Thread 280061857

Gokudo author shitting on isekai:
Usagi Nakamura: I’m not writing light novels anymore, so I’m saying this from the viewpoint of an otaku, but the advent of “Narou-kei” stories was one of the turning points in the industry. Especially the increase in isekai reincarnation type stories.
>There’s tons of isekai reincarnation stories, and ones where they reincarnate as evil ojou-samas.
Nakamura: But when I see the mass production of such stories where the protagonist suddenly gains an overpowered ability and becomes the popular center of a harem, I think to myself, “How’s this original?” and “Don’t people get embarrassed for writing the same sort of stories?”
When I debuted, we tried to write stories were different from others. That was our sort of personal pride – the feeling that “we were the only ones who could write that”.
>So you feel that the current light novel industry is too rote and similar?
Nakamura: This was a while back, but I was chosen as the judge for a male-oriented seinen novel competition, but when reading the candidates, they were so similar that I wondered if they were all written by the same person. I feel the same thing is happening to light novels. Isekai reincarnation genre stories follow the same template so closely that I wonder if they’re written by the same person – even I could write one, despite having lost my touch for light novels.
“Narou” is a system like Comiket where regular amateurs’ works can generate buzz, so that publishers can scout new writers. I believed at the time that “this was the ideal way to find new talent”. I hoped that it would be the best way to find diamonds in the rough that weren’t able to be found by the committee behind amateur writer awards. But when you look now, people are so focused on what others are doing that they’ve become unable to write anything but works following the template. I’m quite disappointed.
Is she right?

>>280061857 (OP)
>Is she right?
Is that like, a rhetorical question?

>>280061857 (OP)
I immediately recognized OP pic
Good to know Gokudo's author is still alive and healthy, I hope Gokudo gets remake to completely adapt the whole series

>>280061857 (OP)
Second ending was kino
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Nc_DmbAy5U

I remember using that WAKE UP ending as my alarm song

>>280062159
Kek
I really love this guy

>>280061857 (OP)
Gokudo's anime artstyle is just right, cute and dynamic

Its very interesting to see the contrast between fantasy light novels that were turned into anime like Slayers and Gokudo and modern Narou-kei Isekai. Gokudo especially made an effort to be subversive for great comedic effect while Narou-kei isekai has this consistent pattern of introducing one gimmick at the beginning to appear novel before falling into the exact same tropes as any other story of its ilk.

>>280061857 (OP)
>shitting on isekai
basedbasedbasedbasedbasedbasedbased!

>>280061857 (OP)
>>280062777
Never heard of this anime before, but the artstyle is indeed great. 90s had SOVL.

>>280061857 (OP)
>gentlemen...isekai bad!
upvooted

>>280061857 (OP)
She's right but Gokudo sucked and was the definition of lolsorandumb. Most japanese fantasy was fucking terrible in the 80s and 90s, and the only good series rarely get talked about.

>>280064113
This

This show was fun

>>280065365
>Gokudo sucked
I stopped reading here

>>280061857 (OP)
>“Don’t people get embarrassed for writing the same sort of stories?”

I often question this myself. I don't think they get embarrassed so much but I do have to wonder how self aware they all are. Because if they're honestly just playing the system I can understand it. I don't like it but I understand it. So how much of this is people who genuinely want to write a story and people who are just trying to get the next anime deal.

>>280067976
I think I read some manga that showed newcomer writers are usually rejected by editors because their novels would not sell, so they were advised to write isekai instead.
At the end of the day, can only blame Japan for their shit taste and reading habits

>>280061857 (OP)
He's right
Same thing eventually lead to the death of comic books. Only a few writers are ever going to be accepted into the big leagues, so what's the point in doing anything that isn't the most popular and successful at the time? It's not like indie light novel writers are making a living off doing it.

The problem in general is that the risk vs reward system means that it makes no sense to any take risk when all of the reward is in doing what is safe. Western Comic Books fell into this pit when they started culling everything that wasn't the most popular of its genre and thus ended up with every single thing on the shelf being capeshit that all had the same story. Soon, Manga is going to follow suit at this rate.

>>280068156
Also a thing done by Comic Books 30 years ago, resulting in the comic industry we have today where anyone only ever wants to write stories that could tie into a potential crossover (the most popular type of comic book)

The villainess trend is the worst thing I've ever seen in manga/LNs.

absolute slop

>>280067976
I don't think anyone likes knowing that the only thing they're going to be allowed to write is the same story about some dipshit dough-faced chigyu suddenly becoming massively popular, powerful, and successful because he died and came back in some specifically western european fantasy town.

And another problem is Poe's law: We don't know how many of this are people trying to make sarcastic jabs at how stupid the genre is vs people who have now grown up with the genre and think it's the best thing ever.

She's not wrong. The demise of isekai can't come fast enough imo.

>>280069610
This. Literally, all of them are identical. To the point where unlike regular Isekai slop, they usually only spend like a page telling their entire story and backstory because all of its readers already know how it goes.

>>280068156
It's the worst kind of self perpetuating problem. They only make isekai because only isekai and sells and as a result they only sell isekai and there's no room for anything else to actually catch on

>>280069622
>Poe's law
How much of this is the readers too I wonder. Yes they eat up this crap but do they eat it up because it's all they want or because that's all that's there? How much of this stranglehold just stems from a lack of options.

FIX YOUR WEBSITE DAMMIT

>>280070264
>How much of this stranglehold just stems from a lack of options.
There's tons of non-isekai web novels and manga out there.

>>280067976
I think most people don't have the creativity, talent, or experience in media to make proper decent stories or different enough takes on a genre to distinguish themselves, so they just default to slop that they know works
Ive seen an author having a meltdown because their slop they made was the only thing that got popular and not any of the other manga they tried making, I'm pretty sure most authors are aware of what they're making

It's not like writing something good and original is easy. There's infinite original ideas that haven't been tried because you could write about any old thing, but not only do you need to get people to give your concept a chance, but then they actually need to like it. And some original ideas simply aren't worth doing.

I will also say this though. Execution matters. Even the dumbest shit when done with some tact can find an audience. Like that one isekai where the MC became a vending machine. I personally think it's stupid as shit, and another elaborate setup to prevent the MC from having sex with anyone, no matter how many women fawn over him, but it got an anime adaptation so clearly it found an audience.

The example I always point to is Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. Just the name sounds retarded when you really think about it, but it's a multigenerational, multi-billion dollar property that everyone knows. If someone could make that work, you can make A LOT of things work. Leo best turtle btw.

>>280070736
Well this is another problem. A lot of the classic stuff too inspiration from many outside sources, modern anime is inspired purely by anime so it comes off as practically incestuous. It's not that they only follow a template it's that they only know the template

Once Isekai dies, do you think some other concept will replace it? If so what? Or do you think they will have moved past these ways and no longer have mass produced garbage?

>>280061857 (OP)
I started writing a portal fantasy but abandoned it when isekai became a thing because I hated the trend so much. Now I have to wait for it to go out of style again before I can finish it

>>280072090
Boy do I feel that. This kind of shit is one of the oldest types of stories and ripe for classic pulp adventure but it's been so diluted and polluted that anything you make will be compared or flooded by dullards who don't get it. "Why is there no adventurers guild. Why isn't this like my video games."

It'll pass. Just as the era of fantasy LNs passed, the era of Battle Harems passed, isekai fad will fade away in time.

>>280072465
It's been going on for a while now and doesn't seem to be showing many signs of slowing down. Speaking of though, it was really funny how people were quick to point out this shit in battle harems yet for some reason nobody seems to mind that EVERY isekai is like this shit.

>>280061857 (OP)
The problem isn't
>a stranger in a strange land

The problem is
>shitty self insert protags
>often power fantasies
>uninspired gamified systems
>relying on a single gimmick only, like "I reincarnated as X"
>etc

Many classic stories like Alice in Wonderlands, Wizard of Oz, Return to Oz, Narnia (to give non anime examples) and so on are technically isekai, but are not at all like what most isekai media is like in todays japanese/chinese market.

>>280072543
I wouldn't even call the power fantasy angle a problem itself. The problem is that it's a combination of power fantasy with out any, well I'm not sure how else to put it, fantasy. A princess of mars absolutely was a power fantasy but back then our power fantasy heroes were people we wanted to be like rather than our bland boring regular selves with access to a directory menu. We wanted to be the cool guy who jumped good and banged a princess. The Savage barbarian hero. Stuff like that. Now people have so little imagination that they can't read anything that isn't a self insert.

>>280072543
Speaking of, which of Baum's OZ books had a boy protagonist turn out to be a transformed girl rightful princess of OZ, IIRC

>>280072465
Isekai seems like it is already dwindling.

>>280065365
>Most japanese fantasy was fucking terrible in the 80s
Such as

What about an Isekai where the protagonist reincarnates into a different kind of game world. Imagine a protagonist waking up in Five Nights at Freddy's or Plants vs Zombies or some shit. This has a lot of unique possibilities if you just think.

>>280072754
I'm pretty sick of game based reincarnation across the board frankly.

>>280072771
Well yeah I suppose. I thought about it more and like, why just not add the extra part to the beginning. Why not just have it be a normal story if reincarnation adds barely anything to it.

>>280072869
The thing about games is that they were always meant to serve as a tool so we could pretend to live out all those old fantasy adventures we dreamed. And because they're games they need rules and mechanics to work. Things that would make much sense in universe are their to facilitate gameplay. So when you play a game you're following the rules and the mechanics but you're not really supposed to think about them (Unless you're min maxing fuck.) They're the special effects, the man pulling the puppet strings. When you focus on these elements, and this is what Japan seems to have a big problem with, you're effectively breaking the illusion. My character has an 18 strength because that's how the game works, but in terms of the fantasy he's just strong. It's not actually measured by an 18.

>>280072250
I think it's only Japan who would think that way.
You have to remember Japan only thinks of Fantasy in terms of Dragon Quest because Dragon Quest was their first widespread taste of western fantasy. It's not like they had decades of Conan the Barbarian novels

>>280073574
That's not true though. They had pen and paper games. They had Wizardry. They've made plenty of non Dragon Quest fantasy. I don't deny or argue the influence it has but it's not the only fantasy it got.

>>280061857 (OP)
Have readers of other genres disappeared?

>>280074664
Depending on whom you ask readers of certain demographics have vanished entirely.

>>280075413
Damn. Well that bodes poorly for variety's sake

>>280062159
Kino

>>280062017
Yeh

>>280062159
This anime had so much gender-bending from bodyswap, possession, and transformation, like it was in 1/3 of the 26 episodes. No way it wasn't a fetish of hers.

>>280071967
>Once Isekai dies, do you think some other concept will replace it?
Yes it will be replaced. I do think War-theme post futuristic, sports related theme and romanceYurithemed titles will be the norm when Isekai gets replaced.

>>280065365
Fantasy anime peaked in the 80s and 90s, even the isekai series like "El Hazard" and "Those Who Hunt Elves" were either alright or good

>>280076391
Nice.

>>280071967
>Once Isekai dies, do you think some other concept will replace it?
Absolutely, before Isekai the big trend authors chased after were battle harems.

>>280076564
That's because they were just regular fantasy. Stranger in a strange land. Regular people summoned to a magical land in order to perform a quest. Characters who actually cared about the world left behind like sane people and weren't just self insert NEETs who want to pretend to play Dragon Quest. I swear it's like the more they develop specific terms for shit the worse it always gets.

>>280071967
Yuri and Boys Love romances will be the next trend setters.

screen cap this.

>>280072754
>This has a lot of unique possibilities if you just think.
I bet all nip editors have this thinking

>>280076391
I'm not too surprised. Every chick is just a little bi-sexual. And women love androgyny. It's how I can sometimes tell a woman is the artist for something when her men and women look identical baring eyelashes, haircuts, and disposition.

>>280077693
>And women love androgyny.
That does explain David Bowie and Grace Jones

>>280076476
I'm hoping for more sports anime
Medalist was peak

>>280077734
I think a lot of men are not honest about that sort of thing.

>>280079956
I think other men are TOO honest about that sort of thing.