Thread 282003615

The fact that both JJK and Demon Slayer both sold themselves not on actual substance but on merely sakuga alone really feels like the moment where battle shonen really started getting especially bad.

And ever since Demon Slayer blew up, there’s been so many competing series trying to vie for its throne. The incredibly shallow Kaiju No.8 that squanders its novelty of an older protagonist, the nonsensical (in a not very fun way) Sakamoto Days that desperately wants to be John Wick but just devolves into superpowered gimmicks, the trainwreck that was Tokyo Revengers, and even the currently airing trope slurry that is Tougen Anki. Even Bleach is going through its Rise of Skywalker phase adapting the final (awful) manga arc throwing in as much nostalgia member berries and Demon Slayer-ish sakuga at the audience to distract from its abysmal narrative. Basically no current shonen are able to rise above the social media hype-farming garbage.

>>282003615 (OP)
You're just a faggot with nostalgia goggles for the earlier but worse shonenshit of the 00s.

>>282003615 (OP)
What about Frieren?

>>282003693
Jujutsu Kaisen is literally a hodgepodge of nonsensically thown together ideas stolen from Naruto, Bleach, and Hunter x Hunter, with no understanding of what made any of those ideas work in the first place.

>complaining about popular series
>incoherent opinions about the industry
>negative comparison to star wars and other western properties
>member berries
>obsession with social media
Tourist thread

>>282003615 (OP)
anime fans do not care about the story or characters or any themes or any other garbage. All they care about is fancy digital effects and animation.

>>282003735
Naruto and Hunter x Hunter are full of rip-offs as well.
It’s just that Westerners know almost nothing about manga from before the ’90s, so they delude themselves into thinking works from that era are some kind of treasure trove of original ideas and end up worshipping them.
In fact, the rip-offs in Hunter x Hunter (which Togashi may intend as parody) are far more frequent and much nastier than those in JJK.

The real issue is simply that there are no longer truly interesting manga in Jump. The readers of Shonen Jump are more discerning than you think, and they do recognize good works

>>282003615 (OP)
>Even Bleach is going through its Rise of Skywalker phase

Bleach was a pile of trash from the very beginning, nowhere near the level of KnY or JJK.
Among the so-called “Big 3,” the only parts that surpass those two in quality are OP up to the Alabasta arc and Naruto up to the Tsunade arc.
Everything after that in both OP and Naruto is garbage as well.

>>282004972
Okay idiots. Everything is a rip off

>>282005083
>>282003615 (OP)
This is not a shounen issue retards. All modern anime and manga is a shallow copy of older anime and manga.

>>282005546
It is. Everything is the Heros journey in the West for instance.

It's not that rip offs are bad, it's how you take and interperate it... In fact I rather like how JJKs power system works because it's basically that, how people interpret things. I know that idea is new or original, but tying it to curses and how people treat each other (could also be a deeper meaning on how we see ourselves based on others actions or words). I just really like it, it resonates and hits home more with me than hunter x hunter which has these long winded planned out plots that may or may not pay off. Or how yu yu Hakusho basically becomes DBZ (same with bleach)

>>282005623
And all western writing is a rip off of the heroes journey/epic of Gilgamesh and the Bible

This isn't a new idea you low IQ moron. Fuck off back to whatever shithole you crawled out of

>>282005757
Exactly. Mankind has never been creative so I don’t understand why OP and others are so upset.
Every creative work is just a small mutation on existing tropes and ideas. The mutations accumulate over time.

>>282004972
This.

By the way, Naruto is basically a collection of ideas borrowed from works like

Ushio and Tora
Ninku
Hunter x Hunter
The Kouga Ninja Scrolls
The Tale of the Gallant Jiraiya
Akira

and so on.
Since /a/ only cares about the Big 3, the latest popular battle shonen, moeshit, and hentai, they probably don’t even know half of these original sources.

>>282006038
Notice how it’s a mix of varied influences sci-fi, novels, Harry Potter, classic Japanese literature, punk aesthetics. While Jujutsu is just HunterxHunter in high school?

>>282006253
> It’s actually better when a work borrows from many different sources.

By the way, JJK also takes ideas from many kinds of works, Bleach, Junji Ito’s serieses, Vagabond, Baki, Onmyoji, Nihon Shoki, and more.

It’s not just the series you hold dear that are like this, every work, throughout history and across the world, is ultimately a collection of ideas the author has seen and heard up to that point.

>>282003615 (OP)
Nah all modern anime is just bad
Just like how all modern songs are just worse than older songs
The next generation is getting worse and worse in multiple aspects. The apocalypse may as well be near

>>282003615 (OP)
We'll see a modern classic shounen soon but it won't come from Japan
>>282008096
Not all modern anime, there are many good modern titles
But the anime OP talks about is shit yes

>>282003615 (OP)
The "substantial shonen" died with My Hero Academia. Now it's just muh aura and muh sakuga.

>>282008096
>Nah all modern anime is just bad

>Hanako-kun
>ToniKawa
>Bishounen Tanteidan
>Kemono Jihen
>Megaton-kyuu Musashi
>Bravern
>Mononoke sequels
>Off&Monster Season
>Inu-Ou
>SAO Progressive Series
>Sonny Boy
>Kimitachi wa Dou Ikiru ka
>Look Back
>Ousama Ranking
>Frieren
>Uma Musume
>Onimai
>Dainanaouji
>Apocalypse Hotel
>GaCen
>CITY
>Shin Yaiba
>Takopii
>NINKORO
>Rock wa Lady

No, I'm pretty sure it's just battle shounen that went to shit.

>>282004972
>>282007029
>shilling for JJK
>shilling for JJK being better than fucking Hunter x Hunter

The shit you see on this board sometimes

>>282003615 (OP)
To be honest, these two series are far better than most older manga.
I myself used to be obsessed with One Piece and Naruto, but looking back, a big part of that was because I was still young and hadn’t had much exposure to creative works.
Manga from 2000s and beforw 90s are generally childish, with cheap themes and fights that lack any real tension. (This includes Dragon Ball, which /a/ has deified.)
As for older shonen manga that can still hold up to today’s standards, there are really only about four: Slam Dunk, Death Note, Hunter x Hunter, and Neuro.

>Two threads claiming KnY and JJK are dead
>Just as both the movie, sequel manga and new season started getting talked about
Surely not a coincidence

>>282009288
>sequel manga
Sequel to JJK or KnY? Im kinda lost with the news.

>KNY can only stay alive when the anime is on air and vanishes into thin air when there's no anime
>Gaygay realized JJK will be the sole success in his entire career and without JJK he's out of job so he panicked and made Boruto: JJK edition
Nu-shounen has no staying power

>>282003615 (OP)
How long will the boomers keep weeping tears of blood in anger, jealous that the beloved manga of their nostalgia never received an anime adaptation as good as KnY or JJK?

>>282009328
Gege's new short run manga was revealed to be a JJK sequel

>>282009485
Zoomer slop can get all the sakuga in the world but they will never reach the height of the Big 3 + DBZ

>>282009602
I don't know what world you're in if you're delusional enough to think that DBZ naruto one piece had bad animation

>>282003615 (OP)
>really feels like the moment where battle shonen really started getting especially bad.
Holy fucking underage

Old good
New bad!

>>282009444
>KnY can only stay alive when the anime is on air
It’s the same with every series.
Even Dragon Ball completely disappeared from public discussion in Japan after both the manga and anime ended in the mid-’90s (in fact, its decline had already begun earlier though), despite the sequel GT still being on air. It had to wait until the revival boom of 2003 before it was back in the spotlight.

>Gege
If you claim that he is having only one successful work, then every one of the Big 3 mangaka falls into that category.

You guys can bash kny all you like. I only like JJK between this 2.

i have contrarian-slop fatigue.

>>282009485
They scream, “Old shonen manga were manly, unlike today’s weak and effeminate ones!!!” yet the way they themselves act is the very height of effeminacy, like a woman dumped hard by her boyfriend, jealous and sobbing while spewing bitter resentment.
The irony couldn’t be greater.

>>282009791
>Even Dragon Ball completely disappeared from public discussion in Japan
Wrong

>>282009875
same but i also have slop fatigue
like the slop on your picrel

>>282010081
From what I read in that pic, it doesn’t seem to contradict my argument at all.

>>282010115
lol stfu you are literally the reason everyone hates weebs. you don't like shounen but you post about them because they are popular to get attention.

>>282010081
>Wrong
wrong what. being a pokemon trier brand doesn't mean it's part of anime discussion. i love my brown spic bros but you negros are out-fucking-dated with this shit. no one shares your obsession with an anime that's been dead for 30 fucking years.

>>282009191
Pre-Grand Line One Piece was peak.
Would 100% still be top of Jump if it ran today.
Same with JoJo parts 3, 4, 5, and 7.

Other than that, I agree with you.

>>282003714
Nothing nore than isekai slop but none of the characters have emotions.

>>282009791
>despite the sequel GT still being on air
Besides being wrong in all the post, GT was absolute shit.

>>282009791
>then every one of the Big 3 mangaka
Who are those?
>>282010115
>slop
If only you weren´t a retard and could explain what that word means...

>>282005546
Thats what OP is so close to realizing. Its fundamentally meaningless.

>>282009288
Would someone really do that? Come to 4chan and seethe?

>>282009485
Mappa is incapable of creating a good adaption. They went out of their way to do a shitty, innacurate job.
Open your eyes.

>>282010259
i only watch good shonen tho
like hxh, jjba and dbz and stay away from the bad ones like the ones you posted

>>282010453
>GT was absolute shit.

So?
It doesn't change the fact that for nearly two years, new fuel kept being thrown in to keep fans talking.
And it wasn’t content already shown in the manga, but anime-original stories where nobody had any idea how the it would progress the following week.

>>282010599
>like hxh, jjba and dbz
you are 30. adorable. no one cares do something with your life instead of making shit up like "staying power" when anime has higher viewership than ever.

>>282003735
Exactly. I have no idea how JJK gets praise past meme shit. It's just so damn sloppy. Same with Cucksaw man.

>>282003615 (OP)
Shonen was never substance you manchild
And stop being obessed with popular shonen shit you retarded low iq brown

>>282010072
The issue is they're fighting over shonen shit
Atleast boomers IRL cry about IRL shit. not some meaningless kids comics that even the fucking AUTHOR doesn't care as mucb about

>>282010707
If they’re talking about “staying power,” none of those three really have it either.
Not just DB, but JoJo too, literally nobody cares about it now.
The only times it got big were like 10 years ago when Parts 1–2 first got an anime, and around 6 years ago when Giorno’s theme became a meme.
And HxH? It only ever trends when Togashi drops his 10-chapter run, and even that buzz keeps getting smaller every year.

>>282003615 (OP)
This is why Im a slice of life chad.

>>282010829
>Shonen was never substance
Sorry to break it to you but older battle shounen were actually about things, rather than just being empty vehicle for fights and sakuga.

This scene gripped viewers without any flashy animation, no one would watch JJK or KnY without sakuga.

>>282010707
higher viewership means nothing will stick
and that's why dbz + big 3 will outlast everyone, cause they have staying power

>>282003615 (OP)
>The fact that both JJK and Demon Slayer both sold themselves not on actual substance but on merely sakuga alone really feels like the moment where battle shonen really started getting especially bad.
You are implying that Naruto, Bleach and One piece had any substance.
>>282009015
>"JJK wasn't different from other shonenshit on that point"
>"Are you shilling JJK?"
>"Hunter x hunter did that specific thing more than JJK"
>"Are you shilling for JJK being better than fucking Hunter x Hunter?"
Discussion with you is impossible, you have no reading comprehension.

>>282011348
Old shonen didn’t have any real depth either.
The only reason you feel Naruto was amazing is because you encountered it at a time when you were still highly impressionable.

Do you not realize how much One Piece, Naruto, and Bleach were mocked back in the mid-2000s as “hollow, childish shows with no substance”?

>>282011348
>Impressed by this scene

Seriously, read more manga.
Even by shonen standards, the messaging in Naruto is clumsy and amateurish.
Even Bleach is still better than this, if only because Kubo’s command of language is on a higher level.

>>282011465
Here's what will happen
new shonen will become, they'll also be popular
you'll cry and cry until you're walking with canes, crying at clouds and at new shonen manga
That is if you didn't put a bullet to blow your brains out you subhuman

>>282011773
Yes I actually am impressed by Pain's speech and how he convincgly ideologically mindbreak the protagonist.
Everyone with a functioning brain remembers the Pain arc as an example of where Naruto addresses legitimately tough questions.

>clumsy
How, its thematically coherent from beginning to end, there isnt one villain who is just evil.

>>282011465
High viewership was exactly what Dragon Ball and the Big 3 anime were proud of 20–30 years ago.
Stop crying like, “b-but my manga isn’t lowbrow entertainment… it’s true artttttt”
What you’re bragging about is no different from a normal shonen anime, it’s just nothing more than a kids’ show.

>>282003735
As of today. This is proven even more true. JJK was a "best of shounen" whose power system barely took itself seriously *or defined itself at all except for deus ex machina ass pulls

>>282011988
dbz + big 3 came out pre-streaming era and so have incredible staying power
zoomer shonen came out in the streaming era that dbz + big 3 helped to build and there's more options than ever so they have 0 staying power
>>282011785
still won't be as remembered as dbz + big 3
the next overrated slop comes and goes but dbz + big 3 will stay

What set off the board wide temper tantrum this time?

>>282011628
No, OP always had a high reputation but with the concession that the anime is too slow/ugly.

Bleach had the meme that it gets bad after soul society due to the anime fillers, but again, was always well regarded by manga readers.

Naruto hate was mostly a 4chan meme and outside a questionable/overlong final arc (which it still pulls together by the end), it's a classic and there will probably never be anything like it again.

KnY and JJK are literally laughing stock carried by animation/sakuga zoomer hype culture

>>282012154
It's one schizo manchild who longs for the DB/big 3 days (even though he never lived when DB was ongoing) and hates new popular thing

>>282012188
They're all trash and you're brown

>>282003615 (OP)
Zoomer chads have good taste
Millennials soys crying and wailing kek

>Still flying under the radar
I wish it never gets an anime adaptation.

>>282011983
This is just peak corny melodrama. They’re clearly going for MGS-style presentation, but it’s a complete failure.
There’s zero novelty here, it’s the most boilerplate shonen battle writing imaginable.
Pain gives a long sob story, Naruto half-slips into empathy mode, and we’ve seen this exact routine way too many times already. Childish as hell.
There’s no real intellectual tension where the villain’s philosophy actually shakes the hero’s worldview. “If everyone shares pain, peace will come” gets repeated so often in this arc it turns into pure cringe. And of course Naruto wraps it all up with the power of “talk no jutsu.”
I envy anyone who can still feel moved by such cheap-ass writing.

>>282012311
Zoomer slop will be forgotten. People will overrate them and move onto the next shiny thing like the Golden Retrievers they are.

DB, Naruto, Bleach and One Piece will stay and outlast them. The funniest thing is, they already did lmao. We're in Gen Alpha now and the new hot topic anime is DanDaDan (which DB and the Big 3 will outlast too).

>>282003615 (OP)
sometimes a simple story is best, whats wrong with a brother wanting to get justice for his family's brutal murder along with his sister and learning how important that bond is?

>>282012188
>OP always had a high reputation
That’s a blatant lie.
If you dig through old 2ch logs, you’ll see that One Piece had been relentlessly slammed by the so-called “manga connoisseurs” after the Skypiea arc (Skyliea itself was poorly received though).

The main reasons were, The story’s slow pacing, Oda’s overly contrived tear-jerking attempts, The excessive use of fake deaths, Fights where characters had absurdly high durability and basically never died.
Even when impaled, they’d just bleed a little and come out virtually unscathed
Because of that, the battles had no real tension at all.

During the first half of Marineford, the hype temporarily brought evaluations back up, but then Ace’s idiotic move of taking Akainu’s bait and dying a pointless death left people dumbfounded, and opinions dropped again.
After the timeskip, online otaku criticism fell even further, and the sheer disaster that was the Wano arc has now seriously started to affect manga sales.

Naruto was ridiculed even more than One Piece.
Westerners might not notice, but Kishimoto’s poor Japanese made the characters’ lines sound weird and idiotic.
On top of that, as mentioned before, it was full of rip-offs from Ninku and Hunter x Hunter, plus Naruto’s creepy obsession with Sasuke in Part 2, and the Akatsuki villains’ stupid behavior. It was constantly compared to Hunter x Hunter and mocked.

>>282012965
Considering that DB was forgotten within a year after the Buu arc ended, KnY and JJK have shown a surprisingly long lifespan.
The only reason Naruto is still popular today is because the franchise is literally still ongoing.
And Bleach has already been forgotten, no one in the younger generation cares about it anymore.

>>282013015
simple stories are good but the author is a hack who doesn't understand the bond of siblings
which is also why it's popular with zoomers, zoomers have the emotional depth of a puddle and love the idea of sibling bonds but doesn't actually understand it
you could write the imouto out and replace her with a dog and you'd get the same outcome

>>282003615 (OP)
I like KnY.
Never read JJK.

>>282013369
>Considering that DB was forgotten within a year after the Buu arc ended
GT was still around, as garbage as it was, and we still had the video games and the franchise accumulated $30 billion by 2004.

JJK and Demon Slayer don't have any lifespan. What they both have, is an anime that keeps them on life-support because the second their anime ends, their franchises will both die along with it. That's why Gaygay panicked and made a Boruto spin-off out of JJK. Dragon Ball doesn't need an anime and it hasn't for decades now.

>>282012965
I don't care. DB and the big 3 are already forgotten to me because I enver read them and never will
KnY and JJK and CSM are my big shonen

>DB, OP, Naruto and Bleach has substance.

I’ll give you a little credit on early One Piece, but the other three are just flashy fights with zero substance, pure "I PUNCH HARDER I WIN" trash.
Demonslayer and Jujutsu are at least somewhat better since they actually take cues from HxH and JoJo.

>>282013643
>"I PUNCH HARDER I WIN" trash
JJK's final battle ended with the MC punching harder and Kimetsu is just retards swinging their swords harder while hallucinating because the power system isn't even a power system lmao

>>282013496
Short lifespan of Dragon Ball stands out even more, since it was forgotten from the late ’90s to the early 2000s despite having GT as completely new content.
It wasn’t until 2003, when a very high-quality PS2 game came out alongside the release of the newly reissued comics, that it became a hot topic again and sparked a revival boom.
Until then, Dragon Ball as a franchise was essentially dead.

Old mangaka used to read literature.
New mangaka only read manga.
All the creatives in Japan suffered a similar degeneration. Miyazaki, the old man who yells at clouds, bitches about how these days kids don't know anything except otaku shit anymore.

>>282013716
Both KnY and JJK actually have tension, take one hit and you might die, or at least be left with permanent damage.
It’s never just “punch harder and win.”
Dragon Ball and the Big 3, on the other hand, are basically pro-wrestling shows.
Characters land dozens of hits on each other, and the result is just some token blood from the mouth while the actual damage is literally zero.

>>282013835
>Old mangaka used to read literature.

Most of Dragonball’s inspiration came from older manga, Hollywood movies, and Toho kaiju films.

I think mainstream shonen died with My Hero Academia. Their threads are still very alive in /vm/

>>282013716
At least, gen generation of manga, characters can die easily as a result of battles, often suddenly and without any foreshadowing.
In contrast, all the characters in the Big 3 are “protected,” making the fights look like nothing more than farcical theater.
And DB is outright disqualified, since dead characters just come back to life with ease.

>>282014007
Toriyama didn't read much manga and Torishima just hated shonen manga, calling them crude lol
Dragon Ball is good because it's made by two geniuses who didn't really give a fuck about manga for the same reason why Madvillainy is a great rap album, it's made by two geniuses who didn't give a fuck about hip hop

>>282014099
>I think mainstream shonen died with My Hero Academia. Their threads are still very alive in /vm/

So much this. Nowadays only Japan cares about Kimetsu. Jujutsu threads ard also dead.

>>282009485
Looks like nothing but oldfag fear that their nostalgic manga will fade and forggotten with the rise of a new generation.
You can literally see it in this thread, spamming “DB and the Big 3 will be remembered forever, unlike this new gen trash that’ll be forgotten instantly” like they’re possessed.

>>282014322
>DB and the Big 3 will be remembered forever, unlike this new gen trash that’ll be forgotten instantly
That's also true. See how SnK got instantly memoryholed the second the wnime ended and Mappa milked it for God knows how long? Same will happen to JJK and KNY. Popular slops comes and goes, only DBZ and Big 3 will really stay.

>>282014221
KnY’s movie has already made 10 billion JPY just from its recent release only in Asia(notincluding Jap), and once it starts rolling out in Europe and the U.S., it’ll probably become the biggest hit anime film both domestically and internationally.
JJK too, when the Season 3 trailer dropped, it instantly blew up across social media worldwide.

Both of them are achieving things that Dragon Ball and the Big 3 never could.

>>282014565
Why no one cares about Kimetsu anymore?

>Old gen vs new gen thread
>Nobody mentions about him

>>282014630
Care in what way? Like what are you expecting

>>282014630
Because you’re wrong.
People do care that’s why the movie is a massive hit in Japan and across Asia.
To be honest, for an anime film, its success is a little out of the ordinary.
And still not even released in West yet.

>>282014565
>Both of them are achieving things that Dragon Ball and the Big 3 never could.
A Dragon Ball gacha alone made more money than every single KNY merch + film + anime combined, JJK too
KNY is only a big deal in Japan with geriatric old farts (KNY's fanbass is madd up of old women in their 40s to 50s), so is JJK powered mentally ill fujoshi

>>282014778
>why the movie is a massive hit in Japan and across Asia
90% of the money came from Japan btw

>>282013918
I don't even know how you can enjoy wan piss fights when you literally know the outcome before it even starts as basically oda refuses to kill even barely relevant NPCs

>>282014894
It broke records for biggest imported Japanese film in multiple asian countries. And looks like it will break records in the US too
records for anime.
It's quiite unironically, the biggest anime movie of all time. the 2nd biggest would probably be Mugen train, another kny movie

what cope is this

>>282015168
And 90% of its money came from Japan btw

>>282014857
>DB took 9 years to hit 5 billion
>in a gacha
Congrats, The ip you dickride literally earns less money than Fate night
a non shonenshit IP

>>282014894
The box office revenue in Japan is currently about 30 billion JPY, with Asia said to be around 10 billion.
That makes a total of 40 billion, so according to your math, 30 out of 40 billion is somehow 90%?
Also, as far as I know, there’s no other IP that can pull in 10 billion in Asia alone without a release in China.

>>282015230
Still made more money than every single KNY merch + anime + manga + film and dickslapped JJK too along the way
>>282015268
>so according to your math, 30 out of 40 billion is somehow 90%?
Yup 90% of the money it made comes from Japan

>>282015364
>than every single KNY merch + anime + manga
You literally don't know that.
According to Charabiz Kny is the only one to top pokemon merch. and the only animanga IP to be in top 5 ever.

>>282015433
Meanwhile in reality:

>>282015227
>>282014894
Anon, I hate to break it to you, but KnY and JJK movies are outselling your beloved DB films, and not just in Japan, but in international markets outside of Japan as well.

>>282015494
Nice sources you got there
I'm sure dragon ball is as popular as batman in merch and revenue
delusional shonenshitter

>>282015502
Still got mogged got mogged by a gacha game
Made more money than every single KNY merch + anime + manga + films and then dickslapped JJK like the little bitch

>>282015545
If you're going for gacha revenue then even a literal fujo game for women mogs ALL dragon ball games revenue by over 3x in a single month
It's laughable

>>282014322
>DB and the Big 3 will be remembered forever, unlike this new gen trash that’ll be forgotten instantly
This is still true though lol. The big 3 are all popular among zoomers; they're timeless.

>>282015642
Not really nobody gives a single shit about DB in my college
they're all about JJK and KnY and SNK and a bit of naruto/OPfags

>>282012848
>corny
Go back to whatever zoomersite you came from

>>282015502
Why is it, in reality, that Dragon Ball movies don’t pull in much at the box office?
DB is practically a religion in US, France, and Latin America, so I honestly thought Super Hero would crush Mugen Train and JJK 0, at least in the Western markets.
And never happened.

>>282015613
LAD is unironically bigger than all shonenshit. Brings over 60M+ monthly and the merch sells like hotcakes since its for women
No IP can compete with it

>>282015677
>DB
Not part of the big 3. You would know this if you were actually into anime.
>they're all about JJK and KnY and SNK
Yes, they appeal the most to normgroids, and are the first anime that they watch, typically in their later teenage years.

>>282015728
Because Dragon ball fags are basically old. The average fan in JP is literally 60 years old and are basically nerds who spend their shit on retarded figures at most or games.
KnY and JJK have younger fanbase so they go to the movies.
In fact that's the exact reason boruto was made according to shueisha. As they wanted to get younger people in

Kagurabachi recent sucess shows that younger audience still want magic sword and sorcery battles but without supernatural/yokai/spirit elements.

Just the good and old men agaisnt men

>>282015677
Dragon Ball is popular within Black, Middle Eastern, and Latin American communities.
Among younger White and Asian generations, though, as you said, it’s SNK, KnY, and JJK that are popular.

>>282015613
Still made more money

>>282015808
I'm unconvinced that this is really that popular.
What are the sales compared to demon slayer and jujutsu kaisen before their respective anime announcements

>>282015824
It doesn't though
Dokkan total = 7.9m
Legend total = 11m
LAD = 69 million. That's a 50 million monthly gap. and that's just the mobile revenue for LAD.

>>282015728
Dragon Ball’s popularity comes from the brand name itself, not from fans actually wanting to go to theaters, pay money, and seriously engage with the story.
In a sense, you could say it’s a false fanbase.

>>282015728
Dragon ball is really dated. I think it'll really die out in a few years as people will get tired of the endless garbage they put out. It's becoming a parody and honestly it just doesn't stand up to the test of time at all. It died out once and I think it'll die forever soon.

It's like one of those action movies from the 80's.

>>282014174
>wait why is Torishima drawn like Dr. Mashirito
> notices Mashirito is an anagram of Torishima
> Toriyama created Dr. Mashirito to mock Torishima

I only learned this now, wow

>>282015728
>chainsoy boy
Superhero is worse than Broly but still made more money than KNY in Latin America
DB also doesn't need sakuga movies to make money, vidyas >>> movies and DB is king. Made 10 billion which is more money than every single KNY merch + anime + manga + films combined
JJK also gets dickslapped and Chainsoy Boy? Get back in the kitchen lol. I heard Part 2 is so ass btw

>>282015677
The reason boomers have been making threads like this lately and freaking out is probably because they can feel this shift happening up close.
Until recently, the reign of Dragon Ball and the Big 3 was unshakable.
Sure, SnK and MHA appeared, but on their alone they never created a massive movement.
For over a decade, the top of shōnen manga was occupied by DB and the Big 3.
But starting with the rise of KnY, followed by JJK and CSM, a generational shift has been steadily taking place among younger otaku.

>>282016153
Its funny how you try hard to pretend dragon ball is a thing kek. I literally don't know a single person who watches that shit in current year

>>282015884
Obviously less, also physical manga is a dying medium. Kagurabachi could've been selling 200k first month now if they bothered to shill it, it's literally getting more stuff overseas than in Japan. Jump is fucking retarded, they must hate Takeru because he's not a veteran nepobaby or something.

>>282016279
I don't understand the seethe though, its just shonenshit for kids. who gives a shit what's popular and whats not?
the big 3 and db suck ass in the first place. Dorehodoro mogs them all

>>282016279
Meanwhile, in reality:
>Torishima: Character creation is actually a very simple thing. Even a child can do it. Around the world, there are lots of manga with complicated themes but not very simple ideas. They don’t make you want to read them.
>Another example: I once spoke with someone from a publishing house in Germany. He told me that Attack on Titan made a lot of noise, but in the end, the paper manga didn’t sell well. The thing is, once the anime ended, the manga no longer sold. But if you look at Dragon Ball and Naruto, they keep selling even after the anime ended. So what’s the difference?

>The difference is that in Dragon Ball or Naruto, you get a shonen style where the reader sees the story through the character’s eyes and discovers the world with them. It’s not the plot that matters, it’s the idea that the reader is swept away by the character.
>Thanks to this simple character-driven construction, you can appeal to both kids and adults. “You drink Coke or Fanta because it tastes good, but when you’re really thirsty, you drink water.”

>>282016153
I’ll be blunt.
Today’s younger gen likes CSM more than your Dragon Ball.
By far.

>>282016366
Congrats on reading your first Seinen, but One Piece is still the pinnacle of Manga.

>>282016366
Because when something comes along that surpasses the works they love, they feel as if not only those series, but also their own youth and the memories of the lives they spent with, are being denied.

>>282016153
>I heard
Why are you so mad at something you haven't even read

>>282016452
Nah OP is shit for me

>>282016383
Didn't he make an interview with Kubo?

>>282016383
>Shitty writing is actually good
>because it makes you keep writing more shit and that shit sells for more time
Didn't help dragon ball when it ended and died out. And now its dying again. While SNK is only a bit down from its peak popularity but is absolutely more popular than DB with anyone younger than 40

>>282016452
I've read like 30 shonen manga and one piece is one of the few I outright dropped. It's garbage.

>>282016279
If the Reze arc movie succeeds and CSM regains its brand power, I think the shift in popularity toward the new generation will accelerate even further.
And the chances of that happening are pretty high.

The question really is, is it better for a manga to rapidly gain popularity due to its anime adaptation but be virtually forgotten once the anime finishes airing, or is it better for a manga to have consistent popularity that doesn't immediately die down after serialization finishes?

>>282016586
It’s only natural that a franchise completely finished will gradually fade from memory and popularity.
The only reason Dragon Ball and Naruto are still popular today is because their series are still ongoing.

>>282016632
It'll happen regardless. That's the natural order of things, newer things are trendy and settle down until new things overtake them.
It'll happen no matter what happens.

The only way they can stop it is to go marvel/dc route and try to make them popular with younger people again by introducting many versions etc. But even that shit will die out within a generation as seen with current capeshit. And honestly its already being done with Boruto / Dragon ball super. You really can't stop it.
Younger people don't want to watch old shit. they want to watch new things. I know because I was young once and I didn't want to watch some 80's classic or whatever boomer shit was at the time.

>bro you need to watch chainsaw man it's really good fr (forgotten coomer shit)
>bro you need to read jujutsu kaisen this shit is bussin (forgotten gay shit)
>bro you need to read demon slayer it's the best show ever no cap (forgotten moeshit)
Chainsaw Man, Demon Slayer, Jujutsu Kaisen and all these other trash nu shounen will all end and wither away with time.

Dragon Ball? Eternal.
>outlives 80s and 90s anime
>survived 15 years with no anime, the vidyas and merch kept this franchise afloat
>whenever they have jump fiestas, DB's booth always beats out every other booth put together combined
>outlives the 10s zoomer shounen era
>outlives the 20s gen alpha shounen era

>>282016777
Are you underage or pretending to be dumb?
Dragon ball was practically dead from 2000's till 2015. Even the video games for it were flopping hard (RB2 and burst limit). It was on its death bad until the launch of Dragon ball super
And now its getting back to the grave.
>>282016729
Yes, but even the ones that continue forever will also fade. As nobody will want to catch up for stuff with endless content

>>282016725
Some series can more easily maintain their popularity even after the story ends, while others can’t.

With Dragon Ball, Naruto, and Bleach, even when the story concludes, the main characters are still intact, fully healthy and holding on to their powers.
That leaves room for fans to imagine what comes next, which helps keep the fandom’s passion alive.

With SnK or KnY, on the other hand, the ending closes things off completely, the protagonist dies, or is too gravely injured to ever fight again.
Once the story is over, nothing more can really be created, and there’s no room left for readers’ imagination, so it’s harder for popularity to last.
(This is exactly why SnK quickly faded from discussion after it ended.)

Personally, I prefer the SnK or KnY type the ones that don’t drag their fans along endlessly, but instead deliver a clean goodbye once the end comes.

>>282017044
I see more discussion and popularity of SNK than DB and Bleach. in the big social media sites

Why exactly do (YOU) care if x is more popular than x? do you lose money? do you suddenly dislike the series you previously liked? and become a fan for current popular x?

What happens here?

>>282017044
That’s why Dai no Daibouken is my favorite among the works from the ’90s.
It was sad that the protagonist died, but that ending felt exactly like, “Alright kid, the show’s over. Face forward and move on to the next stage,” as if it were giving me a push on the back.

>>282017044
More precisely, what matters is whether there’s any reason left in that universe for the MCs to keep fighting.
In KnY, demons have been completely eradicated, so the Breathing Styles no longer have a reason to exist.
In SnK, the Titans disappear from the world, and after the time skip Paradis Island becomes a battlefield again, but by then, the familiar characters are long dead.

>>282017044
KnY would have been completely forgotten by now if it's anime hadn't been dragging on with huge gaps between each arc and making every other arc a movie. It's kept on by artificial extension to it's IP by taking it "slow" to finish the story for none-manga readers. People rarely talk about it unless there's a new release/season announced
It's the same with dr stone, I saw that was airing this season and my initial reaction was
>Didn't the manga end 6 years ago? Wasn't the anime on the second arc then? How has the anime dragged on for 6 years and not finished yet?
And that series was nowhere near as big as KnY AND ended a year before it and is still being dragged on as if it's relevant to milk the IP and even then it's almost never talked about when it's not airing like when the manga was still being published.

Meanwhile things like dragonball had it's anime airing without a single break, a bit of filler here and there to slow the pace down so it didn't catch up with the manga but Dragon ball anime finished airing a year after the manga and then ended up discussed for years.
SnK was big, it had a huge gap between it's anime first and second season which killed steam in it's popularity, but once that second series started it mostly pushed out the anime with few gaps and it ended fairly shortly (2 years) after the manga and even now it still has people discuss and talk about it.

I honestly think modern anime dragging the IP to last as long as possible after the manga ends is more damaging to the lasting story than just ending the anime as soon as they an after the manga finishes.

>>282017044
Part of it is probably that there just isn't much left to talk about. I think this issue is most obvious with JJK.
I think what creates a lot of discussion are characters; you can explore and comment on their relationships with others, talk about what is good, what is evil, what is beautiful about them etc.

>>282017660
KnY actually has a very short gap between releases.
It’s been putting out almost one new season per year.
Originally, the RLD arc and the SSV arc were supposed to be in the same season, but after the unexpected massive success of Mugen Train, it’s clear they rushed to release new series as quickly as possible to keep the hype from cooling down.
And considering ufotable’s production schedule, it’s impossible to speed up the release pace any further.

>>282017660
>Dragon ball anime finished airing a year after the manga and then ended up discussed for years.

Bullshit.
Right after the DBZ anime ended, nobody cared about the Dragon Ball franchise anymore.
By that time, Dragon Ball had already lost kids’ attention to other content that was hitting its peak, like Mini 4WD and CoroCoro Comic.

>>282016383
Why does this guy hate SnK so much? Is he really that bitter over Jump’s mistake of letting SnK slip through their fingers?

>>282016326
They hate Nue too even though most of the Japanese readership buy it and has it beat both Kiyoshi and Hima-ten! in sales.
Saito despises the hand he was dealt and wants to sabotage it even more.

KGB will save the genre.

2006 to 2014 were the dark ages of shounen. Its only now starting to gain roots again.

>>282003615 (OP)
true

>>282003615 (OP)
kimetsu no yaiba is downright terrible, bro

>>282003615 (OP)
Over the past five years, many manga and anime have gone viral, but in the end only these two have survived.
They’ll probably be the only ones remembered by future generations as well.
Spy x Family and Oshi no Ko are already fading away, and Frieren—despite not having the reputation or quality of Hunter x Hunter, already has a hiatus rate approaching that of HxH.