Anyone have manic pixie girl fatigue?

I want well-written female characters, not some loser's wet dream.

>>280677791 (OP)
>well-written female characters
Whatever that means.

>>280677857
I just meant that I want realistic female characters with real personalities that aren't written for incels. Maybe they've had multiple boyfriends in the past. Maybe they're poly, maybe they actually hate men because their father left them and it's up to the MC to show her that men can be good. Maybe she's had an abortion but is still trad. You can make complex female characters and still have good romance anime that young men can enjoy. Not all anime need to create these unrealistic expectations about women.

>>280677791 (OP)
>well-written female characters
You mean writing a male character but removing all reason and accountability?

>>280677977
this so much this
maybe they have multiple STIs or are a single mother of 3

>>280677977
>they've had multiple boyfriends in the past
That's barely tolerable but you are right that is somewhat realistic.
>maybe they actually hate men because their father left them and it's up to the MC to show her that men can be good
I think I've seen similar plots in anime.
>they're poly
>had an abortion but is still trad.
This has to be bait.

>>280678006
>>280678056
All you can do is regurgitate manosphere tripe. You have no thoughts of your own

>>280677977
>>280678056
Anon, anime isn't there to make you hate women. It is like as a girl wanting fat men or ugly men in her otome anime.

>>280678124
What? Do you think single mothers don't deserve a second chance at love? That having children from a previous relationship makes them unwanted? This is why you're an INCEL.
Do better.

>>280678188
So you're saying female characters shouldn't have any real flaws or troubled pasts because it hurts your male sensibilities?
That's ridiculous

>>280678056
>>280678190
We need more female characters dying from AIDS.

>>280677857
The tomboy and nerd girl from Barakamon are great examples.

>>280677791 (OP)
Pic unrelated

>>280678304
>female characters shouldn't have any real flaws or troubled pasts
A whore will always stay a whore.
>hurts your male sensibilities?
If I wanted to look at whores then I would go to instagram or onlyfans or any porn site or watch netflix live-action shows.

>>280677977
>realistic female characters
sorry but anime already has enough illogical evil bitches with no traces of empathy

>>280677857
Men with tits and vagina.

>>280677977
>Maybe they're poly
Ok. So you just want something that appeals to your cuck fetish.

>>280677977
The time has come to watch Zeta Gundam if you haven't already.

>>280678398
They aren't "well written". A character doesn't become well written just because they don't express romantic interest in anyone. They're just one note joke characters.

This thread is bait btw

>>280677791 (OP)
>I don't want people I view as my social inferiors to have happiness, even in fiction. If someone's interesting and cheers up such a person they're "poorly written"
Take away the gender politics for a second and this is just an incredibly cruel and fucked up way to think about other people. OP, if sincere, is a sociopath.
Anyway here's your (you)

>>280678304
>>280677977
There are plenty of females who haven't had multiple relationships, haven't had abortions, not have broken dysfunctional households and doesn't hate men. In fact more of those than the type you describe. Kamala's entire campaign trying to make abortion a big issue for women failed miserably because the average woman doesn't get cummed and dumped and get an abortion and care as much about it as they think they do. I can count only 2 women I know who got an abortion.
If you think 'realistic' female characters needs them to be 'realistic', then you are most likely baiting or not actually interacted with real women.

I have loser blue haired girl fatigue.

>>280679478
>only 2
>you know

>>280677791 (OP)
Read Reika-sama

>>280679425
Suspension of disbelief, look it up. If the MC is a bland loser sack of shit, then you have to justify why the girls in-verse are attracted to him
And no, "he was nice to me one time" doesn't suffice as an explanation

>>280679556
You really don't unless he has tons of actively negative traits rather than just being average.

>>280679526
One of them is just a friend of a friend and the other is just a distant family relative. Not sure what your point is. Are you saying most women don't publicize their abortions and I'm awfully underestimating them or that I even know two is a bad things lol.

>>280679612
Honestly it would be much more believable if he had such 'negative' traits.

>>280679556
They aren't attracted to MC, though
He is literally the friend/'convenient ear while these girls talk about how the guy they actually want to fuck isn't paying attention to them.
And then, it makes sense if they actually fall in love with him eventually because they are basically surrounded by him talking to him all the time

>>280677791 (OP)
>I want well-written female characters
Yeah, you're not going to get that if all you watch is shit like Makeine

>>280679556
This. So. Much. This. If the MC is just a regular average looking "nice guy" without any spice or danger to his personality, I vomit in my mouth a little when any of the beautiful 10/10 girls who are way out of his league give him a chance. That's not how it should be, even in cartoons. It's harmful to society.

>>280679637
This, it's fiction for christ's sake. Why would you want to read about average unremarkable guys who have hot chicks falling all over themselves for their affection?

Wouldn't you prefer a story with an interesting flawed male lead, who's above or below average, with believable chemistry with the female characters?

>>280677977
Not sure why you watch anime if that's what you want. Open Netflix and click on the first non-anime show you see it'll have all the run through whores and poly people and fags you're heart desires.

>>280679637
>>280679660
This. Teenage girls fall in love to feel some spice up in their life. It's believable if it's some Christmas Cake or girl cummed and dumped by multiple chads like that one about trying to settle but a teenager girl falling for the class doormat nice goy is extremely unrealistic.

>>280679726
Every episode of of wish fulfillment romance anime you watch is another poor woman that can't reject you, bucko. Crime would go down and wars would stop if weak men like you manned up and deleted Onimai or something.

>>280679660
The problem is the guy is just boring "nice", he could be funny "nice", smart "nice", but no, the guy is so lame he can't be defined other than by his nice niceness

>>280679783
Actually crimes would go up if loser men lost their copes.

Guys who goon to porn all day are more manly and less pathetic than guys who self-insert into isekai/romcom slop MCs

>>280678362
This is the real response to obvious bait, thank you for finding it.

>>280679846
I self insert as the rapechad in your average shoujo romance.

>>280679711
I find seinen and josei written by women mangaka tend to have more interesting characters and dynamics.
It's a pretty strong signal for me for whether to pick up an anime.
Last season for example would be Kowloon Generic Romance. In the end, I didn't find it incredible or anything. But it was interesting enough. And the characters seem to make people mad in the threads on here for reasons they can't actually articulate, like calling them 'whores' and such despite not actually having any qualities any reasonable person associates with that word.
There's definitely better stuff out there than KGR if you go back in the past too.
Just filter for women mangaka and you'll probably find more stuff you enjoy.

>>280677977
I know this is kind of bait... but I kinda agree to some extent?
Like, not the specific things you're describing, but anime girls have this tendency to be SPECIFICALLY written to be appealing as love interests for the male viewer (blah blah blah obviously this is true for male characters too in female-aimed media but that's beside the point). Meanwhile characters who have real ordinary problems feel a lot easier for me to identify with, especially when they're not presented in an idealized light either

>>280679351
They're well written.

>>280679556
If a guy is just earnestly kind and supportive, is it really that far fetched to think a girl would fall for him regardless of "social hierarchy" bs?
To pick a recent example off the top of my head, Momo and Okarun in Dandadan. Sure she's a popular gyaru and he's a shy otaku, but it doesn't feel forced for wish fulfillment. They're actual friends who enjoy each other's company and share interests and are supportive of each other. They're also both weirdos with flaws of their own despite the surface-level social niches they fall into. So when they do start feeling that way about each other, it just feels natural.

>>280679965
Fellow femanon here. I agree completely. I don't understand why this stuff is written for male viewers. I don't enjoy stuff made for women and western media has just lost its spark for some reason, but chinese cartoons for 16 year old boys just hit the spot, but they would be even better if they stopped appealing to 16 year old boys. This is a deeper gender issue in japanese culture and in anime we can't just turn a blind eye to.

>>280680120
>is it really that far fetched to think a girl would fall for him regardless of "social hierarchy" bs?
Unironically yes it is

>>280677977
>>280679965
these comments have to be by AI bots pretending to be female anime enthusiasts... why the hell would you want such awful female characters in your FICTION?

>>280680149
>I don't understand why this stuff is written for male viewers
Because that's the target audience? That'd be like asking "why are all these otome shows written like they're for women??"

I have anti-manic pixie girl fatigue.

>>280680205
This will sound retarded, but this is why I enjoy women in shonen/seinen action manga more than women in romcoms
Rachel from Tower of God is a selfish cunt and a shitty person, but she still has a lot going on with her as a character that's worth following. The story doesn't demand that I love her or even like her. She's a shitty person, and the story doesn't try to change that.
And now compare that to Minami from Hokkaido Gals. The story really REALLY wants me to love her. Like, love her in the same way I would love a girlfriend irl. Yeah there's some romcoms I do quite like such as Fragrant Flower, but I very rarely get interested in the genre

>>280677791 (OP)
she's not a manic pixie dream girl, she's a passive aggressive architect's dream bitch

>>280677791 (OP)
>>280677977
retard

>>280679556
>bland loser sack of shit
this feels more like OP's projection than an accurate depiction of any recent harem MC
never forget that even those who you view as "losers" can have admirable qualities, you're just too invested in social hierarchy to notice or care

Hey wait a second, this is a bait thread, wtf

>>280677977
Here, for you.

>>280680711
some of the most popular FMC in seinen/shonen oriented romcoms also have really terrible personalities and characteristics. Think of just how horrible of a person Kaguya is in that manga/anime, one of the shittiest personalities in female romcom lead history, and yet the story is still quite enjoyable and her flaws make her more interesting.

>>280677977
Coumterpoint, male characters are not realistic either. It's entertainment. They don't need to be realistic, they need to be interesting.

>>280679556
MC-status

>>280680120
It could be justified if every other dude in the vicinity was some piece of shit goblin. But that's not usually the case and there's plenty of other guys who have those traits plus more than the average nice guy MC has to offer.

>>280677791 (OP)
So you want characters who are nothing like you?
okay, here. read her story.

>>280679647
nailed it.
op may be seething, but it is precisely because this show does exactly as op demands thst it's managed to get the following it has.
where op merely wields the argument as a cope for his evidently irrational hatred for harems, most other men who believe the words that come out of their mouths see the show as being carefully calculated to not offend their pathetic loser high school selves.

(how this offends them is an extension of the unfairness they feel with chad hoarding women: where they'd been buck broken into / grown to accept that chad gets all the women as nature, they've acquired the same jealous disdain to men who get women despite not being chad, which breaks apart their calculus, but more crucially it deprives them of the cope that they only failed with women because they aren't chad, not because they're obnoxious or otherwise deficient in ways above them even today. it's why make heroine is so disproportionately popular with men.)

>>280679425
almost all women are like that
>>280679556
t. someone who devours reverse harem and young romance girlsmut

>>280681588
>as being
as having successfully*

>>280677791 (OP)
I’d recommend watching more anime that isn’t seasonal trash. The actually good female characters that have stood the test of time usually aren’t designed as waifubait, but they make good waifus due to being actually nuanced.

>>280681656
exactly. like holo and rem

>>280681517
Anon, you have a very cynical outlook on relationships
It's not enough for two people to genuinely like and feel accepted by each other. It has to be a competition where men/women are competing with other men/women to maintain their significant other's attention
Healthy relationships happen because people recognize the other's flaws and still love them for that

Is there any anime that subverts this, like the anti-MPDG anime sort of like 500 days of summer? Or is the medium generally just too focused on fan service and wish fulfillment for that to be tolerated?
The only thing that comes to mind is the one scene in Re:Zero where Emelia tells him off and then it proceeds to become a standard haremshit thing anyway.

>>280681846
Most anime that isn’t about wish fulfilment and harem routes.

Your mistake is looking at modern anime that consists of a passive male MC getting hit on by a bunch of girls. This wasn’t really a thing to the same extent until about 20 odd years ago.

>>280681975
I'm specifically wondering about a deconstruction of this modern version of the trope though. I'm sure we'll get something eventually, but I don't know if there are any yet. I don't just mean anime that isn't 'passive male mc who constantly has girls hanging off him for no reason'

>>280681682
>It has to be a competition where men/women are competing with other men/women to maintain their significant other's attention
I'm not saying this is EVERY relationship, but it definitely makes up a good bulk of them.

What you really need are good male MCs who are the prize and the girls are the one who does the chase.

>>280682093
Takamura in toradora.

>>280681682
>Anon, you have a very cynical outlook on relationships
Maybe

>>280681517
>Every other dude is a piece of shit goblin
That's honestly even more unrealistic and retarded

>>280677791 (OP)
Anyone else have faggot fatigue?

>>280681682
>It has to be a competition
Yes, that's how 'dating' works. You take the girl to restaurants and other places to "impress" her.
>healthy relationships
Majority of relationships aren't "healthy".

>>280682223
It's on pair with the scenario of some geeky kid bagging a 10/10 popular girl. Likely? No. But statistically has to exist somewhere at some point.

>>280678124
That "male character but removing all reason and accountability" comment was a quote from an author that got praise for being great at writing female characters and got asked what their process was for doing it.

>>280679478
conservative and pro-life women statistically get more abortions than liberals and "whores". They're just hypocrites who pretend they don't and attack other women.

>>280677977
>that aren't written for incels
Go back.

>>280677977
incel website

>>280682301
No, that is from the movie As Good as it gets where the main character who is supposed to be a flawed character with his bigotry says it.

>>280682323
That's more because they're poor and more likely to get knocked up than anything to do with ideology.

>>280682291
I'm talking about girls liking a guy because every other dude being a PoS part. This is just the peak of self insert writing lmao.

>>280681682
women 3dpd dont keep relationships like that. they keep them because of their usefulness and are a transaction

>>280682037
I remember there being a show about all the girls in the show being in love with MC's chad friend instead of him but then it was revealed he is a playboy wannabe and playing with the girls emotions and it became a regular harem.

>>280678056
I'm glad I'm not so far autistic that I'd be unable to tell this were sarcasm. Fuck you OP, go back to Twitter

>>280682291
Usually it's because the popular girl got tired of fuckboys trying controlling her so she chooses a safe option and goes after a guy whom she can control and so goes for the betaboy(Think Selena Gomez, of all the famous twitch and only fans thots with soi boyfriend, etc...).
A case like Dandandan is imho a statistical improbability. It's believable if both are nerds.

>>280682093
Plenty of shows try to do this.
Except the woman MC is always some ugly defunct social reject who does nothing deserving of the prize male. Femcel wish fulfillment, if you will.
It goes both ways. Ho hum

>>280680711
This is the reason Shield Hero fell apart in second season and never really recovered.
Malty was a horrible bitch and not ur waifu but she was a great fun character. Now, the current arc, the villains are a pair of fucking furfag bureaucrats who won't let you go to Not-Japan? Like what the FUCK is the problem here? Naofumi is King: order them executed.
>bu-buht that'd be mean
Raphtalia would execute them both right now. Lolitiger would literally kill them with her bare hands. Why are you letting some fucking lion and A FUCKING BIRD boss you around, Naofumi? god he's such a loser.
-t Bitch Slut

If you’re tired of it, there is NOTHING for you made in Japan. There are exactly two levels of romance genres: porn and non-porn. Non-porn is absolutely shackled by genre rules and tropes and Japan will never break out of them. The more edgy porn doesn’t have so many limitations but, being porn, the girls are nothing more than fuck toys. If you want a romance with Western-like focus on conflict and psychological insight you will be unsatisfied with JP romances for the rest of time. Probably the single greatest failure of JP stuff of any non-porn genre is the absolute devolution to good morals. The main couple will NEVER do anything that even suggests that they could have done something immoral. You know why the Class of ‘09 is so big in the Western vtuber scene and non-existent in Japan’s? It’s because C09 has really bad morals, and that’s a hard no in Japan. It’s just the way they are.

>>280682652
thats a lot of words to say
>my husband isn't chimping out? I wonder if I could do better....
anyway sorry that happened or I'm happy for you.

>>280682586
That's why the best trope is the male MC showing up the queen bee or an uppity bitch. Plus points if the male MC is a delinquent or addicted to his grind.

>>280682693
I hope Japs stay that way and reject edgelord shit like those.

>>280682468
Fair

>>280677977
Ma'am you are lost.

>>280677977
>incels.
Oh, you're here to troll or are a part of that creepy cult who think man bad woman good, and "incels" are your own personal boogeyman behind all of the worlds wrongs.
Thanks for outing yourself as either a timewaster or a mentally ill activist type.

>>280679425
>Take away the gender politics for a second and this is just an incredibly cruel and fucked up way to think about other people.
Welcome to how feminists think. They're bad people pretending to be good through wordgames.

>>280682037
I mean masturbation master is kinda like that. It makes it seem like MC and the pretty girl "clicked" like a standard romcom couple usually does but subverts it by having the girl start dating a guy that actually bothered to make a move on her.

>>280677977
I think you just have issues with men and want to vent, personally. You feminists are all the same, you had a bad daddy and assume everyone else did, and that men are scum outside of a few examples. In the same breath you are outraged that some men paint all women as the same, but you're too retarded to understand you're doing the same thing.

>>280677977
You sound like you are an ntrfag.

>>280677977
>Maybe she's
>whore
>whore
>whore
>whore
>whore

Why are Americans like this? Women can have other characteristics other than sex. Like being good at sports, or having a hobby

>>280677791 (OP)
Pic related?

>>280679425
>I don't want people I view as my social inferiors to have happiness, even in fiction
Yes.

Bad behavior has to be punished.

>>280684004
>I don't want people I view as my social inferiors
You are on 4chan you know this?

>>280677791 (OP)
>manic pixie girl
Roasty post

>>280684378
There are no women on /a/. That's a trans roastie.

>>280677791 (OP)
Nah, we just need more self-improov manga for men instead of the same old permaloser bullshit.

>>280684659
But then people call it retard sigma grindset edgelord incel anime.

>>280684985
You can't win either way. Nice guy protagonist getting a gf? Incel loser cope anime. Edgelord MC getting a gf? Incel loser revenge fantasy anime. What we have is an epidemic of extreme faggotry.

>>280680120
I mean, they only get together due to sharing life and death experiences.
Their bond is 'natural' in the sense that the grow close to each other because they are saving each other constantly and their trust deepens. It's not natural in that if that their initial exploration hasn't resulted in anything they may not have gotten together for so much time to see if they like each other.

>>280682422
>No, that is from the movie As Good as it gets where the main character who is supposed to be a flawed character with his bigotry says it.
Yet it's the only thing anyone remembers from the movie because it rings true.

>>280680881
they do look weird tho
just a weird hole down there

>>280679556
>Social hierarchy crap
Are you a teenage girl or something? Maybe they just like each other. Imagine that!

>>280677977
Good traits and qualities are repetitive for a reason.

>>280684378
seethe

>>280679425
Misandry makes the world go round, after all
Notice how he doesn't give a single fuck about himbo rapechads (which are the crotch fantasies of dumpy frumpy mid housewives and ugly girls)

>>280681975
It started whenever kimagure orange road came out and intensified after tenchi muyo and reached terminal velocity by the time of love hina. that's almost 40 years right there.

>>280682507
>It seems like it's not gonna be a harem and then becomes a regular harem
every fucking time.

>>280682507
It was a good show for all of exactly one episode

>>280677791 (OP)
>Anti fanservice pro censorship thread...
Go watch western slop then!

>>280677791 (OP)
Why isn't Anna well written?

>>280677791 (OP)
I roll my eyes at manic pixie dream girls but I used to love this shit when I was a teenager, so Its my guilty pleasure nowadays
Also it helps immensely that im married to a manic pixie dream girl who makes me laugh and want to live life everyday

Is op a yurifag?

>>280677977
>realistic
>men can be good.
Kek

We love Yanami here. We love Makeine here.

>>280678398
MC should've bedded one way or another.

>>280682093
There's plenty of those
>saves a cute hobo girl and fixes her so thoroughly she nearly mouthrapes him in his sleep and wants to smother him with his tits when he returns from the mission in order to grab his attention

>>280694455
This is a Pokemon thread.

>>280677977

>>280677977
genuine cuck post

>>280696979
He is into ntr.

>>280677791 (OP)
Isn't she like a mock at that precise character archetype?

>>280679478
>There are plenty of females who haven't had multiple relationships
>In fact more of those than the type you describe
holy hell weebs are this delusional

>>280680205
wow you're a retard. having flaws doesn't make you awful. its just more interesting than a perfect character with nothing else going for them

>>280677791 (OP)
>not some loser's wet dream.
Why are you mean?

>>280698333
There is a difference between having flaws and being a total whore.

>>280677791 (OP)
Watch Haruhi then

>>280677977

>>280701429
Is that a bulge? Is that a trap?

>>280701528
puffy

>>280677977
>I want realistic female characters
Aka SSRI crippled children that hate men

>>280680780
That's the vast majority of stereotypes. I'm active in the history scene and I hear "generals in WW1 were retarded" all the time, but each time I ask them to name a couple, it's always the same one or two, with the majority of them being seen as geniuses. Outside of the two "bad generals" every time you look at most of them they were pretty decent commanders, but every single time it's treated like an exception, except you have more exceptions than the "rule."

But then again, if you got a composite of haremn anime protagonists and averaged it out they would be pretty pathetic, so I can't entirely disagree.

>>280685585
I mean, there's always gotta be a spark for why they "just like each other." I've met plenty of ugly girls I would never give the time of day for any serious relationship. Sure maybe some of them have decent personalities and might make good friends, but I'm not going to engage with that personality because she has no hook. So the fuck would a girl give a mediocre guy the time of day? Heck, I probably stand a much better chance with that girl than the him if both those characters in our "average harem" were real. At least I have a backbone and actual testosterone, unlike a lot of the limp wristed basedboys you see so often.

>>280685030
What about cool guy getting a gf? The only faggotry is the failure of Japan to write a cool male MC. Feels like the reverse of the west - here we tend to have good male MCs and bad female MCs, whereas in Japan we get bad male MCs and good female MCs.

And with all that being said >>280677977 is a cuck. >>280700780 put it the best.

>>280677791 (OP)
So which girl won in this series

>>280702979
To be fair most harem protagonists and romcom protagonists look average. They don't look ugly.

>>280703013
The winning heroines naturally, I don't know why this would be a surprise.

>>280677977
>Maybe they're poly
by Allah. Perhaps the ayy-rabs were right about modern Western culture after all...

>>280677977

>>280677977
GTFO of my hobby, faglord

>>280677977
Baityutiful post

>>280684004
Punish people with your hands IRL, see how it goes.

>>280677977

>>280677977
>>280677791 (OP)
kys, tourist