Thread 281445701

Which one ruined the magical girl genre the most?

>>281445701 (OP)
Sailor troon of course

>>281445701 (OP)
Madoka is the only good one

Sailor Moon is trash

>>281445701 (OP)
Utena.

>>281445842
Utena had exactly zero influence on the magical girl genre.

>>281445701 (OP)
Sakura didn't really have any real influence in spite of its success. Sailor Moon basically redefined the magical girl genre from little girls playing with magic in slice of life stories to little girls gaining powers to fight monsters who interrupt their normal lives.

Madoka resulted in a wave of darker magical girl shows for otaku, but it really didn't take over the entire genre.

>>281445701 (OP)
madoka ruined the genre

>>281445965
The series that were inspired by Madoka are the problem. You can't blame it for inspiring shit writers to try their hand at something similar, everything good does

>>281446185
But that's what this thread is about, blaming fiction for unintended consequences. After all, no anime staff sets out to "ruin a genre" unless someone on the staff was an ignorant jackass to begin with.

>>281445701 (OP)
Sailor Moon attracted ironic weebs
Madoka attracted transbians
I say the latter is worse.

>>281445893
Yeah, CCS was influential aesthetically, possibly moreso beyond the genre, but as a whole it's still very unique within the genre itself.

>>281445701 (OP)
Minky Momo.

>>281446269
obsessed

>>281445745
>>281445841
I thought /a/ loved SM?

>>281447269
I'm not /a/, I'm anon.

>>281447269
It does.
A lot of people here were first introduced to anime girls via SM on TV when they were younger.

>>281447400
They must be 40 year old by now kek

>>281448264
correct

>>281445701 (OP)
Madoka of course

>>281448264
yes pretty much
people don't really change their hobbies too much in my experience. only cycle through various hobbies in periods of activity/inactivity.
especially when there's nostalgia involved.
it's not like either eastern or western culture has really invented much new, worthwhile, or interesting as far as entertainment goes the last 30 years or so.
which is probably why it's so common that 30 and 40 y/o people still tend to have some attachment to similar things that they had when they were younger.

>>281445701 (OP)
I'm a huge magical girl fan. For starters Sailor Moon is the most influential magical girl show of all time. You could almost argue that it's the foundation for all magical girl anime that came after and only be off by a little simply because shows like Lilpri, Full Moon o Sagashite and Pretty Rhythm are based on Creamy Mami and not Sailor Moon. Without Sailor Moon magical girls would be solo acts, pairs at best.

Cardcaptor Sakura was well beloved at the time but had very little influence on overall anime that came after. It was cute, it was fun, it was popular but it didn't really change anything. Perhaps all it really changed is its introduction of Clamp to most of the world.

Madoka has been forgotten. It influenced nothing. Dark magical girls have existed since Pixy Misa, magical girls dying and being reborn have existed since Cutie Honey and evil fairy partners have existed since Kamikaze Kaitou Jeanne. Madoka introduced nothing to the genre. Nanoha was far more influential to the future of magical girls than Madoka ever was.

Since Sailor Moon the most influential magical girl series is Pretty Cure.

>>281446269
And Sakura attracted the pedos, see every thread about the show, which is why it's the worst

>>281445701 (OP)
>CCS
>ruining anything
It tried to save it, not ruin it.

Anyways the objectively correct answer is obviously SM, since its creation ultimately inspired the slop that is both Madoka and Precure. Madoka wouldn’t exist if it weren’t for the Sailor Moon manga and neither would Precure if it wasn’t for the 90’s anime.

>>281445893
All Sailor Moon did was take a page from Go Nagai's Cutie Honey.

>>281448732
New guy here, Is this correct?

>>281448264
Found the newfag normalfag summer child.

>>281446269
>Madoka attracted transbians
No, the Sailor Moon manga did that first with queen yuritard herself Naoko-hime, pic related, Madoka was simply following in her footsteps.

>>281448852
>Sakura attracted pedos
You mean the Toei toyshill Mahou Shoujo like Precure and Sailor Moon which despite being for preschoolers complete with Kigs and everything, unironically have a huge manchild fanbase that only actual literal pedos could ever be “fans” of if they didn’t grow up with said shows, so much so they even have their own unofficial term they coined themselves to designate said pedo fanbase known as “big friends.” Oh yeah, they’re currently banned from all current Precure Kig shows by the way since they ended up creeping on the little girls in the audience and taking creepshots of the kigs kek.

Whatever pedos CCS ended up attracting wasn’t intentional on the part of CLAMP since CCS was always a traditional Shoujo explicitly aimed at teen girls and fujos only, (they literally dab on the yuritroons by making the two lesbian characters lose BIGLY while only the het and gay male couples find happiness, how much more explicit can they get in signaling the CCS franchise is not for you smelly incels?), unlike Precure which literally includes the “big friends” as one of their main target audiences.

>>281449417
kek the fujo seething about yurichads is here again

>>281448893
The idiots at CCS don't understand the concept of market supply and demand. The success of these anime is due to market selection; audiences enjoy watching this type of anime. It has nothing to do with the creators behind these anime; they simply cater to the spiritual and material needs of the audiences of their time.

Why did CCS's TV ratings only reach 0.6% between 1998 and 2000, while Little Witch Doremi and Precure both achieved ratings exceeding 7%? Because CCS couldn't attract its original target audience, and those audiences were snatched away by Little Witch Doremi and Precure.

Because CCS is essentially late-night anime targeting otaku, disguised as Shōjo anime to reach a younger audience, this is why such garbage like CCS suffered a severe commercial failure among its original target audience.

>>281445701 (OP)
i like sailor moon, but technically after sailor moon the magical girl formula was altered forever.
It went from the comfy magical emi to precure.

>>281448893
Precure was only created in 2004, while CCS had already suffered a major commercial failure before 2000.

This kind of garbage, CCS, only appeals to middle-aged otakus between 35 and 45, and has no appeal to any young audiences in Japan.

>>281449444
>yurichads
ahahahhaahahahahahaahhahahahahahahahahahaha

>>281449637
>Because CCS is essentially late-night anime targeting otaku, disguised as Shōjo anime to reach a younger audience,
Fujo otaku, and that’s a good thing because it means it was an actual creative work of art made by CLAMP by fans for fans instead of being soulless commercialized slop like Precure, stay jelly though!

>this is why such garbage like CCS suffered a severe commercial failure among its original target audience.
But CCS is the most popular Mahou Shoujo among fujos, as evidenced by the merchandise targeting them, pic related.

>>281449637
Why did you post a screencap of a rerun of the show? the xxx holic anime came out 2006, 8 years after CCS.

>>281445701 (OP)
None of them did, but Madoka really was the final sign that Magical Girls were dead, and the only way to squeeze something interesting out of the genre is to turn it into a tragedy.

>>281449637
>Why did CCS's TV ratings only reach 0.6% between 1998 and 2000
>that screencap
Now everyone can see this guy deliberately lying and making up false evidence against CCS.

>>281449997
>But CCS is the most popular Mahou Shoujo among fujos, as evidenced by the merchandise targeting them, pic related.

Since CCS owns products, it has tax records to the Japanese government. If CCS's products are popular, CharaBiz DATA, which has a partnership with the Japanese government, will collect data on them. However, since 1999, CCS's sales have not been included in CharaBiz DATA's top 100 sales rankings, indicating that CCS's sales are extremely poor. Even Touhou Project's products outperform CCS.

Even the sales of non-commercial Touhou Project products are included in CharaBiz DATA. The absence of CCS from CharaBiz DATA's sales rankings indicates that CCS's sales are extremely poor.

>>281449237
No. We had a ton of edgy magical girl shows airing after Madoka Magica(Yuuki Yuuna, Magical girl site, and Magical Girl Raising Project to name just a few). That person likely hates Madoka because of how it was paraded around for years as a deeper deconstruction of the genre.

>>281450049

http://animesityouritsu1999.g2.xrea.com/animesityouritu/200001.html

http://animesityouritsu1999.g2.xrea.com/animesityouritu/200002.html

This is the Japanese TV ratings chart from 2000. Can you tell me where CCS is? NHK's anime shows are included in the chart, but CCS isn't listed among them.

>>281449444
>seething is when you tell the truth

>>281450288
>Official broadcast ratings (e.g. percent viewership) for Cardcaptor Sakura in Japan during its original run are not publicly recorded or available.
>It performed strongly in home media sales: in May 2000, certain LaserDisc volumes (Vol. 8 and Vol. 17) were among the top-selling anime LD releases, and DVD volume 18 ranked as the 8th best-selling anime DVD in June 2000.
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cardcaptor_Sakura
>As of mid-2025, audience demand (a modern demand metric from Parrot Analytics) shows Cardcaptor Sakura attracts around 2.9 to 3.4 times the demand of an average TV show.
>tv.parrotanalytics.com/DE/cardcaptor-sakura-kadokiyaputasakura-nhk
>Its popularity is evidenced through awards, strong home media sales, and later audience rankings.

>>281449997
The Touhou Project is also a Doujin production, and ZUN is even less commercially oriented than CLAMP.

However, Touhou Project's annual merchandise sales exceed 2.5 billion to 3 billion yen, while CCS hasn't even made 500 million yen annually since 1999.

>>281450427

So why does this TV ratings list include CCS's TV ratings? Why is CCS's TV ratings only 0.6%?
>>281449637

Then why were other NHK anime included in the 2000 TV ratings list? But CCS, which also airs on NHK, wasn't?
>>281450288

Please explain why.

>>281450462
>Touhou
Obviously because autistic waifufags are way bigger spenders than fujos, why do you think they release special edition BDs?

CCS is also the only old Mahou Shoujo that still consistently gets figures made by the way.

>>281450427

https://www.videor.co.jp/tvrating/2018/01/7807.html

Cardcaptor Sakura: Clear Card

>Original run January 7, 2018 – June 10, 2018

This is the TV ratings chart for the 2018 Clear Card broadcast.

Where is CCS? Why is NHK included in the charts, but CCS Clear Card isn't?

>>281450581
CCS was also featured on a billboard by Kodansha welcoming gaijin to Japan, why would they show CCS if it’s not the most popular and beloved Magical Girl IP in both Japan and worldwide?

>>281450541
The key issue is not whether there are new products, but that CCS's products have very poor sales. CCS's products are positioned for a very niche market. Apart from a very small number of CCS fans, no one will buy CCS products.

Touhou Project is more successful in attracting younger fans than CCS.

>>281445701 (OP)
Revolutionary girl utena

>>281450641
>there aren’t new CCS products
Did you just deliberately ignore the post where it was stated new CCS figures are constantly coming out?

>>281450632
Haven't you already given the answer? Whether in 1998 or 2018, CCS's TV ratings in Japan were very low, which shows that CCS is not popular in Japan. However, CCS is only popular among foreigners, but these foreign CCS fans have very poor purchasing power, resulting in CCS's annual sales of less than 500 million yen.

>>281450699
>Utena
Not Magical Girl, learn your genres newfag.

>>281450718
Retard.

>>281450632
What I'm saying is that CCS merchandise sales are extremely poor, and new CCS merchandise is produced for a tiny minority of CCS fans, not the vast majority of ordinary consumers.

This is because the CCS production committee is well aware that CCS is not popular at all and is just a very niche anime.

>CCS is a very niche anime
That's a good fucking joke. I laughed.

>>281450505
Anime having their own trading cards is nothing to brag about.
>>281450641
This retard seriously screencapped a tweet with 122 views

>>281450766
Ignore the jealous Precure salesfaggot and post Sakura that will make him seethe.

>>281446269
>Madoka attracted transbians
No, covid did. If they didn’t latch onto Madoka they would have latched onto something else.

Riddle me this: why would Sanrio keep collaborating with CCS if it's a "niche" anime and sales are "poor"?

>>281449417
>Madoka was simply following in her footsteps
How? There is zero yuri in Madoka.

>>281449444
Why are you replying to yourself?

>>281450780
The Digimon series also has a TCG, and while Digimon's TCG ranks in the top 10 in annual sales, CCS isn't even in the top 10. This suggests that CCS products are very niche, and the vast majority of consumers won't buy them. CCS products are only available to a tiny minority of CCS fans.

Furthermore, Precure's product sales are over 20 times higher than Digimon's.

>>281450812
Tell me, where is this crap anime from CCS?

>>281450869
Riddle me this schizo, why would mobile game and online game companies collab with CCS, if it's very niche and only has tiny minority of fans?

>>281450841
>>281450828

Precure has six official stores, while CCS can only rent pop-up stores and does not have its own official store.

Most of the unpopular animations rent pop-up stores, and CCS is just one of those unpopular animations that rent pop-up stores.

>>281445701 (OP)
Oh hey it's this thread. I thought it was only on /v/.
CCS did literally nothing other than referencing pre-SM magical girls. Shouldn't even be mentioned in this discussion at all.
Sailor Moon introduces a new style which resulted in more magical girls, some playing it a little too safe like Precure, but also others putting their own twist on the setting or aesthetics, like Symphogear. That's a net positive regardless of your taste, people referencing Sailor Moon is why the genre isn't dead yet.
And Madoka aims specifically at deconstruction which only leads to insincere works or things not for people who enjoyed magical girls in any form. That's your culprit. Also don't get the facts twisted: the issue isn't being darker, the issue is the meta aspect of deconstruction. Many other MG series had darker aspects, long before any these existed, but it's sincere. Meta isn't by design.

>>281450911
Do you know how many CCS collabs there have been from 2024 to the current year?

>>281450895
So is the Nanoha series popular? Are Nanoha products selling well? Why are there so many mobile game collaborations with Nanoha?

>>281450927
Do you know why CCS doesn't have its own official store and mobile games in Japan?

Did you know that CCS's annual mobile game sales in China are only 310,000 yen? Did you know that Precure's ticket sales for each live performance exceed 10 million to hundreds of millions of yen?

>>281450938
It’s not just video game collaborations, though. There are tons of merchandise collabs, like the Sanrio one I mentioned. New gachas are coming out monthly, and a CCS exhibit is happening right now in Hong Kong after it opened in China, South Korea, and Malaysia and you’re telling me that CCS is some throwaway niche series… do you even hear yourself?

>>281450927
Did you know that truly popular anime in Japan often collaborate with McDonald's and Pizza Hut?

But McDonald's and Pizza Hut in Japan have never collaborated with CCS, while Pizza Hut in Taiwan has. What does this prove? It proves that CCS is simply not popular in the eyes of McDonald's and Pizza Hut in Japan.

>>281451035
Is this guy saying that if a show isn’t uberpopular like Eva or Kimetsu, it isn’t popular at all? are you braindamaged

>>281451028
>>281451028
The Aikatsu series has been dead for many years, but Sanrio still cooperates with the Aikatsu series. What does this mean? It means that CCS and Aikatsu series are both dead series. Sanrio only needs to spend a very small amount of money to squeeze out the last remaining value of these anime and anime fans.

>>281451076
I rest my case.

>>281451070
At least in the eyes of McDonald's, KFC, and Pizza Hut in Japan, CCS is unwelcome. Business cooperation with CCS will not make money, and may even result in losses.

Funny that he mentioned pizza hut

>>281451111
>But McDonald's and Pizza Hut in Japan have never collaborated with CCS, while Pizza Hut in Taiwan has. What does this prove? It proves that CCS is simply not popular in the eyes of McDonald's and Pizza Hut in Japan.

>while Pizza Hut in Taiwan has. What does this prove?

Are you trying to prove once again that CCS is unpopular in Japan?

>>281445893
>Sakura didn't really have any real influence in spite of its success.
Prillya is one of the longest running Fate entries in existence and was directly inspired by CCS so I wouldn't say it had no influence.

>>281451147
Didn’t Nanoha also start off as a CCS clone?

>>281451147
More like no influence on the genre as a whole because it took something pre-existing and played it the same.
Compare with Sailor Moon and Madoka twisting the formula into something else.

>>281451146
sure.

>>281451147
Please provide interviews with the manga creator, animation director, and behind-the-scenes staff of Fate/kaleid liner Prisma Illya, and provide evidence to prove that this anime was influenced by CCS.

>>281445745
>Sailor troon

She literally marries Tuxedo Mask and gives birth to Chibiusa

Yet another dogshit magical girl thread

>>281451201
I don't understand what you're trying to prove? Are you trying to tell me that CCS has launched niche merchandise this year targeting a very small number of CCS fans?

This is the headquarters building of Kodansha. Tell me, is the advertisement hanging on the wall of the headquarters building for CCS or Precure?

>>281451248
Unfortunately, time proved again and again that all it takes to make an internet place much shittier is one schizo who's dedicated enough to his mental illness. Not sure if mods are doing anything about him either.

>>281451277
>/a/ mods
>doing anything helpful

>>281451355
Bold of you implying it's exclusive to /a/ mods.

>Engaging with bikinischizo
Newfag hours or what

>>281451277
Did you know that the truly popular Japanese anime rarely collaborate with other franchises? They might only do so once every few years or even a decade?

Have you ever seen anime like Pokémon, Demon Slayer: Kimetsu no Yaiba, Detective Conan, the Fate series, Gundam, Dragon Ball, One Piece, Naruto, and Evangelion frequently collaborate with other anime each year?

The answer is no. Truly popular anime have very stable sales, and they don't want to lose their consumer base to other anime through collaborations. Only less popular anime frequently collaborate with other anime.

>>281451390
>bikinischizo
qrd?

>>281445701 (OP)
Your post

>>281451447
Did you know that nobody gives a shit?

All I want to say is that fighting magical girls is cool as fuck and one of the best ideas Japan ever had in centuries.
Even something that touts itself as "traditional" like Sakura actually just wanted her to be a fighting magical girl, and indeed she does battle with the cards often enough. She wanted a piece of that cake because it tastes really fucking good.

Sailor Moon won bigly.

>>281451248
It is entirely the mods fault for allowing this /v/ermin crossboarding shitposter to make here this bait thread for the 90000000th time

>>281450926
> I thought it was only on /v/
And that’s where all your ilk of shitposting idiots should remain, especially this cancerfag OP, not infesting /a/

>>281449417
Based Fujo. We did a good job destroying the pathetic incel faggot /v/ermins earlier. Until the last cuckcel permavirgin retard is kicked out of Mahou Shoujo.

>>281451379
Yes, on other boards it is even worse

>>281451987
>>281452031
obsessed

>>281446269
...and Sakura attracted lolicons

>>281452108
I'm pretty sure we didn't need Sakura for that. The genre is full of little girls.

need a modern magical girl with ryona and pantyhose and clothing damage
>>281451461
you don't wanna know kek

>>281452169
No we don’t. Fuck off to your containment board for virgin neckbeards
>>>/r9k/

>>281452098
>t. /v/ermin crossboarder eternally BTFO

>>281452196
>>281452207
Extremely obvious samefag. Do not engage.

There are two posters we need to get rid of to make the magical threads normal again
1. the precure schizo
2. and this Toei crying bikini bitch >>281452196

>>281445788
just like Evangelion is the only good mecha show, right?

>>281452235
Sure, but not much anons can do without mod intervention.
OP is also kinda weird. This thread shows up a lot on /v/ https://arch.b4k.dev/v/search/image/B_tCK6NUqCyPRlGLLJbL9g/

>>281451202
Prillya season 1 is literally about capturing cards, are you retarded?

>>281450837
...

>>281452258
>139 results and still not image banned
the guy clearly is one of the mods

>>281452235
Yeah, nice try fucking /v/ermin, completely ignoring the elephant in the room which is that the ban evading OP is spamming flamewar threads despite being banned constantly. You are a goddamn retard.

>>281452282
To be fair the threads to get taken down.

>>281452211
Fuck off to your containment board already

>>281452286
On /v/ his homeboard sometimes yes. He should be instabanned here and permabanned too.

>>281452293
I've seen you on /v/
shall I post the archive post

>>281452304
>I've seen you on /v/
Stay the fuck there and never come back crossboarding cancerfag

So, basically /v/ermin raiding /a/ is what ruined mahou shoujo… whoa who would have thought

>>281452339
Pot, meet kettle.

>>281445701 (OP)
>>281446237
Blaming the stuff that follows is the right and correct thing to do though, because absolute garbage like mahou shoujo site succeeding, showed people that fucking anything was fair game and it'd be slopped up.
Madoka would've been a one-off otherwise, no harm no foul.

>>281452356
What if I think Madoka itself also sucks, and that's not just because it started the deconstruction trend?

>>281452339
https://arch.b4k.dev/v/thread/717990839/#718032780

>>281452378
Same thing. If everyone thought it sucked, still a one-off otherwise, no harm no foul. Only difference would've been it didn't succeed and spawn more of itself.
Someone still would've seen it and went "oh yeah that sucked but I'm a genius and I CAN DO IT BETTER", and we'd be in mostly the same place.

>>281452003
The /v/ thread was much better though, it had a lot of sincere posts by people who people with fresh perspectives and genuine interest in discovering more about the series due to being essentially new to most of it, while here the people just want to continue the inane drama that was started around bullshit there, and most of this thread is catering to that while all the /v/ fags with actual curiosity won't even see this.

>>281452414
Fair enough I guess.

>>281452419
>it had a lot of sincere posts by people who people with fresh perspectives and genuine interest in discovering more about the series
The schizo you are replying to is not looking for this, he is on an autistic quest to "chase away the otaku virgins" or whatever, basically larping as a fujo.

>>281452235
If CCS fans don't trust Japan's most authoritative sales rankings, then this is a ranking of Japan's most popular IPs compiled by Nikkei Business Publications, a subsidiary of The Nikkei, based on extensive nationwide surveys and statistical data. The absence of CCS on this list proves that CCS isn't popular in Japan

This is the most popular IP in Japan, but it does not have CCS.


https://www.resetera.com/threads/2025-japan-media-brands-popularity-survey-age-gender-trends-anime-gaming-manga-ips-entertainment-genres-media-music-acts-etc.1248051/

https://xtrend.nikkei.com/atcl/contents/18/01178/00010/

Please tell me, where is CCS?

>>281452476
>chase away the otaku virgins
some feefees were hurt I see

>>281452419
There was nothing redeeming about that dogshit thread, no genuine interest at all, and retards who think allowing a bunch of newfags and entitled dubfaggots to chime in is somehow “good” and “refreshing” are braindead

>both of these schizos replied to me like clockwork
damn they really are desperate for attention and validation

>>281445701 (OP)
Sakura only fucks shotas

>>281452384
That is the Fujo, not me, you stupid dumbfuck. Well, not that I expect any intelligence from a basement dwelling shitposter.

>>281452512
>it’s totally not me the schizo, right, r-right?
take your lithium for fucks sake

Cancerfags like this who add nothing of value like this idiot here >>281452526 are the main problem… but neckbeard “big friends” will defend that

>>281452479
Please illustrate with infographs how come the government of Japan has given so much recognition to Precure

>>281452527
It's literally (you)

>>281452561
The Japanese government recognized Precure's significant contribution to the Japanese economy and even sent government officials to the Toei headquarters to express their gratitude and congratulations to Precure.

>>281452533
You question my sanity when you post and whie about the same crap in every magical girl thread across the boards

>>281452576
>everyone who thinks I am a retard must be the same person!
No, that’s just because you are in fact a retard. Anyway looool MINDBROKEN by the FUJO. LMAO you can’t make that shit up. Based Fujo

>>281452600
It's literally (you)

>>281452587
I’m not the Fujo, retarded schizoid. But at least the Fujo knows a lot about the genre and you can have serious discussions with her whereas you are just a shitposting idiot who adds zero value. Even the Precure salesman is better than (You). Kys

>>281452607
Keep repeating it until it becomes true in your head! Lol, lmao even

>>281452621
don't make me tap the sign>>281452607

It's about time you ignored the obvious trolls here and started talking about magical girls.
You watching something cool, anons? I'm on edge myself, hence why I browse related threads to add some suggestions and then eventually try them.

>>281452581
I see… but it would be nice if you posted more of your kino infographs and also pictures of the Precure stores. That’s based as fuck

>>281452632
Meds. Now.

>>281452108
>Sakura attracted lolicons
That was Sailor Moon and Precure though, see here >>281449417

>>281452642
There's a huge power gap between these magical girls and I don't know why

>>281452717
'cause MAL is newfag shit.

>>281450541
That figure is old and Tomoyo is finally getting a new nendo

>>281452621
>>281452600
Based ACTUAL Sailor Moon fan, also most of the anons you’re replying to are babby zoom zooms who got into the genre via Midoka and barely know anything about Mahou Shoujo history or lore so it’s pointless to even try starting up a discussion, they’re only in it for the little girls and the yuri pandering like the loser pedos they are after all.

>>281452749
I have that figure and It is one of the most gorgeous figure I own. It's quite a space hogger tho.

>>281452527
is the fujo in the room with us right now?

The Japanese government did not send any officials to CLAMP's largest exhibition.

However, at Precure's exhibition, the mayor of Yokohama attended the ribbon-cutting ceremony and delivered a speech thanking Precure, acknowledging its significant contribution to Yokohama's economic development.

>>281445701 (OP)
Wasn't the genre just bad from the start?

>>281452900
No, and it has not been "ruined" in any meaningful sense of the word either

>Gay men pretending to be fujos ITT
Sad.

>>281452900
Not really, but you are allowed to dislike the premise of young girls getting magical powers. Other than that, it's broad enough that the quality entirely depends on the specific work you are engaging with.

The Japanese government has sent government officials to attend Precure's events many times. Among the entire magical girl genre, Precure is the only magical girl anime recognized by the Japanese government.

https://www.nikkei.com/article/DGXZQOUA237QY0T20C23A1000000/

>>281452758
Based. Even if you have some justifiable resentment towards BSSM due to the unhinged spastic retards that flocked to our series and thus Mahou Shoujo at large, believe me that an actual dedicated Sailor Moon fan like me hates them even more. They have ruined discussion since forever, have the nerve to chime in at spaces meant for actual fans only and even at cons, me and other based chads have to protect our cosplayers from those mouthbreathing retards (when they see a real man they shit their pants), a real fucking plague… on the other hand with you one can discuss the history of Mahou Shoujo or stuff about CCS, which has an undeniable artistic value, unlike with those other retards who know nothing… and we can also agree that SM R movie was one of Ikuhara’s best… but yeah, you are right, it’s a waste of time even engaging those zoomie diaperfags and assorted loser cucks. They are not fans, never will be, they are not even “men”. Gatekeeping is in order and a good thing.
>>281452832
I’m talking to her right now and she’s way more based than any of you dumbfucks

>>281452953
This is getting SAD xister...

>>281452932
I have no objection to the premise, I just don't know of any such story that's actually good, and this thread isn't doing much to dissuade me of that notion.

>>281452953
>Yaoitroon who hates Sailor Moon is "more based" than people who like it
what?

>>281452959
Of course the omega nu-“male” can’t even fathom the existence of women and actual men, after spending a decade in his basement. Not your safe space, not your hugbox. Touch grass freak.

>>281452981
>than people who like it
Except the vast majority of morons here don’t actually like it and are just retarded bandwagonners, speedwatchers and zoomies with fake nostalgia. That, and a truckload of shitposters.

>>281452984
what even is this response? lmfao

>>281452964
There's enough variety with the plots, ranging from excuse plots, coming of age(usually with romance), epic conflict between good and evil, raw character drama, ow the edge and actual fucking shitposts.

>>281453008
You said in the other thread you literally only liked Sailor Moon for the brief faggot pandering in the anime, shut the fuck up you gross fujo. Not everything has to be yaoi.

What significant contributions has CCS made to the Japanese economy and government? The answer is no. No one in Japan cares whether CCS is dying.

>>281448930
It was more Super Sentai and Saint Seiya.
Cutie Honey was just the female version of the disguising android series popular at the time.

>>281450702
>CCS is popular among foregners
yes it was a worldwide phenonmenon there's a huge CCS mural in FUCKING Netherlands

>>281453035
I’m not the Fujo, you demented schizo.

Nanoha ruined magical girls. Everyone else is innocent.

>>281453266
But why though

>>281453284
It did da pantyshot stuff for no reason. People say CCS brought the lolicons, nuh-uh, it was just a cuter precure.

>>281453383
>It did da pantyshot stuff for no reason
Somebody post the Sailor Moon pantyshot chart.

>>281453402
you are a cancerfag worse than precure schizos kill yourself

>>281452277
It’s true.

Have something fun to do instead of pure shitposting. Fill the rest of the chart, I only started it with the ones in OP.

>>281454053
Ok I will throw you the true neutral.
Shonen + plot-focused, MG themes are present and not subverted. Also singing girls.

>>281454663
Well then, Symphogear is based as fuck because I remember it was a massive middle finger to M*doka at the start. Eagerly waiting for the genre rebels.

>>281445701 (OP)
When a genre reaches the point that it's being "deconstructed", that's the end of the line.

>>281455388
Not really, and Madoka-style deconstruction fell out of flavor eventually, though not dead yet.

>>281447332
Smug brat...

>>281449417
Yuri is pure.

>>281455445
I mean, the genre is tapped. The deconstruction can of course continue, but it takes a deliberate effort to return to "sincerity", and even that will be influenced by the deconstruction that preceded it.

>>281455550
>but it takes a deliberate effort to return to "sincerity"
Eh not really. Even if you exclude something like Precure, it's pretty easy to take inspiration from all the pre-deconstruction works. A genre as broad as "magical girls" cannot be solved because it has very few essential elements.

>>281453213
This is a strange phenomenon. Judging from the very poor sales of CCS, CCS fans generally have weak spending power. Why is CCS so attractive to the world's poor?

This is a survey of spending power for Japan's most popular IPs. This chart shows how much men and women aged 20 and over are willing to spend on the most popular IPs.

This spending survey data includes Precure but not CCS.

>>281455388
That only works for genres that are flawed in ways that 'deconstruction' (in the TV Tropes, non-Derridian sense) works for. The elements that could potentially be deconstructed in this way are mostly complete fluff conventions that works of the genre itself don't take seriously in the first place, like "how transformation sequences work" and other nonsense like that.

Madoka doesn't even attempt to deconstruct things like that even, instead it just operates differently than a typical magical girl show, giving the characters a choice to be contracted to gain powers, rather than being born into them and having to learn to use them wisely, as is normal for the genre.

Complete sincere magical girl shows already had more than enough 'bite' and complexity to them beforehand, and Madoka didn't advance anything in that regard. It's more or less an example of mahou shoujo that's just less girly than the norm, and isn't inherently superior for that.

>>281455838
>'deconstruction' (in the TV Tropes, non-Derridian sense)
>Madoka doesn't even attempt to deconstruct things like that even
TV tropes itself would like to disagree.
>2011's Puella Magi Madoka Magica is the Trope Codifier and Genre Popularizer for this genre
from https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MagicalGirlGenreDeconstruction

>>281455892
And I disagree with TV Tropes. Because its idea of deconstruction is complete nonsense.

>>281455943
You disagree purely on how they interpret the term, or that their interpretation applies to Madoka?

https://takeharu-yamanaka.yokohama/achievements.html

https://www.city.yokohama.lg.jp/mayor/photodiary/2023/202309/20230924-4.html

Yokohama Mayor's Official Website

Yokohama's collaboration with Precure and Pokémon Go was a key political achievement during his tenure as mayor.

In the eyes of Japanese government officials, Precure's status is similar to that of Pokemon, and Precure's business activities can have an impact on the economies of Japan's three major cities. CCS has no value to the Japanese government.

>>281456046
The interpreration of the term. The whole thing is just a bunch of vague definitions and vague ideas and vague claims about how media and genres work with no actual substance.

>>281456241
>The whole thing is just a bunch of vague definitions and vague ideas and vague claims about how media and genres work with no actual substance.
Would be if they didn't list examples of what they are talking about. Although sometimes they do be reaching or state contradictory claims, like I just noticed the "Not A Deconstruction" page, specifically under quotes shows arguments against the idea that Madoka is a deconstruction, while at the same time the previous page uses Madoka as the biggest example.

>>281446269
>Sailor Moon attracted ironic weebs
Zoomcucks who weren’t even alive when it was new don’t count.

>>281456400
But the examples don't really clarify the matter at all, they mostly just say this is deconstruction because more vague claims

>>281456504
The page I mentioned does that, by comparing it to other terms used on the site.
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Administrivia/NotADeconstruction

>>281454894
Where does mahoako fit in that chart?

>>281456544
That page is not really any better, it might explain how some things are not deconstructions but it does not add any clarity to what it is that makes the supposed deconstructions actually deconstructions.

>>281456835
Unsurprisingly, same spot as Madoka.

>>281454894
Where does Witch Watch fit in the chart?
This is the only pic I have of witch watch

>>281454053
Contributing

>>281456916
My understanding is that their definition boils down to:
>it's deconstruction when you take a trope that's usually protected by suspension of disbelief, and actually play it out with more realistic logic, implications and consequences
The problem is that the first is a little contextual. Like no one questions magical girls if they appear in this genre, but if you were to make one appear in, say, a down-to-earth mystery story then the first thing everyone will do is suspect she is fact not a real magical girl.

>>281457126
Contributing

>>281457126
Nice

>>281457204
lmao here we go

>>281457033
You tell me. I'm not familiar with it.

>>281457204
a slightly less shitty job

>>281457229
Shoujo, romance, sort of coming of age in later chapters, modern urban daily life, no villains most of the time, girl had powers since a child, no fancy clothes (except for the guy with the vintage autismo)

>>281457318
Sounds like full purist with only a very minor variation, same as Sakura then.
Also, feel free to resize the ones I already put if you want to add more.

Damn /a/ is fast today

>>281449697
>>281450317
>>281450847
That hurt, huh?

>>281454053
I was thinking... aside from things like "girl using sci-fi tech that might as well be magic" or "they are boys", what could qualify as genre rebel?
Can you pull something fancy like having a magical girl end up exposed as not really magical at the end? Or does that just turn it into a completely different kind of show?

>>281458277
Seeing you reply to yourself? No it was mostly just pitiful

>>281451166
I don't know, but Nanoha was probably an inspiration for Prillya as well with Hiroyama sneaking in a reference in the first manga.

>>281458828
and of course the fact that Hiroyama published a Nanoha doujin (non-H) and a Prillya x Nanoha cross-over existing.