced around a single compelling truth over the course of ~2,000 years? Yeah. Ain’t quite “luck.”

>The best and brightest of humanity coalesced around a single compelling truth over the course of ~2,000 years?
But enough about Buddhism.

>>40936407
No, he’s saying “cultivate your yang yang bang a gong get it on” is a very vague instruction without any clear steps to follow. This thread has been 99% academic and only 1% practical.

>>40936382
Im not trying to kick you out of anything, you were never "in" to begin with.
I'm just trying to inform others that another peraspective exists because you continually represent your OPINIONS as objective facts and only admit you might be wrong when pressed by someone who actually has lineage ties to back it up.

You WILL get someone killed doing what you're doing. I hope you learn some humility.

>>40936432
>Saaar yuo must eat cow dung!!
>DO NOT REDEEM THE CARD!!
>SAAAAAR!!!!!

>>40936371
based shell earth enthusiast, all the cosmos above exists asymptotically compressed in the firmament ie terra firma
>Teric doesn't mean earth
terra means earth, teric means of the earth
>No clue what you want to say with your first sentence.
>Because the average humans mind is filled with simple surface level desires, they naturally find the depths of biology esoteric.
a comment on this comparison

what would you do if you were immortal?

>>40936441
What does your pajeet impression have to do with the post? Clearly you are not amongst the best or brightest

Poor OP

No one so far has gave you an actual useful reply, here is one
You will die because God said so, period
You think all the people who has the ability to print money out of thin air wants to die? Why do you think they dont invest in immortality at all? They know its pointless, some of them may try to look and even become younger however they always end up looking like botched freaks proven how God cannot be 'defeated'
If God didnt exist we would have reached immortality a long ass time ago however we have to pay for obeying the Serpent and we will die, obviously in this board filled with cock-sucking satanists no one will mention that true nvke, so no, you wont ever reach immortality and the only thing that science is capable of doing so far is at best improving your health in your old age, nothing else, all the occult teachings must be some truths mixed with lies feed by demons to humankind so can try wasting your time and effort by following those dead end paths at the end God said one thing and it will be done, period, they may try to do the most crazy experiments on rats but at the end those are rats, its all so futile because they dont want to accept the truth

>>40936407
Nothing has been discussed. While I appreciate the effort and sharing, it’s mostly mindless bashing. Insulting anonymous posters and fearmongering. Useless. This thread is about actually achieving immortality. Or at least the first step: having a direction that is logical. That makes sense. I understand that this might be weird from the perspective of a dogmatic person, or a narrow minded person deep in practice who is unable to share their contemplations. This is a great opportunity to face inadequacy, humble up and grow.

>>40936434
I've laid out a pretty comprehensive map already. I can share my personal methodology and break it down into steps if you want, although not everyone starts at the exact same spot, and i might incur the wrath of the qigong anon that serves an immortal from an ancient lineage of cultivators.

My personal methodology relies from the start on being able to feel qi radiation from the body, i call the technique "somatic vipassana", because it's essentially just buddhist vipassana but with a daoist cultivation focus. You need to sit or lie down and relax, then focus on your whole body at once softly. This is will stretch your awareness to the whole body, it's usually stuck to your head area.

Do this while scanning for a "static noise" sensation emanating from your body. If you have no experience it'll be easier to feel while holding your breath, so you can hold it for 10 seconds while you scan the body, take a couple breathers and repeat. You need to locate this sensation of a "staticky field" emanating from your body, no matter how subtle. This shouldn't be a big hurdle, most people will be able to notice it if they do as i'm saying.

Once you've located that field, you then move to the actual vipasana part of the technique. Take a comfortable sitting pose, i've always used seiza. Stretch your shen or awareness so it covers the whole body, locate the field again and then latch your attention onto it, softly. Your objective is to observe the field with this set up for as long as you can. Gradually the perception of the field will grow clearer. Instead of projecting a centimeter or two off the body will project further and further, it will gain new qualities such as pressure or temperature. You'll start feeling it inside your body as well in the form of currents.

By practicing this regularly you're cultivating your qi and your shen, and passively cleansing channels as well. If you're serious about it practice at least one uninterrupted hour a day. (1/2)

>>40936442
If I were immortal, that is free, I would explore the vastness of infinity.
Which means leaving behind earth and humanity.

>>40936534
>having a direction that is logical
From a purely rational view, it makes the most sense if you’re seeking immortality to align yourself with the source of all life. All things perishable will perish, even the yin ghosts, even the vajra bodies, even the ascended masters. Only God can deliver on the promise of life everlasting.

>>40936382
>The """pathogenic areas""" are cleaned the same way blockages are by mindful circulation.
pure schizo thinking.

>>40936540
You'll gradually start feeling this field as an enveloping gas cloud or flame around you even when you're not practicing the "somatic vipassana" technique. And also gradually you will start differentiating qualities in the currents of qi inside your body.

When feeling the field comes naturally and effortlessly you can start adding compressions during the practice. With compression i mean taking the field and compressing it into the lower dantian spot, and then letting go, allowing the field to expand back into its original shape. Do these compressions two or three times every 10 minutes while you're practicing the somatic vipassana. At this point your channels will be clear enough as to not warp or scar by prematurely stacking qi into a core.

By repeating these compressions the core will start feeling like an actual physical ball under your navel, roughly the size of a tennis ball, somewhat smaller, and it will have a natural spin. This becomes a qi battery and a qi modulator as you keep on compressing it. At some point it'll become automatic and the core will gather qi without you having to do manual compressions.


The path up to this point is completely harmless if you do as i say. Pain is normal while compressing the core, either in the form of sharp pain shooting through different parts of the body or burning. If it becomes unbearable you stop compressing and focus on the vipassana aspect of the practice until the circulation naturally stabilizes again.

And always, always use diaphragmatic breathing while practicing, and ideally throughout the day too, take the time to turn it into an automatic action. Also inhale and exhale only through your nose when practicing. (2/2)

>>40936540
What you’re describing is basically vipassanā body-scanning with a Daoist paint job. Buddhism and Daoism don’t approach energy the same way: vipassanā trains awareness of sensation, but it doesn’t establish or stabilize qi flow. In Daoist lineages, you don’t start by latching onto a ‘staticky field’, you start by grounding, building dantian, and opening orbit safely. Mixing methods without realizing the differences is how people confuse perception with cultivation.

>>40936540
>>40936540
Thanks for the effort.
I can at this point easily feel the static, and subtle changes like heat, sometimes cold, tingles and oftentimes vibrations or thumping strong pulses. I’ve been „dabbling“ with growing awareness or gaining more energy for a long time, but very recklessly and self reliant. I have no access to teachers, only books and my own intuition.
At some point I was thinking I developed neurological issues or psychosis.
Because as the awareness of these phenomena grows, I’ve noticed a growth in sensory malleability and attention focus. Dreams becoming very vivid, almost waking up in dreams, having a much better memory and imagination of all senses.
But this also is an issue as the vividness sometimes becomes intrusive. Like hearing clear sounds (hissing, high pitch frequency, very unique sounds)/voices I did not consciously imagine. And the tingling/static etc is almost permanent, except when I focus on anything not my body.
It’s interesting to experience, but I fail to see the benefit. I can lock onto the supposed elixir field and it radiates a pleasant warmth within this etheric „static“ form.
But it comes close to becoming insane. The only benefit I can think of is improved mental clarity in some ways and a much stronger focus and intent.

>>40936550
and if then you discovered the earth was all there was?

>>40936616
What are you talking about kek. I've already explained this is a syncretic technique that takes advantage of vipassana and how daoist cultivation approaches their energy framework.

If you knew the purpose of vipassana you'd understand what is doing to your qi and to your shen when the right object of meditation is being used.

>you start by grounding, building dantian, and opening orbit safely
Again, what are you talking about anon? I know what qigong does, grounding is inefficient and building the dantian requires clean control of your qi, otherwise one's just larping. Which is what happens with most qigong practitioners and instructors, specially in the west, they end up larping because their approach is too inefficient and results are underwhelming.

With the technique i've described you're taking the most efficient path, stop worrying so much about what your master says and more about how things actually work.

>>40936656
I am sure earth is absolutely not all that is.
But in the fictitious scenario that it would be, maybe because of some dogmatic belief carried along and made real, I would use my immortality, which is freedom and therefore endless time, to endlessly pursue ways to expand reality until I have what I want.

>>40936669
what do you want beyond eternity 69 gets?

>>40936648
What you describe is successful cultivation of shen. You should adopt a regular meditative technique that serves as a regulator and grounds your shen, you must have one already but you need to practice it regularly and for longer if you're having these issues.

>>40936692
I definitely have to practice more diligently. Thanks for the heads up.

>>40936669
oh and what have you touched beyond the earth to stand in the absolution of surety?

>>40936700
I haven’t touch anything, I’ve just realized that entire other worlds can exist and flow, like time, inside a person. Whatever inside means. The consciously disengaged awareness. People call them dreams. Having shallow experiences due to their lack of a spirit. But those dreams are realities and they can become very real. Unfortunately, it seems like the world and society is designed to keep you hooked and blind, only leaving a little window to peek outside the prison of the senses.
>>40936680
More freedom

>>40936717
>More freedom
everything is chained to everything.

Did anyone here read John Kreiters magnum opus trilogy? It seems to correlate with some concepts talked about here. Especially the first book Magnum Opus talks about refining „energy“/attention into the philosophers stone within the dan tian, which comes very close to core formation talked about here.

>>40936746
Yes, but I differ from a starving African child in the depths of idiocy. There is a way. A way that is relentless and ruthless pursuit of independence, freedom, growth.

>>40936769
again with the 69s
>but I differ from a starving African child in the depths of idiocy.
> Having shallow experiences due to their lack of a spirit.
you sure look down on everyone
> There is a way. A way that is relentless and ruthless pursuit of independence, freedom, growth
im not posting the slug again mang, if your lore is poor thats on you.

>>40936540
For a more robust method, I would recommend the outer dissolving process taught by B.K. Frantzis

>>40936791
The outer dissolving process is like a road with guardrails compared to somatic vipassana. It's safer but slower, and i don't take safety into account because the somatic vipassana approach is pretty much completely safe. People just hate any type of pain.

>>40936848
"somatic vipassana" was made up by you
you shouldnt be feeling pain
you literally talk about how it will "passively" clear channels, what about "actively" clear channels? The intentional dissolving process will go deeper and intentionally
not to sound like an old fogey but maybe the guardrails are a good thing and syncretic self made practice is going to have gaps in knowledge or execution

>>40936854
And the outer dissolving process was made up by Bruce, what's your point?

Throughout the whole of traditional daoist cultivation pain has been a guideline. This obsession with getting rid of pain at all costs has become a hindrance.

>>40936876
>And the outer dissolving process was made up by Bruce, what's your point?
Frantzis is a lineage holder and trained with numerous well known masters back in the day
who are you?

>This obsession with getting rid of pain at all costs has become a hindrance.
theres a difference between discomfort and pain
any time you are building a new skill in body process, you will have some discomfort as your body adjusts
pain, on the other hand, especially if you are experiencing SHARP pain, ESPECIALLY when compressing chi is uh.... yeah thats not good

>>40929947 (OP)
>Dying completely negates the individuals efforts
if you still thinks this you haven't yet understood what life really is
or who or what you really are for that matter too

>>40936884
I mean, you're free to discard what i say because you don't know who i am. As for pain, sharp pain is pretty common with blocked meridians. You will mostly feel it in fact when you're compressing qi because it shoots and pulsates with more force. This to me is normal and has never caused me any trouble, they've always cleared after a day or two of compressing. Pain from regular circulation is almost always in the form of intense burning, which i find more troublesome than sharp pain because it can get real bad, like acid pumping in your veins kinda bad. This won't happen with passive cleaning of the channels though, it happens when you manually circulate qi into blocked channels and don't realize there's a blockage there.

>>40936917
>This to me is normal and has never caused me any trouble
well this is part of the problem
something may work for you but be idiosyncratic to you and your body
the advantage with a more robust method, and especially when recommending practices to other people, is its going to be tested against a bunch of different body types and situations
not to be a lineage glazer or anything but why WOULDN'T you round out your skillset with methods that are out there for relatively cheap?

>This won't happen with passive cleaning of the channels though, it happens when you manually circulate qi into blocked channels and don't realize there's a blockage there.
This is partly why Frantzis focuses on building awareness, clearing channels, and downward flow first before running energy through the system.
This is basically how people burned themselves out on Mantak Chia in previous decades - they jumped right into running energy through their system and didn't realize they were cruisin for a bruisin until they blew a circuit
Sharp pain may subside for you.... or you may one day encounter a sharp pain that doesnt subside, or a sharp pain that actually damages something

you're clearly well informed and used that information to build a system that works for you. but especially for the other anons in this thread looking for recommendations, you gotta be careful (i wont go so far as the TCM anon did but i do understand that point of view)

Nice larp you've got going on here, hope you are having fun kiddos

Normal ones kick ball outside but this is cool too I guess

>>40936540
>>40936612
At this point, I'm much more interested in the sources that you gained this knowledge from, even if I test the method myself, so that I can do my own research too.

1. What is the source for the method where you scan for "static noise" (I doubt it's called "static noise" in that source book, unless it's a Western book that uses such terminology for the sake of simplification). If you didn't get it from a specific book, then what was the source (and if it's a specific practice, please state it, and if it's from a specific master/teacher please state their name too)?

2. What is the source of the Vipassana and compression technique (same specifics as with question #1)?

Thank you for any information (assuming you haven't left this thread and I was too late).

>>40936934
I think Bruce's method covers all the bases and i don't have any problem with people using it. Definitely better than relying on your average qigong instructor or getting lost in overly pointless tradition that doesn't serve the interests of the practitioner, only those of the school.

I just have different views on pain standards and tolerance. I think modern standards are too careful.

>>40936951
Years ago, before i was into cultivation, i randomly realized i could generate "bursts" of some sort of "ticklish current" in my pelvic area, and then move it other places from there. Although movement was janky and jumpy because of blockages. At some point later on i made the connection it could be something like qi and got into daoist cultivation in order to see if i could make it fit into that framework. This is the time when i burned myself a handful of times by sending these bursts into various parts of my body while playing around. Even had a seizure when i sent it to my head for a couple minutes.

I stopped playing with it altogether and tried to get a formal daoist base to see if i could do something with it. After a while i again, randomly noticed that my body was emitting some sort of static noise feeling if i paid careful attention while being still. I assumed it could be some sort of qi radiation from the internal flows. I knew about buddhist meditative techniques and thought using that field as a meditation object for vipassana could be useful to see where it led, and if i was right. Practiced it for a while and i was right, it amplified my perception of the field and it led to sensing internal flows.

Then i decided to implement traditional cultivation techniques into it and polished it along the way. I had scares in the past like i said, so i made sure to understand the cultivation fundamentals and warnings. That coupled with the actual feedback of practice made me feel completely safe. You have to factor in your own instincts.

>>40936664
Ok, at this point it doesn't looks like I was late and you left the thread. I'll check back in an hour to bump the thread one more time, but after that I'll just ask DeepSeek to give me the origin for the practices you described lol.

It's crazy how you had that back and forth with that other guy and I post like 2 minutes after and now the thread is dead.

>>40937082
>I'll just ask DeepSeek to give me the origin for the practices you described
lmao why didnt you just do that before
you write like a proooooompter and whine like one too

>>40937080
Too many coincidences, I posted this: >>40937082 1 minute after you lol.

Well, looks like it's something you discovered through trial and error. I was hoping it was something with a definite source.

Looks like I will be asking DeepSeek for a source on the phenomena you described. Though you've already "found your practice" I suggest you do the same. With a more definite source you may find ways to improve what you are already doing.

>>40937085
>lmao why didn't you just do that before
It's better to get things from a direct source, AI is a last resort for finding the source yourself.

>>40937085
>you write like a proooooompter and whine like one too
People in the far past only had encyclopedias, us today, we have AI. Imagine how foolish it would sound for the people of the past to invent an insult for people that went to encyclopedia to query things or to seek knowledge.

>>40937080
>I just have different views on pain standards and tolerance. I think modern standards are too careful.
>i randomly realized i could generate "bursts" of some sort of "ticklish current" in my pelvic area, and then move it other places from there
>Even had a seizure when i sent it to my head for a couple minutes.
>You have to factor in your own instincts.
damn anon i gave you the benefit of the doubt, but turns out you're actually retarded

for any anons in this thread and for the TCM anon, this is exactly the type of shit people warn about when figuring out on your own.

Pick up some books by B.K. Frantzis. He's known for going slow and steady, but you also wont accidentally give yourself a seizure lmao

>>40937115
go read a book slophog

kek

>>40937124
My current practice is perfectly fine, safe and efficient. When i first found out years ago that i could generate these bursts of qi in my body i knew little to nothing about cultivation, so it was like a little kid finding a knife.

Besides, most people won't be able to feel and circulate qi without deliverately developing the proprioception for it first. So you can't weaponize my situation since it's a "rare occurrence".

>>40937124
>for any anons in this thread and for the TCM anon, this is exactly the type of shit people warn about when figuring out on your own.
I'm the guy who just asked him for his sources, and yeah it sounds risky, but honestly doing things this way has the most risk and the most reward, because it's a "natural way". Do you know how many people I've talked to online that have said they've practiced qi gong for years and have never felt qi energy (as in literally felt it), and then they say some coping bullshit like "it doesn't really matter" and "the practice is about health and wellness".

That's the usual end result of taking the beaten path. You spend years doing a monotonous practice and if you don't give up because you get little to no results after a lot of time, you'll maybe begin to get some results.

Now I'm not just going to jump right into his jerryrigged practice, I'll do some more research first. But on some level I still like his approach. I mean think about it, the people who disovered this shit had to go through trial and error too, and whatever they passed down has likely been watered down over the centuries or even purposefully falsified for the sake of gatekeeping.

Also, so people pick up on certain things better for their own reasons and may make their own discoveries based on that too. I have my own particular experiences myself that made his practice pique my interest.

>Pick up some books by B.K. Frantzis. He's known for going slow and steady
This sounds like 90% of people will just end up spending a decade plus doing special movements, special poses, and breathing exercises, with no real results to show for it.


>>40937140
>go read a book slophog
I will, but I'm going to find the right book first, then practice what it states.

Be sure to do some more research on your own method, you may ironically be doing a half assed version of your own custom method, and you may find a way to make it better.

The older the book the better.

>>40937168
you know back in the day you had to learn chinese
go to china
walk up hill both ways
try to find a master
now you can just swipe a credit card
such value

>>40937180
keep prompting, surely deepseek will give you the practice you are looking for, scraped and cobbled together from the finest mongolian basketweaving seizure inducing schizos
it would be ridiculous to buy books or, god forbid, travel to a teacher to try and learn it yourself from people who can do it
surely AI will save you from fruitlessly waving your arms around the air!
i mean just think about it, why do the practice yourself when you can crowdsource from hundreds or thousands of other people?
just makes more sense

>>40937200
1. I don't think you understand what I'm going to do. I'm not asking DeepSeek to "generate" a practice for me (that wouldn't make sense)

I'm asking DeepSeek to give me a list of texts (preferably old texts, you set a time range), of which the practices and phenomena that you described can be found. Best possible find would be an old chinese text that has a modern translation (and by modern and mean translated before the 2000's).

Then I go to the usually websites and download those texts and review them to see which ones more closely match what you describe (the close the better). The one that most closely aligns with what you described (which is a new process I've never seen described before) will be the best source and will likely give me a better starting point and understanding (and you too).

2. I am not a lucky person. You got lucky to discover what you did. I am not you. I may even be lacking to talent to even sense what you sensed. So it just makes more sense for me to look for a more direct source that can supply me with more specifics and even prerequisites to increase my chances of success, or even help me find a practice that might be more suited to my special skills. There is something specific I learned I could do very easily in the same way you discovered that "tingle", and if I can find a source I can maybe create my own method more suited to me.

It's just that simple.

>>40937239
Ah but sir you fail to see that the working of the crafting of the nonphysical vessel is itself a trap for fools who think themselves wise who stumble into a pitch of pseudo physicality which locks their dumb plasmoid feet to this plane of existence and tethers their dumbass plasmoid numbskull spirits to the earth’s ionosphere or to sources of energy here on the surface from which they can vampirize their frailly continued existence for however long they can keep up that dumb and cruel charade

>>40937239
no no i understand what you are wanting to do, i just dont think it will work
the reason why i dont think it will work is because this is actually somewhat specialized knowledge which is rare enough to find in china let alone described plainly via text (most of it is dressed up in metaphor), let alone described plainly via text in english

i mean do me a favor and read the "secret of the golden flower" and tell me if that gives you anything practical.

furthermore, most AI that i have used to research qigong, taoism, meditation, etc, use the "usual suspects", guys like Mantak Chia, Thomas Clear, Carl Jung (shudder), why? because they are the most prolific, most discussed authors if you've been scraping the internet for decades (as i suspect most of these big data companies have been).

and lastly, i highly doubt there will be enough contextual knowledge for it to pair the descriptions of seizure anons subjective experience of his body and energy to anything its scraped and indexed to give you anything valuable

fortunately for the big data ai companies you are the target midwid audience that they are exploiting to great profit so you will continue running your little hamster wheel prompting and reading but not actually practicing and thinking you are somehow ahead of the curve

>>40937264
>Ah but sir you fail to see that the working of the crafting of the nonphysical vessel is itself a trap
Still more entertaining than not doing it though. Even if I died in the attempt I'd be satisfied.

>>40937269
>i mean do me a favor and read the "secret of the golden flower" and tell me if that gives you anything practical.
I haven't read the book, but I've skimmed it before, and yes, it doesn't give anything practical and that's why I no longer have the book saved.

>furthermore, most AI that i have used to research qigong, taoism, meditation, etc, use the "usual suspects"
You weren't specific with your search criteria. If you used a "year range" filter you'd filter out a lot of the "cash grab" type authors and you'd get texts from monks, etc that were translated to english in the 80's and 90's, etc. I usually ask it to start listing results starting at a specific year and keep adding to the list going from older to newer, and once I see certain results pop up I stop.

It's only the old books that matter anyways, we all know that once this stuff became commercial most stuff will just be garbage, but you can find a few gems in the old books (some things that genuinely help with meditation or give insight).

>i highly doubt there will be enough contextual knowledge for it to pair the descriptions of seizure anons subjective experience of his body and energy to anything its scraped and indexed to give you anything valuable
Yeah, but ironically I don't get any contextual knowledge from just your two comments anyways, so even if you are right it still makes more sense to seek out other sources to get a more solid base, and maybe I might stumble upon something during that search.

Anyways, still thanks for your post, hopefully it leads to something.

>>40937311
im not seizure anon and i dont recommend following anything he says

Damo Mitchell's book recommended here >>40932125 gives a good breakdown on Taoist alchemical practices. It's not a "basic" book and he has others if you are interested in qigong. It will also give you the theory on the Jing/Chi/Shen and working with those different layers as your practice deepens. He has an energetic dissolving method that is high level and similar to what seizure-anon described.

B.K. Frantzis' book recommended here >>40936791 teaches a more in depth energetic dissolving method that is more refined that seizure-anon's made up method.

idk how old you are but
>which is a new process I've never seen described before
nothing seizure-anon described is particularly new or exciting. anyone starting to do energy work will eventually start feeling their "field", and will eventually be able to grow/shrink it, move it, compress it, and detect blockages in it.

Rather than going for books i would recommend looking for teachers/authors who
>trained with a reputable lineage (so their practices arent just made up)
>have some attainment in whatever it is you are trying to learn (so you know they can walk the walk)

that will get your further than proooooompting much faster

>>40937338
Let's be honest dude, if something is commercial, it's very unlikely that it will actually work. It's the crazy jerryrigged methods that are closer to the source and more likely to produce results.

>i would recommend looking for teachers/authors who
Why do you assume they will even teach the legit stuff and aren't just handing down some bastardized or half assed version to regular students. We all know that it's only the direct disciple who is the lineage holder that gets the legit stuff. More likely than not all of these modern day products you are recommending to me is just some watered down garbage being peddled to Western idiots with low standards and expectations, so all they need to get is a "health boost" or "feeling more energized" (vague subjective nonsense with not practical or testable feats) and they will be satisfied.

I highly doubt any decent methods are being spread commercially in such a common way. Because if that was the case, by now they most effective method would already be known and tested because of all the people raving about the results. The reason why results are so "spotty" and the narrative is "it's different from everyone" is exactly because a "legit" method isn't being taught.

I have found a few things before that have produced minor results, and they were all from old texts (or trial and error - something I randomly tried on a whim for a few days - which is why that guy's posts stood out to me).

>He has an energetic dissolving method that is high level and similar to what seizure-anon described.
Then I guess I'll see it in my "prrrroooooompt" search results lol.

>>40937426
>Let's be honest dude, if something is commercial, it's very unlikely that it will actually work
no thats bullshit excuse made my brokies and college students
i know, i used to be a broke college student
there ARE people who cash in on people with poor discernment, that is true, which is why you need to enter the practice with discernment, skepticism, and self awareness

>It's the crazy jerryrigged methods that are closer to the source and more likely to produce results.
yes and no
the value of a legitimate tradition and lineage is they've been jerryrigging their practices for hundreds if not thousands of years.
schizos on the internet have maybe thrown one lifetime into it, at BEST

>I highly doubt any decent methods are being spread commercially in such a common way
this is cope you are telling yourself to avoid committing to any practice

again, you're kind of right - the BEST way to learn is to be born into a family or be the inner door disciple of an authentic lineage master. anything short of that... well you can either try stuff til you find something that works, or just give up

>Then I guess I'll see it in my "prrrroooooompt" search results lol.
kek if you think the good shit isnt being taught commercially it CERTAINLY isnt being taught in AI kek

>>40937476
>it CERTAINLY isnt being taught in AI kek
Nobody is asking the AI to teach a method, I'm asking it to list older sources (if you didn't know that). I don't think you see the irony in telling me - "No, don't ask the AI to give you sources to these older books, instead go read these modern books I'm recommending to you".

>the value of a legitimate tradition and lineage is they've been jerryrigging their practices for hundreds if not thousands of years.
Once again, you have no proof of whether or not you are actually learning the truly legitimate traditional method of that lineage, or you are just being purposefully taught a watered down version exactly because you aren't a direct disciple, and that method itself may be designed to hardwire a "cap" on your potential.

It reminds me of that cliche thing you'd see in all of those Manhuas, where the energy cultivation technique being taught to common people is purposefully designed with a flaw to be a lower level version of the legit method, and also purposefully lowers the practitioners potential so that they will never become more proficient or powerful than the lineage household.

So in either case i'd rather risk the seizure with the freedom and potential to discover more as a plus, than to just hope that asian culture (which has traditionally been know to block knowledge from outsiders as a custom) will somehow not do what it has always done.

When I see a practice pop up where everyone has proven results that are scientifically measured and tested, then I'll maybe go the extra mile to spend money to learn and practice. But if it's all just going to be a gamble anyways, I'd much rather gamble on myself.

>>40937551
>It reminds me of that cliche thing you'd see in all of those Manhuas, where the energy cultivation technique being taught to common people is purposefully designed with a flaw to be a lower level version of the legit method, and also purposefully lowers the practitioners potential so that they will never become more proficient or powerful than the lineage household.
ah yes im beginning to see the problem

>So in either case i'd rather risk the seizure
well dont worry you've already got brain damage

>When I see a practice pop up where everyone has proven results that are scientifically measured and tested
my brother in christ you talk about irony but do YOU not see the irony in that statement hahahaha look around you are on /x/

>I'd much rather gamble on myself.
just remember you arent gambling on yourself - you're gambling on a schizo on an underwater mongolian basket weaving forum who game himself a fucking seizure haha

all you slophogs are brain damaged for real

>>40937566
>my brother in christ you talk about irony but do YOU not see the irony in that statement hahahaha look around you are on /x/
You started the irony first by speaking as if money is a solution to legit spiritual practice and enlightenment. My point was, if I'm going to "materialist route", why half ass my logic, I should atleast expect some material proof if I'm going to spend my material money.... right?

>you're gambling on a schizo on an underwater mongolian basket weaving forum who game himself a fucking seizure
If somebody gave themselves a seizure just doing a meditation technique, then just indicates that the meditation technique is something special to trigger such extreme phenomena.

>well dont worry you've already got brain damage
At the end of the day, what are your actual feats and how many years have you practice those traditional methods, because I suspect you are like every other person like your type I've encountered on forums online, and they've never even triggered a seizure lol, much more sense qi energy and controlled it to do something practical and undeniable that confirmed the existence of qi energy for them. If all you have to show for this is "I can feel some tingles" (which anyone can do with a single Wim Hof breathing session), then why should anyone even care what you have to say.

At the end of the day, it's the results that matter, and from my perspective the guy who had the seizure will probably progress faster than you and will probably reach some level grander than you.

A safe method that ultimately produces no significant results, is useless.

I'll let you have the "last say" if you want, you seem like the type to want that. I'll end it here.

I actually did find a pretty interesting old book already.

>>40937626
>I should atleast expect some material proof if I'm going to spend my material money.... right?
again, half right, half wrong
you arent wrong to expect the proof to be in the pudding
but if you are looking for any remotely scientifically acceptable results for anything esoteric, the answer any scientist will tell you is "none of it is scientific, otherwise it would be taught it schools".

so at some point, you gotta think for yourself and find what works for you.

>If somebody gave themselves a seizure just doing a meditation technique, then just indicates that the meditation technique is something special to trigger such extreme phenomena.
that is certainly one way of looking at it
you can also drop a brick on your foot, that will give you an extreme phenomenon

>what are your actual feats and how many years have you practice those traditional methods
i edge for hours while trolling schizos on /x/

>I actually did find a pretty interesting old book already.
oh man im edging so hard right now and begging you for the sauce but i know you wont give it to me because you wanted to give me the last word which you thought would be taking the high road but you had to get one last shot in so you're gonna deny me as some proof that your method is so much better oh no i feel the tingle from my pp moving up into my brain aaahhhhh

The key thing to understand is that the limited, finite, mortal, embodied human being cannot ever be immortal. What you can do is transmute and transform your inner essence, and learn how to remain free and conscious as that essence. Then, death will only kill your body.
Some paths and practices also suggest that the "astral body" can be purified and "saved" or made immortal, allowing the individual being to maintain some kind of continuity even after death. But this life will still not be identical to the type of life we live here as mortals. Memory may still exist, for example, but it won't operate in the same way that it does for mortal beings with brains. So on and so forth.

>>40937338
Kek, now they're referring to me as "seizure anon" despite filling this thread with first hand useful information based not only on personal experience and hard work but also on traditional study of daoist frameworks. I guess that's telling.

>>40937426
My somatic vipassana technique is completely safe and even if you're not randomly "gifted" with subtle proprioception, as long as you can get a hold of the sensation of the static field that emanates from the body, you can start practicing it. Something as gentle and simple as vipassana will strengthen your shen when stretching your awareness on your whole body, and will deepen the perception of your qi while using the field as the object of meditation.

Having your shen/awareness stretched over your whole body will naturally and passively start cleaning your channels without much pressure at all too. The main point of the technique at the beginning is for you to develop perception of qi throughout the body. Its flow and its radiating field that extends beyond the skin. It's only after you can feel these things clearly and readily that you should start with compressions into the lower dantian.

There's much more beyond that but you should study the fundamentals of their cultivation framework and get a solid idea of their structure. By the time you're compressing qi into the lower dantian you'll know what comes next and at what cost if you mess up. You won't mess up if you're mindful and understand fundamentally what you're doing though.

You're free to use my methodology or any other's, just don't let people here indoctrinate you into puritanical qigong or their wuxing fantasies when they can't even circulate qi efficiently or at all and they try to show up through the "pedigree" of their master's lineage. Learn the fundamentals, understand them when applied, and practice regularly.

>>40937954
>but also on traditional study of daoist frameworks
citations of said daoist frameworks would go a long way

>>40937979
When i started to gather information i first read "the secret of the golden flower", the one with Jung commentary. Then i was mostly carried by translations of Thomas Cleary. Pretty sure the next thing i read after the golden flower was the book of balance and harmony, that or "the taoist canon selections", but pretty sure it was the book of balance and harmony.

"The inner teachings of taoism" too, pretty short and made me realize how chasing certain outcomes during cultivation was interfering with it, so it saved me a lot of trouble early on. Even though the whole point here is for you to understand the overarching fundamentals of energetic dyanmcis, jing - qi - shen. This is mostly an instinctual process that you will get from experience during practice and the background knowledge, it'll feel like a light bulb moment or a realization, and you'll eventually build a solid scaffolding for your cultivation.

>>40929947 (OP)
Here are some hints…
Taoist Sexual Practices
“The Three Corpses”
Rainbow Bodies
The Royal Secret

>>40937954
>just don't let people here indoctrinate you into puritanical qigong
That would never happen me, I've spoken to too many purists online that ironically have no results and a lot claiming they've never even felt qi energy, respite raving about how I should practice the specific method they've been training in for years. I honestly think a lot of people get caught up in the "sunken cost fallacy" so they refuse to quit because then they'd have to admit that they wasted years on a subpar, inefficient and ineffective method.

Though there is a method I need to test first for a few weeks before I even attempt your method.

This post here: >>40937979 wasn't me btw.

>>40937954
I'd bet you're actually just guessing which Qi is what.
You don't have any anchors.

>>40936773
I could say some roundabout shit like „I wanna meet some cool people and have oh so much fucking fun yeehhhaaaaaa!!“ or „if I get immortal - I will buy a HOUSE!“
But why the fuck would I waste my immortality and opportunity on that?
The only worthy goal as an immortal is continual growth. Of course I would also chill out a lot, enjoy nice tea, or buy a house. But actually, who knows. Maybe at that stage you have transcended the causality of this world and can just spawn tea or imagine a real house. So I’m pointing to the crystallization of my probable intent as an immortal.

Yes I have the tendency of a cynic, but in personal I’m much more affectionate and considerate.

>>40936890
Can you absolutely prove your little head canon though?

>>40936612
Ok, what comes after the core formation? Or is does a formed core grant immortality? I think that’s pretty absurd. Wouldn’t many more people do this then?
There is still a huge gap between energetic awareness and compression to becoming a heavenly immortal

>>40938351
>he only worthy goal as an immortal is continual growth
cancerous. i earnestly hope your the exception but ive never met anyone who holds freedom most dear and desires to be elsewhere who wasnt running from the problems they made at home.
you sound cute though tits or nothing?

>>40938606
Not really problems, but realizations. Life on earth is a miserable lesson. The people who succumb to its hardship or pleasures are the currents of dross that make up this worlds fuel. Endlessly pushing new life out of the revered fleshgates. The destiny of a mortal is to give in and accept. They latch onto cope to better not confront their end, which is inevitable. But instead of striving for freedom from this slavers, other differently put if you prefer, instead of finally learning the lessons this world has to teach, they worship this school and die without progression. Like clinging to the chairs in a classroom. They are so comfortable, make sense to their trained minds, keep your ass warm and firmly directed towards where the master wants them to look.

Escapism goes against the will for immortality. The way to immortality is seeing the world as it is, as viscerally as possible, without giving in to delusion, worldly cope or loose acceptance. It is getting rid of all attachments to it, becoming independent and a conscious individual. But still having a state of agape, letting everything unfold freely.

At least that’s my take on it. I will never lose sight of my goal and I will reach it. I will not bow down forever and dissolve into the mass, mainstream, swarm of ocean.

I guess this is why the transcendental paths to immortality, outside the mandated intellectual mind cage of authority, are so secretive. It triggers the average humans condition. They react usually skeptical or comical at best, angered and frothing at worst, to individuals who really want to be strong. Who want to exist, indefinitely, and explore, beyond the routine garden of earthly life. To peek beyond the cage. Gaze through the looking glass.

All we can do in this thread is regurgitate dogma or attempt to transmit direct experience via inadequate language. It is a real pity.

>>40938663
well, i stand by my you really look down on people statment.
>Escapism goes against the will for immortality
>i must escape the earth
> I will never lose sight of my goal and I will reach it
well its actually somthing every man woman and child can do but its uncomfortable so no one has in thousands of years. step 1 stop eating acid. (anything with a ph lower then 7)

>>40938663
>Life on earth is a miserable lesson
whats the lesson?

>>40938692
I do, it’s a correct statement. Convince me otherwise. I honestly think people are wonderful. The implications of another conscious existence is miraculous. Can you fathom the depth of their existence? The memories in their perceptions? Like dimensional threads of time carried along this infinite moment.
BUT that’s all there is to it. Like observing the brilliance of animals. Or other natural phenomena. All so exquisitely brilliant. But they all die, tide after tide. It is the fate of this life. Yet who, in the face of this overwhelming machine of death, takes eternity seriously? Who doesn’t get lost in mortal affairs like getting a shiny car or fucking a beautiful woman? All valid and real goals for life. Definitely. I am not wiser than whatever is the master who makes the grass green, orchestrates reality. But who of us, of us conscious apparently free willed individuals, takes the time and concentrated effort to pursue immortality? To try to transcend? To beat the odds? Almost no one. It’s like seeing someone lose themselves in a silly game. In my truest and deepest self I won’t judge them for gaming. I love gaming. But my conscious self looks down upon it because I personally value transcendence and immortality.

>>40938701
I can only make vague assumptions based on what I learned.
To experience life. All its intricacies. To grow, and to die. But really, is fate set in stone? Is destiny inevitable? Do we all have to die? To dissolve? To return? Is the existence of a conscious self, of an intellect, the causal outcome of a big mistake?
I want to carry this intellect to the deepest abyss and the greatest heaven. With all the cynical loathing I want to endlessly blogpost about all reality can offer. A single lifetime is not enough.

Right now, I’m convinced that the architecture of life is near perfect. And that it’s existence is for experience, creation. The transmutation cycle of material mortality and maybe immaterial mortality is probably rooted in some fundamental alchemical absorption principle that even the highest orders, oversouls or ideals or angels or gods or archetypes, adhere to. The opportunity for immortality would be an absolute grace. So it’s like a byproduct of the churn of life.

Damn I’m drifting off now, enough surface level contemplation.

>>40938704
>But who of us, of us conscious apparently free willed individuals, takes the time and concentrated effort to pursue immortality?
whom indeed. step 1 stop eating acids.

>>40938719
>whats the lesson?
stop eating life

>>40938719
>Right now, I’m convinced that the architecture of life is near perfect. And that it’s existence is for experience, creation.
its funny you said the right thing right after. your not here to experience or create.
>transmutation
your here until you change. and then your here forever cause here is all there is.

>>40938720
That’s a smart step, but the evolutionary speed or abilities of a human are limited. Having to eat has consequences. We live with them now. How does someone stop eating and freeing themselves from this condition, without losing the ability to still simulate this experience? I think I’m starting to get what that daoist inner alchemy immortal embryo principle is all about. It literally is a „higher“ anchor for your awareness. It is so tedious and fruitless to attempt withstanding the tide of karma that comes with the human race. Better cultivate a new immortal vessel and gtfo.

>>40938728
>How does someone stop eating and freeing themselves from this condition, without losing the ability to still simulate this experience?
right now every part of you is falling apart
>stop eating acid
>>40938728
and you have no components for repair cause you piss them out when dissolved
>stop eating acid
and your coated and bloated with microorganisms that thrive in acids and breed to the point their shit becomes toxic
>stop eating acid
but have you ever considered how a living body may function if it wasnt constant repairing and replacing itself and cleansing itself?
> Better cultivate a new immortal vessel and gtfo.
but youve no means or awareness in how to do this. youve just the one vessel.
> i earnestly hope your the exception but ive never met anyone who holds freedom most dear and desires to be elsewhere who wasnt running from the problems they made at home.
and it seems your not the exception ;(

>>40938728
>but the evolutionary speed or abilities of a human are limited.
ps are you still operating on the limited memes of mutation as the cause for natural selection?(shits like 50 years old yo) sounds like it if your going all slow tier. look into intralife epigenetics, tldr every protein encoding portion of your genome can be turned on or off within the context of one life (and your mostly off, like 90%+ junk {non presently protein encoding} dna tier off)

>>40938746
Good luck with trying to fight biological aging just by adjusting your diet bro.
I have glimpses of an awareness, that is enough for now. Where I step there is a way.
>>40938749
Mutation is a part of change. There is consciously directed „mutation“/transmutation. This is what I want to read about in this thread. Not the slow and automatic „mutation“ of the mass.
But even tweaking biology is not a way. I’m open to it, as I stated in the OP, but it’s not feasible. The complex energetic conglomeration that is the human body. It’s too complex for a human to grasp. We may even become biologically immortal someday. But still then, it would be mortal because of physical constraints. What I aim for is absolute immortality, which is total freedom. Being entangled in anyway in the physical world is a no no for this in the long run.

>>40938766
if i said good luck trying to stop apoptosis with diet would you think im as stupid as you are now or would have no idea what im talking about?
>Mutation is a part of change
a guy fucking his life up with heroin is a part of change, you want good change remember?
>Not the slow and automatic „mutation“ of the mass.
why do you think i prompted you to look into intralife epigenetics, its not slow or gradual?> >It’s too complex for a human to grasp
your the universe folded into a man, nothing is beyond your grasp unless you give up.
>What I aim for is absolute immortality,
thats what i teach, but it starts with a body cured of original sin that dose not age because its individual cells do not fall apart.
where is the tree of life presently ?
bet ya cant answer, the singuarity is the archon that was the acorn that was too be the tree. and its chained at the heart of each of your cells right now. hence rule - pls no eat me

gl cultivating immortality with good thoughts ><

>>40938799
>stop apoptosis
You would still die from accidental physical means, so it's not immortality, but longevity. And I doubt diet change works. But my doubt is not important. Link your work with proof, or instruct me how to get to the experience.
>fucking his life up with heroin
I think the pursuit of immortality entails mastering all life and striving for optimal health, at least at the root of awareness if one has somehow transcended the body, if you allow me to think outside biology.

I feel like you are onto something, but many years have conditioned me to disregard biology as a discipline for immortality. Everything is connected so that assumption is wrong in a way. I'll take a look at intralife epigenetics.

>>40938884
>or instruct me how to get to the experience.
.....................................
>step 1 STOP EATING ACID
>You would still die from accidental physical means
kay so what im describing is more aptly codified in eastern cultivator lore but tld being ageless is the foundation, the base, a man who has dragged themselves out of the underworld. youve yet to wrap your head around step 1, stop eating acid, and now you all well fuck if im ageless i could still die of bullets or nukes or some shit (your clearly a woman tits plox) but im all you have to errect a glorious temple on your immortal foundation to get there but thats not step 2 or 3 or 4 hunny.
>stop eating acid
> but many years have conditioned me to disregard biology as a discipline for immortality.
but your all boomer tier into darwinian natural selection. tldr his finches didnt break internally and mutate new beaks ideally suited to their new diets, his finches dna already contained the code to make all potential beaks, which manifested was a function of the traumas and glories of each birds life passed onto their childern in the form of gene sequence activation. to read more about this see histone tail modification, nucleosome binding and dna metalation. these are the main currently studied mechnicisms that, within the context of a single life, control dna transcription. (ps your like98% deactivated presently)

>>40938904
Nooooo mah intended ironically titled image

>>40938904
not the anon you reply to, a question :
can I know more about the eastern cultivator lore?
thank you :)

>>40939072
https://hianime.to/lord-of-mysteries-19802

>>40939134
huh, I was thinking in terms of life of Mahavira or Milarepa or some such.
Fine, I will look into the anime
Another question :
how is the communion with nature after one steps into the stream? What is the nature of physical exercise one requires on a daily basis? How much sunshine. Any hint appreciated.

>>40938904
I seriously doubt you have any clue about what you are talking about or what you *believe* you can achieve with the "knowledge" you possess, or rather, that possesses you. If this thread teaches one thing well, it's to be vigilant and suspicious of information.

>>40939155
nice fives, its kinda funny both statments require the same response, have you lived enough to differentiate coincidence (a coininciding of incidents) with syncronicity (the world using context only you will know to speak to you) sufficently to follow the sycronicity from just one too synchronized synchronicity too the world unfolds your divine path before you too 10,000 compounding synchronicities unfold per moment in pure divine poetry? alep bet kun seems to be at that last phsae but ive not encountered any other chanfags who can interperte The message in anything but....
in the same way that a master of western lore could construct a story based around the axioms of western lore, this particular anime has done the same with eastern lore.
i spend mebe an hour a day outside unless ive some particular jobs to do in the garden (making a garden is laborious, seeding and water a premade garden is easy)
>how is the communion with nature after one steps into the stream?
in 2022 i skilled up mah inborn greenthumb trait to indigo thumb and likewise all the synergetic epigentic shit ive been doing in my garden caused the majority of the plants i grow to transition from green to purple. the oregano is particularly fragrant but the weed is cognitive ascension tier ya feel me mangz?
tldr building a foundation requires a body that is in perfect homeostasis ie dose not require imput to function, you achieve this by puring cellular aptotis begotten of the first sin, consumption. after that what you build upon the foundation is as unique as the summation of the aspirations of all mankind as one. (most go some variation of broad / tall>>40939100)

>>40939167
>I seriously doubt you have any clue about what you are talking about
defiantly a woman, seriously tits or gtfo
but here an authority figure talking at length about intralife epigenetics, note the thesis statement at the end (and the scathing metacommentary trololol)
>https://youtu.be/mHak9EZjySs?si=_fCOXqYzD_EhlPyO
>https://youtu.be/Vye-eCM-BbU?si=DH2TLaUc2eFlZ8ON
play both at the same time they sync up so well^

>>40929947 (OP)
Niggas want immortality without realizing its youthfulness which makes life worth living.

>>40939187
You seem like a funny guy and all that, but it would be insane to trust a rambling schizophrenic druggy with medical advice. And I don’t think the medical community has cherished eureka about infinite longevity because of your crack house theory.
I was intrigued at first, but now it’s pretty disappointing.

Anyway I’m looking forward to the Taoist anons, will probably make a second thread

>>40939208
the funny part is you dont have to ! eventually your teeth or ass will rot out and youll spend your 42 days in the cave weather you like it or not, i pray you dont fall back into mortality when you emerge but you know what to expect now ^

seriously man your not going to think yourself into eternity, your body is your temple, your eternal soul. you are what you eat carcass feaster.

>>40939183
>weed is cognitive ascension tier
ya I feel you bro :D
thanks for answers, feel empowered.

>>40939208
you seem bit mean when you call him a schizo druggy
>world unfolds your divine path before you too 10,000 compounding synchronicities unfold per moment in pure divine poetry?
he is trying to sync all the insights into a form of poetry and you called him a schizo druggy!

>>40939231
You can utilize vulgar language as much as you like, your loose dogmatic belief won’t do shit or work wonders. I don’t think anyone of us will rot in a cave. What I do know is that both of us will biologically die. Eating differently won’t change the aging process. Maybe improve it. I’m astonished that you have such faith in bullshit. You should visit India.

>>40939242
I was open to his ideas and engaged until it got increasingly deranged. You should be more careful with putting trust in anyone, especially without solid evidence.

>>40939244
all you took from that was ass? lol
>>40939244
im not posting the slug again cunt, but it dosnt die from ageing ever cause it found a pratice that lets it stop eating and thus stop falling apart at a cellular level.
>Eating differently won’t change the aging process
well your not wrong, step 1 = dont eat acid, step 5 = 42 days alone in the cave with none save the adversary.
>until it got increasingly deranged
bet you wont state clearly which parts you coulnt follow

>>40939247
>You should be more careful with putting trust in anyone, especially without solid evidence.
the cellular apoptosis he speaks of is a fact and one clearly stops degenerating after a period of fasting which too is a fact (as I have tested it multiple times). He is warning us not to fall back to eating which would again resume the apoptosis cycle (original sin).
Clearly the process of eating, brushing teeth, pooping, bathing is all signs of a degenerating body which requires constant.
Can you test what he is saying and observe how your body responds to the absense of foodstuffs in your gut?
>the great way is easy, yet people prefer side routes

>>40939242
also i had to sus out the epigenetic conditions to get my plants upto about 16 feet with 2 foot 6 inch crown buds before my weed hit this point, and its only in the super dense crown buds not the 60+ sub stalks

>>40939258
oh weve done this before eh? sup mang, im kinda in a hating mankind as the ayre of the Crone tier mood lately.

Not only schizophrenic, but also samefagging. This thread is now /x/ certified

>>40939271
he seems to think I am blindly trusting you but I am actually seeing the truth of your statements from my own experiences.

> sup mang, im kinda in a hating mankind as the ayre of the Crone tier mood lately.
Love you, love the other anon who called you szhizo, love this thread, love is the answer :D
Maybe the body falling apart internally produces a "mean-ness" in majority of interactions we have in these chans with anons. Such people are responsible for the "so called covid" hysteria and who knows what nonsense they will conjure next to feel secure in their degenerate lifestyles.

>>40939266
yeah, as within so without, the insights one gains within should have interesting applications with outside nature, meditating on all you've said in this thread for a while...

>>40939295
>>40939282

>>40939271
so bigfoot is just a human who has entered the stream (homeostasis in true sense of the word) and the long fur is the epigenetic adaptation to extreme cold... Their skin must be very durable and elastic, extreme strenght and all that.

>>40939317
tfw i can just let youtube wander and speak for me
>https://youtu.be/mfJhMfOPWdE?si=84OZuKXc2vOJcXer

What's the real point of immortality? Repeating the same reptilian process of surviving day in and out. Doing what exactly? Eating, sleeping, breathing, reacting, what's the end point if you keep doing this forever in the physical plane. Do you think all the pleasures you experience in the first 100 years will translate in the same frequency throughout your immortal life?

>>40929947 (OP)
if your seeking immortality of the flesh, then you're missing the point

>>40939317
ya know that feel when you cant decide how much of somthing you wanna retype?
>https://archive.4plebs.org/x/thread/39947624/#q39948717
im still not in the mood but i went in on it once here.

>>40929947 (OP)
Death is an illusion, you are all ready sort of immortal. Immortality in your pic rel has to do with the quality of the next existence and the ability to have agency in it.

>>40938088
Reverse cowgirl is a key sexual tantric practice

Realistically what could a western baizuo really hope to accomplish with a bunch if ancient chinese practices he knows nothing about

>>40941023
hmmm got stuck where you talk about 4th greatness.
A gardener of men you say, and supposedly quite large in proportions you say, essentially an attempt to return to more integrated state (as opposed to entropied state we find ourselves now)?
All quite fascinating and I hope you are in the mood to explain some of it...

Also was thinking here >>40939256 what is step2 and 3?

>>40931427
>>40931770
Genesis 3:22-24

>22 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:
>23 Therefore the Lord God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken.
>24 So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.

>>40937652
been lurking through this thread and I'm interested what the old book you found is and any other old texts you have found. I generally follow the school of thought that most people won't teach you something unless it is of benefit of to them but I imagine this was less of a common thought process in medieval and ancient china. even with all the shit flinging normally found in these qigong threads this one has served as one of the best ones I have seen on this site in recent memory.

>>40937626
been lurking through this thread and I'm interested what the old book you found is and any other old texts you have found. I generally follow the school of thought that most people won't teach you something unless it is of benefit of to them but I imagine this was less of a common thought process in medieval and ancient china. even with all the shit flinging normally found in these qigong threads this one has served as one of the best ones I have seen on this site in recent memory.

>>40943601
>was less of a common thought process in medieval and ancient china
Why do you think that way? Resources were far sparser and life was generally, materially tougher. Today we have "welfare prosperity" and still people are trying to scam and abuse each other.

>>40943812
writing and preserving texts was more costly, people were not knowledgeable about the practices (with immortals relegated to legends for most) and classical literacy was rare so there was less of a need to gatekeep and a higher likelihood that anyone who wanted to learn about this stuff is in your circle. compare that to now where the idea of qi was popularized and you could go to any bookstore in china and buy a book on classical Chinese and suddenly the need to write watered down material to placate the masses and stop them from looking further is created.

>why would I spend all that time learning classical Chinese when this guy wrote everything I might need in modern mandarin already

now extend that to other languages besides mandarin. also I am not saying authors are intentionally telling you how to fuck yourself up or that the practices in all modern books are bad but they are not teaching you to reach the same heights as those classical texts.

>>40943952
*idea of qi pertaining to actual immortality practices instead of legend or other function.

>>40942748
Realistically, what would chinks do with western material science and philosophy they know nothing about?

>>40931731
>le loved ones
Miss me with this trite bullshit

>>40944373
well, theyed pretend intralife epigenetics are the exact same thing as darwinian natural selection and get upset and confused when told they are mistaken?

>>40944508
requesting steps prior to step5 =(42 days alone in the cave) here >>40943077
I am all ready for the journey so any last minute tips are appreciated.

>>40941118
Most based take on thread.

>>40939271
Why do I know you?
We've met before.

>>40943077
do you know why i dug up that link for you?

>>40945020
>everything is chained to everything.
>>40945009
> ive never met anyone who holds freedom most dear and desires to be elsewhere who wasnt running from the problems they made at home.

>>40945023
the insight on how plant goes from growth to flowering as a result of stress and the same how it applies to humans and a result of consuming dangerous consumables and environmental stresses of modern civilization...?
the insight on how modern humans are somewhat entropified versions of previous huemans (more integrated with universe) and also how many animals are entropified and epigenetically emergent fallen-humans...?
am listening...

>>40945031
Can one break the chains?
And should one?

>>40945194
its it one of the few attempts ive ever made to spell out the lore / science at once outside the other conversation you and ive had and im glad you read it however no, its because of how far off your assessment was here >>40939317 and here
>essentially an attempt to return to more integrated state (as opposed to entropied state we find ourselves now)?
it was more like some velikovskyesque dykesquatch 69 tier magic hippy commune forest paradise world wraped in an everlasting purple glow.. that got hard fucked by the matron of face sitting whom cast from the group in her ayre /cast conjure primordial lignin consuming fungus - it was highly successful

>>40944807
and youve done the same with the steps, i wasnt describing some 1 2 3 4 5 step ritual for easy of caveuWu, i already spelled out the wut dos in our chat in the nutrition thread i was charactering the interjecting dude who wouldn't even watch the epigenetics link as stuck on step one of a conversation you and i were having step 5 of.

>>40938799
>>40945202
>picture related.
>https://youtu.be/U7Dg1IX3-hY?si=dNT_oD-xe0QnS_Ec

>>40945233
nice doubles and nice doubles >>40945244

tried to parse the last bit but my brain (which is subject to apoptosis which am trying to remedy) could not.

anyways, no need to help me further on this matter as I intend to find out for myself. I sense a deep truth in all of this which I am unable to type properly.

uWu linden leaf anon

>>40945302
>tried to parse the last bit but my brain (which is subject to apoptosis which am trying to remedy) could not.
after rereading it something seemes to click...
so the everlasting glow world full of lush vegetation was somehow subject to disintegration by a lignin-eating fungus conjured by who now?

so fungus is not part of the hippy commune paradise?

>>40945344
>>40945344
dem 4s, pretty much sorta, not all fungus eats wood huehue, but tldr the Sun >>40939331 and the Y were made for the blood to change and survive in their wasted land.

>>40931427
Cobson 5:13

>Then he said unto me, damn nigga you zesty! Thus you shall get you ass ate
Zamn, he answered while unbuckling his belt

>>40938584
Core formation never ends until death, the core or embryo can always be refined further into a more sophisticated battery. People misunderstand immortality in the daoist framework, it's almost always about what's beyond the loss of the physical body.

In daoism physical immortality has two routes, either completely stop the consumption of jing, which is nearly impossible, or you go down the route of "necromancy", which involves anchoring the yin and shen into the corpse right after you die and control it like a suit, the result being something like a vampire. Thing is if you're not a extremely skillfull cultivator you'll sooner than later turn into a decomposing ghoul thing, it takes fine management of qi to maintain the corpse fresh and human looking. Plus, strong yang qi currents will harm you and dissolve you, things like sunlight.

The cultivation of the core or embryo is the preparation of a vehicle to achieve true immortality AFTER the physical death.

Still reading this thread. I tried what this anon mentioned in the first half of his post about laying, meditating and feeling static >>40936540

If I focus just a little I can feel a "black" static from my left hand and a "white" static from my right. I use those colors as the closest approximate I can explain, they are not literally black and white. The black static is heavier, slower. The white static is lighter, faster. I guess it's more like energy than static.. but it's also not really either of those things, I don't have words for it. Are these the representations of Qi described itt, or what is the 'energy' I'm noticing?

I've never tried this shit before and I wasn't really expecting to feel anything at all so this was kind of surprising.

>>40947838
If you can only feel it in your hands then lie down. Most people will have a hard time perceiving the field while standing up or sitting down if they've never cultivated before. Lying down relaxes the muscles and frees the shen from processing all that physical bodily noise. Locate your awareness which is usually in your head, and stretch it throughout the whole body, let the feeling of the field arise and when it does focus on it softly. You can also start by focusing on the parts where you can easily feel the field and then stretch awareness from there. That's it, just keep the focus on the field emanating from the whole body, that's how the technique works.

If you're feeling different qualities of qi right from the start that's pretty rare, shouldn't happen. But things that shouldn't happen sometimes happen so i'm just gonna assume you have some specific proprioceptive natural talent, seen weirder things. If you're not lying though, don't try to circulate different charges at the same time, you could die pretty easily. Stick to shen cultivation.

>>40947944
To be honest, after noticing it in my hands (I guess it kind of pushed out of the palm in a thick beam more like?) I stopped trying to focus or check anywhere else, because it was more of a "wtf I actually felt something" moment. I'm not going to lie, I wasn't taking this all very seriously, it sounded cool but I figured I wouldn't be able to notice anything. Now that I have I'm actually pretty intrigued, so I'll try more like what you're saying in full later. Thanks anon and everyone else who contributed to this thread, I'm excited to have something new to look into and explore.

>don't try to circulate different charges at the same time,
Just to be clear... Does this mean only move the 'white' energy if I'm trying to move it, then only move the 'black' energy if I'm trying to move it? like... Push white from my hand up my arm = fine
Push black from my hand up my arm = fine
Try to push both from both hands up my arms at the same time = big bad?
If people don't normally feel the black/white difference right away, how would they even know they're pushing both at once? Is that part of why it's considered dangerous? Or am I misunderstanding? Sorry if I sound dumb, I'll do more research after I finish reading the thread

>>40948041
>If people don't normally feel the black/white difference right away, how would they even know they're pushing both at once?
People typically take years of diligent cultivation to differentiate qi qualities clearly. Using somatic vipassana daily it would probably take months, i don't know for sure because i've never shared my methodology so i don't have a frame of reference with it based on other people.

When people can't differentiate currents and they try to move qi they move it as an undifferentiated "bunch". The problem comes when you take two isolated opposing currents and press them together from opposing angles. This will give you a heart attack, an aneurysm or any flavor of organ damage if you survive it, because the result is an explosive current. This has its function, but it's reserved to people who have cleaned their meridians thoroughly and have cultivated a solid core, and even then it's risky.

So if you're feeling two distinct types of charges and you can't tune it into something undifferentiated better to avoid moving any and just rely on passive qi work. Which means focus on shen cultivation. My somatic vipassana is a shen cultivation technique, technically. You don't need to circulate qi manually.

>>40948112
I think I get it now, though it's hard to wrap my head around the idea of people just having an undifferentiated flow.. it feels like it's pretty strictly black on one hand white on the other. I can't even imagine how you'd "bunch" it without pushing them together in your torso or something (the thing you're not supposed to do), so I doubt id be capable of tuning it undifferentiated. Maybe once I try to feel it elsewhere it'll be less rigid? Either way, I'll avoid that for now and stick to what you mentioned, read and learn more. Thank you again, this was really exciting to realize it's an actual "thing". I mean, not that I doubted practitioners, just to feel something (however minor) myself has been neat. Thank you!

>>40948243
I used an analogy with marbles before >>40934860 But yes, if you have natural proprioception to feel both charges then i wouldn't expect you to be able to muddle it into undifferentiated noise.

The charges of qi are yin qi and yang qi. Yin qi is the magnetic passive energy that gives form to things when condensed enough, it's pulling, cold and it feels like a vacuum that pulls towards a center. Yang qi is the electric active energy that attributes functions to things, it's pushing, warm and it feels like a ticklish force.

The core you cultivate in the lower dantian acts as a transistor, so when you push these two charges into it and combine them forcefully you generate a much stronger current as a result, a current that can actually interact with physical matter. With clean channels this explosive current can be directed outside the body to then produce various effects. Pushing, burning, shocking...etc. But if the channels aren't clean enough or the core is weak you're left with a massive discharge inside your body with nowhere to go.

This is very advanced neidan stuff and many cultivators have died trying to figure it out and traditional schools are built on their backs. People with natural proprioception if they figure out how to tap their qi sometimes die by playing around with it without having any idea they're basically frying themselves.

>>40948388
Yeah, I liked your marbles comparison when I was reading the posts. For me right now it kind of reminds me of when you watch pop coming out of a carbonated soda dispenser. &It sort of sounds like being able to tell them apart early is more of a curse than anything, haha. Earlier (before your other reply, I'm heeding your advice now and focusing on awareness instead) I did try pushing both up my arms (just to the elbow-ish and not at the same time). The "yang" qi moves a lot easier. The "yin" qi felt like pushing molasses or something and I had to force it more. So your descriptions of them make sense to me. A while after that my entire left arm to the shoulder started to burn and ache and my left ear felt clogged. It's back to normal now, but after that feeling I think I can understand how it could cause problems when you don't know what you're doing. I feel kind of crazy describing this, it's sort of surreal. What an interesting phenomenon though. Really appreciate you having shared what you have, anon.

>>40929947 (OP)
Stop listening to the retards here talking about Jing, shen and other bullshit. They're idiots that will accomplish nothing and get recycled along with the rest of the monkeys here.

Before you do any sort of immortality stuff you need to develop the ability to see energy. Otherwise you won't know if you're doing things correct or not.

You can learn to develop occult vision either through Rudolph steiner methods involving activation of your doubles. The Astral double, the etheric double or the elemental double. This will get you started on getting you occult eyes.

If you don't want to do that then you can do Carlos Castaneda magical passes and tensegrity to activate your dream double and you'll gain the ability to see energy.

There are other methods but those two I mentioned are the easiest.

Good luck anon.

>>40949218
interesting post anon
franz bardon talked about developing occult senses (all senses not just vision) and had a way of doing it by using the elemental energy in each of the sense organs (also important to clear the energy afterwards to prevent imbalances)
that step came much later in his practice though (step 6 or 7 if i recall out of 10)

>>40949218
Visually perceiving the energies is a pointless new age novelty. It takes time and roundabout, unnecessary methods to induce synesthesia and actually have your visual organs pick up on energetic fields as a default. All this for nothing because the information you get from the visual feedback is still lesser than the information you get from directly feeling it.

This is why traditional frameworks never focus on, or even mention interacting visually with their energies.

Immortality is cringe

if anyone else wanted to do some reading about all this, I asked chatgpt to give me a read list. you can get all the books listed from annas-archive:

Stage 1 – Foundations: Feeling & Basic Circulation
>Goal: Get comfortable with qi awareness, belly breathing, and dantian storage.

>Ken Cohen – The Way of Qigong
Broad, science-friendly, covers qi sensations, yin/yang theory, and health basics.

>Mantak Chia – Awaken Healing Energy Through the Tao
Introduces the Microcosmic Orbit (classic Taoist circulation). Focus on dantian storage. Clear and practical.

Stage 2 – Building the Core (Dantian Power)
>Goal: Strengthen your “battery” and learn to store qi consistently.

>Bruce Frantzis – Opening the Energy Gates of Your Body
Exercises on “sinking qi” and aligning the body so energy drops into the dantian. Very effective for clearing blockages.

>Shou-Yu Liang & Wen-Ching Wu – Qigong Empowerment
Large manual with medical and martial qigong. Good for experimenting once storage feels steady.

Stage 3 – Refinement of Yin/Yang
>Goal: Learn how yin and yang interact and balance.

>Eva Wong – Harmonizing Yin and Yang
Authentic Taoist guide. Focuses on balancing rather than forcing, useful if you sense polarity strongly.

>Thomas Cleary (translator) – The Secret of the Golden Flower
Classic Taoist alchemy text on circulating yin/yang qi with breath and awareness.

Stage 4 – Projection: Martial & Healing
>Goal: Extend stored qi outward, either to strike (martial) or to harmonize (healing).

>Chen Xiaowang – The Five Levels of Taijiquan
Explains how dantian power matures in Tai Chi, leading to fajin (explosive force).

>Wang Xiangzhai – The Correct Path of Yiquan (Paul Brennan translation)
Text on intention force (yi leads qi). Key for projecting energy as power, not just tingling.

>Chunyi Lin – Born a Healer (Spring Forest Qigong)
Guide to projecting qi for healing. Clear steps on scanning and transmitting energy.

>>40949218
>stuff you need to develop the ability to see energy
esoteric biologiy 101, easiest way to learn to see the unseen is to spend a large portion of time listening to music functionally generated by pulsed electromagnets - this will serve the base the establish a mental schema perceiving functionally pulsed magnetism in your environment ie tinnitus / visual snow

>>40935908
When you were burning impurities what sort of things did you see?

>>40936386
I did not learn anything about the method in your pic related, but I did learn some beginner stages of the large heavenly circle. IMO you probably wouldn't want to go through that training. Let me give you some metaphoric examples of the type of experience that your pic related is feeling. Have you ever watched the blue water spear fishermen on youtube, these guys go out to the open ocean to float and spearfish giant tuna. In every direction all they can see is blue, miles to each side of them and below, at any time a shark could come from the abyss. Another example, think of an astrounaut doing a spacewalk outside the ISS, when he losses his grip and floats off into space and his coms stop working. These are the type of scenarios you will face. One must have nearly super human energy to survive these states without going insane.

>>40949688
>>Wang Xiangzhai – The Correct Path of Yiquan (Paul Brennan translation)
>Text on intention force (yi leads qi). Key for projecting energy as power, not just tingling.
I have read most of that and studied with one of the authors. There are too many different traditions there, it's like giving a reading list to a college student with one book from every department in the university. Pick one of them.

>>40950677
*most of that list I meant, I didn't mean to quote that text. Although that book in particular is very good. I will take it as a happy accident, I have some understanding of this text, there exists a free version of an earlier addition, which is just as good imo. It is not possible to learn it's meanings without a very specific lineage of teacher anyway.

https://samim.io/dl/The-right-path-of-Yiquan-by-Master-Wang-Xiangzhai.pdf

>>40945454
me like the Sun, it brings out the impurities through skin - the acidic nature of food we consume is immediately apparent from the body's response to sunshine. When people's body/blood is too acidic - they seem to think Sun as harsh, but when it is alkaline, it is like we are a leaf shining while we face the Sun.

A question : what do you feel about rainbow body?
Another question : I thought fungus only consume/degrade dead wood which helps in recycling and such but here >>40945233 you say fungus themselves are somehow a cause of destruction of the ancient hippie paradise, what gives? Can a grand forest be made without fungus? I suppose interesting insects would consume dead wood in place of fungus - which would have a side-effect of reversing entropy of the system...

>>40929947 (OP)
I wanted to believe in quantum immortality, but I'm getting old and sick, I'm already with 4 or 5 health complications at my forties. So my body is rotting and will eventually perish.
I read about Sinclair's research and his attempts to reprogram dna but it only worked on mice and there were no attempt at humans. I mean if Musk can get volunteers so easily, why wont Sinclair does the same? Yet he sells expensive drugs which have no proven effect in what his research is aiming for.
My window is like 5 years to see some results, after that is death corridor for me. If such does not happen I will prefer to cling to my own liminal ideas, which comes from my own esoteric experiences. I know it is a cope, but it is better than the blackness of an agnostic death.

>>40950694
I have no knowledge on any of this but your outlook towards yourself, life, death, your age and health seems to me like you're inviting negativity. If Taoism teaches that your energy follows intent, and your energy is so negative like this, won't it just become a self fulfilling prophecy of rotting? I'd think, even just for your own happiness, it'd be worth trying to slowly break free from your negative feedback cycle. That's just my 2 cents as a random observer though, I don't know you or what your thoughts are really like outside of your post obviously

>>40950691
>A question : what do you feel about rainbow body?
well shit you just wanna get right to the heart of it. so tldr standard model evolution ie stardust spins itself up into mankindz works great until you hit the fidelity of intralife epigenetics and then its like tldr - wait fuck every plan i could every require for any situation i can every encounter is already locked in the chains this shit isnt cobbled together its perfection in dormancy.
tldr^3 i hold a rather juxtapositional model to standard model gravitational cosmology vened (as in ven diagram - the conflation of spheres) with mutation based evolution and natural selection. the simplest way to put it is that this whole existence seems to be one perfect being falling apart from the beginning of time? would it be easiest to then describe that body as a white light that fractured upon the material prism of the world? if you like all these one for you, do ya think it just fell apart or do ya think it was a choice?

>>40950691
>Another question : I thought fungus only consume/degrade dead wood which helps in recycling and such but here >>40945233 (You) you say fungus themselves are somehow a cause of destruction of the ancient hippie paradise, what gives?
if you wanna go all technical all you familiar with the carboniferous era in paelogeology and the axioms of what limit various body plans on earth today? tldr there was an era before dinosaurs where bugs got gigalarge, bugs dont have blood they suck atmosphear into their bodies and push it around in leui of blood. what limits land bug size is atmosphearic oxygen%, when bugs got really big it was because oxygen was estimated to have hit 35% - because all the carbon was sequestered in the bodies of titanic trees, both alive, and dead upon the forrest floor (like they figure glacial thick on the forrest floor) the trees defined the epoc - then suddenly a fungus that could digest lignin emerged. your projecting your ideals of sustainability on a world where the concepts didint exist.
also the bugs didnt eat the wood anymore then you eat your house. like its estimated over a mile of dead tree bodies made up the upper crust in this era, with trees too make general sherman look wee (higher surface pressure, shhhh)

>>40950803
image forgotten

Heh nice try Jehova but I already accepted my mortality as a necessity for my life he hehe

Isn't the rainbow body just another name for the causal body?

>>40936648
when my practices were in high gear, it always winds up being a thing that I dream much less, but I enter deep sleep stages almost immediately
perchance I have a dream, they are extremely long and revealing epics

>>40937311
>turning the light around isnt practical
when you read a book and miss the most important thing contained therein

>>40949688
lol chatgpt recommends mantak fucking chia

>>40950677
ymaa embryonic breathing
if you cant achieve stillness then the rest of your efforts will be hampered if not doomed

>>40950738
this is a good post and >>40950694 should heed it

>>40950778
lol you didnt say shit about rainbow body or anything to attain it
>>40950854
no
and lol wtf is this new age bs that describes what causal body supposedly is
this is why I dont study more buddhism, it gets annoying when a new word has to be made up for each particular way a ray of light hits the 10,000 things

>>40950959
yo sup step 1 captian jing (are you shit posting in the hairy pussy thread right now? ;P)
did ya ever watch mah epigenetics link? if yes you get the joke yet? it was just for you but just incase here ill summate - when asked the biologist would state a woman is xx and a man is xy - would you disagree?

>>40950959
>lol you didnt say shit about rainbow body or anything to attain it
and as to what youve actually said, i did describe the rainbow body - the state the perfect being exsisted in right after it entereted a material prism and began to fall apart, and, i dont care if you understand or not as you have demonstrated the conversation you interject in is not for you, ive described how to attain it, reverse the degeneration of the material world that has since the first man fractured the spectrum of hue in man
tldrtitsorgtfo

>>40950934
>when you read a book and miss the most important thing contained therein
1. I skimmed it.
2. You can't say something was missed if it is purposefully written in a poetic / philosophical / vague way instead of as a direct instruction. Maybe now with AI I can ask the AI to "translate" the coded speech into literal instructions, but why would I bother when I can attempt more direct methods first. You can keep playing code breaker games if you want, but I don't think it's a coincidence that when it comes to these things, everybody has their own interpretation which leads to differences in how people practice, their beliefs about how it all works, etc. To me, the entire point of things like this is to mislead the uninitiated (people who aren't direct disciples from a direct lineage). Everybody thinks their interpretation is right when it comes to "coded" things, and this is why there are so many denominations of Christianity, but they all miss the forest for the trees that they don't have any proof that their specific God exists while they argue about the most accurate way to serve and worship said God. People do the same thing when it comes to these practices, arguing about the right interpretation when they have no testable and measurable feats that defy reality and prove that their interpretation leads to results as opposed to the others.

>>40950988
you described it in a gay ass way that doesnt sound anything like the way my well developed master taught it, so yeah, just calling out faggots coming up with things by themselves

>>40950994
>1. I skimmed it.
>2. You can't say something was missed if it is purposefully written in a poetic / philosophical / vague way instead of as a direct instruction
lmao pick one

>>40951058
>reeee yU no speak like senpai
polly want a cracker?

>>40950778
>well shit you just wanna get right to the heart of it
:D yes, felt like next logical question when physically one attains homeostasis, and not falling apart... the energy of regeneration must fold into itself creating light.

> do ya think it just fell apart or do ya think it was a choice?
neither, as your image attached shows, the fractral would be ONE regardless of the zoom level and this moment is that "screenshot" of that zoom level.

yes, ven diagrams and circles interleaving into other circles

>>40950949
>ymaa

opinion discarded

>>40950803
right bugs of that era (which was somehow parallel with hairy big woman pic you posted) simply sustained themself through rich oxygen of the atmosphere and did not bother themselves to eat the wood themselves as it would be like eating one's own habitat/home.
then... a fungus appeared... and released all sequestered carbon back to atmosphere creating a "falling apart" or a fracturing of existing order... into seeming disorder (is it really?)

interesting and practical stuff mang...

>>40950959
>lol you didnt say shit about rainbow body or anything to attain it
did not ask him about means to attain it, just what he felt.
We are physical beings using physical keyboards, to communicate this using physical words so clearly one would have to stop using these to seriously investigate the matter... silence is golden and our society wants us to "express" our inner state using these words... which seem to be a problem the more i type... thinking itself should be turned off isn't it? the mind should remain floating and free, unencumbered.

>>40950988
>reverse the degeneration of the material world
a noble holy (wholly) task it seems like
and make sure these sufferings of society is never repeated again!

this is why they say ahimsa (non-hurting) is the foremost religion and consuming food itself could be seen as a form of hurting (oneself and the outer, as within, so without)... since it creates cell apoptosis effect one way or another... I like to eat raw veggies and cucumbers and greens as I said in other thread and clearly do not require much now... any insights into problems caused by consuming salt?

>>40951117
while ymaa is martial arts focused
saying that about the EB book means you're clueless

>>40951062
>lmao pick one
1. Don't have to, I pick both. Nobody needs the read the entirety of the Bible to know that it doesn't give a literal set date for the end of times, nobody has to read the entire bible to know that it speaks in stories and parables that are often open to multiple interpretations. You can read a few pages of that book and immediately see that it is not a literal, direct, step by step instructional manual.
2. Once again, people that speak as you do still have no feats, you just have blind faith in your own interpretations of things translated from a foreign language of which you were never immersed in the culture to fully comprehend the context of the original words.

>>40951222
you can just admit you didnt read the friggin material and dont have a clue what it means
it shows character instead of writing a blog about why you're still right

>>40951216
A mere publisher, and highly regarded among chinese martial artists at all.

>>40951289
yeah keep pointing at all these other things aside from the solid foundational elements in that book
logical fallacy, the refuge of those with no argument
book's worth its weight even if only for the translation section

>>40951351
Fair, I didn't realize that there were original texts in it. I might check it out. Whenever I see YMAA i think of his tai chi and yoga programs and can't take it seriously.

>>40929947 (OP)
This logic follows only if you value permanence and independent existence above all else.
Which means you only value control over all others.
You have however very logically projected the ultimate implications of your moral misalignment to their ultimate aim: to retain power eternally, which requires eternal existence.
The error is that your universe of value is precisely big as 1: yourself.
It's a very lonely existence.
You are in fact a part of a community of co-creators.
That is what the universe is.
When you look at the history of the universe, the over-arching theme is creativity.
In the beginning there was very little complexity because the universe was too hot and chaotic to stability to facilitate the growth of complexity.
During numerous periods events took place that radically increased the possibilities of interactions, and the possible complexity.
The universe since the beginning has continually expanded what it is capable of.
It is a creative process, the trend is towards beauty.
The creativity comes from all the constituents interacting.

Both coming-together and moving-apart, permanence and change, the formation of temporary patterns and stabilities and their differentiation into new forms are necessary for the creative advance of the universe.
The desire for immortality is a metaphysical malady, an imbalance in valuing permanence to the exclusion of change. This is a malady because in healthy creative systems these basic operations are both present and mutually enriching.
Embrace the beauty and value of death, embrace impermanence which is only "impermanence" from the perspective of permanence, but from the perspective of life is rebirth.
You will die but what will outlive you are your influences on the world around you.
The basic question is "what kind of world do you want to nourish?"
You are not the main character.
There is no main character.
And that's the good thing because nothing would be more intolerable than an existence filled with stories of the same entity for all eternity.
The desire for such is grotesquely short-sighted. What is desired isn't truly immortality, but connection.
But when you metaphysical universe is based on independent existence, connection is forever secondary.
If you want a corresponding metaphysical principle, the fundamental theorem of calculus which links integration and differentiation as inverse operations of the same process is the mathematical expression of the creative alchemy inherent to existence itself.

>>40951363
the embryonic breathing book is a stand out
all of his other material could not exist and it would still stand out
you dont really need to read anything except the translation section

>>40950945
yeah cuz chatgpt is probably just indexing whats most popular and mantak chia has been talked about to death for decades
there's gonna be a whole new generation of ai bros with busted million dollar points

>>40951449
ok I'll check it out.

>>40951521
>there's gonna be a whole new generation of ai bros with busted million dollar points
both sad as well as funny

>>40950945
I asked it about that and it said that book was one of his older works and still had some decent foundation despite his newer work being more scamming cash grab. granted I know nothing about it so I have no way of knowing if that's also BS. since you can get the book for free on the site I gave I figured I'd keep it on the list anyway, then once it's read we can draw our own conclusions

>>40951271
You can just admit that you have no feats that prove your interpretation of what you read is accurate, it shows character instead of writing short lazy responses about why you're still right.

>>40951597
>you have no feats
I love it when asswipes write shit like this as if they have any inkling
turning the light around is how you firm the upper dantien to prevent the arising of a thoughtform, amongst other things
but that particular one is important for perchance one puts in enough work to manifest the spiritual light of samahdi
any perturbation destroys samahdi and it doesnt just come right back

>>40951581
honestly his foundational stuff isnt horrible
but he very quickly gets into his sex deviation-teachings
which should be avoided like its a woman with the herp
chia doesnt place anywhere near enough emphasis on the fundamentals
thusly he does his own work a disservice

>>40951449
I found a first addition copy on the internet archive and am just reading the forward, actually based on that I think it's going to be a good book, Jwing ming dedicating the book to a student that died an untimely death.

>>40951611
I love it when asswipes write shit like this as if they have any proof for their unverifiable rants. Calm it down buddy, nobody believes you, at the end of the day you are trying to argue theory, until we all personally test it ourselves you're just talking out of your ass, so either state a step by step method for people to test (like this guy - >>40936540), or STFU lol. Who the hell cares about what you have to say if we can't test it ourselves?, use your brain.

>>40951653
all you have to do is attain samahdi, learn how to stabilize it long enough for your upper dantien to begin to perturb once again while the light is manifest
you wont put in the necessary work to ever know for sure, so dont kid yourself

>>40951621
yeah, even the cover image of it being his face with this smug expression kind of gave me that knee jerk second guessing feel. but at the same time, since I know nothing, I figure it's good to get an idea of lots of sources before following any on my own. never know when part of someone's work resonates with you or helps you come to your own conclusions, at least I hope that's the case

>>40951689
well now that you have been cautioned, you're in a better spot to proceed
being a coomer and doing spiritual practices is the fastest way to blast the fk out of your jing

>>40951653
hilariously, samahdi has not been mentioned once this entire thread
people want immortality/enlightenment and it doesnt even get mentioned once
this is just another reason there cant be any quality advanced spiritual practices threads on this platform

>>40951755
checked
but its not like anyone can stop cooming for 90 days to start the work anyway

This >>40947838 newfag here. I've done some skimming of stuff but still reading more about the basics. I am starting to grasp this is very much a physical phenomena of your nerves and blood focusing with breathing, etc. Like how the wim hoff techniques work. &I also feel like I had a little epiphany last night:
>Be me
>Wake up in intense burning pain, upper back/shoulders feel extremely inflamed and hot
>Tossing, turning, insomnia, pain
>Have gut feeling this has to do with fucking around with qi earlier like I wasn't supposed to
>Read about it
>Something about fire rising
>Yang qi has pooled in my upper back/shoulders because I didn't put it down to my dantian area after trying it (or my untrained dantian couldn't keep it down)
>Deep breaths down, helps a little but still not a large relief
>If anything, feel bloated and stomach is now uncomfortable
>Suddenly think "wait, if the problem is my yang qi is rising, and yin qi is heavy, can the yin qi hold it down in my stomach?"
>Before I can look this basic thought up to make sure I'm not making it worse, I feel the heavy yin qi sink down my torso and into my stomach, like the realization became my intent
>The pain in my stomach, back and shoulders quickly alleviates, breathe and do this a bit more and I'm completely fine
>Notice how easy that was, like your body just "does it", no forcing or pushing like I tried when attempting to move qi up my arms
Kind of think I understand the basic premise of needing a balance of yin and yang qi now, and how it's guided intent that moves it, not forced will. Maybe that sounds really obvious to anyone whose already read the basics, but that was extremely cool to understand first hand (even if it was an accidental situation). I am going to stick to shen exercises and breathing techniques from here, but this was eye opening for me to experience a practical/applied use. I imagine when you know what you're doing you really can alleviate a lot of physical pains this way.

>>40951672
>all you have to do
>short bullshit explanation and leaves out all the details
No, give a proper breakdown of the steps or simply STFU, it's that simple.
All you need to do is actually explain the method, or don't waste your time trying to argue about how your unprovable theory is 100% without a doubt the real deal and everyone else is so stupid for not just immediately believing you and investing months worth of time trying to figure it all out themselves based on your vague half-assed grocery list of steps.

>>40951755
What is even the point of mentioning Samadhi without mentioning prerequisites like Dharana and Dhyana. Too many people giving half-assed theoretical explanations of what they believe is the right path. Most people will never even master Dharana without proper guidance and probably years of training, much more attain Samadhi.

Honestly the best posts in this thread are from this guy - >>40936540

The rest are just pointless ramblings. People need to either give something that can be trained and tested, or be quiet and not waste the bump limit on their pointless theories.

>>40951891
ok newfag
refine breath
attain stillness
pay the fuck attention
is in a nutshell all that is required to manifest samahdi
now STFU, it is that simple
>b-b-but this is unproven
get your retarded ass out of this thread, you make it like you actually cultivate
>muh years of training
>what's the point of mentioning Samahdi
if it takes one longer than a year, year and a half, you're doing it wrong or arent really trying, which is doing it wrong
personally I dont give a flying fuck if you attempt to tell me that my personal experiences are unproven and wrong, it just makes you look like a tool when you recoil so
>dharana
mantras & visualizations are side paths to this endeavor
if you're not working directly with perceived energies, you are blowing smoke up your own ass

>>40951891
>short bullshit explanation and leaves out all the details
this is just further proof that you have next to no cultivation under your belt
that bit you're bitching about is very direct, sad it went cruising altitude over your head

>>40951891
>refine breath
>attain stillness
>pay the fuck attention
the only thing I left out is to habituate the ever living shit out of it
there should be at least 4-5 sessions per day, length only required for the last one before bed
if you're not putting 3-4 hours a day into this then you should not expect to calm ya nerves sufficiently for efficiencies to build up to the point where samahdi will manifest
1-1.5 hours during the day, 2+ in the evening sit
high efficiency required for the real stillness to manifest, which is prerequisite for the light

>>40951929
>this is just further proof that you have next to no cultivation under your belt
Retard, you have no proof period that you have any "cultivation" under your belt lol. You are a random guy on the internet, nobody believes you, calm down.

>>40951918
Nah, no nutshell nonsense. Honestly I don't trust your bullshit, but if you genuinely want to help someone who does, maybe post a book or something that outlines the steps. I'm not wasting months on your nonsense.

Love is the answer

"Nature is an infinite sphere whose center is everywhere and circumference is nowhere"

>>40951891
>Honestly the best posts in this thread are from this guy - >>40936540
that guy gave himself a seizure, by the way, so if he's the best in the thread that tells you a lot about this board

>>40952192
>that guy gave himself a seizure, by the way
This just shows the limitation of your narrow thinking, and that you are unwilling to take any risks that are more likely to lead to a reward.

If there was a meditation technique that could give you a seizure, that means it produces significant enough phenomena that it likely is doing something, and likely works.

But I guess you prefer the typical "do this specific safe meditation for years and MAYBE something will happen" approach, and that doesn't lead anywhere. Once again, most qi gong practitioners I've talked to online boast about the lineages and teachers they've learned from, and ironically they all said they've never felt literal qi energy and have never used qi energy to trigger any kind of supernatural phenomena. If the goal is blind faith, just join a religion.

That mindset is exactly why every single person you'll encounter online is likely an "armchair magician" or in this case an "armchair cultivator". A lot to say, a lot of books read, a lot of years spent doing different forms of qi gong and martial arts, but most report they've never actually felt literal qi energy. That just sounds like a lot of wasted time.

So yeah, I'd much rather risk having a seizure and getting results, than spending years taking a safe route without any results.

The funny part is, before all of these books and safe methods were created, the actual methods had to be discovered through trial and error, just like the guy you are making fun of. Now you'll say you shouldn't "reinvent the wheel" but the problem is, none of you have any proof you actually have a genuine wheel, it could just be some half-assed subpar method passed down to Western plebs because they aren't direct disciples. So it's actually a better approach to start from scratch and take the risk rediscovering the wheel because you'll likely end up closer to true knowledge, than whatever watered down stuff is being drip fed to you.

I'm the "seizure anon" (kek). Seriously, i already explained i got a seizure when i was moving qi around before i even knew it was qi. I've explained how i came across it, whatever i recommend others now is for the most part safe and it has "tangibility" from the start.

It's not that rare for some people to develop a natural proprioception for qi related stuff at different degrees. I just happen to be one of those, was able to produce small bursts of qi when i focused on parts of my body. This had literally no use at all, i was just able to feel it, it was a quirk more than anything. It was almost 10 years ago, had no idea what it was at first, found out randomly, played around with it, hurt myself (i don't have any lasting effects) and started looking more into it. My methodology has nothing to do with this, i developed it way down the line after that.

All i've shared in this thread is literally the technique i use personally to cultivate shen primarily and qi (compressions and indirect cleaning). And for the most part structural information for the energetic daoist dynamics, how they work in various contexts and some related "trivia" to help people get a better picture of it. Even though the practice is safe it trains proprioception directly and from the beginning, so if someone wants a seizure themselves they'll be able to get it if they go out of their way to seek it. I'm providing a pretty ingenuous shortcut to qi proprioception and shen polishing, that then makes traditional cultivation methods a lot faster and readily accessible.

People will experience a burn or two here and there and they'll learn where or when to not push it. I'm counting on people having a minimum of common sense and self preservation. Because if they're deliberately cultivating they know what they're dealing with, unlike me when i randomly discovered i could produce these funny ticklish currents in my body and had zero concept of what it was or what it implied.

>>40952381
yeah you can also pull a muscle working out improperly and that will do something to your body
but its not ideal and could leave you worse off than when you started
do you do you
for any anons reading this thread, you've been warned
original seizure post here >>40937080

>>40952569
>whatever i recommend others now is for the most part safe
kek indeed
>People will experience a burn or two here and there and they'll learn where or when to not push it
preferably before inducing a seizure, but your mileage may vary
>I'm counting on people having a minimum of common sense and self preservation
more or less than you did?

you and this gullible simp >>40952381 are hilarious (assuming you arent samefagging)

>>40952586
I'm not gonna argue with a contrarian in a sinking thread. I've nuanced enough and shen cultivation techniques like mine, with some compressions, aren't gonna kill anyone.

>>40952586
>you and this gullible simp >>40952381 (You) are hilarious (assuming you arent samefagging)
No, I'm not the same guy, and maybe I'm crazy, but if there isn't a possible risk of "qi deviation" or something, then it probably isn't a powerful method to begin with.

And I actually think anybody who stumbled upon this thread before it dies and gets lost to time is lucky, because >>40952569 posted what seems to be a "universal cultivation method" (and that seems to be one of the obvious benefits of discovering something like this through trial and error yourself). The way his method sounds, it seems as if you can start off from the qi sensing part where you can sense the "static" as he puts it, and then from there you can do your own testing and research feeling things out, and it may differ from person to person who will make their own discoveries (e.g. This guy - >>40947838).

Tha method seems "open ended" enough that it allows room for discovery and specialization based on who is practicing the method.

Something like this is way more useful than some cookie cutter commercialized method. If I only gain the ability to feel qi from this method It would be a great method in my book, because most people never even make it to the "feeling qi" part, and that's even people who spent years doing qi gong.

>>40952570
>yeah you can also pull a muscle working out improperly and that will do something to your body
I get your point, but your analogy doesn't fit, because most people that train safely build some muscle over time, but most people that practice qi gong or "energy work" have never felt qi and have never manipulated qi to trigger a supernatural phenomena. That's why your analogy does fit. Building muscle is natural and happens even without effort if you spend years just doing labor. Gaining the ability to feel and control qi usually NEVER happens despite ones efforts.

>>40929947 (OP)
I'm aiming to be reborn in Amitabha's pure land, and from there to be liberated from suffering and rebirth and death. It's a more worthwhile pursuit because it means an end to delusion, and clinging to fantasies of physical immortality means keeping yourself in this hell.