Thread 41062259

A lot of people here seem to not see the truth in Gnosticism and just want to use it as an excuse for their edginess. They make up false shit and believe the internet retarded doomer version of gnosticism that's just
>The friggin demiurge trapped me on Earth dood! Instead of actually reading books about acheiving gnosis im just going to autistically screech about it online and make fun of Catholic and Orthodox Christians!
It's so annoying and it's not even accurate. Are there any non-larp gnostics?

I don't apply the title of gnostic to myself, I prefer not to be bound to any strict way of thinking, but most of my beliefs and understandings align with it, so.
My journey started as a teen, where I was just curious about different religions and spiritual paths. I grew up pretty heavily influenced by native/tribal culture, and started with a foundation of "respect our earth, respect your fellow souls, and be loving/kind."
What I noticed was a lot of the core values of many religions or spiritual paths all had similar core teachings when you removed the names, storytelling, and human omission/addition for the sake of control.
Then in history classes and learning about ancient civilizations, I would branch off on my own to learn more than what school taught.
I came to an understanding pretty early on that multiple things can be true.

The doomer version and expression I feel is by design. People tend to gravitate toward negativity. I prefer to view physical life akin to peeling petals off a closed flower under you get to the center.

>>41062259 (OP)
I've read the Bible and now I'm reading the Nag Hammadi Scriptures
Gnosticism seems like bullshit to me, desu
I just don't understand what people see in it. Christians already know the world is fallen and full of evil and controlled by Satan, so what else is new

>>41062450
Doesn't sound like you've read either.

>>41062470
The world is controlled by Satan, otherwise it wouldn't have made sense for Satan to offer the kingdoms of the world to Jesus
The Nag Hammadi Scriptures just don't have any authenticity to them. Whatever we do know about them is that the early church fathers considered it heretical, which they are.
There is no hidden secret special knowledge that will grant you salvation that only a certain small group of people know about. That's total bullshit and everyone knows it.

>>41062522
Again, you clearly haven't read the scriptures. You're talking irrelevant gibberish.

>>41062319
>I prefer not to be bound to any strict way of thinking
That's Gnostic, bud.

>>41062522
You know most Gnostic Christians didn't take the lore literally, right? It was all allegory to them. What about this don't you understand?

>>41062663
Hehehe, touché

>>41062259 (OP)
Non-larp gnostics don't have any reason to post about their spiritual path on 4chan. Gnosis is not a religion and they do not proselytize. When they do reveal something, they adapt it to the person they are addressing, based on their traditional background and their level of spiritual maturity. Preaching "gnosticism" to those who aren't ready to receive higher teaching is always destructive, first and foremost to the preacher, upon whom it is incumbent to understand that the world is saved through one's own attainment of knowledge and not through controlling the opinions of others (which is one of the functions of religion: so these proselytizers are very often psychics who have gotten themselves confused by seeking that which is above them).

>loving God made the world
>hid the instructions for salvation
>only a few lucky people can figure it out
Wow gnosticism is epic, I'm so smart for being a gnostic and everyone else is an evil hylic

Everyone on 4chan is either a troll, LARPer, or shill.

Just ask them what Barbelo means and when they inevitably ask you what you mean, call them retarded until they leave and stop shitting up the board.

>>41062259 (OP)
I owe nothing to anyone. I don't have to prove whether I'm a true Gnostic or just a usurper. The real question lies elsewhere: we are not all at the same spiritual level, even among Gnostics. Some are much more connected to their spirit than others. This is why there can be divergences in words, in language, in origin, or even in each person's spiritual foundation.
Because gnosis is not a simple reading of texts. It is not an accumulation of information. Gnosticism is direct knowledge, a secret initiation, a lived experience. It is an inner journey.
However, not everyone approaches it with the same intensity. And above all, our thoughts are not always clear. It is difficult to distinguish when it is the ego expressing itself, when it is the mind, when it is the higher mind, or even the spirit. We are not connected in the same way at every moment. It depends on the state of the world, the current egregore, and our inner state at the time. Sometimes you can say very beautiful words, and two hours later, say things that no longer make any sense.

Finally, this world is composed of multiple layers of reality. These realities don't contradict each other: each is true in its own plane. But depending on whether we ascend or descend to another plane, the laws change completely. This doesn't make them any less real.

>>41062789
I think Gnosticism has a lot to do with Buddhism, but only certain sects of Buddhism. Though not all are the same, it's usually Mahayana and Vajrayana that seeks to attain the role of the Bodhisattva. In contrast (again, I understand completely and do not need a lecture on all the exceptions) Theravada, for example, commonly seeks Moksha instead.
I tend to find most of Mahayana akin to Orthodoxy or Catholicism personally. But the topic of the Bodhisattva is nuanced and the sects which practice it, specifically Vajrayana (which is what I'm most familiar with), seem to me to be closer to what I find Gnosticism to be underneath.
To explain, I find a lot of overlap in the structure of their system, where the intense focus on Bhakti Yoga really resembles for me the meditations on the Sophia (or Mary the Magdalene), equating in some ways Shiva to Jesus.
This is just one aspect of the overlap between the systems. I could do a lot more, like the imagery of the Firey Sword (Manjushri and Revelation) the similarities between the references to the Ajna and certain bible verses (again, it's Revelation), the Wisdom of Sophia and Shakti's Bell (muh Seven Rays) and on and on, but I'll save all of you for now.
I really ranted there, but if we're all showing off, I guess this is a brief summary from me. Anyway, all this was to say that I don't think you have a mature understanding of the interplay between Gnosticism and more developed spiritual systems. Gnosticism is, if you're doing it right, in the end about "rescuing Sophia" and you too can do this by becoming a Bodhisattva, anon. To help you understand, you fuck the Shakti in other versions of you (muh Brahman multiple faces), other people, to "rescue Sophia" as the Bridegroom of themseveles trapped in muh Demiurge's "prison".
I think either you got got or haven't figured out yet they all had to go underground because they kept getting murdered (so I guess I don't blame you much).

>>41062259 (OP)
What's an "actual Gnostic" to you? Serious question.

>>41064451
Well part of the preface of the thread is helping OP understand what "Gnosticism" means. I guess we could spend the next 100 posts all asking the same question, but it'd be nice if eventually someone explains the nuance of OP.

>>41064451
Anyone who knows they have the Christ-Sol. NTA

>>41062259 (OP)
>Are there any Jew approved kosher gnostics here instead of "larpers"?
Is what you seem to be really asking...

>>41064488
you are a retarded nigger

In Gnosticism, we mention the Archons, but we never talk about the Archangels, the luminous entities. Do you know why? Because you're fucking Satanists.

>>41064566
>because you're satanists
Problem? Lucifer is the gnostic hero.

>Are there any non-larp gnostics?
ya but /x/ in 2025 is a desert for actual conversation on these matters, so i just lurk
the way is as narrow as ever

Gnostics are ungrateful whores. God created their bodies and souls for them, and they aren't even grateful for the beautiful life they've lived on Earth. They're fed and housed for free. God answers their pleas when they're sick, when they're lonely. I can't wait for you to be thrown into the depths of hell.

>>41064566
are you retarded? Literally search up the Aeons. Gnosticism doesn't only mention the Archons, dumbass.

>>41062450
A few things that might be appealing about it:

For one thing, it fits a little better with modern science to say that this world was corrupt from the beginning rather than created perfectly fine and then taken over, since we don't have much evidence that it was ever a paradise here and we have a lot of evidence to the contrary. For another thing, it avoids attributing all the genocide, genital mutilation, and animal sacrifice commands directly to the good God, making better sense of why those rules don't apply to Christians and perhaps making better sense of some things Paul says, as well as taking seriously the times in the Old Testament where it seems to say that God didn't require sacrifices (Like Psalm 40:6, "Sacrifice and offering you do not desire, but you have given me an open ear. Burnt offering and sin offering you have not required."), which the Gnostic can interpret as being from the influence of Christ/Sophia, while the other things can instead be interpreted as being from the influence of humans, the archons, or the demiurge's distorted lens on the plan for salvation (http://www.gnosis.org/library/flora.htm). It's also more appealing for people who are intuitively very convinced of things like preexistence or reincarnation.

>>41064587
This is worded like Earth is a perfect planet with no mistakes, can you also discuss how God gave us humans war, famine, poverty, death, genocide, and all of the crazy shit on Earth? Should we be grateful for that too?

>>41064624
It's because the demon perched on your left shoulder whispers nonsense and lies to you that you come to believe in reincarnation. If you believe in reincarnation, then you inevitably see this world as a prison: a place where your memory is erased and where you no longer have the freedom to think.

But the truth is quite different: we only have one life. Yes, there is suffering on Earth, but it exists to separate the wheat from the chaff (Matthew 13:24-30), to prepare us for Judgment Day. For it is only through trial that we can truly discern whether we are a good or a bad person.

>>41064675
>the demon perched on your left shoulde
Next you're going to tell us you believe in the rapture lmao

>>41064611
Also doing apologetics for a much more Gnostic Christianity being original could be fun as an ultra-hard (but I believe still viable) mode of apologetics for people who are just really into arguing.

>>41064875
Yeah, true, I'm not sure I believe much about gnosticism but it is definitely an interesting type of theology

>>41064675
You realize how pointless that would be if we only had one life to live and whatever we do here cinches it forever? You understand how you would have learned nothing or whatever you have learned would be moot? How can you not see this?

>>41065310
The concept of reincarnation is like another illusion invented by the Devil to prevent human beings from questioning themselves before death. Not only does it give a sense of impunity
>it doesn't matter, I can do harm in this life, I'll have another chance.

but it also instills in people of good will the impression that liberation will never come. Thus, divine mercy is replaced by an intellectual construct: karma, which seems to appear out of nowhere and becomes an argument for judging whether one is a good or bad person.
However, if a four-year-old child, or even a one-year-old, dies, it is not because they deserved such a fate in a previous life, but because God, who never assigns a trial beyond a soul's capacity, has decided so. In this case, an immense paradise awaits them.

If you take even the slightest interest in this Gnostic religion, you will notice that many of those who practice it behave in an arrogant and disrespectful manner. Since they consider the earth not sacred but impure, they seem to want to destroy it and its inhabitants. They show neither shame nor compassion. As soon as someone speaks to them about the truth, that is, Christianity, they react with contempt and mockery. Their pride is immense: they believe themselves to be more intelligent than others, when in reality, they only take from Christianity what serves their interests. This makes them deeply deceptive people and often lie.

>>41065464
Once you know The Way, you are in a perpetual state of repentant heart. So, you're wrong and you only need one example to prove you're wrong.
>However, if a four-year-old child, or even a one-year-old, dies, it is not because they deserved such a fate in a previous life, but because God, who never assigns a trial beyond a soul's capacity
You use that word so loosely. Explain the theatrics of Revelation.

>>41065484
As for the "theatrical effects of Revelation," it is true that the Bible uses symbolic and dramatic language to reveal God's final victory over evil. These images are not spectacles, but spiritual and prophetic signs that remind us of God's justice, mercy, and triumph.
The Christian Way is based on grace and repentance, not on the cycle of lives or karmic justice. Divine mercy is real, immediate, and perfect.

>>41065504
>As for the "theatrical effects of Revelation," it is true that the Bible uses symbolic and dramatic language to reveal God's final victory over evil
Yeah, so you're saying it's fictional.
>These images are not spectacles, but spiritual and prophetic signs that remind us of God's justice, mercy, and triumph
There's no need for The Creator to "win" anything or "triumph" over anyone. He's The Creator.
Tell me this, why aren't you giving away all you own?

>>41065521
I understand your objection, but there is an important nuance. When the Bible speaks of God's "victory" or "triumph," it is not to suggest that He is in competition or that He must "win" something. It serves to show, symbolically, that evil will be defeated and divine justice will be accomplished. This dramatic language helps our limited minds grasp profound spiritual truths.
As for giving "all one has," the Christian faith teaches generosity and detachment, but God respects our freedom. The call to give does not mean forced impoverishment, but a movement of the heart toward charity and love of one's neighbor, according to one's abilities and gifts. True greatness is not in the material quantity given, but in the attitude of the soul that seeks to love and serve.
Please stop making yourself dumber than you are.

So does anyone have a valid explanation for why there'd be 37 almost entirely devoid of substance related to the OP?
Is there really that many people out there who just know to say "archons" and "demiurge" and maybe two or three other words and that's it - that constitutes a thread about "Gnosticism?
Guys, I have to insist it's extremely evident practically none of you have any understanding of what Gnosticism is. Can you please go read something about this subject? It makes it very boring when /x/ is supposed to be a book-reading board unlike /b/ or /bant/.
Do any of you even know what a Barbelo is? Who is Mani? What is a "Bridegroom" and how does it relate to this subject? Who were the Libertines and why did they become so degenerate? What was wrong with what the Valentinians, Sethians, etc. were doing when Plotinus corrected them (on Gnosticism in the Enneads)? What was the Refrigerium? Who were the Essenes?
If all you know is archons and this is a prison and sophia is stupid or something, then I'm afraid you're not even modestly informed about Gnosticism.

>>41065561
>I understand your objection, but there is an important nuance. When the Bible speaks of God's "victory" or "triumph," it is not to suggest that He is in competition or that He must "win" something.
Are you saying Revelation is not literal or true in a literal sense?
Jesus literally praised the woman that gave ALL she had. Even if it was two stipends. These passages contradict what you just said. Also, literally says you can't be his Disciple if you don't give away all you own. As you know, there's more than one passage about it.

>>41065566
>Do any of you even know what a Barbelo is?
The thoughts of the soul.
>Who is Mani?
That I don't know.
>What is a "Bridegroom" and how does it relate to this subject?
The marriage between your male and female aspects.
>Who were the Libertines and why did they become so degenerate?
It's the kind of impression free will can give you. I don't know anything other than that if you're looking for demon names or ancestral curses and things.
>What was wrong with what the Valentinians, Sethians, etc. were doing when Plotinus corrected them (on Gnosticism in the Enneads)?
This I don't know either.
>What was the Refrigerium?
Don't know.
>Who were the Essenes?
A sect of Judaism that relied on Ancient "YHWH" knowledge from before he revealed himself to the Shasu.

This is your true face, Gnostics. You are the greatest Satanists that the earth has ever known.

>>41062259 (OP)
Dood, i just postin coz snaek

>>41065767
The Demiurge wants us to circumcise our children and gives authority to central bankers.

>>41062259 (OP)
All religions are a larp unless they have some strong root in one's childhood, in which case it is part of their culture. But somehow I know that most of /x/ has adopted an idea they like and say it is their culture.

>>41066101
Both Buddhism and Christianity are theosophies that have been construed into religion by this material world via church and tradition.

>>41062259 (OP)
Fuck you, know that I'm a Gnostic and I don't mind jokes, even about these beliefs. We're not going to create a dogmatic religion where we can laugh at anything.

>>41064550
Why? Because you worship Jew on sticc? Good golem. More blood for the blood god!

Gnosticism to me is a way to make sense of Christianity and the larger abrahamic realm of influence. Oh, god is evil and "free will" is a game of domination and submission? Makes perfect sense.

>>41068079
Retards will always come to /x/ threads and complain about Jews for literally no reason and im sick of it, if you want to go autistically screech about DA JOOOOS go do it on /pol/ you filthy tranny

BUMP

>>41064611
Yes. You are good. One small criticism. Reincarnation is not happening, at least not in the way that people traditionally think of it. Look into the Black Iron Prison time loop 4 answers.

>>41071033
>Literally no reason
Shut the fuck up shlomo

>>41062817
A loving God did not create the world as per the Gnostics. The Demiurge created the world and it is as flawed as any human.

>>41062259 (OP)
I have had other people tell me im "gnostic" when I explained to them my views on religion, but I wouldnt say I am a strict follower of whatever it may be about.

I was sent to a Christian Sunday school as a kid and went through confirmation as a teen, but I always saw (and was taught) more so that the teachings of the faith are just basic, sensible concepts to not being a shit person to others. I think in that respect, I appreciate what I was taught at a young age.

As far as what I actually believe in "creation myth", I like reading about different religions and their backgrounds, but I personally think there is no definitive answer to existence. I do think there is a "God", and I find it extremely hard to no accept the idea that one exists. However, I dont strictly think "God" is a sentient force(maybe it is), but rather a name for whatever force began the universe/reality. Rather then a specific "thing", I see it more as being open to the idea that there is a force beyond all mysticism, beyond all science and understanding, that existence was born from, and we as mortal beings, will never be able to comprehend the nature of what this force is and the nature of it, be it sentient or not. Its simply a concept that no level of science could possibly begin to ever give a final answer on, because its impossible for beings within "reality" to ever truly understand the nature of what exists beyond it. If I had to make up my own head-canon answer, I think "God" is something more along the lines of something equivalent to single-cell organisms on an incomprehensible scale to us, that caused a chemical reaction like event that began reality. Something like that could be either completely non-sentient, or on a level of intelligence that is completely alien to our understanding of the concept, while still being very basic in its function.

Basically, I just try and be a good person and I accept the idea that we will never understand the true nature of existence

>>41062259 (OP)
real gnostics are busy with coitus reservatus...
you won't find them here!

>>41064572
I never understood how he is a hero desu just another manipulator trying to usurp demiurge so he can play god instead

>>41062259 (OP)
Most so-called Gnostics missed the plot and fell into the trap of literalism. The Demiurge is just the ego. I will not elaborate further. Do your own seeking.

>>41074467
>I will not elaborate further
The trademark signature of the disinformation spreader.

No, the ego is bad but the Demiurge is NOT the ego, as the Demiurge predates the physical world by definition whereas your inner ego was formed after YOUR birth (not even the birth of the world)

>>41064451
>frankists
haha yeah, jews who are not pure materialists, sure thing buddy. only the most selfish souls decide to incarnate into the semitic race to then forget that a soul even exists while they get entangled in this realm. their writings are only practical manuals on how to live a successful worldly life, there is no heaven or salvation in the jewish lore. jews consider themselves to be gods.

>>41074711
"It is always, therefore, a question of outward experience, not of inner; the conceptions are always thoroughly concrete, material; as Montefiore assures us, even in the advanced Jewish religion there is nothing which the dullest might not immediately understand and fathom to its uttermost depth; as soon as a man has a feeling of a mystery, as soon as he, for instance, supposes that there can be anything symbolical in the history of the creation, he is a heretic and a gallows-bird. Even the utterly materialised history of creation given in the book of Genesis is so manifestly alien and borrowed that it remains totally isolated amid the Israelitish tradition and without actual connection with it. ‡ The will in fact gives little rope to the understanding and the imagination. So it is that the Semite who has begun to doubt at once becomes an atheist; there is in any case no secret, no mystery: if Allah is not the creator, then must matter be; as an explanation of the world there is scarcely the shadow of a difference between the two views, for in the case of neither does the Semite feel himself in the presence of an inexplicable riddle, a superhuman mystery."

FOUNDATIONS OF THE 19TH CENTURY, HOUSTON STEWART CHAMBERLAIN

>>41074722
german original:

"Immer also handelt es sich um äussere Erfahrung, nicht um innere; immer sind die Vorstellungen durchaus konkrete, materielle; wie Montefiore uns versichert, selbst in der ausgebildeten jüdischen Religion giebt es nichts, was nicht der dümmste Mensch sofort verstünde und bis auf den Boden ausdenken könnte; sobald Einer ein Mysterium ahnt, sobald er z. B. in der Schöpfungsgeschichte Symbolik vermutet, ist er ein Ketzer und verfällt dem Henker; selbst die möglichst materialisierte Schöpfungsgeschichte des Buches Genesis ist ein so offenbar fremdes, entlehntes Gut, dass sie inmitten der israelitischen Tradition vollkommen isoliert und ohne wirkliche Beziehung auf sie bleibt. 3) Der Wille führt eben den Verstand und die Phantasie an kurzen Ketten. Daher schlägt der ungläubig gewordene Semit sofort in den Atheisten um; ein Geheimnis, ein Mysterium gab es ja ohnehin nicht: ist nicht Allah der Schöpfer, so ist es die Materie; als Welterklärung ist zwischen beiden Annahmen kaum der Schatten eines Unterschiedes, denn bei keiner von beiden fühlt sich der Semit in Gegenwart eines unlösbaren Rätsels, eines übermenschlichen Geheimnisses."

DIE GRUNDLAGEN DES XIX. JAHRHUNDERTS HOUSTON STEWART CHAMBERLAIN

>>41074711
The Jewish State has never been delimited in space. It has been spread all over the world, without any frontiers whatsoever, and has always been constituted from the membership of one race exclusively. That is why the Jews have always formed a State within the State. One of the most ingenious tricks ever devised has been that of sailing the Jewish ship of state under the flag of religion and thus securing that tolerance which Aryans are always ready to grant to different religious faiths. The Mosaic Law is really nothing else than the doctrine of the preservation of the Jewish race and, therefore, includes all spheres of sociological, political and economic science which have a bearing on the main end in view.

Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, 1925/26, Stalag Edition
_

Der jüdische Staat war nie in sich räumlich begrenzt, sondern universell unbegrenzt auf den Raum, aber beschränkt auf die Zusammenfassung einer Rasse. Daher bildete dieses Volk auch immer einen Staat innerhalb der Staaten. Es gehört zu den genialsten Tricks, die jemals erfunden worden sind, diesen Staat als „Religion“ segeln zu lassen und ihn dadurch der Toleranz zu versichern, die der Arier dem religiösen Bekenntnis immer zuzubilligen bereit ist. Denn tatsächlich ist die mosaische Religion nichts anderes als eine Lehre der Erhaltung der jüdischen Rasse. Sie umfaßt daher auch nahezu alle soziologischen, politischen sowie wirtschaftlichen Wissensgebiete, die hierfür überhaupt nur in Frage zu kommen vermögen.

Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, 1925/26

>>41062259 (OP)
>Are there any actual Gnostics on /x/ instead of larpers?
lol, if you hate thist world & everything in it, you already qualify to be a gnostic
>b-but isnt it just the rejection of the world without alternative
no, your soul knows the state before it was born, when it was with god & thats the state it longs for & reminisces about. if you are awakened to the reality of heaven, to the existence of the true timeless & incorporial god beyond the veil you suffer in this demiurgic hellrealm, the agents of the matrix attempt to drag you down to their level constantly. while all npc are acllimatized to the world & live their mediocre lives without god in more or less blissful ignorance.

you think you can qualify more than someone else to be a gnostic by studying knowledge written in books, throughout time, over the years acquire enough wisdom to then break free? see where the problem lies? its all worldly categories, you cannot reach heaven by building a tower in this world, wake up, many children are born pure & are already gifted salvation & feel good close by, its the world that confuses us over time & makes us interested more in things & power so we burden ourselves & lose the lightness of heart that is required to know god.

Somewhere in the Nintendos of the 80s the testemet was told.

My astral did it once. But I was in my body, so wtf. I missed out on that. Its kind of funny I fell from grace then all I hear in my head is some trying to take advantage of that and hurt me, then waaadaaa I rose to gnosis. Every tripped and said wtf he's satan! He rising! I was all like Im satan im rising. I am speed. Fuck you! fuck you!

>>41073628
>heh, he doesn't want unneeded jew-hate in a thread unrelated to jews, therefore he must be a jew!

>>41077197
>a heckin racisms??? Not on my /x/!!!
Also Jews are relevant to the subject of how Gnosticism is portrayed in the mainstream and gate kept as a primarily Christian/Jewish offshoot religion. Hence my comment. Don't care if you don't like it you fucking fag.

>>41062663
>That's Gnostic, bud.
That's his point I guess, no true Gnostic will make the mistake of encasing themselves in a denomination.
>>41062789
>Gnosis is not a religion and they do not proselytize
correct
>Preaching "gnosticism" to those who aren't ready to receive higher teaching is always destructive
correct again

>>41064413
It really would be closer to Taoism if you need have that sort of mental representation, but what you are perceiving is because all the religions have a single point of origin, a primordial knowledge if you will.
>I don't think you have a mature understanding of the interplay between Gnosticism and more developed spiritual systems.
I don't think you have a mature understanding of the Gnosis if you are comparing it to 'more developed spiritual systems', perhaps you mean religions?
>I really ranted there
>but if we're all showing off
You are, on both accounts.

>>41074452
>I never understood how he is a hero desu
Calling it a hero is something of an edgy teen deduction.
Think of it as an archetype rather and make your own interpretations.
/x/ much like the rest of 4chan is no longer, or at least atm, a good place to have coherent discussions