rudeus

Corporate sees them as the same picture

what debate
one is in primarily a drama the other is in primarily a comedy
doesn't make much sense to compare them desu

>>279912273
Nobody cares about that pedo.

>>279912225 (OP)
Pantiesbro > Groundhog Naruto

>>279912225 (OP)
uh you're supposed to put rika and okabe instead of kazuma

The answer is obvious

>>279912870
Season 2 was an absolute boring slog. This proves Rudeus can't carry a show, unlike Kazuma, who carries KonoSuba.

>>279912225 (OP)
Kazuma by a mile.

>>279912225 (OP)
They're two completely different characters. What's the debate here?

>>279912225 (OP)
I won't say Subaru is bad. He fits his story, but it's always more interesting to see how Kazuma faces situations and solves problems. It's always entertaining and sometimes unpredictable, because he can range anywhere from simple violence, to negotiating, to scamming, to legit just give up, to throwing someone under the bus, or even to temporarily defecting his side (with varying degrees of sincerity).

Let's not forget that a lot of this is allowed because of the comedy genre, but the point stands.

Another thing that doesn't really work in Subaru's favor for me is that he works on time travel mechanics, so a good number of his solutions come after he has fucked up repeatedly and he arrives at the correct answer by process of elimination, erasing the previous failures. I fully understand that this the POINT of this time of story, and that's fine, but it kinda makes it less engaging than the alternative.

>>279913059
You're so Reddit.

>>279912225 (OP)
This is going to sound super weird to say, all things considered, but even so:
I think Kazuma might actually be a better person than Subaru is. Not just a better character, but actually like a better and more moral dude.

>>279913178

I won't read the LN, does Kazuma ever become competent and stop hiding behind his tard harem?

>>279913546
>redditsons

>>279913577
Wtf are you talking about? Kazuma is the most competent one of the bunch. He's not super specialized like the others, but he knows how to use those specializations to get them out of problems (that they usually got themself into)

>>279913631
>redditchan

>>279912225 (OP)
That debate is so reddit.

>>279912225 (OP)
Kazuma, Kazuma.

>>279912295
Kazuma isn't a cuck. He's not afraid to agressively approach his love interest instead of playing beta orbiter for years.

>>279914990
Its honestly kind of funny to imagine how Re:zero would have played out if you simply swapped Kazuma into Subaru's place. Kazuma with Return by Death would have solved his problems a hell of a lot faster, simply by right of being a smarter dude who makes better use of his resources. Dying sucks, but Kazuma has already died and been rezzed multiple times in his own show so its not like he can't get over that hurdle.
Kazuma is the exact sort of person who would spend a loop JUST gathering information and then suicide-running the endgame to see how far he can get, just to give his next loop as much info as possible to plan with.
Also, he'd recognize that Emelia isn't into him pretty quickly. That alone would massively change the outcome of the story, since simping hard for Emelia is like 90% of what drives Subaru's actions.

>>279912917
The only exceptionally good part of MT was the adventuring aspect of the first season after that it fell off a 100m cliff.

>>279915199
Kazuma without a doubt would chase after Felt in the alley event and entice Petra into signing a contract of becoming his wife in 5 year time.

>>279912273
>elder god powers since age 3 that kills everything with ease
no thank you

>>279912225 (OP)
Kazuma, he has a similar past but doesn't act like a school shooting schizo and gigasimp.
>>279912273
Still Kazuma because Kazuma keeps his personality instead of turning into stale bread.

>>279912225 (OP)
chadzuma

>>279912273

>>279912273
Realest post ITT. I never cared about Re:Zero or Konosuba, but MT I can like
ReZero and Konosuba just isn't cool or edgy enough to be appealing. They feel like half-baked series for idk, cringe fags?

>>279915199
>>279915279
Right. Without a doubt Kazuma goes the Felt route and dodges the entire Emilia camp nonsense.
His conflict then becomes their quest to get rich as fuck, likely gaining Anastasia's faction as his main enemy in the process..

>>279912225 (OP)

Kazuma and it´s not even close. Subaru is unintentionally pathetic and lame, Kuzuma is intentionally pathetic and lame and he embraces his duchebag nature.

>>279912273

Rudeus is not even Shield hero tier. He is just depressing.

Cringebaru and Fagzuma are both Reddit in my book
I consider Rudeus to be the Sakata Gintoki or Joseph Joestar of Isekai, which is my fav type of MC. He's even got Sugita Tomokazu

>>279915852
>I consider Rudeus to be the Sakata Gintoki or Joseph Joestar of Isekai
That's an insane thing to say, rudeus becomes so boring having to read his 0 iq inner monologue becomes painful, he is the worst part of his own series, after he assembles his bitches he could be written out entirely and it would improve the series tremendously.

>>279912225 (OP)
Subaru has been through so much shit that I've really warmed up to him.

>>279916018
Sounds like a major seethe. As someone who actually likes MT, Rudeus is a big part for why I like the series. I don't even care for the harem as much, but I think Rudeus is really great. But he's the kind of protagonist that's sorta have pull-and-push action with the world around him, so his series isn't really one-man show and that's one thing I like about it too

>>279916210
So what do you like about him? Because I've read the whole thing and he just turns into nothing: the character halfway through.

>>279912295
Kazuma actually gets figures though.

>>279916318
You talk like you wouldn't get it. You can keep liking Subaru or Kazuma or whoever, I kinda don't care either way

>>279915618
That someone who enjoys fucking Mushoku Tensei would have the audacity to call other shows cringe is baffling to me.

>>279916402
No answer as expected.

>>279913391
Kazuma isn't schizophrenic.

>>279916445
>posts the most boring girl imaginable
Lol

>>279913577
He 1v1s the Demon Lord and wins

>>279912225 (OP)
If Kazuma picked Luna, Wiz or even Darkness than he would have won over Subaru. Don't get why Konosuba author decided to go for a loli in an era where loli love interest are unacceptable.

>>279915618
Re:Zero is pretty edgy though, it's just that people brush off the edgy parts. To begin with the RBD power is radioactive, only the mentally ill are compatible and it actively makes anybody who uses it more mentally ill, even setting aside the actual dying bit.
If Kazuma or Rudy got it, it still wouldn't be "used properly" they would just get a brain aneurysms and like retards.

>>279916611
Yeah, I don't really think Re:Zero is bad. I think it also has really interesting concepts and cool ideas in it. (It's probably the first isekai I tried back then thinking about it now) It's still enjoyable to watch, I think it was even more entertaining than Konozuba for me. But I'm not really as fond of it as I am with MT

>>279915800
>Kuzuma is intentionally pathetic and lame and he embraces his duchebag nature.

Kazuma is at his most pathetic and lame when he is trying hard to pretend to be something that he is not. When you tries to act high class, refined, like some storybook heroic figure, etc. That is not who he is, so it always comes crashing down on him.
But the funny thing is that, when the chips are down, Kazuma IS a heroic figure. Just not a knight in shining armor. He commits to helping those around him, coming up with plans to save others even when those plan put him in danger and get him killed. He makes personal sacrifices for the wellbeing and happiness of others, strangers and friends alike.

The end of season 2 is a great microcosm of this. Kazuma's first instinct is to run away from the slime demon general because its way stronger than they are, but once he realizes that running away would save *him* but would would still doom the *town*, he stops. Catches his breath. Thinks over his options. And comes up with a plan to save the day. And its made clear that the girls *knew* that Kazuma would do so, they had full trust that this was something he could do as soon as he stopped panicking and got his head in the game.
And as the story continues, we see that he panics less and thinks more. That he gets more comfortable with these kinds of gametime strategy decisions.
Kazuma is still a scummy person in his regular day to day life. A drunkard, rowdy pervert. But he's also the sort of guy who is willing to die to save other people, and I can think of no more straightforward definition of a hero.

>>279912225 (OP)
Rudeus cannot steal pantsu, therefore it’s obvious who is superior

>>279916589
I maintain that the earlier parts of Konosuba strongly telegraph that Darkness was the intended endgame, before the author bowed to fan demands for more Megumin. Kazuma and Darkness just have a bunch of little personal moments where they open up to each other that doesn't exist between him and the other characters.

>>279916713
Frankly, all three are different enough that it really can just come down to personal preferences of edgy/funny/journey.

lmao darkness fags are so pathetic

>>279915199
>if you simply swapped Kazuma into Subaru's place
The whole premise of the first episode is that Subaru simps for Emilia so much that he tries over and over again to save her and so falls into the plot. Kazuma would be like "nah, screw that, i'm not going into that house again" and would fuck off do his own thing.

>>279917168
>Kazuma would be like "nah, screw that, i'm not going into that house again" and would fuck off do his own thing.

Yeah, because he's not a fucking moron. The number of times that Subaru dies in that shitty bar because he lacks a basic understanding of cause and effect made me think that Subaru was legitimately mentally disabled.
> The last time I was here, everyone was dead and then an unseen assailant stabbed me to death
> Huh, didn't I already do all of this today? Weird.
> Oh hey, its that place where I died. But everyone is still alive. *I guess I shouldn't worry about anything*
> Oh hey, new person who I don't remember seeing among the dead bodies the last time that I was here. How are you? I bet you are safe and trustworthy.
> Oh no I am being stabbed to death again HOW COULD THIS HAPPEN TO ME?

>>279917322
The issue isn't that he didn't figure it out, it's that he was overthinking it like a mentally ill retard and was in denial.
He pretty much says as much, "This might be time looping, but that's ridiculous and I don't want to think about it. I must've been healed by someone."

>>279912225 (OP)
Kazuma. He carries Konosuba on his back, as shown by the Megumin spinoff. It would just not be the same without him. He is very entertaining to watch, self aware yet somewhat unhinged and can be nice or shitty person on demand.
Subaru's whole draw is to watch this literally who get out of shitty situations and suffer in the process. This however is not utilized nowhere near enough season 2 onwards plus he is dragged down by the focus on Emilia and her stupidity since he is related to being her orbiter.
>>279915618
Rudeus torpedoed both his and Silphy's character with the same affair. His supposed redemption hit a brick wall and shattered, meanwhile Siphy became a cuck that didn't even try to wrestle for the man she loved and this is nowhere near enough compensated by being the "family pillar" later on. All is made worse by the fact he gets away with this scot free.
Also season 2 was an absolute slog since Rudeus bounces really well off of Paul, Eris, Ruijerd and Zanoba, while others are either jobbers kneeling to him, will they won't they with the first two wives or boot lickers. Adventuring carried the show.

>>279912225 (OP)
Subaru? No kazuma? Nah redesigned? Nope
Kneel before the og light novel harem isekai protag

>>279919317
>Kazuma. He carries Konosuba on his back, as shown by the Megumin spinoff
The Vanir spin-off is miles better than the Konosuba main series though, and he ain't even in there. Kazuma can't carry shit

>>279912273
Based. The other two aren't even stories. They just go on until people get bored.

>>279916589
>where loli love interest are unacceptable.
Who cares about that?

>>279912273
Rudeus would have had all 3 of them pregnant within a month. Kazuma is a cuck.

>>279912273


Don't know why someone thought to make Rudeus a pedo. Like make him a loser neet but that one decision made him completely unlikable.

>>279916523
That's not Sylphie

>>279912917

I'm glad I'm not the only person that thought Season 2 of that show with the 7 deadly sins battles was boring. Made me drop it but I might rewatch it again for Ren

>>279912727
> Naruto.
What part of Re;Zero Kara is naruto? Its the Most Final Fantasy esque world with basic bitch elemental magic system and definitely not Naruto in it.

>>279919666
It's really not that big of a deal. We had a thread complaining that Goku's a bad person and no one really cared.

Why? Probably because Japan hasn't gone insane enough to see pedos as worse than murderers and everything else. For Rifujin it's just a trait to make him a shittier person but for Americans it becomes the entire focus.

why does Rudeus get called a pedo but Subarus official in universe title is little girl user? thats unfair

>>279919356
Nah fuck him. This guy's the most based Isekai MC. (Pic related.) No cheats, just proper training and fuck you up if you mess with me attitude. Wortenia Senki.

Tbh I wish more characters were like Subaru, Im tired of the "common sense meta acknowledging, quippy, I'd react this way too" protagonist. I miss unironic chuuni writing that were written intentionally to make bad decisions.
>>279919729
He was talking about Mushoku Tensei.
>>279919786
He probably means Subaru talk no jutsu'ing Garfiel and making a speech in season 2.

>>279920055
Charisma is a skill. He's just rerolling his saves lik its Fallout 3.

>>279912225 (OP)
They should fuck

>>279919627
Rudeus is far too much of a degenerate to be enjoyable to watch or likeable. It's about the characters surrounding him, they make the show great. Paul, Eris, Zanoba, Soldat, Hikki-girl etc.

>>279920380
The story is filled with fucked up people. Paul's a rapist and Zaonoba killed his wife. Zanoba's this weird quasi-sociopath who was going to snap the neck of an attendant he'd known for his entire life because he thought Rudeus had been insulted. They're still interesting characters though.

>>279920738
Yeah sure, there's better stories that are filled with fucked up people that aren't just 2D haha mustache twirl bad guys like in case of Mushoku Tensei. Its just trash writing.

>>279920887
They're not really 2D bad guys either. Paul goes through great lengths to protect his wife and children.

>>279920974
That's pretty 2D writing, non-2D writing of a fucked up person is Vinland Saga's Askeladd. You just end up rooting for his stupid ass by the end of the show.

>>279916896
It's alright. Darkness is for the viewers, Megumin is for Kazuma. I'm perfectly fine with this arrangement

>>279921119
> Viewers only want one thing and its fucking disgusting heavenly.

>>279921154
>that line where she says she wants a disgusting, lazy jobless NEET because it turns her on to degrade herself

>>279921205
wish it were me tbfh.

>>279919440
Main story, Vanir, and Dust spinoffs are all good.
Only Megumin spinoff is a slog, which is pretty good when you see just how absurdly popular she is.

>>279919440
Kuzuma is a viewer self-insert of what if one of you 4channers was actually tossed into isekai.

>>279921260
Which is pretty odd*

Weird freudian slip...

>>279917168
>Kazuma would be like "nah, screw that, i'm not going into that house again" and would fuck off do his own thing.
If you change comedy setting into more serious setting then Kazuma probably still would be more competent then Subaru in that sense, because Kazuma is character that cares more about gold and glory than Subaru, so he looks smarter pursuing that, then Subaru who pursues white doll-like hair half elf and oni maid.

If Re:Zero had actually competent in vast majority of fields MC, then it would look like current arc where Aldebaran outplays every powerful individual and that's not the point.

>>279921359
most people would not die 8 gorillion times to do everything perfectly

>>279921359
The point of Re;Zero Kara is basically watching a cluless neet getting bullied over and over again by the author. That's the whole thing and why it works well the way it does. Its not your typical power trip series. The author of it even stated it in their Light Novel about how they added more scenes of him being bullied for the readers.

Isekai isn't all about power tripping that's just trashiest of the slop.

>>279921359
Speaking of maids, that would actually be the funniest interaction for Kazuma. Their awful treatment of Subaru in the original is played for laughs so he just takes it like a god boy, but Kazuma would get fucking fed up with them within a day.

Just get up and go complain about the trash maids, or be an obnoxious guest on purpose.

>>279921359
aldebaran has a completely different power
if you wanted to do the same thing as al with subarus power you would need to waste hours or even days with every single attempt

>>279921469
>Its not your typical power trip series
Neither is Konosuba. Kazuma is explicitely stuck in a useless jack of all trades class because his team are all hyper specialized to the point of uselessness.

>>279921706
Ehhh Kazuma's class would be very OP in pretty much any real game because there don't seem to be limitations on what he can learn and the narrative doesn't seem like it ever goes out of his way to show him getting stat checked.

>>279921467
Subaru doesn't either, in Greed if he gets groomed into believing it's the right choice by Echidna. As far as time loopers go, Subaru is on the low side of looping which desu pisses people off just as much

>>279921469
>The author of it even stated it in their Light Novel about how they added more scenes of him being bullied for the readers.
he was really keen on it with all that humiliation in arc 7

>>279912273
Based

>>279921541
Kazuma and Ram interaction would be really interesting

>>279912225 (OP)
kazuGOD would use STEAL on subacuck's manhood and would then proceed to grape him.
kazuma clears, no difficulty.

>>279921867
It had some really good shota abuse desu.

At least Kazuma acts like a human being, Subaru comes across like he's mentally impaired

>>279922072
True, Subaru is a fucking sperg.

>>279921809
I think it balances itself out. Seeing how Megumin has a running theme of using her skill points exclusively for explosion, it means you have to manually level up the power of your skills, so if you hypothetically try to get all the skills in the world as an Adventurer, you'll end up with a legion of lvl.1 skills, on top of your base stats already being low because Adventurer.

>>279921975
How is kaz"GOD" getting dominated by a 13 year old girlchild here?

>>279922227
S-She's stronger than you'd think!

Authorities corrupted Kazuma would probably end up like Regulus.
They seem to be a disaster on the libido though, so idk how Rudy would turn out.

>>279922110
It's not about getting all the skills, you'd just need to find some unintended combination that the designers didn't account for. For example, let's say some "Berserker" class in the world has a skill that lets you use two handed weapons in one hand and a "Ninja" class has a skill that lets you dual wield, combining them would allow you to dual wield two handed weapons.

The narrative never really addresses much about how the class system works though so you can only really take the story at its word that Adventurer is bad.

>>279922334
Regulus never touchted his wives while Capelly would jump anything that moves. And Reinhard is just a great guy. So idk about the libido thing, seems neutral to me.

I really disliked re:zero I thought it was awful.
I only watched a few episodes though

>>279921332
Maybe for some but I don't find that in itself interesting, that's why I don't give a ratass about Kazuma and why I find a cool character like Vanir way better to follow

>>279922441
It gets better and then it goes to shit. It reaches a peak at the end of the twister episode where I legitimately felt bad for both Subaru and Rem and wished the next loop he will do better. It started to fall of during season 2 and hasn't recovered.

>>279922943
I just can't stomach "misery porn" style shows. My life is miserable enough as it is. I found Attack on Titan to be similar.

How would Emilia react to having her panties stolen?

>>279923133
>Anon san ehat do you need those for
>Sugoooooi I didn't know these give strength and willpower to people
She is so dumb I think you could convince her to give them away like candy.

>>279917168
>>279917322
iirc, the anime went the retarded route and never mentioned that Subaru's past loops are only vaguely recalled, explicitly highlighted as akin to lucid dreaming. He's in the second loop when he understands that this is more than mere coincidence, but he has trouble recalling everything and thus correcting his past mistakes completely.
Still, he tries a different route from the second loop onwards once he understands what's going on.
>>279915199
Roswaal obtained Emilia because of his special book that details future events. Emilia has an appearance that creates an innate reaction within Subaru, one that Subaru had before even being isekai'd.
That being said, had Emilia not worked out for Roswaal, the clown would stalk and hunt you down if you're the prophecy he needs to accomplish his goals. Roswaal would ensure you're in his camp by any means necessary, so I doubt there would be as dramatic of a change as you may think.

>>279915534
she deserved better

>>279912225 (OP)
I'd rather hang out with subaru desu

Kazuma choosing to take Aqua with him when he is resurrected is a smarter move then anything Subaru has ever done.

>>279924414
useless goddess

>>279922227
It's obvious he's letting her win, because she is his future wife

>>279912273
Absolutely based, it's a shame the anime can't and won't be able to replicate how good this story actually is.

>>279925311
I love her speeches when she is casting explosion

>>279912225 (OP)
Kazuma is actually a likeable protagonist and isnt annoying. Subaru is an incompetent

>>279917168
>"nah, screw that, i'm not going into that house again" and would fuck off do his own thing.

Emilia dies and then Puck freezes the entire capital, forcing him to reset without knowing what the hell is happening.

People keep using that argument as if it was the smart thing to do, but this thought also crossed his mind and his conscience didn't let him run like a coward, as he was the only person who could prevent their deaths.

>>279912225 (OP)
Cain, Haruto, Yuuya, Banaza, Cid, Touka, Naofumi, Touya, Satou/Ichirou, Kelvin, Ryouta, Hiraku, and Seiya would be better candidates for the debate than this.

>>279925892
for the literal who competition?

>>279924516
He says that, and Aqua certainly *is* a bitch that causes as many problems as she solves, but despite not being as OP as Kazuma thought she was when he picked her he unironically would not have gotten as far as he has without her.
It's pretty clearly telegraphed that all of the isekai dudes that picked OP powers ended up worthless or a net-negative for the world. They either accomplished nothing or just made more problems.
Aqua and what she can do, from breaking curses to bringing back the dead, has proved invaluable. Kazuma has died, what? 5 or 6 times just by where the anime has covered? Some of those were joke deaths, but the fact remains that Aqua has given him the chance to make mistakes and learn from them instead of just being dead. Thats a hell of a boon even before you get into her other uses. Her dumb party trick spells have *consistently* won public opinion in their favor when they need to work a crowd, her buffs enable party shenanigans to work, etc.

>>279925759
>Emilia dies and then Puck freezes the entire capital, forcing him to reset without knowing what the hell is happening.

Serious "uhhh if you attack the shopkeep it turns out he's an ancient red dragon in disguise!" railroading GM energy.

>>279926292
nah hes wrong anyways because reinhardt would beat pucks ass before he could do anything

>>279926327
>reinhardt would beat pucks ass before he could do anything
Reinhard was famously absent during arc 3. So even with his powers, by the time he realizes what's happening with Puck, there's some severe damage done to the land.
I guess you could argue that he stops it before the entire world freezes over, but it, along with the whale and witch cult, still cause an immeasurable amount of damage to Lugunica.

>>279926327
I'm not so sure if he would be able to stop Puck before he does any damage, it's debatable.
Rein has a reputation of being useless.

>>279926292
What's so hard to believe about the girl who might be the devil incarnate having a pet that would go berserk after death?

>>279927512
i forgot the "her"
>after her death*

>>279912273
This
Its not even close
Its a real shame that he can't interact with them in that Isekai Quartet anime, would have had some funny moments.

>>279927542
I would assume that Kazuma would hate him the more he learns about him, since Rudy is much more of an abject power fantasy than his reincarnation turned out to be. Kind of a more extreme version of the shit he gave Subaru for getting to have a harem, but for real this time because Rudy unambiguously just does have a harem in the most literal sense.

>>279927542
>shame that he can't interact with them in that Isekai Quartet anime
great concept that is under utilised

>>279927920
>Rudeus telling him about the times he got laid
That would be funny enough

>>279928243
I could see Rudy being happy to have a fellow otaku to talk to about stuff from his first life, and accidentally oversharing or making references that cause Kazuma to clock his real age.

Does Kazuma really end up with Megumin, or is it just a
>and the adventure continues
ending?

>>279912225 (OP)
Kazuma is the better character, but Basura has the better harem.

>>279928553
Not sure if i would call this a harem.

>>279912225 (OP)
kazuma is funny but watching subaru go psycho is hilarious

Subaru's "harem" include Rem, Petra and Beatrice, right?

>>279929127
Rem was off-screen for almost the entire series and Beatrice it's not really a romantic counterpart, she's a spirit and it's not even clear if they can have those sort of feelings.

>>279929127
beatrice is family and petra takes 9 arcs to even become a character and shes probably gonna die soon

>>279926605
>>279926984
Rein restores the land to its previous state after he kills the cat.

>>279912225 (OP)
How would the two act if they switched bodies?

>>279926257
The most important aspect I think Aqua brings to Kazuma though is being a true and through companion for him. The two of them tend to be in sync in a lot of ways and act as pillars of support for each other, as well as just someone to bounce off the wall with.

>>279930655
>confused subaru tries to kill himself to go back to last save point and get back to emilia
>he dies for good
kek

>>279930655
Found this

>>279912225 (OP)
Kazuma is much more likable save the part where he was ogling some broad in a hotspring. Subaru is immature but most 17-year-olds are, so he's well written in that regard despite how you personally feel about him.

>>279926094
Kek.

>>279912225 (OP)
Subaru. Kazuma is funny but he's barely a charcter.

>>279912273
Why are MT redditors so insecure? Always inserting Rudeus into every isekai thread.