Thread 40960148

So, I've been thinking about enlightenment, and the concept is still insane to me.

The fact that you have to detach yourself from literally EVERYTHING is fucking nuts. It's not just sex, and other pleasures, you have to detach yourself from your family, and sure that maybe easy for some, but not many. You have to detach yourself from caring about any material thing to free yourself, even down to EATING.

How is this possible? How could a human being actually do this???

I did it, it's easy.
You can't control anything around you.
You can control your mind.
You decide what you want and if you want.

He made very detailed instructions if you gave a shit to look

>>40960148 (OP)
What is pleasure?
What is happiness?
Is it something someone told you?
Is it something you learned?
Have you taught yourself something that makes you happy?
If you moved tomorrow what would you leave behind?
If money was no obstacle what would you buy and why?
What is the same between then and now? Not just physical locations- how about actions as well?
If you could talk to him or any buddha what what you talk about? If you could talk to any deity would all the questions be similar?

I'll tell you right now. 99.9999999% of humans think the body mind is all there is. So they live their entire lives avoiding pain and chasing pleasure.

Once you sit down and really note how all sensations come and go, you realize that there's a whole other realm of experience. At that point, why would you chase the fleeting unsatisfying pleasures of the body or flee from the displeasures of the mind?

At that point there is no rebirth.


"Ten thousand things
all in this breath
grasping hold of emptiness,
there's really nothing to say."

>>40960148 (OP)
Through knowledge and pain, there is no other way, I checked. There are perhaps alternative solutions to enlightenment which bear common functionality.

>>40960148 (OP)
I don't think you even read carefully.
Buddha choose the middle path to obtain enlightenment.
He does eat what was given to him.
You can detach yourself from desire once you realize everything in this world are all temporary.
You realize that you stop hold on to the ego, the I this, I that.

>>40960148 (OP)
It's possible once you realize you're just another meaningless thing in the world, just like everything else.

>>40960148 (OP)
It’s not about detaching yourself from everything
It’s about Attaching yourself to everything!
Because this world is a harmful cycle that we need to escape, it’s not meaningful to remain here any longer than we have to
In that sense by renouncing this world you give up “nothing” in the same way that a shut in may delete his video games and reenters the real world

To become a renunciate wasn't uncommon back then, Siddharta Gautama wasn't the first, but his 8-Fold Noble Path was unique and new. He went further to challenge the caste system which is the one huge thing that goes over everyone's head all the time.

>>40960148 (OP)
enlightenment is just understanding, you don't have to give these things up, you have to understand why they matter at all, and then from there you can decide they if you're willing or wanting to abandon your humanity, enlightenment is perceiving your bindings, seeing the utterly strange outer existence which they hold you back from falling into, and then choosing to remove them and fall, part of the buddha's journey has learning the inner workings of all these things so he could give them up in actuality, as well as studying the realm beyond and preparing himself for it... enlightenment is not a random blessing or a feeling, it is a tireless pursuit at the bleeding edge of human existence for ascension and freedom, knowing in full regard you are leaving everything behind which you stand atop, to be nobody, but not nothing. You have to see suffering and wade head first in it for a goal, knowing there will be no release, no ending... it's not something everyone does because it's not something everyone or possibly anyone alive today can or wants to do once confronted with the raw understanding of the process and its consequences, to a human being without divine vision, enlightenment may as well be dedicating your entire eternal life to digging a hole for no reason, you don't just get to poke at it and think hey yeah maybe that'd be cool maybe I want that, you need to pursue it every moment of every day and make no compromises.

>>40960148 (OP)
He literally took the middle path after failing at those things and then he became Enlightened.

Examine desire. Desire is a relative, passing feeling. You are not your emotions, neither your desire. For me, I can recognize that everything is empty. Any fulfillment from a desire is merely an illusion that conversely makes one mor attached. To give in to desire is to eat and become hungrier and hungrier. Chasing desire causes us to act unrighteously, giving in to ignorance and evil.

But, the Buddha advocated for a mediated asceticism, not a fully sacrificing one. What constitutes mediation may be fully up to you. But, you must recognize maya and its effect on you.

stronge emotions (both positive and negative) are energy food for the archons

he recognized you escape the loosh farm/material samsara by grey rocking the narcissistic matrix

>>40960175
How distorted is the message? No one ever tells things of spirituality without someone distorting the meaning, misranslating, or creating cults around specifics that were meant as teaching points.

>>40960208
It's gotta be this because depictions of the Buddha show him to be a fat slob.

>>40960346
the middle path that can be talked about is not the eternal (living) middle path.

>>40960449
>To give in to desire is to eat and become hungrier and hungrier.
essentialy this, be fulfilled without seeking fulfillment

be naked in front of reality, vulnerable and attentive to what is happening in the present moment, not expecting, not waiting,

>Not-knowing is true knowledge.
>Presuming to know is a disease.
>First realise that you are sick;
>then you can move toward health.
>The Master is her own physician.
>She has healed herself of all knowing.
>Thus she is truly whole.

>>40960148 (OP)
Do me a small favor and I shall attempt to explain.

>>40960685
>>>Not-knowing is true knowledge.
>>Presuming to know is a disease.
>>First realise that you are sick;
>>then you can move toward health.
>>The Master is her own physician.
>>She has healed herself of all knowing.
>>Thus she is truly whole.
Nice.

>>40960828
Low grade antique derelict mysticism.
There has been a misunderstanding about the Prometheus situation. Prometheus indeed. A wonder to wondrous wonders. Unfathomable foresight. This is some Willy Wonka type shit we are talking about.

>>40960148 (OP)
>>40960171
>>40960175
>>40960179
Anybody who believes they are going to to master the second half of his life as Buddha, without first indulging in the first half of his life as (Siddhartha Gautama), is very naïve.

I always find it funny that most people who are talking about "attaining enlightenment" or "becoming like Buddha", never want to consider the possibility that he was only able to detach himself from worldly things because he was a wealthy prince with harems, etc. for the first part of his life.

Simply put, he was able to detach because he got to thoroughly enjoy these things.

I like to look at it as three factors:
1. Having Your Fill - The normalization of worldly pleasures because you enjoyed them in excess, to the extent that the parts of your body, mind, soul, etc. that "hunger" end up feeling more "full" indefinitely.
2. Becoming Numb - Becoming numb to worldy pleasures due to overexposure. Once you experience something enough over and over, at a certain point it will go past the level of "being normal" and reach the level of "being inconsequential" to where you have a level of indifference towards it. I'd imagine that someone who has enjoyed having sex with beautiful women in a harem for years would begin to see sex as something that "just happens" as they never really had to struggle or put effort in to get it, and to them it's like drinking water, it's a given that they will get to have sex with beautiful women.
3. Removal The Element Of "Taboo" - Something being "taboo" or "forbidden" has always been a psychological factor that draws the human mind towards something, because it triggers both strong curiosity and desire (why can't I do this, what is it about, what would it feel like, etc.). If you've never been able enjoy it in excess, you trying to detach from it is likely to just end in failure.

So yeah, likely none of you will ever make it, because you haven't enjoyed worldly pleasures in excess like Buddha did.

>>40960232
>reenters the real world
What is the real world to you? Just working in an office building and trying your best to fit in with the latest trends? Dipshit. Playing video games is fine.

>>40961672
Shalom rabbi

>>40961734
Lol at this retarded response, what does this even have to do with jews? I can only assume that this is low effort rage bait.

I'm just pointing out that a lot of guys are coping, thinking that you can basically "quit life" before you have even "indulged in life". My point is, guys are skipping steps, looking at Buddhas second half of life and thinking you can just skip straight to that part without experiencing the first part. It's nothing but blind hope.

There's a reason why things like in these videos are happening everyday and they are a problem that is common yet hidden and not spoken about:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyJJmMSnqdM
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/Qzk15PAkUVI

You can't skip steps, if you are not well versed in and numb to the pleasures of the world, the chances of you resisting temptation are very low.

>>40961783
dont care didnt read
stop jerking off

>>40961812
Haven't jerked off in years, you're a retard, keep coping.

>>40961818
This is fucking retarded, man. You're acting like people don’t have the opportunity to indulge in vices today which given the conveniences of modern life is simply not true. But, on the other hand, Buddhist practice is about detachment and following the 8 fold path. Sure, most people don’t reach nirvana. So fucking what. The point is to liberate yourself from suffering, faggot.

I think its weird as fuck how you came in here trying to discourage people. And to this I say:

I can feel your energy from two planets away,
I got my drank, I got music, I would share it but today I’m saying bitch don’t kill my vibe.

>>40960148 (OP)
>How is this possible? How could a human being actually do this???
Through understanding dukkha and impermanence. When dukkha is FULLY understood - attachment goes away by itself. But one must meditate, of course, with a superficial, unconcentrated mind one cannot achieve the understanding of the presence of dukkha in all phenomena. Even the most perfect phenomena end (being god etc) - and this is their dukkha.

___________________________________________________________
"Aggivessana, this body is physical. It’s made up of the four primary elements, produced by mother and father, built up from rice and porridge, liable to impermanence, to wearing away and erosion, to breaking up and destruction. You should see it as impermanent, as suffering, as diseased, as an abscess, as a dart, as misery, as an affliction, as alien, as falling apart, as empty, as not-self. Doing so, you’ll give up desire, affection, and subservience to the body.

There are these three feelings: pleasant, painful, and neutral. At a time when you feel a pleasant feeling, you don’t feel a painful or neutral feeling; you only feel a pleasant feeling. At a time when you feel a painful feeling, you don’t feel a pleasant or neutral feeling; you only feel a painful feeling. At a time when you feel a neutral feeling, you don’t feel a pleasant or painful feeling; you only feel a neutral feeling.

Pleasant, painful, and neutral feelings are impermanent, conditioned, dependently originated, liable to end, vanish, fade away, and cease.

Seeing this, a learned noble disciple grows disillusioned with pleasant, painful, and neutral feelings. Being disillusioned, desire fades away. When desire fades away they’re freed. When they’re freed, they know they’re freed.

They understand: ‘Rebirth is ended, the spiritual journey has been completed, what had to be done has been done, there is no return to any state of existence.’"

One of the first books on Buddhism I read explicitly said not to believe anything I read about buddhism on internet forums.
He isn't wrong cause this entire thread is drivel. And it was created with the intention to bring more suffering instead of compassion

>>40961672
this is wrong, i know it from first hand experience.
i wanted many things in life and now see how pointless they are even though i never had them.
sure, being rich and full of bitches will make it more obvious, but its not necessary.
you can learn a lot by just observing. you can see that those folks who endulge in richness and sex are quite often depressed. some will say openly, and some will try (and fail) to hide it. those who are happy, would probably be happy even if their circumstances were different

>>40961854
based actual quoter of the suttas

>>40960148 (OP)
The religion is just a bunch of dogma and ego now.

>>40960148 (OP)
he was *exceptionally* spiritually developed even before achieving enlightenment, it takes much more time than 7 days of meditation for most people to realize their true nature, because we have accumulated much more karma

>>40961845
>You're acting like people don’t have the opportunity to indulge in vices today which given the conveniences of modern life is simply not true.
None of you can indulge in vices to the extent that Buddha did, that's my point. Being able to masturbate to porn and maybe have 8 sexual partners your entire life (the average number of lifetime sex partners for men based on stats I've seen) while living as a wage slave, is not the same thing as having a harem and living a life of luxury.

Your response is just showing me that you are coping, because it's like your mind is going out of it's way to avoid what I am so obviously and blatantly saying, I can't get any more specific than literally saying you didn't get to live the first half of Buddhas life, so thinking that you will excel in the second half is coping, it's blind faith, you likely won't make it.

>>40961845
>I can feel your energy from two planets away,
>I got my drank, I got music, I would share it but today I’m saying bitch don’t kill my vibe.
Why did you finish your response with these faggot tier lines? At first I thought you were a regular guy, now I can only assume you are a woman or a faggot (which are ironically two groups who will definitely never achieve what Buddha did (even Buddha said women couldn't do it, and a degenerate fag definitely will never do it).

I'll leave this thread now, I've made my point, keep coping but it won't make a difference.

>>40961879
>i wanted many things in life and now see how pointless they are even though i never had them.
You failed and gave up, that's a reasonable response, but that doesn't mean you are immune to temptation, it just means you don't have much means and opportunity, but the motive is still there. If a guy like you wins the lottery he'll do a 180. You just lack means and opportunity, and when your standards are low because you've lost in life, once the tiniest opportunity presents itself, you'll likely take it.

>you can see that those folks who endulge in richness and sex are quite often depressed
This is just a sad cope for losers in life. Someone being depressed doesn't mean that they aren't happier than you or that their life isn't objectively better than yours, because suffering is often relative to ones experiences and standards. Someone who lives a 10/10 life can become depressed when it becomes a 8/10 life, and their brain may trigger a level of depression similar to someone with a 5/10 life that became a 3/10 life, but that doesn't make their life just as bad or make either of their lives equivalent. One person has an objectively better life than the other, but their brain is so used to excess convenience and pleasure, that when it experiences a minor reduction, it can trigger depression for minor life problems in comparison to the person with an average life that becomes below average.

Rich people killing themselves doesn't mean that "money can't buy happiness", it just means that not everybody is objective enough to enjoy money properly or spend in properly.

Some people will waste their money on brand name clothes to show off for people who don't care about them, do drugs, etc., and then wonder why they are depressed and feel "empty". Others will be perfectly content just using the money to travel, fund their hobbies, eat well, etc. and to them money can definitely buy happiness.

I'll end it there.

>>40961960
>because suffering is often relative to ones experiences and standards.
ding ding ding

>>40961783
There are no steps - Buddha

He did not detach himself from everything.
Buddha died from food poisoning.
He was detached from bodily requirements and he was subject to the usual human frailties.

>>40961672
There is nothing to master - Buddha

>>40962708
>Confirmed that he did not master anything.
So nothing he said was any use then? He was just an amateur?

>>40960148 (OP)
Many other merits. Child of Ubermensche .

The Buddha spent many lifetimes becoming a Buddha. There are some practices that can lead to one becoming enlightened faster, but even most of those require spending the lifetime after this becoming enlightened in a Buddhas pure land or similar over a period of time.
>>40960512
Those are depictions of the monk Putai/Budai. He was a manifestation of the Buddha Maitreya, a future Buddha. That is not the same as who people usually call the Buddha, who is Sakyamuni Buddha.

>>40961941
This retard literally struggles with object permanence. Listen, you dumb faggot. Enlightenment isn’t up to you. You don’t get to determine that. There have been Buddhas who have indulged in more vices, and ones who have indulged in less. They are Buddha’s none the less. This claim that you have to have the act same vices as the Buddha is just retarded and becomes completely destroyed by the existence of other Buddhas, dumb fuck.

How do you not know that song. I can tell you’re like 50 or something. Heh.

>>40960148 (OP)
Enlightenment isn't necessarily detachment, it comes from detachment but true Enlightenment is Omniscience. Omniscience comes from freedom from craving, Om-niscience. Those who seek Nirvana in this life are riding a lesser vehicle and are simply daunted by the Wisdom of the Buddha. You are also already Enlightened and here you are praising the Buddha, it's just the false ego that makes it seem as if you are unenlightened. Just be patient and take little steps to eliminate desire, and keep paying homage to the Buddha and you can easily do it. Not everyone has the greatest birth but Buddha preaches for normal everyday people. Enlightenment comes from knowing the Wisdom of the Buddha. You clearly perceive his Wisdom so this is obviously your enlightenment and may totally encompass your path to Omniscience...

>>40960208
Yeah I actually just realized I was being too disciplined, and forgot about right livelihood. I am enjoying a cup of vanilla cold brew iced coffee and listening to the Lotus Sutra. The Lotus Sutra also talks about a sacred jewel everybody already has which allows you to enjoy the desires of the five senses. This happens after you practice asceticism, so don't jump right into it. But always right livelihood. Maybe take the Middleway

>>40962756
He mastered emptiness. (There is nothing to master.) This is in the Diamond and Heart Sutras

>>40963086
It's the same way that Stars come from empty space. The Tathagata is Void, the root of all that we perceive as existent. Dharma, Void, and Bliss are all One. The Tathagata is immutable so he does not have "causal" effects. But when you perceive the unity of Dharma, Void, and Bliss, this is the Tathagata turning the wheel of the Dharma (Nirvana Sutra). How everything is created. Christians stole the Tathagata root of existence and called it the Word. As long as you give proper credit to the Tao you'll never fall for empty words.

>>40960175
Didn't pretty much everything get destroyed by Muslims and what's left are other people's recollections of his teaching?

>>40963220
People made copies of Sutras, etc. and practices had spread widely by then. Buddhism's decline wasn't until it had already spread outside of North India. By the time its decline had begun it had already spread to China, Japan, etc.

>>40963220
There was nothing to destroy, it was an oral tradition from the start. The preservation of the pali suttas was passed from monk to monk over generations, so it can be said that many of the pali suttas, especially most important ones about 8fold path, 4 noble truths, the mahaparanibbana sutta (last teaching before he died), and also, any of the ones that would be especially easy phonetically to memorize, are likely to be close if not the exact words buddha spoke. It is quite impressive especially compared to the historical preservation of the aramaic jesus would've spoken in, but thats unrelated

>>40960148 (OP)
watch Theoria Apophasis
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IITj8V4ZXsk
he explains metaphysical liberation well and has literally thousands of videos

>>40963044
It's not omniscience. And humans obviously can't handle omniscience. Humans can be enlightened. Even jesus had a sort of limited knowledge and that was perfect to do what was necessary.

>>40960148 (OP)
>How could a human being actually do this?
By trying.

>>40961672
Braindead reasoning

>>40960148 (OP)
It *is* nuts.
I don't understand buddhism as much,
but I imagine you detach from *all thought*,
or *all emotions*, at least momentarily.

Understanding that you are not your thought, but that you are the vessel that hosts the thoughts, and that people tend to get lost in their thoughts and identify with their thoughts which are only temporary resonances that would otherwise change shape one day, is a big lesson to learn.

Then, you can learn how to detach, or manage, the frequency (literally is low, mid, high as in lust is a low frequency), and even be aware of how merely *seeing* a lustful image can provoke low frequency resonant vibrations, is the next step. Apply this likewise for all emotional states, and you become better at centering yourself in all situations.

Your body is your temple, and your mind is your ark.

You can build a house on a foundation of sand, or THE ROCK.

If you want to make a good impact upon this world, then you want to lay the foundation upon THE ROCK, and that rock is NOT Peter.

You are on that rock, right now.

>>40966186
It is said that buddhist monks have a rock inside them or something? Not sure if that's real.

>>40966186
It's said that they burned a ton of Tibetan buddhist writings.

The first block printer was invited in Korea for buddhist writings. I wonder what it says, maybe there are some confirmations in there.

Because detachment from *everything* is nihilistic. It's a valid option, but I'm staying on this rock.

>>40966208
The dissolution of suffering should not be an ultimate goal.

Like grapes are stressed to strengthen their roots, the overcoming of suffering increases us more.

Does that mean Buddha got it wrong? No. To each their own.

What I can tell you is that when Christianity and Buddhism collide, the idols disintegrate into sand.

Amen.

>>40966208
*invented

>>40966215
>The dissolution of suffering should not be an ultimate goal.
Yes it should. There is nothing more important than escaping suffering. There cannot be everlasting peace and comfort without the dissolution of suffering. Suffering is the prime evil of existence.

>>40960148 (OP)
Who cares?

>>40960148 (OP)
wealth.. buddha was a prince, son of a wealthy king at the time. You can literally detach or be a complete debauch degenerate if you're rich enough. Spirituality is literally a rich man's hobby.

>>40960148 (OP)
Just stop listening to lying jews

>>40960148 (OP)
buddhism is anti-life it's not profound

>>40960148 (OP)
very carefully

>>40960148 (OP)
My belief is the process recreates a moment of release you were already going to experience at your moment of natural death


I support egoic belief simply for the immortality aspect of existing here.

>>40960148 (OP)
bump for buddha

>>40960148 (OP)
Actual detachment would imply dematerialization. He is cited as having chosen to reincarnate, if you accept a mystical point of view